The Syndicate

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:06 am Personally I would like to ultimately see quin lynched. I feel he is the most compelling lynch and given the volume he has posted if the only good reason anyone has to refute the bad stuff is that he would probably not post as much as a mafia player with bad internet well I disagree and that's an awful reason.

Jimmy. If you were a mafia player who had bad internet and were one of the few players looking lynchable would you post with less frequency than if you were town with bad internet? I feel entirely the opposite and having really thought about it I really question the nature of the analysis from you. Bad look.

I would probably find a public place with wi-fi and post from the restroom stalls. I don't give a shit what I would do. Quin is not me. That also wasn't the only reason I changed my mind about Quin. Go read my posts and then tell me how bad they look.

I just had a quick read of kyle's iso and I am dropping him to a suspect. I would support his lynch. He had utilised a lot of tactics I employ when mafia. Focus on mechanisms. Lots of fluffiness. Lots of civ reads and de-escalation and very little active accusations have come from him.

Who is bad Kyle?

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:09 am

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:06 am Personally I would like to ultimately see quin lynched. I feel he is the most compelling lynch and given the volume he has posted if the only good reason anyone has to refute the bad stuff is that he would probably not post as much as a mafia player with bad internet well I disagree and that's an awful reason.

Jimmy. If you were a mafia player who had bad internet and were one of the few players looking lynchable would you post with less frequency than if you were town with bad internet? I feel entirely the opposite and having really thought about it I really question the nature of the analysis from you. Bad look.

I would probably find a public place with wi-fi and post from the restroom stalls. I don't give a shit what I would do. Quin is not me. That also wasn't the only reason I changed my mind about Quin. Go read my posts and then tell me how bad they look.

Your posts look busy and look like you. You know that. You also know that it's the detail in which you can unravel so asking me to go read your posts like that is facetious. You sound like you would rather me just assume you are civ? What does that sound like? Dare we not question you?

What you would do is very relevant when in the context of your analysis of players. Answer my question without the defensiveness.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:06 am Personally I would like to ultimately see quin lynched. I feel he is the most compelling lynch and given the volume he has posted if the only good reason anyone has to refute the bad stuff is that he would probably not post as much as a mafia player with bad internet well I disagree and that's an awful reason.

Jimmy. If you were a mafia player who had bad internet and were one of the few players looking lynchable would you post with less frequency than if you were town with bad internet? I feel entirely the opposite and having really thought about it I really question the nature of the analysis from you. Bad look.

Has anyone actually made this point? 3J considered the effort in finding alternative ways to access the game thread, not my level of participation as a result of my lack of internet.

Quin wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:18 am

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:06 am Personally I would like to ultimately see quin lynched. I feel he is the most compelling lynch and given the volume he has posted if the only good reason anyone has to refute the bad stuff is that he would probably not post as much as a mafia player with bad internet well I disagree and that's an awful reason.

Jimmy. If you were a mafia player who had bad internet and were one of the few players looking lynchable would you post with less frequency than if you were town with bad internet? I feel entirely the opposite and having really thought about it I really question the nature of the analysis from you. Bad look.

Has anyone actually made this point? 3J considered the effort in finding alternative ways to access the game thread, not my level of participation as a result of my lack of internet.

How is that not the same thing? Would you not seek out said alternatives in order to maintain participation?

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:20 am

Quin wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:18 am

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:06 am Personally I would like to ultimately see quin lynched. I feel he is the most compelling lynch and given the volume he has posted if the only good reason anyone has to refute the bad stuff is that he would probably not post as much as a mafia player with bad internet well I disagree and that's an awful reason.

Jimmy. If you were a mafia player who had bad internet and were one of the few players looking lynchable would you post with less frequency than if you were town with bad internet? I feel entirely the opposite and having really thought about it I really question the nature of the analysis from you. Bad look.

Has anyone actually made this point? 3J considered the effort in finding alternative ways to access the game thread, not my level of participation as a result of my lack of internet.

How is that not the same thing? Would you not seek out said alternatives in order to maintain participation?

3J did not say "wow quin looks good because even though his internet sucks he's posting a lot". 3J said "wow quin looks good because he went through the effort of getting internet access so he could participate whereas a mafia might not be as motivated to do that. also he's just such a cool person i could never seriously scumread him"

That is how they are different.

Tell me why each of the other points in my defence are not good arguments, Mac.

