[END] Avant-Garde Mafia 2

[timmer]

I can put myself in "civvie FH" and "baddie FH"'s theoretical shoes and see different reasons for revealing versus not, so the whole thing is impossible to really gauge imo. The sticky point is basically what BWT said. This all started with FH choosing the "wrong" color by mistake. That, more than anything, is troublesome.

@Boats, buddy, I'm hoping to see a little more from you. Just saying you are going to "trust people" now is an empty-sounding statement that just sounds like you are posting to post. Who are your suspects? Why? Who do you feel is civvie?

[Kate]

the other troublesome part, is that she said first she chose the colors because they were her fav. then said, after I got them I realized the color code, but then forgot again (?) and chose green...?

[Dom]

the other troublesome part, is that she said first she chose the colors because they were her fav. then said, after I got them I realized the color code, but then forgot again (?) and chose green...?

T H I S

Did you HAVE to reveal the secrets to everyone? (anyone who has read a book)

[Kate]

NO, it was optional.

[Dom]

NO, it was optional.

OK, well her decision to publish Zappa doesn't incriminate her as much as reading the Green book in general. It's possible that Zappa could go baddie, so that's kind of good to know.

[Flyin' High]

If the secret hadn't been about the potential of Zappa turning to the dark side I'd have kept it to myself. Also, as you can see, there are two different shades of green. The lighter, second shade was a secret that even Zappa himself didn't know. So I decided I'd be doing him a favor by revealing it.

I had the best of civvie intentions in mind.

And sorry for being absent-minded and picking the wrong book. Just like with me making the occasional mistake in voting records, I am not perfect.

@Dom: There was over 48 hours between me choosing the two books I wanted and then deciding which book to read--so yes, me forgetting and making a foolishly hasty decision is totally possible. It's not like I made the connecting then forgot it two minutes later.

[Dom]

If the secret hadn't been about the potential of Zappa turning to the dark side I'd have kept it to myself. Also, as you can see, there are two different shades of green. The lighter, second shade was a secret that even Zappa himself didn't know. So I decided I'd be doing him a favor by revealing it.

I had the best of civvie intentions in mind.

And sorry for being absent-minded and picking the wrong book. Just like with me making the occasional mistake in voting records, I am not perfect.

@Dom: There was over 48 hours between me choosing the two books I wanted and then deciding which book to read--so yes, me forgetting and making a foolishly hasty decision is totally possible. It's not like I made the connecting then forgot it two minutes later.

[reywaS]

Well, this is all very interesting.

BWT...So, you won a prize for finishing 3rd in the poker tournament? I finished 2nd and didn't win anything. The only thing I got from the poker tournament was the -1 vote which everyone ended up being a part of.

[S~V~S]

@Kate: Again, if you knew I had a book, or guessed (which makes sense, not arguing that) why do you not find it strange that BWT didn't win his book from the same contest as you and me? I'm not sure what it means, personally, I just find it odd.

Correct me if i am wrong, but this reads like a textbook example of a classic distraction. There is more than one way to win a prize

I am not sure what i think of this. FH sounds very plausible, but then she always does. And i know her to be competent and really, really smart. I don;t know that I buy all this "Whoopsy, silly me, i forgot "

I just did a skim, I have to reread more deeply, and then do the reread i said I planned to do.

[timmer]

Well, this is all very interesting.

BWT...So, you won a prize for finishing 3rd in the poker tournament? I finished 2nd and didn't win anything. The only thing I got from the poker tournament was the -1 vote which everyone ended up being a part of.

[Kate]

Don't let her divert your attn timmer.

[Dom]

Don't let her divert your attn timmer.

I typed a post to say this to timmer and you beat me.

[Kate]

I think she was just hoping I wouldn't be able to figure it or have the balls to call her on it in the thread.

[triceratopzeuhl]

HM

Books

Also I think BWT meant 3rd in the posting challenge, and mistyped. That way would actually make sense.

