The Syndicate

Sloonei wrote: ↑Fri Dec 01, 2017 11:50 pm
colonialbob wrote: ↑Fri Dec 01, 2017 11:44 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Fri Dec 01, 2017 11:35 pm
JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Fri Dec 01, 2017 8:48 pm If bob is a mafioso and Sloonei is a civilian, he was met with a challenging scenario after the Day 2 no lynch. Sloonei's general credit in the thread improved in that period, and then he made a big ISO for Bob himself. In this scenario, mafia Bob saw his attempted lynch target gain a strong foothold and then turn the sword against him in quick succession. I draw this image to facilitate a perspective of the post above wherein Bob assesses Sloonei's case against him -- that it started from a point of bias and wasn't alignment indicative. It strikes me as a necessary condition that for Sloonei to be susceptible to this bias, he must first be a civilian. A mafia Sloonei operates with a deliberate slant, not an pre-biased mindset. I don't care for this response. I described the challenge a mafia Bob would have faced handling Sloonei's ISO, and this response does bear an appearance of "I don't know what to do about this."
This point reignited my bob suspicion a little bit.
Ask Jack about Nightblue and why I'm skittish about going into ISOs with preconceived notions. (Tl;dr I recently got mislynched because of it and I'm still a little salty about it)
That's not my concern. The concern is, as Jay pointed out, that the premise which you labeled as "not alignment-indicative" would, in reality, have to be indicative of a town-aligned player. If I was giving into confirmation bias while ISOing you, that means I'm town, does it not?

Ohhhhh ok. So not alignment indicative - if Sloonei is town, his ISO started with the premise that I was bad and found reasons to believe so (confirmation bias). If he's mafia, his ISO started with the premise that I was bad and found reasons to believe so (because he's mafia and wants me to look bad). It's basically impossible to tell the difference because it's all in the motivation, the end behaviors look the same, and are thus not alignment-indicative.

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sat Dec 02, 2017 12:05 am
Kylemii wrote: ↑Fri Dec 01, 2017 2:26 pm Can I please request a link to a past game with a typical civvie Jay

Also while you're at it can I see a game with a baddie dunya, please
Jay once replaced into an HCRealms game and doubled the town's post count and found the whole mafia in one day phase. It was embarrassing.

(This story is actually true. L)

I modded that game and it was amazing (Sloonei was awesome too)

nutella wrote: ↑Sat Dec 02, 2017 12:20 am
Kylemii wrote: ↑Fri Dec 01, 2017 11:45 pm Jay's iso case posts read sincere to me.
I must say I strongly disagree. They look so, so fake to me. Either way, they will be interesting to consider once we know his alignment.

Intrigued. How so? Are you saying you don't see yourself moving off JJJ today?

speedchuck

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sat Dec 02, 2017 12:09 am
colonialbob wrote: ↑Sat Dec 02, 2017 12:07 am
Sloonei wrote: ↑Fri Dec 01, 2017 11:50 pm
colonialbob wrote: ↑Fri Dec 01, 2017 11:44 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Fri Dec 01, 2017 11:35 pm
JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Fri Dec 01, 2017 8:48 pm If bob is a mafioso and Sloonei is a civilian, he was met with a challenging scenario after the Day 2 no lynch. Sloonei's general credit in the thread improved in that period, and then he made a big ISO for Bob himself. In this scenario, mafia Bob saw his attempted lynch target gain a strong foothold and then turn the sword against him in quick succession. I draw this image to facilitate a perspective of the post above wherein Bob assesses Sloonei's case against him -- that it started from a point of bias and wasn't alignment indicative. It strikes me as a necessary condition that for Sloonei to be susceptible to this bias, he must first be a civilian. A mafia Sloonei operates with a deliberate slant, not an pre-biased mindset. I don't care for this response. I described the challenge a mafia Bob would have faced handling Sloonei's ISO, and this response does bear an appearance of "I don't know what to do about this."
This point reignited my bob suspicion a little bit.
Ask Jack about Nightblue and why I'm skittish about going into ISOs with preconceived notions. (Tl;dr I recently got mislynched because of it and I'm still a little salty about it)
That's not my concern. The concern is, as Jay pointed out, that the premise which you labeled as "not alignment-indicative" would, in reality, have to be indicative of a town-aligned player. If I was giving into confirmation bias while ISOing you, that means I'm town, does it not?
Ohhhhh ok. So not alignment indicative - if Sloonei is town, his ISO started with the premise that I was bad and found reasons to believe so (confirmation bias). If he's mafia, his ISO started with the premise that I was bad and found reasons to believe so (because he's mafia and wants me to look bad). It's basically impossible to tell the difference because it's all in the motivation, the end behaviors look the same, and are thus not alignment-indicative.
Do you currently think I'm town? what about jack?

