Mental Health Awareness - Discussion

[TS Mental Health]

Mental Health Awareness Month - Discussion Thread

May is Mental Health Awareness Month, and we, the staff on TS and MU, would like to bring attention to it with this campaign posted in its separate thread and also on Mafia Universe, who we have collaborated with to raise awareness.

In this thread, any feedback, questions, discussion and comments, that aren't sent to us privately, can be posted here! We would love to support everyone who shares their story with us as well! This is a safe space, where we can support one another.

!	Message from: TS Mental Health
	As always, we expect a civil and respectful tone from everyone choosing to post here, especially since this topic is very close to heart for many of our users.

[Syn]

I posted this on MU, but I'll copy-paste it here too since I know many of you do not frequent that site. Sorry for the impending wall.

-----

I don't know how to feel about this.

Whenever corporations do these campaigns, it comes across condescending and fake. With MU and TS, I at least know it's meant genuinely, but it still feels condescending. The announcement post felt like I was being talked down to.

I try to balance my perspective by observing how other people respond to campaigns like this, and it seems to be a hit with the majority. So I recognize, at least to some extent, that I'm an outlier when it comes to this.

I dunno. To be told there's always help, that I should just talk to people, that "suicide is a permanent solution to a temporary problem," it just all feels very gross. The reality is that this isn't true for a lot of people. There isn't always help. Talking doesn't always act as relief. And these "temporary problems" often aren't temporary. It's condescending to be told I've failed to access the help that's supposedly available to me, or that I just haven't figured out how to solve a temporary issue. People in crisis, or approaching crisis, certainly aren't in the best frame of mind, but can anyone really say with a straight face that there is always help? That friends and family are always available? That all problems are always temporary? If I say I can't access help, that my problems are forever or long term enough to be equivalent, am I helped if someone pats me on the head and tells me I'm wrong? Am I respected? Acknowledged? What good was that person's "awareness" if it requires belittling and discrediting me and my lived experience?

While I don't go out of my way to hide my issues, I am also cagey about sharing specifics. People who know me know that I am troubled, though not to what extent nor how. There is a reason for this. The reason is that, frankly, the vast majority of people are not equipped to deal with complicated, personal, intimate problems. If I were to follow the advice from all these campaigns, my mental health would get worse, not better, and funnily enough, that is more stigmatizing to me. It's this indictment of who I fundamentally am. I'm so broken that even the pro-help side is totally inaccessible to me. I'm told to do this, to do that, and everyone is so certain that it'll help, and I'm in the uncomfortable position of saying well, no, it doesn't help. What am I doing wrong? These tips are so universally lauded. Everyone is so sure. It's gone from mental health is fake to mental health is real, yet somehow monolithic. The help is just as nonexistent for people like me on both sides of that spectrum.

I don't exactly know where I am going with this. I guess I just wanted to voice that these things are inevitably exclusionary toward the demographic you're trying to cater to. It'll help a lot of people, and I have no doubt that it'll educate them too, but the way the campaign is structured and reasoned is inherently going to result in many falling through the cracks or being silenced, or in some cases, made to feel worse instead of better.

Just as an example... and I want to stress here that I am in no way upset with the people who came up with the idea, so apologies and what-have-you are unnecessary... but I saw a mock-up where a banner will include the mental health awareness campaign on TS. And for someone in my position, that is amazingly harmful. I'm in an active mental health crisis right now. I have been on the precipice for years. I engage in recreational activities to have fun, to give myself reasons to keep going another day. Mafia is one of those recreational activities. I don't want to access a recreational activity multiple times a day and be reminded, in big bold font, of just how miserable my life is. That I should be "aware" of being on the edge. But I don't need help being more aware. I am too aware already. I don't need to be reminded, because my mind reminds me every minute of every day.

And that's the issue, isn't it? To most reading, a big banner about mental health awareness isn't harmful. It makes mental health public. It encourages discussion. Maybe it'll help people get help with their anxiety or depression. These are net goods. And yet it can also harm the people you're wanting others to be aware of.

What's the solution? No clue. On TS, I asked for the banner to be opt out. That seems like an idea. But with all this other stuff, like the language surrounding getting help or coping, I don't have any clear solutions. It probably helps more people than it hurts, and you can't cater to every individual perspective. Maybe I am just offering this viewpoint as something to chew on, and nothing more.

[nutella]

Pasting my response to Syn because I think it is crucial to acknowledge his perspective!

---
This is important, thanks for sharing. Mental illness is absolutely NOT monolithic. Every individual has a different experience and different needs, and the same approaches are certainly not going to work for everyone, or even be accessible for everyone. You are right that in any campaign like this some people's needs will fall through the cracks -- but even acknowledging this could be helpful for someone ("you are not alone" in being alone is that too cheesy....) There is no guarantee that this campaign can be a positive influence to all who engage with it, but the hope is that it can be positive for most who opt to participate/follow along. It's mainly intended to provide resources and ensure that people know what potential help is available to them, and perhaps you have already been repeatedly made aware of such options and know they don't fit your situation, but others may not have even been exposed to such resources.

