The Syndicate 2014 Game of Champions [ENDGAME]

[Long Con]

This lynch absolutely blows.

I'm pretty sure we have two civvies here... :/

I'll grant that you are 100% sure of your own alignment, but what makes you "pretty sure" of Bass being Civvie? I mean, I don't suspect him for anything in particular, but that's very different from being "pretty sure" that he's Civvie. Your statement gives me the feeling.

I think Bass is a civvie because when he is bad I believe him to be more engaged.

That's a really presumptuous way to figure out Bass' whole playstyle. Does that work for you in every game you play? He's that transparent?

[Dom]

This lynch absolutely blows.

I'm pretty sure we have two civvies here... :/

I'll grant that you are 100% sure of your own alignment, but what makes you "pretty sure" of Bass being Civvie? I mean, I don't suspect him for anything in particular, but that's very different from being "pretty sure" that he's Civvie. Your statement gives me the feeling.

I think Bass is a civvie because when he is bad I believe him to be more engaged.

That's a really presumptuous way to figure out Bass' whole playstyle. Does that work for you in every game you play? He's that transparent?

it makes me think he's more likely civvie than baddie yeah

[Boomslang]

I really am having trouble figuring out what to say this lynch. Obviously, I'm somewhat happy that Dom is getting attention, because I sure as hell don't deserve the tunnel vision hunt he's been throwing my way ever since Day 1. But jumping on that will make me seem bad, so... maybe I better keep my opinions to myself.

[Turnip Head]

This is probably one lynch where we should have all started voting early just to see what would happen next. I feel like I have nothing to go on right now, and one of the two candidates isn't even here. I have no idea what to do.

[Turnip Head]

I guess I really need to reread Dom and try to form an opinion on him. I've always felt Dom has two distinct playstyles, one hyper aggressive and one a bit more toned down, controlled, focused. But I've found that neither of those two playstyles correlates directly to his civ game or baddie game. At least that's my take on it, I feel like he always sort of subtly changes his persona for each game. He's a very hard read for me without anything else to go on.

[Turnip Head]

I also object to the notion that Bass is more involved when he's bad. I think RL does factor into his participation a lot, but also I think he's a player who takes it slow at the beginning of games and then picks it up toward the end. In WWE, Bass was almost nonexistent at the start of the game, until after I was NK'd on like Night 7 or whatever, and then I noticed in my deadness that he came out of the woodwork after that. He was a baddie in Doctor Who and I don't remember him being particularly active in that game either. He was a baddie in X-Men and had to be replaced I believe.

However, it is true that after he got recruited in both LOST (on RM) and in Monopoly, that he became more involved after that. But like I said, I feel like he ALWAYS starts games quiet.

[Dom]

I also object to the notion that Bass is more involved when he's bad. I think RL does factor into his participation a lot, but also I think he's a player who takes it slow at the beginning of games and then picks it up toward the end. In WWE, Bass was almost nonexistent at the start of the game, until after I was NK'd on like Night 7 or whatever, and then I noticed in my deadness that he came out of the woodwork after that. He was a baddie in Doctor Who and I don't remember him being particularly active in that game either. He was a baddie in X-Men and had to be replaced I believe.

However, it is true that after he got recruited in both LOST (on RM) and in Monopoly, that he became more involved after that. But like I said, I feel like he ALWAYS starts games quiet.

That might be true-- but I have always felt that a quieter bass means a bass who isn't being energized with btsc.

[Spacedaisy]

I must be a weirdo, because unlike everyone else I am ok with either of these two being lynched. In the case of Bass, I think the big thing for me is the fact Roxy suspects him. That speaks volumes to me. As far as Dom, I didn't suspect him all that much until his comment about them both being civ. That pinged big time. There are a good number of baddie roles that target people, if I was up against someone in a Tyler showdown then it would make me pretty darn suspicious of the other person. The fact he isn't seems to me that he is trying to look civ.

I have some other suspicions that have come from today too, but it is premature to discuss them really so I will leave it for now. I am perfectly happy to vote for either of these two at this point, but I am going to vote Dom because I feel like it might give us the most information since he has been much more vocal. I truly think both are likely bad though. I could be wrong but I just don't think I am.

