The Syndicate

Fair responses, but I still think you're probably Boddy.

Bass role claimed The Chief. He claims to have switched the lynch to Blooper earlier and now he obviously just stopped the lynch, so yeah... severely doubt he's Boddy.

Well, we know it's either you, Bass, or MR. It can't be Bass now, but I was leaning HEAVILY towards you from the beginning. I'm shocked no one voted for you today as it's very likely you're Boddy. Sorry man.

I hope everyone else reads this carefully because it's damning evidence that Epig is Boddy. And worst case if he isn't, then it'd have to be MR, but I doubt that so much.

Here's why:

1) The fact that S~V~S was targeted by Boddy first and the way you interacted with her about it
http://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/viewto ... 422#p85422
http://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/viewto ... 464#p85464
http://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/viewto ... 660#p85660


2) You never actually defend against any of the accusations that you're Boddy, seen here, earlier with S~V~S, and even with your "Why?" just now:

Epignosis wrote:

Bass_the_Clever wrote:well we dont even know if the indie has a kill yet or not so why worry about epig ?

Oh ffs.

Epignosis wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:

Epignosis wrote:Allowing for the assumption that Mr. Boddy has been active all game (he did reveal info about S~V~S Night 1), that means he is going to be either Bass or MR. One of them is Mr. Naughty.

Who says it can't be you?

The host?

For just two examples.


3) Even though you've appeared super helpful you have contradicted yourself multiple times and lied about suspicions (not gambits either), something you NEVER do as a civvie. You were convinced I was bad and tried to get me lynched D3 even though you said this after D1:

Epignosis wrote:Having been bad in the last two games, and having witnessed it both times from my teammates, I am willing to bet that Mafia didn't vote on Day 1. Although anyone could miss a vote for legitimate reasons, I've seen it far too often that Mafia miss a vote on purpose. So I would be looking at a missed vote followed by a reaction that belies the missed vote.

This, for example:

Mongoose wrote:WTF we had a lynch vote??

Mongoose posted seven times during Day 1, participating in a discussion of potentially suspicious behavior. Incidentally, two of those seven posts are ambivalent comments about missing voters. What I don't understand is that Mongoose voted in the Day 0 poll and voted in the Night 1 poll, but comes back later expressing shock that we had a lynch vote. What else would we have had between Day 0 and Night 1- a Parcheesi tournament?

You never actually gunned after Mongoose EVER after that post, you gunned after S~V~S all D2 and me all of D3.

AND you never once pursued your suspicion of the mafia member missing the vote. Both me and S~V~S made the vote, did we not?


4) I know you are typically helpful as a civvie but you've been pushing it really hard and OOT to the point where it's read to be almost trying too hard sometimes, conveniently trying to get the general consensus that you were Boddy (perpetuated by S~V~S, Bass, and i think others too) out of the thread:
http://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/viewto ... 063#p87063
And it seems you did a good job since everyone keeps following your lead. In fact, it's the only thing you CAN do to win this game. And I feel bad about suspecting you hard as Boddy because you have played a really great game. But this point still stands.


5) Then there's your insane fixation on all things Mr. Boddy:

Epignosis wrote:I also have Mr. Boddy narrowed down to five people.

Epignosis wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:

Epignosis wrote:I also have Mr. Boddy narrowed down to five people.

Lol.

That's allowing for no assumptions at all. If I permit myself one small assumption, I've got it down to three.

Epignosis wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:Considering there's still a killer about, it'd probably be unwise to be a pacifist right now.

Would you like to know who Boddy is?

Epignosis wrote:Anyone could be any Boddy, but it takes a certain some Boddy to fool every Boddy, and I am no Boddy.

Epignosis wrote:Allowing for the assumption that Mr. Boddy has been active all game (he did reveal info about S~V~S Night 1), that means he is going to be either Bass or MR. One of them is Mr. Naughty.

Epignosis wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:

Epignosis wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:

Epignosis wrote:Allowing for the assumption that Mr. Boddy has been active all game (he did reveal info about S~V~S Night 1), that means he is going to be either Bass or MR. One of them is Mr. Naughty.