And for the record I believe there are benefits for us to be able to know what other civs are capable of as well. I mean, Damo Suzuki just killed a civvie last night. Their actions affect us this game too, not just those of the baddies.

[triceratopzeuhl]

Not benefits that outweigh the benefits of knowing baddie powers, but it's not a total loss. I do buy that she wasn't thinking about the colors. BWT said he made the connection that red=indy himself, so it can't have been explicitly explained with the doling of the prize

[S~V~S]

Day 3: The Ultimate Event - Results

Rank	Player	# of Posts	# of Words	# of Theories	Total Score
1	Flyin' High	16	1575	3	1713
2	Kate	41	1225	1	1378
3	birdwithteeth11	10	1292	1	1352
4	Mr. Droopy Cash	19	1224	1	1311
5	S~V~S	18	1155	3	1299
6	reywaS	16	610	3	748
7	triceratopzeuhl	18	609	1	693
8	DharmaHelper	23	595	0	664
9	Epignosis	11	468	3	591
10	chaindeath	4	469	1	511
11	Benthayer15/juliets	2	422	1	458
12	AceofSpaces	7	403	1	454
13	rabbit8	15	378	1	453
14	Captain Bunny Killer	4	365	0	377
15	DisgruntledPorcupine	17	237	1	318
16	LittleTiger	6	289	0	307
17	insertnamehere	11	190	1	253
18	BoatsBoatsBoats	6	152	1	200
19	Jokreher	1	158	0	161
20	Vompatti	10	111	0	141
21	Boomslang	6	121	0	139
22	The Truth	7	116	0	137
23	Roxy	0	0	0	0

Total Score = (# of Posts x 3) + (# of Words x 1) + (# of Theories x 30)

Theories must be original (theories copied from another player do not count) and must meet the host's subjective judgment of what a theory constitutes. When grading, be sure to note the difference between suspicion and theory.
Clearly off-topic posts/content are not eligible.



Flyin' High wins first place!
Kate wins second place!
birdwithteeth11 wins third place![/color]

Yeah that would be my guess too.

Yay for trying to make something out of nothing

[triceratopzeuhl]

Hey uh Sockface, should you change Roxy to read Timmer in the lynch poll?

[reywaS]

HM

Books

Also I think BWT meant 3rd in the posting challenge, and mistyped. That way would actually make sense.

And for the record I believe there are benefits for us to be able to know what other civs are capable of as well. I mean, Damo Suzuki just killed a civvie last night. Their actions affect us this game too, not just those of the baddies.

But that's not what he said or meant. He later clarified that he did, in fact, win the book prize from the poker tournament and that he won some other prize from the posting challenge. If he misspoke, I would think he would come back and say so. This seems very strange to me.

[S~V~S]

Can you quote that, I haven't found it yet?

[reywaS]

are you talking to me?

[S~V~S]

@FH: Nope. I won it from the poker tournament. I ended up finishing 3rd, so I was assuming the rest of the top 2 won another book. I guess I was wrong.

And yeah, if you had both green and purple, what was your reasoning for choosing green over purple? I at least figured the red book had something to do with the indy roles, so I'm sure you could have figured it out based on the book colors.

NVM, here it is

Still, I don;t think the source of the prize is all that big of a deal. Actually, implying it did kinda makes FH look more guilty to me.

[S~V~S]

are you talking to me?

i was. You made a stement about what someone said without quoting it, so I asked to see it, but then found it myself

[reywaS]

You don't think it's strange that bwt said he won a prize in the poker tourney for finishing 3rd when I finished 2nd and didn't win anything?

[Kate]

HM

Books

Also I think BWT meant 3rd in the posting challenge, and mistyped. That way would actually make sense.

And for the record I believe there are benefits for us to be able to know what other civs are capable of as well. I mean, Damo Suzuki just killed a civvie last night. Their actions affect us this game too, not just those of the baddies.

Huh? Chain death? Was he confirmed somehow?

[reywaS]

HM

Books

Also I think BWT meant 3rd in the posting challenge, and mistyped. That way would actually make sense.

