The Syndicate

nutella wrote: ↑Sun Jun 11, 2017 10:34 pm Hmm. Perhaps LC is independent, then? If he didn't realize/his PM didn't indicate his alignment or gave him some sort of indie win condition?

I like trees. I don't want to chop them up. But I'll have to pick one I guess. And the event... yeah public protection doesn't seem like it makes sense, but then again it does ensure that player won't die but it pretty much ensures that someone else will be targeted and likely die (rather than have a chance of protecting the right person, as non-public protections can). The BTSC block might be better though, especially if we already suspect that someone (e.g. LC) may have ulterior anti-town motives in attempts to contact people.

nutella wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 1:33 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 12:42 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 12:51 am Hm. I believe LC and Dys are telling truths.

Why?

Just because. They sound legit. I buy LC's story about assuming LMS with a vanilla role. Your assessment of that makes sense as well. He could be an actually LMS role, but that seems much less likely.

And I suppose I've been misguided in reading Dys before, but I'm really only getting genuine town vibes so far. Except I'm pretty baffled by her strong desire to lynch llama (which rico seems to agree with inexplicably). Why lynch llama, what's the reasoning?

An interesting change of heart, one must admit.

A few questions:

1. Why in your initial statement do you say "we" instead of "i"? It sounds to me you're trying to make the LC suspicion seem a little more credible/widespread by insinuating that it is a widely held suspicion. It also smells of disassociation (i.e "We all thought it! I wasn't the only one! if it blew up in your face later).

2. What about LC's defense did you specifically "Believe" from point A to point B? You seem confident enough at least in the beginnings of your LC suspicion to base your D0 vote around the idea (by blocking BTSC, in your own words, with the targeted goal of affecting LC).

3. How did you go from putting such stock into the initial LC suspicion (enough so to push it in that one post on two separate statements, as highlighted) to believing that your own assessment was "much less likely"

Ricochet, are you going for a straight-up OMGUS strategy on purpose?

S~V~S wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 5:36 pm Rico have you reached out to anyone?

I myself have not, and only one person has reached out to me.

Out of the Dizzy voters, Epis vote looks better to me than Timmers, so I am temp voting Timmer. Might stay there might not.

And lulz at Rico and Llama being traditional and voting for each other.

P O P P Y I'm Poppy!
P O P P Y I'm Poppy!
P O P P Y I'm Poppy!
P O P P Y That's me!

Very lonely I aaaam
Inbox's full of just spaaaam
Maybe they're all shyyy
Can't imagine whyyy

S~V~S wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 5:36 pm And lulz at Rico and Llama being traditional and voting for each other.

Tradition is the backbone of civilization.

Long Con wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 4:27 pm I'm going to place a vote on Epignosis.

a) because he's sketchy and/or hypocritical regarding making deals. Compare, if you will:

Epignosis wrote:Sun Jun 11, 2017 7:24 pm

Long Con wrote:Sun Jun 11, 2017 5:53 pm How about some sort of alliance, or perhaps a mutual non-voting clause until Final... Five?

Works for me.

^^ That's what he said when I PMed him.

Epignosis wrote: ↑Mon Jun 12, 2017 10:50 pm...LC tried to get me in a deal with not voting for him, and that's fine if he believes this is a last man standing game, which I hope it is not, because those are not fucking Mafia games, and they should stop calling them Mafia, but my role gives me the slim hope that there are mafia to find, and I'm not interested in making vague deals with people, especially if those people make them with everybody and their brother and then everybody again behind the brother's back.

^^ That's what he said publicly. And being two-faced is bad enough, but he tried to use it to invoke suspicion on me.

b) because I already asked him to comment on this, and patiently waited for him to come back and do just that, and he ignored it.

Hypocritical?

I have not voted for you. I am keeping my end of the bargain.

You are not keeping yours.

Ouch.

Saucy.

We do not have a deal, Epignosis. I'm not dealing with someone I can't trust.

So there are a few revelations here.

First, Long Con has posted the PM he sent me and then voted for me when I didn't vote for him. That proves that he is not trustworthy (as thought we need any confirmation of that).

Second, Dyslexicon followed DH's vote against nutella quickly, and then, when LC made a move against me, joined his vote. Dyslexicon doesn't give me the impression of effort toward finding mafia. Neither does LC. He voted for me because I'm apparently a hypocrite (who still hasn't voted for him). I think he got spooked that I was going to come after him. And as for the being a hypocrite part, I criticized people making deals with a truck ton of people, not making deals in general. And frankly I don't give a shit if I'm a hypocrite. I do as I please.