[Hally]

syn

[DaughterOfOmega]

I posted this on MU, but I'll copy-paste it here too since I know many of you do not frequent that site. Sorry for the impending wall.

-----

I don't know how to feel about this.

Whenever corporations do these campaigns, it comes across condescending and fake. With MU and TS, I at least know it's meant genuinely, but it still feels condescending. The announcement post felt like I was being talked down to.

I try to balance my perspective by observing how other people respond to campaigns like this, and it seems to be a hit with the majority. So I recognize, at least to some extent, that I'm an outlier when it comes to this.

I dunno. To be told there's always help, that I should just talk to people, that "suicide is a permanent solution to a temporary problem," it just all feels very gross. The reality is that this isn't true for a lot of people. There isn't always help. Talking doesn't always act as relief. And these "temporary problems" often aren't temporary. It's condescending to be told I've failed to access the help that's supposedly available to me, or that I just haven't figured out how to solve a temporary issue. People in crisis, or approaching crisis, certainly aren't in the best frame of mind, but can anyone really say with a straight face that there is always help? That friends and family are always available? That all problems are always temporary? If I say I can't access help, that my problems are forever or long term enough to be equivalent, am I helped if someone pats me on the head and tells me I'm wrong? Am I respected? Acknowledged? What good was that person's "awareness" if it requires belittling and discrediting me and my lived experience?

While I don't go out of my way to hide my issues, I am also cagey about sharing specifics. People who know me know that I am troubled, though not to what extent nor how. There is a reason for this. The reason is that, frankly, the vast majority of people are not equipped to deal with complicated, personal, intimate problems. If I were to follow the advice from all these campaigns, my mental health would get worse, not better, and funnily enough, that is more stigmatizing to me. It's this indictment of who I fundamentally am. I'm so broken that even the pro-help side is totally inaccessible to me. I'm told to do this, to do that, and everyone is so certain that it'll help, and I'm in the uncomfortable position of saying well, no, it doesn't help. What am I doing wrong? These tips are so universally lauded. Everyone is so sure. It's gone from mental health is fake to mental health is real, yet somehow monolithic. The help is just as nonexistent for people like me on both sides of that spectrum.

I don't exactly know where I am going with this. I guess I just wanted to voice that these things are inevitably exclusionary toward the demographic you're trying to cater to. It'll help a lot of people, and I have no doubt that it'll educate them too, but the way the campaign is structured and reasoned is inherently going to result in many falling through the cracks or being silenced, or in some cases, made to feel worse instead of better.

Just as an example... and I want to stress here that I am in no way upset with the people who came up with the idea, so apologies and what-have-you are unnecessary... but I saw a mock-up where a banner will include the mental health awareness campaign on TS. And for someone in my position, that is amazingly harmful. I'm in an active mental health crisis right now. I have been on the precipice for years. I engage in recreational activities to have fun, to give myself reasons to keep going another day. Mafia is one of those recreational activities. I don't want to access a recreational activity multiple times a day and be reminded, in big bold font, of just how miserable my life is. That I should be "aware" of being on the edge. But I don't need help being more aware. I am too aware already. I don't need to be reminded, because my mind reminds me every minute of every day.

And that's the issue, isn't it? To most reading, a big banner about mental health awareness isn't harmful. It makes mental health public. It encourages discussion. Maybe it'll help people get help with their anxiety or depression. These are net goods. And yet it can also harm the people you're wanting others to be aware of.

What's the solution? No clue. On TS, I asked for the banner to be opt out. That seems like an idea. But with all this other stuff, like the language surrounding getting help or coping, I don't have any clear solutions. It probably helps more people than it hurts, and you can't cater to every individual perspective. Maybe I am just offering this viewpoint as something to chew on, and nothing more.

Sadly I've had to experience both sides of the argument to what I bolded.

I am going to be fairly personal in this post, but only because they are things I've let people know publicly in the past:

When I was suicidal, I found the "suicide is never the option" or " just get help 4head" just corny and not helpful to anything I was feeling at the time. Though let me say this, I survived because a select few of people never quit sending me these type of messages everyday. The care and stubbornness of certain individuals just having the energy to try and keep me alive, ended up helping me get to the point I am. Nothing particular said to me really had an impact, never called any numbers, was already in therapy, taking drugs. These one liner responses that may not really help an individual at all, but are ways that uneducated/inexperienced (in mental illness) people can be there for someone who is dealing with this. (though my personal experience was that educated professionals were useless)

I actually was unable to ever find some professional or lifestyle help that had any real impact on the issues I dealt with. I had to learn through a ton of personal testing and experience to find different ways that I could live my life. Though I would never have been able to find these on my own without other individuals putting time into my life. I can definitely relate to certain things you think and feel. On the topic of being more private about specific mental health aspects, part of me wishes I never told people things about my brain and body, but there is also part of me that wonders if I would still be here if I didn't share who I was at the time.

