The Syndicate

We need more letters. Get ready to give a good one if they offer.

nvm no t

that isn't to be?

is it "blocks" or "block" - i thought i only saw 5 dashes but maybe i just can't see them well.

I am voting Karn as it seems to be associated with regeneration which I see as a good thing.

Also, regarding the decoding, there must be a list of letters that the author (bwt or bea) has already given us in the quotes. Does anyone have a list of the letters that are already accounted for?

So zeek, as it stands now you don't suspect enrique, have I got that right?

MP, any thoughts on who they were steering away from? Or would you rather not say at night.

fingersplints wrote: Epig. Bye Nikki and Boogs but welcome back juliets and TH.

Gotrees wrote:Idk, I think right now I'm leaning towards Periboea (assuming that's what the hosts meant by Perbia). Hopefully that dead man walking is a good thing and not a bad thing. If both Kolm and Periboea offer resurrection, I'd rather deal with some explorer/warewolf duo than with an evil Time Lord. Gonna leave my vote there unless someone can come up with a better reason to go somewhere else.

I'm also going to vote this option. I don't like the sound of helping the evil time lord at Karn (you say Kolm here but I see mentions of the time lords in your description of Karn), but possible resurrection sounds like good idea. Also this option has the hostesses name in it

At Karn, do they have to help the evil time lord? I thought he was just there, but I haven't seen any of these Who episodes.

Hello everyone I am now juliet 2.0, starting over as a different character. This means I can't speak as juliet 1.0, that character is dead. Where it is relevant though I may have to comment as a third party on something that went on there if it is relevant. And also welcome Turnip Head 2.0!

I attempted to keep reading through the game even after I died but I have to admit last night was a whirlwind I'm glad I wasn't involved in because it was hard to keep up. I'm not sure I could articulate what happened other than at the end of the whirlwind Epi was dead. That's two lynches now that seemed like they were a rush at the end. I don't know if there is anything to that, it's just an observation.

I need to decide who to read back on, as when I was reading the game after my death I wasn't reading as a participant, just an interested bystander. I just need to decide who I see as the most suspicious and do some research.

Also, Karn seems like the best choice to me based on Gotrees summaries (thanks Gotrees). I think I'll wait just a bit in case someone comes up knowing more about that evil doctor who is there and how much of a danger he is.

I can see everything you say

Just keep telling yourself that that reworded post meant I was bad. Keep telling yourself.

changing wording is not a big deal. How often do you change your wording on things? It was totally innocent - dont try to absolve yourself.

zeek wrote:

S~V~S wrote:

zeek wrote:Ah, I thought you meant her reasoning for posting differently.

Spacedaisy wrote:But she could have just been changing her mind between the two posts, I don't know.

I asked her why she didn't copy and paste. She said it was too much of a bother, not that she'd changed her mind.

Thats kinda quibbly, to be honest. I will reserve judgment until we see how she flips, but if that is the entire basis of the case against her that is kinda weak. I hope you are right.

The problem is how it changed.

he's not right - you will see.

Oh, and note that no one defended me before it got out of hand. That should be a big tell.

I'll vote enrique to try to save myself. Probably a lost cause but I've done everything I can think of to show I'm civ. You will find out when i flip that you were wrong, those of you who voted for me. For those other than MP and Epi, take a look at what happened in my lynch and how you were manipulated or how others got manipulated. Something happened late in the day that was no big deal yet it ends up lynching someone because there was no time to properly discuss it.. Baddies love that kind of situation. And don't use the excuse "Oh but it is day 1". This could have been prevented if people thought for themselves, and I'm especially talking to the two people who just bandwagoned without knowing what the issues were. You know who you are.

So good luck civs, you're going to need it.

Here's the two quotes contained in all the other quotes.

Epignosis wrote:

Turnip Head wrote:

Epignosis wrote:

juliets wrote:Epi since you are so good at picking out baddies I've been trying to piece together your suspicion of enrique but it would be more helpful if you could just give a short list of the things that have hit you about enrique. I was sure I wouldn't vote him but I want to make sure I understand why you are.

