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I don't think it was T-T, but like I said earlier, I had a crisis of confidence.Long Con wrote:Jack was town... was that whole ordeal town-town? I doubt it, at this stage of the game. MM is the only baddie we've got, right?juliets wrote:We need to see the votes - are we tied?
If I was right all along about Quin I'm going to be very frustrated.
This is something I hadn't thought about.speedchuck wrote:Also, it looks like LC might be an even night something as his claim. We could always lynch him tomorrow if anyone wants to test that.
Those are all of the arguments I have for lynching Soneji over LC, I think.
I'm just having a crisis of confidence on the Quin issue and the point about Jay targeting LC and seeing nothing was what compelled me to change my vote.Fredwood wrote:Quin and Soenji's votes I get, they're likely axed if they don't team up to vote out the other guy. The other players willingness to follow is a bit huh?Sloonei wrote:A role discrepancy that has existed all day.Quin wrote:The case is about a role related discrepancy. Do you think there's a lot of room for doubt?Sloonei wrote:These votes have all swung very easily against Long Con.
You're the one who convinced me. I don't know how Long Con gives the gun to you if Jay saw nothing when he targeted him.Sloonei wrote:These votes have all swung very easily against Long Con.
Hammer is at 7. No "sneaking" going on.Scotty wrote:This is why I think we should stay on soneji.juliets wrote:I'm going to
UNVOTE
VOTE Long Con
I don't trust juliets right now
We're awfully close to someone trying a sneak hammer
It goes another hour now. Until 11:00 eastern.Dyslexicon wrote:I thought day was ending in like 10 minutes, but it's more?
Hmm. Pretty good case on LC. How could he have given you the gun if he targeted no one? What's the explanation for that?Sloonei wrote:CliffNotes reasons to suspect Long Con: he claimed to have given me the gun on Night 2 after I had moved my focus onto him, despite there being no strong in-thread evidence to suggest I was on his townie radar at that point, and some evidence which even suggests I wasn't. I also have doubts that the gun was the gift of an individual player. Combine that with the fact of Jay's night 2 results: Long Con targeted no one. It looks like Long Con just pulled saved himself from being shot by lying through his teeth. Or fingers. Whatever.
I think he's bad and I think Soneji is bad too. Quin or Golden might be, I don't wish to offer a read on them right now though.
Only because I do expect it. And its true I'm not telling everything because I cant see that it's in the best interest of the town. So I'm depending on my ability to determine the right thing to do in this situation and I admit I might be doing the wrong thing.Dyslexicon wrote:It seems like you hold some info that should either make you pretty certain Quin is scum, or I just don't understand it. Also commenting that you expect to be lynched if he isn't scum is weird to me - why say that?juliets wrote:Oh I thought I answered that - No it doesntDyslexicon wrote:Does your qualms with Quin have something to do with Wilgy?juliets wrote:I thought there were 4 votes on Soneji?
linki Dyslexicon I'm sorry I didn't see a question. Should I go look for it or do you want to repeat it?
What do you mean my err?
Here is where I answered it. I just don't want you to think I ignored you.juliets wrote:No, it doesn't Dys.Dyslexicon wrote:@Juliets, Does your qualms with Quin has anything to do with Wilgy?
Oh I thought I answered that - No it doesntDyslexicon wrote:Does your qualms with Quin have something to do with Wilgy?juliets wrote:I thought there were 4 votes on Soneji?
linki Dyslexicon I'm sorry I didn't see a question. Should I go look for it or do you want to repeat it?
I haven't ruled out redundancy and I still might change my vote.Quin wrote:When I'm lynched I expect you to name the other doctor. I don't believe you haven't ruled out redundancy.juliets wrote:I may change my vote but for the moment I'm going to
Vote Quin
If he gets lynched and is town I will expect to get lynched after him.
No, it doesn't Dys.Dyslexicon wrote:@Juliets, Does your qualms with Quin has anything to do with Wilgy?
I think I responded based on the people who said that it was highly unlikely or 0% possible. The other posts were separate.Quin wrote:[
You heavily implied you don't believe that there are redundancies. You rekindled your idea that I'm lying because of my answer as to whether it was a possibility.
Oh ok, thanks for the explanation. Actually, my stance isn't that there can be no redundancies. I think Soneji and Golden said in a CF game anything is possible including overlap that screws with claiming. So, that looks like it's possible.Fredwood wrote:Quin is saying that because of your stance that there can be no redundancies, and Quin autopsies as the town odd night doctor, that then you must lynch the town odd night doctor that you are claiming to know the existence of, because the same argument would hold true for them.juliets wrote:I don't understand what this means. As I said, it could be that my inexperience with this set up is blinding me to an alternative I can't think of.Quin wrote:If you don't go balls to the wall against this second doctor after my flip, you are bad.juliets wrote:There are two things that could be true here and you not be lying: 1.) it's a redundancy. 2.) my lack of experience with this type of game set up is precluding me from seeing a way what I know to be true and you being an odd night doctor could simultaneously be true. I tried to clarify what I know to be true further with the hosts but as I said earlier today, they said it would be cheating for them to clarify any further than they've done.Quin wrote:If you aren't the doctor yourself, and you're under the impression there are two identical roles, why are you so sure I'm the one who is lying?juliets wrote:And I'll also say I'd like to believe your claim is true, and I've tried today to think of ways that it could be true but I just can't come up with anything other than we have a redundancy.