[Made]

Hello friends, After a crazy application turn in buzzer beater because i don't know how to prioritize, i am back... catching up stand by

[Turnip Head]

That's a good point Daisy. I had forgotten that Roxy had mentioned being wary of Bass. Has she checked in yet? We know Bass isn't hogging the laptop

[Turnip Head]

I also object to the notion that Bass is more involved when he's bad. I think RL does factor into his participation a lot, but also I think he's a player who takes it slow at the beginning of games and then picks it up toward the end. In WWE, Bass was almost nonexistent at the start of the game, until after I was NK'd on like Night 7 or whatever, and then I noticed in my deadness that he came out of the woodwork after that. He was a baddie in Doctor Who and I don't remember him being particularly active in that game either. He was a baddie in X-Men and had to be replaced I believe.

However, it is true that after he got recruited in both LOST (on RM) and in Monopoly, that he became more involved after that. But like I said, I feel like he ALWAYS starts games quiet.

That might be true-- but I have always felt that a quieter bass means a bass who isn't being energized with btsc.

Okay, but I named at least three separate games where that was not the case.

[Made]

caught up. Missed the night poll, but would of voted TH

I also object to the notion that Bass is more involved when he's bad. I think RL does factor into his participation a lot, but also I think he's a player who takes it slow at the beginning of games and then picks it up toward the end. In WWE, Bass was almost nonexistent at the start of the game, until after I was NK'd on like Night 7 or whatever, and then I noticed in my deadness that he came out of the woodwork after that. He was a baddie in Doctor Who and I don't remember him being particularly active in that game either. He was a baddie in X-Men and had to be replaced I believe.

However, it is true that after he got recruited in both LOST (on RM) and in Monopoly, that he became more involved after that. But like I said, I feel like he ALWAYS starts games quiet.

Dom, regardless if you think Bass is bad or not, you are obligated as a civvie to get him killed, so do it.
That might be true-- but I have always felt that a quieter bass means a bass who isn't being energized with btsc.

Okay, but I named at least three separate games where that was not the case.

Regardless Dom, you are obligated to get Bass killed. You know your a civvie, and don't know if he is.

Dom seems to not want to ruffle many other feathers

I agree, it seems very out of character in comparison to my interactions with him in other games.

This all does fit nicely in the idea of Dom being Hattie. No one has claimed hatter effect because doing so would reveal who Tyler was if hatter is lynched today. Tbh this feels like a stretch. I agree that Dom has seemed passive this game relative to how he normally does me.
As for Bass spot read, I don't have one. He wasn't on my radar, which is suspicious in it's own right.
Now reading through Bass and Dom.

[Turnip Head]

What if Bass and Dom are on the same baddie team?

[Turnip Head]

It makes sense. Teammates are more likely than anyone to end up targeting the same person with their different powers, IMO.

I bet MP got double targeted by a baddie team last night.

[reywaS]

Sorry I haven't been involved the last few days. I'll do better now.

[Turnip Head]

Does Bass know that people associate his quietness with civvieness?

[zeek]

This all does fit nicely in the idea of Dom being Hattie. No one has claimed hatter effect because doing so would reveal who Tyler was if hatter is lynched today. Tbh this feels like a stretch. I agree that Dom has seemed passive this game relative to how he normally does me.
As for Bass spot read, I don't have one. He wasn't on my radar, which is suspicious in it's own right.
Now reading through Bass and Dom.

You know, I never really game any cred to the theory of Dom being the Hatter, but it does make sense that.

[S~V~S]

It makes sense. Teammates are more likely than anyone to end up targeting the same person with their different powers, IMO.

I bet MP got double targeted by a baddie team last night.

I don't ever recall being on a team that did this, although it is possible I have forgotten. You get more bang for your baddie buck, and learn more, by spreading it out.

I don't ever recall being BTS with you; is this something you do regularly yourself?

Everyone, when you are on a team do you recall more than one power being used often on the same person in the same night? I mean it's possible but you say it like it is common, like it happens all the time. And in a game where it is known that two people targeting the same person can cause a duel. I disagree, I find it unlikely.