[Hally]

doom

[dunya]

@Syn

i appreciate everything you wrote. your concerns are valid and honest, and personally gave me a lot to think about on how i approach this subject with others.

the certainty that "everything WILL be better" - though meant more as a positive reinforcement - isn't always what people want to hear and i acknowledge that here. it's arrogant, perhaps, or even condescending as you say, but written with the best intentions i promise, and i apologize for it and will strive to grow from this discussion. i have already tried to edit the language, and will continue working on this (with you, perhaps, if you feel up for it), to bring across the message in a less triggering/offensive manner.

i don't think our initiative was meant to be this controversial: our goals were to help break the stigma that mental health issues are taboo, by sharing experiences of our own struggles to perhaps normalize it or encourage someone who's afraid or ashamed by it, post resources from referenced websites (not opinion pieces or medical advice of our own, certainly, as we don't have any medical experience!), and just connect people with another friend if they are looking for one. being depressed and lonely, looking for someone outside your immediate circle to talk to, is a real struggle some people have.

i'm probably a hypocrite who says "talking to someone" is good when my lowest moments are spent in isolation. yet, when i do disappear, i have people reach out to me - "just let me know you're ok, and i won't bother you more" - is what my best friend Spacedaisy tells me when i'm going through those episodes. she acknowledges my need for space, but still wants to let me know she's there. it works for me, honestly. i hope it can work for someone else. i acknowledge people work in different ways, of course, and we aren't trying to force anything on anyone.

anyway, i love and appreciate you a lot and i appreciate your opinions and feelings.

[dunya]

@DaughterOfOmega

thanks for sharing your experience. it means a lot to me, and fills me with a little hope that someone else benefits from having a friend reach out! i'm really glad you were able to find what works for you, all within your comfort zone.

[Hally]

@juliets thanks for being great, love ya

[juliets]

@juliets thanks for being great, love ya

Thank you so much Hally, exposing my issues was really freeing in a lot of ways.

[nutella]

thanks for sharing @juliets, I personally find some aspects of your experience relatable and take your story to heart.

[juliets]

thanks for sharing @juliets, I personally find some aspects of your experience relatable and take your story to heart.

Thanks for reading and acknowledging nutella, it was hard to write but I'm glad I did.

[dunya]

@juliets your story is something i relate to (even now) and it really explains how you've been able to understand my stress triggers and help me navigate through my issues over the years.

thank you for sharing. you know you have me always

[juliets]

@juliets your story is something i relate to (even now) and it really explains how you've been able to understand my stress triggers and help me navigate through my issues over the years.

thank you for sharing. you know you have me always

I really appreciate your words dunya. I enjoy helping others when I can, I don't want to see anyone struggle. And yes, I know you're always there for me

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I appreciate your candor, juliets. While I can never truly understand the gender side of your struggle, I do recognize the distinction between being a boulder in the eyes of one's peers and being anything but a boulder in the eyes of oneself. That was a consistent conflict of my own in the Air Force.

[Syn]

For the writers and readers of TS:

https://www.mafiauniverse.com/forums/th ... instorming

[DaughterOfOmega]

I typed up about 4000 words in a doc, didn't save and was tilted off the face of the earth. I think I may return to the topics I wanted to cover later this month. The main thing I wanted to say is that if you think things you are dealing with is something you are forced to deal with, never make that assumption. I used to have an extreme fear, and anxiety that would shake me to my core. When I was young, I thought others were also dealing with these things to the level I did, and that I just wasn't strong enough. I learned that the impact that anxiety and fear had on me was so much more extreme than what typical people go through. Medicine and some other treatments have allowed me to live what I assume is a much more common experience, and I am a functional human being now. I just want to advise people that if they are dealing with something they feel is having a massive impact on their life, don't assume you need to just overcome it, talk with a professional and try treatments if they recommend it.

Another thing I wanted to share is my eating disorder.

For about 13 years I've struggled with depression, schizophrenia, bipolar, anxiety, but none of these have taken a toll on me like the eating disorder I have. When I think about all aspects of my health, physically or mentally, the feeling of uncontrollable hunger is the hardest thing. Living with extreme stress and in a toxic environment, I started to cope with food as a young kid. To cut a long story shot, my body always craves food any time I am feeling extreme emotions, and instead of dealing with the emotions I eat them away. It really got to the point where my body would be in pain if I wasn't eating if I was stressed, pains in my stomach like I hadn't eaten for days. I've let my body become something I hate, and the toll it takes on me physically, ruins my mental state. I wish I could say I've found ways to solve this and get the body I want, and to not feel this craving for eating all the time. This summer I am aiming to lose about 30lbs, I won't be able to do it on my own because I'm so weak against myself, but whenever I am in pain I will try and post on this forum to ignore it!

