Anniversary Game 1 - Classic Syndicate [Day 9]

[Golden]

I’m not town reading you yet, DH, and the absence of town reading you yet troubles me. Your tilde solving felt like a DH imitation.

This means nothing

You think i should consider it NAI?

[DharmaHelper]

Yes I know he meant "lack" of substance, no I don't think its fair to say I lacked substance Day 1 when I've repeatedly had to point out that I sparked both the Eloh and Scotty discussions, and then offered substantial thoughts and reads on literally every active player.

[DharmaHelper]

I’m not town reading you yet, DH, and the absence of town reading you yet troubles me. Your tilde solving felt like a DH imitation.

This means nothing

You think i should consider it NAI?

No I meant that your post literally means nothing. You said nothing there. "You're imitating yourself" and "Because I don't think you're town, I can't not think you're bad"

Nothing.

Also, its NAI.

[Golden]

I’m not town reading you yet, DH, and the absence of town reading you yet troubles me. Your tilde solving felt like a DH imitation.

This means nothing

You think i should consider it NAI?

No I meant that your post literally means nothing. You said nothing there. "You're imitating yourself" and "Because I don't think you're town, I can't not think you're bad"

Nothing.

Also, its NAI.

If it means nothing how did you manage to frame it up to mean something else that I didn’t say?

[Golden]

Let me reframe.

I have a bull read on you and I don’t like having a bull read on you, so I voted you to get your attention and see what came next.

And I got your attention, and I’m seeing what comes next.

[DharmaHelper]

I’m not town reading you yet, DH, and the absence of town reading you yet troubles me. Your tilde solving felt like a DH imitation.

This means nothing

You think i should consider it NAI?

No I meant that your post literally means nothing. You said nothing there. "You're imitating yourself" and "Because I don't think you're town, I can't not think you're bad"

Nothing.

Also, its NAI.

If it means nothing how did you manage to frame it up to mean something else that I didn’t say?

Because in the absence of meaning any meaning can be interjected by a skilled tactician. Thank you for both proving my point and complimenting me.

[Golden]

Null. Phone and being drunk don’t go so well together.

[Golden]

I’m not town reading you yet, DH, and the absence of town reading you yet troubles me. Your tilde solving felt like a DH imitation.

This means nothing

You think i should consider it NAI?

No I meant that your post literally means nothing. You said nothing there. "You're imitating yourself" and "Because I don't think you're town, I can't not think you're bad"

Nothing.

Also, its NAI.

If it means nothing how did you manage to frame it up to mean something else that I didn’t say?

Because in the absence of meaning any meaning can be interjected by a skilled tactician. Thank you for both proving my point and complimenting me.

No, it can’t be given ‘any meaning’. It means exactly what it says. You saying it means something I didn’t say (that I ‘can’t help reading you as bad’ when I said ‘the absence of a town read troubled me’ is not finding a different meaning to it. It’s adding something that isn’t there.

[DharmaHelper]

So what does "troubles me" mean and do you normally vote for people you don't think are bad?

[DharmaHelper]

Troubles you? Troubles you how? Like, I'm troubling? I trouble you? Like I'm some kind of clown? I'm her to trouble you?

[DharmaHelper]

Troubles you? Troubles you how? Like, I'm troubling? I trouble you? Like I'm some kind of clown? I'm here to trouble you?

There we go

[Golden]

So what does "troubles me" mean and do you normally vote for people you don't think are bad?

I vote for people for a number of reasons. One of them is ‘to assist me in getting a read on someone’.

And ‘troubles me’ means ‘troubles me’. It’s not a read, it’s an emotional/gut unease.

[DharmaHelper]

So what does "troubles me" mean and do you normally vote for people you don't think are bad?

I vote for people for a number of reasons. One of them is ‘to assist me in getting a read on someone’.

And ‘troubles me’ means ‘troubles me’. It’s not a read, it’s an emotional/gut unease.

Okay.

[Golden]

Troubles you? Troubles you how? Like, I'm troubling? I trouble you? Like I'm some kind of clown? I'm her to trouble you?

The only clown I know around here is the one that accuses me of being a coward.

[Vivax]

Hiii I'm back to annoy more people, well not as much, I had a license to do it previously.
I spent all day reading yesterday, it's kinda awkward to just reappear in the game after dying.

Spoiler: show

What a bizarre kill. RIP splints.

I came in to today ready to make a case against her, so I guess that’s one off my checklist.

"Odd choice for a kill" tell

Indeed. This post pinged me a lot, even though I do not really see mafia voting for Sloonei yesterday and I have previously had a town read on Scotty. There is tension here in my feelings about him.

Oh wait, Scotty voted for Quin, not Sloonei. So that makes me feel even worse about him.

“I don’t see mafia voting for sloonei”
“Scotty didn’t vote for sloonei”
“I feel worse about him”
????

Makes total sense. IF mafia didn't vote for Sloonei AND you voted for Sloonei, THEN I would have a hard time reading you as mafia. Given that that is not the case, it is easier for me to read you as mafia.

This is some Dwight Schrute tier reasoning.
Not meant as criticism because I had the same thought shortly after I placed a vote on Wilgy and then switched back to Sloonei. Just a funny way to talk to Scotty imo.

Anyone else thinking that all the baddies are among the off wagon voters, currently ?

If I remember the VC correctly at the time of above post, there were I think three nonvoters (Bea, LoraB, DFara)

Eloh: Michelle, Kate (?)
Sloonei: FP, llama, Viv, NAA

As for anyone not on Eloh or Sloonei:
Golden was on Quin.
Wilgy, G-Man on Golden.
Sloonei, Eloh on Viv.
Sig, DH were on ?
Scotty on bea.

