Mafia Misplay Mafia

[Sabiplz]

Why would a wolf defend mac in that scenario? Make it make sense to me

To look like there isn't tmi.

Because it's too obvious of a wolf partner to start cw when their partner is probably going to flip

What

[Porscha]

Twice iirc. She's very pockety with me if she's wolf against me. She hasn't this game.

only once you think i haven't been pockety of you? I've pretty much let you slide through on a TR all game with little to no pushback on your slot...

Wasn't the mu game you were wolf, no?

Compared to asmr it hasn't been on my radar

Is this why I'm alive?

ah haha I think the one game on MU we played *you* were wolf ;p

compared to asmr, you haven't been imploding in ate most of the game so I haven't felt the need to give you extra affirmation in your play.

It's been two games in a row of mostly controlling my emotions.

Plz give me affirmationz

No I'm talking the you G justice game.

You weren't in mountainous ita. Only Esooa and lily were

ah young justice we were both town. I haven't randed maf on MU yet

WAIT IT WAS THE SC2 PRESIDENTS ANON GAME


U WERE WOLF

I CAUGHT YOU D1

no sabi, I was nixon and I was town there too. lol

[Esooa]

Why would a wolf defend mac in that scenario? Make it make sense to me

by that logic HK is never wolf then because nobody defended mac harder than HK did day 2, despite mac saying he needed to be voted off for being day 1 counter wagon. make it make sense to me.

HK literally is the one in the position to not want Mac to die because Mac was pushing on him to bus him and Mac dying is awful in that scenario as literally I've said, Achro said day 2, nanook was saying all game, and on top of that Neon's play around it was way more believable and emotion after, and even despite that, call it a wash and HK has been turbo wolfy all game

[Sabiplz]

only once you think i haven't been pockety of you? I've pretty much let you slide through on a TR all game with little to no pushback on your slot...

Wasn't the mu game you were wolf, no?

Compared to asmr it hasn't been on my radar

Is this why I'm alive?

ah haha I think the one game on MU we played *you* were wolf ;p

compared to asmr, you haven't been imploding in ate most of the game so I haven't felt the need to give you extra affirmation in your play.

It's been two games in a row of mostly controlling my emotions.

Plz give me affirmationz

No I'm talking the you G justice game.

You weren't in mountainous ita. Only Esooa and lily were

ah young justice we were both town. I haven't randed maf on MU yet

WAIT IT WAS THE SC2 PRESIDENTS ANON GAME


U WERE WOLF

I CAUGHT YOU D1

no sabi, I was nixon and I was town there too. lol

My memory sucks ass

[Sabiplz]

Noticed I was kicked out of the town core Coolio

[Lilypetal]

Why would a wolf defend mac in that scenario? Make it make sense to me

by that logic HK is never wolf then because nobody defended mac harder than HK did day 2, despite mac saying he needed to be voted off for being day 1 counter wagon. make it make sense to me.

Sorry, I should've been clearer. Assume HK and Mac are both wolves. One is going to die, the other is trying to go deeper and tbh just play in the exact way hk has with "you can't kill me anymore!" and it makes sense to me at least. But why would the last wolf join in? Wolves probably went fuck we have to go REALLY deep. Neon defending mac and putting herself in the limelight doesn't really fit that image. I mean she's town for a million other reasons anyway

[Sabiplz]

Noticed I was kicked out of the town core Coolio

[Lilypetal]

@Sabiplz

Can you post your solve?

[Lilypetal]

@Porscha What is your solve as well

[Sabiplz]

@Sabiplz

Can you post your solve?

Kinda just leaning neon/tsp atp.

You're not like the clue game.

Esooa because of D2 cw

Porscha because it out wolf range.

[Lilypetal]

Yeah idk i dont see how we lose this game idt neon or esooa are wolves

[Lilypetal]

Like if someone wants to show receipts that out neon then go for it but just saying things doesn't change my mind personally

[Lilypetal]

@Porscha

Would you consider yourself out of your wolfrange? I see other ppl saying it but I want your opinion

[Sabiplz]

OK I'm home and my friends are here so I'm limited atn

[hollowkatt]

lily is your solve then Sabi/TSP after I flip town or are you planning on re-evaluating?

[Esooa]

NONE OF THIS IS SUPPORTED BY ANYTHING I LOOKED FOR BECAUSE I LOOKED FOR NOTHING

current votes:

Santy: neon, porscha, sabi, lily
HK: santy, esooa, risiing
risiinq: HK

does it make MORE sense if two wolves are on me saying "hk is wolf and even if not he has to die" or does it make LESS sense?

I think the longer the game goes the more I can't be a wolf, if I don't go over here today and Santy is town I expect the dialog tomorrow to be "HK was protected, kill him then kill on the santy wagon" but like I've shown today that I'm not someone worth protecting. I haven't participated, haven't solved, haven't done much of anything at all.

Partially b/c I'm lazy and bad, partially because I scored a PS5, and partially because it stops the narrative of "HK was protected" because again, haven't done shit to protect, there's no reason. The wolf team, if I am a wolf, should have been busing me from D2 onward, even D1 after my outburst.

which would indicate to me that either Santy is a hit OR Santy is the "protect risiinq" wagon.