This is worded very differently than what you accidentally posted in Monty Python:

juliets wrote:I think I may have to retract my statement about not voting for zeek, enrique or mp. I am piecing together Epigs suspicion of Enrique and it holds more water than I thought. Epi you could make this easier by just listing the reasons you voted for him. Just a few key words even.

I am reminded of a certain evil dragon who piggybacked on my suspicions for several days, getting me to elaborate on them.

I don't want to make things easier. Why don't you tell me what you've pieced together about Enrique now that he has three votes?

Is that second quote from a different thread?

Yes. Mistakenly posted in a different thread.

S~V~S wrote:Wait Zeek did not say that, changing it to Rey cause i want to poke him and make him post!!!

Linki~ Juliets, can you link me to the post, I have no idea what the issue is.

ok sure give me a minute

and epignosis the only way i know how is to go through copy and paste

zeek wrote:I don't get why you didn't copy and paste, juliets?

too much trouble

Elohcin wrote:Looks like Juliets is the way to go today.

Elo, why did you vote for me? Just give me a couple or reasons.

You would be defensive too if you were a civ and were going to be lynched for no good reason.

Enrique wrote:That sounds like a pretty specific role claim to me...

I don't think I buy it. But it's pretty ballsy when whoever actually has that role could be out there. Then again, you could just tell us "that's not what you meant."

Read my sentence again - i did not say i don't have a power. And I don't think I should say anymore because of the rules.

Turnip Head wrote:Juliets why did you change some of the words in your cross post?

I decided not to put in the part about retracting what I had said earlier because I really wasn't sure I wanted to do that. If I didn't find enrique to be bad then by saying I retracted my earlier statement I would have just confused the hell out of everyone. "I'm not voting for any of them" "Oh, maybe i will vote for one - let me ask about enrique" "I stand by my earlier statment and don't retract". I thought it would be too confusing and make me look wishy washy so decided not to put it in. It was just one of those blink of an eye decisions. Oh also, if another word changed or something I'm not aware of it. I didn't copy and paste from the other thread I just made a brand new post.

I can't keep answering these posts. Vote me, one and all vote me. The civs won't lose much in terms of a power they will just lose my vote.

Bullzeye wrote:Should have voted and gone to bed hours ago but kinda glad I didn't because I wouldn't have known what to do then. This whole thing with Juliets looks quite suspicious, she almost seems to suck up to Epi with the whole 'since you're so good at picking out baddies comment'. It also makes it as though he's responsible for her vote and is the one who should be held accountable if she ended up voting for a civ. Not to mention she's basically saying she'll vote where someone else tells her to when there's no reason to really trust anyone that much yet. It just doesn't look good to me so I'm going to *Vote Juliets* and leave for the night.

I NEVER said I was going to vote someone just because someone else did. If someone has a suspicion I want to understand it - maybe the points are good or maybe they are bullshit like the suspicions Epi had for enrique (obviously bullshit because he didn't even wait for me to replay to his questions before he quickly changed to me). I want to understnad the suspicion so I know whether to add it to my own body of knowledge or not. And you didn't even let me answer this before you voted? Bullshit again.

After the lynch is over Epi is going to say he is not sorry because, he will say, I did baddie things. Or made mistakes that couldn't be corrected. Keep in mind people make mistakes like posting in the wrong thread all the time - civs and baddies It sure would be nice to know what those baddie things are that I did. Please the rest of you, hound Epi when he says something is so and make him explain himself. This is what happens when you let him get away with thinking things are one way and no one challenges him. Remember if you are civ it could be you next. He and someone else votes for you, people come in the thread who are tired and just take the easy way.

Made i took out the line that i might have to retract my thought that enrique, mp and zeek were all good. I just decided not to post that line and otherwise left it intact. And I have no idea why that is baddie behavior. i knew Epi was there in the other thread and saw it because he pointed it out to me. So, I certainly wasn't trying to hide anything. And what would I be hiding, that I was starting to have doubts about enrique? I asked Epi a question about what he saw in Enrique so that was hardly a secret. I do not understand what about that makes me a suspect.

You picked me out as a baddie in the last game we played and like this game, I was civ. I'm just one of those you can't read.

Ok, if you think it makes me bad - did you ever explain how it makes me bad, asking someone to help understand their own case and changing what they are saying in the thread - but if you do you lose a civ vote if I get lynched. I think I'm just a convenient target.

