The Syndicate

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Wed Apr 20, 2022 1:02 pm
Arcbell wrote: ↑Wed Apr 20, 2022 1:00 pm It's interesting that you think it's a possibility he was trying to make it look this way

Again he has 0 reason to make it look that way since death=loss. He's not a normal mafia team member who wants to throw town off after they flip. Were you voting him at that time?
Yes. I voted him before anyone else this day. I voted him instead of voting NAA, who was my counter wagon. And I told the game how I thought NAA was town.

And I'm pretty sure HK fully tried to help the mafia.
Just based on the kind of person and player he is.
Like, I'm pretty sure he saw himself as mafia sided and if he was to go down (which he didn't seem very interested in avoiding), he would root for mafia and try to help mafia. And I would guess this was how he was playing the entire game.

I'm pretty sure HK was aware of his win condition and wouldn't try an elaborate frame on his deathbed lol

@Lag @Jack can you guys tell me I'm crazy if I'm crazy for thinking those quotes are Hollowcat trying to signal to Dizzy in a last-ditch effort to get them to unvote him?

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Wed Apr 20, 2022 1:00 pm
Arcbell wrote: ↑Wed Apr 20, 2022 12:55 pm
Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Wed Apr 20, 2022 12:52 pm
Spoiler: show
Arcbell wrote: ↑Wed Apr 20, 2022 12:49 pm
Mizery wrote: ↑Wed Apr 20, 2022 12:42 pm
Arcbell wrote: ↑Wed Apr 20, 2022 12:41 pm
Mizery wrote: ↑Wed Apr 20, 2022 12:30 pm
which is why assuming that the other wolf had to be on Falcon is a bad assumption- he'd want make sure he was voting right as to not die.

He would need wolves to win, but another option is trying to get the wolves to die early, taking their NK, and then playing like an SK? how reliable would that be vs. trying to signal who he is so they can not push him or something? idk. He could have also been playing to try and get nkd so they could find him
I'm not assuming anything about who voted on falcon. Reading Hollow's iso I don't really see much that looks like spew on you though, he basically tr'd everyone. He did agree with lag's fos on you to an extent but never pushed it
I never said you did lol, I was making a general comment
mb,mb

I can't see HK as being aware of lag's alignment here. He casts too much shade on lag and then turns around and puts most of his effort into hashing things out with lag. Why wouldn't he just direct pocket them instead of doing things like this

Spoiler: show
hollowkatt wrote: ↑Sat Apr 16, 2022 1:55 pm
Lag wrote: ↑Sat Apr 16, 2022 1:54 pm
hollowkatt wrote: ↑Sat Apr 16, 2022 1:50 pm

this phrasing is weird.
I find arc townie b/c of his posts, you seem to be saying you find him townie despite his townie posts?
I find his posts townie, I'm just not entirely sure why I find his posts townie though.

What part was unclear?
the part where it read like your town read of arc is separate from you thinking his posts are townie
where he's accusing lag of reading me for non-alignment reasons

or this

Spoiler: show
hollowkatt wrote: ↑Sat Apr 16, 2022 1:27 pm
Lag wrote: ↑Sat Apr 16, 2022 1:19 pm
hollowkatt wrote: ↑Sat Apr 16, 2022 1:17 pm

"you have no fire"
Correction. "You have no fire" was Lag to HK. Not the other way around.

I just read that interaction. I don't find it clearing for Lag. However, I think Lag has been really towny. But I'm circling around on everyone right now. I don't really buy that it's Mizery either tbh.
Ah yea thx for the correction.

Would you flesh out the mizery tr? So far no one has been up to the task
I don't know if I can beyond what I've already said.
HK's handling of her. Her words.
Not sure how she struggles to read me, but I'll let her talk about that. I feel she's mostly ignored me this game.

What is HK's handling of her? I asked her to give examples of this and none given. Which stand out to you?

It's interesting that you think it's a possibility he was trying to make it look this way

Again he has 0 reason to make it look that way since death=loss. He's not a normal mafia team member who wants to throw town off after they flip. Were you voting him at that time?

Arcbell wrote: ↑Wed Apr 20, 2022 12:39 pm Guys read these quotes. Are you seeing what I'm seeing?

Spoiler: show
hollowkatt wrote: ↑Sat Apr 16, 2022 11:17 pm
Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Sat Apr 16, 2022 5:19 pm
hollowkatt wrote: ↑Sat Apr 16, 2022 12:04 pm
Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Sat Apr 16, 2022 12:02 pm Did we lose?
depends are you a wolf?
What do you think and why?