Either way, it's like half the game not being on Sloonei or Eloh. So saying mafia was off wagons doesn't really restrict the lynch pool enough.

Here's a list from least suspicious to most suspicious, very memory-based:

Scotty (Very un-agendad way of being in the thread, relaxed attitude, lots of poking around)
Michelle (The thoughts on the game and various players appear believable and posts spontaneously)
Sig (Relaxed way of giving his views on his own. They seem rather original and I'd expect scum to be more adaptive to pre-existent reads)
DH (Very solvey streaks of posts, like the attempts to decipher roles, bit less invested on alignments !)

G-Man (Seemed to show genuine interest into the game. Writing style looked interesting. Hoping for more.)
Wilgy (Hard to explain. There's something townie in all that flying around and licking random people)

I'll stop here, actually.
Would rather try to suggest this as town core for now before trying to figure out who the mafia are (and I'd rather read more first). For which I think it would make sense to start out with feasible pairings.

[Golden]

DH, a question for you.

You haven't voted yet. If you could vote for Scotty, would your vote currently be on Scotty?

[DharmaHelper]

DH, a question for you.

You haven't voted yet. If you could vote for Scotty, would your vote currently be on Scotty?

I mean, more likely than not.

[Golden]

DH, a question for you.

You haven't voted yet. If you could vote for Scotty, would your vote currently be on Scotty?

I mean, more likely than not.

You had, perhaps short of a fixation, but certainly a focus on scotty on day one. He was in your baddie mix after you did isos, but ultimately you went with G-Man. What made you choose G-Man over Scotty yesterday, and why do you feel like that's swapped over today?

[DharmaHelper]

DH, a question for you.

You haven't voted yet. If you could vote for Scotty, would your vote currently be on Scotty?

I mean, more likely than not.

You had, perhaps short of a fixation, but certainly a focus on scotty on day one. He was in your baddie mix after you did isos, but ultimately you went with G-Man. What made you choose G-Man over Scotty yesterday, and why do you feel like that's swapped over today?

I feel like the answer to that question is in the substance that I posted that I seem to be lacking according to some people.

[DharmaHelper]

As to why I'd be on him *today*, over say G-Man

Because I can.

[Golden]

As to why I'd be on him *today*, over say G-Man

Because I can.

Lol!

(DH, whatever your alignment, I love playing with you. It takes balls to give the answer of 'because I can' when Scotty is literally not on the poll so you literally can't!)

[DharmaHelper]

As to why I'd be on him *today*, over say G-Man

Because I can.

Lol!

(DH, whatever your alignment, I love playing with you. It takes balls to give the answer of 'because I can' when Scotty is literally not on the poll so you literally can't!)

Well I mean in a world where I could, it would be because I could.

[DharmaHelper]

Anyone think that its worth noting that only a handful of people participated in the Prog thing and that mafia would be more incentivized to do that

[Elohcin]

I’m gonna identify a pattern for you.

Popping in. I’ll be driving most of the day, and so I can do so safely, will not be posting and driving. But I will try to check in on stops.

Note well use adverb above, as well as in this sentence.

Do you sus Scotty for that ?

Not necessarily. I want to see how he responds.

Or with secrets in civvie roles, there’s also a chance he may be looking for votes as a civ thing.

So, really, I want to see how he responds.

Hi.

Here’s my response:

Really? That’s the hill you’re leading a charge on? Yikes.

I wasn't leading a charge. I was noticing a weirdness. But ok.

Lorab did indeed pop in, as Vivax pointed out, just to call attention to my joke post. That…sure is something. She needs to offer more than that.

Obviously, I didn't read it as a joke post--to be fair, I was reading the entire day's worth of posts, so I likely missed tone. And I will offer more--as I said in the sign ups, I was away for a long weekend, so didn't have much time to get into the game. And yesterday was traveling back home yesterday. As I'm sure you remember, you'll get plenty more from me.

I'm going to assume that you are a civ, and that you are reading me as bad because you are not. But, keeping in mind that it could be a switcheroo.

Home from work. Just finished reading through the rest of day. And don’t worry—I’m going to vote. There’s over 20 minutes left. Why rush?

I'm here!! Went to bed before the results posted last night (because I'm an old person). RIPIYWG (nd you probably were), Splints. (and yes, I know that all of the night victims are likely civ, but I make no assumptions--assumptions are dangerous in this game). And sorry that this post is kind of all over the place.

Splints is a good player, and so I can see why she'd be a N1 target for mafia. Especially if one of the players is someone whom she historically has been able to read. Now I need to remember who that could be. And, mafia knows that anyone not on their team is civ, so is a good target no matter what.

And I should have a normal-er schedule now, so can post more regularly. And maybe actually get reads on people.

Also, I swear that I totally submitted a song for the contest, but now that message seems to have disappeared, and it's super weird. And I'm curious where it went to.

Looking at the visible night results, Kate was Greened and Bea was somethinged. Not knowing what role/circumstance had that effect on Bea, hard to say if that's good or bad. I disagree with whomever said it was a result of the map poll--since she wasn't the only Canada voter, but seems to be the only one whose posts have been altered. And she even said (I think?) that it wasn't Vompatti.

I have more thoughts and I'll remember them later.

@LoRab got any reads yet?

I don’t like how quiet it is. Suggests the mafia are under no real pressure at all. The game is coasting.

Not really. I’m not thinking about bea and kate until tomorrow. And really wanting to know what happened to bea. I have more players I feel good about than am suspish of. Which makes sense in terms of numbers, but is annoying. Not wanting to name who I feel goosed about because don’t want to help mafia. And not convinced the game secrets don’t contain weirdness that makes the allegiances less obvious than they seem.