Yes I feel quite good about you being town. Jack is still in my bottom half, want to ISO his stuff today/yesterday though as I got a generally better feeling and I want to see if there's real behind that or just gut.

Elohcin wrote: ↑Sat Dec 02, 2017 12:26 am Look at me voting alongside sloonei, another suspicion of mine. This game is so crazy. Fun, but crazy.

Why are you suspicious of Sloonei?

malakim2099 wrote: ↑Sat Dec 02, 2017 12:34 am MULTIQUOTE POST FOR THE WIN! Or at least, for the summary.

dunya wrote: ↑Fri Dec 01, 2017 6:49 pm Let's find replacements for them! Hey, anyone wanna read 76 pages of mafia?
I'm still working on it! Geez. I don't want to punt the the rest of it but I honestly don't know when I'll have TIME to read through everything.

tbh just read d3 onward and you'll get most of the important stuff. Enough to be fine I think.

Kylemii wrote: ↑Sat Dec 02, 2017 1:00 am
JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sat Dec 02, 2017 12:47 am
Kylemii wrote: ↑Sat Dec 02, 2017 12:43 am Now that you mention it it seems strange he's not focusing on people who could viably be lynched today.
There are two hours remaining. Nearly anyone can viably be lynched today. Given the freedom and total control, who would you lynch right now?
cbob or speedchuck or maybe DDL

you've got the most votes right now and I trust about half of your voters but I've felt sincerity in your posts and actions but Nutella is right that maybe that really actually your goal, did you respond to nutella's post about that?

what even is this post

Why do you lynch me or speedchuck or maybe ddl?

Spacedaisy wrote: ↑Sat Dec 02, 2017 1:13 am
colonialbob wrote: ↑Fri Dec 01, 2017 10:48 pm
Spacedaisy wrote: ↑Fri Dec 01, 2017 8:56 pm
Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Fri Dec 01, 2017 7:55 pm
dunya wrote: ↑Fri Dec 01, 2017 7:49 pm
Kylemii wrote: ↑Fri Dec 01, 2017 7:45 pm malakim2099 would you please do me a solid and describe your past mafia experience, to whatever extent you're comfortable with?
I suggest you take a look at the street fighter game: http://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/viewto ... alakim2099
He was scum here.
Your link is broken. You accidentally mentioned yourself while typing it.

Also the forum is trying to force me to mention you too. It has had this kind of bug for weeks now. Spacedaisy
When ever you try to quote a post that has an @mention in it, you have to delete the @mention to avoid that problem. Otherwise it sees the original @mention and gets confused.
Why is this not in red
Because I was responding as a Tech mod, not as a former player and because it was OT.

I know I was joking. Poorly, it seems.

CFD. For the fourth night in a row. No thanks I'll stick with speed.

speedchuck wrote: ↑Sat Dec 02, 2017 1:36 am
colonialbob wrote: ↑Sat Dec 02, 2017 1:33 am CFD. For the fourth night in a row. No thanks I'll stick with speed.
I am the CFD. Original was JJJ.

Wilgy is the CFD.

I like the people on JJJ much more, so I'm swtiching over. JJJ

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Sat Dec 02, 2017 6:17 am So guys. I need the people who do not like to sleep to provide me some info:

How big were those speedchuck and wilgy wagons?

Did they ever surpass, or threaten, the Jay lynch?

Who was on them, besides the people appearing in the poll?

When I switched over, I changed the lead from Speedchuck to JJJ. Jack, Mal, Kyle were still on speed.

EBWOP oh mal is still there heh.

I also think Wilgy might've been somewhere else? I know Epi/nutella/speed were on him for sure, and I thought Sloonei was too but if you weren't around at EoD it had to have been you.

[mention]Jackofhearts2005[/mention] I find it interesting you don't include LC or Eloh in your obviously bad list.