Who says it can't be you?

The host?

Lol.

Frankly, I'm still not even thinking about Mr. Boddy. Gotta catch this last killer first.

I am not bothered either way. Wadsworth is going to be tougher to pin though. I've narrowed him down to four individuals. Boddy, two.

Epignosis wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:Oh, I guess that's true, since Wadsworth doesn't kill every night. Got it.

Actually, I would prefer we eliminated Boddy first.

Wadsworth will either kill or not tonight. No changing that, and he won't be able to kill for two Nights following. Two people voted and two did not. So Wadsworth has a choice to make.

With Boddy, we can eliminate him on Day 5 or 6 at the latest.

These were ALL posted during Day 4 and Night 4.

Epignosis wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:

Epignosis wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:Dammit, I can't believe I missed the vote, just barely. Sorry folks!! Will catch up after I worry about Dr. Who first.

I am trying so hard to win here, and you miss another vote. Come on man.

Sorry man, totally didn't think I would.

Kind of surprised on the consensus that Bass was Boddy to be honest. That's not who I was thinking.

Great. Please. Who. Is. It?

Dude, now is not the time to hide shit. There's W and B. I want them both out ASAP.

I'm pretty sure you're Mr. Boddy, sorry to say it. I wish you were a civilian, but too many things you've said and the way you've made comments about Boddy all game, in addition to your insane attempts to seem as helpful as possible, tell a story.

Epignosis wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:Dammit, I can't believe I missed the vote, just barely. Sorry folks!! Will catch up after I worry about Dr. Who first.

I am trying so hard to win here, and you miss another vote. Come on man.

Sorry man, totally didn't think I would.

Kind of surprised on the consensus that Bass was Boddy to be honest. That's not who I was thinking.

Dammit, I can't believe I missed the vote, just barely. Sorry folks!! Will catch up after I worry about Dr. Who first.

Only here for a second, but I'll try to be back later, real busy day.

If we want to catch Boddy today, isn't everyone in agreement on this matter who it is? Seems like one player in particular is probably Boddy. I'm curious what people are thinking here, so for now I'll refrain from mentioning who I think it is, and I'll come back.

Epignosis wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:Oh, I guess that's true, since Wadsworth doesn't kill every night. Got it.

Actually, I would prefer we eliminated Boddy first.

Wadsworth will either kill or not tonight. No changing that, and he won't be able to kill for two Nights following. Two people voted and two did not. So Wadsworth has a choice to make.

With Boddy, we can eliminate him on Day 5 or 6 at the latest.

Astute point.

They both haven't been very active either... Damn.

Oh, I guess that's true, since Wadsworth doesn't kill every night. Got it.

Epignosis wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:

Epignosis wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:

Epignosis wrote:Allowing for the assumption that Mr. Boddy has been active all game (he did reveal info about S~V~S Night 1), that means he is going to be either Bass or MR. One of them is Mr. Naughty.

Who says it can't be you?

The host?

Lol.

Frankly, I'm still not even thinking about Mr. Boddy. Gotta catch this last killer first.

I am not bothered either way. Wadsworth is going to be tougher to pin though. I've narrowed him down to four individuals. Boddy, two.

Isn't Wadsworth more likely to be Vompatti or Mata? Who are the other two?

Epignosis wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:

Epignosis wrote:Allowing for the assumption that Mr. Boddy has been active all game (he did reveal info about S~V~S Night 1), that means he is going to be either Bass or MR. One of them is Mr. Naughty.

Who says it can't be you?

The host?

Lol.

Frankly, I'm still not even thinking about Mr. Boddy. Gotta catch this last killer first.

Epignosis wrote:Allowing for the assumption that Mr. Boddy has been active all game (he did reveal info about S~V~S Night 1), that means he is going to be either Bass or MR. One of them is Mr. Naughty.

Who says it can't be you?

Epignosis wrote:Anyone could be any Boddy, but it takes a certain some Boddy to fool every Boddy, and I am no Boddy.