Quin wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:23 am

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:20 am

Quin wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:18 am

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:06 am Personally I would like to ultimately see quin lynched. I feel he is the most compelling lynch and given the volume he has posted if the only good reason anyone has to refute the bad stuff is that he would probably not post as much as a mafia player with bad internet well I disagree and that's an awful reason.

Jimmy. If you were a mafia player who had bad internet and were one of the few players looking lynchable would you post with less frequency than if you were town with bad internet? I feel entirely the opposite and having really thought about it I really question the nature of the analysis from you. Bad look.

Has anyone actually made this point? 3J considered the effort in finding alternative ways to access the game thread, not my level of participation as a result of my lack of internet.

How is that not the same thing? Would you not seek out said alternatives in order to maintain participation?

3J did not say "wow quin looks good because even though his internet sucks he's posting a lot". 3J said "wow quin looks good because he went through the effort of getting internet access so he could participate whereas a mafia might not be as motivated to do that. also he's just such a cool person i could never seriously scumread him"

That is how they are different.

Okay so you are arguing what?

Jimmy said it how you said it. I believe implying what I stated. I disagree either way. I believe the average player would be more inclined to do that as a mafia player under pressure than a civ.

Quin wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:25 am Tell me why each of the other points in my defence are not good arguments, Mac.

What are they?

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:17 am Your posts look busy and look like you. You know that. You also know that it's the detail in which you can unravel so asking me to go read your posts like that is facetious.

I have no idea what any of these three sentences mean. Please restate them another way.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:17 amYou sound like you would rather me just assume you are civ? What does that sound like? Dare we not question you?

What? I didn't say that or anything similar to that. I didn't imply that or anything similar to that. You said my crappy-Internet-based reason for changing my mind on Quin looked bad. There were other reasons too, and I want you to talk to me about those as well if you're going to judge my turn on Quin. I also asked you a question about Quin earlier which I don't believe you addressed directly.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:17 amWhat you would do is very relevant when in the context of your analysis of players. Answer my question without the defensiveness.

Its relevance is very limited. Nearly nobody on the Internet plays Mafia the way I play Mafia. I might care about that if I am assessing a Sloonei or a MovingPictures07. To judge Quin based upon my own behavior and tendencies does not make sense, because Quin plays this game quite differently to me.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:26 am

Quin wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:23 am

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:20 am

Quin wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:18 am

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:06 am Personally I would like to ultimately see quin lynched. I feel he is the most compelling lynch and given the volume he has posted if the only good reason anyone has to refute the bad stuff is that he would probably not post as much as a mafia player with bad internet well I disagree and that's an awful reason.

Jimmy. If you were a mafia player who had bad internet and were one of the few players looking lynchable would you post with less frequency than if you were town with bad internet? I feel entirely the opposite and having really thought about it I really question the nature of the analysis from you. Bad look.

Has anyone actually made this point? 3J considered the effort in finding alternative ways to access the game thread, not my level of participation as a result of my lack of internet.

How is that not the same thing? Would you not seek out said alternatives in order to maintain participation?

3J did not say "wow quin looks good because even though his internet sucks he's posting a lot". 3J said "wow quin looks good because he went through the effort of getting internet access so he could participate whereas a mafia might not be as motivated to do that. also he's just such a cool person i could never seriously scumread him"

That is how they are different.

Okay so you are arguing what?

Jimmy said it how you said it. I believe implying what I stated. I disagree either way. I believe the average player would be more inclined to do that as a mafia player under pressure than a civ.

I dunno. You didn't understand part of the reason he flipped his read on me so I elaborated.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 5:58 am

Kylemii wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 5:33 am mafia-fatigue is also not an exclusive emotion for any particular faction, but I do believe LC that it is at least in part to blame for his apparent lack of zest for this game.

A very easy and non controversial comment here. Reads like a mafia player making a future credit civ read on a player they know isn't bad.

hey, excuse me sir?

not a single part of what I said in that post or the one before it was about anything close to reading LC as civ. I believe LC when he says he is experiencing mafia fatigue, I don't think that it's alignment indicative, and I want to see more content from him.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sat Jan 13, 2018 3:06 am Quin seems fine. He was obstinate in the face of my bossy ass, something I think is typical of his civilian play, and I like that he has continued to find ways into this thread despite Internet troubles at home which would leave him a reasonable excuse to slank off.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sat Jan 13, 2018 7:38 pm

Quin wrote: ↑Sat Jan 13, 2018 7:31 pm 3J, why are you town reading me now? I'm wary of how you went about dropping the suspicion on me.