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sat Dec 02, 2017 10:43 am
colonialbob wrote: ↑Sat Dec 02, 2017 10:40 am Jackofhearts2005 I find it interesting you don't include LC or Eloh in your obviously bad list.
Why would I?

A vote for Wilgy is not the paragraph each of the others have.

I've never seen bad LC in this game and have heartread good Eloh for awhile.

Plus Eloh was Quin's attempted mislynch.

What about the speedchuck train?

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Sat Dec 02, 2017 10:44 am There was an attempt to save Jay last night. There are baddies among those. And there was a movement to bring the Jay lynch back to life that came near EoD. Those in it are civs. Once I'm back to town I'll try to piece it together. But if someone can do it for me I'll love you forever.

From what I recall, Epi brought it back, I was the vote that put JJJ back in the lead. I don't remember if it got down to 2 or only 3 before it came back.

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sat Dec 02, 2017 10:50 am
Sloonei wrote: ↑Sat Dec 02, 2017 10:41 am I voted for speedchuck to make reactions happen. I can't read him right now and wanted to talk about him.
I voted for Wilgy because I liked chuck's respinse. I still think Jay coukd have been putting distance between himself and teammate wilgy.
I voted for Jay because he was bad. Jack is tinfoiling hard against me.
Bullshit.

You were waffley. "I don't know what's going on."

Wilgy is not w/w with all the other baddies. Why would they push Wilgy early and stay there if he was their teammate? Why not just bus Jimmy?

I'd be more likely to believe you had a nervous tick that caused you to place bad votes than this.

He was also probably the second-biggest "JJJ is bad" voice behind Epi.

Sloonei did you move back to JJJ before or after I did?

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sat Dec 02, 2017 11:06 am
colonialbob wrote: ↑Sat Dec 02, 2017 11:05 am Sloonei did you move back to JJJ before or after I did?
I don't know. I was the 5th or 6th vote on him.
Initially I was the first.

Yeah I'm trying to figure out who was already there before me. I think you were 5th because I saw you, Epi, and nutella and liked that a lot more than jack, mal, kyle. Meaning it was DDL, speed, Epi, nutella, you on JJJ vs Eloh, Mal, LC, Jack, Kyle, myself on speed when I switched.

Thoughts before I'm out the rest of the day:
I'm almost positive one of the people who voted JJJ after me is mafia. Tinfoiling Jack real hard right now for this push on Sloonei.

Lean town on dunya. I think teammate JJJ is smart enough to not be the only vote on somebody with her.

One of Eloh/mal/LC is also likely mafia. Don't need to elaborate on the first two, Jack/LC feel slightly w/w but the D1 agreement is over the top if so.

Also feel pretty good about everybody on JJJ before me, although speed gets the least bump up because self-preservation. Still he's not atop my suspect list any longer.

You know what I'm doing with JJJ's ISOs? Totally ignoring them. Way too WIFOMy for me to get any real info.

nutella wrote: ↑Sat Dec 02, 2017 4:27 pm
colonialbob wrote: ↑Sat Dec 02, 2017 1:33 am CFD. For the fourth night in a row. No thanks I'll stick with speed.

colonialbob wrote: ↑Sat Dec 02, 2017 2:25 am I like the people on JJJ much more, so I'm swtiching over. JJJ
his vote is on speed for a while, then when it becomes clear that Jay is taking the lead again he hops on!

I'm sold sloonei let's do this

Wrong. I was the vote that put JJJ in the lead.

nutella wrote: ↑Sun Dec 03, 2017 12:15 am Can you tell me exactly what the vote tally was at the time you voted?

colonialbob wrote: ↑Sat Dec 02, 2017 11:31 am
Sloonei wrote: ↑Sat Dec 02, 2017 11:06 am
colonialbob wrote: ↑Sat Dec 02, 2017 11:05 am Sloonei did you move back to JJJ before or after I did?
I don't know. I was the 5th or 6th vote on him.
Initially I was the first.
Yeah I'm trying to figure out who was already there before me. I think you were 5th because I saw you, Epi, and nutella and liked that a lot more than jack, mal, kyle. Meaning it was DDL, speed, Epi, nutella, you on JJJ vs Eloh, Mal, LC, Jack, Kyle, myself on speed when I switched.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Dec 03, 2017 12:15 am
colonialbob wrote: ↑Sun Dec 03, 2017 12:11 am
nutella wrote: ↑Sat Dec 02, 2017 4:27 pm
colonialbob wrote: ↑Sat Dec 02, 2017 1:33 am CFD. For the fourth night in a row. No thanks I'll stick with speed.

colonialbob wrote: ↑Sat Dec 02, 2017 2:25 am I like the people on JJJ much more, so I'm swtiching over. JJJ
his vote is on speed for a while, then when it becomes clear that Jay is taking the lead again he hops on!