[Syn]

I typed up about 4000 words in a doc, didn't save and was tilted off the face of the earth. I think I may return to the topics I wanted to cover later this month. The main thing I wanted to say is that if you think things you are dealing with is something you are forced to deal with, never make that assumption. I used to have an extreme fear, and anxiety that would shake me to my core. When I was young, I thought others were also dealing with these things to the level I did, and that I just wasn't strong enough. I learned that the impact that anxiety and fear had on me was so much more extreme than what typical people go through. Medicine and some other treatments have allowed me to live what I assume is a much more common experience, and I am a functional human being now. I just want to advise people that if they are dealing with something they feel is having a massive impact on their life, don't assume you need to just overcome it, talk with a professional and try treatments if they recommend it.

Another thing I wanted to share is my eating disorder.

For about 13 years I've struggled with depression, schizophrenia, bipolar, anxiety, but none of these have taken a toll on me like the eating disorder I have. When I think about all aspects of my health, physically or mentally, the feeling of uncontrollable hunger is the hardest thing. Living with extreme stress and in a toxic environment, I started to cope with food as a young kid. To cut a long story shot, my body always craves food any time I am feeling extreme emotions, and instead of dealing with the emotions I eat them away. It really got to the point where my body would be in pain if I wasn't eating if I was stressed, pains in my stomach like I hadn't eaten for days. I've let my body become something I hate, and the toll it takes on me physically, ruins my mental state. I wish I could say I've found ways to solve this and get the body I want, and to not feel this craving for eating all the time. This summer I am aiming to lose about 30lbs, I won't be able to do it on my own because I'm so weak against myself, but whenever I am in pain I will try and post on this forum to ignore it!

I am also a binge eater.

Last year, I ended up in the hospital with starvation due to my other health problems. It took two months before I had to go, and I only ended up doing so because I started throwing up water too. When asked why it took me so long to go to the ER, I realized it was more than my general distaste of going to the hospital. The feeling of extended starvation didn't feel any different from how I normally do while bingeing.

I don't share that to try and one-up you (I suspect you've felt that exact scenario too, based on what you've shared elsewhere in the past), but to provide a frame of reference to those who don't have binge eating disorder what it feels like. It is very easy to say "just eat less," but this becomes empty advice when put up against how pervasive the sensation and urge is on a daily, every-minute basis. What's particularly insidious about eating disorders is that they often recode your gut biome and the unconscious nerve triggers inside your stomach and intestine. After a while, it becomes more than a mental health issue, because it is likely that your body becomes physically attuned to that behaviour... and resists attempts to change.

[Hally]

both of you

[Hally]

@vanity. thanks for sharing

[juliets]

I appreciate your candor, juliets. While I can never truly understand the gender side of your struggle, I do recognize the distinction between being a boulder in the eyes of one's peers and being anything but a boulder in the eyes of oneself. That was a consistent conflict of my own in the Air Force.

Thank you Jay I really appreciate your reading my story and sharing your struggle with that same issue of what you are in the eyes of others vs. how you see yourself. It can be disorienting to me at times but I have gotten used to that feeling over the years.

[Syn]

What up, gangsters?

I've written the writing prompt event document.

I thought I would offer the event guidelines now so writers can get going.

Find out more about the prompts and the limitations here: https://docs.google.com/document/d/15ms ... sp=sharing

The above also talks about the presentations. If you're a potential writer, this document is everything you need to get started.

The deadline to have your prompt submitted to me is SUNDAY, MAY 16.

Here is the submission form: https://forms.gle/wFiKZH81gTfDkzdw6

It is anonymous. It does not collect your email or Google account info. You can submit your prompt in an incognito window for extra assurance.

[Tangrowth]

I expressed this on MU, but wanted it said here as well.

I just would like to express my immense appreciation for the effort that everyone made (and continues to) in order to put all of this together.

[CRichard]

Hello again MU peeps.

[Herm]

I caught Covid in December/January this year and went through some heavy anxiety and depression when I was recovering. It seems like that's a common thing after you've had it and thankfully it was only temporary, but it lasted longer than normal so wasn't the best of times. I started to exercise after that and change my diet, helped tremendously tbh. It also helped me that I talked to and befriended new people, played some games etc.

Being there for people and not being afraid to talk to others, helps get through at least some of the mental health issues some of us are faced with at least.

[Hally]

herm