Epignosis wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:Considering there's still a killer about, it'd probably be unwise to be a pacifist right now.

Would you like to know who Boddy is?

Wait, what? You've narrowed it down, you're saying? If so, sure.

Considering there's still a killer about, it'd probably be unwise to be a pacifist right now.

Mongoose, I would recommend you NOT choose that option.

I chose the poison!

YES!! BIH Hedge! But well played for sure.

Yeah, despite Hedge's response, I don't see any better vote either. Fingers crossed.

Well, what does everyone else think?

Epignosis wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:

Epignosis wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:

Epignosis wrote:I also have Mr. Boddy narrowed down to five people.

Lol.

That's allowing for no assumptions at all. If I permit myself one small assumption, I've got it down to three.

Are you leaning more towards a Hedgeowl vote than a Vomps or Mata vote due to your assessment of the NK targets and her specific behavior? I presumed it to be so, but thought I'd check.

I'm almost tempted to just vote her now because I can't see me changing my mind.

I would like to hear what she says in response to what I wrote. The thing is, allowing for my assumption, she's one of the three Boddy possibilities too. I rather believe she's Mafia though.

Fair enough. I will be back in time for the vote anyway, so I suppose I'll just wait until after I'm back from my night class.

I hope so too, since it seems likely there are two Mafia left (correct? unless I'm missing something?).

Epignosis wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:

Epignosis wrote:I also have Mr. Boddy narrowed down to five people.

Lol.

That's allowing for no assumptions at all. If I permit myself one small assumption, I've got it down to three.

Are you leaning more towards a Hedgeowl vote than a Vomps or Mata vote due to your assessment of the NK targets and her specific behavior? I presumed it to be so, but thought I'd check.

I'm almost tempted to just vote her now because I can't see me changing my mind.

Epignosis wrote:I also have Mr. Boddy narrowed down to five people.

Lol.

Astute analysis, Epig. I agree that those three options seem to be the way to go, and I would feel comfortable with a Hedgeowl vote based on your observations.

Something that adds to your analysis is that I speculate that more passive powers are NOT canceled when one misses a vote. I have solid reason to believe this is the case. So it's still possible that Canuck was Mr. Green, especially since in reading that role I never thought that she would get to necessarily pick the person that goes down with her, but rather it would be selected, probably randomly.

Mister Rearranger wrote:Hoping Canuck was the captain who went down with the kill-ship, at least! She could fit the Day 1 killer's bill.

I am sorry to hear about your current irl crisis though, Canucklehead. Hope you're okay!

I hope so too.

What are you thinking for today's lynch, MR?

Mongoose wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:Wow, that sucks. Why were there two deaths...???

My guess is it had something to do with the Maid. She chose Person X to be her companion and so they done died too.

LOL, thank you, Mongoose.

Wow, that sucks. Why were there two deaths...???

Matahari wrote:I finished reading. Still confused. Do all the night polls lead to prizes?

They lead to something, that's for sure.

Epig, yes, ignore the first half of those posts you quoted. :P I came in the thread, saw Blooper was lynched, thought WTF, and was confused how I missed the vote because my alibi was true and I thought the poll was over at 10:30 and that I'd have dinner at 6:00 and go to the grocery and be home by 9:00 or 9:30 at the latest, but it turns out that's not what happened. It also explains why I said I have to go but I'll be back but probably not too much before the vote's end when I left that afternoon.

Now I didn't bother to check the voting thread right away because I knew there were no outright vote manipulation roles and no secrets. So that explains the next few posts you quote. Then I finally realized that it seemed more people said they were voting me in the thread than Blooper so I checked the voting thread and THEN I realized no one actually tried to lynch Blooper. Then I thought about how I could have possibly survived that lynching, given Blooper's role, and now I get it.

Also, I obviously thought Blooper was the Chief since I thought she switched the vote to S~V~S the previous day, but that was off. So I am obviously not that role. I am a different civilian role, however.

