Zootopia Mafia [Game Over]

[Epignosis]

epignosis, are you really vanilla or more "technically vanilla"

Vanilla.

Not French Vanilla or Vanilla Bean.

Vanilla.

I'm generic Vanilla.

What's leftover after the strawberry and chocolate are gone.

[Kylemii]

what kind of monster eats the chocolate and strawberry first

[Kylemii]

I mean strawberry and vanilla first sure, I get that

[Epignosis]

I'm going to play a game with the children. When I come back, I want to walk through the universes as they exist in my mind and judge which one is real.

[Long Con]

Well, Owner is casting his lot with a Long Con lynch, agreeing that Epi and Kyle are likely town. So be it. I doubt that my checks were false, because I'm Officer Judy Hopps. Owner has to be it. [VOTE: Owner] aubergine

[Kylemii]

owner's whole thing is way specific and I need to reread all his shit i guess

[Kylemii]

[mention]Epignozis[/mention] [mention]Owner of a Lonely Heart[/mention] what kind of animal are you?

[Owner of a Lonely Heart]

Well, Owner is casting his lot with a Long Con lynch, agreeing that Epi and Kyle are likely town. So be it. I doubt that my checks were false, because I'm Officer Judy Hopps. Owner has to be it. [VOTE: Owner] aubergine

You could be dumb bunny, but your character is more likely to be good. But it could also be a fake claim.

6) Anti town players get fake claims if applicable.

5) Don't call a bunny cute unless you are also a bunny. This is seen as racist.

Has anyone played another game by Jack to know if they would get legit good fake claims or not?

[Owner of a Lonely Heart]

@Epignozis @Owner of a Lonely Heart what kind of animal are you?

I'm a lion.

[Kylemii]

[mention]Owner of a Lonely Heart[/mention] can you explain more why you thought speed was going to die but didn't? were you notified about it?

[Owner of a Lonely Heart]

@Owner of a Lonely Heart can you explain more why you thought speed was going to die but didn't? were you notified about it?

The speedy thing is more a hindsight thing. Until Mac died, I thought I had a doctor role. But both leetic and Mac died on the nights that I targeted them, which doesn't make sense with speedy not dying night 1. Soneji was already lynched at this point. So nutella's death is the main question mark in my mind, as I know I didn't target nutella.

I think jack mentioned somewhere that we wouldn't know if our targets had been changed, so that could potentially be something? But yeah, I was expecting more kills.

One of the nights the flavor, sparked my interest a little bit, but I couldn't tell if it truly meant anything.

Also, when I saw leetic die, I also wondered if it was only 1 kill a night, which meant that I didn't save speedy or rather it didn't do anything.

[Owner of a Lonely Heart]

I guess thinking about it now; I should look at nutella and see if they were truly suspicious of anyone. Maybe they are still alive and are the last one?

[Kylemii]

did anyone target dizzy on night 4?

[Long Con]

did anyone target dizzy on night 4?

Yes, I did.

[Kylemii]

fuck

[Long Con]

fuck

Did you have a theory?

[Kylemii]

fuck

Did you have a theory?

idk, maybe? it seems stupid and unlikely, and I don't even know what we'd do about it if it were true

[Epignosis]

I am the winner of Catan.

Now I will try to be the winner of this shit show.

[Epignosis]

Each of you will get a full analysis and a spirit animal.

[Long Con]

Each of you will get a full analysis and a spirit animal.

Different from our actual animal?

[Kylemii]

I am eager to learn what my epignosis assigned fursona is

[Kylemii]

my galaxy brain take is that every murder victim we know about has also been targeted by something else that same night, having a strange correlation with night powers that don't happen to actually do anything, so like what if there just isn't a mafia and we've been killing people by accident?

the problem with that is obviously that it's insane, and also it would be a weird coincidence that most of the accidental murders were carried out by 3 of the 4 surviving players

[Epignosis]

Long Con

I'm starting with LC because I've had the most overall trust in him.

Hi Kyle. Great to see you.

So, a bastard game... that means we will be lied to by the host? Maybe we already have been lied to?

What troubles me most here is that LC is aware of the idea that the host is unreliable. I guess what troubles me more is that he directly addresses Kyle(mii), who would later expound upon how "math" proves there can only be one mafia left.

Eh. Moving on.

Wow, nice job folks. Sorry I wasn't around, the Fair ended around 6 last night, and I was too exhausted after four days of morning-to-night work to think about Mafia. I actually got caught up about three minutes after the poll ended and stared blankly at the screen for another minute before fully getting it that I was too late.

The reaction to the Day 1 lynch is fair.

