The Syndicate

Dyslexicon, if you're still around, can you tell me what your opinion is of the new Spacedaisy?

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:01 am Oh great. You did not pay attetion. Anyway, I will need to deal with this later. Shush!

Oops.

I didn't quite gather all of your intended meaning there, but I think I follow in alignment terms. I'm not keeping my vote here.

[mention]speedchuck[/mention], Dyslexicon read right now GO

Kylemii wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:02 am

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sat Jan 20, 2018 11:29 pm

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sat Jan 20, 2018 11:11 pm Fam if you wouldn't mind I had a Kyle and long con team as a good possibility. Would you mind looking at their interactions and sharing with me your thoughts when you have a moment?

I did a brief search. They seemed to have a small flare up early in the game around the Day 0 Kyle nonsense, but after that they both seemed to quietly settled on town reads of each other with little visible movement in the thread. That's something I wouldn't mind talking about.
@Kylemii @Long Con, mind elaborating on how your early reads of one another developed?

I initially viewed his cropping of my post as being opportunistic and sneaky, I felt better when he apologized later I felt better about him, it seemed like a realistic mistake. Coming into day 2 I decided to press a tiny reset button in my brain. Many of my day 1 reads were poisoned by emotions and stress. LC's case he made coming into today gave me an impression of good. I've seen LC in many games and been disappointed by his lack of involvement. (not in a shame on you way but like in a, I wish LC would play more way] so seeing a case from him at all was a sign of proactiveness, indicative ofpositive vibes

Talk about your read of him at the point of this GTH list: The town read you're describing right now speaks to his Day 2 involvement, but you had him down as good prior to today as well.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sat Jan 20, 2018 11:58 pm

LoRab wrote: ↑Sat Jan 20, 2018 11:50 pmWell, we already know I'm suspicious of Epi. Looking at LC's post on speedchuck, his main point against him was that he jumped on the kylewagon and then didn't let go--which is simmilar to what he did here. So, that makes me eyeball him more. Wilgy? I have no idea. He's Wilgy. 3J I don't suspect for this.

What do you think?

I think that the substance of your Epignosis suspicion is unclear. I see that you are suspicious of him, but I don't quite see why. Could you talk more about that?
I'm also not sure what to make of your speedchuck suspicion here. what is the relationship between Long Con's case against speedchuck, speedchuck's pressure of kyle, and speedchuck's involvement in this nutella bandwagon?

My suspicion of Epi is that he's going after players in a way that he does when he's bad, particularly when he's bad in a speed game--I've tried to explain it a few times now...not sure how to differently articulate my feelings.

And my suspicion of speedchuck, based on his jumping on the LA bandwagon, coupled wit LC's case--which I read as, essentially, jumpting on the kyle bandwagon--show a pattern of behavior which I don't see as civ behavior. Does that make more sense?

LoRab wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:07 am
My suspicion of Epi is that he's going after players in a way that he does when he's bad, particularly when he's bad in a speed game--I've tried to explain it a few times now...not sure how to differently articulate my feelings.

I'm Epi, and I don't know what you're talking about.

You can name twelve different methods and accuse me of doing those things when I am bad and still be accurate.

Epignosis wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:10 am

LoRab wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:07 am
My suspicion of Epi is that he's going after players in a way that he does when he's bad, particularly when he's bad in a speed game--I've tried to explain it a few times now...not sure how to differently articulate my feelings.

I'm Epi, and I don't know what you're talking about.

You can name twelve different methods and accuse me of doing those things when I am bad and still be accurate.

Why aren't you lynching Sloonei today?

LoRab wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:07 am

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sat Jan 20, 2018 11:58 pm

LoRab wrote: ↑Sat Jan 20, 2018 11:50 pmWell, we already know I'm suspicious of Epi. Looking at LC's post on speedchuck, his main point against him was that he jumped on the kylewagon and then didn't let go--which is simmilar to what he did here. So, that makes me eyeball him more. Wilgy? I have no idea. He's Wilgy. 3J I don't suspect for this.

What do you think?

I think that the substance of your Epignosis suspicion is unclear. I see that you are suspicious of him, but I don't quite see why. Could you talk more about that?
I'm also not sure what to make of your speedchuck suspicion here. what is the relationship between Long Con's case against speedchuck, speedchuck's pressure of kyle, and speedchuck's involvement in this nutella bandwagon?

