The Syndicate

Quin wrote:Now that Phenon has ended I can say that my accusation of Sawyer for discrediting his own take on an argument is a tried and tested baddie tell. Follow me (tomorrow)

I'm already there.

MacDougall wrote:
Epignosis wrote:
Epignosis wrote:If Jack were not on the poll, where would you vote and why?
Where my vote is currently. Jack has enough votes now so I cbf moving it.

DrWilgy wrote:
Epignosis wrote:
Epignosis wrote:If Jack were not on the poll, where would you vote and why?
We've been over this Epi. You, Sawyer or DF.

If you've answered, then I'm not addressing you.

Epignosis wrote:If Jack were not on the poll, where would you vote and why?

Nobody's been bloody talking until now.

Marmot wrote:I do think it's odd that Epignosis wants to keep jack around to find his teammates, but he has only produced one read as a result of it: Floyd.

I'm voting for jack today. The longer he sticks around, the more he becomes a discussion point that would distract from more productive discussions. There has been a ton of chatter about whether to lynch him or not, but the points put out for not lynching him are not being taken advantage of.

And what was my "read" on Floyd, dear MM?

MM: Do you believe I would have killed Eloh Night 1?

Marmot wrote:
Epignosis wrote:
Marmot wrote:Another note.

One of the factors for Epignosis's vote for SVS yesterday stemmed from her vote for Quin on Day 1. Epignosis read through their interactions, and deduced that her vote was based on a pretty minor tiff.

More evidence of Epignosis reading Quin interactions, and that it's unlikely he actually forgot Quin was in the game.
You astound me.
Your response to my case is to write this game off as lacking rational thought and snarky remarks like this one.

I don't like these responses.

I don't care if you don't like them. I'm not trying to win your approval. You voted for me before I even said anything about forgetting Quin.

Marmot wrote:Another note.

One of the factors for Epignosis's vote for SVS yesterday stemmed from her vote for Quin on Day 1. Epignosis read through their interactions, and deduced that her vote was based on a pretty minor tiff.

More evidence of Epignosis reading Quin interactions, and that it's unlikely he actually forgot Quin was in the game.

You astound me.

Marmot wrote:
Epignosis wrote:So people think I would kill Eloh Night 1, and now MM thinks that when I'm bad, I'm more likely to forget things.

Mad house up in here.
Hardly.

I've made such comments like that before when I'm mafia, the one where you said "Oh, I forgot Quin was playing".

You were jonesing hard for a mafia game to get going, and you've been a driving force for discussion in this game. I don't believe that you forgot that Quin was in this game. I believe you felt like naming a player without offering a stance on him, a stance you had determined in the previous day phase already.

I have also been reading Phenom, the GoC, and Survivor on top of this. Quin is involved in all of those. The quote you pulled was something I said ages ago. Quin hasn't said anything here for a while. I forgot he was in this until I started looking for some place else to park my vote.

When you get into your 30s, have children, and teach high school, let me know how your memory is.

In the meantime, ask yourself what purpose a bad Epignosis would have in mentioning that he forgot Quin was even in this. I could have easily not said anything at all about him. Mafia tend to be more careful about what they say in the thread, no? If I already offered a stance on Quin, what have I to gain by acting like I don't have a stance on him (although I don't agree that forgetting Quin was involved equates to not having a stance on him)?

llama, what do you make of MM naming me his top suspect for forgetting about Quin?

So people think I would kill Eloh Night 1, and now MM thinks that when I'm bad, I'm more likely to forget things.

Mad house up in here.

DrWilgy wrote:
Epignosis wrote:I feel like there is zero rational thought taking place in this thread right now. Zero.
That makes you wrong again. Stop being wrong Epi.

That's my feeling. Feelings aren't wrong.

I feel like there is zero rational thought taking place in this thread right now. Zero.

Marmot wrote:If you're a civilian, I don't see how you would have forgotten a read or an interaction like that.

You my friend, are my top suspect behind jack right now.

If that's what does it for you.

You can join the rest of the clowns at the clown table who think I'd kill Eloh Night 1.