Occam's razor does apply though: Read Sabie's posts yourself. She obviously was left to hang dry. Though I will agree with you that two completely inactive teammates seems more unlikely than just having one really inactive teammate, the former is still a possibility, given kevin and kpence were new and Canuck wasn't around to make the vote, and has also been really absent. Mongoose has also been relatively absent. So those are four possibilities for baddie teammates right there that would explain the Sabie situation with the least amount of assumptions.

If you assume that I'm her teammate, which I'm not, then you assume that my case on Blooper was fabricated, and you also assume that I missed the vote last day period on purpose, which I did not.

And the mistakes I made were CLEARLY these: I misunderstood how the killing roles worked when I came in and saw no death for N2, and then all of the Blooper stuff at the beginning of N3. What you are NOT seeing here is a tactful, evil sock; it's just a civvie sock who comes in here and makes posts without fully analyzing the situation because he's trying to balance PhD work, a giant Doctor Who game, and this game, all at the same time.

And yes I realize I offer up assumptions in my defense, but you're making a ton of assumptions in thinking I'm bad.

Think about it harder, Epig. What is the only possible civilian role that could survive a lynch poll due to picking favorable options and have knowledge of doing so? There's only one. i can't be any more clear TBH.

I'm pretty sure I know what's going on with the lynches.

Mister Rearranger wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:Also, think very clearly about the fact that I survived that lynch when I was two votes ahead. Think VERY carefully about the fact that there are no "secrets" by baddies and READ THE CIVVIE ROLES and think about how I've been voting. Enough said.

You didn't vote at all yesterday...

And I'm still very lost as to how SVS died on Day 2, tbh. I don't think enough is said.

Welcome Mata, iyag!

Who said I was talking about those votes?

Also, think very clearly about the fact that I survived that lynch when I was two votes ahead. Think VERY carefully about the fact that there are no "secrets" by baddies and READ THE CIVVIE ROLES and think about how I've been voting. Enough said.

I may be quick to throw my teammates under the bus, but I cherish my teammates. There's no way Sabie would have posted the way she did because I would have contacted her.

With my thoughts on Blooper being wrong, it's very clear we're dealing with a case of Occam's razor.

Yeah, but I got lynched D1. How much can you scheme when one dies before even the first night?

Don't listen to Epig, he's wrong about me. Occam's razor suggests Sabie had an uninvolved teammate. That is NOT me and it would never be me. I would have PMed her at the least, especially in a situation like that. I'd bet at least one of kpence, kevin, and Canuck are her teammates.

Heaven forbid I EVER actually help us find a baddie because when I do, everyone just thinks I'm throwing a teammate under the bus. Seriously, consider another perspective guys! I am not bad. I definitely wouldn't be making this many mistakes if I were bad either.

Linki Mata I look forward to your thoughts. I don't even remember the times we were teammates, really, they must have been a while ago and when I wasn't as active. Since being on TS, I am always an incredibly active team member. Just refer back to MOTU or WWE.

Lol, I didn't look at the distribution of the votes when I made those posts, Elo. I didn't realize there was vote manipulation this game, but now I think I get it. But just ignore me. :P I just couldn't believe Blooper was lynched and I assumed it was because we voted to lynch her, but there is obviously more way vote manipulation this game than I thought. But now it makes sense.

Also, welcome Mata!

Bass_the_Clever wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:Seriously, what the hell, guys??? Was it not obvious she was that role and why I backed off of her??? Wow, WTF.

Epignosis wrote:

Elohcin wrote:

Epignosis wrote:Nota bene:

I have died and come back from a kill (not "survived") and someone still sees fit to vote for me.

nijuu has lived and someone else lynched in her place and someone still sees fit to vote for her.

Foolishness. But that's OK.

I tend to agree. Problem is..I know who I DON'T want to vote for, but I don't know who I WANT to vote for, and my eyes are getting very tired :/

You can do one of two things if you want my advice.

You can vote for me (I won't be lynched today).

Or you can vote for MP. Recall your time with him in The Hobbit. Was he around and helpful? I think sabie fucked up and he made the most of it.