Anyone else noticing the pattern?

Spoiler: show

It’s full of excuses.

Now I want to preface that I know she has outlined her time constraints. Everyone has a life outside the game. But the excuses are starting to add up and there’s nothing to show with it. All of her posts have been real nothing burgers and she’s obviously reading along because she’s made multiple comments like “did he just claim mafia” and “it’s weird that JJJ is voting” and yet “I have no reads” or “I have town reads but don’t want to give the mafia any ideas”

I expect more…something substantive at this point.

I've been trying to give Lorab the benefit of the doubt, but I have noticed this as well and have been keeping an eye on it. It is very fishy.

[Elohcin]

I have to try and find the time to read over DH and Quin This phase. Quin for me has no presence in the thread which is just a bit odd. I know he’s posted but can’t recall any thoughts from me on anything he’s said.

DH was a scum lean I remember day one calling out his like of substance and it seems like other people see that too. I’d like to reread him though.

I’ll caveat my last post by saying if we keep missing mafia I could tinfoil Llama as one.

Also we should be looking out for whoever doesn’t vote as I believe a mafia ability is to take a vote and give it to an outside 3P? Which I’m assuming is JJJ vote

The question I had is: do we think the player knows their vote is gone? I didn’t get that necessarily from the syntax of the role

I imagine we will all vote as normal but one of those votes won't count, but JJJs will.

[Vivax]

Anyone think that its worth noting that only a handful of people participated in the Prog thing and that mafia would be more incentivized to do that

I wouldn't use it to base my reads on tbh. Maybe keep it in mind for posterity.

Also forgot to add Llama to towncore. When I look at their rainbow list I find myself coinciding with the bottom mostly reads-wise (if I take my slot out since that's a wrong read).
I know it's from Day 1 but even for D2 it coincides mostly with mine. I don't find myself capable of ranking the bottom like that at the moment, so I don't necessarily agree with the order of reads in the bottom pool (just that it's where I'd look).

Is it too early for a classic rainbow list?
Michelle's participation today (apart from asking for sensitive personal information like my time zone) has me feeling better about her. My vote is unlikely to stay on her.

Scotty
fingersplints
DrWilgy
Golden
Michelle
DharmaHelper
DFaraday
G-Man
sig
Vivian
bea
Kate
Sloonei
Elohcin
Lora
Quin
NotAnAxehole

[Elohcin]

Yes I know he meant "lack" of substance, no I don't think its fair to say I lacked substance Day 1 when I've repeatedly had to point out that I sparked both the Eloh and Scotty discussions, and then offered substantial thoughts and reads on literally every active player.

And what do you have for us today?

[DharmaHelper]

Yes I know he meant "lack" of substance, no I don't think its fair to say I lacked substance Day 1 when I've repeatedly had to point out that I sparked both the Eloh and Scotty discussions, and then offered substantial thoughts and reads on literally every active player.

And what do you have for us today?

I dunno quite yet. Maybe nothing, who knows.

[DharmaHelper]

Genuinely haven't read much recently, did G-Man ever address anything I said or is he suffering the same "I can't see DH's posts" affliction that sig was?

[LoRab]

You guys will get there eventuallt.

oh thank Cthulhu I can finally role check you tonite

Did you just role claim a mafia role?

[VOTE: LoRab] aubergine

For snipey pop-in

If pointing out a strange post makes me seem suspish to you, I’m ok with that.

These two posts go together. LoRab thinks this jokey scum claim from Scotty is alignment indicative (a later post clarifies this somewhat). I'm okay with that.

Do you sus Scotty for that ?

Not necessarily. I want to see how he responds.

Or with secrets in civvie roles, there’s also a chance he may be looking for votes as a civ thing.

So, really, I want to see how he responds.

Follows from the above, but I am confused at the "looking for votes as a civ thing" part. Need her to explain this.

Do you sus Scotty for that ?

Not necessarily. I want to see how he responds.

Or with secrets in civvie roles, there’s also a chance he may be looking for votes as a civ thing.

So, really, I want to see how he responds.

Hi.

Here’s my response:

Really? That’s the hill you’re leading a charge on? Yikes.

I wasn't leading a charge. I was noticing a weirdness. But ok.

Lorab did indeed pop in, as Vivax pointed out, just to call attention to my joke post. That…sure is something. She needs to offer more than that.

Obviously, I didn't read it as a joke post--to be fair, I was reading the entire day's worth of posts, so I likely missed tone. And I will offer more--as I said in the sign ups, I was away for a long weekend, so didn't have much time to get into the game. And yesterday was traveling back home yesterday. As I'm sure you remember, you'll get plenty more from me.

I'm going to assume that you are a civ, and that you are reading me as bad because you are not. But, keeping in mind that it could be a switcheroo.

Her conclusion from all this is that he's town, because scum reading LoRab in this game is a thing civilians do. But also, Scotty could be scum because 'switcheroo'. Do you think you deserve to be scum read, LoRab? I do.

I am not going to, but tempted to vote axehole, because he doesn’t seem to honor at all the way other people play, and not adapting to the way many of us are used to. Which is frustrating, and I’m trying not to let me suspect him because I’m annoyed. Similar with VIVA.

This post may as well have not been made. It has nothing to do with the game.

Voting Bea.

[VOTE: Bea] aubergine

I don’t suspect her much, but I don’t have a read on her yet. And I want her to come out and play more.

Give me a better reason than this for why you voted bea, please. The last two posts set you up to look like you were making the most inoffensive vote possible.

@LoRab got any reads yet?

I don’t like how quiet it is. Suggests the mafia are under no real pressure at all. The game is coasting.

