The Syndicate

Yeah, if the Manipulators are completely eliminated then that would explain Creeper's odd night killing. I didn't mean to confuse. I think the Manipulators are no more, but I proposed an alternative explanation just in case. This is a complex game and I want to look at things from every angle.

I agree that it's better to focus on Fetus over Cohen at this point. I've not seen any reason to suggest Boom being one of those roles over the other, unless I missed something (which is quite possible).

RIP Timmer.

This game is making my brainz hurt.

I would really like to hear BWT's input right now on boomslang's survival.

Well, I guess Zodac didn't get the memo regarding the usefulness of an Elo lynch to the baddie-hunting cause. For all reasons previously outlined, I'm very inclined to vote her again today.

But let's think about the likely outcomes if you vote for me again today. If I'm Fetus, you can't kill me until BWT passes his random search, which is basically a coin flip and a potentially wasted lynch. If I'm Cohen, you'll have wasted a lynch on an almost entirely harmless indie role. If I'm MacGuyver, I'm invincible until Penny dies, so you'll gain no new information from my lynch (unless timmer was Penny, in which case you'll be killing a civ).

So if I were in your shoes, I'd be searching for a better target than me.

Boomslang wrote:Well, I guess Zodac didn't get the memo regarding the usefulness of an Elo lynch to the baddie-hunting cause. For all reasons previously outlined, I'm very inclined to vote her again today.

But let's think about the likely outcomes if you vote for me again today. If I'm Fetus, you can't kill me until BWT passes his random search, which is basically a coin flip and a potentially wasted lynch. If I'm Cohen, you'll have wasted a lynch on an almost entirely harmless indie role. If I'm MacGuyver, I'm invincible until Penny dies, so you'll gain no new information from my lynch (unless timmer was Penny, in which case you'll be killing a civ).

So if I were in your shoes, I'd be searching for a better target than me.

I agree with paragraph two.

Spacedaisy wrote:I would really like to hear BWT's input right now on boomslang's survival.

I'm not sure what to tell you, other than that I didn't find Dr. Fetus last night.

Well, Boomslang does have a good point there. And for the record, here's my suspish-o-meter as things currently stand, from most to least suspicious:

Elo
Mongoose
Boom
Hedge
Daisy
Bea
FH
Lizzy
Nevin
BWT
SVS
DF

I should have more to say, but I often lose my train of thought. Still, Elo is probably where my vote is going today.

Boomslang wrote:Well, I guess Zodac didn't get the memo regarding the usefulness of an Elo lynch to the baddie-hunting cause. For all reasons previously outlined, I'm very inclined to vote her again today.

But let's think about the likely outcomes if you vote for me again today. If I'm Fetus, you can't kill me until BWT passes his random search, which is basically a coin flip and a potentially wasted lynch. If I'm Cohen, you'll have wasted a lynch on an almost entirely harmless indie role. If I'm MacGuyver, I'm invincible until Penny dies, so you'll gain no new information from my lynch (unless timmer was Penny, in which case you'll be killing a civ).

So if I were in your shoes, I'd be searching for a better target than me.

So... you are not saying you are a civvie? You are trying to talk us out of lynching you based on probablities?

You're bad, IMO.

I agree with you SVS that Boom is bad. And I think he is just using me to deflect attention.

I think he's bad too. But the question is, is he lynchable?

I think he's Cohen. Which is not exactly "bad", but probably needs lynching.
No rush on that though.

I certainly don't think he's fetus, though I suppose he could be the creeper if he got a protection of some kind from somewhere.

So who do you think IS Fetus? Or Creeper?

So does everyone think it's worth possibly "wasting" a day voting to lynch Boom?

S~V~S wrote:So who do you think IS Fetus? Or Creeper?

I don't have any idea who is the creeper, I'm afraid..
I recommend that you read back over my last few days, though -
Knowing what you know I know you know I know, of course. ;-)

Ugh! I can't help but feel a bit responsible for Timmer's death, or more like, I could have avoided it... SVS should know what I'm talking about.