Now if Santy is NOT a hit I think it's more likely that risiinq IS a hit AND ALSO that there's a wolf on the Santy wagon, of which Sabi makes the least sense (watch it be sabi), then Porscha, then probs a tossup between neon/lily, neither of which I really have a read on.

If Santy IS a hit I'm torn. On the one hand having a wolf there makes sense, and it might be Neon then. But having a wolf be off wagon is also fine here as the "off wagon" is the policy chop that's been hanging on for days now.

UGH. I don't think you can say anything concrete if Santy is a hit. I think you can if Santy isn't a hit.

If Santy is a hit I do not think there are two wolves on my wagon. Which I said above.

game is hard, mafia is dumb, etc etc

why you don't shut down sabi if they are town:

1. Nobody is listening to Sabi. They file Sabi away into a "town but" box and forget about them until it's needed to pull them out of it.
Sabi has the most posts of anyone in the thread and honestly the least amount of pull outside of me and TSP. Nobody is really following Sabis pushes, unless they are consensus, and nobody for sure is following their defenses. See Jack going over and me leading today.

2. Sabi is highly likely wrong on where the wolf team is. If Sabi were right about any of the wolf team, or were not protecting the wolf team in some way, Sabi would be dead. Instead Sabi is, like I said in point 1, mostly ineffectual, but also pointint in the wrong directions. Sabi also does not appear to be doing wholescale reevaulations of the game and their view on it, until today starts. The wolf team can play the odds Sabi doesn't re-evaluate and instead falls deeper into the "spam things and despair" gameplay they're exhibiting the last two days

3. Sabi and HK form an Alignment Confirmation duo. Inverse of the Difference Check, an Alignment Confirmation is functionally this: When HK flips town Sabi is functionally confirmed town. I've hard town read Sabi for days, and Sabi has been in the "HK is town" corner for days as well. If Sabi is a wolf today is the day Sabi needs to turn the corner, and Sabi needs to start doing it sooner rather than later, so that the HK chop is cemented AND so that Sabis pivot into HK wolfing isn't called into question in the coming max 2 game days.
Likewise, Sabi flipping town functionally confirms HK as town for the same reason. You can't simultaneously argue "HK kills his wolf readers" and also "HK kills his town readers" in the same breath, or even the same game day. It's a juxtaposition that can't be reasonably held.

I was gonna find more reasons from quotes about wolfy things HK has done but there's so much bullshit I'm just gonna quote these two and talk about some of it

A ton of HK's solving posts this game have been meandering longer posts with little conclusion and only the veneer of solving, mostly for self defense. Read the top post and tell me what comes of it. The first half is just him giving reasons why he can't be a wolf, none of which hold up, and the second half is words masquerading as thoughts that does nothing productive in the end. How many times has HK given a definitive wolf read? 90% of the time it's been these things like "I dunno" or just a random PoE put together. The only times he's given an actual wolf read of someone it's not held up at all imo and has mostly been things like nit-picking Risiinq when she was killable, Santy when he was, or Neon earlier and camping it out without much thought. Neon today specifically I don't think someone can believe like HK has considering everything she's posted this game.

The second post shows more of this, how it's mostly just a veneer and self defense. HK says Sabi is wrong on the wolf team so hasn't died, but never cares to extrapolate on actual wolf reads from this. I know this is something he's done a ton this game and I was gonna find more examples but I just can't be bothered to read through his ISO to do that. The first quote is another one, at least. Then the 3rd point which is sorta valid from the perspective that him town makes Sabi more town, in that she's been defending him, but the inverse is literally just not true like how he tries to make it out to be. Sabi correctly town reading HK isn't a reason she doesn't die, that's a reason for her TO die and is directly related to point 2 in his own post (if she was correct, she would be killed), but he's not trying to put these things together, he's writing all his solving so he can get people off his back. Almost everything he's written this game has felt like that imo

[Lilypetal]

lily is your solve then Sabi/TSP after I flip town or are you planning on re-evaluating?

if u flip w i probably kill porscha tomorrow

[Esooa]

Oh, and, another thing, when I poke him on this earlier, I don't think his PoE can make sense, give actual wolves, like that he should be thinking more about TSP or caring more about me, he just doesn't. He doesn't try to solve or think about things or wolf read people that aren't convenient for him, he just uncaringly threw his vote away. I really can't see HK caring about solving at all this game

[Lilypetal]

btw if you guys are confused about the toxic gamestate, i'm almost certain it's just a jack wolf world and we're all sitting here twiddling our thumbs getting pissy with one another because the reality is that today really just needed a short day to hammer obvious jack wolf. all mafia players devolve into lunatic degeneracy when they are left to their own devices for too long (see: asmr and dizzy win)

@Sabiplz

What thinks you of Nanook?

He's null. His tunnel on HK is towny but he hasn't town told.

Why is it towny?

How have I not town told

Most of your content is just tunneling hk.

You haven't really tried to solve other slots with much effort.