I decided I believed your comments about being lazy and worn out of playing at a crazy level, and in that context your posts don't really look that bad. I actually found myself feeling a bit of the same thing when I started getting shit and that was telling. All else aside and despite that weariness of the game, you've been heavily involved and weren't deterred by heavy pressure right out of the gate. That's a difficult task for any mafioso. Plus there was the thing you mentioned about your Internet screwing up, and I liked that you were still trying to find ways to keep your presence felt here.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:26 am

Quin wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:25 am Tell me why each of the other points in my defence are not good arguments, Mac.

What are they?

You tell me. You're the one campaigning the lynch me.

A direct parallel I can draw for Quin is to the RED vs. BLUE game, when Golden and I screamed at him for a while, eventually leading to his mislynch. One of the reasons I was screaming was Quin's handling of his other accuser, Golden. I thought it looked terrible and I lynched him and he was a civilian. Looking back now at Day 0 of this game, I was screaming at him at least in part for his handling of an accuser (me) and his general obstinate reception of that felt familiar.

So Jimmy you are saying that there is no value in considering what you would do in a situation when assessing what another player would do, at all, unless they were a similar player to you?

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:34 am A direct parallel I can draw for Quin is to the RED vs. BLUE game, when Golden and I screamed at him for a while, eventually leading to his mislynch. One of the reasons I was screaming was Quin's handling of his other accuser, Golden. I thought it looked terrible and I lynched him and he was a civilian. Looking back now at Day 0 of this game, I was screaming at him at least in part for his handling of an accuser (me) and his general obstinate reception of that felt familiar.

the other was that scotty scumslipped and "outted me" as his teammate

Quin wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:31 am

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:26 am

Quin wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:25 am Tell me why each of the other points in my defence are not good arguments, Mac.

What are they?

You tell me. You're the one campaigning the lynch me.

I'm not going digging in the thread for every post someone has made to defend you just to refute them all line by line because you asked me to with a low effort post. Sorry bub I have better things to do with my time. If you want me to do something with that much effort assist me. Or you can just not get your way.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:34 am A direct parallel I can draw for Quin is to the RED vs. BLUE game, when Golden and I screamed at him for a while, eventually leading to his mislynch. One of the reasons I was screaming was Quin's handling of his other accuser, Golden. I thought it looked terrible and I lynched him and he was a civilian. Looking back now at Day 0 of this game, I was screaming at him at least in part for his handling of an accuser (me) and his general obstinate reception of that felt familiar.

A good argument against your own logic. Says nothing about his alignment. I would say his response to our assault in the early game is just how he would respond either way.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:34 am So Jimmy you are saying that there is no value in considering what you would do in a situation when assessing what another player would do, at all, unless they were a similar player to you?

I would say that the value is limited. It might serve as a baseline in the absence of any known personality or play style (like if I am playing on a new site or judging a newcomer from another site). I don't hold other players to my own standards if I already know they don't play the way I do, because other players generally aren't hopelessly competitive and obsessive like I can be. That's to their credit.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:37 am

Quin wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:31 am

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:26 am

Quin wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:25 am Tell me why each of the other points in my defence are not good arguments, Mac.

What are they?

You tell me. You're the one campaigning the lynch me.

I'm not going digging in the thread for every post someone has made to defend you just to refute them all line by line because you asked me to with a low effort post. Sorry bub I have better things to do with my time. If you want me to do something with that much effort assist me. Or you can just not get your way.

A MacDougall who couldn't give a shit about anyone's opinions besides his own is a civilian MacDougall. I mean, I have 0 game references to back that opinion up with. It's just my interpretation of your character.


Happy lynching, Big Mac.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:37 amIf you want me to do something with that much effort assist me.

I just did that.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:14 am I just had a quick read of kyle's iso and I am dropping him to a suspect. I would support his lynch. He had utilised a lot of tactics I employ when mafia. Focus on mechanisms. Lots of fluffiness. Lots of civ reads and de-escalation and very little active accusations have come from him.

Who is bad Kyle?

hey please tell me who my 'lots of civ reads' are because I can only think of 2 people that I read as civ right now, 3 if you count Glorfindel.

I don't go out of my way to make a lot of unique accusations unless I notice something other people aren't focusing on, like I did with Sloonei.

I don't think I've really de-escalated anything... I gave a possible reason for why LC might be acting the way he is because I wanted to make sure the full story was being considered.

Where are you even getting most of this? What are my fluff posts?

MacDougall please tell me what your current reads are on Jack, Made, LC, and Sloonei

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:41 am

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:34 am So Jimmy you are saying that there is no value in considering what you would do in a situation when assessing what another player would do, at all, unless they were a similar player to you?

