Game of Champions 2017 - GAME OVER

[S~V~S]

Quick post (because I’m seriously doubtful I’ll be back before deadline with the day’s events here). Gonna aubergine Wilgy because of that role descriptor. Will catch up later (I’m trying to do bits by phone when I have time) when I’m on a computer.

I am curious
My role sounds much worse than his
Why no vote for me?

Are you voting for
Wilgy ONLY for the role
Description? Or why?

If only for the
Role Description you look bad
for that vote reason

[Scotty]

Ok like I’m all for a Wilgy counter lynch but this is ridiculous.

Speedchuck needs to die today. Crocodile tears be damned.

Wilgy can die tomorrow. We’ve been waiting for this for 3 full cycles.

Plus, Quin will probably remove him from the poll again tomorrow so like...don’t make my skin turn green

[sig]

Everyone on the Wilgy wagon needs to readjust their priorities, we've got someone who's basically an outted scum and mechanically bad. Even if he's actually scum hunting it means nothing since there are two scum teams. The speed matter needs to resolved and he needs to be gone.

[sig]

Voting Wilgy before I forget to vote tomorrow. I think Chuck is probably also bad, but I think there is more reason to believe Wilgy is bad. I look great in aubergine, btw.

Like are people comfortable being on a wagon with this vote? She thinks Speed is bad AND HE HAS BEEN MECHANICALLY OUTTED, yet she's going for an inactive player who might or might not be mafia? Even if we think wilgy is bad an inactive scum can be lynched later, we've got an active scum right here who should've been lynched phases ago.

[sig]

There's been several mafia flips.

How about we just start lynching people with fewer than several posts?

Bad plan low poster/inactive doesn't equal mafia. Why go for Wilgy over speed if you think both are bad? Walk me through this thought process.

Quick post (because I’m seriously doubtful I’ll be back before deadline with the day’s events here). Gonna aubergine Wilgy because of that role descriptor. Will catch up later (I’m trying to do bits by phone when I have time) when I’m on a computer.

Role Description over mech outted not good. I could vote here tomorrow.


Here is the thing with the knowledge we have Speed is mafia. Nutella role and the fact we know there are two teams proves that. Also the amount of resistance to Speed's lynch means in my mind he has teammates trying to keep him alive longer and that he hopes this'll get brushed under the rug. Wilgy is nothing but a scapegoat counterwagon at this point.

[sig]

There's been several mafia flips.

How about we just start lynching people with fewer than several posts?

Bad plan low poster/inactive doesn't equal mafia. Why go for Wilgy over speed if you think both are bad? Walk me through this thought process.

Quick post (because I’m seriously doubtful I’ll be back before deadline with the day’s events here). Gonna aubergine Wilgy because of that role descriptor. Will catch up later (I’m trying to do bits by phone when I have time) when I’m on a computer.

Role Description over mech outted not good. I could vote here tomorrow.


Here is the thing with the knowledge we have Speed is mafia. Nutella role and the fact we know there are two teams proves that. Also the amount of resistance to Speed's lynch means in my mind he has teammates trying to keep him alive longer and that he hopes this'll get brushed under the rug. Wilgy is nothing but a scapegoat counterwagon at this point.

[Kylemii]

I wanna hear the general idea in your words how you currently interpret them.

alright, so the argument for speedchuck lynch seems to be primarily related to his public flip, being host confirmed as civ followed by nutella's flip as a mafia member with a role that creates fake flips. speedchuck's argument against this seems to be that from his point of view there must be a "one of us only tells the truth and the other only tells lies" counterpart to nutella's role, which is basically the only thing he actually could present in his defense of the Nutella thing. 3 problems, why would speedchuck make an ideal target for a power like that? If such a role existed I would expect the player that has it to be defending speedchuck from the suspicion they had unintentionally put upon him, so I guess that would be a thing to look out for. Problem 3, if speedchuck's public flip was the result of a different role than nutella's then doesn't that mean that nutella's role went unused?

wilgy's deal is a little more nebulous, which is usual for wilgy I guess. there seems to be multiple people who want to lynch Wilgy for different and sometimes intersecting reasons. ive seen meta related reasoning that Wilgy is more serious than usual which is a tendency for his baddie gameplay. there's also talk of his previous role seeming like a role which would be more effective in the hands of the mafia. there's also Sloonei(?) and.... DH's(or was it epi's???) reasoning that because sprityo was killed following the immigration of Cerberus that his killer was more likely to be a part of the immigrating group. Sloonei worked down the group to Wilgy using poe and he was left with Wilgy as the most likely killer of that group.

that's the understanding I get from my limited experience in the thread, I am confident that I'm missing out on some nuance, and would appreciate any gap-filling that may occur. as of right now I'd be more inclined to lynch speed out of the two.