Nevinera wrote:I think he's Cohen. Which is not exactly "bad", but probably needs lynching.
No rush on that though.

This is very interesting. I took that N9 post for what it was/seemed and thought we were dealing with a kind of baddie ELP, with a new and improved baddie Cohen recruited by Moriarty. Do you think Cohen is still a proper independent who hasn't decided what his allegiance is? Unless, the supergroup did happen, with the main killers from each team keeping their successive NKs, and if the Manipulators are indeed gone, then what's it to the VG's to throw Cohen under the bus knowing he'd survive, and either frame him as Fetus or convince us to waste a lynch on him while they get to kill one of the trusted people the next night?

Either way, I vote to NOT vote Boom today.

Mongoose wrote:I"m okay with voting Boom. Because if he survived because he's McGuyver, it means Penny is still alive and the lynch won't occur, so it's not like we will lynch a civ for information.

Mongoose wrote:So does everyone think it's worth possibly "wasting" a day voting to lynch Boom?

You seem very eager to 'waste' a day, don't you? Why is that?

I think I might throw another vote at you today.

I am not, which is why I brought it up because of that concern. I feel that is a bit word-twisty of you to even say that when my last post is clearly showing wariness of wasting another day.
I even swore on my cat that I'm good.if you are truly good, and not Martell, help me look elsewhere. If not Boom, who?

I don't know as I'll be on to vote before it ends, so I'll go ahead and *Vote Elo*

S~V~S wrote:

Boomslang wrote:Well, I guess Zodac didn't get the memo regarding the usefulness of an Elo lynch to the baddie-hunting cause. For all reasons previously outlined, I'm very inclined to vote her again today.

But let's think about the likely outcomes if you vote for me again today. If I'm Fetus, you can't kill me until BWT passes his random search, which is basically a coin flip and a potentially wasted lynch. If I'm Cohen, you'll have wasted a lynch on an almost entirely harmless indie role. If I'm MacGuyver, I'm invincible until Penny dies, so you'll gain no new information from my lynch (unless timmer was Penny, in which case you'll be killing a civ).

So if I were in your shoes, I'd be searching for a better target than me.

So... you are not saying you are a civvie? You are trying to talk us out of lynching you based on probablities?

You're bad, IMO.

Because desperate claims towards being a civ are always convincing and don't ever look like a last-ditch baddie attempt to fit in. I'm giving you the facts and advising you to make smart decisions based on them.

I'm not saying we waste a day and vote Boom. However, I am thinking it may be good to vote Boom. Couldn't he be bluffing? And won't it provide some info?

I don't see how it would provide any info. If he survived once, he'll survive again and the same roles will be considered. And if he is Cohen, like Nev thinks, then he's not as immediate a threat as Creeper or Fetus.

I am torn on who to vote for today.

Wait a minute. I am thinking of MOTU and how we civvies could have won if we have just tried to lynch zodac twice in a row. Am I remember his incorrectly? What if he is Zodac and we just need ot lynch him twice in a row to kill him?

Maybe he had different win cons there? Here he can win with any team, he is not a LMS role. And I am not thinking Boom is Zodac, tbh.

Flyin' High wrote:I don't see how it would provide any info. If he survived once, he'll survive again and the same roles will be considered. And if he is Cohen, like Nev thinks, then he's not as immediate a threat as Creeper or Fetus.

I am torn on who to vote for today.

I want to lynch someone who is, A) Bad, and B) will die

Getting someone who is a more immediate threat would be good, but in the absence of 100% foolproof info, a dead baddie will be good for me, regardless of immediacy.

I'm going to be on my phone most of the day.

In terms of ? my largest ones are for Boom, Elo and SD.

Hedgey and goosey are in the next level. It's possible one of them are conning me in my feelings of civness.

I feel pretty sure that DP is civ.