I was actually just contemplating the pros and cons of doing a mass claim, and reading about it. I'm interested in hearing others' thoughts on this idea. When I was coming up in mafia (eons ago, LOL) info-dumping and role outing was a mod-kill offense. So this realm of role claiming and info-dumping is foreign soil to me. I know there are definitely pros and cons, and am interested in discussing whether we think it would be helpful, and at what point in the game it might be most helpful.

I don't think a massclaim is the best idea at this point.

This is an important post.

LC was quick to argue against people claiming so quickly. That leads to one of two scenarios:

LC is mafia and does not feel comfortable handling the fallout of such a thing.
LC is a civilian with a role he genuinely believes is helping the civilian faction and does not want to be killed for it.

More on this in a moment.

These votes are thin. This game is in thin water right now.

But blood is thicker than water, and there's some blood floating around here now.

Agree that Nut was somewhat of a surprising kill given the post restriction. But she was very unlikely to get lynched because of tipping the scales on Soneji.

Also Flash Hundred Yard Dash is a 'good guy' (probably), and nutella had the post restriction to prove it.

The anti-town faction(s) have fakeclaims, so don't get too crazy with this kind of talk.

There was a conversation about this. LC commented on how the mafia faction(s)(?) have fake claims. It was weird, but I remember discussing it.

For what it's worth, I don't think LC blurted this tidbit out into the thread.

Owner had their vote on you earlier, Kyle, following Epi and Sloonei's votes... now she has followed Dys's Sloonei vote. Maybe that's "casting a wide net", or maybe it's looking for a train to push all the way.

Didn't get the linki on this. This is Owner's town game, then... what does Owner's scum game look like?

More narrow. Not actually trying to think about all kinds of angles.
I probably don't read Owner perfectly, but I'm not bad at it. Likely town imo.

It was your very recent game together that Owner publicly got town cred for "casting a wide net". You have no concerns that she might be emulating this praised behaviour?

There is a degree of suspicion against Owner.

Ok, you want my reads, here's a rainbow:

Epignosis - I don't suspect Epi
Dyslexicon - Day 1 vote, townish presence
indiglo - Day 1 vote, looks good in-thread
Neverwhere - Don't know
Owner of a Lonely Heart - lots of bob-focus, slight nods to other possible cases but no follow up
MacDougall - not sure yet
colonialbob - I liked his defense against Owner's accusations
birdwithteeth11 - Not much here, voted off-wagon
Sloonei - not looking to lynch right now
Rej - some bad vibes, Miller claim is sketchy because it didn't go anywhere
Kylemii - possible scummate
speedchuck possible scummate

I'll [VOTE: speedchuck] aubergine now.

This is Day 2. I am never tip-top-teal-shit in LC's list Day 2.

What this tells me is that LC checked me and had a reason to believe I'm a civilian, which is what he's said all along.

I even accused LC of trying to get on my good side, but well, let's move on.

Epi: what is the problem you have with those posts? Why are you concerned about it?

I don't recall the context, but LC asked me to clarify something, which, in light of the above, signifies that he genuinely trusted me.

I won't quote the next thing, but it was a large analysis of Owner that resulted in a "I would vote Owner," and then he defended my drinking from Owner who used it as a way to vote for me:

In the Scrimmage game with Epi, he was following his town circle. He had opinions.

Here, he's drinking. (not quite coffee)

He leaves an impression in my mind that there is something to be desired.

tl;dr

He feels different.

[VOTE: Epig] aubergine

Drinking is Epi's usual MO. It's NAI, he feels normal to me.

I also suspect Owner. I'll put a vote there at this time.

Just for the Rej stuff mentioned awhile ago or something else?

I also don't like the show you're putting on with the talking-to-self. It's an attempt to seem... thoughtful, maybe?

talking to self is nai, but you wouldn't have known that

LC pressed Owner further, who self-defended with a "you wouldn't have known that."

Owner kept bringing up "Scrimmage," and I don't remember Owner talking to self.

Maybe I don't remember it. I can look back easily.

Hey, I see I have a few votes.. I'm at a concert so I can't address any issues. I can claim if need be, it's not a good idea to lynch me.

This is consistent with a cop who believes in himself.

Guys don't vote speed chuck, I am quite sure he is civ.

This is too.

Again, a mafia LC would have no reason to come in and beg for the life of speedchuck when LC also had votes.

The last baddies have to be in Jinrou, Kyle, Logic, or Owner. I feel very good about Epi and bob, and indi and Dys are outside tinfoils... pretty far outside.

Additional evidence that LC believes who he says he is.

The last baddies have to be in Jinrou, Kyle, Logic, or Owner. I feel very good about Epi and bob, and indi and Dys are outside tinfoils... pretty far outside.

