The Syndicate

Since it's looking like I'll probably go, I think once I'm gone y'all should look at Made. I presented a comprehensive response to his reasons for suspecting me, and he still voted me without addressing anything I said. And probably Canuck, for obvious reasons.

Bass, Roxy, I promise you I'm a civvie. If I survive, I will do whatever I can to find the real baddies, but our numbers are so bad right now that I'm worried.

Ricochet wrote:

DFaraday wrote:I, for one, think that since Vomps is the active player his vote should count and not Daisy's.

Daisy's vote is not going to be counted, DF, didn't you see Mongoose's post?

I did not, I must have missed it while skimming at some point. That's my secret, Cap, I'm always a terrible Mafia player.

I, for one, think that since Vomps is the active player his vote should count and not Daisy's.

S~V~S wrote:So...why did you have reason to think he was a Hack? No baddie lynches as of the time you made that post, and I did not think the kill patterns said much. Did I miss something?

You did. I suspected him of being a Hack because he was one of the people gathering suspicion just prior to the first thread lock, and I theorized whoever locked the thread had done it to avoid taking votes (which seems to have been the case). Also, when I started bringing that theory forward, MM was trying to discredit it, which made me think he had something to do with it.

Well, time to vote myself. Just kidding, *voting Canuck*.

Dom wrote:

DFaraday wrote:

Metalmarsh89 wrote:Why a Hack and not a Brother?

I am very interested to hear your reasons there.

Because when I tried to investigate the circumstances surrounding the Boll thread lock, you reacted as if that was a shady thing to do. I wonder if you don't want anyone looking into it.

I'll keep you and your family in prayer Bass!

Is this the only reason why?

Yes. I had no reason to think he was a Brother.

Dom, you already voted, but you should know as well as anyone that I actually apply myself when I'm a civ, and am certainly more outspoken. As a baddie I try not to rock the boat or draw attention (which if Made were right, I've been doing a whole lot of).

Made wrote: This isn't a typical lynch scenario. I know that If I were to arrive in the thread before it was locked, I would of voted DF, so i'd hesitate to say that the lynch was a lost cause for MM. With that in mind, I think it's likely that MM and DF were on the same team.

In order to distance more effectively, DF voted for MM, whom he knew was bad then gave MM the high sign to lock the thread.

It's worth noting that both DF and MM had yet to vote when the thread was locked to kill Made 1.0, serving to allow them a way to avoid suspicion for the coming day.

As I recall, Bass had in spirit cast his vote for MM, Dom was expressing intention to vote MM, and none of the low posters had mentioned me, so I'd say it was pretty close to a runaway. Also, since both he and I had been under suspicion prior to the start of the day, wouldn't it have made more sense for one of our supposed team to vote someone else at the start of the day, then immediately lock the thread? For that matter, if we were on the same team why bother locking the thread at all? All that would accomplish is bringing even more scrutiny onto me (as it indeed has).

Made wrote: It's important to realize that all the post above are all the post-- in order-- that DF has made on MM. If he felt that MM was a hack or even was confused and thought MM for reasons x or y, he hadn't brought it up until after he voted... and multiple other people voted for MM.

This is willful misrepresentation. There are three posts regarding or addressing MM which you failed to mention. I still haven't figured out how to multiquote, but anyone can look at my posts to see that I believed that the thread had been locked by someone who had been under suspicion shortly before, and I called out MM as trying to discredit my thread theory (which was apparently right). You make it seem as if I just voted MM out of the blue and without any logical thought progression.

Also, you cite my mention of MM being a Hack as a slip up, even though I clearly stated why I thought him more likely to be a Hack than a Brother.

Canuck, I was referring to this post in particular:

Canucklehead wrote:Yeah, I have a feeling MM is a done deal at this point, but I'm going to vote for DF, too. I think he's trying waaaay to hard to stir shit up ("Hey guys! Isn't this thing weird? We should totally look closer at it because it's likely baddie behaviour but I'm being very careful not to say anything definitive or come down hard on one side or the other so that I can always backpedal if my pot stirring doesn't work out. I'm also not interested in providing thoughts on anything else that's going on or conversations that are happening, I really just want everyone to notice that I'm here and pointing out really suspicious things but not things that I'm personally willing to vote based on"....is totally how virtually all his posts read to me this game).