I'm sold sloonei let's do this
Wrong. I was the vote that put JJJ in the lead.
so?
colonialbob wrote: ↑Fri Dec 01, 2017 10:34 pm Jay seems a pretty obvious target for today - if he is bad he seems a better candidate for bussing than saving, especially considering his availability.

So she was factually incorrect. It was not clear JJJ was taking the lead, since my vote put him in the lead. if you think I'm bussing him, fine. You're wrong, but fine. But let's at least base the case on things that actually happened.

Again, that's fine. I obviously disagree with you, because I'm town, but that's fine. All I want is for the case to be made on facts, not falsehoods. That's all I was trying to correct nutella on.

Question for Sloonei: if you think JJJ told his teammates to bus him D3, doesn't every suspicion of JJJ expressed D3 instantly become worthless because it's potential bussing?

Second: if all his teammates were bussing him why were there so many Wilgy and Speed votes until very late in the phase?

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Dec 03, 2017 12:35 am
colonialbob wrote: ↑Sun Dec 03, 2017 12:31 am Again, that's fine. I obviously disagree with you, because I'm town, but that's fine. All I want is for the case to be made on facts, not falsehoods. That's all I was trying to correct nutella on.
why did you vote for speedchuck, or how did your read of Jay progress throughout the day?

I votes for speedchuck because he was my biggest scum read. As the day went along, I bought into the JJJ case you and Epi laid out. So speedchuck and JJJ were my top scumreads. But then I looked at the trains and I was on a train with Kyle (somebody I didn't trust, see my first vote), Jack (somebody I didn't trust, see my history), Mal (somebody who was a pretty common scumread), and Eloh and LC (two players I wasn't suspicious of but also didn't have a solid town read on). Meanwhile JJJ had my three strongest town reads (nutella, you, epignosis). I decided I'd rather be with my town reads than my scumreads, considering that independent of other viewpoints he was second on my suspicion list.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Dec 03, 2017 1:11 am "Player x is/was my strongest scum read" is not an adequate answer for me. All that does is reaffirm that your suspicion exists. I'm asking you to give me reasons why speedchuck was your strongest scum read, especially relative to Jay.

I believe I talked about him, should've seen that in your ISO. Sorry for being a little snarky but I'm headed to bed and not in the mood to relitigate a case against somebody I no longer have strong suspicions about. And the frustrating thing is I'm pretty sure you're town so it's frustrating that you can't find me so we can go catch bad guys together. So we can revisit this tomorrow when I have more energy.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Dec 03, 2017 4:05 am That I've come up with colonialbob as my primary suspect on two different occasions and based upon two totally separate lines of investigation in this game is borderline overwhelming. At this point I'll be shocked if he's town and I'll owe him a tremendous apology.

"You're not Nightblue."

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Dec 03, 2017 11:26 am I also did not get the sense that Jack and Jay are scum partners when I did my Jay ISO yesterday. I could be wrong for sure, but I came out of it feeling good about Jack. Which makes his stubbornness about me all the more frustrating right now.

Preaching to the choir, buddy.

The best way of summing up my voting yesterday is this:
I started off on Kyle because he had been pinging me and JJJ already had 4 votes while nobody else had more than 1. As several people have said, locking in a lynch suspect that early in the phase is generally not a great idea (obvious exceptions like revealed mafia not applying here). By the time I came back to the thread, nobody had followed my Kyle suspicion, so I went with my most consistent scumread, Speedchuck. Call it a gut read, whatever. Fact is I've been consistently reading him bad since roughly N2. Because that lasted fooooreeeeeeveeeeer the reasons aren't as fresh in my mind but the feeling of mafia was. If I have time this afternoon I'll sit down and ISO him and try to actually point out why I thought he was bad. But regardless, he was the player I most consistently read as mafia (after I felt you were basically cleared D2 and I got better feelings on Jack I think D3). Meanwhile a couple of players (mostly you) had laid out the JJJ case, which I mostly bought into, but which was also somewhat meta on a player that I've never played with (and I'm not a particularly meta-reliant player). So I stayed with my own read. Then Epi came and laid out a non-meta argument, which I also mostly bought into, and voted JJJ. That was the point I looked at the trains and noticed that my biggest townreads were on JJJ while several players who were neutral reads or worse were with me on speedchuck. That was enough to push me away from my top scumread to my second scumread.