Third, Dyslexicon just witnessed Long Con's vote for me and apparently there's something between them now. I maintain there was something between them all along.

Fourth, the new Power Rangers movie was ass garbage.

Long Con wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 7:25 pm We do not have a deal, Epignosis. I'm not dealing with someone I can't trust.

Whom can you trust, LC?

Long Con wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 7:25 pm We do not have a deal, Epignosis. I'm not dealing with someone I can't trust.

Lame, you used "thought" instead of "though", so I can't really make sense of your post.

Doesn't matter, you directly and intentionally betrayed my trust when you brought my PM into the thread as a weapon against me.

What the hell are you even accepting a deal like that for, in a regular Mafia game? At least I have an excuse. You knew it was regular Mafia all along, and you still accepted the deal.

Epignosis wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 7:31 pm

Long Con wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 7:25 pm We do not have a deal, Epignosis. I'm not dealing with someone I can't trust.

Whom can you trust, LC?

I don't know who I can trust. I do know that I can trust the majority of the people out there at this time. I also know that I cannot trust you.

Couple'a real saucy boys getting good and saucy.

DharmaHelper wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 7:38 pm Couple'a real saucy boys getting good and saucy.

Saucy like a chicken wing?

Lots of drama coming out of Day 1. i don't know whether to feel sad that I didn't really have a hand in most of it.

Do something infamous.

Long Con wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 8:03 pm Do something infamous.

All in good time my friend.

Long Con wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 8:03 pm Do something infamous.

Heh. Already working on that.

Of the two, I feel less inclined to trust Dyslexicon. LC's gaffe doesn't fit his nature if a baddie but he's a wily one and could easily be an indy that done goofed. To me, it looks like Dyslexicon is stumbling through all the new faces and the methods and biases that come with them. The punchy factor doesn't help Dys's cause but I don't know Dys at all (or his/her gender), so I'm forced to work with generalizations.

Long Con wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 7:36 pm Lame, you used "thought" instead of "though", so I can't really make sense of your post.

Doesn't matter, you directly and intentionally betrayed my trust when you brought my PM into the thread as a weapon against me.

What the hell are you even accepting a deal like that for, in a regular Mafia game? At least I have an excuse. You knew it was regular Mafia all along, and you still accepted the deal.

Ah, you caught me on a typo. Goodie for you.

Look at those adverbs though.

YOU DIRECTLY AND INTENTIONALLY BETRAYED MY TRUST

Who are you? M. Bison? A villain from a Steven Segal movie?

It's cute.

Your "trust" meant nothing when I realized you had peppered your "deal" to every bitch up in here. You aren't sincere. You were looking to get as many people as possible to not vote you until a certain point in time. That, to me, suggests a motive.

How do I know it's a "regular Mafia game?" It's INH we're talking about. He threatens us with phase one. I don't know any of that shit. I just know what my role says, and my role suggests hope that this is a Mafia game. And if it is, having you not vote for me is beneficial to me regardless, isn't it?

But you voted for me. So you are untrustworthy.

Anybody you strike a deal with in future? Buyer beware.

I'm trustworthy. Everyone trust me.

thellama73 wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 8:44 pm I'm trustworthy. Everyone trust me.

"I'm not Count Olaf," said Count Olaf.

sprityo wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 4:25 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 2:25 pm Changed my vote to sprityo. Tune in later to find out why.

Well?

Can I help you?

Epignosis wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 7:31 pmSecond, Dyslexicon followed DH's vote against nutella quickly, and then, when LC made a move against me, joined his vote. Dyslexicon doesn't give me the impression of effort toward finding mafia. Neither does LC. He voted for me because I'm apparently a hypocrite (who still hasn't voted for him). I think he got spooked that I was going to come after him. And as for the being a hypocrite part, I criticized people making deals with a truck ton of people, not making deals in general. And frankly I don't give a shit if I'm a hypocrite. I do as I please.

1. I am very much trying to find scum, whether or not it's in the way you recognise or not. I will contest I'm one of the player having actually engaged with people for that exact reason.
2. I move my vote around a lot. I like it. It's a tool to find scum. It will end up on who I think is the best lynch.
3. Did you get that I never made any deal?
4. Can you clarify your correspondence with LC?

Third, Dyslexicon just witnessed Long Con's vote for me and apparently there's something between them now. I maintain there was something between them all along.