It reads to me as if you were referencing both of my topics of discussion (LC and the thread lock). It seemed like you were writing off both as simply pot-stirring attempts, which is why I referenced you in regards to the thread lock.

Ricochet wrote:

So Daisy voted for me right before being replaced? I don't even remember her mentioning me before (or anything else she said).

In answer to your question, Rico, I am leaning civ on most of the NKed players, which is not inspiring much hope at this point. I do agree a posible MM/Canuck link is worth looking into, since she was one of his defenders.

I don't really have a read on Dom, but I'd say civ if I had to guess. His play doesn't feel as calculated as in recent games where he was a baddie.

I was right! MM was the most suspicious of the discussees before the previous lock. But I really don't know why he'd do it when he's the vote leader. It definitely seemed like most of the remaining voters were going for MM anyway, so maybe he just wanted to cause chaos?

I don't want to speculate too much about this event because people don't seem to like it when I do.

Bye MM!

Ugh, my mistake, that was Canuck, not you. I was conflating both of your suspicions of me into one amorphous mass, apparently. I retract my Hack statement, but nothing else.

Metalmarsh89 wrote:Why a Hack and not a Brother?

I am very interested to hear your reasons there.

Because when I tried to investigate the circumstances surrounding the Boll thread lock, you reacted as if that was a shady thing to do. I wonder if you don't want anyone looking into it.

I'll keep you and your family in prayer Bass!

Canucklehead wrote:Yeah, I have a feeling MM is a done deal at this point, but I'm going to vote for DF, too. I think he's trying waaaay to hard to stir shit up ("Hey guys! Isn't this thing weird? We should totally look closer at it because it's likely baddie behaviour but I'm being very careful not to say anything definitive or come down hard on one side or the other so that I can always backpedal if my pot stirring doesn't work out. I'm also not interested in providing thoughts on anything else that's going on or conversations that are happening, I really just want everyone to notice that I'm here and pointing out really suspicious things but not things that I'm personally willing to vote based on"....is totally how virtually all his posts read to me this game).

I voted MM, didn't I? Yes, in part to save myself, but I am more and more convinced that he is a Hack.

And yes, I'm not very committal. I never am. You two don't play much with me, but I'm not Llama or MP or Epig. I never just throw myself in 100% to something unless I'm absolutely positive I'm right.

Metalmarsh89 wrote:

DFaraday wrote:

Black Rock wrote: RIP Made. I am certain the baddies locked the thread when three civvies were tied at one vote each, giving them a free lynch. I would have probably voted Made if I could have just because the other two I am certain are civvie and I had no idea if he was or not.

That was my thinking as well. Although I wouldn't necessarily say that the three who were tied were civvie, simply that they are not Hacks. I am leaning civ on MM at this point, though.

Way to justify your vote with something that contradicts your last read on me.

Guys, I really think we should lynch DF today, not me.

That was before you seemed dead set on discrediting everything I try to look into. It feels like you don't want anyone to examine the events going on the game for some reason.

I'm thinking it's level 1.

And as I've explained before, even though I'm leaning civ on LC, I'm not positive, and I just didn't think that possibility should be ignored all around.

Anyway, *voting MM* mainly for self-defense, but also because I think he's the shadiest of the people I've been looking at.

Canucklehead wrote:

S~V~S wrote:So you agree with Faraday, Canuck?

I see that kind of thing as more of a baddie frame up than as something LC would actually do. I have played lots of games with LC over the years, and I do not ever recall him to make a move so lacking in finesse.

No, I don't agree with DF. Like I said, I think LC is civ.

I'm pretty sure that's what I said. I just want to explore all possibilities.

Speaking of, looking over Night 4/Day 5, it seems that MM, Dom, and Roxy were all gathering suspicion shortly before the locked thread. I feel pretty good about Dom and Roxy, not sure about MM (he has a lot of posts to look over).

Long Con wrote:I cast my vote for DFaraday, who now has tried to introduce thread actions resulting from baddie moves (the Llama kill, the Uwe Boll thing)... I think he's a baddie who wants certain results from those actions.