[S~V~S]

I looked over the roles again, and the only real scenarios I see for beneficial double targeting would be Mr Boddy & The Warden, silencing & blackmailing the same person. Then the target can get role info revealed about them since they fail the blackmail. But it seems a small benefit to risk for the potential of accidentally double targeting Tyler. The risk, which would involve definitely losing one team member, does not seem worth the gain. Plus this team has lost Vince McMahon, so I cannot imagine any benefit that would outweigh the risk of accidentally targeting Tyler.

The other teams possibilities are Bavmorda/Crowley, which would provide a benefit if you knew for a fact who someone was. You could redirect their action one night, and prevent them from having an action the next night by double targeting them. But unless you knew the targets role, I would not see the point, and too much chance of targeting Tyler.

The only plausible scenario I see is based on not knowing what Horcruxes do. So it might benefit that team to double target one individual depending on the nature of the Horcruxes. But again, I don't see what gain would be worth risking Tyler.

I guess they could be baddies on opposing teams, though, I guess. But unless they are on a team that did not read the roles, double targetings seems way too risky to me.

I was thinking about trying for a tie, letting Stanley decide, but then, we have a few vote manip roles, so Unless there is a smoking gun that seems to clearly give us direction, I will probably vote towards the end.

[Long Con]

Well, if Dom says that Bass is likely to be a Civvie, then I guess that's that. Seems strange to me. If I was in a fight to the death with the Pope himself, you can bet your ass I would shank that mutha.

Dom, you had all the opportunity in the world to make a case that Bass is bad in order to save your life, and you did the opposite. So, from me, you get the opposite as well.

*votes Dom*

[Dom]

I must be a weirdo, because unlike everyone else I am ok with either of these two being lynched. In the case of Bass, I think the big thing for me is the fact Roxy suspects him. That speaks volumes to me. As far as Dom, I didn't suspect him all that much until his comment about them both being civ. That pinged big time. There are a good number of baddie roles that target people, if I was up against someone in a Tyler showdown then it would make me pretty darn suspicious of the other person. The fact he isn't seems to me that he is trying to look civ.

I have some other suspicions that have come from today too, but it is premature to discuss them really so I will leave it for now. I am perfectly happy to vote for either of these two at this point, but I am going to vote Dom because I feel like it might give us the most information since he has been much more vocal. I truly think both are likely bad though. I could be wrong but I just don't think I am.

So... I know my role.... and I have reason to believe that Bass is a civvie.... and me thinking we're both civvies somehow makes me bad?
That makes no sense.

I also object to the notion that Bass is more involved when he's bad. I think RL does factor into his participation a lot, but also I think he's a player who takes it slow at the beginning of games and then picks it up toward the end. In WWE, Bass was almost nonexistent at the start of the game, until after I was NK'd on like Night 7 or whatever, and then I noticed in my deadness that he came out of the woodwork after that. He was a baddie in Doctor Who and I don't remember him being particularly active in that game either. He was a baddie in X-Men and had to be replaced I believe.

However, it is true that after he got recruited in both LOST (on RM) and in Monopoly, that he became more involved after that. But like I said, I feel like he ALWAYS starts games quiet.

That might be true-- but I have always felt that a quieter bass means a bass who isn't being energized with btsc.

Okay, but I named at least three separate games where that was not the case.

Okay, but that isn't the experience I am used to with him. I appreciate your experience with him, but that's not what I've noticed.

It makes sense. Teammates are more likely than anyone to end up targeting the same person with their different powers, IMO.

I bet MP got double targeted by a baddie team last night.

Why?

Does Bass know that people associate his quietness with civvieness?

I don't know. I don't know that "people" associate the two. I know I do.

Well, if Dom says that Bass is likely to be a Civvie, then I guess that's that. Seems strange to me. If I was in a fight to the death with the Pope himself, you can bet your ass I would shank that mutha.

Dom, you had all the opportunity in the world to make a case that Bass is bad in order to save your life, and you did the opposite. So, from me, you get the opposite as well.