You really can't take a joke, can you?

Fourth, the new Power Rangers movie was ass garbage.

I'm not surprised.

DharmaHelper wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 8:02 pm Lots of drama coming out of Day 1. i don't know whether to feel sad that I didn't really have a hand in most of it.

It wasn't my fault, I swear! *holds back inappropriate joke*

G-Man wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 8:32 pmHeh. Already working on that.

Of the two, I feel less inclined to trust Dyslexicon. LC's gaffe doesn't fit his nature if a baddie but he's a wily one and could easily be an indy that done goofed. To me, it looks like Dyslexicon is stumbling through all the new faces and the methods and biases that come with them. The punchy factor doesn't help Dys's cause but I don't know Dys at all (or his/her gender), so I'm forced to work with generalizations.

I'm totally trustworthy, just like Llama. Can you clarify the outlined? Cause but I know me and my gender, and maybe we could have a heart to heart about us two in this game.

thellama73 wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 8:44 pm I'm trustworthy. Everyone trust me.

Of course you are. A Llama would never hurt anyone.

POPPY!

Sing me a song about LC and Epi - it will be a hit!

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 9:20 pm

Epignosis wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 7:31 pmSecond, Dyslexicon followed DH's vote against nutella quickly, and then, when LC made a move against me, joined his vote. Dyslexicon doesn't give me the impression of effort toward finding mafia. Neither does LC. He voted for me because I'm apparently a hypocrite (who still hasn't voted for him). I think he got spooked that I was going to come after him. And as for the being a hypocrite part, I criticized people making deals with a truck ton of people, not making deals in general. And frankly I don't give a shit if I'm a hypocrite. I do as I please.

1. I am very much trying to find scum, whether or not it's in the way you recognise or not. I will contest I'm one of the player having actually engaged with people for that exact reason.
2. I move my vote around a lot. I like it. It's a tool to find scum. It will end up on who I think is the best lynch.
3. Did you get that I never made any deal?
4. Can you clarify your correspondence with LC?

4. Clarify what? He posted it.

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 9:20 pm

Third, Dyslexicon just witnessed Long Con's vote for me and apparently there's something between them now. I maintain there was something between them all along.

You really can't take a joke, can you?

I don't see what you said that was a joke.

@Epi - LC gave you a deal offer not to vote you until the final five, and you said "works for me" or something like that. And then it all went to shit in thread. Is that right?

Did LC offer the deal before or after he was made aware that this is not an LMS game?

Why did yu accept the offer in the first place?

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 9:54 pm @Epi - LC gave you a deal offer not to vote you until the final five, and you said "works for me" or something like that. And then it all went to shit in thread. Is that right?

Dunno. Wasn't paying attention to the timing.

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 9:54 pm Did LC offer the deal before or after he was made aware that this is not an LMS game?

Dunno.

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 9:54 pm Why did yu accept the offer in the first place?

Someone said he wouldn't vote for me. It's hardly an offer.

What are you hoping to learn from this line of questioning?

I think this has been a good Day 1 so far.

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 9:20 pm

How presumptuous of me. See, Dyslexicon, I am but a casual player here and thought you joined only recently. I can see from your member profile that you joined back in autumn. That's possibly long enough to get accustomed to many of the regulars you now find yourself sparring with. It actually makes me trust you less now.

Epignosis wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 10:04 pmDunno. Wasn't paying attention to the timing.

K.

Dunno.

Mh. Would make a difference.

Someone said he wouldn't vote for me. It's hardly an offer.

Alright.

What are you hoping to learn from this line of questioning?

More about LC and how seriously you're taking this "deal" stuff. You seem to take it seriously for me/LC even when we never had any "deal.

---

@LC, Am I right in assuming that you offered the deal to Epi before you knew this was not an LMS game? Or no?

Apart from this one question I'm pretty done with the deal stuff. Seems based on a lot of different misunderstandings. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

G-Man wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 10:27 pm

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 9:20 pm

How presumptuous of me. See, Dyslexicon, I am but a casual player here and thought you joined only recently. I can see from your member profile that you joined back in autumn. That's possibly long enough to get accustomed to many of the regulars you now find yourself sparring with. It actually makes me trust you less now.

Yeah, I know a few. I've played about 4 games here I think. Can you clarify what your distrust is about? Your points were very abstract/loose. I'm obv!town btw.

Long Con wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 10:23 pm I think this has been a good Day 1 so far.

