The Syndicate

If I had multiple possible targets, I would have floated one as a read and then tried to sneak in a kill on an unsuspecting mafia who freely claims the other.

If I had multiple possible targets, I would have floated one as a read and then tried to sneak in a kill on an unsuspecting mafia who freely claims the other.

okay that's just absurd ebwop remove three of those

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 4:21 pm The makeup of Tony's role, as it is described, seems wack.

Suppose a civilian gets this role. "You can kill Karen The Assassin's Creed Character on an odd night".

If Karen is a civilian, then than role is explicitly crippled. It has no purpose but to ruin the civilians; it is bastardized.

If Karen is a mafioso, then it's just a free kill without requiring any investigative work? Eh?

yep that's it I think it's kinda cool actually

ts account wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 4:22 pm
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 4:20 pm
ts account wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 4:18 pm Tony, who did you kill Night 1?
I have 1 character.
They are not dead yet. Therefore I have killed no one.
Maybe I do not understand how your role works. You have a given character name and you have the ability to kill them whenever?
What is the character name?

See JJJ's post for how it works. Not revealing the name because I have time and want to think through all possibilities.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 4:22 pm
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 4:19 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 4:17 pm
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 4:13 pm
JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 4:12 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 4:09 pm Might Tony be telling the truth?
If he is then Long Con is mafia and the game is over.
explain
why is funnygurl still in your poe?
JJJ's post says that if its not me then it's long con. I don't think it's Long Con. Therefore, it must be someone else. I think funnygurl has been wholly unbelievable.

I'm willing to accept that it's Long Con in place of Speed. I might be wrong and it's both of them. Unsure.
Why can't it be long con? Why isn't ts account named in this post?

I don't think it's lc and speed. I have an unhealthy amount of trust in life man.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 4:25 pm "I have an unhealthy amount of trust in life" seems odd coming from the guy who suspects the player with the most verifiable claim in the game right now.

in Mikey

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 4:25 pm "I'm going to give you an explicitly crippled role that can only kill a civilian in a game that opened at 9 vs. 4."

yeah I have balance questions as well.

ts account wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 4:25 pm
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 4:23 pm See JJJ's post for how it works. Not revealing the name because I have time and want to think through all possibilities.
I believe you should share the name you have.

To be honest I shared my character name and this is clearly a direct story thing so anyone who cared could have a really good idea. Desmond.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 4:31 pm @TonyStarkPrime to be clear:

Do you simply affirm that "yes, tonight I want to kill Karen"

Or do you have to name a player and hope that the player happens to be Karen?

The former

ts account wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 4:34 pm Note that, if Desmond is town, wolves achieve parity.

note that the only way this can be stopped if I’m scum is by lynching me over Epi.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 4:35 pm
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 4:33 pm
JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 4:31 pm @TonyStarkPrime to be clear:

Do you simply affirm that "yes, tonight I want to kill Karen"

Or do you have to name a player and hope that the player happens to be Karen?
The former
In a few words at least, tell me why Long Con is a civilian.

No one voted to save him day 1. Epi and Turnip treated the lynch as if they didn’t care. Maybe vote manipulation or some clever scum willing to risk it, and LC didn’t vote to save himself so if he had teammates they’d hardly be expected to do it, but can you imagine if a scum member were lynched or nearly lynched with not a single mafia member on him or the counter lynch? That only happens if the top two options are town.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 4:42 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 4:40 pm
JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 4:38 pm Someone tell me how Tony's claimed role makes any sense whatsoever for a civilian if Desmond is also a civilian -- especially in a 9 vs. 4 game
He has secondary abilities that provide him some utility in the event that he chooses not to kill Desmond.

Why does mafia tony make this convoluted claim?
@TonyStarkPrime confirm or deny secondary abilities.

POE was tightening around him. He is from HCRealms, where convoluted claims are a way of life.

Confirm existence of.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 4:45 pm
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 4:44 pm Confirm existence of.
At this point I think you're going to need to expand.

I’ve hinted to it. It’s underwhelming. As to your previous question, I’ll point out that Mac had a Vig shot that could only hit people with pirate ships, something which is currently looking to be very limited (and thus far solely town).

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 4:53 pm
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 4:49 pm
JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 4:45 pm
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 4:44 pm Confirm existence of.
At this point I think you're going to need to expand.
I’ve hinted to it. It’s underwhelming. As to your previous question, I’ll point out that Mac had a Vig shot that could only hit people with pirate ships, something which is currently looking to be very limited (and thus far solely town).
but if mac was killed on a night that he also killed then we know at least one mafia member must have a ship.

trust me i did too much research into this.

Yes and I maintain this didn’t happen.