DrWilgy wrote:
Epignosis wrote:
Marmot wrote:
Epignosis wrote:
Marmot wrote:
Epignosis wrote:Deal with it mate. Jack has a team. My job is to find them. I don't accomplish that by going, "Okay, voting Jack."
Why did you vote for me?
No reason. Should I have a reason?
Given that you said this, then absolutely yes!
Oh wait, I did have a reason. I was just taking my vote off DrWilgy to give him some room so he wouldn't end up feeling like he had to vote Jack. You were just a bystander. I do not know if you are an innocent one.
You think I'd go out like a coward?

Recent interaction with Sawyer had me doubting my Epi read, oh well going back to that.

Go on.

Marmot wrote:
Epignosis wrote:I took my vote off of Wilgy and placed it on MM.

And I forgot Quin was even in this.
How did you forget Quin was in this game, you had a lengthy back-and-forth with him about whether or not you would murder FZ, and also called him a civilian.

Because I'm getting old and forget things, and Quin hasn't posted recently.

Marmot wrote:
Epignosis wrote:
Marmot wrote:
Epignosis wrote:Deal with it mate. Jack has a team. My job is to find them. I don't accomplish that by going, "Okay, voting Jack."
Why did you vote for me?
No reason. Should I have a reason?
Given that you said this, then absolutely yes!

Oh wait, I did have a reason. I was just taking my vote off DrWilgy to give him some room so he wouldn't end up feeling like he had to vote Jack. You were just a bystander. I do not know if you are an innocent one.

Marmot wrote:
Epignosis wrote:Deal with it mate. Jack has a team. My job is to find them. I don't accomplish that by going, "Okay, voting Jack."
Why did you vote for me?

No reason. Should I have a reason?

notsawyer540 wrote:
DrWilgy wrote:Are these not the same? We are still going to lynch JoH, but we are taking our time. Never did I specify phase. Also if Epi and I are teammates, why would've I waited for my teammate to float an idea? I could've just stated it myself. I also don't see a scenario where I'd ever adamantly stand on a view with a teammate, but that's just me.

Are you sying it's my fault a civ got lynched?

Linki - how is it logical? How? What logic did you use to decide this.
I'm saying you played a part.

As far as how it's logical, I discussed this to death before. Lynching someone we know is bad sooner rather than later gives us more time to avoid making the kind of mistake that lynching SVS was. Not only would we have had an extra day to make a more rational decision, the mafia kill a civ every night, so the odds of a mislynch go down every day.

No it doesn't. You don't get a bonus Day phase because you lynch Jack. You merely postpone actually having to do work. Lynching Jack Day 2 would also not preclude lynching S~V~S Day 3.

notsawyer540 wrote:
Epignosis wrote:I don't know. I'm not counting.
I wish I had been. It's quite a few, and iirc it hasn't been the confirmed baddie at all.

So moving my vote around a lot means I'm bad. Got it.

notsawyer540 wrote:
notsawyer540 wrote:Linkitis: I definitely believe it's in the realm of possibility. Epi helped us get Scotty (who wasn't even mafia) and then convinced a bunch of people to lynch SVS instead of a confirmed baddie.

Epignosis wrote:So the fact that I'm persuasive enough to get a bunch of people to vote for S~V~S makes me suspicious?

You're going to have to lynch someone who isn't Jack eventually. Doing so sooner was the preferred choice of many, irrespective of who got lynched.
Nothing wrong with being persuasive. I agreed with your assessment of Scotty on day one and helped lynch him. What I was talking about was the fact that you've helped lynch one indie role, one civ, and refuse to vote for someone you know is bad.

You're going to have to lynch Jack eventually. Doing so sooner is the more logical decision, irrespective of how many people you convince otherwise.

Deal with it mate. Jack has a team. My job is to find them. I don't accomplish that by going, "Okay, voting Jack."

notsawyer540 wrote:
Epignosis wrote:
notsawyer540 wrote:
Epignosis wrote:
Marmot wrote:
Epignosis wrote:I took my vote off of Wilgy and placed it on MM.

And I forgot Quin was even in this.
I'm busy.

Why'd you put your vote on me. You just asked everyone where they'd vote and why. What's your why?
My vote isn't on you. It's on notsawyer for the horrible theory about me he just posted.
You asked for people to post their ideas not relating to Jack and I answered. Seems a bit petty and insincere to vote against someone because they voiced suspicion against you. Not really a civ move imo.
My perspective of your theory is entirely sincere.
How many people have you voted for today?