I've noticed you reading me correctly a lot of time. I'm curious.
from checking my notifications:

I think I've gotten pretty good at reading you, or it's TMI not sure which

Spoiler: show
hollowkatt wrote: ↑Sat Apr 16, 2022 11:47 pm
Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Sat Apr 16, 2022 11:41 pm
NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Sat Apr 16, 2022 11:37 pm
Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Sat Apr 16, 2022 11:31 pm Jack/Porscha doesn't look like it's a thing. Jack voted her 7 min before EoD, I followed. But I do think it's conceivable that Porscha could be run down. There was a lot of chaos during EoD.
They wouldn't know of each other's existence given that Falcon was the team mafia, yeah?
Well, yeah. Unless Jack 3p. Knowing of each other only goes one way. Though the mafia might have a good idea.
do you think the 3p would want to signal here or not? I was thinking about that in my fevered half-sleep this afternoon and couldn't come to a decision

These ones @Dizzy

There's no reason he'd try to make it look that way since if he dies he loses so death framing doesn't help him

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Wed Apr 20, 2022 12:52 pm
Spoiler: show
Arcbell wrote: ↑Wed Apr 20, 2022 12:49 pm
Mizery wrote: ↑Wed Apr 20, 2022 12:42 pm
Arcbell wrote: ↑Wed Apr 20, 2022 12:41 pm
Mizery wrote: ↑Wed Apr 20, 2022 12:30 pm
Arcbell wrote: ↑Wed Apr 20, 2022 12:25 pm Btw just something I want to point out, HK has almost 0 reason to anti-spew. It's not like if mafia team can win for him if he dies early.
which is why assuming that the other wolf had to be on Falcon is a bad assumption- he'd want make sure he was voting right as to not die.

He would need wolves to win, but another option is trying to get the wolves to die early, taking their NK, and then playing like an SK? how reliable would that be vs. trying to signal who he is so they can not push him or something? idk. He could have also been playing to try and get nkd so they could find him
I'm not assuming anything about who voted on falcon. Reading Hollow's iso I don't really see much that looks like spew on you though, he basically tr'd everyone. He did agree with lag's fos on you to an extent but never pushed it
I never said you did lol, I was making a general comment
mb,mb

I can't see HK as being aware of lag's alignment here. He casts too much shade on lag and then turns around and puts most of his effort into hashing things out with lag. Why wouldn't he just direct pocket them instead of doing things like this

Spoiler: show
hollowkatt wrote: ↑Sat Apr 16, 2022 1:55 pm
Lag wrote: ↑Sat Apr 16, 2022 1:54 pm
hollowkatt wrote: ↑Sat Apr 16, 2022 1:50 pm
Lag wrote: ↑Sat Apr 16, 2022 1:37 pm
hollowkatt wrote: ↑Sat Apr 16, 2022 1:32 pm

why not just read for content? that shouldn't be difficult
I like the way Arcbell thinks and have a weakness to it.

But actually his posts do feel towny, I'm not entirely sure why, but I have a gut townread on him.
this phrasing is weird.
I find arc townie b/c of his posts, you seem to be saying you find him townie despite his townie posts?
I find his posts townie, I'm just not entirely sure why I find his posts townie though.

What part was unclear?
the part where it read like your town read of arc is separate from you thinking his posts are townie
where he's accusing lag of reading me for non-alignment reasons

or this

Spoiler: show
hollowkatt wrote: ↑Sat Apr 16, 2022 1:27 pm
Lag wrote: ↑Sat Apr 16, 2022 1:19 pm
hollowkatt wrote: ↑Sat Apr 16, 2022 1:17 pm
Lag wrote: ↑Sat Apr 16, 2022 1:15 pm
hollowkatt wrote: ↑Sat Apr 16, 2022 1:13 pm

feels like you're trying to push "absence = wolf" here.
You've not been entirely absent, but like, I could basically copy paste the post I made from last game where I correctly wolf-read you there.

And the same logic applies here. You have no fire
"you have no fire"
Correction. "You have no fire" was Lag to HK. Not the other way around.

I just read that interaction. I don't find it clearing for Lag. However, I think Lag has been really towny. But I'm circling around on everyone right now. I don't really buy that it's Mizery either tbh.

Ah yea thx for the correction.

Would you flesh out the mizery tr? So far no one has been up to the task

Dizzy I'm having paranoid thoughts about hollow trying to signal to you in the posts above ^^^

Can you set my mind at ease?