Then SVS, Nev and Lizzy.

I'm most sure I'm civ.

I have no idea where to vote, but I'm willing to follow what those I trust most think is best. I've had crap luck trying to figure anything out.

@SVS - I understand and I agree.

Lizzy wrote:

Mongoose wrote:I"m okay with voting Boom. Because if he survived because he's McGuyver, it means Penny is still alive and the lynch won't occur, so it's not like we will lynch a civ for information.

Mongoose wrote:So does everyone think it's worth possibly "wasting" a day voting to lynch Boom?

You seem very eager to 'waste' a day, don't you? Why is that?

I think I might throw another vote at you today.

As much as I agree with this, Mongoose is still my 2nd choice currently. I still have bea as my primary suspect/vote-getter though.

It definitely seems like she's trying to make us burn another lynch opportunity. I will have to think about this.

Mongoose wrote:I am not, which is why I brought it up because of that concern. I feel that is a bit word-twisty of you to even say that when my last post is clearly showing wariness of wasting another day.
I even swore on my cat that I'm good.if you are truly good, and not Martell, help me look elsewhere. If not Boom, who?

I'm having a deja vu from Shawshank. So if I vote for you now, I'm Martell, eh? Hmmm... If not Boom, you.

Lizzy wrote:

Mongoose wrote:I am not, which is why I brought it up because of that concern. I feel that is a bit word-twisty of you to even say that when my last post is clearly showing wariness of wasting another day.
I even swore on my cat that I'm good.if you are truly good, and not Martell, help me look elsewhere. If not Boom, who?

I'm having a deja vu from Shawshank. So if I vote for you now, I'm Martell, eh? Hmmm... If not Boom, you.

birdwithteeth11 wrote:

Lizzy wrote:

Mongoose wrote:I"m okay with voting Boom. Because if he survived because he's McGuyver, it means Penny is still alive and the lynch won't occur, so it's not like we will lynch a civ for information.

Mongoose wrote:So does everyone think it's worth possibly "wasting" a day voting to lynch Boom?

You seem very eager to 'waste' a day, don't you? Why is that?

I think I might throw another vote at you today.

As much as I agree with this, Mongoose is still my 2nd choice currently. I still have bea as my primary suspect/vote-getter though.

It definitely seems like she's trying to make us burn another lynch opportunity. I will have to think about this.

The thing with Bea is that BDH basically confirmed she was civ. And think about his role. And I'm willing to take another risk and say that DF is also a civ.

Lizzy wrote:So, if Boom is Cohen and DF and Bea are cleared, then we need two of the following:

Elo
Goosey
Hedgey
SD

Does this mean you are up for trying to lynch Boom?

Yesterday Mongoose, Bea, and Elohcin voted for Boomslang. Elohcin came across sounding like either an indy who just had their win condition made almost impossible, or a very frustrated civvie. Bea has been giving me some squirrelly vibes so it's possible something is off with her, I'm undecided on that front.

Lizzy, Timmer, and Hedgeowl voted for Mongoose yesterday. I feel certain Lizzy is Mycroft and I totally trusted Timmer. Hedgeowl I go back and forth on. But at least two people I trust voted for Mongoose and think she's up to no good.

Of the Elohcin voters, Nev thinks Boomslang is Cohen (I'm not sure, but I don't think Boomslang is civvie at this point), Nev I trust, S~V~S I trust, SD I am leaning towards trusting because she went after Epig who was likely PP, and myself.

So I guess my big question marks are Mongoose, Hedgeowl, and Elohcin with me leaning towards voting for Mongoose based on cases brought against her and not being able to pin her down as trustworthy.

*Linki* Oh, forgot about DF since he didn't vote. He hinted at something that makes me inclined to trust him for now, but he also goes on my question-mark list.

