The Syndicate

Other thoughts: I don't think Daisy, DDL, you, and sig are bad. I'd be surprised to find any of you are. Jack seems trustworthy just due to be cleared by mechanics. I really was thinking Epi was bad but I don't think that anymore. I tentatively trust LC.

That just leaves Dom, Sorsha, and Quin, hence my GTHs from earlier reflecting that.

Golden wrote:MP, I really want to get your thoughts on things generally. Like, do you trust LC and Jack and their defence of Quin? Who do you think is bad?

I don't know what to make of their defense of Quin. I trust Jack but I don't trust that he knows what he thinks he knows because he's certainly wrong about me, for one, and I don't understand his defense of Quin. I think I trust LC.

I don't trust Quin as far as I can throw him, but I don't think he's a slam dunk either only because of LC and Jack defending him. The whole thing is just a clusterfuck I can't make sense of.

Golden wrote:Also, the denials that go on. Like, Quin definitely acted as though he knew you have the bowl, and then backtracked.

I feel like one of them is a deepwolf tricking the other two. I don't know how else this all makes sense.

Golden wrote:It's almost as though Jack, LC and Quin are hinting at being the Ishmael cult, but then wtf would Quin be saying he had a damning case on sig being Ishmael? That would make no sense, since sig actively wrote a massive case on LC. So, this explanation doesn't check out.

I'm trying to think of a single good town explanation for why LC, Jack and Quin would all be protecting each other with little more than 'trust me, you're wrong' to go on with.

I don't think they are hinting at that, but I don't know what else they could be hinting at.

Quin wrote:
MovingPictures07 wrote:"I think MP is bad because he's obviously Indy"
You can lynch me today. I'm cool with that. I really am. But you will be next, because you just stepped on a land mine.

Why the hell would I be next? I've heard literally no argument for why I should be lynched other than "MP is acting like he's an Indy and I don't believe him", which is absurd. But at least LC is giving something. The rest of you all are giving nothing. You just said "MP is bad" with nothing to assert it, even when I countered your post with a legitimate question.

It's frustrating and makes you look suspicious as fuck.

Quin wrote:
MovingPictures07 wrote:
Epignosis wrote:That was painful reading. I got nothing out of it. It's also hard to put any stock in Golden's perspective and early vote because he did the same thing to me last phase.
I see a similar Quin that I saw in Mad Max. I think dom's observation of Quin declaring me bad and then proceeding to argue Golden is disingenuous and bad is a good one as well. He seems like a desperate baddie willing to discredit and try to make an argument seem town vs town but personally I don't think it is.
You are not seeing a similar quin because that is not at all how I carried myself in mad max. Talk about a bad post.

I'm roadtripping for the next five hours. Adios.

I thought the comparison was apt.

Epignosis wrote:
Long Con wrote:
Epignosis wrote:
Long Con wrote:
Epignosis wrote:
Jackofhearts2005 wrote:
Epignosis wrote:The zebra kill puzzles me a good deal.
Elaborate.
Of everyone alive, why would Olaf want zebra dead? Zebra was hardly participating and apt to miss additional votes.
Also, zebra was one of the more likely lynch candidates. I found it very puzzling, and a poor decision on Olaf's part. There are a few players that are seen as very Civ and are not likely to be lynched that would have been smarter choices in my opinion.
Maybe that kill got redirected.
But Elohsir was already dead.
That's right. I'm lumping the Day and Night phase outcomes together.

Oh right.

Epignosis wrote:
Long Con wrote:
Epignosis wrote:
Jackofhearts2005 wrote:
Epignosis wrote:The zebra kill puzzles me a good deal.
Elaborate.
Of everyone alive, why would Olaf want zebra dead? Zebra was hardly participating and apt to miss additional votes.
Also, zebra was one of the more likely lynch candidates. I found it very puzzling, and a poor decision on Olaf's part. There are a few players that are seen as very Civ and are not likely to be lynched that would have been smarter choices in my opinion.
Maybe that kill got redirected.

I'd agree that's a likely possibility.

Long Con wrote:
MovingPictures07 wrote:Epi, interesting thoughts; I'll mull over them. Not sure what immediate conclusion to take regarding sprityo's treatment of LC... I'm torn between him treating LC as a teammate and as a target.
I would like to point out that acting hesitant or frustrated about voting me looks good on him when I flip Civ. That's why he acted like that.

That's a good point.

MovingPictures07 wrote:
Jackofhearts2005 wrote:I'm having trouble figuring out who Sunny is.