My suspicion of Epi is that he's going after players in a way that he does when he's bad, particularly when he's bad in a speed game--I've tried to explain it a few times now...not sure how to differently articulate my feelings.

Could you point to an example of him doing this on Day 2?

And my suspicion of speedchuck, based on his jumping on the LA bandwagon, coupled wit LC's case--which I read as, essentially, jumpting on the kyle bandwagon--show a pattern of behavior which I don't see as civ behavior. Does that make more sense?

I'm not sure. What is "unciv" about taking part in these particular bandwagons?

I was just reading FZ's ISO, and found myself developing a perspective:

My reads on FZ and Long Con are backwards. I don't think FZ is mafia and LC might be. I'm going to dig deeper and expand, just putting this out here now.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:11 am

Epignosis wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:10 am

LoRab wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:07 am
My suspicion of Epi is that he's going after players in a way that he does when he's bad, particularly when he's bad in a speed game--I've tried to explain it a few times now...not sure how to differently articulate my feelings.

I'm Epi, and I don't know what you're talking about.

You can name twelve different methods and accuse me of doing those things when I am bad and still be accurate.

Why aren't you lynching Sloonei today?

Too much new בּוּלְשִׁיט to process.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:04 am speedchuck, Dyslexicon read right now GO

GTH scum

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:01 am

speedchuck wrote: ↑Sat Jan 20, 2018 11:56 pm Mac
Epi
LC

Wilgy

FZ
nutella
Kyle
daisy 2
JJJ

Marmot
Nova

Sloonei
Dizzy
LoRab

This is the readlist I posted earlier, now without color or reasons

Does this reflect your current feelings?

Pretty well, yeah

speedchuck wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:15 am

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:04 am speedchuck, Dyslexicon read right now GO

GTH scum

Has anything happened to your read on Dizzy over the last hour or so?

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:16 am

speedchuck wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:15 am

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:04 am speedchuck, Dyslexicon read right now GO

GTH scum

Has anything happened to your read on Dizzy over the last hour or so?

I... felt worse about it? But it's still there. Weaker than it was. I can see everything she's saying from scum perspective.

Why do you scum read me, speedchuck?

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:04 am

Kylemii wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:02 am

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sat Jan 20, 2018 11:29 pm

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sat Jan 20, 2018 11:11 pm Fam if you wouldn't mind I had a Kyle and long con team as a good possibility. Would you mind looking at their interactions and sharing with me your thoughts when you have a moment?

I did a brief search. They seemed to have a small flare up early in the game around the Day 0 Kyle nonsense, but after that they both seemed to quietly settled on town reads of each other with little visible movement in the thread. That's something I wouldn't mind talking about.
@Kylemii @Long Con, mind elaborating on how your early reads of one another developed?

I initially viewed his cropping of my post as being opportunistic and sneaky, I felt better when he apologized later I felt better about him, it seemed like a realistic mistake. Coming into day 2 I decided to press a tiny reset button in my brain. Many of my day 1 reads were poisoned by emotions and stress. LC's case he made coming into today gave me an impression of good. I've seen LC in many games and been disappointed by his lack of involvement. (not in a shame on you way but like in a, I wish LC would play more way] so seeing a case from him at all was a sign of proactiveness, indicative ofpositive vibes

Talk about your read of him at the point of this GTH list:

Spoiler: show

Kylemii wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 9:28 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 9:17 pm @Kylemii

GTH reads on every player please. I would appreciate it. You don't have to research them or think too hard. Just give me the gut takes. Copy the list here if you like:

Epi - good
Nutella - good
Wilgy - good
Daisy - bad
LC - good
Dyslexicon - good
FZ - bad
Speed - good
JJJ - good
Marmot - bad
Sloonei -bad
Lorab - good
Dave - ???
Novaselinenever - ???
Mac - good

The town read you're describing right now speaks to his Day 2 involvement, but you had him down as good prior to today as well.

I believe that was post-apology/clarification, I don't remember what specifically tipped him over to good.

speedchuck wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:17 am

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:16 am

speedchuck wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:15 am

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:04 am speedchuck, Dyslexicon read right now GO

GTH scum

Has anything happened to your read on Dizzy over the last hour or so?