I would say that the value is limited. It might serve as a baseline in the absence of any known personality or play style (like if I am playing on a new site or judging a newcomer from another site). I don't hold other players to my own standards if I already know they don't play the way I do, because other players generally aren't hopelessly competitive and obsessive like I can be. That's to their credit.

Generally yes but in this context in particular? You genuinely feel that the average player is more likely to seek out alternative ways to play the game as a civvie than mafia?

@Quin and @Kylemii: I’m still struggling to find where both of you sit in my ‘world of Elven reads’ this game (this is by no means an accusation so there is no need to be defensive). I’m wondering though if you guys would care to (briefly) help me by explaining why I (and everyone else for that matter) should be reading you as Towny?

Kylemii wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:46 am MacDougall please tell me what your current reads are on Jack, Made, LC, and Sloonei

What is this trend where players feel like they can just haphazardly make demands of other players like this? I do not like it. It is a very easy way to move the dialogue away from the topic at hand and you have given me no reason for why you chose those four names. Furthermore I have a very recent read on jack and LC so it really feels like you are just trying to change the conversation.

Glorfindel wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:47 am @Quin and @Kylemii: I’m still struggling to find where both of you sit in my ‘world of Elven reads’ this game (this is by no means an accusation so there is no need to be defensive). I’m wondering though if you guys would care to (briefly) help me by explaining why I (and everyone else for that matter) should be reading you as Towny?

Because MacDougall suspects me and he's always wrong on Day 1. Also my role card says so.

Kylemii wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:45 am

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:14 am I just had a quick read of kyle's iso and I am dropping him to a suspect. I would support his lynch. He had utilised a lot of tactics I employ when mafia. Focus on mechanisms. Lots of fluffiness. Lots of civ reads and de-escalation and very little active accusations have come from him.

Who is bad Kyle?

hey please tell me who my 'lots of civ reads' are because I can only think of 2 people that I read as civ right now, 3 if you count Glorfindel.

I don't go out of my way to make a lot of unique accusations unless I notice something other people aren't focusing on, like I did with Sloonei.

I don't think I've really de-escalated anything... I gave a possible reason for why LC might be acting the way he is because I wanted to make sure the full story was being considered.

Where are you even getting most of this? What are my fluff posts?

All of your posts can be described as how I put them. Perhaps you are as you say someone who doesn't make mafia reads lightly but I am reading it how I am.

Please excuse me. Lots of should be replaced with some. The point is being ignored in your reply though. As to be expected from a mafia player.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:46 am Generally yes but in this context in particular? You genuinely feel that the average player is more likely to seek out alternative ways to play the game as a civvie than mafia?

In a vacuum, absolutely yes. Mafia members slank off more in general, and when the universe hands them an excuse to do it free of judgment, many of them are going to be very pleased -- even those who've been under some pressure. Also consider the character of Quin's involvement in this period of connectivity issues: is he merely fending off accusations and assure survival, or is he attempting to solve the game?

Quin wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:49 am

Glorfindel wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:47 am @Quin and @Kylemii: I’m still struggling to find where both of you sit in my ‘world of Elven reads’ this game (this is by no means an accusation so there is no need to be defensive). I’m wondering though if you guys would care to (briefly) help me by explaining why I (and everyone else for that matter) should be reading you as Towny?

Because MacDougall suspects me and he's always wrong on Day 1. Also my role card says so.

Haha how provocative of you.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:51 am

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:46 am Generally yes but in this context in particular? You genuinely feel that the average player is more likely to seek out alternative ways to play the game as a civvie than mafia?

In a vacuum, absolutely yes. Mafia members slank off more in general, and when the universe hands them an excuse to do it free of judgment, many of them are going to be very pleased -- even those who've been under some pressure. Also consider the character of Quin's involvement in this period of connectivity issues: is he merely fending off accusations and assure survival, or is he attempting to solve the game?

And do you know Quin to be an inactive mafia member? I consider him one of the finer and more confident mafia members I have ever had the pleasure of teaming with.

And I don't see that much solving. Am I missing where he has made some great and insightful civvie posts?

All of my posts are great, insightful and civvy. That's why I'm such a good mafia member.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:48 am

Kylemii wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:46 am MacDougall please tell me what your current reads are on Jack, Made, LC, and Sloonei

What is this trend where players feel like they can just haphazardly make demands of other players like this? I do not like it. It is a very easy way to move the dialogue away from the topic at hand and you have given me no reason for why you chose those four names. Furthermore I have a very recent read on jack and LC so it really feels like you are just trying to change the conversation.