Soup and Nacho would have not been my top vig targets.

Poe has been killing people I suspect so he's probably already on my townie list of DDL, Epi, Golden, Sig, Quin, LC.

Sunny, though? Probably somewhere in the potential scum list of Sorsha, Daisy, Dom2, MP.

Both town killers should probably aim at the later group but it's probably worth trying to figure out who wanted Soup and Nacho dead so as not to aim at those players.
I think we ought to be careful about extrapolating too much here because there was potential for target redirection (at least as long as Elo was alive).

To elaborate on this, I can see Sunny wanting to kill Soup n2 because it's believable that a town vigilante would shoot a low or non participating player to remove that variable from the game. The Nacho kill on n4 is the one that could have been redirected... because from my recollection, no one here had any major beef with him. It'd be worth investigating whether my memory is right there though.

Epi, interesting thoughts; I'll mull over them. Not sure what immediate conclusion to take regarding sprityo's treatment of LC... I'm torn between him treating LC as a teammate and as a target.

Jackofhearts2005 wrote:I'm having trouble figuring out who Sunny is.

Soup and Nacho would have not been my top vig targets.

Poe has been killing people I suspect so he's probably already on my townie list of DDL, Epi, Golden, Sig, Quin, LC.

Sunny, though? Probably somewhere in the potential scum list of Sorsha, Daisy, Dom2, MP.

Both town killers should probably aim at the later group but it's probably worth trying to figure out who wanted Soup and Nacho dead so as not to aim at those players.

I think we ought to be careful about extrapolating too much here because there was potential for target redirection (at least as long as Elo was alive).

Jackofhearts2005 wrote:Super frustrating day phase.

Town be like

Well I'm one of your final two vote considerations so you're not doing any better.

On that note

What else HAS happened. Stupid phone.

I'll be back this afternoon/evening to see what else he and happened and actually read some ISO stuff.

Long Con wrote:
MovingPictures07 wrote:Are we allowed to talk about missing night PMs?
Oh... maybe not. Never mind then.

Depending on host clarification I'll answer your question.

Are we allowed to talk about missing night PMs?

Long Con wrote:
MovingPictures07 wrote:
Long Con wrote:
MovingPictures07 wrote:I realize this is going to be ironic given the conversation I had earlier with Epi, but let me just say one thing about this and then drop it:

Do you all really think, especially those who know me, as a baddie I would have behaved as cavalier about this game as I have for most of this game if I i here bad?
Absolutely.

MovingPictures07 wrote:
Long Con wrote:
Golden wrote:Voted Quin. Hopefully it's a better bet than MP.
Goddammit Golden!

Why, Quin? Why couldn't you just drop it? Fucking pointless argument... about sig?! Sig is not on the plate today!
You're going to have egg on your face.
I already do. But you don't know why.
Then you don't know how to read me that well.
I never claimed I do know how to read you that well.

I don't know what that has to do with my egg. I think we're talking about different eggs.

Oh yeah, I stopped talking about the egg thing because I was confused.

Long Con wrote:
MovingPictures07 wrote:
Golden wrote:I think you're doing the exact opposite. Trying to avoid having much impact on who is chosen for a lynch, or on having any strong opinions on who troupe members might be.

You're too busy arguing why sig could be Troupe even though you think he isn't, for example. Why should this be seen as townie? What's the function of it from a civilian mindset? All it does is cast doubt on someone who we have every reason to trust...
Bingo. I would like to lynch Quin.
So where's your vote?

What kind of question is that? I may need to vote out of self-preservation. I'm waiting. Still plenty of time left in the phase.

Long Con wrote:
MovingPictures07 wrote:I realize this is going to be ironic given the conversation I had earlier with Epi, but let me just say one thing about this and then drop it:

Do you all really think, especially those who know me, as a baddie I would have behaved as cavalier about this game as I have for most of this game if I i here bad?
Absolutely.

MovingPictures07 wrote:
Long Con wrote:
Golden wrote:Voted Quin. Hopefully it's a better bet than MP.
Goddammit Golden!

Why, Quin? Why couldn't you just drop it? Fucking pointless argument... about sig?! Sig is not on the plate today!
You're going to have egg on your face.
I already do. But you don't know why.

Then you don't know how to read me that well.

Long Con wrote:
Golden wrote:Voted Quin. Hopefully it's a better bet than MP.
Goddammit Golden!