Mizery wrote: ↑Wed Apr 20, 2022 12:42 pm
Arcbell wrote: ↑Wed Apr 20, 2022 12:41 pm
Mizery wrote: ↑Wed Apr 20, 2022 12:30 pm
Arcbell wrote: ↑Wed Apr 20, 2022 12:25 pm Btw just something I want to point out, HK has almost 0 reason to anti-spew. It's not like if mafia team can win for him if he dies early.
which is why assuming that the other wolf had to be on Falcon is a bad assumption- he'd want make sure he was voting right as to not die.

He would need wolves to win, but another option is trying to get the wolves to die early, taking their NK, and then playing like an SK? how reliable would that be vs. trying to signal who he is so they can not push him or something? idk. He could have also been playing to try and get nkd so they could find him
I'm not assuming anything about who voted on falcon. Reading Hollow's iso I don't really see much that looks like spew on you though, he basically tr'd everyone. He did agree with lag's fos on you to an extent but never pushed it
I never said you did lol, I was making a general comment

mb,mb

I can't see HK as being aware of lag's alignment here. He casts too much shade on lag and then turns around and puts most of his effort into hashing things out with lag. Why wouldn't he just direct pocket them instead of doing things like this

Spoiler: show

where he's accusing lag of reading me for non-alignment reasons

or this

Spoiler: show

"you have no fire"

Mizery wrote: ↑Wed Apr 20, 2022 12:30 pm
Arcbell wrote: ↑Wed Apr 20, 2022 12:25 pm Btw just something I want to point out, HK has almost 0 reason to anti-spew. It's not like if mafia team can win for him if he dies early.
which is why assuming that the other wolf had to be on Falcon is a bad assumption- he'd want make sure he was voting right as to not die.

He would need wolves to win, but another option is trying to get the wolves to die early, taking their NK, and then playing like an SK? how reliable would that be vs. trying to signal who he is so they can not push him or something? idk. He could have also been playing to try and get nkd so they could find him

I'm not assuming anything about who voted on falcon. Reading Hollow's iso I don't really see much that looks like spew on you though, he basically tr'd everyone. He did agree with lag's fos on you to an extent but never pushed it

Guys read these quotes. Are you seeing what I'm seeing?

Spoiler: show

so if HK spewed someone town they're probably town

Btw just something I want to point out, HK has almost 0 reason to anti-spew. It's not like if mafia team can win for him if he dies early.

Mizery wrote: ↑Wed Apr 20, 2022 12:07 pm I also do think that HK's approach to me was unpartnered and the fact that that approach had a lot to do with HK's interactions with lag is something that I feel lag should be able to see.

what about his approach to you was unpartnered?

Why do you fos me mizery? If your argument is compelling I may self vote.

I still feel pretty good about hard shielding dizzy, porscha, and lag. Maybe this ends up clowning me in the post-game, but I feel strongly about it if I can be said to feel anything at all.

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Wed Apr 20, 2022 9:46 am Fuck, what if it is Lag. That would be cool.

A tinfoil for a much later day tbh. After I'm dead. My grandkids' grandkids may have to worry about the scum!Lag world

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Wed Apr 20, 2022 9:38 am
Arcbell wrote: ↑Wed Apr 20, 2022 9:38 amI'm out of my scumrange
Because you broke your scum range? Hm HMMM???

I wish. My scumrange is pretty much 90% of my town games, and this is in the 10%

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Wed Apr 20, 2022 9:36 am I'm voting Jack, because I'm out of options. I really don't know.
HK vote Jack with the reasoning of "Do things" or something like that. HK voting the last mafia without pushing him would be kind of typical. I guess that's my reasoning. It's not great reasoning.

[VOTE: Jack] aubergine

Yea this is the other option for me atp but I have to go re-read him and that's work and idk if mizery has earned that yet, they seem reluctant to engage / answer questions

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Wed Apr 20, 2022 9:34 am Going back in DDL's iso. I don't think it's him either.

Is it just Arc?

@Arcbell Would you do this to me?