Epignosis wrote:

Turnip Head wrote:

Epignosis wrote:

juliets wrote:Epi since you are so good at picking out baddies I've been trying to piece together your suspicion of enrique but it would be more helpful if you could just give a short list of the things that have hit you about enrique. I was sure I wouldn't vote him but I want to make sure I understand why you are.

This is worded very differently than what you accidentally posted in Monty Python:

juliets wrote:I think I may have to retract my statement about not voting for zeek, enrique or mp. I am piecing together Epigs suspicion of Enrique and it holds more water than I thought. Epi you could make this easier by just listing the reasons you voted for him. Just a few key words even.

I am reminded of a certain evil dragon who piggybacked on my suspicions for several days, getting me to elaborate on them.

I don't want to make things easier. Why don't you tell me what you've pieced together about Enrique now that he has three votes?

Is that second quote from a different thread?

Yes. Mistakenly posted in a different thread.

Yes I posted in the other game i was playing by mistake. I reposted in this game but decided not to retract my statement just yet. The post I had seen that caught my attention again was the one where you told us to vote for him. That's a pretty hard stance and made we want to look at what was behind it. I tracked down what I just posted but the evidence didn't persuade me.

I'm probably going to vote for someone not on any of these lists we've been discussing.

Well in terms of enrique you offered this with no explanation other than later when you said Enrique had done something that you had done when you were bad. I guess that pertains to this post:

http://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/viewto ... 091#p85091


You said some of his posts didn't sound genuine.

And you said this:

Epignosis wrote:I am telling you to vote for Enrique. What do I have to gain from this?

If he is lynched and is bad, then I get Night killed.

If he is lynched and is good, then I get lynched.

Which is par for the course for me.

Vote for Enrique.

That's all I find so I am not compelled to vote for Enrique.

Why are you voting for zeek MR?

Sorry for the double post but I want to correct something I said earlier. Bass and Elo have posted but I can't find anywhere that Gotrees has posted.

linki zeek:
I wouldnt be shocked if one of the talkative ones is bad but I think for the moment the rest of the baddies are just watching. That's imho.

Made, how will you determine how someone wants to be perceived to compare it with your angle?

Made, questioning is my normal state in a mafia game, so I guess if you want to call it an angle you can.

Neither have bass or eloh. I do know Nikki was looking for some help on the game of mafia.

MP the fact that I didn't think you were bad doesn't mean I thought you were a civ. I was still open to thoughts about you. The points TH made resonated with me while nothing else had. I had choice to make which I didn't articulate but it was either random the ones who are not even contributing feelings or vote for you based on the ping of TH's post. I decided to vote for you. That's all there was to it. I think one other person had voted for you so it certainly wasn't a bandwagon.

Epi since you are so good at picking out baddies I've been trying to piece together your suspicion of enrique but it would be more helpful if you could just give a short list of the things that have hit you about enrique. I was sure I wouldn't vote him but I want to make sure I understand why you are.

<SNIP>

MovingPictures07 wrote:Okay, I did a re-read skim. Unfortunately, nothing really stuck out to me. A few players that are making me a bit wary but I don't know that I'd vote for them include S~V~S and juliets. S~V~S has had a surprising mix of being in the background and yet posting a lot without really saying much of anything. Definitely ringing bells for me. BUT I can't really read her for crap 90%+ of the time, so... I don't know there. juliets latched pretty quickly onto TH's thoughts against me and then backed off saying there was still much time left in the lynch, but she's been especially latching onto others for opinions and I know she can do that often regardless of alignment, but it strikes me as a bit too much and the timing of her "vote" (but not really a vote) post seemed opportunistic.

You're right MP, early in games I tend to go with something logical I've seen in the thread regardless of my alignment. It's only when the game thins out that I begin seeing things myself. It's just my game.

I don't understand your point about my non-vote. I thought the vote closed last night and I was voting close to the end. Noticed it wasn't til tonight and of course didn't vote. What is "opportunistic" about that? I haven't really understood this word "opportunistic" since it's become a mafia word. It seems to be a word someone uses when they just didn't like what someone did but doesn't have anything concrete to say. If you can explain what you mean by my timing being opportunistic maybe i will understand.