I... felt worse about it? But it's still there. Weaker than it was. I can see everything she's saying from scum perspective.

Yes, but what is your opinion about Daisy Rose?

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:13 am

LoRab wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:07 am

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sat Jan 20, 2018 11:58 pm

LoRab wrote: ↑Sat Jan 20, 2018 11:50 pmWell, we already know I'm suspicious of Epi. Looking at LC's post on speedchuck, his main point against him was that he jumped on the kylewagon and then didn't let go--which is simmilar to what he did here. So, that makes me eyeball him more. Wilgy? I have no idea. He's Wilgy. 3J I don't suspect for this.

What do you think?

I think that the substance of your Epignosis suspicion is unclear. I see that you are suspicious of him, but I don't quite see why. Could you talk more about that?
I'm also not sure what to make of your speedchuck suspicion here. what is the relationship between Long Con's case against speedchuck, speedchuck's pressure of kyle, and speedchuck's involvement in this nutella bandwagon?

My suspicion of Epi is that he's going after players in a way that he does when he's bad, particularly when he's bad in a speed game--I've tried to explain it a few times now...not sure how to differently articulate my feelings.

Could you point to an example of him doing this on Day 2?

And my suspicion of speedchuck, based on his jumping on the LA bandwagon, coupled wit LC's case--which I read as, essentially, jumpting on the kyle bandwagon--show a pattern of behavior which I don't see as civ behavior. Does that make more sense?

I'm not sure. What is "unciv" about taking part in these particular bandwagons?

I haven't seen him do it day 2, but not every player does the same things every day, so I'm not sure it makes a difference. At least not to me. And it's my suspicion, so I'm really the only one that it matters to. His day 1 behavior makes me suspicious of him. Nothing he has done day 2 makes me feel better about him. Does that make more sense?

And this post from day 1 is kind of the best summary of why I suspect Epi:

Epignosis wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 3:07 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 3:01 pm

speedchuck wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 2:57 pm I'm sure Scum Epi would go after JJJ first. Because he's such an easy townie to lynch.

Have you met Epignosis?

Holy hell, that's basically what I'm accusing you of now.

That sort of joking arrogance--pointing out exactly what he's doing, but in a joking way and involving someone else, is what I have noticed him doing, particularly as a baddie (and not so much as a civie).

If my reasons for suspecting him don't resonate with you, that's ok. I'm not sure saying it in different words is going to change your mind about Epi. But, that's why I find him suspish.

As for speedchuck, it's not those particular bandwagons, but that he jumped on bandwagons in general. Come to think of it, he voted for Daisy, too. I see jumping on all the bandwagons as typically non-civ behavior, as it makes it easier to hide, and to vote for non-teammates without being obvious about it.

That was neither joking nor arrogance. That was bewilderment.

I wonder if I changed my avatar to a cat or a penguin would people stop assuming my posts are arrogant.

How do you read me, [mention]LoRab[/mention]?

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:19 am Why do you scum read me, speedchuck?

"Sloonei - his turnabout on me is garbage. I can't read the "oh, if you play a better townie while mafia then you must be mafia" vote without having a spasmodic fit. That's one way to excuse and turn around a convenient townread you've been using. Bull friggin crap.
Different point:
Amusingly, Sloonei never actually tunneled on cBob when he was town in mountains. It was a constant suspicion, but I never saw him pursue it super hard.
Final point: I really think one of the main three is scum, and Sloonei is my top guess. I'm sorry if I'm wrong, Sloonbeard. You feel off, and that's the best argument I can give you. This readlist/thread review is taking all of my remaining time today. I'm probably just going to have to hope I don't die in MK mafia."

It's... not great if you still townread me. I don't know what to make of your treatment of my read there.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:25 am How do you read me, @LoRab?

I don't have much of a read, tbh. My gut says civ.

I don't think it's prudent with limited time remaining to compile a huge, thorough LC ISO -- I'm not even sure I can finish it in time. Cliff notes:

~ Epignosis and I were fiercely antagonistic with each other for nearly all of Day 1. We ate up a lot of thread content with that combat, and left all other observers scratching their heads trying to parse apart the motives. If there's anyone alive who should keenly understand what scenario and be able to provide insight on it, it's the other guy who has so frequently found himself in the same position against Epignosis.

