The Syndicate

We finally had The Sandwich Argument on Discord. It was a matter of time. Among a few of us, we've derived some perceptions of what constitutes a sandwich, through a series of questions. Clearly we are not in agreement.

If it does not feature bread of any kind, can it be a sandwich?
JJJ - no
nijuukyugou - no
Quin - yes
A Person - yes

Does it have to feature leavened bread to be a sandwich?
JJJ - no
Quin - yes
juliets - yes
A Person - no

Does the cover have to be separated into two or more detatched pieces?
JJJ - no
Quin - yes
juliets - yes
A Person - no

Must a sandwich be eaten with a specific direction of intake?
JJJ - no
Quin - no
juliets - no
A Person - no

Must a sandwich feature any specific food contents, or equally do any specific food contents prevent a meal from being a sandwich?
JJJ - no
Quin - no
juliets - no
A Person - no

If an item would be a sandwich when covered (with bread, pieces of bread, or whatever else), is it still a sandwich when open-faced?
JJJ - no
Quin - no
juliets - no

While a sandwich may or may not be eaten in any particular way, can sandwiches be distinguished from other styles by the way it is typically eaten or presented?
JJJ - yes
Quin - yes
juliets - yes

If it would be a sandwich when covered by two pieces of the covering food material, is it still a sandwich if only one piece is used and folded over the contents?
JJJ - yes
Quin - no
juliets - no

I want to know what y'all think. If you have any other crucial questions, by all means ask them. I want to know what *you* think, not Merriam Webster.

I think it is important that some definitions be presented otherwise people won't understand why we're talking about leavened bread, even though JJJ doesn't want to talk about definitions.

First a sandwich, from the oed: An item of food consisting of two pieces of bread with a filling between them, eaten as a light meal. 'a ham sandwich'

Then bread, also from the oed: Food made of flour, water, and yeast mixed together and baked. Merriam Webster says "leavening agent" instead of yeast.

So all my answers come from those definitions, specifically two pieces of bread and bread being made with a leavening agent.

Re-posting this after nutella put it on the discord channel. Where do you stand?

I begrudgingly accept a hot dog as a sandwich, because to reject it is to also reject a sub (barring arguments of direction of intake or ingredients which I find insufficient). If anyone can convince me of a way to drop hot dogs while keeping subs, I'd be grateful.

I would otherwise be a structural purist, ingredient neutral but the chart defines bread as "bread/baked product" and I accept only bread per the definition of sandwich, thus I am other.

I reject a waffle sandwich as a real sandwich, it's a pseudo-sandwich if anything. I still vote there because I believe in dessert sandwiches, and to vote neutral is too restrictive.

I like the category pseudo sandwiches because I can put things that aren't between bread in that category. Also open faced sandwiches would go there.

White bread problems.

I'm 27 and what is this

I think I could even rebel against structure, if the chart hadn't shown me what it meant.

No, a Pop-Tart is not a sandwich. Fight me.

If it does not feature bread of any kind, can it be a sandwich?
JJJ - no
nijuukyugou - no
Quin - yes
A Person - yes
Speedchuck - Yes

Does it have to feature leavened bread to be a sandwich?
JJJ - no
Quin - yes
juliets - yes
A Person - no
Speedchuck - No

Does the cover have to be separated into two or more detatched pieces?
JJJ - no
Quin - yes
juliets - yes
A Person - no
Speedchuck - no

Must a sandwich be eaten with a specific direction of intake?
JJJ - no
Quin - no
juliets - no
A Person - no
Speedchuck - no

Must a sandwich feature any specific food contents, or equally do any specific food contents prevent a meal from being a sandwich?
JJJ - no
Quin - no
juliets - no
A Person - no
Speedchuck - no

If an item would be a sandwich when covered (with bread, pieces of bread, or whatever else), is it still a sandwich when open-faced?
JJJ - no
Quin - no
juliets - no
Speedchuck - no

While a sandwich may or may not be eaten in any particular way, can sandwiches be distinguished from other styles by the way it is typically eaten or presented?
JJJ - yes
Quin - yes
juliets - yes
speedchuck - yes

If it would be a sandwich when covered by two pieces of the covering food material, is it still a sandwich if only one piece is used and folded over the contents?
JJJ - yes
Quin - no
juliets - no
speedchuck - yes

It feels like Quin's answers are really inconsistent.

u wot

I'm with juliet at 'other'. I started off at structural purist/ingredient rebel, but then realised structural rebel requires bread or baked goods. I think that a sandwich is where you get two detached slices of one thing, and put another thing in between them. No subs, no wraps, but a KFC Double Down is a sandwich, and I guess a burger is too (I remember being very confused the first time I got to Los Angeles to discover a lot of the 'sandwiches' I bought were burgers).