I voted Mongoose. I'm watching TV and didn't want to lose track of time and miss the vote later.

bea wrote:Goosey did also imply pretty heavily that she had lots to do with my rez and that it may have been a result of the contest prizes. Again I ask, why would she have rezed me if she wasn't civ? This is one of the things I mean by "her actions in the game aren't consistent with being a baddie."

I guess she could be pulling the wool over my eyes, but it's really, really hard for me to buy that she's bad.

Bea I am interested in this thought right here. Do you still think mongoose had something to do with your rezz? Considering you defended her yesterday but now place her and I as tier 2 suspects I am just wondering. Based on ths statement and some thinking I have been wondering if mongoose is in fact a very useful civvie.

Now that we know it was a tie between Boom and Elo, there are only so many reasons that could have happened. Based on Nevs thought that Percy could have influenced the vote, there are only 3 people that could be: Mongoose, bea, and Elo.

Based on bea statements above if BDH were thomas and his partner Percy had the ability to rezz someone, wouldnt it be likely that person would rezz bea? Only other way I see this working is if bea is Percy. Thoughts?

This would make me reevaluate my stance on Mongoose. Otherwise I will probably vote for her again.

Linki

I'm not feeling elo again - if she isn't cohen, then her reaction seemed more civ than desperate baddie to me.
And since I did that reread I have had the feeling that she's barely been reading the game -
that remark about Zodac is completely typical of her this game.

Either she's a masterful actress, or she doesn't have teammates feeding her explanations and advice.
I still have no feelings either way about mongoose, but she's acting the most like I think *I* would behave in a situation like the baddies must be in now.
So I'm going to vote there also tonight, and hope.

Hedgeowl wrote:

bea wrote:Goosey did also imply pretty heavily that she had lots to do with my rez and that it may have been a result of the contest prizes. Again I ask, why would she have rezed me if she wasn't civ? This is one of the things I mean by "her actions in the game aren't consistent with being a baddie."

I guess she could be pulling the wool over my eyes, but it's really, really hard for me to buy that she's bad.

Bea I am interested in this thought right here. Do you still think mongoose had something to do with your rezz? Considering you defended her yesterday but now place her and I as tier 2 suspects I am just wondering. Based on ths statement and some thinking I have been wondering if mongoose is in fact a very useful civvie.

Now that we know it was a tie between Boom and Elo, there are only so many reasons that could have happened. Based on Nevs thought that Percy could have influenced the vote, there are only 3 people that could be: Mongoose, bea, and Elo.

Based on bea statements above if BDH were thomas and his partner Percy had the ability to rezz someone, wouldnt it be likely that person would rezz bea? Only other way I see this working is if bea is Percy. Thoughts?

This would make me reevaluate my stance on Mongoose. Otherwise I will probably vote for her again.

Linki

There were also contest prizes. Lets not forget those.

I kinda think Percy is dead~ I had someone in mind for that role.

I am gonna go with Bea. Her throwing Goosey under the bus so easily after the major production yesterday is making me tense, tbh.

S~V~S wrote:I kinda think Percy is dead~ I had someone in mind for that role.

I am gonna go with Bea. Her throwing Goosey under the bus so easily after the major production yesterday is making me tense, tbh.

I do keep forgetting about the prizes since no one gave me one. I do not feel good about beas 180 on Mongoose either, but would love to hear from both of them. It occured to me the other day and I wish I had posted earlier.

Hedgeowl wrote:

bea wrote:Goosey did also imply pretty heavily that she had lots to do with my rez and that it may have been a result of the contest prizes. Again I ask, why would she have rezed me if she wasn't civ? This is one of the things I mean by "her actions in the game aren't consistent with being a baddie."

I guess she could be pulling the wool over my eyes, but it's really, really hard for me to buy that she's bad.

Bea I am interested in this thought right here. Do you still think mongoose had something to do with your rezz? Considering you defended her yesterday but now place her and I as tier 2 suspects I am just wondering. Based on ths statement and some thinking I have been wondering if mongoose is in fact a very useful civvie.