Not really. I’m not thinking about bea and kate until tomorrow. And really wanting to know what happened to bea. I have more players I feel good about than am suspish of. Which makes sense in terms of numbers, but is annoying. Not wanting to name who I feel goosed about because don’t want to help mafia. And not convinced the game secrets don’t contain weirdness that makes the allegiances less obvious than they seem.

Revising what I said before. I misremembered this post as LoRab talking about not wanting to explain her town reads, which I thought was a bad look because she lacked the clout needed for scum to want to react to them. Now reading it again, that's all because Scotty specified town reads in his ISO. What a nugget. I'm not concerned if she's holding back on her scum reads.

I still have absolutely no idea what is going on in LoRab's head besides "Scotty could be either good or bad".

Not repeating Scotty's ISO in here, I agree with all of it. You said you have more time, so I'd appreciate you using it to respond to this, and provide reads. [VOTE: LoRab] aubergine

Do I “deserve” to be suspected? I mean, i don’t think I’ve ever played and not been suspected. Especially on here.

Indeed, I don’t have many reads. It’s day frigging 2 and I haven’t played in a while. Also, I tend to think more about mechanics than read early in games. Mainly because my reads on people come largely from pattern recognition of individual’s posts, which takes time.

To define terms: switchers= OMGUS. In the mafia culture I learned in, of which this site came from, that was the standard term.

Civvie roles that want to get voted out (often day 1) are not uncommon. And fake slipping is a way that role is often played.

I voted Bea because I usually read her fairly easily, but I don’t have a read on her yet. So I wanted her to know she has my eyeball on her.

I’m civ. I get that I’ve been quiet and that I don’t currently have strong reads. I also know that my style often reads bad on this site. I had thought maybe that would be the case in this old timers game, but here we are.

Im civv. Don’t know how to prove that or convince anyone of that. But none of what has been said about me is allignment indicative. It’s just me.

And, because someone will call me out if I don’t. Eye me all you want.

[Vivax]

If I just townread LoraB (tone is okay from what I've read) and assumed TvT wagons on D1, and that kate isn't faking being role impaired, I'd currently have a bea/quin PoE.

Maybe DFara instead of one of them because I didn't like in DFara's last post that they only mentioned Eloh as possible townread, but didn't comment on Sloonei at all.

[thellama73]

If eloh and I are both town, the mafiers had a very relaxing end of Day 1.

This is my contention, and part of why I think they are taking it easy right now.

Let’s put some pressure on them then.

Vote LoRab with me. She says she is going to post more, and we’re now less than half the day left, and she won’t give reads.

Or vote Quin, who is content to just shrug about everything.

Okay. [VOTE: Lorab] aubergine

I note that Quin has also voted Lorab. Bussing would not surprise me if she flips bad.

[DharmaHelper]

If eloh and I are both town, the mafiers had a very relaxing end of Day 1.

This is my contention, and part of why I think they are taking it easy right now.

Let’s put some pressure on them then.

Vote LoRab with me. She says she is going to post more, and we’re now less than half the day left, and she won’t give reads.

Or vote Quin, who is content to just shrug about everything.

Okay. [VOTE: Lorab] aubergine

I note that Quin has also voted Lorab. Bussing would not surprise me if she flips bad.

[Sabiplz]

hi I love u all. Hope u r having fun uwu

sabi forever tryna collect simps for their collection

need more simps imo uwu

[thellama73]

Indeed, I don’t have many reads. It’s day frigging 2 and I haven’t played in a while. Also, I tend to think more about mechanics than read early in games. Mainly because my reads on people come largely from pattern recognition of individual’s posts, which takes time.

"I don't have reads because it's day 2" is so unhelpful. We do not have unlimited time to find the Mafia. Every day that we lynch wrong makes it easier for them to win. "I'll just wait until Day six or seven to hunt baddies" is not an option. Most of the people doing the hunting will have been night killed by then.

If you want to play the game, you need to start playing it, because otherwise you are effectively working for the baddies regardless of your actual alignment.

[thellama73]

You know what, I changed my mind. [VOTE: Quin] aubergine

[DharmaHelper]

You know what, I changed my mind. [VOTE: Quin] aubergine

Shot/Chaser

[Michelle]

Hi again, I walked today a lot, visiting the town after we finally reached our destination.
Poland is beautiful in autumn, the leafs have all possible colours and the weather is perfect.


Now i only skimmed and I don't have time to make a solid opinion myself
I think the best option is to sheep someone but idk who. We don't have a consensus but this is not bad per se

After my interaction with drW I still think he is town, and i understand he is voting Sloonei because Fingers suspected Sloonei. Please correct me if i am wrong

I know I had Bea as town and I had a town read for llama but I forgot why. I can reread and find out mondqy.

If we think at NKA, Sloonei can be mafia who killed Fingers but also can be town framed by the kill

@Sloonei is voting me because allegedly I should be more active. This is weak, why are you doing this? I didn't find any question from you and also I was AFK.

If I stop posting means I am sleeping, hopefully I can be up for eod to find a vote

[Scotty]

As to why I'd be on him *today*, over say G-Man

Because I can.

Lol!

(DH, whatever your alignment, I love playing with you. It takes balls to give the answer of 'because I can' when Scotty is literally not on the poll so you literally can't!)

Well I mean in a world where I could, it would be because I could.

Getting some real Cat In the Hat vibes right here

[Sloonei]

@Sloonei is voting me because allegedly I should be more active. This is weak, why are you doing this?

I don't recall saying this.

[Scotty]

Anyone think that its worth noting that only a handful of people participated in the Prog thing and that mafia would be more incentivized to do that

Not really. To the same degree that I would expect mafia to play with the same level of activity they’ve already played with.