[Kylemii]

also aubergine [VOTE: speed] aubergine

[Dragon D. Luffy]

I wouldn't call that a slip up, fwiw.

What exactly is the suspicion against him?

Distancing. I don't think you misunderstand, I just think calling it a slip is wrong. To me, a slip is what LC did. I'm kinda arguing semantics but to me there's a big difference between "behavior that indicates one may be mafia" and "slip".

Distancing from wilgy?
@insertnamehere care to respond to this?

My question was your answer, SVS.

We are not voting INH for the reasons he gave to lynch Wilgy.

We are voting him for the reasons he gave NOT to lynch Wilgy.

Do you disagree with my reasons? I'm sorry, it was an 11-3 split, a couple hours until EOD, and the person with three votes was someone I think is an active town. Speedchuck isn't lynchable, and I don't have time to shout Sig or Scotty's name from the rafters, and given the "strategy" I've seen on display, I doubt anyone would have gave a damn anyway.

DDL responded to this with:

It's not like I need you to agree with the case anyway.

I gave my reasons for what I did, and I don't think it's "distancing." Apparently, some people disagree. Bully for them.

You gave reasons and a bunch of "wah wah I hate you guys I am never playing mafia again"

My reaction to this was "waste of time to keep going".

[speedchuck]

we've got someone who's basically an outted scum and mechanically bad.

She thinks Speed is bad AND HE HAS BEEN MECHANICALLY OUTTED,

Here is the thing with the knowledge we have Speed is mafia. Nutella role and the fact we know there are two teams proves that.

I get that occam's razor points to me being bad, but come on. This is blatantly false.

-

Speedchuck needs to die today. Crocodile tears be damned.

Spoiler: show

I don't mind being lynched, but you guys are NOT going to shame and cast suspicion on the open-minded players in this game. I refuse to let that be a thing. I think my flip will clear things up, so long as you don't go over the rainbow to tinfoil land. But agh, this grates.

[sig]

There is no way around the fact that nutella's role outs you as mafia.

[mention]Dragon D. Luffy[/mention] Explain your progression on votes? You went from being adamant about lynching Speed for two phases, to for almost no reason switching over to Wilgy since he could also be mafia.

[Scotty]

I don't mind being lynched, but you guys are NOT going to shame and cast suspicion on the open-minded players in this game.

Hey dude, how bout some legacy reads in the case that the rest of the tribe gets their shit together? I mean, regardless, you did promise maybe

[Scotty]

Oh, and sig technically you are wrong- he can’t mechanically outed in a game that has a closed set up and fake role reveals ala cbob.

But knowing that there do exist fake role reveals in this game, we have yet to see a real role reveal from someone that hasn’t died, so it gives clear credence to speedchuck’s label.

So.

[speedchuck]

I don't mind being lynched, but you guys are NOT going to shame and cast suspicion on the open-minded players in this game.

Hey dude, how bout some legacy reads in the case that the rest of the tribe gets their shit together? I mean, regardless, you did promise maybe

I will. I'll give a POE + readlist with reasons for every player before dayend.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

Quick post (because I’m seriously doubtful I’ll be back before deadline with the day’s events here). Gonna aubergine Wilgy because of that role descriptor. Will catch up later (I’m trying to do bits by phone when I have time) when I’m on a computer.

I am curious
My role sounds much worse than his
Why no vote for me?

Are you voting for
Wilgy ONLY for the role
Description? Or why?

If only for the
Role Description you look bad
for that vote reason

I disagree.

Wilgy's sounds more like a role that would be given to mafia.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

Ok like I’m all for a Wilgy counter lynch but this is ridiculous.

Speedchuck needs to die today. Crocodile tears be damned.

Wilgy can die tomorrow. We’ve been waiting for this for 3 full cycles.

Plus, Quin will probably remove him from the poll again tomorrow so like...don’t make my skin turn green

The last point is convincing.