Funnygurl555 wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 4:55 pm could you tell us your secondary abilities tsp?

no

Funnygurl555 wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 4:55 pm or at least tell us what you did n1 if you didn't try to kill

nothing.

ts account wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 4:56 pm
Funnygurl555 wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 4:55 pm could you tell us your secondary abilities tsp?
Yes. At this point, trying to hide the rest of your role will not help town prepare in the night.

JJJ- do you think it is time for a massclaim, then? Given... all this.

No

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 4:59 pm
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 4:54 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 4:53 pm
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 4:49 pm
JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 4:45 pm
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 4:44 pm Confirm existence of.
At this point I think you're going to need to expand.
I’ve hinted to it. It’s underwhelming. As to your previous question, I’ll point out that Mac had a Vig shot that could only hit people with pirate ships, something which is currently looking to be very limited (and thus far solely town).
but if mac was killed on a night that he also killed then we know at least one mafia member must have a ship.

trust me i did too much research into this.
Yes and I maintain this didn’t happen.
Why?

1) Mac thinks he’s getting killed night 1, he made sure of it. He used the power that night. How do we know? Largely we don’t, but it’s agreed that that makes more sense. It’s quite possible that Epi targeted him with an additional kill that night and failed, or just tried to block him. Epi also needs a reason to lie about his night 1 action. Maybe it’s so he can get counterclaimed by his teammate to secure an easy win, maybe it’s because he had more nefarious purposes. If Mac didn’t use the power it’s agreed he got very paranoid night 2 after being in BTSC with Ted for a day, which is almost confirmed. Then scum would have had to get lucky enough to target him with a pirate ship kill — and on current proportions it’s unlikely they have more than one— and he would have had to turned on someone in his towncore for no real reason.

It makes far more sense that mafia has a second kill power, something which I’d voiced suspicion of early because I am aware that there exists a fair amount of kills in this game.

Speed... didn’t actually vote for me?

I’m disappointed actually

Chances are then Speed is Desmond and also scum, correct?
Ooh cool idea: Desmond has the alternate power (can kill lucy on even nights) but then it’s only a cool mechanic if both are town and then someone just ends up dead

speedchuck wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 5:11 pm Tony seems a pretty obvious lynch tbh. If we don't we're boned.

linki: he told me he had a cop.
Sorry I'm quite behind.

I do have a cop

ts account wrote: ↑Tue Apr 07, 2020 11:40 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Apr 07, 2020 11:37 pm What if he wasn't confident enough in any of his reads to justify killing someone?
That should not be a real thought. A vigshot is simply a public cop check. It is always beneficial to use it if one is given to you (and funnygurl is right in her post, that night 1 seems more optimal to use it than night 2, if macdougall was indeed given the option).

I need to make longer posts the short ones cause too many whats

ts account wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 5:15 pm What does linki: mean, by the way? I have seen it a lot and I can not imagine what it could represent.

In response to the people who posted in between when I started writing and when I hit submit

nutella wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 5:15 pm This is so ridiculous holy shit

@speedchuck @TonyStarkPrime please just tell us if you are mafia so we all can stop feeling like idiots

I am not.
I encourage you to find a plausible world where I’m scum.

Funnygurl555 wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 5:19 pm
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 5:17 pm
nutella wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 5:15 pm This is so ridiculous holy shit

@speedchuck @TonyStarkPrime please just tell us if you are mafia so we all can stop feeling like idiots
I am not.
I encourage you to find a plausible world where I’m scum.
did you know that not contracting words when making a statement is a tell that you're lying

In that one episode of B99 it’s the opposite, isn’t it

speedchuck wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 5:12 pm Oh Tony can kill desmond specifically?

I'm not desmond.

Didn’t you already claim someone else

speedchuck wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 5:32 pm
Funnygurl555 wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 5:30 pm
speedchuck wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 5:29 pm
Funnygurl555 wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 5:28 pm
ts account wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 5:27 pm
Funnygurl555 wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 5:27 pm oooooooooooh, what if tony wants to know who desmond is because they have to know who's desmond to kill them?

we have mechanics like that on ffr
...I just said that.
oh oops

hahahahaha
Isn't that usually a 3P role though?
nah. it'd be a mechanic that incentivizes town to hide their roles
So a scumrole.

Yeah that would make a lot more sense.

alignments are distributed randomly to roles.

LC is gonna be so confused after he catches up

Long Con wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 5:46 pm
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 5:41 pm LC is gonna be so confused after he catches up
LOL why? So far a lot of the talk is about you using a specific-character-kill. I don't really get the confusion, maybe it's because you slowplayed the claim so much. I've seen that type of role as both town and Mafia aligned before, and it's not that uncomon.

look a normal person

Long Con wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 5:48 pm LOL ok I'm a bit confused. Tony says his role is to kill Desmond. He targets a player every odd night, and if they're Desmond, then they die. No?

no I take back the normal person thing

I suppose that would make more sense. In line with the anti monitor from GoC

nutella wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 5:49 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 5:48 pm LOL ok I'm a bit confused. Tony says his role is to kill Desmond. He targets a player every odd night, and if they're Desmond, then they die. No?
No, he said that he kills the role and he doesn't have to know who they are. If he's not lying about this, it's a very broken role.