I'm out of my scumrange

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Wed Apr 20, 2022 9:30 am
Mizery wrote: ↑Tue Apr 19, 2022 9:22 pm
Arcbell wrote: ↑Tue Apr 19, 2022 9:16 pm
Mizery wrote: ↑Tue Apr 19, 2022 9:14 pm Lag/Arc giving the vibes that it's in there for how supportive they've been of eachother and i dislike that read
are you sure this isn't just a solution to the problem of how to omgus 2 people at the same time?
no, lol

but I'm willing to sheep a TR on porscha rn. The wolf obviously feels comfortable if they're going after the 3p. Either that or the wolf is mac and they accidentally hit the 3p, but lol I'm not going down that rabbit hole until i have to which should hopefully be never lol
Mh.
This is the type of read that only I make and only I agree with. Buuut, I kind of think this makes Mizery not mafia. Cause if Mizery is mafia, I don't think she does feel comfortable. And it's rare for mafia to post boastful things when the game is ongoing. It would be kind of like saying "Well, I'm comfortable and not worried that you noobs would get me, so I shot Mac lol". I mean, it's not that, but that's kind of the mind frame behind it. And that is rare for mafia. MAYBE. Probably.

This is too bad, cause I was starting to think it might be her.

Yea I saw this and it could sort of be a reason to townread her, but at this point it's just some wording vs. a mountain of towny stuff from other people imo

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Wed Apr 20, 2022 9:19 am
Arcbell wrote: ↑Wed Apr 20, 2022 9:19 am Casual reminder that mac probably doesn't have the coin and is intentionally voting his townread. Mac should know I'm town at this point.
How should he know?

He's wolfed with me and I'm playing pretty different

Casual reminder that mac probably doesn't have the coin and is intentionally voting his townread. Mac should know I'm town at this point.

mean in favor*

Lag wrote: ↑Tue Apr 19, 2022 10:06 pm https://www.fortressoflies.com/t/prehis ... s/1550/521

You seem to have remembered the term just fine here?

I don't think this is too suspicious. I, too, have repeatedly forgotten what LAMIST means for in favor of the definition I gave.

Porscha wrote: ↑Tue Apr 19, 2022 10:04 pm no but really wtf is illithids lmao

Anyone could be an illithid really

Porscha wrote: ↑Tue Apr 19, 2022 9:54 pm a lot of times when I ask what something means, I get ignored, so I try to just figure it out from context instead of getting ignored repeatedly but I still haven't figured out NAI / AI

Not Attractive to Illithids / Attractive to Illithids

LAMIST: someone whos profession is to be/act lame, like a dentist is a dental professional

Also why is supporting lag scummy to you? Think I'm pocketing?

Miz, you said you thought I was maf at start of day, didn't answer why, then after I supported lag you used that as a reason. What was the reason before though?

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Tue Apr 19, 2022 9:25 pm This is wifom but I think every person who has a lot of experience playing games with me is currently townreading me.

I'm townreading you a bit based on your posts today ngl

wolf prob went after mac just for the fact that he's the only player with no wolf equity, and they can get away with hitting the vest

Mizery wrote: ↑Tue Apr 19, 2022 9:13 pm Table thing isn't AI and is usually something i do on my homesite because it's hard to track votes I don't expect people to townread me for that

can you please do my taxes?

Mizery wrote: ↑Tue Apr 19, 2022 9:14 pm Lag/Arc giving the vibes that it's in there for how supportive they've been of eachother and i dislike that read

are you sure this isn't just a solution to the problem of how to omgus 2 people at the same time?

Mizery wrote: ↑Tue Apr 19, 2022 9:14 pm I'm like a prod away from omgusing Lag hard

can you confirm or deny that lag has you completely figured out based on recent game history?

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Tue Apr 19, 2022 9:11 pm
Arcbell wrote: ↑Tue Apr 19, 2022 9:09 pm
Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Tue Apr 19, 2022 9:07 pm Re: Mizery shes a blur to me. Can't remember the last townie thing she did. Kinda like Porscha but Porscha grew on me I suppose. The table thing is neat but Ive done similar piles of gargantuan office work as scum.

Would kill.

But Arcbell is the one who is currently weirding me out with all the random priorities.
What do you think my priority should be?
Anyone not called Mac.

but he's fun to poke

okay sir, what is your read of dizzy?

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Tue Apr 19, 2022 9:07 pm Re: Mizery shes a blur to me. Can't remember the last townie thing she did. Kinda like Porscha but Porscha grew on me I suppose. The table thing is neat but Ive done similar piles of gargantuan office work as scum.

Would kill.

But Arcbell is the one who is currently weirding me out with all the random priorities.

What do you think my priority should be?

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Tue Apr 19, 2022 9:05 pm Or because you don't wanna focus on finding scum?