And for the record I believe there are benefits for us to be able to know what other civs are capable of as well. I mean, Damo Suzuki just killed a civvie last night. Their actions affect us this game too, not just those of the baddies.

Huh? Chain death? Was he confirmed somehow?

I was about to comment on this, too. So, this is me asking the same question as Kate.

[S~V~S]

You don't think it's strange that bwt said he won a prize in the poker tourney for finishing 3rd when I finished 2nd and didn't win anything?

Maybe, but the point was that he won a prize. Maybe he misunderstood where he won it, or misstated. But Kate says he won a prize, and so does FH. He won one. The issue I thought was what was done with the prize. BWT won a prize and revealed a baddie secret.

As opposed to FH who revealed a civvie secret.

This appears to just be a distraction to me. He won a prize, obviously. I am sure the source will be determined at some point.

@MP~ Mr Sox, will you tell us how BWT won a prize?

[reywaS]

He's saying he won 2 prizes. He says he got the book from the poker tournament whereas FH and Kate say that their books came from the posting challenge. BWT says he won something completely different from the posting challenge. It all seems strange to me.

[S~V~S]

Maybe it is strange. Maybe he is lying about prizes, maybe he is hoarding prizes in a closet. That does not change the fact though that he somehow won a book and revealed a baddie secret, and she did not

So it is an interesting sidelight, and I hope he comes in and clears it up. But it does not make me less suspicious of FH.

[LittleTiger]

I think she was just hoping I wouldn't be able to figure it or have the balls to call her on it in the thread.

That whole exchange was excellent! I am actually pretty shocked that FH confessed in the way she did - you are a good lawyer I find it very odd that FH would choose to read the green book vs the purple book.

He's saying he won 2 prizes. He says he got the book from the poker tournament whereas FH and Kate say that their books came from the posting challenge. BWT says he won something completely different from the posting challenge. It all seems strange to me.

That is strange. Not sure it amounts to anything though. Just odd though....

Hey uh Sockface, should you change Roxy to read Timmer in the lynch poll?

If he does that, it will reset the poll.

[reywaS]

Maybe it is strange. Maybe he is lying about prizes, maybe he is hoarding prizes in a closet. That does not change the fact though that he somehow won a book and revealed a baddie secret, and she did not

So it is an interesting sidelight, and I hope he comes in and clears it up. But it does not make me less suspicious of FH.

I'm not trying to lessen any suspicion on FH. I agree with it.

[Tangrowth]

@MP~ Mr Sox, will you tell us how BWT won a prize?

All Books of Knowledge were awarded as the result of the posting challenge. Not the poker tournament.

[S~V~S]

Thank You O Wooly One

[Tangrowth]

Also, I cannot reset the poll, but I realize I accidentally left Roxy instead of putting Dom.

If you wish to vote for Dom, please vote Roxy.
If you wish to vote for timmer, please vote Captain Bunny Killer.

[S~V~S]

I would like to ask a favor. There is a picture in the Six Feet Under game submission of a lime green hearse right at the top of the page. Kate says she cannot see it, but i can, in all formats. Can you guys look at it and let us know if you see it (post it in the thread, not this one, lol)

viewtopic.php?f=7&p=3714#p3714

[triceratopzeuhl]

Also, I cannot reset the poll, but I realize I accidentally left Roxy instead of putting Dom.

If you wish to vote for Dom, please vote Roxy.
If you wish to vote for timmer, please vote Captain Bunny Killer.

er yeah that was what I meant

But that's not what he said or meant. He later clarified that he did, in fact, win the book prize from the poker tournament and that he won some other prize from the posting challenge. If he misspoke, I would think he would come back and say so. This seems very strange to me.

On re-read, you're right. And yet Alex claims otherwise. Would BWT have any motivation to lie about that, or was he just confused

HM

Books

Also I think BWT meant 3rd in the posting challenge, and mistyped. That way would actually make sense.

And for the record I believe there are benefits for us to be able to know what other civs are capable of as well. I mean, Damo Suzuki just killed a civvie last night. Their actions affect us this game too, not just those of the baddies.

