Page 7 of 21

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 4:53 pm
by Principal Skinner
Dunya... I'm not bad. Are you and Turnip Boi bad?

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 4:59 pm
by The Dry Flood
Obviously, I am not mafia. :beer:

But people think I should read the thread so I probably should.

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 4:59 pm
by The Dry Flood
Votes are changeable

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 4:59 pm
by Maid
DrSloogy wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 4:51 pm I still think we should be voting CollinisSpeed...
plz expand?

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 0]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:02 pm
by The Dry Flood
M Plus 1 wrote: Tue Jul 10, 2018 12:23 am Hello, everyone! Incredibly excited to be playing this game. :yay:
Town

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:02 pm
by JaggedJimmyJay
The day phase will end in approximately 118 minutes, or just under two hours.

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:03 pm
by The Dry Flood
Galactic Mac wrote: Tue Jul 10, 2018 9:05 am Alright y'all. We ain't here to fuck spiders.
Will not vote you day one with that avatar.

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:05 pm
by JaggedJimmyJay

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:05 pm
by The Dry Flood
ColinIsSpeed wrote: Tue Jul 10, 2018 12:27 pm
DrSloogy wrote: Tue Jul 10, 2018 11:53 am I voted for fratyo. We can hammer in this game. Avoid accidental hammers.
It says no hammers tho
Thought you were town until it turned out you read the rules.

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:06 pm
by Celeste
Lunatella wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 4:37 pm [VOTE: Fratyo] aubergine
Because Fratyo is voting an inactive on day one, and that's not a good look. Town should want to get as much input from players as possible before deciding if they are a good lynch target. Scum would be quick to lead an easy lynch like this.
Didn’t you briefly suggest random voting on D1 as town in Courage?

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:07 pm
by The Dry Flood
Cuphead and Mugman wrote: Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:08 pm Well...

Cuphead and his pal Mugman
Were feeling mighty glum
To save the thread
And keep their heads
They’ll need to lynch some scum

Lynch some scum!

And though the act of hanging folks
May now seem a little rude,
If the ones to blame
Are at endgame

Well…

The good guys will all be screwed!
Town

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:08 pm
by Lunatella
ColinIsSpeed wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:06 pm
Lunatella wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 4:37 pm [VOTE: Fratyo] aubergine
Because Fratyo is voting an inactive on day one, and that's not a good look. Town should want to get as much input from players as possible before deciding if they are a good lynch target. Scum would be quick to lead an easy lynch like this.
Didn’t you briefly suggest random voting on D1 as town in Courage?
Did Luna do that? Gosh that's stupid.

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:09 pm
by Celeste
Rimworld Boyz wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 4:59 pm
DrSloogy wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 4:51 pm I still think we should be voting CollinisSpeed...
plz expand?
Agree

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:10 pm
by The Dry Flood
M Plus 1 wrote: Tue Jul 10, 2018 3:41 pm @The Dry Flood

I need you, Golden. We need to mindmeld. Otherwise expect me to come after you.
Hey. Why golden. Am I not good enough for you?

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:12 pm
by The Dry Flood
ColinIsSpeed wrote: Tue Jul 10, 2018 4:04 pm Is quiet The Dry Flood usually bad? Ha.

I'm just go ahead and townread Fratyo for now. I think it's not great that 2 Stupid Dogs trust DrSloogy, and they are voting together on my townread.

I will ask for an explanation of this.
I had a paradox meltdown at this meta question.

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:16 pm
by Celeste
I think I’m gonna vote for DrSloogy. The 2 Dog characterization of Sloonei is reasonable and we were all on the same scum team in Ancient Greece when we saw some similar kind of voting (it reminds one of us the most of Sloonei’s vote for Colin in it, actually, although the circumstances were not identical.)

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:16 pm
by Celeste
[VOTE: DRSLOOGY] aubergine

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:17 pm
by The Dry Flood
2 Stupid Dogs wrote: Tue Jul 10, 2018 5:15 pm Here's my rainbow as of this second you see in the time stamp of this post

2 Stupid Dogs
M Plus 1
DrSloogy
Rimworld Boyz
Galactic Mac
Lunatella


your scum are among these:

Cuphead and Mugman
The Dry Flood
ColinIsSpeed
Fratyo
This post is bad.

Besides the fact that we’re town, I like the feel of every other red team as at this point in the thread.

I think scum are among the green. Someone should tell this dog to roll over.

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:17 pm
by Celeste
The Dry Flood wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:12 pm
ColinIsSpeed wrote: Tue Jul 10, 2018 4:04 pm Is quiet The Dry Flood usually bad? Ha.
I had a paradox meltdown at this meta question.
;airguitar:

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:20 pm
by 2 Stupid Dogs
The Dry Flood wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:17 pm
2 Stupid Dogs wrote: Tue Jul 10, 2018 5:15 pm Here's my rainbow as of this second you see in the time stamp of this post

2 Stupid Dogs
M Plus 1
DrSloogy
Rimworld Boyz
Galactic Mac
Lunatella


your scum are among these:

Cuphead and Mugman
The Dry Flood
ColinIsSpeed
Fratyo
This post is bad.