No, because they're more fun.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Tue Apr 19, 2022 9:02 pm
Arcbell wrote: ↑Tue Apr 19, 2022 8:53 pm I believe that mac has a true townread on DDL with much more confidence than I believe he has a true townread on Mizery
Why are you trying to analyse what Mac believes

How is this relevant

We know hes not a wolf

Unless someone CCs but if they havent already thats just stupid lol

Sometimes I just focus on things because they're more fun

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue Apr 19, 2022 8:53 pm
Lag wrote: ↑Tue Apr 19, 2022 8:52 pm
MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue Apr 19, 2022 8:49 pm I dislike how you're approaching this situation. Just pointing out that the towny things slots are doing can be wolfy is legitimately poor. It's obvious and it's not a correct way to go about solving in this scenario.
What read in particular do you dislike? The Mizery read? The DDL read?
I didn't say I dislike your reads I said I don't like your approach. That's not even mentioning the fact that you're choosing to conflict with the literal clear 3p who desperately needs mafia to die today.

I didn't see what you mentioned "pointing out that the towny things slots are doing can be wolfy" in any of lag's posts.

Also the odds of you claiming to have coin today regardless of whether or not you do are 1, so the odds that you got coin today are ~3/8. Sure, you could have the coin, but I don't care about could or might I care about what's probable.

I believe that mac has a true townread on DDL with much more confidence than I believe he has a true townread on Mizery

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue Apr 19, 2022 8:49 pm I dislike how you're approaching this situation. Just pointing out that the towny things slots are doing can be wolfy is legitimately poor. It's obvious and it's not a correct way to go about solving in this scenario.

Who's doing this?

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue Apr 19, 2022 8:37 pm @Mizery towncase yourself please.

awooooooo~~

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue Apr 19, 2022 8:36 pm
Lag wrote: ↑Tue Apr 19, 2022 8:33 pm
MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue Apr 19, 2022 8:32 pm
Arcbell wrote: ↑Tue Apr 19, 2022 8:10 pm omg mizery I didn't even see that you actually posted the tables!! you're my hero. I'm still probably going to kill you, but you're my hero.
What has Mizery done that's scummy?
What has Mizery done that's towny?
Wack.

I really want to know the answer to this question if you have one mac

Lag wrote: ↑Tue Apr 19, 2022 8:27 pm Arcbell has cleared:
Dizzy, Porscha, Mac, me

He's one clear away from locking himself out of a win. He seems more interested in clearing players than getting cleared himself. It could be pocketing. But even if that's the case, he would have left a very narrow path for him to walk in order for him to be able to win the game without having to do a hard double back on some of his earlier reads. That's definitely something that wolves can do, since town does it all the time - and I might not be giving his wolf game enough credit, and I might just have been pocketed by his applied Monty Hall Problem allure, but it just feels townie to me.

I don't wanna sound like I'm trying to slip self-meta in here but to support this, I'm really not confident enough in my ability to avoid getting yeeted to walk this fine line as wolf. I don't normally go for deepwolf positions anymore though I hope to improve and add that to my scumrange. Mac can back me up (reluctantly if he doesn't have coin lol) that when I played with him as scum I didn't want to bus him and try to endgame even when he suggested it. Also that stuff I mentioned earlier about getting yeeted d2 or d3 almost every game in recent history wasn't a lie lol

[VOTE: Mizery] aubergine pending answers

omg mizery I didn't even see that you actually posted the tables!! you're my hero. I'm still probably going to kill you, but you're my hero.

Mizery wrote: ↑Tue Apr 19, 2022 8:04 pm I'm between dragon and arc so arc being between me and dragon doesn't look so terrible to me except that everyone else considers dragon to be cleared (i still don't know why. I read things. I don't think he's cleared.)

Why me?

Like, I'd believe Lag might make a sacrifice like that as wolf for towncred in a different situation like earlier when more mafia were alive or if Lag could just plan to kill porscha later but porscha was primo lim material for yesterday and today and now she's not so it's just too much -ev. Not saying it clears Lag but it puts me over the edge on feeling confident enough to declare them a strong townread

luffy's treatment of me trying to chain-clear lag is weird

I'm between mizery and luffy atm

MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue Apr 19, 2022 7:37 pm
Arcbell wrote: ↑Tue Apr 19, 2022 7:32 pm Given that mafia is forced to kill, if he doesn't have the coin, he's in another "lynch town or lose" situation. So his best move there is to pretend he has the coin and is going to lead town.
So you think that if I wanted to kill a town I'd pick you?

Yeah, probably

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