Why, Quin? Why couldn't you just drop it? Fucking pointless argument... about sig?! Sig is not on the plate today!

You're going to have egg on your face.

Epignosis wrote:That was painful reading. I got nothing out of it. It's also hard to put any stock in Golden's perspective and early vote because he did the same thing to me last phase.

I see a similar Quin that I saw in Mad Max. I think dom's observation of Quin declaring me bad and then proceeding to argue Golden is disingenuous and bad is a good one as well. He seems like a desperate baddie willing to discredit and try to make an argument seem town vs town but personally I don't think it is.

I realize this is going to be ironic given the conversation I had earlier with Epi, but let me just say one thing about this and then drop it:

Do you all really think, especially those who know me, as a baddie I would have behaved as cavalier about this game as I have for most of this game if I i here bad? My job as a baddie is always to try to convince you all I'm the towniest town that ever towned, and I take that as a personal challenge even when I'm low on time. I get off on successfully doing that. Why would I pass up another opportunity to do that?

My actions are not indicative of a baddie. I'm low hanging fruit. But it's OK because frankly I'm shocked it took you all this long to want to lynch me.

Golden wrote:I think you're doing the exact opposite. Trying to avoid having much impact on who is chosen for a lynch, or on having any strong opinions on who troupe members might be.

You're too busy arguing why sig could be Troupe even though you think he isn't, for example. Why should this be seen as townie? What's the function of it from a civilian mindset? All it does is cast doubt on someone who we have every reason to trust...

Bingo. I would like to lynch Quin.

"I think MP is bad because he's obviously Indy"

Quin wrote:
MovingPictures07 wrote:
Long Con wrote:If you HAD to vote for Dom or Sorsha, who would it be?
Me? Doesn't matter to me. I'm fine either way.
MP is bad.

Spoiler: show
Dom wrote:Mark my words.

Lol, the fact that any of you all think I would make this post as a baddie is amusing.

Alright, bbl.

One thing about LC is that a baddie would want to seem like they're an indy, so there's that, but that's the exact logic that LC is scumreading me for and he's wrong, so maybe that's not worth anything.

I'll be pretty peeved if you all waste a lynch on me today to be honest, even though I shouldn't be.

Golden wrote:
MovingPictures07 wrote:You lynch me and all you're doing is wasting your all's time.
What do you think of "LC is Olaf" theory?

Seems feasible. I'm only here for a few more minutes, I'm just trying to pop on here occasionally for the rest of the day to stay current with the thread (won't have solid time until tomorrow).

I'm torn though. My brain agrees that your theory makes a lot of sense, but my gut says LC is telling the truth, and so my brain realizes there's a possibility that occam's razor explains LC's actions and that he is indy, but I don't know.

There are 4 independents in this game after all.

Long Con wrote:
Golden wrote:Anyway, LC, I take your very direct point.

Are you thinking of voting MP today?
Absolutely. I think it's extremely unlikely he's an Indy.

I think either you're hinting at a role that you don't have as a bold play, or you're flat out wrong.

You lynch me and all you're doing is wasting your all's time.

I have to bolt again, but I'll see if I can dig quickly into some ISOs later to confirm or question my gut-based assessments, then I'll throw up a rainbow.

Spoiler: show

Dom, there's really nothing substantial here. It'd be nice if you answered my questions instead of just putting "lol".

Golden wrote:
MovingPictures07 wrote:FWIW Daisy has worked the last 10 days straight and her sister has been in town the entire time, so I think that's a big contributor to her decline in activity. Her sister being in town is a large part also as to why I've been busy.
And what is your gut read on daisy, hat-eater?

Town, though she fooled me pretty damn hard in Lost Again so I was hesitant for a while there.

Golden wrote:
MovingPictures07 wrote:Where did I claim indy? And why don't you believe that claim?
- just at the way these two sentences are put together. Hilarious.

Long Con wrote:
MovingPictures07 wrote:Why should I believe you to be town, LC?
Because I will take the Civvies to the win.

Why should I believe you to be town, LC?

Long Con wrote:
MovingPictures07 wrote:FWIW Daisy has worked the last 10 days straight and her sister has been in town the entire time, so I think that's a big contributor to her decline in activity. Her sister being in town is a large part also as to why I've been busy.
If only her sister were on the poll.

That would be an intriguing twist.