I’m more perplexed by the amount of people that seem to have admitted submitting a song and either didn’t follow the rules or just didn’t get judged for whatever reason

[Michelle]

@Sloonei is voting me because allegedly I should be more active. This is weak, why are you doing this?

I don't recall saying this.

It was implied in a post, you said I don't need incentive or something like that. I remember because I had to search to understand what you said
For me that means you say I wasn't active. Did I take it wrong?

[DharmaHelper]

Anyone think that its worth noting that only a handful of people participated in the Prog thing and that mafia would be more incentivized to do that

Not really. To the same degree that I would expect mafia to play with the same level of activity they’ve already played with.

I’m more perplexed by the amount of people that seem to have admitted submitting a song and either didn’t follow the rules or just didn’t get judged for whatever reason

The rules seemed simple enough to me

[Sloonei]

I still hold a town read on Quin, and it is still based primarily on the way he expressed his reads mid-Day 1. I'll flesh that out a bit now since the suspicion against him is mounting.

Spoiler: show

Just started work, so I can't wallpost or anything, but here's some takes:

Scotty's insistence on the Eloh scumread feels forced. Possible distancing. sig is a good boy if true.

Axe is a zero-faith townie, reminds me of Phenon where I just shat in everyone's cereal in some weird sussy town performance.

The bea train is garbage. Looking at that in more detail tonight.

Llama needs to explain his rainbow, The bit about me, specifically.

Possible distancing, huh? So you think Elo is bad then?

Yes, in that I think you're w/w. I want to expand on my independent reads on you both when I get home.

It starts here when he introduces the idea of Scotty and Eloh being partners. Note that I am not interested in whether or not Quin's read is accurate. What I like is the way this read develops in the thread. He floats the idea, and promises to expand on it when he has the time. I am familiar with this predicament: Quin has a read that he wants to discuss, but he is unable to communicate it fully at the moment because Work is happening. Such a shame.

But then Quin follows through on his pledge, presumably upon arriving home after work.
Eloh post:

Spoiler: show

Alright, I'm here! It may take me a bit to get back into the groove of things, not that I ever had a really good groove with mafia. But, looking forward to some old-time fun!

Eloh's first post has an excuse in it.

Votes should be expressed in the thread though, like this:
[VOTE: Vivax] aubergine

Let the little man whisper!

I will HAPPILY use an adverb, but it may take me a while to get used to the vote tag thing. Have patience.

Right, so Sig is obviously mafia, right?

I would say it is something to consider.

I'm not a fan of changing votes. I like to take the day to interact and observe without being hasty.

Sig says votes are changeable. I don't see how he could have known this before voting. I can only find him sus right away as his hasty vote would most likely land on a civ.

Yeah if only there were a role that explicitly stated (hey look guys, adverb. I'm multitasking!) that votes were changeable.

Maybe Eloh missed that part, though. I guess if it were an indie role or a mafia role, and Eloh were a civ and had no reason to read up on the mafia/indie sides of things, that could be it.

But if that role were not an indie or mafia role, and Eloh were a mafia or an indie and would have reason to be more focused on that side of the board, I could see a world where Eloh might forgo reading up on the civ side of things.

So, rule number 5 says the "votes are changeable. MAYBE." Then, I did read the roles including Moveable Votes, but didn't understand it. I was looking at it like a RULE and not a ROLE, probably b/c I had been in the car all day traveling. But I just had a lightbulb moment looking back at it now after a good night's sleep! So, I definitely get it now.

I no longer suspect sig atm. We shall see what's to come.

methinks the baker might be baking up some sugar-free excuses here

All the initial post told me is that Eloh didn't read the roles thoroughly before posting. What does Eloh having not reading the roles thoroughly tell you about her alignment? Hopefully this is a rhetorical question.

In all seriousness, this Day 1 is going to be bizarre because I’m going to feel dirty eliminating a player that has made a triumphant return after a lengthy break only to be yeeted early.

I suppose I can take solace in the fact that rezz’s are in the game. But for day 1? It just feelsbadman.jpg

I guess we could always all just vote for dog lol

"yeet" and "yeeted" are not allowed in old school mafia games. Silly Scotty, yeets are for kids.

I think you mean Yeezys.

Y'all should know to give me a little leeway before suspecting me, especially when I've been away for so many years. Did you forget that I only married into intelligence? Though I overthink and internalize everything IRL, I'm ultimately a doer and not a thinker. That is why Epi and I mesh so well together.

I remember catching a scum Dana years ago on her first game back in ages (my first game with her, she was great). She used her time away as a crutch to excuse her inability to contribute and it just felt like she couldn't integrate herself into the thread. It could be the same thing here, but I'm happy to sit on it and let that idea progress.

And, I'm not lying about the role thing. I didn't understand the movable votes until I reread the roles this morning after reading DH's comments. I must have more tired than I thought last night b/c everything was much clearer this morning.

That’s fair. I often overanalyze roles in my pregame analysis and make bold assumptions that can be easily disproven with the obvious information given.

I think another part of your explanation that is still not swaying me, however, is the way you’ve presented your suspicion for sig in so many words, then just as succinctly dropped your suspicion for him without offering any other reads for other players. It’s very cookie-cutter apple pie and although it doesn’t lack logical progression, it does seem to lack that extra scoop of ice cream a-la-mode

First of all, I don't remember using "so many words." Second, there was not much to go on at the time of that post. I will most likely have more reads as the day goes on. But for DAY ONE, unless someone majorly slips, any reads are kind-of a shot in the dark. If I were to make a guess, though, I imagine that day 1 mafia players act like one of the following:
a) pretty quiet (laying low)
b) kind-of silly/off-topic (distracting from gameplay), or
c) hard core readers (they obviously know who isn't a part of their own)

This is what I am looking for. So far I have my eye on Scotty for reasons of letter (b).

