The Syndicate

And yes I agree gman should keep his info to himself, I was just greedy and wanted to know more civs for my PoE. Plus after sig I don't trust that someone who should claim will do so but I hope that doesn't happen again

dunya wrote: ↑Thu May 07, 2020 9:58 am eh, i take role claims with a grain of salt since mafia may have fake roles they can claim. indeed nutella's role didn't even need a fake role claim, her role could be a civ one.

nutella's fake claim is very strong in the flavor sense though. Tooty is the main character's sister, and this game's damsel in distress, so it's a character that is likely to be in the game and a claim that townies are likely to believe in. It's a stronger claim than most of the town roles that have flipped so far, except Bottles I guess.

This makes me want speculate on what TH's claim of Leaky means. In one hand, Leaky is an absolute bottom of the barrel character to be included in the setup. He gets like 2 lines of dialogue. Not a character I would think of including if I made the game myself. On the other hand, it may be even less a character I'd gave to the mafia as a fake claim, since it doesn't perform that job that well. Now that we are seeing Jay gave one of the better ones to the mafia for that purpose, this makes me feel good about TH. Then again, nutella's role was the main villain, so it would make sense if she also got the best fake claim.

Okay so my avatar is from Carnival Phantasm which is a spoof anime of Fate Stay Night. Stay Night is supposed to be a battle royale between seven heroes but Gilgamesh crashes the party as an eighth competitor. In Carnival Phantasm, the seven compete in everything but battling from cards to racing. In the middle of the race, Gilgamesh comes flying in from off the track to complaints of "You aren't even supposed to be in this race." His motorcycle is called the GilGil Machine but if you search for that on google, this is the first thing that comes up.

MP's explanation of how to read Sloonei kinda hurts my heart cause I'm so bad about it. I could pretty easily believe it's TMI because I want it to be.

Idk if MP going "Talk to me about X" three or four times in one post is like actually a thing that scum MP does and town MP doesn't but it is pretty softball and I could believe it's alignment indicative. I don't really know how to read MP when he's not posting 5 million times in champs.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Thu May 07, 2020 9:57 am I think you should probably claim your result. The benefits of confirming both you and the person who vigged nutella at this stage of the game (with mafia only having 3 kills left) probably enclipse the possible benefits of trying to make a later claim. I'm thinking you probably won't have that chance yourself anyway, since this mafia seems to have cop paranoia.

Idk if it's that useful.

We are allowed claims and flips. Presumably if whoever it is claims vig or x shot vig or whatever down the road, we'll believe them. It only matters if the game goes to lylo, GMan is dead and two players claim vig.

dunya wrote: ↑Thu May 07, 2020 9:58 am i still think tony/speed look worst out of nutella's iso. i get the TH suspicion more now though and i'll keep an open mind about that when isoing them.

Can we compromise and go something like Speed -> MP -> pretend I'll get lynched right here -> TH?

Cause I don't have an opinion on Speed yet and MP looks kinda bad and I bet I can show my townie underwear before I'm actually lynched given another couple days.

Turnip Head wrote: ↑Thu May 07, 2020 10:14 am Plus after sig I don't trust that someone who should claim will do so

Sig is one of the players I'd be concerned about that with. Perhaps GMan, too, but that's not a concern this game for obvious reasons. Idk Russ but for everyone else, being absent from EOD aside, I'm not so worried about them not claiming when push comes to shove.

I’m liking the idea of a nutella, MP, Jack team.

K. Bussing MP probably.

[VOTE: MPlus7] aubergine

dunya wrote: ↑Wed May 06, 2020 9:47 pm Yes, gman lock town. Look at nutellas role "you will be told who targeted that player that night if anyone."

GMAN knows who shot nutella. There isnt 2 similar scum roles on the sane team. I give Jay way more credit than that plus it would be weird. It makes sense for town to have a similar counter balance role though.

No doubt in my mind G is town. Big difference between his claim and nanooks.

I'm a bit confused. I'm all for people claiming whenever they think is best, but if G-Man knows who shot nutella, shouldn't he tell us that, even if the information is potentially unclear?