What insight did he provide? Fuck all. He made a few isolated comments about it, but never anything of substance. To check yourself, click here and CTRL+F for Epi or 3J/Jay/JJJ

~ FZ. gave him crap for "asking clarification questions". LC's immediate response was to accuse her of inventing that notion. I don't see many avenues for that to be a neutral or better comment from LC to FZ -- it's a suspicion. This turned into a somewhat hostile exchange, and LC continues to assert that FZ is making shit up, or at least "making unfounded claims", and challenges her for proof. At no point does LC voice a clear read on FZ in light of this debate -- his commentary carries discrediting weight but does not probe his accuser to learn more about her (trendy new accusation ). This smells of CFTWR (caught for the wrong reasons).

Vote Long Con.

Jay, move your vote to Sloonei.

Oh you just moved off Dizzy. K whatevs

speedchuck wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:26 am

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:19 am Why do you scum read me, speedchuck?

"Sloonei - his turnabout on me is garbage. I can't read the "oh, if you play a better townie while mafia then you must be mafia" vote without having a spasmodic fit. That's one way to excuse and turn around a convenient townread you've been using. Bull friggin crap.
Different point:
Amusingly, Sloonei never actually tunneled on cBob when he was town in mountains. It was a constant suspicion, but I never saw him pursue it super hard.
Final point: I really think one of the main three is scum, and Sloonei is my top guess. I'm sorry if I'm wrong, Sloonbeard. You feel off, and that's the best argument I can give you. This readlist/thread review is taking all of my remaining time today. I'm probably just going to have to hope I don't die in MK mafia."

It's... not great if you still townread me. I don't know what to make of your treatment of my read there.

You've been a strong town read for a lot of the game. I began to question myself on that read. I've still felt good about you, but it's not a read upon which the game hinges. My mind is far from made up.
why does my "turnaround" bother you, and what does the Mountains anecdote mean to you in this game?

Epignosis wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:24 am I wonder if I changed my avatar to a cat or a penguin would people stop assuming my posts are arrogant.

I don't think mine is doing me any favors either.

LoRab wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:28 am

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:25 am How do you read me, LoRab?

I don't have much of a read, tbh. My gut says civ.

why?
Do you have anything to say at all about Epi's play on Day 2?

nutella wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:28 am Jay, move your vote to Sloonei.

Why? Give me abridged version.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:29 am

Epignosis wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:24 am I wonder if I changed my avatar to a cat or a penguin would people stop assuming my posts are arrogant.

I don't think mine is doing me any favors either.

I'm pretty sure mine does the trick.

With limited time remaining, I'd appreciate some quick feedback on the LC gripes I just posted.

Nutella and Dizzy are insanely buddy-buddy
I could see a scum or 3P on either side of the LC JJJ thing.

nutella, move your vote to LoRab.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:30 am

LoRab wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:28 am

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:25 am How do you read me, LoRab?

I don't have much of a read, tbh. My gut says civ.

why?
Do you have anything to say at all about Epi's play on Day 2?

Like I said--it's gut. Gut, to me, says there isn't a real reason, just a general feeling.

I don't have much to say on Epi's play Day 2. It has felt fairly neutral to me.

LoRab wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:32 am

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:30 am

LoRab wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:28 am

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:25 am How do you read me, LoRab?

I don't have much of a read, tbh. My gut says civ.

why?
Do you have anything to say at all about Epi's play on Day 2?

Like I said--it's gut. Gut, to me, says there isn't a real reason, just a general feeling.

I don't have much to say on Epi's play Day 2. It has felt fairly neutral to me.

Do you have any other reads to share?

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:30 am

nutella wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:28 am Jay, move your vote to Sloonei.

Why? Give me abridged version.

I wanted you to move off Dizzy and Sloonei is my preferred lynch, though LC is fine too. I also wanted to see if you would do it (would have been a three-way tie including yourself anyway but now it's not so it doesn't work the same way) whatever LC is a fine choice

If Lorab is bad, she has a teammate in jeopardy. If she truly suspects me, why not put me further into the running to die?