I think I've been sufficiently townie

sufficiently is a bit strong imo

honestly a good portion of why I am leaving lily and esooa in my poe is exactly because of how they have interacted with each other, which is strong TR's for a long time. I am more suspicious because I don't particularly trust lily. it's possible it is not w/w, solid chance it's v/w w/v, but I don't think it's v/v.

I really haven't seen anything from you explaining what you don't like from Lily other than "a few posts sound icky" which I mean, I don't agree, so like

Yeah I'm sure you dont agree. You probably wouldnt even if I showed examples

can u show me examples? i dont see what you think is wolfy abt me and i townread you pretty strongly so im beginning to think im wrong

Wrong about what

[Esooa]

Also another thing about Mac/HK is like, HK never really picked up that much traction. Achro pointed out from Mac's PoV really good reasons to town read HK and it very clearly made Mac falter a bit, I can even quote these if people don't remember. It was about the thing Porscha quoted from me earlier in her ISO post. But once that was pointed out, Mac doesn't switch, he did temporarily, but then was back to HK. So like Porscha asked earlier, what is the point of this? If Mac was trying to push over a town, like he would be if HK was town, he has way way better options that he steers off of to push HK. It's not natural and imo it doesn't make sense as Mac/HK w/v

[Porscha]

@Porscha What is your solve as well

I guess same as before. most likely esooa/lily/tsp/hk

[Porscha]

lily is your solve then Sabi/TSP after I flip town or are you planning on re-evaluating?

if u flip w i probably kill porscha tomorrow

wow it's almost like I made 700 word posts on this exact thing in advance nobody could be assed to read. nice. very poggers

[Porscha]

lily is your solve then Sabi/TSP after I flip town or are you planning on re-evaluating?

if u flip w i probably kill porscha tomorrow

wow it's almost like I made 700 word posts on this exact thing in advance nobody could be assed to read. nice. very poggers

I have explicitly stated that my read is if hk does flip wolf, his teammate is bussing or has bussed or is willing to bus. I'm most clearly, out of everyone here except tsp who also isn't voting hk and said that hk might not be wolf, the option that sticks out like a sore thumb when hk flips wolf. I do not fear this world because i do not have have tmi. I am unsure of hk's alignment. if I had tmi, I am bussing. I'm not leaving myself out to dry looking like the one idiot who hard defended hk on multiple occasions just for him to flip wolf because now the entire point of getting hk deep has gone out the window when he flips and I immediately flip next day. the solve of me being wolf after hk flip is level 1 and I'd like you to read this argument this time instead of skipping it because despite nothing happening most of the day, you couldn't be assed to read my long interaction with neon where I went through all of this already.

[Porscha]

Also another thing about Mac/HK is like, HK never really picked up that much traction. Achro pointed out from Mac's PoV really good reasons to town read HK and it very clearly made Mac falter a bit, I can even quote these if people don't remember. It was about the thing Porscha quoted from me earlier in her ISO post. But once that was pointed out, Mac doesn't switch, he did temporarily, but then was back to HK. So like Porscha asked earlier, what is the point of this? If Mac was trying to push over a town, like he would be if HK was town, he has way way better options that he steers off of to push HK. It's not natural and imo it doesn't make sense as Mac/HK w/v

yeah that's a good point

[Porscha]

@Porscha

Would you consider yourself out of your wolfrange? I see other ppl saying it but I want your opinion

probably. i've wolfed very little

[Esooa]

@Porscha do you think Neon can be a wolf still? And how come?

yes, I think it's possible, however, I think the read is not formed particularly well because I remember so little from earlier in the game. I can maybe see a world where neon/hk are wolves and neon insisted on pushing back on my read that I strongly believe that if hk is wolf, his partner has been bussing or willing to bus at any given moment because otherwise they would stick out like a sore thumb. she could argue against this if it were true because it would mean it leaves her in my poe and wants to prove (perhaps lead into a poe) that someone like me, sabi, and tsp who have been off hk wagon today could still be his wolf partners.

This is my first game with neon - she was vehemently against my push on her regarding her change in wim when it came to yesterday where we lynched santy and I dropped it, because ultimately (especially for me with no meta), the subject of wim change is ... not necessarily productive in providing a read. it was only giving me ate to work with.

I worry that neon can flip a switch and go from floating in thread with relatively light presence to creating very convincing posts that include world building around something that... could be true. It's a large part in reason why I went onto santy yesterday, and really her only response to the flip was, "well I was wrong. so what" and when the wim of those posts is questioned, it's "well wim is AI for me but the subject of wim is NAI anyway so this is pointless."

her tone in the conversation her and I had yesterday was relatively towny. she ended with the, "well I didn't *really* think you're wolf but I have to keep my options open and I think this helped me see that you are more likely town. if you're town, I really need you here." It's something a good wolf could fake to make me feel comradery with her while still moving the needle on my slot (I think she had little choice but to do this because I was grilling her so hard on every little fucking thing and to try and triple down on a lot of it as me putting it out as manipulation / wolf tactics would be extremely hard for anyone to do and it would put a lot more attention on her slot b/c the reality is that I *am* strongly TR'd) while still... maybe leaving a little room for a lylo situation where she walks the read back on me to possible wolf.