[VOTE: speedchuck] aubergine

[Scotty]

I don't mind being lynched, but you guys are NOT going to shame and cast suspicion on the open-minded players in this game.

Hey dude, how bout some legacy reads in the case that the rest of the tribe gets their shit together? I mean, regardless, you did promise maybe

I will. I'll give a POE + readlist with reasons for every player before dayend.

Appreciated my good sir.

[Scotty]

Ok like I’m all for a Wilgy counter lynch but this is ridiculous.

Speedchuck needs to die today. Crocodile tears be damned.

Wilgy can die tomorrow. We’ve been waiting for this for 3 full cycles.

Plus, Quin will probably remove him from the poll again tomorrow so like...don’t make my skin turn green

The last point is convincing.

[VOTE: speedchuck] aubergine

I figured the whole nutella thing was convincing enough tho

[Dragon D. Luffy]

I mean seriously, the thought of not seeing Speedchuck in the poll tomorrow gives me shivers.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

It is, but I was willing to lynch Wilgy first since he also has some reallt damning things about him.

[speedchuck]

Cerberus V1:
Boomslang
DrWilgy - targeted Marmot with pseudo-killing role? Not Strex?
insertnamehere
JackofHearts - killed by Strex twice, probably town
Kylemii
LoRab - Button that switched tribes.
Marmot - Strex
nijuukyugou - killed night 1 by Strex, nutella's BTSC partner
Scotty - has been nightkilled once
sig
Sloonei - selected to spy on other tribe
Spacedaisy
-------(At least one Even present in Cerberus)-------

Pikachu V1:
colonialbob - First role was a trap. Evens sprung that trap. Likely not an Even.
dharmahelper - Candidate for haiku.
Dom - Called out LC's slip. Not an Even. Candidate for haiku.
Dragon D Luffy - Accidentally died, then rezzed with 2 lives in second role. LC was the reason for the rez. But that also killed nutella.
Epignosis - Has been trying to clear town. Candidate for haiku?
Long Con - Even
Nutella - Even
Quin - still townfirmed
Speedchuck - mathematically confirmed town with first role. Implicated by nutella flip, which cannot target a teammate. Still town tho.
sprityo - First role was Cecil, town? announcer
S~V~S - First role was a trap that SVS tried her best not to spring. Towny behavior.
-------(No evidence of Strexcorp presence)-------

Cerberus V2:
Boomslang
ColonialBob - First role was a trap. Evens sprung that trap. Likely not an Even.
Dom - Called out LC's slip. Not an Even. Candidate for haiku.
Dragon D. Luffy - Accidentally died, then rezzed with 2 lives in second role. LC was the reason for the rez. But that also killed nutella.
insertnamehere
LoRab - Button that switched tribes.
Nijuukyugou - killed night 1, nutella's BTSC partner
Quin - still townfirmed
sig
S~V~S - First role was a trap that SVS tried her best not to spring. Towny behavior. Killed by Evens.
Speedchuck - mathematically confirmed town with first role. Implicated by nutella flip, which cannot target a teammate. Still town tho.

Pikachu V2:
dharmahelper - Candidate for haiku.
DrWilgy - targeted Marmot with pseudo-killing role? Not Strex?
Epignosis - Has been trying to clear town. Candidate for haiku?
Kylemii
Marmot - Strex
nutella - Even
Scotty - has been nightkilled once, by the evens
Sloonei - selected to spy on other tribe in v1
Spacedaisy
sprityo - First role was Cecil, town? announcer

Players that moved from Pikachu to Cerberus: cbob, dom, ddl, quin, svs, speedchuck
Players that moved from Cerberus to Pikachu: Wilgy, Kyle, Marmot, Scotty, Sloonei, Daisy

DEATHS:
D1 - Quin - survived
N1 - niju (Strexkill)
D2 - speedchuck
N2 - Scotty (Evens)
D3 - nutella (changed from DDL)
N3 - JoH (Strexkill)
INH dies
D4 - Long Con
N4 - Evens blocked by Strex
D5 - Long Con
N5 - Sig (Strex)
D6 - Cbob
N6 - SVS (Evens)
D7 - Marmot

BUTTON

N7 - JoH (Strex)
Nutella dies
D8 - Marmot
N8 - Sprityo (Evens)
LoRab Dies
MERGE
D9 - Wilgy

I've got this thing copied, and I'm making notes as I go. Is it missing anything?