Huh? Chain death? Was he confirmed somehow?

I keep mistyping things that make me look like an idiot, it should have said something like killed (as a civvie) last night.

[triceratopzeuhl]

In regards to Damo Suzuki, my initial interpretation of his role definitely didn't involve a night kill. The impression I got was that giving people objects from the bag is supposed to be a good thing, and yet somebody just got killed by it. Like I said earlier, Damo might have had no control over it.

[S~V~S]

Ha ha, in my experience objects from a bag can be lethal. I have had people with similar roles give me bombs. You never know

[juliets]

Maybe it is strange. Maybe he is lying about prizes, maybe he is hoarding prizes in a closet. That does not change the fact though that he somehow won a book and revealed a baddie secret, and she did not

So it is an interesting sidelight, and I hope he comes in and clears it up. But it does not make me less suspicious of FH.

I'm not trying to lessen any suspicion on FH. I agree with it.

I'm just as suspicious of FH but i think the bwt thing is important on its own. Why would he win something and the #2 person didn't? It doesn't seem like he mispoke because he clarified in the thread. Until bwt explains it or MP does, I will be suspicious there as well as FH.

[S~V~S]

MP Said he won it in the posting contest. It's like 5 posts up ^^

[LittleTiger]

Maybe it is strange. Maybe he is lying about prizes, maybe he is hoarding prizes in a closet. That does not change the fact though that he somehow won a book and revealed a baddie secret, and she did not

So it is an interesting sidelight, and I hope he comes in and clears it up. But it does not make me less suspicious of FH.

I'm not trying to lessen any suspicion on FH. I agree with it.

I'm just as suspicious of FH but i think the bwt thing is important on its own. Why would he win something and the #2 person didn't? It doesn't seem like he mispoke because he clarified in the thread. Until bwt explains it or MP does, I will be suspicious there as well as FH.

@MP~ Mr Sox, will you tell us how BWT won a prize?

All Books of Knowledge were awarded as the result of the posting challenge. Not the poker tournament.

See above, juliets - MP did already clarify.

[DharmaHelper]

Vote LT

[Epignosis]

Any reason why?

[DharmaHelper]

Yeah.

[Epignosis]

Okay, just making sure.

[DharmaHelper]

Any reason why?

1. In both the Droopy and Vomp votes, LT voted within 1 vote of Aces and Boats. I want to check the validity of the "baddies phoned it in"theory.
2. LT's response to my vote analysis was blown up and over the top, classic baddie LT.
3. LT's ignored me going after her all day today. Didn't even comment on me saying I'd vote for her unless someone confessed. Civvie LT would not have let that go.

So. There you go. Reasons.

[S~V~S]

*Sigh*

Because she is on a Venn diagram somewhere and has not been subject to a bandwagon, i would guess.

DH, I so want to believe you at times, but you make it so hard </3

Linki~ civvies can vote in clusters as well.

[DharmaHelper]

Well, whatever.

[S~V~S]

See, the problem is your clusters always have people i think are civvies in them.

So, yeah.

[DharmaHelper]

*Sigh*

Because she is on a Venn diagram somewhere and has not been subject to a bandwagon, i would guess.

DH, I so want to believe you at times, but you make it so hard </3

Linki~ civvies can vote in clusters as well.

2. LT's response to my vote analysis was blown up and over the top, classic baddie LT.
3. LT's ignored me going after her all day today. Didn't even comment on me saying I'd vote for her unless someone confessed. Civvie LT would not have let that go.

[BoatsBoatsBoats]

@Boats, buddy, I'm hoping to see a little more from you. Just saying you are going to "trust people" now is an empty-sounding statement that just sounds like you are posting to post. Who are your suspects? Why? Who do you feel is civvie?

I've been studying for finals, so I guess that's my only excuse. At this point, I really see everyone as a civ until proven otherwise. I've been doing this ever since Vomps was lynched and I was absolutely convinced that he was a baddie.