*votes Dom*

And if I built a case against someone I believe is civvie, you'd call me bad. There's no winning for me here-- especially with an absent bass.


What do I have to gain from saying bass is a civvie? Like what do people think is suspicious about that?

[Long Con]

Altruism to look Civvie. Like, say you're bad, and you want to look Civ. So you try to play people up so it looks like you and Bass are both Civ, going for the "well, Dom is here and Bass isn't, and Dom seems real Civvie with his generously sympathetic portrayal of Bass, so let's just go Bass."

And for the record, I only put this viewpoint forward because you specifically asked for it.

[Dom]

Altruism to look Civvie. Like, say you're bad, and you want to look Civ. So you try to play people up so it looks like you and Bass are both Civ, going for the "well, Dom is here and Bass isn't, and Dom seems real Civvie with his generously sympathetic portrayal of Bass, so let's just go Bass."

And for the record, I only put this viewpoint forward because you specifically asked for it.

Now, LC, if I built a case against someone I believe is civvie, then what would you all do?
Lynch me.

All I was saying is that we're stuck between a rock and a hard place.

[Spacedaisy]

If you built a case against bass it would only seem logical since you don't want to die. It wouldn't have made me think you're bad. But your actions this lynch period have convincedme you are bad. Like I said, I'm cool wth either of you being lynched. I think you're both bad.

[timmer]

I got called into work top do a double. I swear I will catch up on my Lunch break sorry guys.

[Dom]

If you built a case against bass it would only seem logical since you don't want to die. It wouldn't have made me think you're bad. But your actions this lynch period have convincedme you are bad. Like I said, I'm cool wth either of you being lynched. I think you're both bad.

I'm not saying I don't want you to lynch Bass, but I'm not saying I think he is bad. I obviously would like you to lynch him over me... I never said otherwise.
One comment has really been blown out of proportion about me thinking we have no good options here.
My "actions"? I literally said that I feel that we've got no options that benefit the civvies. If I had built a case against Bass when I think he is civvie, then what? Like, there's absolutely no winning for me in this situation.

[Dom]

AND bass isn't even here to talk about it-- what the hell am I supposed to say?

[Long Con]

Altruism to look Civvie. Like, say you're bad, and you want to look Civ. So you try to play people up so it looks like you and Bass are both Civ, going for the "well, Dom is here and Bass isn't, and Dom seems real Civvie with his generously sympathetic portrayal of Bass, so let's just go Bass."

And for the record, I only put this viewpoint forward because you specifically asked for it.

Now, LC, if I built a case against someone I believe is civvie, then what would you all do?
Lynch me.

All I was saying is that we're stuck between a rock and a hard place.

Sure, it's a hard place, but, like Spacedaisy, I wouldn't have thought you were a baddie who made a bogus case on a Civvie. I would have thought you were a player with one chance to continue playing in the Champions game, and that's to make Bass get lynched.

If I were in your situation, I would build my best damn case against Bass. It's highly unlikely I'll ever be in your situation though. That was what my comment about being in a knife fight with The Pope was about.

[Dom]

Altruism to look Civvie. Like, say you're bad, and you want to look Civ. So you try to play people up so it looks like you and Bass are both Civ, going for the "well, Dom is here and Bass isn't, and Dom seems real Civvie with his generously sympathetic portrayal of Bass, so let's just go Bass."

And for the record, I only put this viewpoint forward because you specifically asked for it.

Now, LC, if I built a case against someone I believe is civvie, then what would you all do?
Lynch me.

All I was saying is that we're stuck between a rock and a hard place.

Sure, it's a hard place, but, like Spacedaisy, I wouldn't have thought you were a baddie who made a bogus case on a Civvie. I would have thought you were a player with one chance to continue playing in the Champions game, and that's to make Bass get lynched.

If I were in your situation, I would build my best damn case against Bass. It's highly unlikely I'll ever be in your situation though. That was what my comment about being in a knife fight with The Pope was about.

Building a case against a player who isn't even here to respond to anything?
LC it sounds like you want me to commit suicide.

Yes, please lynch Bass over me-- I thought that would be my obvious opinion.