I get a stronger Scotty/Eloh team vibe reading Scotty's posts than the other way around. This makes me want to do a fluff count on Scotty's posts.

Spoiler: show

Begrudgingly, sure, even though it’s only 20 posts back. I could probably flesh it out more.

It’s admittedly a pretty weak scumread, but the arguments that Elo had made agreeing with the suspicion of sig based on a mechanic that she hadn’t read, then recanting her suspicion upon learning said mechanic was rather safe. It wasn’t a slam dunk by any means. But then she reacts to my read of her with a long winded explanation that mafia will have certain qualities in D1. She lists them; then, she makes, in more or less words, an OMGUS on me using one of the bullet points “silly/off-topic (distracting from gameplay)” which is objectively a terrible statement. Sure, I’m perhaps silly as much as a pumpkin spice latte in spring, but you can still DRINK a pumpkin spice latte in spring I’m making gab, advancing gameplay. Am I not?

So you're voting for Eloh because she acted on a weak suspicion, backtracked on it nearly as soon as it was called out, and offered a "whatever sticks" explanation as to her actions?

Why is that not a slam dunk? Where is this hesitation and hedging coming from? Is she doing an OMGUS to you or are you doing an OMGUS to her?

It’s not a slam dunk because D1 reads are never slam dunks. I’m like the looney tunes when the monstars suck the power away. I need reveals to better get a sense for players.

This could very well just be a player personality that I’m reading too much into.

Though I wouldn’t call this hedging. I’m currently voting there

Maybe it's not a slam dunk bc he is scared to get it wrong. Or maybe it's not a slam dunk bc he is bad and just trying to make a semblance of a baddie read on someone to make it look like he is trying. This response looks very bad to me.

I don’t really like the whole Elo vs Scotty thing. I do feel like Elo was a little quick to jump on sig who is an easy target, but as someone who almost never thoroughly reads the rules, I can wholeheartedly understand missing something like that. And in most cases wouldn’t it be easier for a mafia Elo to just leave that mild suspicion of sig out there instead. Scotty’s suspicion also seems quick to jump on something little.
Maybe I’ll reread it after the kids are asleep

kidS! Yay! How many now and what ages?

[I imagine that day 1 mafia players act like one of the following:
a) pretty quiet (laying low)
b) kind-of silly/off-topic (distracting from gameplay), or
c) hard core readers (they obviously know who isn't a part of their own)

This is what I am looking for. So far I have my eye on Scotty for reasons of letter (b).

What does a Day 1 town player act like?

I think that civvie behavior on day 1 is more personalized than baddie behavior. For instance, if Blooper were here and she didn't make a single post on Day 1, I would not suspect her for it. But, if Pink were here and did not post on day 1, I think that would be something to keep an eye on. Unfortunately, there are three players here that I don't think I've ever played with, so they will probably escape a vote from me today unless something extreme happens.

Y'all should know to give me a little leeway before suspecting me, especially when I've been away for so many years. Did you forget that I only married into intelligence? Though I overthink and internalize everything IRL, I'm ultimately a doer and not a thinker. That is why Epi and I mesh so well together.

leeway
noun
1.
the amount of freedom to move or act that is available.

Do I understand coorect, you ask for a day 1 pass here?

Yes, that is correct. I am smart enough to look up the word before I post it as well If you knew me, you would know that it is classic Eloh to say five words and be suspected right out of the gate.

I am she. And I am eastern standard. 3:54pm atm.

---------------------------------
@Golden I never voted sig at all, btw. just talked about him in the thread. I don't like movable votes at all and I think Llama explained my thoughts on it very well, so I won't repeat.
---------------------------------

@ Michelle

Judging from my perspective I don't consider others' reads except they are my town reads. Had Eloh said they town read Scotty and Golden? Because if not, why do you think they should post more and reconsider?

It left a bad impression that Eloh claimed to have found a reason to be sus on sig but went off when a few dropped opposite conclusions. Maybe I'm expecting too much from early pages but that would have made for a fine topic to ruffle some heads early on if I were them.

This really isn't that difficult folks. I misinterpreted the roles and thought no one KNEW if votes were movable or not yet. Then, I reread the roles after getting some much needed sleep and wah-la, I understood it!

-----------------------------------
@thellama73 I don't have a civ game, remember?
-----------------------------------

“@Golden I never voted sig at all, btw. just talked about him in the thread. I don't like movable votes at all and I think Llama explained my thoughts on it very well, so I won't repeat.”
Right, you said you weren’t one to vote early, but wholly offered that sig could be bad. That was your only read at the time. Tomato/potato.

“Maybe it's not a slam dunk bc he is scared to get it wrong. Or maybe it's not a slam dunk bc he is bad and just trying to make a semblance of a baddie read on someone to make it look like he is trying. This response looks very bad to me.”
Correct that I don’t want to get it wrong. I think I tend to struggle on correct D1 reads. But a broken clock is right twice a day, eh?

If I had edged off you, would that response have looked better? I’m just continuing to get OMGUS vibes here.

@Elohcin If you could vote someone right now, who would you vote? GTH, as they’d say

I actually felt like your response was you "edging off me", so I'm confused by the question. It's like you thought, "Shoot, I really could be wrong here so I'm going to back off and say that my theory wasn't a slam dunk," after driving it hard for so many posts. You backing off is what made me question your civ status further. You may say I did the same thing with sig (flippity-flop), but really it wouldn't be true. I made a couple comments, in a tired state, about sig being sus right before going to bed. Then, when I woke up and saw comments about it, I reread the rules and roles, had a derp moment, and backed off. I really think you just need to let that go and let us move on.