How would you rather I play? Just vote people based on intuition?

Canucklehead wrote:Today I'm likely voting for Bass, DF, SD, or (outside chance) Dom. Bass, DF, and SD for being extreme low-liers, Dom 'cuz a have a gut feeling (but those have sucked this game, so I'm not too inclined to follow that again).

Still don't understand why MM is on everyone's lists. I've re-read him already, but I guess I'll give a re-read to his main suspector/accuser SVS and see if I can figure out why you all feel so unsure of him.

I wouldn't say I'm an extremely low lier these days. It just takes me a while to warm up in most games.

Anyway, since we have had no success yet, today I'm going to work off of a theory. Uwe Boll apparently locked the thread when there were 3 votes, so presumably none of those players are Hacks. My belief is that he probably locked the thread because he or one of his teammates had been under suspicion, and he didn't want them to take votes. I'm going to go back and see who was being discussed during the day and night prior to the thread lock.

Long Con wrote:Ok, but if you look at it from my point of view, the baddies try to frame me, and it's not totally catching on, so I watch for who tries to push it. You did, and though you say what you just said, that looks like you backing off. I'm sure you can appreciate that perspective.

I can see how it looks that way, sure. And like I said in my original post, I don't think you would be that obvious. I just think we would have been remiss without discussing the fact that you were Llama's top suspect right before he died.

*Votes TH* That felt like more than just idle speculation on a role.

Long Con wrote:No, wait, I mean DFaraday! DFaraday is the one that will probably get my vote today. He knows why.

For pointing out the obvious? I don't even particularly think you're bad.

Metalmarsh89 wrote:You may have concluded that, but I could find no such statement that said what you thought of him. Your post that you mention was a summary of his gameplay up until now. Thanks for answering. What changed your mind from indifferent to civ?

His posts feel sincere to me, and the more I think about the thing with Dom, the more it feels like just a random squabble than something shady.

Metalmarsh89 wrote:

DFaraday wrote:I haven't gone over the case on TH just yet (I'm about to), but is everyone just ignoring that Llama said he intended to vote for LC today and then gets killed that very night? I doubt LC would be that unsubtle, but I think it strengthens the need to look into his posts/votes more closely.

Certainly not. And I'm glad I didn't discuss it last night because that may well have been why llama met his fate. I know this doesn't clear llama as civ, but the odds are much higher, even than before.

I also don't trust you one bit DF. You were speculating on whether we should trust BWT several days ago for dying and coming back twice, and now I get the feeling you are diverting attention from his case on TH. You also never answered my question from a couple days ago.

Having a suspicion is diverting attention? Don't you want to explore every possible avenue? Having looked over it, I actually think BWT's case is pretty good, and I'm more inclined to vote TH than LC. I just don't want people to ignore what could be a brazen baddie move.

And I did post re: Rico, wherein I concluded that I had no particular read on him. I'm feeling more civ than not on him now.

I haven't gone over the case on TH just yet (I'm about to), but is everyone just ignoring that Llama said he intended to vote for LC today and then gets killed that very night? I doubt LC would be that unsubtle, but I think it strengthens the need to look into his posts/votes more closely.

Black Rock wrote: RIP Made. I am certain the baddies locked the thread when three civvies were tied at one vote each, giving them a free lynch. I would have probably voted Made if I could have just because the other two I am certain are civvie and I had no idea if he was or not.

That was my thinking as well. Although I wouldn't necessarily say that the three who were tied were civvie, simply that they are not Hacks. I am leaning civ on MM at this point, though.

Metalmarsh89 wrote:

DFaraday wrote:Okay, I'm really starting to apply myself in the game. I went over Rico's posts, and the results are muddled.

He maintained a Vomps suspicion (like basically everyone else) for much of the early game, and briefly mentioned suspicion of SVS and Roxy in connection to Vomps.

Later on, after Vomps was lynched, Rico had something of a row with Dom over Dom's less than enthusiastic reaction to BWT's rezz. As someone who is always a bit leery of such things anyway, I don't see anything suspicious in Dom's behavior. Rico felt like he was pressing the issue a bit much, imo.