Maybe I missed it Dom but why did you vote for Enrique?

Hmm...so both Epi and Daisy think MP is not bad. That carries some weight with me and makes me a little uneasy about a vote for MP. Maybe what's been bothering me is I find his behavior with zeek inappropriate and that leads me to baddie. But, one of Epi's points is you can be inappropriate and still be good. I really need for the silent ones to say something. Speak up, put your opinion out there.

Oh wait!!!! The vote isnt until tomorrow!! No wonder no one is here. I am not voting MP at this time - there is plenty more time for something to happen.

Well, the football game has started and I'm going to lose track of time so I'd better vote. The biggest thing I can find to vote for is TH's comments about MP. I really hate this because i know MP wants to play and that he has been eliminated the in the beginning of too many games. But, I can't find anything else that resonates with me so I'm voting MP. I hope the rest of this group votes, its not fair to decide a lynch with a group of this size with so few people.

SVS, who are you leaning for at this point in time? And where is everyone?? (I don't expect you to know). It looks like about 5 of us are going to decide this lynch.

I'm kind of at a loss for this first vote. TH's post about MP's actions really struck a cord with me. At the same time I know he does these kinds of things often. And I'm certainly not going to vote zeek or enrique, and don't see the SVS case. Anyone seen suspicious behavior from anyone else in this game?

Made wrote:

juliets wrote:TH, when you are talking about "gambit" I get the impression it is the same thing as making a bullshit move, but then again your use of the word gambit makes me think it means something special. What does "gambit" mean to you as used in this MP discussion? And you brought up some points that I hadn't really thought about in the way you stated them.

Gambits (in terms of chess anyways) is a move where you give up something (normally a piece or positioning) In hopes of gaining something later. Tons of fun when executed well in mafia. The important thing to realize where the gambit actually lies in this scenario.

when MP faked his opinions on Zeek with the intent of gaining information two things could of happened( that i could think of anyways....)
If it succeeds: MP gains reads on people that could directly lead to a lynch

If it fails: MP has to reveal that he changed his mind, and looks like a baddie attempting to bail on a bad lynch

Imo, he screwed up twice: He showed his hand too early and didn't account enough for the fact that people don't like to be manipulated.

There's always the possibility that he did actually distrust zeek at the beginning of the game for the reasons he stated, but based on how odd the argument against Zeek was, i find that unlikely as asking about roles isn't very suspicious imo.

linki- If civvie vibes existed everyone would have them.

Also thanks to you made - helped me to understand what gambit means.

And no, sorry you cannot edit posts. Thats a rule that extends to all mafia on this site no matter what your permissions are.

Turnip Head wrote:@Juliets: MP and others described his move as a gambit which is why I put it in quotations, but to me that's a misnomer. I think it was baddie-motivated entrapment. And I think he's calling it a gambit to cover up his perceived misfire at Zeek, and is now using that as an excuse to develop suspicions on Enrique. I think SVS pretty accurately described this type of behavior as "manic". Not getting civvie vibes from MP at all.

Ok TH, I had forgotten MP said that first and thanks for the explanation.

TH, when you are talking about "gambit" I get the impression it is the same thing as making a bullshit move, but then again your use of the word gambit makes me think it means something special. What does "gambit" mean to you as used in this MP discussion? And you brought up some points that I hadn't really thought about in the way you stated them.

Epignosis, I would like you to take a look at my post about what the Enrique suspision is all about and tell me if you would add anything to it.

I read back what I saw others say about enrique and I just want to verify that the only things he did were question zeek about supatown (which i still have no idea what it means) and say that he always see's SVS and Epi's behavior this way yet he hasn't played with us for a year or two. Is there something else out there that he did that I'm missing? I know there were some long posts and maybe I didn't get the jist of something. Frankly I see the SVS comment as more suspicious but that doesn't seem like a good enough reason to vote for him right now.

We are really missing a lot of people who are not talking at all which always makes me nervous.

Epignosis in answer to the question about why you voted Enrique you referred us back to a post where MP made comments about what he saw about Enrique. Are you trying to say you have the same reasons? Can you just list the reasons in your post so this won't be so confusing? It should be no problem since you so recently voted for him.