I hate GTH questions and refuse to answer them.

New read, Bea is civ bc she would know when day ends if she had BTSC.

Eloh thinks that her not reading the roles is NAI and Scotty should back off. She also thinks Scotty is bad for backing off. I want to come up with a cool metaphor like Scotty does but I can't so I'm just going to say this sounds like distancing.

EBWOP: actually...if you really were scared you were wrong, then you'd have to be civ. It's getting close to my bedtime again. I'm useless in the evening and should not play mafia at this time. This is why I work during the first half of my day. I don't know what I think anymore.

So Eloh thinks Scotty is town? Is that where we ended?

There are a couple more isolated observations in here that I like. Namely, Quin's recognition and recollection of a similar mafia performance from a different player in a past game that he was in (RE: Dana). I like the fact that Quin is making that connection. It suggests to me that Eloh's behavior triggered a specific memory in Quin's mafia career, which is less likely to happen if he's not being honest about his thoughts here. He could be making it up. But the memory is an old one, and it's not as if he's relying on it as a significant point here. It comes off like an incidental observation, which makes it feel more natural to me.

Scotty post:

Spoiler: show

I voted bea because
A) she is extremely cheery
B) she is the first in the poll
C) I don’t know if it’s pronounced “bay” or “bee” or “bah-ee”
But mainly e) her first post was quoting another post, which is suspicious.

Boom! Roasted.

I appreciate that Scotty elaborated on an otherwise random vote without being prompted. But I also don't know if he believes in this quote tell. I feel like I'm hung up on this but it's just because this post keeps coming up in my ISO's and I'm like "It has to mean something!" bea pointed out that he skipped a letter too.

I am so excited!!! Thank you guys for making this happen!!

Great opening post...good luck all

I just can’t believe this post exists AND I’m replying to it.

oop, Golden also started by quoting another post.

Ruh roh raggy

He brings it up again, although it's only in the post after so I can't say that this quote tell thing is a thing he's been specifically thinking about. If I say quote tell again I'm gonna shit pant.


There's nothing outrageous in Scotty's posts, which are very not-fluffy and of a significant amount. He's poking his head into pretty much everything. He reads a lot better if I just pretend the Eloh interactions don't exist, so I'ma leave the temmie idea at the door for now. I don't want to lynch either of them Day 1 for their own reasons (Scotty looks alright, I'm watching Eloh) so god knows who I'm voting.

After doing his homework on both players, Quin does not abandon his theory, but evidently he feels underwhelmed by the results of their individual ISOs. He expresses a desire to move on to other subjects. This, again, suggests to me that Quin's efforts were sincere.
He had a theory which required more digging.
He did the digging and raised some points which seemed to come naturally to hom.
He concluded that his theory was still viable, but not a lock, and turned his attention elsewhere:

Sike.

[VOTE: DharmaHelper] aubergine

He posts, yet he says nothing.

Once again, I do not care about the DH vote specifically. My argument for Quin to be town has nothing to do with whether or not his reads are accurate. I am only asking myself if I believe that they are authentic. I believe that they are.

As an additional point, I'll add that I've liked his approach to me on this day. Despite my repeated defense of him, he has kept me at arm's length and suggested that there are things lacking in my play. Quin and I go back a long time, and he perhaps knows my play better than anyone else in this game. I appreciate that he feels underwhelmed with the defense I have provided for him, and that a mystery element is missing from my play to this point in his eyes. A mafia Quin might be more content to leave me alone while I repeatedly shout about him being town.

[Sloonei]

@Sloonei is voting me because allegedly I should be more active. This is weak, why are you doing this?

I don't recall saying this.

It was implied in a post, you said I don't need incentive or something like that. I remember because I had to search to understand what you said
For me that means you say I wasn't active. Did I take it wrong?

You did, I apologize for being unclear.

Scotty asked me if my vote was because you had been inactive. When I said that you "don't need incentive", what I meant was that I don't think you're the kind of player who needs to be pressured into saying things. I trust you to be active and share your thoughts when you can.

I voted for you because you have not been a major topic of conversation and I was fishing for reactions. Not your reaction specifically, but the reactions of others. People like to project when they see a blank vote. I was hoping we'd get some projections.

[Sloonei]

[VOTE: DharmaHelper] aubergine

Because Golden is also doing this, and I want to be cool like Golden.

Let's go find out why Golden is doing this.

[Sloonei]

I moved my vote to [VOTE: DH] aubergine.

Sloonei feels very confident.

Why for?

To get your ass moving.

I see. And how has that ass moved, exactly?

Spoiler: show

I’m not town reading you yet, DH, and the absence of town reading you yet troubles me. Your tilde solving felt like a DH imitation.

This means nothing

You think i should consider it NAI?

No I meant that your post literally means nothing. You said nothing there. "You're imitating yourself" and "Because I don't think you're town, I can't not think you're bad"

Nothing.

Also, its NAI.

If it means nothing how did you manage to frame it up to mean something else that I didn’t say?

Because in the absence of meaning any meaning can be interjected by a skilled tactician. Thank you for both proving my point and complimenting me.

No, it can’t be given ‘any meaning’. It means exactly what it says. You saying it means something I didn’t say (that I ‘can’t help reading you as bad’ when I said ‘the absence of a town read troubled me’ is not finding a different meaning to it. It’s adding something that isn’t there.

I side with Golden in this kerfuffle, and not just because that was my predisposition. DH's objections feel arbitrary and/or to be missing the mark. That does not need to mean that he is mafia though.