I would seriously like for people to discourage this type of posting for the reason outlined. Encouraging it is giving mafia teams a weapon.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:48 am

Kylemii wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:46 am MacDougall please tell me what your current reads are on Jack, Made, LC, and Sloonei

What is this trend where players feel like they can just haphazardly make demands of other players like this? I do not like it. It is a very easy way to move the dialogue away from the topic at hand and you have given me no reason for why you chose those four names. Furthermore I have a very recent read on jack and LC so it really feels like you are just trying to change the conversation.

we don't have to change the subject but I still want an answer from you

knowing your current reads on those four players helps me assess your motivation

Quin wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:54 am All of my posts are great, insightful and civvy. That's why I'm such a good mafia member.

You're very chipper with KOFM in here defending you aren't you.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:56 am

Quin wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:54 am All of my posts are great, insightful and civvy. That's why I'm such a good mafia member.

You're very chipper with KOFM in here defending you aren't you.

I'm literally just throwing out gang signs while he takes the stage.




I thought he was defending his own read on me. I don't have any business talking about that.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:50 am

Kylemii wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:45 am

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:14 am I just had a quick read of kyle's iso and I am dropping him to a suspect. I would support his lynch. He had utilised a lot of tactics I employ when mafia. Focus on mechanisms. Lots of fluffiness. Lots of civ reads and de-escalation and very little active accusations have come from him.

Who is bad Kyle?

hey please tell me who my 'lots of civ reads' are because I can only think of 2 people that I read as civ right now, 3 if you count Glorfindel.

I don't go out of my way to make a lot of unique accusations unless I notice something other people aren't focusing on, like I did with Sloonei.

I don't think I've really de-escalated anything... I gave a possible reason for why LC might be acting the way he is because I wanted to make sure the full story was being considered.

Where are you even getting most of this? What are my fluff posts?

All of your posts can be described as how I put them. Perhaps you are as you say someone who doesn't make mafia reads lightly but I am reading it how I am.

Please excuse me. Lots of should be replaced with some. The point is being ignored in your reply though. As to be expected from a mafia player.

look dude... I really don't trust that your read on me is coming from a sincere place. you're putting the cart before the horse and assuming I'm mafia before even asking me anything or really investigating at all.

is this how you usually operate?

Quin, Jay have you played with Mac before?

Kylemii wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:55 am

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:48 am

Kylemii wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:46 am MacDougall please tell me what your current reads are on Jack, Made, LC, and Sloonei

What is this trend where players feel like they can just haphazardly make demands of other players like this? I do not like it. It is a very easy way to move the dialogue away from the topic at hand and you have given me no reason for why you chose those four names. Furthermore I have a very recent read on jack and LC so it really feels like you are just trying to change the conversation.

we don't have to change the subject but I still want an answer from you

knowing your current reads on those four players helps me assess your motivation

I question you are genuinely trying to solve anything given you have asked me to provide reads on two players that if anyone was genuinely paying attention would know my position on. Given that I question your motives for asking I will refrain. I hope you understand.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:54 am And do you know Quin to be an inactive mafia member? I consider him one of the finer and more confident mafia members I have ever had the pleasure of teaming with.

And I don't see that much solving. Am I missing where he has made some great and insightful civvie posts?

I don't know him to be an inactive mafia member. I would expect less concerted effort than I saw from him though with Internet problems hampering him if he didn't have a vested interest in figuring out the game. I think his posts bear that appearance too, even without necessarily being great and insightful. Granted, if this Internet issue was the only thing I liked about Quin I probably wouldn't have found the same inspiration to change my mind about him. It was one point among a few.

If you want to hang out in the tunnel for a while, be my guest. I've moved on for the time being.

Kylemii wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:59 am

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:50 am

Kylemii wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:45 am

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:14 am I just had a quick read of kyle's iso and I am dropping him to a suspect. I would support his lynch. He had utilised a lot of tactics I employ when mafia. Focus on mechanisms. Lots of fluffiness. Lots of civ reads and de-escalation and very little active accusations have come from him.

Who is bad Kyle?

hey please tell me who my 'lots of civ reads' are because I can only think of 2 people that I read as civ right now, 3 if you count Glorfindel.

I don't go out of my way to make a lot of unique accusations unless I notice something other people aren't focusing on, like I did with Sloonei.