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:31 am nutella, move your vote to LoRab.

OK, sure. That's inconsequential anyway, but Lorab and LC are equally decent candidates in my view. But if anyone reconsiders and goes back to wanting to lynch Sloonei I'm coming right back.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:29 am

speedchuck wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:26 am

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:19 am Why do you scum read me, speedchuck?

"Sloonei - his turnabout on me is garbage. I can't read the "oh, if you play a better townie while mafia then you must be mafia" vote without having a spasmodic fit. That's one way to excuse and turn around a convenient townread you've been using. Bull friggin crap.
Different point:
Amusingly, Sloonei never actually tunneled on cBob when he was town in mountains. It was a constant suspicion, but I never saw him pursue it super hard.
Final point: I really think one of the main three is scum, and Sloonei is my top guess. I'm sorry if I'm wrong, Sloonbeard. You feel off, and that's the best argument I can give you. This readlist/thread review is taking all of my remaining time today. I'm probably just going to have to hope I don't die in MK mafia."

It's... not great if you still townread me. I don't know what to make of your treatment of my read there.

You've been a strong town read for a lot of the game. I began to question myself on that read. I've still felt good about you, but it's not a read upon which the game hinges. My mind is far from made up.
why does my "turnaround" bother you, and what does the Mountains anecdote mean to you in this game?

Your form of questioning yourself on the read, in one post, said:
"Speed says he plays a good town game if bad. He's playing a good town game. Therefore I'd better switch my read." If that was you being snarky, it's one thing. But at the time, I thought you were using my meta against me to enlarge a wagon, and it did NOT sit right. A reversal like that needed more to it. I'm confused on this point still ATM. No time to find the post, I've got LC to look at.
I was stating that your method of approaching Kyle near EOD1 was not the same as your approach to cBob, or really anyone I've seen. The fire that you put into that was something I'd expect from JJJ and not you. And even though you've gotten someone lynched before, you going after Kyle was distinctly different.

nutella wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:33 am

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:30 am

nutella wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:28 am Jay, move your vote to Sloonei.

Why? Give me abridged version.

I wanted you to move off Dizzy and Sloonei is my preferred lynch, though LC is fine too. I also wanted to see if you would do it (would have been a three-way tie including yourself anyway but now it's not so it doesn't work the same way) whatever LC is a fine choice

Can you share any version of a case against me?

Epignosis wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:34 am If Lorab is bad, she has a teammate in jeopardy. If she truly suspects me, why not put me further into the running to die?

I am troubled that she hasn't voted yet for anyone.

Actually no, [mention]nutella[/mention], I don't care about your read on me right now. It's negative and not budging until further notice. Talk to me about LoRab instead.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:33 am

LoRab wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:32 am

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:30 am

LoRab wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:28 am

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:25 am How do you read me, LoRab?

I don't have much of a read, tbh. My gut says civ.

why?
Do you have anything to say at all about Epi's play on Day 2?

Like I said--it's gut. Gut, to me, says there isn't a real reason, just a general feeling.

I don't have much to say on Epi's play Day 2. It has felt fairly neutral to me.

Do you have any other reads to share?

Not particularly. I have other players I feel are probably civ, but no reason to point them out. If I had other reads on players I think are bad, I'd have stated them by now.

Do you care to say why you think I'm bad, other than the fact that you disagree with the reasons I suspect people?

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:30 am With limited time remaining, I'd appreciate some quick feedback on the LC gripes I just posted.

My only complaint with LC is a small one- that he was doing exactly what FZ. accused him of doing (answering for her). I noted this because I said to myself that I would have rather had FZ. answer for herself.

oh hey i have to vote in the next 29 minutes and the votes are all super close good thing i'm drunk and in a dark and loud room, aka the best circumstance to make decisions in

there, I voted now.

The habit of waiting until the end to vote is strong.

Epignosis wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:36 am

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:30 am With limited time remaining, I'd appreciate some quick feedback on the LC gripes I just posted.

My only complaint with LC is a small one- that he was doing exactly what FZ. accused him of doing (answering for her). I noted this because I said to myself that I would have rather had FZ. answer for herself.

Has he done anything that gives you the opposite (civilian) impression?