I don't know. I'm not counting.

notsawyer540 wrote:Linkitis: I definitely believe it's in the realm of possibility. Epi helped us get Scotty (who wasn't even mafia) and then convinced a bunch of people to lynch SVS instead of a confirmed baddie.

So the fact that I'm persuasive enough to get a bunch of people to vote for S~V~S makes me suspicious?

You're going to have to lynch someone who isn't Jack eventually. Doing so sooner was the preferred choice of many, irrespective of who got lynched.

Long Con wrote:
Epignosis wrote:
notsawyer540 wrote:
Epignosis wrote:
Marmot wrote:
Epignosis wrote:I took my vote off of Wilgy and placed it on MM.

And I forgot Quin was even in this.
I'm busy.

Why'd you put your vote on me. You just asked everyone where they'd vote and why. What's your why?
My vote isn't on you. It's on notsawyer for the horrible theory about me he just posted.
You asked for people to post their ideas not relating to Jack and I answered. Seems a bit petty and insincere to vote against someone because they voiced suspicion against you. Not really a civ move imo.
My perspective of your theory is entirely sincere.
You think that notsawyer is bad and is putting forth a fraudulent theory that he doesn't really believe?

I'm in the process of figuring that out.

notsawyer540 wrote:
Epignosis wrote:
Marmot wrote:
Epignosis wrote:I took my vote off of Wilgy and placed it on MM.

And I forgot Quin was even in this.
I'm busy.

Why'd you put your vote on me. You just asked everyone where they'd vote and why. What's your why?
My vote isn't on you. It's on notsawyer for the horrible theory about me he just posted.
You asked for people to post their ideas not relating to Jack and I answered. Seems a bit petty and insincere to vote against someone because they voiced suspicion against you. Not really a civ move imo.

My perspective of your theory is entirely sincere.

Marmot wrote:
Epignosis wrote:I took my vote off of Wilgy and placed it on MM.

And I forgot Quin was even in this.
I'm busy.

Why'd you put your vote on me. You just asked everyone where they'd vote and why. What's your why?

My vote isn't on you. It's on notsawyer for the horrible theory about me he just posted.

I took my vote off of Wilgy and placed it on MM.

And I forgot Quin was even in this.

DFaraday wrote:I'm putting a vote on Jack for now. I'm not liking how Wilgy has three votes right now, for what seem to be three different reasons. Llama for the visual, but also a little because he didn't like Wilgy's SVS vote. Epi because he finds Wilgy's case against him forced and fabricated. LC because he doesn't like how jokey Wilgy is playing?

For the record, I don't agree with Wilgy's assessment of Epi, but I can see how a civ could come to that conclusion.

This is the kind of thing that loses games, DF.

You don't like why people are voting for Wilgy...why can't you offer some other insight? If Jack were not on the poll, where would you vote and why? That question goes to everybody. The level of participation this phase has been shite. There's an outed mafia member for crying out loud.

Say something.

MacDougall wrote:
Epignosis wrote:
Long Con wrote:
MacDougall wrote:Who said I was certain? I am more confident in my little read on you than anyone else seems to be on anything and you aren't gonna lynch yourself so might as well get a wagon cooking on someone. Why not Pingy McStrangepost himself?

A fool would be certain given such little evidence.
If he's good: This looks pretty legit

If he's bad: He accuses while simultaneously suggesting it's foolish to believe it.
In that last post, it seems like MacDougall is throwing in the towel trying to get his biggest suspect lynched...before he's actually done anything in earnest to get people to vote Jack.

Am I reading that incorrectly?
It sounds like you guys are just struggling to believe I am this good at Mafia.

If you can't persuade others to vote for your man, then no, you're not that good.

Marmot wrote:
Epignosis wrote:After reviewing MacDougall's posts and checking some time stamps, I'm not going to vote for him today.
Why time stamps?

The timing of posts in relation to other posts can provide clues. Circumstantial clues, but clues nonetheless.

See how long it took me to respond to you? I might have had to think about what to say.

After reviewing MacDougall's posts and checking some time stamps, I'm not going to vote for him today.

I turn my attention now to Floyd.

TheFloyd73 wrote:I'll bear the blame for missing the poll, I don't really have much of an excuse apart from being too engaged in my education.