I'm quoting this post. Keep track, guys. We get so much information by lynching and nightkills in this setup.

Upcoming is a readlist based on this.

[DharmaHelper]

Christ alive whats going on

[DharmaHelper]

I for sure changed my vote to Wilgy and I just had to do it again

[Epignosis]

There's been several mafia flips.

How about we just start lynching people with fewer than several posts?

Bad plan low poster/inactive doesn't equal mafia. Why go for Wilgy over speed if you think both are bad? Walk me through this thought process.

If speedchuck is bad, then it's a good thing that he keeps talking as much as he does.

DrWilgy isn't saying anything.

Quick post (because I’m seriously doubtful I’ll be back before deadline with the day’s events here). Gonna aubergine Wilgy because of that role descriptor. Will catch up later (I’m trying to do bits by phone when I have time) when I’m on a computer.

Role Description over mech outted not good. I could vote here tomorrow.


Here is the thing with the knowledge we have Speed is mafia. Nutella role and the fact we know there are two teams proves that. Also the amount of resistance to Speed's lynch means in my mind he has teammates trying to keep him alive longer and that he hopes this'll get brushed under the rug. Wilgy is nothing but a scapegoat counterwagon at this point.

DrWilgy
6
33%
Voters: Sloonei, speedchuck, Epignosis, Quin, LoRab, nijuukyugou

Hot damn that's a big team.

[DharmaHelper]

Epi (again) voting to save speedchuck his teammate but nobody wants to listen to me so I don't give a fuck anymore I'm voting for Wilgy.

[Scotty]

I wanna hear the general idea in your words how you currently interpret them.

alright, so the argument for speedchuck lynch seems to be primarily related to his public flip, being host confirmed as civ followed by nutella's flip as a mafia member with a role that creates fake flips. speedchuck's argument against this seems to be that from his point of view there must be a "one of us only tells the truth and the other only tells lies" counterpart to nutella's role, which is basically the only thing he actually could present in his defense of the Nutella thing. 3 problems, why would speedchuck make an ideal target for a power like that? If such a role existed I would expect the player that has it to be defending speedchuck from the suspicion they had unintentionally put upon him, so I guess that would be a thing to look out for. Problem 3, if speedchuck's public flip was the result of a different role than nutella's then doesn't that mean that nutella's role went unused?

wilgy's deal is a little more nebulous, which is usual for wilgy I guess. there seems to be multiple people who want to lynch Wilgy for different and sometimes intersecting reasons. ive seen meta related reasoning that Wilgy is more serious than usual which is a tendency for his baddie gameplay. there's also talk of his previous role seeming like a role which would be more effective in the hands of the mafia. there's also Sloonei(?) and.... DH's(or was it epi's???) reasoning that because sprityo was killed following the immigration of Cerberus that his killer was more likely to be a part of the immigrating group. Sloonei worked down the group to Wilgy using poe and he was left with Wilgy as the most likely killer of that group.

that's the understanding I get from my limited experience in the thread, I am confident that I'm missing out on some nuance, and would appreciate any gap-filling that may occur. as of right now I'd be more inclined to lynch speed out of the two.

nice, thanks man.

good things to look for, indeed. Could be a smear campaign for nutella if speed was civ. I don't have a reason yet laid out on why speed would be her target. She had already lost a life, so maybe she was feeling the heat to expend her power?

If speed is mafia, he is either on Strex or a 3rd mafia team, should it exist. 100%.

If speed is civ, there is a civ identity revealer out there, that had a one-shot ability like nutella had.

[Epignosis]

Epi (again) voting to save speedchuck his teammate but nobody wants to listen to me so I don't give a fuck anymore I'm voting for Wilgy.

[Scotty]

Epi (again) voting to save speedchuck his teammate but nobody wants to listen to me so I don't give a fuck anymore I'm voting for Wilgy.