Spoiler: show

dunya wrote: ↑Sun Dec 03, 2017 2:17 pm
JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sat Dec 02, 2017 2:40 am If I do end up dead, a few parting words:

~ Any civilians who helped to kill me -- it's alright. I don't blame you. I understand that I have been a different player in this game and that is inherently going to generate suspicion. I'm over it.

~ Second, the activity level in this game has been fantastic to this point. The best thing the civilians can do moving forward is to maintain that through the finish. Do not let this game thread stagnate. That is the single best way to let a mafia team get comfortable.

~ Epi and Jack are full of shit right now. Press them on it when I'm gone. I'd also list Wilgy as a premier suspect.

~ My top town reads are Sloonei, dunya, and Quin.

~ I think speedchuck and malakim handled themselves well in this day phase, particularly toward the end. I'm less thrilled with Long Con.

~ Please at least give my ISOs a look, their primary value is as legacy and that's the whole point.
Three remaining scum.

He names 8 players

Epi, Jack, Wilgy - anitown

sloonei, dunya, Quin - town

speedchuck, mal - positive things

long con - negative things

People he did not name at all in his "legacy post":
Elo
Kyle
insertnamehere
colonialbob
sig
nutella
DDL

Three scum remaining, it's a pick and mix. No way he didn't name all 3 of his team mates in that post and no way he would name all 3.

I'm going to start with the people he not name and list them from least scummy to most scummy in my head as of now, with the exception of insertnamehere (insert angry face emoji here)

sig
DDL
colonialbob
Elo
insertnamehere
Kyle
nutella

I wanted to place insertnamehere in the middle, but I actually feel much better about Elo today after reading some of her past civ games, so I'll place him one spot under here.

Potential suspects from this pool imo are:
INH
Kyle
nutella

I'm a little baffled as to why he didn't name nutella amongst "top town read", or colonialbob in any read, especially after his iso of him, since it's (the fact he didn't means he's not even really paying attention to bob imo, despite being slightly pro-bob all game....). I can't extend that same excuse to nutella, since she's literally been a "top town read" in everyone's lists and she was attacking him all kinds of harsh that eod phase. He couldn't have forgotten about her. He wanted us to forget about her. The one thing that clears nutella slightly for me is how hard Jay went after sprityo (my alter ego) for voting for her! He was hoping to lynch him fast and it all revolved around nutella. I feel awkward about that, because a sprityo lynch would be a town flip; and I don't think he'd want to be that wrong about someone over another scum member.

This post is a massive ball of WIFOM and I'm not sure why you'd even try to analyze it.

Sloonei, here's the biggest thing about the bus case - I put JJJ in the lead. In my experience, mafia will almost never put their teammate in the lead unless they're an almost certain lynch, because mafia lives are super valuable. I could see a teammate voting him early and hoping the trains end up on different people so he could swap off, and I could definitely see a teammate jumping on to make sure their vote showed up once he flipped. But when I swapped my vote it was far from certain he was getting lynched - votes had been swapping for a while, his vote itself could've been thrown onto speed, Quin was voting for Epi or something silly like that. You swapped, I swapped, then several other people jumped on once he went ahead on the voting.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Dec 03, 2017 6:18 pm
colonialbob wrote: ↑Sun Dec 03, 2017 5:17 pm Sloonei, here's the biggest thing about the bus case - I put JJJ in the lead. In my experience, mafia will almost never put their teammate in the lead unless they're an almost certain lynch, because mafia lives are super valuable. I could see a teammate voting him early and hoping the trains end up on different people so he could swap off, and I could definitely see a teammate jumping on to make sure their vote showed up once he flipped. But when I swapped my vote it was far from certain he was getting lynched - votes had been swapping for a while, his vote itself could've been thrown onto speed, Quin was voting for Epi or something silly like that. You swapped, I swapped, then several other people jumped on once he went ahead on the voting.
I don't agree with your self-analysis. Your vote might have put Jay ahead in the poll at the time, but like I've already said, the atmosphere in the thread at the time (and really for all of Day 4) was overwhelmingly anti-Jay. The flood of votes that came piling in afterward is a testament to that. And the fact that you've repeatedly turned to this in self-defense is not a great look for me, but I will grant you that my constant attacks have forced you to raise your shields. It's tough for me to be overly critical of that sort of thing when I'm the one causing it. That said, this sort of post isn't going to help you change the way I feel. I'm interested in understanding your thoughts, not a reflection on why I shouldn't treat your vote as suspicious.