Besides the fact that we’re town, I like the feel of every other red team as at this point in the thread.

I think scum are among the green. Someone should tell this dog to roll over.
i updated my rainbow. get with the times, oldiez. (hi marmot :hugs: )

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:22 pm
by 2 Stupid Dogs
ColinIsSpeed wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:16 pm I think I’m gonna vote for DrSloogy. The 2 Dog characterization of Sloonei is reasonable and we were all on the same scum team in Ancient Greece when we saw some similar kind of voting (it reminds one of us the most of Sloonei’s vote for Colin in it, actually, although the circumstances were not identical.)
:ponder:

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:24 pm
by 2 Stupid Dogs
I find Colin's post and tone agreeable and frankly that scares the shit out of me.

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:27 pm
by 2 Stupid Dogs
Galactic Mac wrote: Tue Jul 10, 2018 9:05 am Alright y'all. We ain't here to fuck spiders.
Mac is vanilla town. I called it. :beer:

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:28 pm
by The Dry Flood
2 Stupid Dogs wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:20 pm
The Dry Flood wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:17 pm
2 Stupid Dogs wrote: Tue Jul 10, 2018 5:15 pm Here's my rainbow as of this second you see in the time stamp of this post

2 Stupid Dogs
M Plus 1
DrSloogy
Rimworld Boyz
Galactic Mac
Lunatella


your scum are among these:

Cuphead and Mugman
The Dry Flood
ColinIsSpeed
Fratyo
This post is bad.

Besides the fact that we’re town, I like the feel of every other red team as at this point in the thread.

I think scum are among the green. Someone should tell this dog to roll over.
i updated my rainbow. get with the times, oldiez. (hi marmot :hugs: )
:hugs:

I think rimworld boyz are bad.

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:30 pm
by 2 Stupid Dogs
The Dry Flood wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:28 pm :hugs:

I think rimworld boyz are bad.
I kinda agree. I was actually giving town cred on something I've seen Kyle fake. So when I snapped out of it...I actually didn't like Quin's tone mostly.

what do you think about drsloon?

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:34 pm
by Lunatella
Dunya you're bad aren't you

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:38 pm
by The Dry Flood
2 Stupid Dogs wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:30 pm
The Dry Flood wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:28 pm :hugs:

I think rimworld boyz are bad.
I kinda agree. I was actually giving town cred on something I've seen Kyle fake. So when I snapped out of it...I actually didn't like Quin's tone mostly.

what do you think about drsloon?
By end of page 3, nothing stands out.

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:40 pm
by 2 Stupid Dogs
Lunatella wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:34 pm Dunya you're bad aren't you
no, nutella, I'm not.

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:41 pm
by Lunatella
2 Stupid Dogs wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:40 pm
Lunatella wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:34 pm Dunya you're bad aren't you
no, nutella, I'm not.
How am I supposed to believe you?

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:45 pm
by The Dry Flood
ColinIsSpeed wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 1:10 pm
Cuphead and Mugman wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 1:03 pm Well…

Cuphead and his pal Mugman
Have all their reading done
The two concur
They must confer
A take on M Plus 1

M Plus 1!

He came upon things acting like
They were a hydrant red
And now all of this
Smells of doggy piss

So…

No one should make him dead!
Is piss good?
When describing M Plus 1 - surprisingly, yes.

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:46 pm
by The Dry Flood
Fratyo wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 1:11 pm
Lunatella wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 11:39 am
M Plus 1 wrote: Tue Jul 10, 2018 3:40 pm - Rimworld Boyz
I'm vibing with Kyle. Kyle is one of the most tonally-centric players I've ever met in that he reads incredibly organically when he's town and not when he's scum. Specifically if I read at least half of the posts in Kyle's ISO and can hear Kyle thinking out loud in a Vocaroo type setting, that means he's almost certainly town. Scum!Kyle can't quite replicate the way town!Kyle thinks.

Subject to change. Other input desired.
Rimworld Boyz wrote: Tue Jul 10, 2018 3:44 pm i have a problem with that? up until now neither of us have posted anything that would require genuine-ness or the faking there-of. which posts seemed particularly genuine to you?

M Plus 1
For Rimworld Boyz to question M Plus 1's read of their genuineness really makes them look town. If they were scum they would have just rolled with it. Extra cred looks good. But what does this say about M Plus 1?
Nothing? This part seems like it might've been added on just to sound thoughtful. How would Rimworldz looking town ever mean something for M1's alignment?
Townie post from Fratyo. Making a valid point about Lunatella.