oh I just saw this for some reason

I guess I can see the flipping a switch thing but to me that's way more easily explained by a towny motivated by thinking they have something than a wolf deciding to do that and most of what she's been saying lines up well with that too internally imo. I don't really think a wolf sees the payoff of that as worthwhile. It's a lot of effort and if she's intending to bus HK like she would be if she is today then it's a weird move to do that the day before then kill HK today like you're saying

[Lilypetal]

lily is your solve then Sabi/TSP after I flip town or are you planning on re-evaluating?

if u flip w i probably kill porscha tomorrow

wow it's almost like I made 700 word posts on this exact thing in advance nobody could be assed to read. nice. very poggers

I have explicitly stated that my read is if hk does flip wolf, his teammate is bussing or has bussed or is willing to bus. I'm most clearly, out of everyone here except tsp who also isn't voting hk and said that hk might not be wolf, the option that sticks out like a sore thumb when hk flips wolf. I do not fear this world because i do not have have tmi. I am unsure of hk's alignment. if I had tmi, I am bussing. I'm not leaving myself out to dry looking like the one idiot who hard defended hk on multiple occasions just for him to flip wolf because now the entire point of getting hk deep has gone out the window when he flips and I immediately flip next day. the solve of me being wolf after hk flip is level 1 and I'd like you to read this argument this time instead of skipping it because despite nothing happening most of the day, you couldn't be assed to read my long interaction with neon where I went through all of this already.

i have read every post in this game that doesn't mean i remember them all

[Porscha]

@Porscha

Would you consider yourself out of your wolfrange? I see other ppl saying it but I want your opinion

probably. i've wolfed very little

like besides third wolf partner getting mod killed day 1 I was caught on a perspective slip day 1 trying to make a stupid read. if I've made it this far with essays of posting and nobody has caught any slips, then it leads me to believe that if i'm wolf this game, I sucked ass last time I wolfed and I have quickly and suddenly changed into a god. doubt it's that scenario

[Porscha]

lily is your solve then Sabi/TSP after I flip town or are you planning on re-evaluating?

if u flip w i probably kill porscha tomorrow

wow it's almost like I made 700 word posts on this exact thing in advance nobody could be assed to read. nice. very poggers

I have explicitly stated that my read is if hk does flip wolf, his teammate is bussing or has bussed or is willing to bus. I'm most clearly, out of everyone here except tsp who also isn't voting hk and said that hk might not be wolf, the option that sticks out like a sore thumb when hk flips wolf. I do not fear this world because i do not have have tmi. I am unsure of hk's alignment. if I had tmi, I am bussing. I'm not leaving myself out to dry looking like the one idiot who hard defended hk on multiple occasions just for him to flip wolf because now the entire point of getting hk deep has gone out the window when he flips and I immediately flip next day. the solve of me being wolf after hk flip is level 1 and I'd like you to read this argument this time instead of skipping it because despite nothing happening most of the day, you couldn't be assed to read my long interaction with neon where I went through all of this already.

i have read every post in this game that doesn't mean i remember them all

well I hope this helps you remember

[Esooa]

lily is your solve then Sabi/TSP after I flip town or are you planning on re-evaluating?

if u flip w i probably kill porscha tomorrow

wow it's almost like I made 700 word posts on this exact thing in advance nobody could be assed to read. nice. very poggers

I have explicitly stated that my read is if hk does flip wolf, his teammate is bussing or has bussed or is willing to bus. I'm most clearly, out of everyone here except tsp who also isn't voting hk and said that hk might not be wolf, the option that sticks out like a sore thumb when hk flips wolf. I do not fear this world because i do not have have tmi. I am unsure of hk's alignment. if I had tmi, I am bussing. I'm not leaving myself out to dry looking like the one idiot who hard defended hk on multiple occasions just for him to flip wolf because now the entire point of getting hk deep has gone out the window when he flips and I immediately flip next day. the solve of me being wolf after hk flip is level 1 and I'd like you to read this argument this time instead of skipping it because despite nothing happening most of the day, you couldn't be assed to read my long interaction with neon where I went through all of this already.

okay ya but also this applies like doubly to TSP who has literally nothing going for him honestly lmao. Like defending HK with two posts then disappearing I think he knows is just asking to die. Also I kinda thought TSP earlier when he asked me specifically to think about HK was towny

[Porscha]

@Porscha do you think Neon can be a wolf still? And how come?

yes, I think it's possible, however, I think the read is not formed particularly well because I remember so little from earlier in the game. I can maybe see a world where neon/hk are wolves and neon insisted on pushing back on my read that I strongly believe that if hk is wolf, his partner has been bussing or willing to bus at any given moment because otherwise they would stick out like a sore thumb. she could argue against this if it were true because it would mean it leaves her in my poe and wants to prove (perhaps lead into a poe) that someone like me, sabi, and tsp who have been off hk wagon today could still be his wolf partners.

This is my first game with neon - she was vehemently against my push on her regarding her change in wim when it came to yesterday where we lynched santy and I dropped it, because ultimately (especially for me with no meta), the subject of wim change is ... not necessarily productive in providing a read. it was only giving me ate to work with.