What if I told you I feel pretty good about Logic, and that I feel I may have been wrong about Jinrou?

LC, this is when I was 100% sure you were a cop too. I had suspected it already.

Just for the record, THIS is how we used to info-dump on LP back when info-dumping was illegal.

That's how we do! It's probably obvious at this point who I checked, but Epi N1, speedchuck N2, bob N3. All town results.

This could be a mafia member trying to gain backwards credibility, but LC didn't play it that way: Recall that he called me good Day 2. He then tried to avert a speedchuck lynch.

This is remarkably consistent.

Hey, Zootopia is on TV right now!!! I haven't seen this since it came out in the theaters. Maybe it'll help.

What if the bunny cop has to find the otter for town to win? That's who she's looking for right now, and I think it's a pretty big plot point.

Someone was saying they thought... Rej?... was the Otter. But he's dead, so I dunno. The bunny cop probably just has to take out the mafia, I haven't seen anything that prompts too much speculation . Soneji was bad... there ARE baddies in this game.

LC commented on his own claimed role's win condition here.

If one or more of the cops is bad, who and why?

From what I remember of the movie, with the exception of one, the cops are just kinda incompetent.

The last baddies have to be in Jinrou, Kyle, Logic, or Owner. I feel very good about Epi and bob, and indi and Dys are outside tinfoils... pretty far outside.

I disagree with you about myself and Kyle, but think Kyle is less towny than Indi, Dys and Epi.

Who would you put as your bottom two; the ones you want lynched first?

I think I missed answering this yesterday. At this time, I would lynch Owner first, then Kyle, Jinrou, Logic from that list. I still don't want to lynch Epi, bob, or Dys.

I have to remind myself why I voted for Owner before, but I'll [VOTE: Owner] aubergine at this time. I am home and well-rested this evening (unlike the last few), so I'll be around until lynch time.

This man is on a mission.

I feel confident that bob is bad.

I disagree. I believe the baddies are in Owner, Jinrou, or Kyle.

LC didn't turn this around on me. He believes in what he's selling.

LC, on what basis are you trusting that you've cleared anybody? Don't go the indiglo route, but if there is bullshit afoot, and there quite likely is, I want the civilians to be in front of it, not stepping in it.

I have reason to believe some things.

I invited LC to question his results, and he chose not to waver. Mafia would appreciate the out.

Well, I checked Kyle last night and he came back as Civ. So I can vote for Owner or give up the idea that I'm actually a competent cop.

LC on a mission.

Epignosis, if my cop checks are bad, then why are you a civilian in this game?

I anticipated this question, and I'm glad LC asked it, because it shows he's open to me being bad after all, even though he has a clear path to win as mafia.

I'm satisfied. I need nothing else.

Long Con is a civilian and will not get my vote today. He is the Galapagos Tortoise. His stroll might be leisurely, but he leads you to the water.

[Epignosis]

If anyone disagrees with something I've written, please speak not or forever hold your peas.

[Kylemii]

LC is too consistent to have been making things up from the start. I believe he is who he says he is.

[Kylemii]

I mean even more than that, his words and actions are consistent with someone who's working positively towards a good end based on information they gained at night. information he at least trusted

[Epignosis]

I agree. I'm on you Kylemii, but I have to take a phone call, and I don't know how long I will be.

[Long Con]

I hope there aren't long distance charges on that phone call.

[Epignosis]

[Epignosis]

Kylemii

Kylemii said a lot of fun, stupid stuff I'm not going to quote, but it did lead to this:

Hosting back to back Pathfinder sessions to make up for failing my players other weeks taking up all my time and energy. Don't really have a feel for this game yet.

Vote : KyleMii

Their bad attempts at playing around with the movies name lasting past day 0 is yikes.

what's yikes about it?

I will admit that I took this to be a point against Kylemii, but I had to keep being reminded that Kylemii was on the chopping block too.

I dislike soneji admitting he's disengaged from the game while saying my funny joke posts are sketchy without explaining why

is soneji cus of the Miller claim thing?

I forgot to post but I voted for soneji. it was either him or SD and his votal reasoning still irked me.

My concern was that this was Soneji(R) distancing. Had I paid more attention to the Kylemii posts (sorry Kylemii I don't pay much attention to you), I might've dismissed that idea sooner. I don't know. Moving on.

epi, there's something wrong the thing that you just said. at the point where I came into the thread I was tied for the lead with less than 20 minutes left to vote. I could have probably died just as easily as Spacedaisy or soneji. I know that doesn't really counter your point cus your implication is distancing, and death is a crucial part of a balanced distancing, I just thought it seemed like an important piece of data

also the idea of my name being tattooed on the devil's ass is... an amazing concept. like... how cool do you have to be to earn that?