[Spacedaisy]

This post from SVS came on Thursday around 4:40 pm

This is gonna be a hard one for me. Dom seemed a bit straw graspy to me early on, but having read his tl;dr, I can see his points better. Not sure I agree with them, but I can see them. Bass has taken some flack for his general Bassiness, although Rox has said he could have been more present. Although he was not as posty during the pairs contest, I really do think he tried. He posted I think 6 times that day, which is more than he posted other days. Plus my experience of Bass is that he is vitalized by BTSC. He plays a more active baddie game.

After which you started talking about how bass is energized by BTSC in these posts:

I think Bass is a civvie because when he is bad I believe him to be more engaged.

That might be true-- but I have always felt that a quieter bass means a bass who isn't being energized with btsc.

My question is why are we only just now hearing this defense of bass? Why did no one say this when he was brought up on Day 3 for being suspicious to Roxy for his lack of participation?

[DharmaHelper]

This post from SVS came on Thursday around 4:40 pm

This is gonna be a hard one for me. Dom seemed a bit straw graspy to me early on, but having read his tl;dr, I can see his points better. Not sure I agree with them, but I can see them. Bass has taken some flack for his general Bassiness, although Rox has said he could have been more present. Although he was not as posty during the pairs contest, I really do think he tried. He posted I think 6 times that day, which is more than he posted other days. Plus my experience of Bass is that he is vitalized by BTSC. He plays a more active baddie game.

After which you started talking about how bass is energized by BTSC in these posts:

I think Bass is a civvie because when he is bad I believe him to be more engaged.

That might be true-- but I have always felt that a quieter bass means a bass who isn't being energized with btsc.

My question is why are we only just now hearing this defense of bass? Why did no one say this when he was brought up on Day 3 for being suspicious to Roxy for his lack of participation?

Well, if you're asking everyone, lets start with yourself. Why didn't you bring this up D3?

[Dom]

This post from SVS came on Thursday around 4:40 pm

This is gonna be a hard one for me. Dom seemed a bit straw graspy to me early on, but having read his tl;dr, I can see his points better. Not sure I agree with them, but I can see them. Bass has taken some flack for his general Bassiness, although Rox has said he could have been more present. Although he was not as posty during the pairs contest, I really do think he tried. He posted I think 6 times that day, which is more than he posted other days. Plus my experience of Bass is that he is vitalized by BTSC. He plays a more active baddie game.

After which you started talking about how bass is energized by BTSC in these posts:

I think Bass is a civvie because when he is bad I believe him to be more engaged.

That might be true-- but I have always felt that a quieter bass means a bass who isn't being energized with btsc.

My question is why are we only just now hearing this defense of bass? Why did no one say this when he was brought up on Day 3 for being suspicious to Roxy for his lack of participation?

I looked into it and read bass?
I responded to Roxy at the time with what I knew. Perhaps you missed that when you pulled these posts.
Do I have to read and do everything instantaneously for you?

[Long Con]

Building a case against a player who isn't even here to respond to anything?
LC it sounds like you want me to commit suicide.

Clearly we have different expectations about what would have happened. I guess that's fine, but from my perspective, you made the wrong decision.

From a personal standpoint, I hope you don't get lynched, to be honest. Bass is a fine dude and I enjoy playing with him, but you out of all players have been one of the most engaging to play with/against. Maybe because you have driven me crazy to the point of laying out a case pixel by pixel and doing a paragraph discussion on each one... but the more involved and invested one gets in a Mafia game, the more fun it is.

If I didn't vote for you, would you bring that Dom to the table?

My question is why are we only just now hearing this defense of bass? Why did no one say this when he was brought up on Day 3 for being suspicious to Roxy for his lack of participation?

Well, if you're asking everyone, lets start with yourself. Why didn't you bring this up D3?

OH, ask me, ask me!

[Spacedaisy]

Well, if you're asking everyone, lets start with yourself. Why didn't you bring this up D3?

The answer in my case is quite simple, I have no reason to believe this is true. I am not the one putting this forward as the being the case though. Are you protecting someone with that attempted redirect, DH?