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Thu May 07, 2020 1:05 pm

dunya wrote: ↑Wed May 06, 2020 9:47 pm Yes, gman lock town. Look at nutellas role "you will be told who targeted that player that night if anyone."

GMAN knows who shot nutella. There isnt 2 similar scum roles on the sane team. I give Jay way more credit than that plus it would be weird. It makes sense for town to have a similar counter balance role though.

No doubt in my mind G is town. Big difference between his claim and nanooks.

I'm a bit confused. I'm all for people claiming whenever they think is best, but if G-Man knows who shot nutella, shouldn't he tell us that, even if the information is potentially unclear?

What's the upside?

The downside is the wolves get the name of the vigilante...

I'm an idiot, yes, ignore me.

"littered with clues"

Turnip Head, what does this mean?

I don't have much to say in my defense other than:

Point #1 is *shrug*, I would never even look at that wording twice if someone else said it. This is your weakest point easily.
Point #2, have you met me before?
Point #3, this is definitely your strongest point, but I'd have to inform you that softball questions in and of themselves aren't inherently scummy because as town I naturally ask questions that some people may think seem unnecessary because it can help me get a handle on what people are thinking. I seem to recall having this discussion with someone in Champs at excruciating length.

And yes, my solving, especially as evidenced by my posts this day and last day, is down considerably this game. I'm aware of this. This game has thankfully been in relatively capable hands, and I'm having trouble pulling out the WIM for this one. I'm just trying to stick to a solid POE, because in that Champs practice game I kept trying to nail people specifically, and it didn't work out. And I usually I would have received some "a-ha!" dogpee moment by now but I've not really... and what little ones I have received I've internalized for the good of the game, because I wasn't ready to launch into full-on tinfoil of certain players.

I keep thinking I'm going to find the time and motivation to solve more, but it doesn't come. I'm honestly a bit frazzled for [redacted IRL reasons] and ever since I played that Champs practice game on MU where I posted over 1,000 times, I've been finding myself relatively burnt out in WIM in my mafia games since.

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Thu May 07, 2020 1:11 pm "littered with clues"

Turnip Head, what does this mean?

I also pride myself in being able to find town, because that's one of my best contributions to a game, and it's in part due to "softball" questions like the ones I asked earlier. Mac was pretty discernibly town after I had seen more inside of his brain, and I'm sorry I wasn't around and able to convince more people of that in retrospect.

I also like to think I'm halfway decent at reading Sloonei, and I wanted to make it abundantly clear why I was reading him town. If you read my entire ISO, you'll even see me move Sloonei around in my rainbow reads trying to figure him out. That's not TMI.

I actually think G-Man may be saying what he's saying and still be scum, by the way. Not sold on either way, but I'm a bit nervous with people clearing him and a lot of people suddenly being OK with lynching me instead.

Regardless of your intention, if a goal was to get me more invested in this game, I suppose it worked a little. I'm really at a loss as to where to lynch except Jack though. I feel like a decent case can be made for everyone left to be town.

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Thu May 07, 2020 1:33 pm I actually think G-Man may be saying what he's saying and still be scum, by the way. Not sold on either way, but I'm a bit nervous with people clearing him and a lot of people suddenly being OK with lynching me instead.

I was going to mention this if no one else did. I think I've cleared G-Man too easily for this.

I can't help but think one of the mostly towncleared players is scum, but I can't figure out who and why, and otherwise I just shrug and feel like dunya and Russ, and to a lesser extent but still there, Turnip, are all just town, and I'd be okay lynching outside of that. I just feel like I'm wrong though.

Also in fact I'm especially worried I've been wrong about Sloonei this whole time, and nutella and Sloonei are crafty enough to read thread environment and realize that nutella was inevitably going to die, so they wanted to set Sloonei up to carry.

There, things I've been thinking but you all haven't been fully getting. I admittedly have not been close to fully transparent lately.

dunya
Russ

Turnip

Sloonei

DDL
G-Man
Jack
speed

??????

I don't think it's likely that sloonei and Nutella are teammates. Their back and forth about G-Man looked organic

You are making me feel better about you though, incidentally

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Thu May 07, 2020 1:06 pm

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Thu May 07, 2020 1:05 pm

dunya wrote: ↑Wed May 06, 2020 9:47 pm Yes, gman lock town. Look at nutellas role "you will be told who targeted that player that night if anyone."