linki
I don't understand what this means. As I said, it could be that my inexperience with this set up is blinding me to an alternative I can't think of.Quin wrote:If you don't go balls to the wall against this second doctor after my flip, you are bad.juliets wrote:There are two things that could be true here and you not be lying: 1.) it's a redundancy. 2.) my lack of experience with this type of game set up is precluding me from seeing a way what I know to be true and you being an odd night doctor could simultaneously be true. I tried to clarify what I know to be true further with the hosts but as I said earlier today, they said it would be cheating for them to clarify any further than they've done.Quin wrote:If you aren't the doctor yourself, and you're under the impression there are two identical roles, why are you so sure I'm the one who is lying?juliets wrote:And I'll also say I'd like to believe your claim is true, and I've tried today to think of ways that it could be true but I just can't come up with anything other than we have a redundancy.
There are two things that could be true here and you not be lying: 1.) it's a redundancy. 2.) my lack of experience with this type of game set up is precluding me from seeing a way what I know to be true and you being an odd night doctor could simultaneously be true. I tried to clarify what I know to be true further with the hosts but as I said earlier today, they said it would be cheating for them to clarify any further than they've done.Quin wrote:If you aren't the doctor yourself, and you're under the impression there are two identical roles, why are you so sure I'm the one who is lying?juliets wrote:And I'll also say I'd like to believe your claim is true, and I've tried today to think of ways that it could be true but I just can't come up with anything other than we have a redundancy.
No, it doesn't.Quin wrote:No, I wouldn't. My brain would implode arguing that level of WIFOM. Does the second redirecting role that exists factor in to that conclusion?
I don't know Quin, would you? Because from where I sit either there are two doctors on the odd nights in the civ alignment or your claim is false. And I know I've said it already but I'll say it again, I am not claiming doctor.Quin wrote:Well, I am. All I can say is 'was all of this really necessary just so I could fake doctor claim?'juliets wrote:Then, as I said last night, I don't think you are telling the truth about your claim Quin unless the theory JJJ put forth last night is true.speedchuck wrote:Almost zero percent likely.Quin wrote:Unlikely. If Epi had a hand in balance, redundancy shouldn't be a thing.juliets wrote:Two doctor roles that operate on odd nights.Quin wrote:What do you mean by redundancy?juliets wrote:Soneji, Quin, and Golden:
Do you think it's likely that there is redundancy in the doctor role in the civ alignment? [Soneji you may not have gotten to the point yet that you understand why I'm asking this]
Would I make it obvious in my posts that I thought nutella was the cop on Day 2, not kill her that night and risk a cop check, kill her the next night just so I could go back and point out that I thought she was the cop, make a blatant meh moment in having contradictory reads on nutella and claiming doctor after shit hit the fan?
Come on.
Then, as I said last night, I don't think you are telling the truth about your claim Quin unless the theory JJJ put forth last night is true.speedchuck wrote:Almost zero percent likely.Quin wrote:Unlikely. If Epi had a hand in balance, redundancy shouldn't be a thing.juliets wrote:Two doctor roles that operate on odd nights.Quin wrote:What do you mean by redundancy?juliets wrote:Soneji, Quin, and Golden:
Do you think it's likely that there is redundancy in the doctor role in the civ alignment? [Soneji you may not have gotten to the point yet that you understand why I'm asking this]
Two doctor roles that operate on odd nights.Quin wrote:What do you mean by redundancy?juliets wrote:Soneji, Quin, and Golden:
Do you think it's likely that there is redundancy in the doctor role in the civ alignment? [Soneji you may not have gotten to the point yet that you understand why I'm asking this]
Hopefully he can answer some of the important questions that have arisen about her actions.sprityo wrote:MP07 will be filling in for Eloh. He is of course very busy and is mostly going to just submit night actions
Golden, is there anything I could review that speedchuck has done or said that would help me understand what you are seeing? I have been reading him as town.Golden wrote:I feel the need to read speedchuck. He *feels* town but last time I analysed him I didn't like what felt like feigned ignorance.
@Speed - why are you town?
Could you explain what that is?Sloonei wrote:My first thought when I see something about marking is a demolition man.
Do you feel like only one of JOH or Quin is bad?JaggedJimmyJay wrote:As the day wears on I am find myself returning/regressing to my suspicion of JOH too. If I were to make a bulleted list of scummy things said/done by every player, his list would be the longest.