Dom, you are telling me that you went back and read all of Bass' past games in the space of time from when he was brought up Day 3 until you posted those things this period? If that is the case why not say as much? it would have been much more compelling if this true, though I highly doubt it.

[Dom]

Building a case against a player who isn't even here to respond to anything?
LC it sounds like you want me to commit suicide.

Clearly we have different expectations about what would have happened. I guess that's fine, but from my perspective, you made the wrong decision.

From a personal standpoint, I hope you don't get lynched, to be honest. Bass is a fine dude and I enjoy playing with him, but you out of all players have been one of the most engaging to play with/against. Maybe because you have driven me crazy to the point of laying out a case pixel by pixel and doing a paragraph discussion on each one... but the more involved and invested one gets in a Mafia game, the more fun it is.

If I didn't vote for you, would you bring that Dom to the table?

My question is why are we only just now hearing this defense of bass? Why did no one say this when he was brought up on Day 3 for being suspicious to Roxy for his lack of participation?

Well, if you're asking everyone, lets start with yourself. Why didn't you bring this up D3?

OH, ask me, ask me!

If you hope I don't get lynched, then why are you voting for me?
Out of principle?
(Because that's what you're criticizing me for)


What would you like to discuss? What would you like me to get your immersion on within?


Daisy, please, why is that hard to believe? Does bass have a lot of posts?

[Dom]

Hint: He has 17 posts in 4 days.

[DharmaHelper]

Well, if you're asking everyone, lets start with yourself. Why didn't you bring this up D3?

The answer in my case is quite simple, I have no reason to believe this is true. I am not the one putting this forward as the being the case though. Are you protecting someone with that attempted redirect, DH?

Dom, you are telling me that you went back and read all of Bass' past games in the space of time from when he was brought up Day 3 until you posted those things this period? If that is the case why not say as much? it would have been much more compelling if this true, though I highly doubt it.

What do you mean attempted redirect? Is it really that objectionable to ask you to answer your own question?

[Dom]

I'm out for a little while, Daisy, would you stop antagonizing me and just vote me if you think I'm bad?

[Spacedaisy]

Dom, you are telling me that you went back and read all of Bass' past games in the space of time from when he was brought up Day 3 until you posted those things this period? If that is the case why not say as much? it would have been much more compelling if this true, though I highly doubt it.

Clearly you missed what my question was. Your argument was based in the idea that a baddie bass (having BTSC) would be more engaged. When asked why you didn't bring this up when he was first called out for being disengaged you said it was because you went back and read him during that time, but in order for that answer to make any sense would mean you had read his past games in order to understand how a bad bass would have responded.

DH, obviously it is not a problem for me since I just answered the question. Let me speak clearly to be sure you understood. I don't think it is true, which is why I did not present it then or now. TH has already give examples where it wasn't. I want to know why the people who are saying they believe this now did not say it back then. I think it is a fair question, and a revealing one as well.

Linki: I thought I already had, apologies. I'm not antagonizing Dom, I'm just playing the game and on a personal note I have nothing but respect for you as a player.and you're an awesome guy I just happen to really suspect at the moment.

[DharmaHelper]

DH, obviously it is not a problem for me since I just answered the question. Let me speak clearly to be sure you understood. I don't think it is true, which is why I did not present it then or now. TH has already give examples where it wasn't. I want to know why the people who are saying they believe this now did not say it back then. I think it is a fair question, and a revealing one as well.

If its not a problem why did you immediately accuse me of trying to save someone with a redirect? Seems like an overblown reaction compared to a response that could have just been "I don't subscribe to the thought that Bass is more engaged when he has BTSC, so I didn't bring that up as a possibility."

We're just having a conversation.

Personally, I don't know bass well enough to comment one way or the other. I do know Dom though, or at least I'd like to think.. His most recent posts remind me of his play in Avante Guarde. He was a baddie.

[Turnip Head]

It makes sense. Teammates are more likely than anyone to end up targeting the same person with their different powers, IMO.

I bet MP got double targeted by a baddie team last night.

I don't ever recall being on a team that did this, although it is possible I have forgotten. You get more bang for your baddie buck, and learn more, by spreading it out.