GMAN knows who shot nutella. There isnt 2 similar scum roles on the sane team. I give Jay way more credit than that plus it would be weird. It makes sense for town to have a similar counter balance role though.

No doubt in my mind G is town. Big difference between his claim and nanooks.

I'm a bit confused. I'm all for people claiming whenever they think is best, but if G-Man knows who shot nutella, shouldn't he tell us that, even if the information is potentially unclear?

What's the upside?

The downside is the wolves get the name of the vigilante...

I was thinking that clearing someone from the POE would be worth it, and that scum can work together in chat to try to vigilante hunt anyway, and that the player likely only had 1-shot, etc. etc., by the way, but then I realized it still sounded reckless and stupid.

Turnip Head wrote: ↑Thu May 07, 2020 1:42 pm I don't think it's likely that sloonei and Nutella are teammates. Their back and forth about G-Man looked organic

You are making me feel better about you though, incidentally

I honestly don't either, that post I made last night still stands, and I'm tinfoiling Sloonei pretty hard just right now. I'm just like, the scum have to be somewhere?

Not sure how obvious it was nutella was going to die. I think the movement mostly started late at night? A lot of people said they were okay with it pretty fast. But there were other wagons floating around. Sloonei himself was mainly going against Gman, some people were attacking nanook, etc.

I can easily make the case for all four of those POE being town too, like Jack has read genuine to me since his entrance, DDL has been pretty solvy and doesn't look very teammate-indicative but it could go either way, G-Man has been beating to his own drum plus the potential info dump even if that could also go either way, and I guess speed is the one I have the least reason to feel is town but that could just be a direct result of his lack of activity here, and he's actually felt genuine to me at times in posting as well.

So I'm pretty worried I'm wrong and we'll set up a thread-consensus POE that will lose us the game, but I also have no idea what to do about it, and I haven't had much time to properly do anything like ISOs.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Thu May 07, 2020 1:45 pm Not sure how obvious it was nutella was going to die. I think the movement mostly started late at night? A lot of people said they were okay with it pretty fast. But there were other wagons floating around. Sloonei himself was mainly going against Gman, some people were attacking nanook, etc.

Hmm, sure, you're probably right. I just felt like nutella was never leaving the immediate POE, regardless of when exactly she might have been lynched. So she may have been considering that, especially in more recent interactions. And if you look at her earlier interactions with me, I think it's more suggestive of shade (accusing me of no dogpee on D1, really?), but I have inside information as far as that's concerned, so I can't speak to the others.

I feel like Paratroopa in Season 5 finale right now. SOMETHING IS WRONG BUT I DON'T KNOW WHAT TO DO.

I've had some insane spicy tinfoil too that Russ and dunya were bussing each other earlier on but then conveniently dropped it over time. I don't believe it for more than a second though.

Thank you so much to whoever gave me the Jiggies by the way. I can't post like this (my natural state) without you.

I need to really do more work anyway, I'll be back.

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Thu May 07, 2020 1:38 pm Also in fact I'm especially worried I've been wrong about Sloonei this whole time, and nutella and Sloonei are crafty enough to read thread environment and realize that nutella was inevitably going to die, so they wanted to set Sloonei up to carry.

There, things I've been thinking but you all haven't been fully getting. I admittedly have not been close to fully transparent lately.

Let's talk some more about the world where I am bad please.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu May 07, 2020 1:53 pm

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Thu May 07, 2020 1:38 pm Also in fact I'm especially worried I've been wrong about Sloonei this whole time, and nutella and Sloonei are crafty enough to read thread environment and realize that nutella was inevitably going to die, so they wanted to set Sloonei up to carry.

There, things I've been thinking but you all haven't been fully getting. I admittedly have not been close to fully transparent lately.

Let's talk some more about the world where I am bad please.

I don't think I truly believe it... you'd have to have tapdanced around early suspicion and having trouble adapting your playstyle, especially if you rolled scum, but found your groove otherwise; interacted with nutella in manners in the thread that had very specific clearing intentions (your breaking the cardinal sin by associating her with someone, etc.). Possible, I suppose. I also felt like there was always pretty decent resistance to you getting lynched, although I realize a good portion of that early on was me, lol.