I worry that neon can flip a switch and go from floating in thread with relatively light presence to creating very convincing posts that include world building around something that... could be true. It's a large part in reason why I went onto santy yesterday, and really her only response to the flip was, "well I was wrong. so what" and when the wim of those posts is questioned, it's "well wim is AI for me but the subject of wim is NAI anyway so this is pointless."

her tone in the conversation her and I had yesterday was relatively towny. she ended with the, "well I didn't *really* think you're wolf but I have to keep my options open and I think this helped me see that you are more likely town. if you're town, I really need you here." It's something a good wolf could fake to make me feel comradery with her while still moving the needle on my slot (I think she had little choice but to do this because I was grilling her so hard on every little fucking thing and to try and triple down on a lot of it as me putting it out as manipulation / wolf tactics would be extremely hard for anyone to do and it would put a lot more attention on her slot b/c the reality is that I *am* strongly TR'd) while still... maybe leaving a little room for a lylo situation where she walks the read back on me to possible wolf.

oh I just saw this for some reason

I guess I can see the flipping a switch thing but to me that's way more easily explained by a towny motivated by thinking they have something than a wolf deciding to do that and most of what she's been saying lines up well with that too internally imo. I don't really think a wolf sees the payoff of that as worthwhile. It's a lot of effort and if she's intending to bus HK like she would be if she is today then it's a weird move to do that the day before then kill HK today like you're saying

why is getting rid of santy the day before flipping her theoretical wolf partner who will inevitably be flipped before lylo weird? ftr I do think it's more likely that santy argument came from town as well.

[Porscha]

lily is your solve then Sabi/TSP after I flip town or are you planning on re-evaluating?

if u flip w i probably kill porscha tomorrow

wow it's almost like I made 700 word posts on this exact thing in advance nobody could be assed to read. nice. very poggers

I have explicitly stated that my read is if hk does flip wolf, his teammate is bussing or has bussed or is willing to bus. I'm most clearly, out of everyone here except tsp who also isn't voting hk and said that hk might not be wolf, the option that sticks out like a sore thumb when hk flips wolf. I do not fear this world because i do not have have tmi. I am unsure of hk's alignment. if I had tmi, I am bussing. I'm not leaving myself out to dry looking like the one idiot who hard defended hk on multiple occasions just for him to flip wolf because now the entire point of getting hk deep has gone out the window when he flips and I immediately flip next day. the solve of me being wolf after hk flip is level 1 and I'd like you to read this argument this time instead of skipping it because despite nothing happening most of the day, you couldn't be assed to read my long interaction with neon where I went through all of this already.

okay ya but also this applies like doubly to TSP who has literally nothing going for him honestly lmao. Like defending HK with two posts then disappearing I think he knows is just asking to die. Also I kinda thought TSP earlier when he asked me specifically to think about HK was towny

right. I don't know if tsp bothers making this play if he is informed. but he subbed into helluva slot and if i were him i'd read like an hour's worth of stuff and give baby reads like he has as well

[Esooa]

@Porscha do you think Neon can be a wolf still? And how come?

yes, I think it's possible, however, I think the read is not formed particularly well because I remember so little from earlier in the game. I can maybe see a world where neon/hk are wolves and neon insisted on pushing back on my read that I strongly believe that if hk is wolf, his partner has been bussing or willing to bus at any given moment because otherwise they would stick out like a sore thumb. she could argue against this if it were true because it would mean it leaves her in my poe and wants to prove (perhaps lead into a poe) that someone like me, sabi, and tsp who have been off hk wagon today could still be his wolf partners.

This is my first game with neon - she was vehemently against my push on her regarding her change in wim when it came to yesterday where we lynched santy and I dropped it, because ultimately (especially for me with no meta), the subject of wim change is ... not necessarily productive in providing a read. it was only giving me ate to work with.

I worry that neon can flip a switch and go from floating in thread with relatively light presence to creating very convincing posts that include world building around something that... could be true. It's a large part in reason why I went onto santy yesterday, and really her only response to the flip was, "well I was wrong. so what" and when the wim of those posts is questioned, it's "well wim is AI for me but the subject of wim is NAI anyway so this is pointless."

her tone in the conversation her and I had yesterday was relatively towny. she ended with the, "well I didn't *really* think you're wolf but I have to keep my options open and I think this helped me see that you are more likely town. if you're town, I really need you here." It's something a good wolf could fake to make me feel comradery with her while still moving the needle on my slot (I think she had little choice but to do this because I was grilling her so hard on every little fucking thing and to try and triple down on a lot of it as me putting it out as manipulation / wolf tactics would be extremely hard for anyone to do and it would put a lot more attention on her slot b/c the reality is that I *am* strongly TR'd) while still... maybe leaving a little room for a lylo situation where she walks the read back on me to possible wolf.

oh I just saw this for some reason

I guess I can see the flipping a switch thing but to me that's way more easily explained by a towny motivated by thinking they have something than a wolf deciding to do that and most of what she's been saying lines up well with that too internally imo. I don't really think a wolf sees the payoff of that as worthwhile. It's a lot of effort and if she's intending to bus HK like she would be if she is today then it's a weird move to do that the day before then kill HK today like you're saying

why is getting rid of santy the day before flipping her theoretical wolf partner who will inevitably be flipped before lylo weird? ftr I do think it's more likely that santy argument came from town as well.