Finally, he has begun looking more closely at MM, noting that MM has contributed to civvie lynches (although that's pretty much all we've had), and questioning MM's suspicion of Roxy.

I need to look over Dom, MM, and Roxy to see how this all comes together.

If that's going to be your reason, I could name a handful of players who've contributed to more civvie lynches than I have. Regardless, contributing to civvie lynches isn't a baddie sign. Voting patterns would be better to look at.

MM, I didn't say I was suspecting you. I was saying that's what Rico said about you.

Okay, I'm really starting to apply myself in the game. I went over Rico's posts, and the results are muddled.

He maintained a Vomps suspicion (like basically everyone else) for much of the early game, and briefly mentioned suspicion of SVS and Roxy in connection to Vomps.

Later on, after Vomps was lynched, Rico had something of a row with Dom over Dom's less than enthusiastic reaction to BWT's rezz. As someone who is always a bit leery of such things anyway, I don't see anything suspicious in Dom's behavior. Rico felt like he was pressing the issue a bit much, imo.

Finally, he has begun looking more closely at MM, noting that MM has contributed to civvie lynches (although that's pretty much all we've had), and questioning MM's suspicion of Roxy.

I need to look over Dom, MM, and Roxy to see how this all comes together.

Made wrote:

S~V~S wrote:And why would he still be looking at me, Made?

You're right, logically, he would of dropped the case as his reason for thinking you or roxy were mafia was chained directly to Vomp right? Once Vomp died, Llama should have no opinions of you or Roxy, and his cases against you and Roxy should of dissolved. But they didn't, not truly anyways. There are very many points independent of Vomp that suddently Llama has forgotten in favor of a Ninja Bloop vote.

http://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/viewto ... 28#p110728

thellama73 wrote:SVS hasn't really brought me up as a suspect before. Now she doesn't trust me. She knows I am on her trail and she is scared. Watch for me to be the mindless bandwagon alternative to Vomps tomorrow.

thellama73 wrote:

Metalmarsh89 wrote:Btw llama, what are your thoughts on Roxy? Does she usually just post thoughts about players without addressing actual game content?

Damn straight I'm going to vote Vomps tomorrow. SVS or Roxy or both are desperate to see absolutely anybody but him lynched. What better reason to lynch him is there than that?

My suspicions go:
1. Vomps
2. Roxy
3. SVS

SVS is only below Roxy because I think she mostly sounds sincere, and I have a hard time believing she is playing the most blatant baddie game ever rather than just being a victim of bad luck, but the vote record looks VERY bad for her. Roxy has been wiffle waffly and non-committal, barely brought up suspicion of MP before this lynch, and her voting record is as bad as SVS'. I don't trust her one bit.

Arguments against Blooper?

thellama73 wrote:After a game of silence, you've gotten awfully chatty now that I asked people to lynch you, Blooper. Awfully chatty indeed.

Which If i'm correct He's said early this game to someone else.....

thellama73 wrote: Vompatti - I still think his level of participation so far is unusual and I don't trust him. He might well get my vote today.

But what do you I know?

Sorry, I'm not entirely following this. You point out that Llama's supicion of SVS and Roxy was tied to Vomps, and thus should have faded once he flipped civ. But you then say that Llama suddenly forgot a bunch of points in favor of lynching Ninja. Wouldn't that be the expected thing to do once his suspicion against his top suspects was dissipated?

I really thought this poll ended like 2 hours later! I'm sorry hostess!

MM, my thoughts post-Vomps are that SVS and Roxy are looking somewhat better to me now that he's flipped civ. I still get a civ vibe from Llama though, and I will go over Ninja's posts when I get back from work.

As for Rico, I'm not sure about his calling out Dom for the "hmmm". That seems a reasonable response to an unexplained rezz in my book.

Ricochet wrote:

Dom wrote:

Ricochet wrote:Awesome, BWT! Very phoenix-like, already. The odd night baddies are having a nightmare of a game, so far.

Dom wrote:hmmmm

why the evil eye?

Your reaction stood out from the rest made me curious, that's all. Why did you "hmm" at BWT's rezz? Are you not happy with it?

I can't answer for Dom, but I, for one, am just a bit wary of anyone who comes back to life twice in one game.