I just like this response. So I'm copying it here. Nothing game-related. Just love it.

epi, there's something wrong the thing that you just said. at the point where I came into the thread I was tied for the lead with less than 20 minutes left to vote. I could have probably died just as easily as Spacedaisy or soneji. I know that doesn't really counter your point cus your implication is distancing, and death is a crucial part of a balanced distancing, I just thought it seemed like an important piece of data

also the idea of my name being tattooed on the devil's ass is... an amazing concept. like... how cool do you have to be to earn that?

scum do like to keep the record straight though.

[VOTE: Kylemii] aubergine

I don't like being misrepresented regardless of alignment. that's how mislynches happen

this seems like a weak justification for a vote, without doing much personal investigation into the thing you're taking a stance on and I dislike that.

Striking back against Owner.

Let's try this

[VOTE: Sloonei] aubergine

[VOTE: Sloonei] aubergine Kyle isn't doing anything. And I am feeling a little bit better on bob. Sloonei's vote for bob wasn't anything special.

I'm a little confused why you moved your vote off of me for not doing anything, was the goal of your vote on me to get a reaction about it, rather than an actual declaration of suspicion?

Kylefiire

Kyle, do you suspect any of your voters, either today or yesterday? Your Soneji vote was a good look for you, do you have any teammate ideas?

I don't suspect Mac or Epi. Mac's behavior is pretty typical for him. And I think epignosis seems like he's questioning me from a position of good faith.

I was irked by owner earlier but having read their recent posts they seem to be casting a wide net and putting work into getting feels on people and I like that but I want to see more and also hear answers to my questions(s?) still to know whether that's genuine or a performance.

I want to look at and question speedchuck still but it will have to wait til later

Calling me and Mac good that early is ballsy.

I was irked by owner earlier but having read their recent posts they seem to be casting a wide net

Owner "casting a wide net" was the exact phrasing that was used to describe why she was read town in the last game we played together. In other words, Owner is most likely town. [Insert tinfoil about Owner/Kyle team]

I know, that's not the part that irked me. The wide net observation only happened after the irkedness

This clarification is important. Kylemii wants to be understood.

Kylemii asked Sloonei a question about "French Vanilla," which mirrors a recent question he asked of me.

I'm not "hitting my stride" because I'm just not that into mafia right now I guess, I've been playing this game whole-ly from my phone. I took a break for a reason.

I know that feeling.

Can you point to anywhere you did something cop-like?

(Hopefully you understand why I'm not taking further cop claims at face value)

I can't. I'm 99% sure a bastard cop. Instead of results I've been getting responses like "you totally meant to do that but instead you got distracted with a phone app" or "you were definitely gonna do that but you got distracted by donuts" last night I didn't get a message like that but was just told "no results" implying something else happened.

Is Kylemii lying about his claim? As I noted earlier, it seems too elaborate.

If any of the cop claims are untrue, I think it would be Kyle's. That whole getting random messages could definitely be made up. Why would Kyle be the only one getting custom messages. I just got town every time, and it seems that was the experience that Bob, Logic and indiglo had too. I can easily see Kyle make up this shit to make it sound believable and specific. I think. Maybe. Right?

[VOTE: Kyle] aubergine

I want to point out before I go to bed that I don't like how far dizzy goes out of the way to ignore the fact that my role is clearly a thematic joke role in a bastard game. Having one role that's "haha Jonah Hill cat cop wants junk food instead of detective work, it's a fun prank" is cute and funny, but having multiple roles exactly like mine that say they do one thing but actually don't do anything would be less creative or interesting, especially if they were both cops for some reason

I want to highlight that Kylemii doesn't just defend himself- he turns his defense into a suspicion of Dyslexicon.

I have no further motivation to continue this exercise. I think overall, Kylemii's post history looks clean. I like his involvement and there's an urgency within his posts to clarify things.

Kylemii is a the turkey that, come Thanksgiving, nobody has the heart to kill because he's a friend.

[Long Con]

Kylemii is a the turkey that, come Thanksgiving, nobody has the heart to kill because he's a friend.

He's got a good niche there... so damn likeable, funny, and fun.

Your Kylenalysis hits some good major points in Kyle's game, and some of that Owner stuff resonates more given the point we're at in the game.

[Long Con]

Of the things that make Kyle look good, which would be the hardest to fake as a baddie?

[Long Con]

You know what, how about this : we now know it's a two-person Baddie team, how likely is it that Kyle bus-lynches his only teammate on day one and has been going it alone this whole time by design?