I have like waaaay many null reads, and lots of people aren't talking - so meh.

Why did you vote nutella and then vote me?

Epignosis wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 10:48 pm Why did you vote nutella and then vote me?

Because I like to move my vote around a lot to see what happens. Especially D1. I don't feel I have a very clear place I want to place it atm actually. Why does it matter?

Ok, so a few things. I'm intrigued by the fact that dys generally disliked the fact that I had made comments about LC but had placed my vote on him in stead (or are you a she? a ze? ) but meanwhile he talks of liking to move his vote around to get reactions. Why not see that my vote was for a similar reason? Why dislike a vote that has been made in the same spirit as your own gameplay? It's interesting.

As for being mentioning that something is good enough for Day 1, I don't like that that was taken as a dismissive statement. In a game where votes can be moved, and in the midst of someone seeming to stumble, me voting early and then saying that is a good enough reason for that moment is fine, I think?

As for LC, maybe I'm not voting for him because part of this whole thing has been to see how people react. While it isn't enough for my to even raise an eyebrow at her, I'm a touch surprised that SVS took as much suspicion from my play as she has, but then again, I don't play much these days and I'm certainly being a bit more glib than my usual cautious, mopey way, lol, so maybe that's all it is? Again, I'm not suspicious of her for the vote, I'm just surprised.

As for others, well I'm certainly curious to hear what nutella says about what DH posted. That is an apparent complete 180 turn, so some chatter there is more than necessary as that puts nutella squarely on the vote map.

Whoever is posting only in haikus or whatever, I'm not reading your posts, so I hope you aren't actually trying to play that way for realz.

Oh, and special bonus marks to dys for posting a Latrice gif... brings back memories of the greatest laugh in the history of television!

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 11:11 pm

Epignosis wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 10:48 pm Why did you vote nutella and then vote me?

Because I like to move my vote around a lot to see what happens. Especially D1. I don't feel I have a very clear place I want to place it atm actually. Why does it matter?

You are a liar. You have not moved your vote around to "see what happens."

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 2:09 pm

DharmaHelper wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 2:08 pm Voted for Nutella.

Sheeping.

nutella never posted. Yet you moved your vote to me when LC did. So you voted nutella to see what happens? Nah.

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 4:47 pm I'm going to sheep LC's vote instead, because we're bffs and I'd like to hide behind his vote since Epi is giving me so much pressure. Wink wink.

You are evil.

Wtf, are you kidding me with this? Nut didn't show up, I don't control that. It's in any case not just about Nut. Maybe someone else will hop on her wagon, or comment on it, or whatever. And then I got an idea to vote you instead, so I did, cause frankly I was bored. I'll move my vote around all day, and it's not A-B-C cause and effect style in my brain in case you haven't noticed.

Lol, I didn't even notice Timmer posting. Was distracted by being mind blown.

timmer wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 11:18 pmAs for LC, maybe I'm not voting for him because part of this whole thing has been to see how people react. While it isn't enough for my to even raise an eyebrow at her, I'm a touch surprised that SVS took as much suspicion from my play as she has, but then again, I don't play much these days and I'm certainly being a bit more glib than my usual cautious, mopey way, lol, so maybe that's all it is?

I think the glibness could be a cherished hallmark of this game when it's all over.

Whoever is posting only in haikus or whatever, I'm not reading your posts, so I hope you aren't actually trying to play that way for realz.

I super-love you for this post. "Haikus". You are my hero.

timmer wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 11:18 pm Ok, so a few things. I'm intrigued by the fact that dys generally disliked the fact that I had made comments about LC but had placed my vote on him in stead (or are you a she? a ze? ) but meanwhile he talks of liking to move his vote around to get reactions. Why not see that my vote was for a similar reason? Why dislike a vote that has been made in the same spirit as your own gameplay? It's interesting.

I actually don't think I disliked it specifically and don't think I've said so? I asked you cause I was curious, it didn't make sense since you seemed to think LC was explicitly non-town. You said for reactions and lulz which is honestly fine by me. I will expect your vote to end up on the person you argue as the least likely town in the end anyway.

As for being mentioning that something is good enough for Day 1, I don't like that that was taken as a dismissive statement. In a game where votes can be moved, and in the midst of someone seeming to stumble, me voting early and then saying that is a good enough reason for that moment is fine, I think?

Sure - but there should always be an interest in digging deeper and clearing up - that is my point.