Sorry, but since you've never been on a team of mine before you'd never know, but I would NEVER be absent for a teammate. I bug the fuck out of my teammates.

Linki: Eye me all you want but it's all true.

How was it obvious that she was that role?

Oh, sorry, I'm an idiot; ignore me. I was getting the Cop and Chief mixed up. Lol.

Epignosis wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:Wow, whatever, I can't believe both Epig and Elo apparently think my posts are "bullshit". Whatever, just lynch me next and lose another civvie. That'll sure help you. Where's the roll eyes smiley?

Right here.

You did put it there, right?

Yeah, but I hate that one.

Wow, whatever, I can't believe both Epig and Elo apparently think my posts are "bullshit". Whatever, just lynch me next and lose another civvie. That'll sure help you. Where's the roll eyes smiley?

Seriously, what the hell, guys??? Was it not obvious she was that role and why I backed off of her??? Wow, WTF.

Epignosis wrote:

Elohcin wrote:

Epignosis wrote:Nota bene:

I have died and come back from a kill (not "survived") and someone still sees fit to vote for me.

nijuu has lived and someone else lynched in her place and someone still sees fit to vote for her.

Foolishness. But that's OK.

I tend to agree. Problem is..I know who I DON'T want to vote for, but I don't know who I WANT to vote for, and my eyes are getting very tired :/

You can do one of two things if you want my advice.

You can vote for me (I won't be lynched today).

Or you can vote for MP. Recall your time with him in The Hobbit. Was he around and helpful? I think sabie fucked up and he made the most of it.

Sorry, but since you've never been on a team of mine before you'd never know, but I would NEVER be absent for a teammate. I bug the fuck out of my teammates.

Linki: Eye me all you want but it's all true.

Sorry everyone, I had dinner with my PhD cohorts and then had to stop by the grocery store and I thought I'd be back a bit sooner.

RIP Blooper. WTF EVERYONE! How could you lynch Blooper?!?! Will catch up in a second.

WTF!!! I thought I still had time?!?!!?

I have to go, but I'll be back before the vote deadline, even if it isn't too much before it's over. I don't feel comfortable voting now, haven't had time to look back yet.

Epignosis wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:Sounds good. Yeah, I've been distracted by PhD work since I spent Friday goofing off mafiaing most of the day, but I'll make some time before the poll ends to concentrate fully on this game and maybe re-read some folks (shouldn't take long anyway, I would think).

I look forward to your thoughts.

Believe it or not, I made a goddamned spreadsheet. This IS Clue.

I should have, but I am working on a colossal spreadsheet for my Empirical Accounting Research class, so I have enough of that to keep me busy.

Mister Rearranger wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote: Wait, why lynch Epi?

I'd say there's nothing to think about regarding the Mr. Boddy role until we see evidence of it. Until then, I'm going to assume it's relatively harmless in the fact that it doesn't kill and doesn't say "secrets" by it.

To address both lines:

The LMS can't win with the civs.

Like I said though (and in agreement with you), the priority shouldn't be on figuring out anything about Mr. Boddy quite yet.

How do you feel about Canuck this game? I know she's checked in and said she's busy/struggling to get into the game, but the way Day 1 went down leads me to believe that sabie's team hasn't been all that active to begin with.

Makes sense.

She's been incredibly inactive... she definitely could fit the bill. I could see a vote going that way, or to kpence or Kevin since they aren't playing either.

I kind of dislike to flat out lynch nonparticipants, but what else are you going to do? Especially since the situation with Sabie heavily implies nonparticipants on the baddie team. And it is Day 3.

Sounds good. Yeah, I've been distracted by PhD work since I spent Friday goofing off mafiaing most of the day, but I'll make some time before the poll ends to concentrate fully on this game and maybe re-read some folks (shouldn't take long anyway, I would think).

I look forward to your thoughts.

Honestly, I wish I had better reads on everyone right now; I feel I haven't been paying much attention to this game since the D1 lynch, but it could just be that some people haven't contributed much too.