*Dom, not Dome.

I think SVS was just saying that saying they're having a "nightmare" of a game makes it almost sound like you're personally experiencing it. I've said stuff like that, so I don't put stock in that particular comment.

What did you mean with the to Dom?

EBWOP: Dome beat me to it.

Metalmarsh89 wrote: It should. A fake info-drop is still an info-drop. Since real info-drops are against the rules, any info-drop should be assumed to be fake, unless addressed by the host. The circumstances tend to be messy. I've used a fake info-drop once, and I felt extremely bad for doing so, since I ruined DF's chances at winning Monopoly. I don't know if there were any hard feelings, but I think I owe DF an apology for that one.

No worries, my role hinting helped cause Dom to lose Doctor Who Mafia, so I can't complain about it happening to me. Sorry again Dom!

And yay BWT?

Roxy wrote:

DFaraday wrote:

Roxy wrote:

Dom wrote:Roxy, do you think lynching Vomps is a good idea at all?

No

So who would you rather go for, Roxy?

I think the evidence around Vomps continues to grow, and (as expected) Vomps is doing nothing to convince anyone otherwise. Hopefully this will at least shed some light, so... *votes Vomps*

Are you reading the thread or just asking this to "seem" involved?

I already stated who I will be voting for.

You're right, I missed that. I disagree re: Made, but fair enough.

Roxy wrote:

Dom wrote:Roxy, do you think lynching Vomps is a good idea at all?

No

So who would you rather go for, Roxy?

I think the evidence around Vomps continues to grow, and (as expected) Vomps is doing nothing to convince anyone otherwise. Hopefully this will at least shed some light, so... *votes Vomps*

I still don't see anything in Vomps' gameplay to suspect him, but Llama does raise a good point about the seeming repeated saves on him. I don't know as Roxy and SVS would be so transparent in saving a teammate, but it's something to keep in mind.

I don't have any suspicion of them outside of that possible Vomps connection, though.

Oh, and I don't have a read on Made, but then again, I never have been able to read him yet.

I hosted Vomps in WWE, and he posted virtually nothing on topic all game, yet he sent in his powers consistently and was actually a major player behind the scenes. So even if he's not being helpful in thread, I don't want to just dismiss him out of hand as not helping civvies. His behavior is typical Vomps to me, so I won't be voting him.

I'm leaning civ on MP, and MM I'm really not sure. I do agree that Rico seems to be catching on awfully quick, perhaps a little too much. I will *vote Rico* today.

FZ. wrote: 3. What do you all make of DF voting as the last voter for himself. What's the point in even voting if you didn't have time to read? He had time to come and say that he doesn't have time, so he's voting for himself, and conveniently, it was after AP was almost a sure bet for the lynch. And then he comes in after the night and says Sabie probably saved herself.

I voted because some hosts punish players for missing votes. And if, as you're suggesting, I avoided voting for AP because he was already a sure lynch and I knew he would flip civ (which I didn't), the more sensible thing for me to do is throw my vote on to one of the players who has a bit of suspicion on them, in order to seem more active. Self-votes draw attention, so why would I do that unless I really had no clue where to vote?

I'm also not quite sure how my Sabie remark ties in with your previous points. I think that Sabie would be a weird choice of protection unless she herself had such an ability. However, now that Mongoose has cleared up how posts are written, I think it's much more likely that the kill was blocked.

And for the record, I work in a school, so I'm much busier in RL and less active in Mafia in January than December, regardless of alignment.

I've finally just about caught up! I think it's very odd that Sabie would be targeted for an NK so early in the game, and even weirder if someone decided to protect her. I'm thinking Sabie herself probably was the cause of her survival.

I don't have a read on Vomps, but I don't necessarily think Llama is suspicious for looking at him. And I'm not clear on why SVS thinks there is a connection between AP and MM.

I still haven't found time to catch up, so I will vote myself and get down to reading the thread tonight.

So sorry I missed the first day, hostess! I was out of town over the weekend and didn't really check in. I will catch up tomorrow, which is apparently Day 1, Version 2.0.

Vompatti wrote: tommy wiseau

Searched your list for this, was not disappointed.