I don't understand you. You speak Klingon

[Epignosis]

I wanna hear the general idea in your words how you currently interpret them.

alright, so the argument for speedchuck lynch seems to be primarily related to his public flip, being host confirmed as civ followed by nutella's flip as a mafia member with a role that creates fake flips. speedchuck's argument against this seems to be that from his point of view there must be a "one of us only tells the truth and the other only tells lies" counterpart to nutella's role, which is basically the only thing he actually could present in his defense of the Nutella thing. 3 problems, why would speedchuck make an ideal target for a power like that? If such a role existed I would expect the player that has it to be defending speedchuck from the suspicion they had unintentionally put upon him, so I guess that would be a thing to look out for. Problem 3, if speedchuck's public flip was the result of a different role than nutella's then doesn't that mean that nutella's role went unused?

wilgy's deal is a little more nebulous, which is usual for wilgy I guess. there seems to be multiple people who want to lynch Wilgy for different and sometimes intersecting reasons. ive seen meta related reasoning that Wilgy is more serious than usual which is a tendency for his baddie gameplay. there's also talk of his previous role seeming like a role which would be more effective in the hands of the mafia. there's also Sloonei(?) and.... DH's(or was it epi's???) reasoning that because sprityo was killed following the immigration of Cerberus that his killer was more likely to be a part of the immigrating group. Sloonei worked down the group to Wilgy using poe and he was left with Wilgy as the most likely killer of that group.

that's the understanding I get from my limited experience in the thread, I am confident that I'm missing out on some nuance, and would appreciate any gap-filling that may occur. as of right now I'd be more inclined to lynch speed out of the two.

nice, thanks man.

good things to look for, indeed. Could be a smear campaign for nutella if speed was civ. I don't have a reason yet laid out on why speed would be her target. She had already lost a life, so maybe she was feeling the heat to expend her power?

If speed is mafia, he is either on Strex or a 3rd mafia team, should it exist. 100%.

If speed is civ, there is a civ identity revealer out there, that had a one-shot ability like nutella had.

Required reading for Scotty and Kylemii.

[Scotty]

Epi (again) voting to save speedchuck his teammate but nobody wants to listen to me so I don't give a fuck anymore I'm voting for Wilgy.

I don't understand you. You speak Klingon

like this has warning bells all over it.

did something change in alignment last night for you?

[DharmaHelper]

Epi (again) voting to save speedchuck his teammate but nobody wants to listen to me so I don't give a fuck anymore I'm voting for Wilgy.

I don't understand you. You speak Klingon

like this has warning bells all over it.

did something change in alignment last night for you?

No.

[Epignosis]

The irony of that post kills me, DH.

[Scotty]

I'm not seeing anything to suggest that refraining from lynching speedchuck would be a good idea.

And yet, here you are, voting for Wilgy.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

There's been several mafia flips.

How about we just start lynching people with fewer than several posts?

Bad plan low poster/inactive doesn't equal mafia. Why go for Wilgy over speed if you think both are bad? Walk me through this thought process.

Quick post (because I’m seriously doubtful I’ll be back before deadline with the day’s events here). Gonna aubergine Wilgy because of that role descriptor. Will catch up later (I’m trying to do bits by phone when I have time) when I’m on a computer.

Role Description over mech outted not good. I could vote here tomorrow.


Here is the thing with the knowledge we have Speed is mafia. Nutella role and the fact we know there are two teams proves that. Also the amount of resistance to Speed's lynch means in my mind he has teammates trying to keep him alive longer and that he hopes this'll get brushed under the rug. Wilgy is nothing but a scapegoat counterwagon at this point.

Hey dude chill on the conspiracy theories. Chances are baddie speed doesn't even have ebough teammates to fill 1/3 of the Wilgy wagon.

[DharmaHelper]

The irony of that post kills me, DH.

Dramatic Irony

[Epignosis]

I'm not seeing anything to suggest that refraining from lynching speedchuck would be a good idea.

And yet, here you are, voting for Wilgy.

And?

[Scotty]

I'm not seeing anything to suggest that refraining from lynching speedchuck would be a good idea.

And yet, here you are, voting for Wilgy.

And?

[Dragon D. Luffy]

Epi (again) voting to save speedchuck his teammate but nobody wants to listen to me so I don't give a fuck anymore I'm voting for Wilgy.

- nobody
- speedchuck leading the poll.

Okay.

[DharmaHelper]

A line from Shakespeare
"Wherefore art thou, Romeo?"
Juliet says that.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

DH either you are part of the solution or part of the problem. Pick one.

[Epignosis]

I'm not seeing anything to suggest that refraining from lynching speedchuck would be a good idea.