Whoever is posting only in haikus or whatever, I'm not reading your posts, so I hope you aren't actually trying to play that way for realz.

Haikus are lovely.
But sometimes they don't make sense.
Refrigerator.

timmer wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 11:19 pm Oh, and special bonus marks to dys for posting a Latrice gif... brings back memories of the greatest laugh in the history of television!

Yay - someone gets me! Also, I'm whatever gender you'd like me to be, you can just pick one.

DharmaHelper wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 5:44 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Sun Jun 11, 2017 10:34 pm Hmm. Perhaps LC is independent, then? If he didn't realize/his PM didn't indicate his alignment or gave him some sort of indie win condition?

I like trees. I don't want to chop them up. But I'll have to pick one I guess. And the event... yeah public protection doesn't seem like it makes sense, but then again it does ensure that player won't die but it pretty much ensures that someone else will be targeted and likely die (rather than have a chance of protecting the right person, as non-public protections can). The BTSC block might be better though, especially if we already suspect that someone (e.g. LC) may have ulterior anti-town motives in attempts to contact people.

nutella wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 1:33 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 12:42 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 12:51 am Hm. I believe LC and Dys are telling truths.

Why?

Just because. They sound legit. I buy LC's story about assuming LMS with a vanilla role. Your assessment of that makes sense as well. He could be an actually LMS role, but that seems much less likely.

And I suppose I've been misguided in reading Dys before, but I'm really only getting genuine town vibes so far. Except I'm pretty baffled by her strong desire to lynch llama (which rico seems to agree with inexplicably). Why lynch llama, what's the reasoning?

An interesting change of heart, one must admit.

A few questions:

1. Why in your initial statement do you say "we" instead of "i"? It sounds to me you're trying to make the LC suspicion seem a little more credible/widespread by insinuating that it is a widely held suspicion. It also smells of disassociation (i.e "We all thought it! I wasn't the only one! if it blew up in your face later).

2. What about LC's defense did you specifically "Believe" from point A to point B? You seem confident enough at least in the beginnings of your LC suspicion to base your D0 vote around the idea (by blocking BTSC, in your own words, with the targeted goal of affecting LC).

3. How did you go from putting such stock into the initial LC suspicion (enough so to push it in that one post on two separate statements, as highlighted) to believing that your own assessment was "much less likely"

You are reaching pretty far here. I used LC as an example because people were already questioning his motives early in day zero, but that didn't mean he was a serious suspect by the time the game actually got going. Like, yeah, I was initially a little suspicious of his mix-up, but the more he and others talked about it the more clear it became to me that he just made a legitimate mistake. In the first post you quote, I did think it was reasonably possible he had a LMS/indie role of some kind that supported his assumption, but afterward he explained that he had already thought it was a LMS game and just didn't process the "vanilla civ" part of his pm, and that made sense to me.

This is apropos of nothing, but there is a trailer out for a Flatliners remake. On the one hand, it looks awful. On the other hand, it also looks awful.

@Dys, I'm a product of my age, so I'll go with male pronouns as a default until corrected, then?

I think Nut is town. Sue me.
Dharma seems ok.

timmer wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 11:37 pm@Dys, I'm a product of my age, so I'll go with male pronouns as a default until corrected, then?

Sure.

@Timmer, I meant to ask you - You earlier said you found it hard to believe that LC would miss his "civillian" from his role PM. But dt if you think he'd not miss the civ, do you think it's likely that he would miss that he is mafia with X, Y and Z? Someone else brought this up (can't remember who), but haven't seen you comment on it.

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2017 11:44 pm @Timmer, I meant to ask you - You earlier said you found it hard to believe that LC would miss his "civillian" from his role PM. But dt if you think he'd not miss the civ, do you think it's likely that he would miss that he is mafia with X, Y and Z? Someone else brought this up (can't remember who), but haven't seen you comment on it.

It's a balance of things known versus things unknown. Because of my role PM, I know the word civilian is there and that INH used it. But I have never to my knowledge played an INH game, and people keep saying they are different, and if I can be quite honest, I don't know if I've ever played a Heist game, either, so the balance of those last points is that I do not know what terminology INH would use for bad guys. Would the word baddie be there? Or just bad? Or mafia? Or mafioso? It's a bit more grey, thus I put less weight into the idea that LC just somehow missed the word civilian in his role PM because there is at least a chance that the alternate words (especially if he is a true LMS indy type role!) may not be as traditionally eye-catching for someone who is skimming.