The Syndicate

I just voted fayt right away because she was the obvious next candidate after Jay's flip and the consensus vig target that didn't happen. I'm not just going for the path of least resistance, I definitely think we need to talk through our other options but I think she is the logical place to start. If you disagree please engage with me on that point. LC did so a bit regarding how yesterday's lynch went, so that is at least something to chew on but it didn't make her look particularly better in my eyes.

Dom wrote: ↑Mon Oct 21, 2019 12:13 am

Dragomir wrote: ↑Sat Oct 19, 2019 12:58 pm You know what, I'ma vote Jay. I really want to see what he flips. Nothing against you Jay.

Honestly what do we think of this?

It is weird. If Drago's bad he could have taken advantage of the Jay lynch to buy him another day, and then maybe he was able to block the vig hit on Fayt with the assumption that we'd eat up yet another day lynching Fayt. Ugh I don't want to feel like I'm falling into a trap voting for fayt.

Damn this makes sense though. He was defending Jay like hell (TMI) right up until Jay was actually getting lynched and then he decided to use it to his advantage to steer us wrong.

Fuck it [VOTE: dragomir] aubergine

novaselinenever wrote: ↑Mon Oct 21, 2019 12:23 am

nutella wrote: ↑Sun Oct 20, 2019 9:34 pm I just voted fayt right away because she was the obvious next candidate after Jay's flip and the consensus vig target that didn't happen. I'm not just going for the path of least resistance, I definitely think we need to talk through our other options but I think she is the logical place to start. If you disagree please engage with me on that point. LC did so a bit regarding how yesterday's lynch went, so that is at least something to chew on but it didn't make her look particularly better in my eyes.

What's your take on it?

Well it's possible she was legitimately going for the tie plan and hoping Jay would flip bad with the softvote? Right? Idk the whole thing kind of confused me

So I guess I see what LC is going for there if I'm thinking about that correctly?

novaselinenever wrote: ↑Mon Oct 21, 2019 12:24 am Also it's not really just EoD, it's basically the whole phase. Like she had given up and accepted her death for the greater good lol.

Sure sure. I don't know. There are so many things that look bad for her, but now that I'm thinking about Drago in the ways I described above, I'm seeing fayt in a more forgiving light.

[mention]Michelle[/mention] where's your head at fam?

Michelle wrote: ↑Mon Oct 21, 2019 1:49 am From today I dislike the most Nutella for inconsistency.

Hi nice to meet you.

When you say I pocketed you as a wolf are you referring to the hydra game on mu?

My "easy town read on you" has been consistent for several phases; I have recently begun to doubt it.

Let me go down the list again.
Mac, I trust; if he's bad I have been thoroughly fooled. I will probably only seriously consider lynching him if it comes down to F3, which it better not tbh.
LC, I waffle on and have kept in mind as a possibility but Jay and Mac have stated confidence in his townie tone enough times to influence my view, and he seems to be legitimately trying to solve.
Michelle, I have some paranoia I'm wrong about her but I've had the strongest tone civ read of her almost all game and as far as I remember offhand her interactions with the dead cats / her general presence in previous days has seemed innocent enough.
My gut is telling me Nova vs Dom is town/town.
That leaves Fayt and Drago. Thinking back to yesterday, Fayt seemed to go along with the tie plan, which could indicate she (a) really understood that her slot needed to be solved, and/or (b) despite having townread jay previously, had enough hope that he could be bad and the softvote plan would work; both of these indicate innocence. However, several other data points, such as dead cat interactions and previous treatment of Jay, do not look good on her.
Drago... is a bit of a weird case. Rej's refusal to vote for him, speed's "could they both be bad" line, and a few other things reflect poorly on him; he also hard defended Jay for a while, until he bizarrely solidified Jay's lynch because he "needed to see how he flipped." My current concern about his behavior yesterday is that he saw how the tide turned on Jay and Fayt and saw that the town was desperate to solve both of those slots, and he decided to use that to his advantage to buy him a couple more day phases, and knowing the consensus plan was for the vig to target Fayt, potentially he successfully used his role block on that in order to prolong the focus on Fayt.