And yet, here you are, voting for Wilgy.

And?

Do you think the game will end if speedchuck is lynched? I don't.

I already answered this to sig. speedchuck is talking. That's a good thing regardless of his alignment. DrWilgy, in my view, also needs to be removed, but he is not providing anything further for people to analyze.

Consider also that I originally voted for colonialbob, and then moved to DrWilgy after Sloonei asked me to do so. At that time, DrWilgy had two votes to speedchuck's four or five. Did you except DrWilgy to be tied with speedchuck at this moment? I certainly didn't, but it makes no never mind to me, because even if by some stretch DrWilgy is a civilian, he's not producing, and speedchuck is.

[DharmaHelper]

DH either you are part of the solution or part of the problem. Pick one.

Do you bite your thumb at me, sir?

[Scotty]

DH either you are part of the solution or part of the problem. Pick one.

For DH

[speedchuck]

Speedchuck
Quin
sprityo
S~V~S
Epignosis
dharmahelper
Scotty

nijuukyugou
colonialbob - not even
Dom - not even
LoRab
Boomslang
Sloonei
Spacedaisy
insertnamehere
sig
Dragon D Luffy
Kylemii
DrWilgy

I don't think there were Strex on Pikachu v1. That alone is responsible for putting Dom and cbob as high as they are. I would have to be wrong there for them to be scum.
Maybe someone will actually engage that theory once I die.

Quin is townfirm.

Sprit is only scum if recruited IMO. Cecil and all. Plus I like his output.

SVS is just straight-up town in my eyes. She wouldn't be trying so hard to fit me in a scumspot as scum. She'd know better. I firmly believe that only town can be this misguided, as I was on the LC lynch.

Epi has done absolutely nothing to set off any alarms. I follow all of his thought processes, to the point where it looks like I'm buddying. I don't think he's been coasting, which is what I saw him do once as scum. I have no reason to read scum here.

DH - His opposition to the LC lynch looked good. Biased on my part, maybe. He hasn't been blending. He put in effort despite whatever weirdness his role represents. And he got nightkilled by Strex.

Scotty - Some people have voiced suspicion of Scotty. He's probably not Evens. They killed him, after all. I haven't seen any alarms from his posting, even when I disagree.

Niju - is also genuinely behind. I think her having BTSC with nutella gives her a good chance of not being among the evens with role 1. She was killed by Strex N1. Actually, I'm moving her up to the top of my nulls. Evidence points to her first role not being on a scumteam. She hasn't seemed aligned with Wilgy. If he flips town, take a look here maybe.

Cbob - Cbob isn't even. He's blending, which isn't great. If my theory about Strex is right, he isn't scum. His first role doesn't look great. He's my top candidate for 3P, based on role, theories, and performance.

Dom - I don't think Dom outed LC. I've disliked quite a few aspects of Dom's play, but my theory doesn't allow him to be scum. I'm trying to discard bias given that most of the aggravations I've had with his play are emotional, either on my side or his. Give him a good chance. I'll leave that to you guys.

LoRab - I don't think scum held the button. I think Lorab, based on recent posts, is genuinely behind. Not sure if that's alignment indicative. I'm not pinged by her, but I don't have much to go on.

Boomslang - I have no impression here.

Sloonei and Spacedaisy are both people I expect a town ping from pretty quickly. I haven't gotten that. I've hardly noticed their presence.

INH - reacted quickly to suspicion earlier. To me it felt more like "I am not getting lynched for such a stupid reason" rather than genuine baffled innocence. Could go to either alignment, but didn't give me good feels.

sig - It's very difficult to place Sig right now. I usually have good feels about Sig, but I'm usually trying to mislynch him. The only good thing about sig is that he was killed by Strex. If he's evens, he bloody well knows that he's wrong about me, and is using what he perceives as a false flag near-scumfirm to get a free townie lynch. Of all the people calling for my head, I feel the worst about him, because of the way he's shoving the suspicion off on mechanics. Deniability. Ergh.

DDL - I've had bad feels about him all game. Now that I know LC saved him in favor of lynching nutella of all people, I'm simply confused. If you want more elaboration, go back and read my posts.

Kylemii - same as sloonei and Spacedaisy, but to a greater degree. I hardly knew that Kylemii was in the game until this post. What's with that? Maybe he should be just above sig, but unlike sig, he hasn't been nightkilled and I have no reason wehatsoever to townread.