I really don't think it's that good

nutella wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 5:52 pm
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 5:50 pm I suppose that would make more sense. In line with the anti monitor from GoC
So, that's what it really is, right? You were just messing with us?

no I don't have to know

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 5:53 pm
nutella wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 5:52 pm
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 5:50 pm I suppose that would make more sense. In line with the anti monitor from GoC
So, that's what it really is, right? You were just messing with us?
no I don't have to know

But they're functionally the same, right? I'm never reasonably choosing to kill someone without knowing who I'm hitting?

Long Con wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 5:53 pm Tony, you gonna use it tonight?

I'd really hope to have more information before I use it, but if it looks certain that I'll be lynched in two days if I don't then I really have no choice.

nutella wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 5:56 pm
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 5:55 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 5:53 pm Tony, you gonna use it tonight?
I'd really hope to have more information before I use it, but if it looks certain that I'll be lynched in two days if I don't then I really have no choice.
Well I guess we just have to hope that you're town and Desmond is mafia. Which to be fair is probably the version that would make the closest to some sense balance-wise I guess there's just like... a bit of a mindgame involved.

mind games are cool

Long Con wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 6:03 pm Is Nanook known for strange roles like that? My role is nowhere near as unusual.

did you see Mac's?

nutella wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 6:02 pm
speedchuck wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 6:00 pm
nutella wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 5:58 pm
speedchuck wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 5:56 pm
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 5:52 pm
nutella wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 5:49 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 5:48 pm LOL ok I'm a bit confused. Tony says his role is to kill Desmond. He targets a player every odd night, and if they're Desmond, then they die. No?
No, he said that he kills the role and he doesn't have to know who they are. If he's not lying about this, it's a very broken role.
I really don't think it's that good
Not if it's town targeting town or mafia targeting mafia.

The role is either a partial win button or unusable. I guess the question is whether it makes sense to change the game from hunting and reading players to wheedling for names to make sure you aren't shooting yourself in the foot.

So no, the role doesn't make sense to me, and the way it was revealed makes less sense.
Maybe the purpose of the role is just the mindgame itself
But that's not really mafia? A reward for guts with no counterplay or chance to it.

Might be getting too far off into game theory here, which is something I love. The question is, is Tony telling the truth, and is he town?
Well, my theory is that the point of this role was just to have this ridiculous discussion, and that Tony is not really supposed to use it at all.

this might be correct.

if there's a town doctor or something this could perhaps be simplified but I don't know if in this sort of situation you'd want to out the town doctor

Long Con wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 6:08 pm
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 6:05 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 6:03 pm Is Nanook known for strange roles like that? My role is nowhere near as unusual.
did you see Mac's?
That is a cool role. And unusual... and I want to steal it for my next game.

speedchuck wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 6:06 pm
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 6:05 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 6:03 pm Is Nanook known for strange roles like that? My role is nowhere near as unusual.
did you see Mac's?
Mac had an extremely limited (and targeted) kill paired with pretty good every other night protection, if I understand it. It was perfectly normal.

someone's lying

Long Con wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 6:09 pm
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 6:06 pm if there's a town doctor or something this could perhaps be simplified but I don't know if in this sort of situation you'd want to out the town doctor
This sounds wack. Huh?

doctor protects Desmond claim or at least threatens to

just pointing out the discrepancy

Funnygurl555 wrote: ↑Fri Apr 10, 2020 5:25 am
Long Con wrote: ↑Fri Apr 10, 2020 12:22 am
Funnygurl555 wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2020 9:35 pm
speedchuck wrote: ↑Sat Apr 04, 2020 8:56 am [VOTE: Long Con] aubergine

Today is super busy I'll catch up later.

But I maintain that self-votes are bad.
this is the best case of genuine distancing i have for speed and lc. this could've caught on. it really could've at the beginning of d2
I guess "genuine distancing" qualifies this in the way you intend it, but generally I see "distancing" as a term solely for use for two Mafia teammates. This is exonerating speedchuck for you?
i couldn't find a better way to phrase it at the time so i just let it go

you're right

this makes me feel eh.

That is, I agree with Nutella on LC's post. But FG, instead of answering the actual clarification question that LC sets up (which assumes that LC is scum?), instead agrees that the vocab was confusing.

I think we're fine to lynch Epi.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Fri Apr 10, 2020 11:39 am Can anyone who hasn’t shared a Team of 3 please do so? I’d like us all to be able to compare our results.

Epi speed LC first alt FG

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