While I'm talking about DH, I want to revisit a point that Scotty made yesterday. DH spent some time ISOing everybody on Day 1. And while that work is appreciated, and he came out of it with reads, I do not feel as though he has had much momentum in pursuing those reads since. There has not been much, if any, follow through on the work he started.

[Scotty]

You guys will get there eventuallt.

oh thank Cthulhu I can finally role check you tonite

Did you just role claim a mafia role?

[VOTE: LoRab] aubergine

For snipey pop-in

If pointing out a strange post makes me seem suspish to you, I’m ok with that.

These two posts go together. LoRab thinks this jokey scum claim from Scotty is alignment indicative (a later post clarifies this somewhat). I'm okay with that.

Do you sus Scotty for that ?

Not necessarily. I want to see how he responds.

Or with secrets in civvie roles, there’s also a chance he may be looking for votes as a civ thing.

So, really, I want to see how he responds.

Follows from the above, but I am confused at the "looking for votes as a civ thing" part. Need her to explain this.

Do you sus Scotty for that ?

Not necessarily. I want to see how he responds.

Or with secrets in civvie roles, there’s also a chance he may be looking for votes as a civ thing.

So, really, I want to see how he responds.

Hi.

Here’s my response:

Really? That’s the hill you’re leading a charge on? Yikes.

I wasn't leading a charge. I was noticing a weirdness. But ok.

Lorab did indeed pop in, as Vivax pointed out, just to call attention to my joke post. That…sure is something. She needs to offer more than that.

Obviously, I didn't read it as a joke post--to be fair, I was reading the entire day's worth of posts, so I likely missed tone. And I will offer more--as I said in the sign ups, I was away for a long weekend, so didn't have much time to get into the game. And yesterday was traveling back home yesterday. As I'm sure you remember, you'll get plenty more from me.

I'm going to assume that you are a civ, and that you are reading me as bad because you are not. But, keeping in mind that it could be a switcheroo.

Her conclusion from all this is that he's town, because scum reading LoRab in this game is a thing civilians do. But also, Scotty could be scum because 'switcheroo'. Do you think you deserve to be scum read, LoRab? I do.

I am not going to, but tempted to vote axehole, because he doesn’t seem to honor at all the way other people play, and not adapting to the way many of us are used to. Which is frustrating, and I’m trying not to let me suspect him because I’m annoyed. Similar with VIVA.

This post may as well have not been made. It has nothing to do with the game.

Voting Bea.

[VOTE: Bea] aubergine

I don’t suspect her much, but I don’t have a read on her yet. And I want her to come out and play more.

Give me a better reason than this for why you voted bea, please. The last two posts set you up to look like you were making the most inoffensive vote possible.

@LoRab got any reads yet?

I don’t like how quiet it is. Suggests the mafia are under no real pressure at all. The game is coasting.

Not really. I’m not thinking about bea and kate until tomorrow. And really wanting to know what happened to bea. I have more players I feel good about than am suspish of. Which makes sense in terms of numbers, but is annoying. Not wanting to name who I feel goosed about because don’t want to help mafia. And not convinced the game secrets don’t contain weirdness that makes the allegiances less obvious than they seem.

Revising what I said before. I misremembered this post as LoRab talking about not wanting to explain her town reads, which I thought was a bad look because she lacked the clout needed for scum to want to react to them. Now reading it again, that's all because Scotty specified town reads in his ISO. What a nugget. I'm not concerned if she's holding back on her scum reads.

I still have absolutely no idea what is going on in LoRab's head besides "Scotty could be either good or bad".

Not repeating Scotty's ISO in here, I agree with all of it. You said you have more time, so I'd appreciate you using it to respond to this, and provide reads. [VOTE: LoRab] aubergine

Do I “deserve” to be suspected? I mean, i don’t think I’ve ever played and not been suspected. Especially on here.

Indeed, I don’t have many reads. It’s day frigging 2 and I haven’t played in a while. Also, I tend to think more about mechanics than read early in games. Mainly because my reads on people come largely from pattern recognition of individual’s posts, which takes time.

To define terms: switchers= OMGUS. In the mafia culture I learned in, of which this site came from, that was the standard term.

Civvie roles that want to get voted out (often day 1) are not uncommon. And fake slipping is a way that role is often played.

I voted Bea because I usually read her fairly easily, but I don’t have a read on her yet. So I wanted her to know she has my eyeball on her.

I’m civ. I get that I’ve been quiet and that I don’t currently have strong reads. I also know that my style often reads bad on this site. I had thought maybe that would be the case in this old timers game, but here we are.

Im civv. Don’t know how to prove that or convince anyone of that. But none of what has been said about me is allignment indicative. It’s just me.

And, because someone will call me out if I don’t. Eye me all you want.

I unfortunately have yet to see you have any reads. This is different from your annoyance at being suspected for not having strong or many reads.
You even clarify that you don’t even have a read for bea, the only real person you’ve shown opinion for.

Furthermore, I don't see evidence in the thread of you thinking about mechanics either.

[Scotty]

You know what, I changed my mind. [VOTE: Quin] aubergine

…what? That’s some weird logical leaps. That’s like having a terrible meal at restaurant, jumping to your feet and explaining in outrage “this food is disgusting!” Then paying with a 30% tip and coming back the next day for lunch.

[Sloonei]

I have more players I feel good about than am suspish of. Which makes sense in terms of numbers, but is annoying. Not wanting to name who I feel good about because don’t want to help mafia

I think this point may make Lorab difficult to read, or cause us to default to suspicion against her. This mindset is a bit of a relic from an earlier era of Syndicate games, where sharing town reads was seen as a hindrance because it gave the mafia a team a roadmap of which players to kill first. This means we are unlikely to get the type of reads out of Lorab that we would normally want, even if she is town.