DrWilgy - :o

hella linkis to respond to

[speedchuck]

I have been trying to think of a mechanic that would reveal a civilian speedchuck as a civilian.

Let's begin with this:

If nutella used her ability and targeted a civilian, and that civilian was revealed as mafia, who among us would believe it? I would be far more willing to believe someone being revealed as a civilian than I would the hosts outing someone as mafia. It's clear to me that the optimal use of Evil Even resources would have been for nutella to frame a civilian on his second life, and then for Long Con to use his power to make sure the civilian was revealed to be bad upon lynch.

That bit of deviousness would never come to fruition, for obvious reasons, and good thing it didn't.

If a civilian caused a civilian speedchuck to be revealed, what would we expect to find?

<SNIP>

Outside of Quin, who cited due process, and maybe, if you squint a little bit, Boomslang, not one person truly went to bat for speedchuck. Not one.

In addition, one must ask, "Why would a civilian out a person who was unlikely to be lynched?" A shrewd use of the role, for a civilian, would be to target someone who could be lynched in order to prevent a poor lynch or confirm a good one.

The only remaining possibility I can think of is that speedchuck's role was revealed by some mechanic other than nutella's role, and that the person responsible for that mechanic had no say in targeting speedchuck or was even aware that he or she had targeted speedchuck. Even then, the person would have to have some knowledge that he could cause someone's role to appear in the thread, because if not, then what the hell does the role card look like? "If something happens, then something else will happen." Okay then.

I'm not seeing anything to suggest that refraining from lynching speedchuck would be a good idea.

*looks at drwilgy votes*

[Scotty]

I'm not seeing anything to suggest that refraining from lynching speedchuck would be a good idea.

And yet, here you are, voting for Wilgy.

And?

Do you think the game will end if speedchuck is lynched? I don't.

I already answered this to sig. speedchuck is talking. That's a good thing regardless of his alignment. DrWilgy, in my view, also needs to be removed, but he is not providing anything further for people to analyze.

Consider also that I originally voted for colonialbob, and then moved to DrWilgy after Sloonei asked me to do so. At that time, DrWilgy had two votes to speedchuck's four or five. Did you except DrWilgy to be tied with speedchuck at this moment? I certainly didn't, but it makes no never mind to me, because even if by some stretch DrWilgy is a civilian, he's not producing, and speedchuck is.

I agree that Wilgy looks bad- this is on gut
speedchuck looks bad only for reasons completely against my gut- bonafide information.

So Wilgy gets voted out today. He's bad, which is entirely likely.

Then tomorrow, when speed's personal cheerleader removes speed from the lynch poll again, who's next in line?

Why not take the one we don't have forces working against us to take out today? No one is defending Wilgy, not even Wilgy.

I'm just frustrated ala 1973 when we learned on Pikachu that nutella had this ability and they didn't lynch speed then and still may not today.

[Scotty]

I would even fathom to say that those not voting for speed look more suspect even if speed is revealed as civ

Am I wrong in my fathoming?

[speedchuck]

I would even fathom to say that those not voting for speed look more suspect even if speed is revealed as civ

Am I wrong in my fathoming?

Yes.

Knowing my own flip already, I'd say it depends on their reason for voting one way or another. It's not that simple.

[speedchuck]

I'm just frustrated ala 1973 when we learned on Pikachu that nutella had this ability and they didn't lynch speed then and still may not today.

Nutella dies
D8 - Marmot
N8 - Sprityo (Evens)
LoRab Dies
MERGE
D9 - Wilgy

Nutella dies, and my fate is kicked in the nuts.

D8 happens. Not enough active people in cerberus to get me dead over Marmot (you should not be frustrated about the Marmot lynch)
D9 happens (speed is off the poll)
D10 happens (That's today)

There was no lynching me sooner, dude. I wasn't even on pikachu when nutella's ability was revealed.

[Scotty]

I would even fathom to say that those not voting for speed look more suspect even if speed is revealed as civ

Am I wrong in my fathoming?

Yes.

Knowing my own flip already, I'd say it depends on their reason for voting one way or another. It's not that simple.

Now I don't want you to go, and wish it didn't have to be so- I'm sorry I'm currently holding a hammer to your pinkies.

I find myself mostly agreeing with your reads.