I'm still interested in the development of your Jay read over time, as well as any updated reads you can share.

Yeah, I decided after this post I'm done defending myself with regards to the vote trains, because we'd just end up going in circles and it doesn't really get us anywhere anyway.

My JJJ read was basically driven by the cases of you and Epi. I dont have much original thought there, I'm afraid, just a case of "yeah those arguments make sense" combined with the other voters on each of them, like I talked about earlier. I'll work on updating other reads in light of the flip though.

Dear mafia, if you kill one of kyle/Epi i promise to try to get the other lynched so we don't have to read any more academic dick-measuring kthx

Kylemii wrote: ↑Mon Dec 04, 2017 12:01 am
colonialbob wrote: ↑Mon Dec 04, 2017 12:00 am Dear mafia, if you kill one of kyle/Epi i promise to try to get the other lynched so we don't have to read any more academic dick-measuring kthx
Chill. Epi and I are cool now.

Oh good.

Mafia please don't kill anybody kthx

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Mon Dec 04, 2017 8:04 am
Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sat Dec 02, 2017 10:12 pm
colonialbob wrote: ↑Sat Dec 02, 2017 2:25 am I like the people on JJJ much more, so I'm swtiching over. JJJ
Post 3302.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sat Dec 02, 2017 2:17 am also i put my vote back on jay. his ISOs don't sway me much. That's exactly what I'd expect him to do as scum. It's exactly what he always says players, town or scum, should do in the face of pressure. I don't feel like his mesk vote came from a place of sincerity and prior to today I got very little sense that he was trying to solve the game in any capacity.
Post 3287.

My bad, guys. Sloonei voted Jimmy before Bob.
This doesn't look good for Bob.

Bob already mentioned that twice but apparently nobody actually reads what he says

Sorry all, busy Monday. Will be catching up over the next couple of hours (although dinner is in there too).

Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon Dec 04, 2017 1:51 pm Last but not least, anyone who doesn't vote colonialbob is literally the Grinch.

You mean initially they were mean and grumpy and going to vote for me but then they realized the true meaning of Christmas and that I'm town and their heart grew three sizes and everybody loved them?

Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon Dec 04, 2017 2:49 pm Another question for people who are good at analyzing this sort of thing: Why might Jack have been killed? He was still on a lot of people's radar and has been a controversial figure for much of the game.

He was after myself and Quin most recently, as well as malakim.

That was pretty surprising to me too. But I'm not in the habit of trying to analyze mafia kills, for one because WIFOM but mostly because I come from power madness setups so usually mafia is trying to leverage their info to take out town power roles.

nutella wrote: ↑Mon Dec 04, 2017 3:47 pm Sloonei tinfoil is definitely interesting (especially considering his Mesk vote switch that saved jay), but I thought that pretty much all of the theories as to how he survived Day 2 involved him being town. Unless... wait, there is one possibility. Hold on, I'm rethinking everything I had in mind for Jack and Sloonei and recalculating.... hmm I'll have to think about this more, it's really confusing. Bottom line is I think the chances of Sloonei being bad are very, very, very slim.

Yeah Sloonei tinfoiling is understandable (I don't get why he refuses to consider Mal at all either, Jack), but it's a waste of time. I'm firm town on him.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon Dec 04, 2017 6:27 pm
Quin wrote: ↑Mon Dec 04, 2017 5:30 pm You, Eloh and malakim.
Talk about bob

Kylemii wrote: ↑Mon Dec 04, 2017 5:35 pm
Quin wrote: ↑Mon Dec 04, 2017 5:27 pm
Okay. And why is that scummy again?
It's scummy because a scum quin following a lynch of teammate jay, in a game where his teammates may already under fire, and so many players are difficult to accuse because of the general civvie-trust vibes of the thread, when being asked what his suspects are, might quickly respond with listing two suspected players who aren't on his team.