I don't think I've really de-escalated anything... I gave a possible reason for why LC might be acting the way he is because I wanted to make sure the full story was being considered.

Where are you even getting most of this? What are my fluff posts?

All of your posts can be described as how I put them. Perhaps you are as you say someone who doesn't make mafia reads lightly but I am reading it how I am.

Please excuse me. Lots of should be replaced with some. The point is being ignored in your reply though. As to be expected from a mafia player.

look dude... I really don't trust that your read on me is coming from a sincere place. you're putting the cart before the horse and assuming I'm mafia before even asking me anything or really investigating at all.

is this how you usually operate?

No I read your entire iso before I arrived at the conclusion that you are suspicious. I see you finally have a potential scum read though so that's good. A shame that it's the world's most blatant no u.

Kylemii wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 7:00 am Quin, Jay have you played with Mac before?

I have probably played 50-60 games with MacDougall. We both got our start in Mafia on RYM, along with Sloonei and dunya.

Kylemii wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 7:00 am Quin, Jay have you played with Mac before?

Three times, maybe. My impression from those games is that he doesn't care about his process as long as he catches scum. I've never seen a scum game he's lived more than one day in, though I'd guess it's the same thing.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 7:02 am

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:54 am And do you know Quin to be an inactive mafia member? I consider him one of the finer and more confident mafia members I have ever had the pleasure of teaming with.

And I don't see that much solving. Am I missing where he has made some great and insightful civvie posts?

I don't know him to be an inactive mafia member. I would expect less concerted effort than I saw from him though with Internet problems hampering him if he didn't have a vested interest in figuring out the game. I think his posts bear that appearance too, even without necessarily being great and insightful. Granted, if this Internet issue was the only thing I liked about Quin I probably wouldn't have found the same inspiration to change my mind about him. It was one point among a few.

If you want to hang out in the tunnel for a while, be my guest. I've moved on for the time being.

I'm not tunneling Jimmy. That's unfair and for someone who influences most of the play to say that is not appropriate. I have made reads on a lot of players and I have given quin lots of time to change my mind too.

Quin wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 7:05 am

Kylemii wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 7:00 am Quin, Jay have you played with Mac before?

Three times, maybe. My impression from those games is that he doesn't care about his process as long as he catches scum. I've never seen a scum game he's lived more than one day in, though I'd guess it's the same thing.

Really? I swear we have played a lot more than that.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 7:05 am I'm not tunneling Jimmy. That's unfair and for someone who influences most of the play to say that is not appropriate. I have made reads on a lot of players and I have given quin lots of time to change my mind too.

That wasn't an accusation or a dig. I don't view tunneling as an inherently bad thing. If you don't think you're doing it, sure okay.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 7:01 am

Kylemii wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:55 am

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:48 am

Kylemii wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:46 am MacDougall please tell me what your current reads are on Jack, Made, LC, and Sloonei

What is this trend where players feel like they can just haphazardly make demands of other players like this? I do not like it. It is a very easy way to move the dialogue away from the topic at hand and you have given me no reason for why you chose those four names. Furthermore I have a very recent read on jack and LC so it really feels like you are just trying to change the conversation.

we don't have to change the subject but I still want an answer from you

knowing your current reads on those four players helps me assess your motivation

I question you are genuinely trying to solve anything given you have asked me to provide reads on two players that if anyone was genuinely paying attention would know my position on. Given that I question your motives for asking I will refrain. I hope you understand.

saying you suspect someone doesn't magically relieve you of the responsibility of putting forward effort as a civ.

I don't get the impression that you're actually trying to figure out my alignment. it seems like you've made a decision about me that you're now trying to brute-force into reality.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 7:02 am

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:54 am And do you know Quin to be an inactive mafia member? I consider him one of the finer and more confident mafia members I have ever had the pleasure of teaming with.

And I don't see that much solving. Am I missing where he has made some great and insightful civvie posts?

I don't know him to be an inactive mafia member. I would expect less concerted effort than I saw from him though with Internet problems hampering him if he didn't have a vested interest in figuring out the game.

And if his vested interest was on winning the game via not beinf lynched day 1 as mafia?

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 7:08 am

Quin wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 7:05 am

Kylemii wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 7:00 am Quin, Jay have you played with Mac before?

Three times, maybe. My impression from those games is that he doesn't care about his process as long as he catches scum. I've never seen a scum game he's lived more than one day in, though I'd guess it's the same thing.

Really? I swear we have played a lot more than that.

I only remember Mad Max, Goc 2016 and Rot3K.