Yeah. I'm comfortable with this. Until today I was so reluctant to seriously consider Dragomir, but whatever reasons I had for assuming he was town do not stand up to the strength of this current theory in my mind. He's a sneaky kitty.

Oh my god just thinking of a couple more interactions and everything is clicking into place. It's gotta be drago. Fucking take it to the bank boys.

Dragomir wrote: ↑Mon Oct 21, 2019 1:54 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Mon Oct 21, 2019 2:09 am Drago... is a bit of a weird case. Rej's refusal to vote for him, speed's "could they both be bad" line, and a few other things reflect poorly on him; he also hard defended Jay for a while, until he bizarrely solidified Jay's lynch because he "needed to see how he flipped." My current concern about his behavior yesterday is that he saw how the tide turned on Jay and Fayt and saw that the town was desperate to solve both of those slots, and he decided to use that to his advantage to buy him a couple more day phases, and knowing the consensus plan was for the vig to target Fayt, potentially he successfully used his role block on that in order to prolong the focus on Fayt.

@bold that doesn't make any sense at all. How do I buy a couple more DPs by voting up Jay? There was absolutely no point in me voting up Jay as mafia when both wagons would be townies. I just sit back and chill with my Dom vote. Prolong the focus on Fayt? For what? I started town reading him at EoD last DP. Should have been clear I wouldn't try pushing him but instead Dom or Michelle. If anybody I want the focus to be on is one of those two. Man, this lacks all logic in it. Like how did you come up with this?

It makes total sense. Of course you're also planting seeds for attention on Dom and Michelle, but you were happy to go along with the Jay and Fayt attention as well -- and on their flips you could easily point to your earlier Dom suspicion as your next logical choice, buying you yet another mislynch.

Dragomir wrote: ↑Mon Oct 21, 2019 2:12 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Mon Oct 21, 2019 2:17 am Oh my god just thinking of a couple more interactions and everything is clicking into place. It's gotta be drago. Fucking take it to the bank boys.

You had similar surety with Jay and look at how that turned out. You shouldn't trust your own thoughts right now imo

Really?? That's how you're going to defend yourself? By discrediting me since I was oh so conveniently wrong last time? This is your scummiest post yet my dude.

Dragomir wrote: ↑Mon Oct 21, 2019 2:24 pm

Fayt wrote: ↑Mon Oct 21, 2019 2:15 pm

Dragomir wrote: ↑Mon Oct 21, 2019 2:10 pm

Fayt wrote: ↑Mon Oct 21, 2019 11:43 am I'm still waiting on what Dragomir has to say.

What do you want me to say?

I'm thinking the wagon on you might've picked up really quick when you weren't here so I didn't want to vote you without hearing your defense.

Why did he have to die so the game progress? wouldn't it better for me to die? JJJ was wrong about me but he seemed absolutely hellbent. My flip could've shown him to reevaluate.

He did self destruct at the end there when he didn't need to though...

Because until Jay died, we would still be trying to lynch him. If Jay was alive right now, he'd be the leading wagon most likely, it wasn't going to end unless he died. At least that's how I felt like.

But the whole point of the tie plan was that he was going to get resolved no matter what; if he didn't flip/if fayt got lynched and flipped town, the vig would kill him. You didn't need to ensure the lynch ended on him. Unless you were already planning on blocking the vig?

novaselinenever wrote: ↑Mon Oct 21, 2019 2:37 pm

Dragomir wrote: ↑Mon Oct 21, 2019 2:25 pm [VOTE: Long Con] aubergine

Going back to my first scum read.

Huh?

Dragomir wrote: ↑Mon Oct 21, 2019 1:48 pmDom is bad.

Dragomir wrote: ↑Mon Oct 21, 2019 2:09 pm

Michelle wrote: ↑Mon Oct 21, 2019 2:05 pm

Dragomir wrote: ↑Mon Oct 21, 2019 1:49 pm It's either Dom or Michelle for me but I need to read back at them to get my best feel.

your own words sound cool.
How did you come up with this?

Nova's case against Dom is the best case in the entire game. I've been having a bad feeling against you lately.