My answers to the questions

1 - yes
2 - no
3 - yes
4 - no? What the heck? A direction of intake? I mean, I think it should be by mouth... Don't go from the bottom up? But sandwiches are often symmetrical, so how can a symmetrical object by directional?
5 - no
6 - no
7 - yes
8 - no

The only place Quin is inconsistent is the first two answers.

Golden wrote: ↑Sun Jul 02, 2017 7:23 pm My answers to the questions

1 - yes
2 - no
3 - yes
4 - no? What the heck? A direction of intake? I mean, I think it should be by mouth... Don't go from the bottom up? But sandwiches are often symmetrical, so how can a symmetrical object by directional?
5 - no
6 - no
7 - yes
8 - no

The only place Quin is inconsistent is the first two answers.

A good way to put it is that while I don't believe that sandwiches must be made with bread, if it is made with bread, that bread must be leavened.

Golden wrote: ↑Sun Jul 02, 2017 7:23 pm4 - no? What the heck? A direction of intake? I mean, I think it should be by mouth... Don't go from the bottom up? But sandwiches are often symmetrical, so how can a symmetrical object by directional?

This primarily references things not eaten in a bottom-top or top-bottom format, but rather a side-side format (hot dogs).

What the heck is a KFC double down?

Oh god I just found it: The Double Down contains "bacon, two different kinds of melted cheese, the Colonel's secret sauce... pinched in between two pieces of Original Recipe chicken fillets." See even they don't call it a sandwich - "pinched between".

juliets wrote: ↑Mon Jul 03, 2017 2:55 pm What the heck is a KFC double down?

The chicken is the bun.

That is truly one of the most disgusting things I've ever seen.

juliets wrote: ↑Mon Jul 03, 2017 7:49 pm That is truly one of the most disgusting things I've ever seen.

Sure, but I still think it's a sandwich

Ingredient anarchy literally has sandwich in the definition, and is therefore a sandwich.

Fried chicken smashed between two waffles is a sandwich.

Have you guys ever heard of a bauru sandwich?

It's named after the city I was born.

Nope, never heard of it. What's in it?

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bauru_(sandwich)

Also if you ever see one made with ham instead of roast beef, it's fake.

(I hate ham)

LOL, they actually made the recipe law in Bauru? That's too funny. It sounded good until I got to pickled cucumber. There are very few pickled things I care for at all. In fact I can't think of any off the top of my head. And why take the soft bread stuff out?

I guess less soft bread = more fillings

Also this is one of those laws that nobody enforces, it's just to make it an official tradition or something. Also because politicians are silly.

It makes me giggle. I suppose that logic makes sense re:removing the soft bread...

I keep seeing this thread pop up and I feel inclined to participate but I feel like I'm late to the party. I also missed the Discord discussion that spawned this thread, so that puts me even further behind. What's the quick and dirty rundown?

there is a questionnaire in the first post, and an alignment choice in the third. Where do you stand, G-Man?

After looking at that fancy chart, I guess I would place myself as a Structural Neutral/Ingredient Purist.

Have you talked about peanut butter and jelly sandwiches? The charts speaks of ingredients associated with deli sandwiches but I consider PB&J a sandwich. I may veer toward true neutral, because I have had a marshmallow cream & jelly sandwich on occasion but I don't consider a hot dog a sandwich.

If you think PB&J is a sandwich, I think you are a structural purist/ingredient rebel. Or else your train of thought may be, 'it's a sandwich because I've always called it a sandwich for my lifespan, and not because of any objective criteria'.

Golden wrote: ↑Mon Jul 24, 2017 5:42 pm If you think PB&J is a sandwich, I think you are a structural purist/ingredient rebel. Or else your train of thought may be, 'it's a sandwich because I've always called it a sandwich for my lifespan, and not because of any objective criteria'.

Just call me a sandwich relativist then.

G-Man wrote: ↑Mon Jul 24, 2017 5:35 pm Structural Neutral/Ingredient Purist.

G-Man wrote: ↑Mon Jul 24, 2017 5:35 pm marshmallow cream & jelly sandwich on occasion but I don't consider a hot dog a sandwich.

nutella wrote: ↑Tue Dec 19, 2017 2:52 pm

I didn't know [mention]A Person[/mention] had a twitter account.

does a straw have one hole or two holes

edit: my favorite answer is "It has both one and two holes. This is my proof that the law of noncontradiction is fake news."

also Quin says "when a straw has liquid in it, is it a sandwich?"

nutella wrote: ↑Tue Jan 02, 2018 9:49 pm does a straw have one hole or two holes

edit: my favorite answer is "It has both one and two holes. This is my proof that the law of noncontradiction is fake news."

also Quin says "when a straw has liquid in it, is it a sandwich?"

Today I was standing firmly with two feet on the ground. Looking above me, I saw the sky. Looking down, I saw the Earth; and in that moment I had to ask myself: Am I a sandwich?