Epignosis wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:

Epignosis wrote:

Bass_the_Clever wrote:

Epignosis wrote:

Bass_the_Clever wrote:Well I would like to point out that ninja said she was only 99% sure how she survied the lynch. I think if it was because of her role she would be 100% sure. I will be most likley voting ninja.

Or you can outline the alternate scenarios in which she survived the lynch. That wasn't just a survival. That was a switch.

well first guess would be that some roles might have secrets because why wouldnt she just use a stop instead of the switch?? it would still save her .

No roles have secrets listed. And I would always use a switch before a stop.

Addendum: Angry MP. That's a reaction I didn't expect.

Sorry, I'm just agitated at the fact that I wasn't paying attention and that you flat out ignored my question.

That's okay. I've been going back and forth about you. Were I bad in this game, I would not burn a teammate. But you would. You've done those things in the past. I am trying to decide if sabie was your gambit.

As for Eloh, she could be bad. I don't know. I don't think she gives a shit about Mafia right now.

Understandable. I was honestly surprised you didn't mention that earlier given I tend to steamroll teammates, but I don't think Sabie would have found herself in that position if I were her teammate since I was clearly incredibly active during that entire time period.

Fair enough, I just was curious if you had any specific read on her, since you typically do.

Epignosis wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:And why would you always use a switch before a stop, out of curiosity? Because I'd do the opposite.

Stops give everyone else information. Switches give YOU information.

Hmmm, good point. I guess I'd just be afraid to use switches as a civvie because I wouldn't want to lynch another civvie, but I suppose it'd be inevitable, and I can't even remember the last time I had a civvie stop/switch role anyway...

Mister Rearranger wrote:We could always lynch Epi since I'm fairly sure he's gotta go eventually.

But if the kills work in the way he theorizes they do, I'd advocate getting rid of at least 1 more baddie first.

We've gotta think though: If 2 of the team die, is there only a kill once every 3 nights? Does the LMS inherit any kills? Things to think about...

Wait, why lynch Epi?

I'd say there's nothing to think about regarding the Mr. Boddy role until we see evidence of it. Until then, I'm going to assume it's relatively harmless in the fact that it doesn't kill and doesn't say "secrets" by it.

And why would you always use a switch before a stop, out of curiosity? Because I'd do the opposite.

Epignosis wrote:

Bass_the_Clever wrote:

Epignosis wrote:

Bass_the_Clever wrote:Well I would like to point out that ninja said she was only 99% sure how she survied the lynch. I think if it was because of her role she would be 100% sure. I will be most likley voting ninja.

Or you can outline the alternate scenarios in which she survived the lynch. That wasn't just a survival. That was a switch.

well first guess would be that some roles might have secrets because why wouldnt she just use a stop instead of the switch?? it would still save her .

No roles have secrets listed. And I would always use a switch before a stop.

Addendum: Angry MP. That's a reaction I didn't expect.

Sorry, I'm just agitated at the fact that I wasn't paying attention and that you flat out ignored my question.

Epignosis wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:

Epignosis wrote:The lack of a kill was not unexpected. With Scarlet out, her kill doesn't exist anymore.

Yes, I too am frustrated that hardly anyone is speaking.

Oh, duh, that makes sense.

What do you think of Elo this game?

It makes me wonder why you don't know this. Wadsworth kills first. Scarlet second. Peacock third.

You make incredibly complicated games. I don't understand why you don't get something that simple.

Are you kidding? It doesn't even say in the roles which role kills first, it just lists them in a row. And I was in this thread for like 15 seconds, saw the results, and immediately thought, why no NK? The thought that Mrs. Scarlet was gone and that this past night was her kill night didn't even strike my mind until I came back into the thread and saw you mention it. I couldn't even tell you what most of the role powers are this game off the top of my head.

Now can you stop chastising me and answer my question for once?

Epignosis wrote:The lack of a kill was not unexpected. With Scarlet out, her kill doesn't exist anymore.

Yes, I too am frustrated that hardly anyone is speaking.

Oh, duh, that makes sense.

What do you think of Elo this game?