Because if you're willing to bus like that, the thing you think of before bussing isn't "I'm going to possibly remove any credit I can get for this by forcing a town to die before my partner does" I'd figure

[hollowkatt]

NONE OF THIS IS SUPPORTED BY ANYTHING I LOOKED FOR BECAUSE I LOOKED FOR NOTHING

current votes:

Santy: neon, porscha, sabi, lily
HK: santy, esooa, risiing
risiinq: HK

does it make MORE sense if two wolves are on me saying "hk is wolf and even if not he has to die" or does it make LESS sense?

I think the longer the game goes the more I can't be a wolf, if I don't go over here today and Santy is town I expect the dialog tomorrow to be "HK was protected, kill him then kill on the santy wagon" but like I've shown today that I'm not someone worth protecting. I haven't participated, haven't solved, haven't done much of anything at all.

Partially b/c I'm lazy and bad, partially because I scored a PS5, and partially because it stops the narrative of "HK was protected" because again, haven't done shit to protect, there's no reason. The wolf team, if I am a wolf, should have been busing me from D2 onward, even D1 after my outburst.

which would indicate to me that either Santy is a hit OR Santy is the "protect risiinq" wagon.

Now if Santy is NOT a hit I think it's more likely that risiinq IS a hit AND ALSO that there's a wolf on the Santy wagon, of which Sabi makes the least sense (watch it be sabi), then Porscha, then probs a tossup between neon/lily, neither of which I really have a read on.

If Santy IS a hit I'm torn. On the one hand having a wolf there makes sense, and it might be Neon then. But having a wolf be off wagon is also fine here as the "off wagon" is the policy chop that's been hanging on for days now.

UGH. I don't think you can say anything concrete if Santy is a hit. I think you can if Santy isn't a hit.

If Santy is a hit I do not think there are two wolves on my wagon. Which I said above.

game is hard, mafia is dumb, etc etc

why you don't shut down sabi if they are town:

1. Nobody is listening to Sabi. They file Sabi away into a "town but" box and forget about them until it's needed to pull them out of it.
Sabi has the most posts of anyone in the thread and honestly the least amount of pull outside of me and TSP. Nobody is really following Sabis pushes, unless they are consensus, and nobody for sure is following their defenses. See Jack going over and me leading today.

2. Sabi is highly likely wrong on where the wolf team is. If Sabi were right about any of the wolf team, or were not protecting the wolf team in some way, Sabi would be dead. Instead Sabi is, like I said in point 1, mostly ineffectual, but also pointint in the wrong directions. Sabi also does not appear to be doing wholescale reevaulations of the game and their view on it, until today starts. The wolf team can play the odds Sabi doesn't re-evaluate and instead falls deeper into the "spam things and despair" gameplay they're exhibiting the last two days

3. Sabi and HK form an Alignment Confirmation duo. Inverse of the Difference Check, an Alignment Confirmation is functionally this: When HK flips town Sabi is functionally confirmed town. I've hard town read Sabi for days, and Sabi has been in the "HK is town" corner for days as well. If Sabi is a wolf today is the day Sabi needs to turn the corner, and Sabi needs to start doing it sooner rather than later, so that the HK chop is cemented AND so that Sabis pivot into HK wolfing isn't called into question in the coming max 2 game days.
Likewise, Sabi flipping town functionally confirms HK as town for the same reason. You can't simultaneously argue "HK kills his wolf readers" and also "HK kills his town readers" in the same breath, or even the same game day. It's a juxtaposition that can't be reasonably held.

I was gonna find more reasons from quotes about wolfy things HK has done but there's so much bullshit I'm just gonna quote these two and talk about some of it

A ton of HK's solving posts this game have been meandering longer posts with little conclusion and only the veneer of solving, mostly for self defense. Read the top post and tell me what comes of it. The first half is just him giving reasons why he can't be a wolf, none of which hold up, and the second half is words masquerading as thoughts that does nothing productive in the end. How many times has HK given a definitive wolf read? 90% of the time it's been these things like "I dunno" or just a random PoE put together. The only times he's given an actual wolf read of someone it's not held up at all imo and has mostly been things like nit-picking Risiinq when she was killable, Santy when he was, or Neon earlier and camping it out without much thought. Neon today specifically I don't think someone can believe like HK has considering everything she's posted this game.