I don't ever recall being BTS with you; is this something you do regularly yourself?

Everyone, when you are on a team do you recall more than one power being used often on the same person in the same night? I mean it's possible but you say it like it is common, like it happens all the time. And in a game where it is known that two people targeting the same person can cause a duel. I disagree, I find it unlikely.

First, full disclosure I was definitely stoned when I came up with that theory I didn't really factor in that a team should be on the lookout for something like this happening. A smart and careful baddie team would not do this in this game. But yes I've been on a baddie team where we used more than one power on the same player, if it made strategic sense to do so. I've been on a team that would roleblock our NK target so that they couldn't protect themselves or what have you. Looking at the baddie roles though, there's not much incentive for either team to use two powers on the same player unless we're talking about the horcruxes maybe.

That said I still feel like something seems off about Dom defending Bass. But I have no idea how I'd play if I were in the same situation as Dom in any game, civvie or baddie. But I don't think I'd defend my competition. I think I would look for as much evidence as possible that my opponent was bad. But if I genuinely didn't find the player suspicious, how would I act? I'm not sure.

[Dom]

Dom, you are telling me that you went back and read all of Bass' past games in the space of time from when he was brought up Day 3 until you posted those things this period? If that is the case why not say as much? it would have been much more compelling if this true, though I highly doubt it.

Clearly you missed what my question was. Your argument was based in the idea that a baddie bass (having BTSC) would be more engaged. When asked why you didn't bring this up when he was first called out for being disengaged you said it was because you went back and read him during that time, but in order for that answer to make any sense would mean you had read his past games in order to understand how a bad bass would have responded.

DH, obviously it is not a problem for me since I just answered the question. Let me speak clearly to be sure you understood. I don't think it is true, which is why I did not present it then or now. TH has already give examples where it wasn't. I want to know why the people who are saying they believe this now did not say it back then. I think it is a fair question, and a revealing one as well.

Linki: I thought I already had, apologies. I'm not antagonizing Dom, I'm just playing the game and on a personal note I have nothing but respect for you as a player.and you're an awesome guy I just happen to really suspect at the moment.

I know... I just think you're trying to get something out of me to manipulate...
I clearly did not read all of Bass's past games.
Why the hell would I ever do that?

It makes sense. Teammates are more likely than anyone to end up targeting the same person with their different powers, IMO.

I bet MP got double targeted by a baddie team last night.

I don't ever recall being on a team that did this, although it is possible I have forgotten. You get more bang for your baddie buck, and learn more, by spreading it out.

I don't ever recall being BTS with you; is this something you do regularly yourself?

Everyone, when you are on a team do you recall more than one power being used often on the same person in the same night? I mean it's possible but you say it like it is common, like it happens all the time. And in a game where it is known that two people targeting the same person can cause a duel. I disagree, I find it unlikely.

First, full disclosure I was definitely stoned when I came up with that theory I didn't really factor in that a team should be on the lookout for something like this happening. A smart and careful baddie team would not do this in this game. But yes I've been on a baddie team where we used more than one power on the same player, if it made strategic sense to do so. I've been on a team that would roleblock our NK target so that they couldn't protect themselves or what have you. Looking at the baddie roles though, there's not much incentive for either team to use two powers on the same player unless we're talking about the horcruxes maybe.

That said I still feel like something seems off about Dom defending Bass. But I have no idea how I'd play if I were in the same situation as Dom in any game, civvie or baddie. But I don't think I'd defend my competition. I think I would look for as much evidence as possible that my opponent was bad. But if I genuinely didn't find the player suspicious, how would I act? I'm not sure.

Why did you think MP was double targeted?

[Dom]

(not going out for a bit now)

[Long Con]

If you hope I don't get lynched, then why are you voting for me?
Out of principle?
(Because that's what you're criticizing me for)

I would say there is a massive chasm of difference between your situation and mine, and any criticisms would have an equally vast difference. "Principle". That's so broad.