Now that we know it was a tie between Boom and Elo, there are only so many reasons that could have happened. Based on Nevs thought that Percy could have influenced the vote, there are only 3 people that could be: Mongoose, bea, and Elo.

Based on bea statements above if BDH were thomas and his partner Percy had the ability to rezz someone, wouldnt it be likely that person would rezz bea? Only other way I see this working is if bea is Percy. Thoughts?

This would make me reevaluate my stance on Mongoose. Otherwise I will probably vote for her again.

I think goosey rezzed me via a prize. It is how I read her hints. I am not Percy. I do not think she is Percy. I think Percy is very much alive. I was not throwing her under the bus. I did not say I was voting her nor did I vote her. I WAS saying that maybe I'm missing something if so many others seem to think she is bad.


You and she and fh are in this weird middle ground for me.

Linki[/quote]

Wish I knew the remaining bads, but I don't. So I must lurk in case I need to save myself.

This is really hard to do from my phone I miss the crackberry...

bea wrote:I'm going to be on my phone most of the day.

In terms of ? my largest ones are for Boom, Elo and SD.

Hedgey and goosey are in the next level. It's possible one of them are conning me in my feelings of civness.

I feel pretty sure that DP is civ.

Then SVS, Nev and Lizzy.

I'm most sure I'm civ.

I have no idea where to vote, but I'm willing to follow what those I trust most think is best. I've had crap luck trying to figure anything out.

Based on that, I am not sure who you think to be Percy. Or, should i say, there is only one person you could be alluding to based on process of elimination, and i have read that persons posts over and over before today, and i have no idea how you would get that idea of this persons role, or indeed, any idea of their role at all, based on their posts.

bea wrote:

Hedgeowl wrote:

bea wrote:Goosey did also imply pretty heavily that she had lots to do with my rez and that it may have been a result of the contest prizes. Again I ask, why would she have rezed me if she wasn't civ? This is one of the things I mean by "her actions in the game aren't consistent with being a baddie."

I guess she could be pulling the wool over my eyes, but it's really, really hard for me to buy that she's bad.

Bea I am interested in this thought right here. Do you still think mongoose had something to do with your rezz? Considering you defended her yesterday but now place her and I as tier 2 suspects I am just wondering. Based on ths statement and some thinking I have been wondering if mongoose is in fact a very useful civvie.

Now that we know it was a tie between Boom and Elo, there are only so many reasons that could have happened. Based on Nevs thought that Percy could have influenced the vote, there are only 3 people that could be: Mongoose, bea, and Elo.

Based on bea statements above if BDH were thomas and his partner Percy had the ability to rezz someone, wouldnt it be likely that person would rezz bea? Only other way I see this working is if bea is Percy. Thoughts?

This would make me reevaluate my stance on Mongoose. Otherwise I will probably vote for her again.

I think goosey rezzed me via a prize. It is how I read her hints. I am not Percy. I do not think she is Percy. I think Percy is very much alive. I was not throwing her under the bus. I did not say I was voting her nor did I vote her. I WAS saying that maybe I'm missing something if so many others seem to think she is bad.


You and she and fh are in this weird middle ground for me.

Linki

[/quote]

This makes me more likely to vote Mongoose, although she did swear on her cat, which in Animal Sanctuary Code speak is pretty serious.

We still have almost two hours right? I need dinner and will be back.

I think they hinted. I was not the only person to catch it.

Tbh I only moved her into the question catagory because I feel like I'm the only one who sees her as good. If I'm the only one theni have to at least conciser the life's that I'm a sucker. Right?

bea wrote:I think they hinted. I was not the only person to catch it.

Tbh I only moved her into the question catagory because I feel like I'm the only one who sees her as good. If I'm the only one theni have to at least conciser the life's that I'm a sucker. Right?

It would be the first time that a bunch of civs were wrong, misled, etc. but if she's not Percy then I don't think she good either.

votes Mongoose