The second post shows more of this, how it's mostly just a veneer and self defense. HK says Sabi is wrong on the wolf team so hasn't died, but never cares to extrapolate on actual wolf reads from this. I know this is something he's done a ton this game and I was gonna find more examples but I just can't be bothered to read through his ISO to do that. The first quote is another one, at least. Then the 3rd point which is sorta valid from the perspective that him town makes Sabi more town, in that she's been defending him, but the inverse is literally just not true like how he tries to make it out to be. Sabi correctly town reading HK isn't a reason she doesn't die, that's a reason for her TO die and is directly related to point 2 in his own post (if she was correct, she would be killed), but he's not trying to put these things together, he's writing all his solving so he can get people off his back. Almost everything he's written this game has felt like that imo

I cannot wait for you to go "oops I was wrong"

[Porscha]

Why would a wolf defend mac in that scenario? Make it make sense to me

by that logic HK is never wolf then because nobody defended mac harder than HK did day 2, despite mac saying he needed to be voted off for being day 1 counter wagon. make it make sense to me.

HK literally is the one in the position to not want Mac to die because Mac was pushing on him to bus him and Mac dying is awful in that scenario as literally I've said, Achro said day 2, nanook was saying all game, and on top of that Neon's play around it was way more believable and emotion after, and even despite that, call it a wash and HK has been turbo wolfy all game

yeah I think this scenario is the strongest reason I have to SR hk

[Lilypetal]

this is hard lol i see what porscha means but going through her iso she like wolfsides pretty much this entire game

[Lilypetal]

i am not free of sin either but it's like constant

[Esooa]

this is hard lol i see what porscha means but going through her iso she like wolfsides pretty much this entire game

if you can quote it that'd be helpful cause I can't rly be bothered to ISO so much rn

[Esooa]

NONE OF THIS IS SUPPORTED BY ANYTHING I LOOKED FOR BECAUSE I LOOKED FOR NOTHING

current votes:

Santy: neon, porscha, sabi, lily
HK: santy, esooa, risiing
risiinq: HK

does it make MORE sense if two wolves are on me saying "hk is wolf and even if not he has to die" or does it make LESS sense?

I think the longer the game goes the more I can't be a wolf, if I don't go over here today and Santy is town I expect the dialog tomorrow to be "HK was protected, kill him then kill on the santy wagon" but like I've shown today that I'm not someone worth protecting. I haven't participated, haven't solved, haven't done much of anything at all.

Partially b/c I'm lazy and bad, partially because I scored a PS5, and partially because it stops the narrative of "HK was protected" because again, haven't done shit to protect, there's no reason. The wolf team, if I am a wolf, should have been busing me from D2 onward, even D1 after my outburst.

which would indicate to me that either Santy is a hit OR Santy is the "protect risiinq" wagon.

Now if Santy is NOT a hit I think it's more likely that risiinq IS a hit AND ALSO that there's a wolf on the Santy wagon, of which Sabi makes the least sense (watch it be sabi), then Porscha, then probs a tossup between neon/lily, neither of which I really have a read on.

If Santy IS a hit I'm torn. On the one hand having a wolf there makes sense, and it might be Neon then. But having a wolf be off wagon is also fine here as the "off wagon" is the policy chop that's been hanging on for days now.

UGH. I don't think you can say anything concrete if Santy is a hit. I think you can if Santy isn't a hit.

If Santy is a hit I do not think there are two wolves on my wagon. Which I said above.

game is hard, mafia is dumb, etc etc

why you don't shut down sabi if they are town:

1. Nobody is listening to Sabi. They file Sabi away into a "town but" box and forget about them until it's needed to pull them out of it.
Sabi has the most posts of anyone in the thread and honestly the least amount of pull outside of me and TSP. Nobody is really following Sabis pushes, unless they are consensus, and nobody for sure is following their defenses. See Jack going over and me leading today.

2. Sabi is highly likely wrong on where the wolf team is. If Sabi were right about any of the wolf team, or were not protecting the wolf team in some way, Sabi would be dead. Instead Sabi is, like I said in point 1, mostly ineffectual, but also pointint in the wrong directions. Sabi also does not appear to be doing wholescale reevaulations of the game and their view on it, until today starts. The wolf team can play the odds Sabi doesn't re-evaluate and instead falls deeper into the "spam things and despair" gameplay they're exhibiting the last two days

3. Sabi and HK form an Alignment Confirmation duo. Inverse of the Difference Check, an Alignment Confirmation is functionally this: When HK flips town Sabi is functionally confirmed town. I've hard town read Sabi for days, and Sabi has been in the "HK is town" corner for days as well. If Sabi is a wolf today is the day Sabi needs to turn the corner, and Sabi needs to start doing it sooner rather than later, so that the HK chop is cemented AND so that Sabis pivot into HK wolfing isn't called into question in the coming max 2 game days.
Likewise, Sabi flipping town functionally confirms HK as town for the same reason. You can't simultaneously argue "HK kills his wolf readers" and also "HK kills his town readers" in the same breath, or even the same game day. It's a juxtaposition that can't be reasonably held.

I was gonna find more reasons from quotes about wolfy things HK has done but there's so much bullshit I'm just gonna quote these two and talk about some of it

A ton of HK's solving posts this game have been meandering longer posts with little conclusion and only the veneer of solving, mostly for self defense. Read the top post and tell me what comes of it. The first half is just him giving reasons why he can't be a wolf, none of which hold up, and the second half is words masquerading as thoughts that does nothing productive in the end. How many times has HK given a definitive wolf read? 90% of the time it's been these things like "I dunno" or just a random PoE put together. The only times he's given an actual wolf read of someone it's not held up at all imo and has mostly been things like nit-picking Risiinq when she was killable, Santy when he was, or Neon earlier and camping it out without much thought. Neon today specifically I don't think someone can believe like HK has considering everything she's posted this game.