Dragomir wrote: ↑Mon Oct 21, 2019 3:25 pm

novaselinenever wrote: ↑Mon Oct 21, 2019 3:22 pm

Dragomir wrote: ↑Mon Oct 21, 2019 3:10 pm

novaselinenever wrote: ↑Mon Oct 21, 2019 3:07 pm Like why go after LC when you know it's not happening and your ass is on the line, especially when you allegedly suspect Dom and you got me as support there as well as Dom being viewed in a lesser light than LC overall.

I don't know. I want to lynch the person I have the strongest scum read for.

But your ass is on the line, that's dumb.

I don't really care. I've played a game where I've done the same thing as I'm doing right now and because of it, ppl changed their votes and I wasn't lynched. So it's not dumb.

Dragomir wrote: ↑Mon Oct 21, 2019 3:39 pm
A vote anywhere else wouldn't do much either. It's hard to believe that anybody on my wagon would change their vote anywhere else.

......

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uhh ok so it sounds like the pit bull thing might explain that but drago is still not even attempting to make any sense lol

wait no it doesn't hahaha wtf

nothing makes any sense

Dragomir wrote: ↑Mon Oct 21, 2019 3:52 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Mon Oct 21, 2019 3:51 pm nothing makes any sense

Unvote me then.

no wtf why

I think you're acting strange and unpredictable in order to sow doubt but I don't think it's working, like I'm confused but it's not making me want to move off of you lol

Dragomir wrote: ↑Mon Oct 21, 2019 3:57 pm I don't think you guys actually that I'm scum. My behavior is bizarre to you guys and you associate with me being scum which imo more points to me being town instead of scum. About the other reasons like Rej not voting for me, well...I don't know what to tell you.

No, sorry but I do actually think you're scum. And no it's not some bias that I associate you with being scum, how would that even make sense?? You've been town in most of the games I've played with you, and one of the strongest townreads I had in them at that, so that's definitely not an issue. I suppose your bizarreness here is marking difference from those games, but meta is not really that much of a concern on top of the rest of my case for your catness based solely on the events of this game.

novaselinenever wrote: ↑Mon Oct 21, 2019 3:57 pm The pitbull thing doesn't really explain anything, also he said there is no meaning behind it and I don't think it's kosher stuff. But still, even without any meaning behind it, I feel like this is the kind of stuff townies do. It's so dumb and he's being stubborn, standing his ground, like I don't see this as an approach a last cat on the ropes would have

I understand this perspective but I also think that's what he wants you to think.

Dragomir wrote: ↑Mon Oct 21, 2019 4:16 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Mon Oct 21, 2019 4:03 pm

Dragomir wrote: ↑Mon Oct 21, 2019 3:57 pm I don't think you guys actually that I'm scum. My behavior is bizarre to you guys and you associate with me being scum which imo more points to me being town instead of scum. About the other reasons like Rej not voting for me, well...I don't know what to tell you.

No, sorry but I do actually think you're scum. And no it's not some bias that I associate you with being scum, how would that even make sense?? You've been town in most of the games I've played with you, and one of the strongest townreads I had in them at that, so that's definitely not an issue. I suppose your bizarreness here is marking difference from those games, but meta is not really that much of a concern on top of the rest of my case for your catness based solely on the events of this game.

Huh? I wasn't talking about meta.

Then what? I thought you were town until this phase lol.

Though I guess I have been confirmation biasing a fair amount since forming my case on you today.

Dragomir wrote: ↑Mon Oct 21, 2019 4:20 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Mon Oct 21, 2019 4:18 pm

Dragomir wrote: ↑Mon Oct 21, 2019 4:16 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Mon Oct 21, 2019 4:03 pm

Dragomir wrote: ↑Mon Oct 21, 2019 3:57 pm I don't think you guys actually that I'm scum. My behavior is bizarre to you guys and you associate with me being scum which imo more points to me being town instead of scum. About the other reasons like Rej not voting for me, well...I don't know what to tell you.

No, sorry but I do actually think you're scum. And no it's not some bias that I associate you with being scum, how would that even make sense?? You've been town in most of the games I've played with you, and one of the strongest townreads I had in them at that, so that's definitely not an issue. I suppose your bizarreness here is marking difference from those games, but meta is not really that much of a concern on top of the rest of my case for your catness based solely on the events of this game.

Huh? I wasn't talking about meta.