Great voting guys. Man, Scotty's pic of a putrid, mutated creature makes me squeamish. It's not usually moral to lynch someone for posting an image, but this time it's justified.

notsawyer540 wrote:So is Ted Cruz dead or do we have to lynch him day 2? It says "he is" in the post where it says "he was" for Assange. So I'm assuming he have to lynch Jack next.

Note the nod. What is he nodding at? I can only conclude it is in response to "So I'm assuming he have to lynch Jack next."

TheFloyd73 wrote:I know any excuse for low posting is going to be held against me, so I won't bother exclaiming one.

From my brief reads, I can take this:
As already stated, Wilgy lost his usual cherpiness when Jack's role was revealed. That's a subtle detail that's well-pointed out. I don't feel implied to label him as scum at this stage, but I'm open to any change.
With Jack's role revealed, I can understand the benefits of lynching and not lynching him. When I have the time, I might investigate his associations and statements before Night 1.
Heck, Long Con holds a strong stance of being the interrogator. It makes it difficult to assume his alliance. I've seen it in other games as well. I know I'm probably stating the obvious, but doesn't anyone else think likewise with me?

In his next post (his fifth), the underlined occurs.

Floyd appeared enthusiastic about voting for Jack Day 2, but then said he could see benefit of leaving him alone. Then Floyd said he might do some work, but didn't deliver (hell, didn't even vote).

A minor thing, sure, but I'm combing for whatever I can find.

I also note that Floyd's only other interaction with anybody was with Eloh.

DrWilgy wrote:Have you ever expected Mac to do anything earnestly?

Good point.

Long Con wrote:
MacDougall wrote:Who said I was certain? I am more confident in my little read on you than anyone else seems to be on anything and you aren't gonna lynch yourself so might as well get a wagon cooking on someone. Why not Pingy McStrangepost himself?

A fool would be certain given such little evidence.
If he's good: This looks pretty legit

If he's bad: He accuses while simultaneously suggesting it's foolish to believe it.

In that last post, it seems like MacDougall is throwing in the towel trying to get his biggest suspect lynched...before he's actually done anything in earnest to get people to vote Jack.

Am I reading that incorrectly?

Long Con wrote:"Toing"?

going

DrWilgy wrote:You should when wierd can translate to baddie indicative. Are you toing to not care about that?

No.

DrWilgy wrote:Actually, I guess Mac did bus LC in talking heads, but LC wanted out of that game. It also wasn't right out of the gate.

Linki - 3. So you want me to see the following -
"It's not wierd that Epi is more alive than FZ right now even though he's a 'confirmed' civvie. It's not wierd that Epi wouldn't have been killed after Eloh because a confirmed civvie (SVS) stated that it was a frame (which implies civvynes). It's not wierd that the players voting for Epi now, missed that interaction, which was a decent bit of what the person we lynched yesterday said."

I don't care about something being weird.

DrWilgy wrote: 3. So is the scenario that both players that voted for you are bad and missed that framing interaction with you?

3. Not necessarily.

Damn stray tags.

DrWilgy wrote:
Epignosis wrote:
I am confirmed. Some people just don't agree.

I don't think the mafia knew that by killing Eloh Night 1, they would create that circumstance, and I didn't harp on it until this Day.

Killing FZ. is textbook Mafia strategy 101: Nobody was going to lynch FZ, were they?
1. Clearly
2. Why harp on it then? You acknowledge it is solely WIFOM yes?
3. Was anyone going to lynch you? SVS, a civ, pointed out "someone was trying to frame Epi" meaning the thought of you being civ was already there if the mafia had been watching the interaction.

[/quote][/quote]

2. Because. Nope.
3. I came into Day 3 taking two votes right out of the gate. I ain't having none of that.

Opinions on these Day 1 MacPosts® pretty please:

MacDougall wrote:Lynch jackofhearts team and we will be sitting pretty.

MacDougall wrote:
Jackofhearts2005 wrote:
thellama73 wrote:I don't think I'v played with Jack of Hearts before, but I'm finding him annoying. He apologized for not being "entertaining" enough. Entertainment is not the goal of the game, boyo. Finding baddies is. Take the snark down a notch, why don't you, and answer me this:

Who are looking at voting today and why?
I know this post was accidentally aimed at me but I'll answer anyway.

We were in Unfortunate Events together but you got lynched on Day 1.