The second post shows more of this, how it's mostly just a veneer and self defense. HK says Sabi is wrong on the wolf team so hasn't died, but never cares to extrapolate on actual wolf reads from this. I know this is something he's done a ton this game and I was gonna find more examples but I just can't be bothered to read through his ISO to do that. The first quote is another one, at least. Then the 3rd point which is sorta valid from the perspective that him town makes Sabi more town, in that she's been defending him, but the inverse is literally just not true like how he tries to make it out to be. Sabi correctly town reading HK isn't a reason she doesn't die, that's a reason for her TO die and is directly related to point 2 in his own post (if she was correct, she would be killed), but he's not trying to put these things together, he's writing all his solving so he can get people off his back. Almost everything he's written this game has felt like that imo

I cannot wait for you to go "oops I was wrong"

Also posts like this don't rly help it lol. You keep trying to insinuate if I was town I'd be doing better here like you said earlier, but then when I push you more you have no reaction to it as far as it being wolfy, and you've never cared to highlight it to the thread. Where is your care about finding wolves? I don't see how you can care to write up 4 paragraph meandering posts but not point out things as they are right in front of you

[Lilypetal]

Let the record show I am strongly anti HK flip today and if he goes over and was town I am viciously scumhunting in the voters, wolves feel free to remove your votes now in advance

what HK has done today in the past 24 hours:

Make a post with the contradicting premises that btw, even if you say something like "he was just conflicted cause it should mean they were town but he wolf read them," then where is the conflict? Cause to me that post doesn't read like he's conflicted by it at all, it reads like he's trying to justify that fact to the thread

Omgus me for wolf reading it

Omgus everyone else afterwards

Self vote and leave

HK when he's a towny is way more inquisitive imo but the way he handled all that stuff felt more like shutting it down imo

Maybe he sucks and I'm stupid but I usually catch wolf HK pretty quick and I'm just not landing these pokeballs right now so it is what it is

[hollowkatt]

lily is your solve then Sabi/TSP after I flip town or are you planning on re-evaluating?

if u flip w i probably kill porscha tomorrow

lol you think porscha has TMI on my alignment and that's why she's defending me?

[Lilypetal]

Let the record show I am strongly anti HK flip today and if he goes over and was town I am viciously scumhunting in the voters, wolves feel free to remove your votes now in advance

what HK has done today in the past 24 hours:

Make a post with the contradicting premises that btw, even if you say something like "he was just conflicted cause it should mean they were town but he wolf read them," then where is the conflict? Cause to me that post doesn't read like he's conflicted by it at all, it reads like he's trying to justify that fact to the thread

Omgus me for wolf reading it

Omgus everyone else afterwards

Self vote and leave

HK when he's a towny is way more inquisitive imo but the way he handled all that stuff felt more like shutting it down imo

Maybe he sucks and I'm stupid but I usually catch wolf HK pretty quick and I'm just not landing these pokeballs right now so it is what it is

Santy town

@Sabiplz

I disagree. My lawyer advise I not talk about him due to my death tunnel so I will decline to comment further.

So who will you look to go for going into eod

I don't like both ender and hk wagons so I might go to Jack or Achro or mac or stick to santy. Just don't like those two wagons.

I'm not big on ender wagon either but I'd rather ender over HK today. I do find it plausible that enders FE pact was an attempt at friendly pocketing from a wolf
I'd go santy over mac or achro or jack today

[Lilypetal]

lily is your solve then Sabi/TSP after I flip town or are you planning on re-evaluating?

if u flip w i probably kill porscha tomorrow

lol you think porscha has TMI on my alignment and that's why she's defending me?

howl elsewhere

[hollowkatt]

Oh, and, another thing, when I poke him on this earlier, I don't think his PoE can make sense, give actual wolves, like that he should be thinking more about TSP or caring more about me, he just doesn't. He doesn't try to solve or think about things or wolf read people that aren't convenient for him, he just uncaringly threw his vote away. I really can't see HK caring about solving at all this game

I fail to see a reason to wolf read me for something that's been clear since the shitshow on D1 but go off

[Lilypetal]

don't flash wagon neon jfc

hmm lmao

[Lilypetal]

do the townie thing and flash wagon esooa you plebs

do the townie thing and flash wagon esooa you plebs

This is the way

[Lilypetal]

wolf team is hk mac neon game is solved good night

reposting this for after i throw the game

[hollowkatt]

do the townie thing and flash wagon esooa you plebs

do the townie thing and flash wagon esooa you plebs

This is the way

I so desperately want this post to be good

[hollowkatt]

lily is your solve then Sabi/TSP after I flip town or are you planning on re-evaluating?

if u flip w i probably kill porscha tomorrow

lol you think porscha has TMI on my alignment and that's why she's defending me?

howl elsewhere

lol no go back to reads school

[Sabiplz]

Am I poe'd wtf