Then what? I thought you were town until this phase lol.

I'm talking about this game. I've been playing bizarre and you guys don't understand it so you attribute it to scum behavior. That's how I feel about it. The only reason against me that isn't linked to my bizarre play is Rej not voting for me which I can't explain.

What changed this DP for you to scum read me?

...I've been over this. Your strange vote behavior yesterday combined with the lack of vig kill

Sure we can try to do the softvoter tie thing again between drago and dom if it can get set up in time, that's fine.

I suppose on the off chance Dom is the pitbull nova's vote wouldn't count

Dragomir wrote: ↑Mon Oct 21, 2019 4:36 pm Why does this soft voter thing matter?

if the softvoter votes for a townie and it's tied, that townie won't get lynched, though the person who does get lynched could still be town or scum. if the softvoter votes for scum and it's tied, it's a coin flip. so it just slightly decreases the chance of a mislynch idk the exact math it's confusing

ok [VOTE: dom] aubergine not sure if this plan will even get off the ground in time but worth a try

oh nvm we did it lol

novaselinenever wrote: ↑Mon Oct 21, 2019 4:37 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Mon Oct 21, 2019 4:36 pm I suppose on the off chance Dom is the pitbull nova's vote wouldn't count

I'll be on the Drago's side then of the tie, that should work no?

makes sense to be safe, maybe LC would switch with you

oh nvm

fayt went to dom for a few seconds so nova could have changed but then went back lol

h4xorz

aight well, fingers crossed, i mean if dom is the pit bull that makes it more likely drago is bad anyway so

Dragomir wrote: ↑Mon Oct 21, 2019 4:45 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Mon Oct 21, 2019 4:44 pm aight well, fingers crossed, i mean if dom is the pit bull that makes it more likely drago is bad anyway so

No, it doesn't.

it quite literally does

lmao all other factors aside it objectively goes from 1/7 to 1/6

Well certain things make me still believe very strongly that it's Dragomir. LC was the softvoter so that would mean it was an actual tie yesterday. Obviously Drago could be town as that would have made it result in the Dom lynch but other factors still make me think Drago bad. However it could also be Fayt and my worldview would still make nearly as much sense, I just feel like I have more reasons to townread her from the last couple phases. Drago, prove me wrong or make a convincing case for Fayt or someone else, or die.

Dragomir wrote: ↑Tue Oct 22, 2019 4:40 pm Michelle or Fayt. Hmm.

Reason Nova is out of the running?

Reason I'm out of the running?

You know I'm town and I know that you know it because you are bad.

It's just Drago. It really makes the most sense the way things have gone down here.

Michelle wrote: ↑Tue Oct 22, 2019 4:48 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Tue Oct 22, 2019 4:45 pm It's just Drago. It really makes the most sense the way things have gone down here.

I get what you say.

But i have a question, why wanted Nova to switch with Fayt, at eod, the wagons. Where is the sense?

The concern was that if dom had been the pitbull nova's vote wouldn't have counted on him since he also voted there the previous day, read how the pit bull works (dom wasn't the pit bull so this doesn't end up mattering but it was just considered as an extra precaution to ensure the tie)

Nova, do you have reason to doubt Drago is the cat?

I think you're misunderstanding the soft vote. Maybe deliberately misunderstanding eh?
His vote was on you. If you are bad it was a true tie. If not it was 4 to 3. Whatever. You're still bad

why would it be michelle tho

Dragomir wrote: ↑Tue Oct 22, 2019 5:39 pm

novaselinenever wrote: ↑Tue Oct 22, 2019 5:34 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Tue Oct 22, 2019 5:06 pm Nova, do you have reason to doubt Drago is the cat?

I'm not sure right now. Most of my thoughts there were linked to my Dom suspicion and Drago being the one Dom was casing, as well as my experience with him. There are a lot of flashes of his civ self in how he's behaving and being stubborn. I'm supposed to reread and reassess some stuff in a bit so I'll see how I feel especially with the whole "that's what he wants you to think" perspective.

Idk what you need to reassess on me bro? What does your gut say? Town or scum?

Ick

"Nah man don't analyze shit just trust your first instinct lol"

That's manipulative, opportunistic, bad defense