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:46 pm
by 2 Stupid Dogs
Lunatella wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:41 pm
2 Stupid Dogs wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:40 pm
Lunatella wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:34 pm Dunya you're bad aren't you
no, nutella, I'm not.
How am I supposed to believe you?
what makes you not believe me?

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:47 pm
by 2 Stupid Dogs
The Dry Flood wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:46 pm
Fratyo wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 1:11 pm
Lunatella wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 11:39 am
M Plus 1 wrote: Tue Jul 10, 2018 3:40 pm - Rimworld Boyz
I'm vibing with Kyle. Kyle is one of the most tonally-centric players I've ever met in that he reads incredibly organically when he's town and not when he's scum. Specifically if I read at least half of the posts in Kyle's ISO and can hear Kyle thinking out loud in a Vocaroo type setting, that means he's almost certainly town. Scum!Kyle can't quite replicate the way town!Kyle thinks.

Subject to change. Other input desired.
Rimworld Boyz wrote: Tue Jul 10, 2018 3:44 pm i have a problem with that? up until now neither of us have posted anything that would require genuine-ness or the faking there-of. which posts seemed particularly genuine to you?

M Plus 1
For Rimworld Boyz to question M Plus 1's read of their genuineness really makes them look town. If they were scum they would have just rolled with it. Extra cred looks good. But what does this say about M Plus 1?
Nothing? This part seems like it might've been added on just to sound thoughtful. How would Rimworldz looking town ever mean something for M1's alignment?
Townie post from Fratyo. Making a valid point about Lunatella.
ya, but he said it like 10 mins after MP said it..

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:47 pm
by The Dry Flood
Fratyo wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 1:14 pm
M Plus 1 wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 1:02 pm
Lunatella wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 11:39 am
M Plus 1 wrote: Tue Jul 10, 2018 3:40 pm - Rimworld Boyz
I'm vibing with Kyle. Kyle is one of the most tonally-centric players I've ever met in that he reads incredibly organically when he's town and not when he's scum. Specifically if I read at least half of the posts in Kyle's ISO and can hear Kyle thinking out loud in a Vocaroo type setting, that means he's almost certainly town. Scum!Kyle can't quite replicate the way town!Kyle thinks.

Subject to change. Other input desired.
Rimworld Boyz wrote: Tue Jul 10, 2018 3:44 pm i have a problem with that? up until now neither of us have posted anything that would require genuine-ness or the faking there-of. which posts seemed particularly genuine to you?

M Plus 1
For Rimworld Boyz to question M Plus 1's read of their genuineness really makes them look town. If they were scum they would have just rolled with it. Extra cred looks good. But what does this say about M Plus 1?
What do you think it says about me?

I don’t like the open-ended question at all.

[VOTE: lunatella] aubergine
lol...

now people will think i just sheeped this. i actually just read this. villapoint for mindmeld
The M Plus 1 post also passed me by. The point was less clear.

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:51 pm
by The Dry Flood
2 Stupid Dogs wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 1:29 pm
Fratyo wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 1:23 pm 2 Dogs, what do you mean by Luna looking sketchy as town? Do you think she looks less sketchy when scum? Or was this a specific way of sketchy you think she generally only looks when town?

Also, i think she was one of the most obvious and least sketchy people in all of the Courage game. It's only 1 game but still
actually that's sort of what I mean. In UPick, she was scum and her posts were all more pointed--served a purpose, slightly reserved with her words even. I knew something was off with her there.

In other games we've played with her as a civilian, she tends to be a little more loose in her thoughts and opinions. she makes posts that read scummy. she doesn't pay attention to what can be perceived as scummy, because she's town, so why would she? I think that post MP quotes is a classic example of misread Luna intentions. I understand what she was trying to get at. I don't see a scum Luna edging for that angle.

if i'm wrong, i'm gonna look so stupid. but it's a risk i'm willing to take.
Why is that post luna not nutella

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:53 pm
by 2 Stupid Dogs
The Dry Flood wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:51 pm
2 Stupid Dogs wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 1:29 pm
Fratyo wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 1:23 pm 2 Dogs, what do you mean by Luna looking sketchy as town? Do you think she looks less sketchy when scum? Or was this a specific way of sketchy you think she generally only looks when town?

Also, i think she was one of the most obvious and least sketchy people in all of the Courage game. It's only 1 game but still
actually that's sort of what I mean. In UPick, she was scum and her posts were all more pointed--served a purpose, slightly reserved with her words even. I knew something was off with her there.

In other games we've played with her as a civilian, she tends to be a little more loose in her thoughts and opinions. she makes posts that read scummy. she doesn't pay attention to what can be perceived as scummy, because she's town, so why would she? I think that post MP quotes is a classic example of misread Luna intentions. I understand what she was trying to get at. I don't see a scum Luna edging for that angle.

if i'm wrong, i'm gonna look so stupid. but it's a risk i'm willing to take.
Why is that post luna not nutella
I can tell. :eye:

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:54 pm
by 2 Stupid Dogs
Luna's language and phrasings are quite different than nutella's imo.