If I had a day kill that I had to use this second, I'd shoot Mac. Three seconds in and he's sure I'm scum? Never played with him before so his certainty is either a bluff or a lie (depending on his alignment and if he's bad, how many scum he thinks exist outside his group). Plenty of townies are jokingly certain of scum on Day 1 but with two posts about it, I get the impression he isn't joking. Some townies can act really certain on Day 1 when they actually just have a hunch. Don't know Mac's meta to know if he plays that type of a townie game or if he's just looking for a mislynch or to look like he's contributing.

I'm not actually planning on voting for Mac, though. I'm planning on voting for whoever pings me enough that I want to lead a lynch or my top suspect that is getting enough votes to make them lynchable. (I don't vote third party very often cause I want my vote to matter.) I don't know who that is, yet, but I'll let you know.
Why you seem so bad then?

MacDougall wrote:Who said I was certain? I am more confident in my little read on you than anyone else seems to be on anything and you aren't gonna lynch yourself so might as well get a wagon cooking on someone. Why not Pingy McStrangepost himself?

A fool would be certain given such little evidence.

n.b. the colored text.

DrWilgy wrote:
Epignosis wrote:
DrWilgy wrote:Why were you killed instead of FZ Epi?
wut
If you are so confirmed civvy, why did FZ die? Several were still suspect of her.

And what leads you to that? Why is that hard to believe?

I am confirmed. Some people just don't agree.

I don't think the mafia knew that by killing Eloh Night 1, they would create that circumstance, and I didn't harp on it until this Day.

Killing FZ. is textbook Mafia strategy 101: Nobody was going to lynch FZ, were they?

DrWilgy wrote:In my head, we've hit a point where you not being bad is harder to believe due to the ammount of "hey look I'm so civvy because of these simple reasons!!"

I don't believe you genuinely believe this.

DrWilgy

I don't know. Ask Jack.

DrWilgy wrote:Why were you killed instead of FZ Epi?

wut

DrWilgy wrote:I can see a scenario where Epi was attempting to distance from DF, but wasn't expecting for more votes to go that way last cycle.

I'd like to lynch DF still.

A scenario that would require a few things to be true:

1. I'm bad.
2. I would kill Eloh Night 1.
3. I don't know how to distance from a teammate well.

DrWilgy wrote:
Epignosis wrote:
Marmot wrote:Why do you think he's civilian that is?
Chickenshit stuff. He gave a full assessment when under pressure to do so, but a lot of what he said didn't make any sense. He came in cool with lynching S~V~S as long as he wasn't getting the rope.

I see textbook DF is all.
Epignosis wrote:
DFaraday wrote:I won't be able to catch up on the thread until tonight, so I randomized Sawyer. I hate randomizing, but I haven't read since page 3 and literally have no suspicions yet.
This was Mon Feb 27, 2017 3:13 pm EST. I note that there were only seven pages, which means DF was only four pages behind. Surely he could have skimmed and made a more informed decision in that time, could he not?

DFaraday wrote:Finally caught up. Good result, all! RIP Elo.

I agree that there's no rush to lynch Jack, we just need to be careful about how close lynches are or he could tip the scales. Then again, I doubt he'd use that to save a teammate, but rather frame a civ.

To Sawyer: I have no suspicion of you. I randomized from everybody besides myself and it was you. That's all.
This next post is Wed Mar 01, 2017 3:15 am EST, over 36 hours later. In it, DF did nothing but talk about Jack- no mention of suspects, whom he would have voted had he been caught up, no ideas on who is a civilian- nada.

I'm voting DFaraday.
So you 180'd on DF?

Marmot wrote:Why do you think he's civilian that is?

Chickenshit stuff. He gave a full assessment when under pressure to do so, but a lot of what he said didn't make any sense. He came in cool with lynching S~V~S as long as he wasn't getting the rope.

I see textbook DF is all.

Marmot wrote:
Jackofhearts2005 wrote:Also, my team is Epi, LC, Marmot and Quin.
I've never been mafia with Epignosis though.

Or llama, or Sockface. How the hell does that happen?

Really?

I need to host something and make us bad together.

DrWilgy wrote:Epi, what are your current thoughts on DF?

That he needs to speak more.

But I'd call him a civilian at this moment.

I'm voting MacDougall.

I might have a careless oversight and leave it there.

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