That said, my initial inclination was to clear you completely, and although after looking back at the stuff and/or thinking about it more thoroughly I can more easily envision nutella/Sloonei, I don't believe it strongly... but maybe I should.

Anyway, work, things, I only have so many posts. Stuff.

I also feel like certain things you've said, Sloonei, are more or less... okay with the game flow. Except for the G-Man case, I suppose, but he'd be an easy ML to push if you're scum here and he's town, yeah? I'm not sure how much credit you really should get for that. And then otherwise, like, you were interested in the MP theory, idk. I lately haven't gotten as much of a feeling that you care.

I'll stop being a liar now.

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Thu May 07, 2020 1:35 pm Regardless of your intention, if a goal was to get me more invested in this game, I suppose it worked a little. I'm really at a loss as to where to lynch except Jack though. I feel like a decent case can be made for everyone left to be town.

So vote me and we can distance to the max.

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Thu May 07, 2020 2:10 pm That said, my initial inclination was to clear you completely, and although after looking back at the stuff and/or thinking about it more thoroughly I can more easily envision nutella/Sloonei, I don't believe it strongly... but maybe I should.

Anyway, work, things, I only have so many posts. Stuff.

So have you not read Night 2 then?

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu May 07, 2020 2:13 pm

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Thu May 07, 2020 2:10 pm That said, my initial inclination was to clear you completely, and although after looking back at the stuff and/or thinking about it more thoroughly I can more easily envision nutella/Sloonei, I don't believe it strongly... but maybe I should.

Anyway, work, things, I only have so many posts. Stuff.

So have you not read Night 2 then?

Why do you care about pushing this? I'm in an infinitely more precarious position than you.

Does scum DDL invite me to read his partner Nutella right after I replace in?

Consider, I read Nutella correctly like 8 games running...and then misread her last game.

What does it matter what I have or haven't read? Does that reflect my alignment?

You know what, fuck it, this feels right.

[VOTE: Sloonei] aubergine

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu May 07, 2020 2:13 pm

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Thu May 07, 2020 2:10 pm That said, my initial inclination was to clear you completely, and although after looking back at the stuff and/or thinking about it more thoroughly I can more easily envision nutella/Sloonei, I don't believe it strongly... but maybe I should.

Anyway, work, things, I only have so many posts. Stuff.

So have you not read Night 2 then?

Town Sloonei doesn't say this. I'm locking on this.

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Thu May 07, 2020 2:16 pm You know what, fuck it, this feels right.

[VOTE: Sloonei] aubergine

lol.

Nope. I am asking these questions because of how they reflect on you. This isn't self-defense. This is town sloonei doing town sloonei things. I know I'm never being lynched today. I am considering you.

So talk to me about Night 2 please.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu May 07, 2020 2:18 pm lol.

Nope. I am asking these questions because of how they reflect on you. This isn't self-defense. This is town sloonei doing town sloonei things. I know I'm never being lynched today. I am considering you.

So talk to me about Night 2 please.

I don't feel sincerity from you.

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Thu May 07, 2020 2:19 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu May 07, 2020 2:18 pm lol.

Nope. I am asking these questions because of how they reflect on you. This isn't self-defense. This is town sloonei doing town sloonei things. I know I'm never being lynched today. I am considering you.

So talk to me about Night 2 please.

I don't feel sincerity from you.

Wild. Nutella said the same thing on Night 2.

[VOTE: MP] aubergine

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu May 07, 2020 2:19 pm

M Plus 7 wrote: ↑Thu May 07, 2020 2:19 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu May 07, 2020 2:18 pm lol.

Nope. I am asking these questions because of how they reflect on you. This isn't self-defense. This is town sloonei doing town sloonei things. I know I'm never being lynched today. I am considering you.

So talk to me about Night 2 please.

I don't feel sincerity from you.

Wild. Nutella said the same thing on Night 2.

[VOTE: MP] aubergine

So you're lynching me because I don't remember that and based on something someone else said? What exactly from Night 2 do you want to talk to me about?

I'm punching above my weight right now, but it feels good.