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:56 pm
by The Dry Flood
M Plus 1 wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 1:51 pm I’m a bit underwhelmed by DrSloogy.

I’m super underwhelmed by The Dry Flood. More concerned than anything. It’s so bizarre for both of them to be inactive.
It's ok, we are also underwhelmed with ourselves :sigh:

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:58 pm
by Principal Skinner
Dunya, what is your aim to gain targeting my other head the way you have. Do you disagree with the vote altogether? Or just the process in which my other head placed the vote?

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 6:00 pm
by The Dry Flood
Meh, I'm okay leaving lunatella for another day. I'm not convinced though :beer:

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 6:02 pm
by 2 Stupid Dogs
DrSloogy wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:58 pm Dunya, what is your aim to gain targeting my other head the way you have. Do you disagree with the vote altogether? Or just the process in which my other head placed the vote?
I disagreed with the reasoning behind the vote, and his defence of it. I wasn't persuaded convincingly about his intentions. I felt there was too much backtracking when I pursued him too (weak ~placeholder vote~ but oh, if it's daisy, that changes how I look at it...) (the vote wasn't the reason I voted for Galactic Mac) (you're misreading my reasons) and it didn't strike me as Town Sloonei, but rather scum sloonei looking for entrances on a lynch--somewhere safe to park his vote

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 6:03 pm
by 2 Stupid Dogs
if he'd outright called it a pressure vote, I could have seen Town Sloonei somewhere in there. everything else felt fabricated on the whim.

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 6:06 pm
by The Dry Flood
I most like the voters on sloog and Rimworld. Either can go in my book and I feel good about the votes because of who is on them.

I like Fratyo but Fratyo's vote is bad. Hey Fractal, you played with Golden as bad? Do you think he'd be a no show?

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 6:08 pm
by Golf
[VOTE: Rimworld Boyz] aubergine

linki: lol, i just voted Rim on the poll and see this b4 i post it in the thread.

Anyway, idk. My vote was mainly PoE based more than anything else. Think you've been ok since you came into the thread recently

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 6:08 pm
by Principal Skinner
2 Stupid Dogs wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 6:03 pm if he'd outright called it a pressure vote, I could have seen Town Sloonei somewhere in there. everything else felt fabricated on the whim.
:sigh:

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 6:09 pm
by Principal Skinner
“Slonei always pressure votes.”
“This is the thing Sloonei always does.”
“Sloonei is not pressure voting.”

Starting to think dunya is bad. She’s never willfully misread me like this.

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 6:09 pm
by 2 Stupid Dogs
The Dry Flood wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 6:06 pm Hey Fractal, you played with Golden as bad? Do you think he'd be a no show?
that's not a very fair question because it could go either way. golden has been around the syndicate, so being a complete no show is very strange tbh. He doesn't strike me as someone who ditches a game intentionally and lurks. I'm led to assume he's asking to be replaced? maybe seeing he has another scum card in succession was too overwhelming for him? maybe he has a busy life following the final days of the world cup? maybe he is sick? making guesses based on his appearance or lack of isn't really productive for me :p

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 6:10 pm
by Golf
If my other head was around he'd probably defend Sloogy based on his comment on them earlier, and i dont have a townread on Rim, so that's a pretty easy choice between the 2 for me

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 6:11 pm
by Principal Skinner
2 Stupid Dogs wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 6:02 pm
DrSloogy wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 5:58 pm Dunya, what is your aim to gain targeting my other head the way you have. Do you disagree with the vote altogether? Or just the process in which my other head placed the vote?
I disagreed with the reasoning behind the vote, and his defence of it. I wasn't persuaded convincingly about his intentions. I felt there was too much backtracking when I pursued him too (weak ~placeholder vote~ but oh, if it's daisy, that changes how I look at it...) (the vote wasn't the reason I voted for Galactic Mac) (you're misreading my reasons) and it didn't strike me as Town Sloonei, but rather scum sloonei looking for entrances on a lynch--somewhere safe to park his vote
[VOTE: 2 Stupid Dogs] aubergine

Re: Two-Headed Monster Mafia [Day 1]

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 6:11 pm
by 2 Stupid Dogs
DrSloogy wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 6:09 pm “Slonei always pressure votes.”
“This is the thing Sloonei always does.”
“Sloonei is not pressure voting.”

Starting to think dunya is bad. She’s never willfully misread me like this.
now you're misreading me. :p I implied you always pressure vote randoms to illustrate a similarity in behavior between you and Spacedaisy's vote.

I never said you were pressure voting Galactic Mac in this game, indeed you said you had genuine reasons for it.