[Owner of a Lonely Heart]

You know what, how about this : we now know it's a two-person Baddie team, how likely is it that Kyle bus-lynches his only teammate on day one and has been going it alone this whole time by design?

I gotta head to work. With this in mind, and I pray and hope that jack didn't give Long Con "Judy Hopps as a fake claim".

True story:

The last time Soneji and I were on a team together, I was away and unable to participate, and Sonji got lynched Day 1.

I was away and unable to participate tonight.

We're not bad together though.

Also, with these in mind, [VOTE: Epignosis] aubergine

I could have spent more time on this, but the more, I overthink something the harder it is to make a concise decision later on.

He was still very fillery until recently.

If I die before I get back home, good game mafia, lol!Soneji winning.

[Kylemii]

I think it might be epignosis

[Long Con]

I think it might be epignosis

More than owner?

[Epignosis]

My day has been bad. I'm not bad.

[Epignosis]

So much so that I have no motivation to read through Owner's posts. However, I don't think it's necessary, as I believe LC and Kylemii are civilians.

[Kylemii]

ugh idk

[Kylemii]

I'm just thinking over what we know, the mafia apparently was 2 people and one of them died first. Mafia!LC would be ballsy as fuck to claim not only a cop but literally the main character of the movie. that's a risky tactic, though I guess technically that risk would be nullified if bunny cop was his fake claim

I honestly didn't follow owner's whole thing but it seems so complicated and hard to be fake. But I don't really know owner that well maybe this is something they excell at? that one post was so elaborate and didn't make any sense at all

I'm still at work, posting from the stock room. I need to review shit again later.

[Kylemii]

Epignosis would have killed long con by now, wasn't he the one who figured out he was softclaiming cop?

[Kylemii]

Unless mafia!epignosis knew LC was an optimist cop or he's a god father so leaving him around would be beneficial to him???

[Epignosis]

Epignosis would have killed long con by now

Ages ago.

[Kylemii]

the same would be true of owner technically. godfather owner would also have reason to keep possible LC alive, but am ordinary mafia owner would want to get rid of LC sooner than later, having no way to know if he was an effective cop.

who were the other players who claimed cop? did they die at night

[Kylemii]

I am going to get fired for going to the bathroom to mafia so often

[Kylemii]

alright so now what

[Epignosis]

I think my only hang up at this point is LC checking me, checking you, and then not voting Owner. What's up LC?

[Epignosis]

Never mind.

I'm a dumb ass.

Today has sucked.

I'm voting Owner.

[Kylemii]

@Owner of a Lonely Heart who else did you target? for the sake of transparency

N1 - Speedy
N2 - Leetic (I almost targeted Epi that night, but I thought he was likely mafia with Soneji, so I changed my mind.) 'Cause I was a doctor.
N3 - MacDougall (this was when I started to wonder if I was more of vig than an actual doctor when I woke up to Mac dying, but it still didn't explain N1)
N4 - Dizzy (He was playing in a different game with someone he hadn't played with in awhile. He was pretty townie in my mind. Plus, he was was very active, so I did think mafia would target him if not indiglo. But yeah, I'm still very confused.
N5 - bob (Bob mentioned me in the thread to switch my vote to jinrou instead of kyle. I thought maybe mafia determine who's night action performs the kill each night. So maybe someone has been targeting me consecutively? Idk. So I targeted bob. Because if bob and kyle were mafia together, I would have eliminate a world of 2 going into today.)

But the main reason why I'm leaning on voting for Long Con is that the day that Rej/leetic died. LC brings up a post where I interacted with Rej/leetic.

Seeing that kind of freaked me out.

So part of me was wondering if LC had a legit tracker or watcher role and saw that I targeted leetic. Or if LC was the supposed mafia who made me actually kill someone one. That's also why I mentioned I think during one of the night phases that I thought LC was okay, because I was under the assumption that LC saw me target leetic, but in my mind, at this stage I thought it was a coincidence that leetic died and that I somehow couldn't save or that my protection didn't work.

LC had I think joking made some comment day 1 about having a nullifier or vanillariser role of sorts. So I generally thought that they were the "godfather" character that was in Zootopia.

But I'm not sure that I really put this godfather character with Soneji's character. So, I thought LC was town, but then they claimed cop, which isn't what I expect from them, unless they happen to Judy Hopps.

If owner is mafia what do they gain from making all this stuff up, instead of making up something more simple and believable?

[Kylemii]

@Epignozis @Owner of a Lonely Heart what kind of animal are you?

I'm a lion.

Is it too in the nose if the mayor lion and his sheep assistant are the mafia together?