I voted for you because your actions made me suspicious that you're a baddie. I could easily be wrong about that. Was your targeting of Tyler benign, or offensive? Have you asked the host if you're allowed to reveal anything about Tyler's identity? Is that something you're interested in doing? There's an argument that knowing who Tyler is would a) keep this situation from happening again, b) show us someone we seemingly don't need to suspect, and c) pretty much ensure a Champions Win for Tyler Durden.

[Long Con]

Spacedaisy, I think it's a little harsh to put this "read the past games" thing on Dom. It's reasonable to think that he would be motivated to think more about Bass in this situation, and specifically recall past games in his mind, and then analyze the behaviour he remembers.

That said, please don't ever expect me to do that. That's just not how my mind operates for the most part. I know I've said it already in this game, but it's just something I've realized, and I don't want to be expected to be able to do it. Ever.

[Dom]

If you hope I don't get lynched, then why are you voting for me?
Out of principle?
(Because that's what you're criticizing me for)

I would say there is a massive chasm of difference between your situation and mine, and any criticisms would have an equally vast difference. "Principle". That's so broad.

I voted for you because your actions made me suspicious that you're a baddie. I could easily be wrong about that. Was your targeting of Tyler benign, or offensive? Have you asked the host if you're allowed to reveal anything about Tyler's identity? Is that something you're interested in doing? There's an argument that knowing who Tyler is would a) keep this situation from happening again, b) show us someone we seemingly don't need to suspect, and c) pretty much ensure a Champions Win for Tyler Durden.

I'm not sure what you're getting at.

[Long Con]

I think that Roxy and MP are both silenced. They're both in here like ghosts, I can see them but they do not participate.

Which is funny, because yesterday I saw Roxy reading the thread, and that's when I said "I bet Roxy's not silenced!", expecting her to post... but she never did. So I'm glad no one took that bet.

[Long Con]

If you hope I don't get lynched, then why are you voting for me?
Out of principle?
(Because that's what you're criticizing me for)

I would say there is a massive chasm of difference between your situation and mine, and any criticisms would have an equally vast difference. "Principle". That's so broad.

I voted for you because your actions made me suspicious that you're a baddie. I could easily be wrong about that. Was your targeting of Tyler benign, or offensive? Have you asked the host if you're allowed to reveal anything about Tyler's identity? Is that something you're interested in doing? There's an argument that knowing who Tyler is would a) keep this situation from happening again, b) show us someone we seemingly don't need to suspect, and c) pretty much ensure a Champions Win for Tyler Durden.

I'm not sure what you're getting at.

You know who Tyler Durden is.

[Spacedaisy]

I don't expect him to, or anyone to. I don't and wouldn't myself. And I apologize that you think that is what's saying or that I'm being harsh. The way I read his answer was that he had read bass and that was why he brought it up now but not before. But to me that implies he read his past games since the topic of discussion was already that he was disengaged. If people were tossing that around as a reasoning to vote someone that I had in the past experienced to play that way when they were a civ without BTSC, my response on the spot would be yeah but he usually plays this way when he has no BTSC. Him saying what made him bring it up now was reading back on Bass would imply to me he had read bass past games.

Dom, I'm not manipulating you. I'm pointing out inconsistencies in what I am seeing.

On that note I have a movie to finish watching before I go take a drug test for the job I was offered (yay!)

[Dom]

If you hope I don't get lynched, then why are you voting for me?
Out of principle?
(Because that's what you're criticizing me for)

I would say there is a massive chasm of difference between your situation and mine, and any criticisms would have an equally vast difference. "Principle". That's so broad.

I voted for you because your actions made me suspicious that you're a baddie. I could easily be wrong about that. Was your targeting of Tyler benign, or offensive? Have you asked the host if you're allowed to reveal anything about Tyler's identity? Is that something you're interested in doing? There's an argument that knowing who Tyler is would a) keep this situation from happening again, b) show us someone we seemingly don't need to suspect, and c) pretty much ensure a Champions Win for Tyler Durden.

I'm not sure what you're getting at.

You know who Tyler Durden is.

Yes.... potentially (allowing for redirects, and special cases we discussed earlier)

I'm not sure I can share who it was I targeted.
I'm waiting on a few pieces of information.

But beyond that, how would the rest of your argument follow- I don't understand.