Thanks Fred and I understand about today being a cluster fuck. I would still love to see some reads from you.Fredwood wrote:juliets wrote:
Fred - 3 - I read his posts and it seemed he mentioned Jack was probably bad a lot yet doesn't rate Jack in his top two. I thought this was odd. Fred, have you been burned badly by Jack in the past? It feels like you think you have to keep mentioning him as bad.
I don't think I have been specifically burned by him, the only time I actually remember being burned by a player was Adamical. I may have been in games where he did burn someone, but I was probably dead by then. If I make it to the end game I have a high win percentage, so It's not that, but in general I've found that my best approach with Jack is to be careful unless given a reason to put him strongly into one category (Town) or the other (scum).
What makes me think he's a suspect is that he keeps misrepresenting my posts, which makes me distrust his other posts regarding others. Additionally, part of the read is based of process of elimination. He keeps harping on that I proffered a theory about strong players wanting to discredit each other early in the game, when 3 strong players were each fighting each other simultaneously. I thought it was an interesting interaction and pointed it out. He then twists it and then uses it as the only proof he really has that he thinks I am bad. The rest of his stuff isn't committal, or just not accurate, and he keeps changing those non-committal reads without any follow up even though I address what he accused me of and he doesn't respond. Up until today I really didn't have a ton of strong thoughts one way or the other and felt there was a slight scum tinge to his game along with a few other people and a number of actual targets. I don't know where people are saying I rank him 3rd among my targets, I might put him in the bottom 3 now but I haven't really done a read list yet.
It feels like today specifically that he wants me to lynching him or Quin, when I think that argument has been exhausted to that point, and I still don't really trust either of them, apparently this train is going to a hospital. And as such am unsure who to go after...I will admit that I am non-commital on that specific argument, because today has been a massive clusterfuck.
I know. I don't know what to say. Maybe there is something I'm not thinking about. The hosts are no help to me, they say it would be cheating if they tell me that. Or maybe there is redundancy.Long Con wrote:Quin wasn't even under that much suspicion, though. He didn't make the claim out of desperation.juliets wrote:If we assume no redundancy then it's a 9, the 1 being for something that I just can't contemplate because of my lack of experience.JaggedJimmyJay wrote:It's quite speculative still. The theory wouldn't require two roleblockers though -- the bad roleblocker would have blocked both of us.juliets wrote:So then for those who think Quin is civ, the dynamic would be he was blocked by the good role blocker and JJJ by the baddie role blocker?
On a scale of 1-10, how much does Quin's role claim stink to you? 10 is Limburger cheese.
If we assume no redundancy then it's a 9, the 1 being for something that I just can't contemplate because of my lack of experience.JaggedJimmyJay wrote:It's quite speculative still. The theory wouldn't require two roleblockers though -- the bad roleblocker would have blocked both of us.juliets wrote:So then for those who think Quin is civ, the dynamic would be he was blocked by the good role blocker and JJJ by the baddie role blocker?
On a scale of 1-10, how much does Quin's role claim stink to you? 10 is Limburger cheese.
I moved you up after I re-read you, I just didn't post a new list.Strawhenge wrote:I understand not being in the greener parts of people's rainbow lists, but I cannot fathom how I'm in the red of some. If it's just for low activity, that's pretty weak.
Read my 4's as "baddie lite" and my 3's as I'm on the fence.Jackofhearts2005 wrote:Hi, Juliets.
Point of clarification. You have a lot of 3s in your reads but you also list two players as scum by process of elimination.
Could you walk me through what separates your 3s from your 4s?
Linki- Now that Straw looks better to you, who looks worse? You got a ton in the middle.
Golden, on the subject of your progression, you indicate you didn't have much of a read on nutella when you did your first reads on Marmot. I took this to mean once you got a civ read on nutella it influenced your thoughts on marmot because she came out against him. I checked her posts and your posts though and you changed your read on marmot before nutella came out against him. Maybe I am misunderstanding what you are saying about the relationship between the two in your mind. Could you clarify?Golden wrote: <snip>
2) Jay, it's true I didn't have much of a progression in marmot. One thing you left out is the first reads post (where I had him as town) was so early that I didn't even have a read on nutella yet. I liked his map cover and the way he handled himself around it. I didn't like much else thereafter. I referenced Dune which was a game where he lacked in any real content. That's exactly what he felt like here.
On the day he was lynched, I had to be absent and had very little time to contribute, so it is an accurate observation to say I didn't push my marmot suspicion much but I didn't really push any much (even inh, who I voted for). I wish I could say who I would have voted for or what I might have contributed if I was around, but I can't. I think it would probably have been marmot, but perhaps my participation in the thread would have seen inh lynched and delayed the marmot vote. Who knows.
ok, sorry - take your time, it was a busy nightLong Con wrote:Still catching up a bit from last night, Jules.juliets wrote:Long Con! Thank goodness! Do you have any reads this morning?Long Con wrote:Hi Juliets.
Long Con! Thank goodness! Do you have any reads this morning?Long Con wrote:Hi Juliets.