Long Con wrote:
MovingPictures07 wrote:
Long Con wrote:
sig wrote:
Long Con wrote:
sig wrote:From just looking over voting I'd say LC and Quin look the worst.
This is wrong.
How? Also I'd still like your thoughts on why MP, Sorsha, Dom, Daisy, and Quin are placed where you placed them.
Ok, MP is claiming Indy and I don't believe him, I think he's bad.

Dom was subbed back in to a baddie role, I'm sorry, but it's so obvious. The Host wouldn't have gotten involved again if it wasn't to correct an unfairness like the baddie getting lynched for the "wrong reasons".

Daisy seems pretty good, I have a role in mind for her.

Sorsha is probably not that role. I don't know that she's bad, she's just the most likely according to my spreadsheet.

Quin, I am almost sure I know his role, and the one I have in mind is not on a baddie team.
Where did I claim indy? And why don't you believe that claim?
Between the lines... and it occurred to me that the Troupe has the dead role checker, and how the purpose of that role is to give the team something to hint at being to seem less suspicious.

It would be a great strategy, but it's not mine.

Spoiler: show

FWIW Daisy has worked the last 10 days straight and her sister has been in town the entire time, so I think that's a big contributor to her decline in activity. Her sister being in town is a large part also as to why I've been busy.

Long Con wrote:If you HAD to vote for Dom or Sorsha, who would it be?

Me? Doesn't matter to me. I'm fine either way.

Long Con wrote:
sig wrote:
Long Con wrote:
sig wrote:From just looking over voting I'd say LC and Quin look the worst.
This is wrong.
How? Also I'd still like your thoughts on why MP, Sorsha, Dom, Daisy, and Quin are placed where you placed them.
Ok, MP is claiming Indy and I don't believe him, I think he's bad.

Dom was subbed back in to a baddie role, I'm sorry, but it's so obvious. The Host wouldn't have gotten involved again if it wasn't to correct an unfairness like the baddie getting lynched for the "wrong reasons".

Daisy seems pretty good, I have a role in mind for her.

Sorsha is probably not that role. I don't know that she's bad, she's just the most likely according to my spreadsheet.

Quin, I am almost sure I know his role, and the one I have in mind is not on a baddie team.

Where did I claim indy? And why don't you believe that claim?

Jackofhearts2005 wrote:
MovingPictures07 wrote:
Jackofhearts2005 wrote:
Jackofhearts2005 wrote:Rainbow

JoH
DDL
Golden
LC
Sig
Quin
Epi
Daisy
Dom
MP
Sorsha
EBWOP

I'm pretty damn willing to lynch the bottom two.
Why Quin higher than the rest?
Whaddo I look like?

An explanation tree?

You can't explain your own reads?

Jackofhearts2005 wrote:
Jackofhearts2005 wrote:Rainbow

JoH
DDL
Golden
LC
Sig
Quin
Epi
Daisy
Dom
MP
Sorsha
EBWOP

I'm pretty damn willing to lynch the bottom two.

Why Quin higher than the rest?

Golden wrote:OK, a rainbow.

Jack
DDL
sig
Epi
LC
Dom
MP
Daisy
Sorsha
Quin

I've leaned town on Daisy and Sorsha all game but I'm beginning to run out of options. This seems like a very townie group to me. I wonder if we've been lucky and there aren't many left.

It's entirely mathematically possible there's only 1 baddie left, isn't it?

Golden wrote:
MovingPictures07 wrote:
MovingPictures07 wrote:I'll do a rainbow list later once I've had time to dig into some ISOs. For now, a GTH reads list:

Daisy - Town
DDL - Town
Dom - Mafia
Epi - Town
JoH - Town
LC - Town
Quin - Mafia
sig - Town
Sorsha - Mafia
Oh, and

Golden - Town

Not sure how I forgot him.
I'm not very memorable

We both know that's not true.

Dom wrote:so, alex, when did you get recruited?

I haven't been. What makes you think I have specifically, and why is that notable?

Dom wrote:
Long Con wrote:Ha.

My concern is that the Troupe has that dead role checker, and that they will begin to try and hint at being roles that they know are dead and gone. It might have already happened.
Are you gonna answer the question?
MovingPictures07 wrote:I'll do a rainbow list later once I've had time to dig into some ISOs. For now, a GTH reads list:

Daisy - Town
DDL - Town
Dom - Mafia
Epi - Town
JoH - Town
LC - Town
Quin - Mafia
sig - Town
Sorsha - Mafia
MP, having not played for days, lists me as bad. Sad !

Oh, I've been playing the game.

Does anyone have any major disagreements? If so, why?

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