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Jan 04, 2018 10:07 pm Today I was standing firmly with two feet on the ground. Looking above me, I saw the sky. Looking down, I saw the Earth; and in that moment I had to ask myself: Am I a sandwich?

Quin would say yes; you meet all of the criteria, which isn't a fucking lot let me tell ya.

dunya wrote: ↑Fri Jan 05, 2018 6:36 am

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Jan 04, 2018 10:07 pm Today I was standing firmly with two feet on the ground. Looking above me, I saw the sky. Looking down, I saw the Earth; and in that moment I had to ask myself: Am I a sandwich?

Quin would say yes; you meet all of the criteria, which isn't a fucking lot let me tell ya.

This is slander!




You're thinking of Pink/A Person kk

I think an important key factor is that a sandwich must be able to be handheld. A calzone is basically a sandwich, but lasanga is not a sandwich, even though it is food contained in another food. Hot Pockets are marketed as a warm sandwich. Nigiri rolls can be eaten by hand but are also more often eaten with chopsticks, keeping them from sandwich status. A deep dish pizza is further from being a sandwich but I think it could be argued that flat pizza or regular pizza is a style of open faced sandwich. I would also put quesadilla and hotdog in sandwich territory.

I think just in general if you have to sit down to eat something it's probably not a sandwich. If at least one food item is contained within a different non-liquid food item and can be eaten while standing or walking without you needing to wash your hands afterwards, then I believe that food item can qualify as a sandwich.

Idk where that puts me on the chart.

Kylemii wrote: ↑Sat Jan 06, 2018 3:23 am I think an important key factor is that a sandwich must be able to be handheld. A calzone is basically a sandwich, but lasanga is not a sandwich, even though it is food contained in another food. Hot Pockets are marketed as a warm sandwich. Nigiri rolls can be eaten by hand but are also more often eaten with chopsticks, keeping them from sandwich status. A deep dish pizza is further from being a sandwich but I think it could be argued that flat pizza or regular pizza is a style of open faced sandwich. I would also put quesadilla and hotdog in sandwich territory.

I think just in general if you have to sit down to eat something it's probably not a sandwich. If at least one food item is contained within a different non-liquid food item and can be eaten while standing or walking without you needing to wash your hands afterwards, then I believe that food item can qualify as a sandwich.

Idk where that puts me on the chart.

Am I a sandwich in the hand of God?

I'd label myself a sandwich dadaist.

[mention]Sloonei[/mention]

If a specified god can eat clothing as well as uncooked and still-living human meat then I think you would qualify as a sandwich for that particular god, assuming that the god in question is large enough (or just strong enough) for you to be considered a portable food item to them.

bringing non-human entities expands the definition I think. humans (probably) invented the concept of "sandwich", if I saw a monkey drop a smooshed banana in a pile of leaves and he went to pick it up and noticed there were two leaves stuck to it on either side and ate it anyways, I'd consider that to be a sandwich almost without contest.

I mean, Cronus ate essentially an entire pantheon of gods which then went on to overpower him, and the Judeo-Christian God more or less encompasses all creation. I think there's a firm baseline for deities who could feasibly consume a living person, textiles and all.

The cosmos is God's sandwich.

A wise skeptic would present a riddle of the universe wherein God has prepared His sandwich and set down to eat it in all its glory. Every star, every solar system, every living and non-living thing, every last speck of dust, all is crafted into this immaculate hoagie. But just as He is set to take His first bite, He puts some mayonnaise on it.

Hellmann's.

Quin wrote: ↑Fri Jan 05, 2018 11:33 pm

dunya wrote: ↑Fri Jan 05, 2018 6:36 am

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Jan 04, 2018 10:07 pm Today I was standing firmly with two feet on the ground. Looking above me, I saw the sky. Looking down, I saw the Earth; and in that moment I had to ask myself: Am I a sandwich?

Quin would say yes; you meet all of the criteria, which isn't a fucking lot let me tell ya.

This is slander!




You're thinking of Pink/A Person kk

oh right, you called my falafel sandwich NOT a sandwich. You're True Evil.

Ok, I just found this article:

https://www.theatlantic.com/entertainme ... ch/414352/

juliets wrote: ↑Sat Sep 22, 2018 12:34 pm Ok, I just found this article:

https://www.theatlantic.com/entertainme ... ch/414352/

good article except it says that a roll is a sandwich which it absolutely is not

Quin wrote: ↑Sat Sep 22, 2018 10:24 pm

juliets wrote: ↑Sat Sep 22, 2018 12:34 pm Ok, I just found this article:

https://www.theatlantic.com/entertainme ... ch/414352/

good article except it says that a roll is a sandwich which it absolutely is not

I don't think it does [mention]Quin[/mention] because their first rule is:

To qualify as “a sandwich,” a given food product must, structurally, consist of two (2) exterior pieces that are either separate or mostly separate;

Isn't your roll attached?