Why me and Eloh? Why not Cbob or speedchuck or sog or LC. Why specifically list those two players? You weren't specifically asked for 2 suspects.

Now *this* is circular logic. Quin is scummy for naming two suspected players who aren't on his team. How do you know Eloh is town? As speedchuck says why are the other four better? If he had said "Kyle and cbob" or "Eloh and speed" is this somehow now not scummy?

Kylemii wrote: ↑Mon Dec 04, 2017 6:24 pm
Quin wrote: ↑Mon Dec 04, 2017 6:17 pm Let me tell you something about my meta, nutella.

Pretty much the only thing I know how to do in mafia is be genuine. I can only play by those standards. My suspicions are authentic or they are nothing. I don't say someone looks bad unless they look bad. When nobody looks bad, I say nobody looks bad. If you ever think I've made something up, reconsider. Because "making things up" is not something I care to do, and not something I'm confident I can do.

That is how I play mafia, both as a civilian and as scum.
If this were word-for-word true then you'd go through every mafia roll game suspecting no one at all.

Townies never look bad?

(Lol look at me defending Quin who is probably one of my bigger scumreads before really digging into everybody)

Kylemii wrote: ↑Mon Dec 04, 2017 7:11 pm How does Malakim usually do under pressure?

He's often somewhat angry-ish, at least when presented with reasons like "you replaced into somebody we think is mafia" that (valid as it may be) is hard to defend against. At least from what I can recall. This is where I miss Jack, he's way better at meta than me.

Ok, caught up. Gonna clean the kitchen then do some ISOs / reread the end of Day 4.

Quin wrote: ↑Sat Dec 02, 2017 5:08 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Sat Dec 02, 2017 5:06 pm
Quin wrote: ↑Sat Dec 02, 2017 4:56 pm
Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sat Dec 02, 2017 9:42 amQuin is bad for saving Jimmy yesterday, trying to save him today and continually arguing the cause against Jimmy is bad, is a misrepresentation and there was an actually case against Mesk because....nothing. Over and over he repeats these lies and cannot explain. Additionally, he repeated the "lets lynch lasagna" noncase while Domalakim and Jimmy were on the chopping block.
This makes me want to cry. And also throw things at you. Begone, Satan.
Gimme a short list of suspects
Eloh and Kyle.

[mention]Kylemii[/mention] I was literally just ISOing Quin so this sequence was fresh in my mind. Your accusation doesn't really fit the conversation.

vote Kyle

He hasn't made a case I remember agreeing with once.

Quin wrote: ↑Mon Dec 04, 2017 11:37 pm
Kylemii wrote: ↑Mon Dec 04, 2017 11:29 pm
Quin wrote: ↑Mon Dec 04, 2017 10:56 pm
Kylemii wrote: ↑Mon Dec 04, 2017 10:33 pm @Quin my accusation of you wasn't specifically about your suspect list choices. My suspicion is that your behavior looks like how a baddie would act in an increasingly hopeless situation.
Because my suspects didn't line up with the generic lynch candidates, yeah. I got that.
No no, the point is that you've seemed less motivated lately, despite the fact that we're doing really good.

Maybe I made a mistake in pointing it out, you've been talking about this with me all day instead scum hunting and it's not you can argue with a psychology based theory.
Fair enough. I am just very difficult to motivate.

I moved my vote off you to malakim. I disliked bobs reason for voting you. There are better cases out there than 'I don't agree with him'.

It's not really "I don't agree" it's "I have no idea why you think the case you're laying out makes X scum." And it hasn't just been you, it's been multiple things.

Because it's stuff like misrepresenting the context of what Quin was responding too to make his Kyle/Eloh answer sound suspicious/bad, or saying Jack wouldn't answer his questions when they were a) dangerously close to asking him to break the rules and b) not alignment indicative. And from what I read of pirates, he was better at making cases than this. If he's been off for a while, I can absolutely see him struggling to make townie-sounding cases as mafia, and his response to your "I'm always sincere no matter my alignment" post points that direction as well.

Plus as I've said, I'd bet one of the voters after me on JJJ is a teammate, and Jack got NKed, so.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2017 12:39 am I was already coming around to putting a vote down on malakim, but if his badness would get people to start listening to my rants about colonialbob then that just about settles it.

Why would it?

A) I'm not bad
B) if I'm mafia why am I trying to save a teammate who can't even be bothered to show up to defend himself

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