The Syndicate

Dana wrote: It's okay, I understand. I'll never forgive DH.

You're learning.

Thanks! I was hoping it would mean I could keep playing mafia as a good distraction... but my workload is just going to be too much for a while until I can get a handle on it. I'll see if I can get back into another game one of these days in the not too distant future! But I'm glad I at least got to play your and Made's first game.

Trust me, I am one of the world's worst liars, and I'm pretty sure pursuing my PhD in Accounting means nothing other than I'm completely insane, so. :P I wouldn't equate higher education to meaning much of anything in terms of mafia ability, haha.

My Accounting PhD program has just started up, and I had every intention of talking with you, but I was preoccupied the entire day until late in the evening and didn't get a chance, sadly.

Sorry for going after you both, Made and Dana. :P

Nooooo!!!!! Oh well, definitely well played, Virtue! This was seriously some of the most fun I've had in a mafia game in ages, such a great game MR!

DharmaHelper wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:I am not bad, DH.

Why are you ruling out Keterman, Blooper, and even Dana for that matter?

Dana I know is a civvie. Keterman and Blooper I'm not 100% on, but you I 100% know are a baddie.

You're so wrong. I can't believe everyone is listening to you right now.

I'm voting DH because of his blatant baddie play here.

WTF

I'm busy all day and everyone lynches me. Wow. Okay, well, way to waste a lynch, guys.

I am not bad, DH.

Why are you ruling out Keterman, Blooper, and even Dana for that matter?

Mister Rearranger wrote:

DharmaHelper wrote:What're the chances we'll get a post tonight?

500

I'll take those odds, good sir.

DharmaHelper wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:WTF!!!!!!!

Some major manipulation's obviously been going on. I didn't expect that at all. Sorry, Made, RIP.

Shame the Emmy's were last night

Not sure I follow.

Now I just don't know what to think. Seriously, WTF.

WTF!!!!!!!

Some major manipulation's obviously been going on. I didn't expect that at all. Sorry, Made, RIP.

Everyone knows blue is the best color anyway.

That's what I get for trying to read through posts while multitasking, lol.

nijuukyugou wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:I thought you said Nijuu didn't vote for Harbor.

If she did, then I would bet she's Tony.

I don't know if she did or not because she didn't state so in a post, from what I saw.

Just to set the record straight because it's driving me nuts reading it over and over, I absolutely voted for wet cement :P Throwing bodies into a body of water is a horrible idea, and I would never pick it. Proof:

nijuukyugou wrote:Wet cement makes the most sense, although I'd imagine it would be a rather messy and tedious business However, the bodies could be more easily found in a locker, a cooler (mmm meatsicle), or the water. Wet cement it is!

I promise I don't dispose of bodies for a living. Promise.

Also, I don't even understand what Made is trying to argue here, but it sure is amusing. Logic be damned.

Oh, I must have missed that. Thanks Blooper!

That settles it then.

Made wrote: linki- why the hell does everyone all of the suddent trust dana?

Spoken like a true Virtue team member.

DharmaHelper wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:I thought you said Nijuu didn't vote for Harbor.

If she did, then I would bet she's Tony.

I don't know if she did or not because she didn't state so in a post, from what I saw.

Oh if you're going off just Harbor voters then it would be either you or Bullz.

Well, I know it's not me. Bullz seems pretty civ to me, but I guess it's possible.

If it came down to you or Bullz, I honestly wouldn't be sure what to do. I'd have to think about it.

I thought you said Nijuu didn't vote for Harbor.

If she did, then I would bet she's Tony.

I don't know if she did or not because she didn't state so in a post, from what I saw.

DharmaHelper wrote:Instead of trying to refute an incorrect theory that says you are mafia you embrace that theory even at the detriment of the entire town.

Genius.

So if Made and Keterman are the last two Virtue, then who is Tony?

Thoughts? Because I'm at the point now where I was definitely thinking Dana and Bullz were not bad...

Made wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:

Made wrote:
Yeah even if tony bought my crazy gambit, or figured I was Virtue or something, They would of let me lived and killed ketterman as a sort of power move to kill 2 virtue in one day/night cycle, before virtue would have a chance to react night 6.

Did you seriously just out Keterman and yourself as Virtue here?

Definitely sounds like it to me.

I'm working with the theory you guys presented as to not upside you delicate cognative biases <3

Lol, nice try though.

Made wrote:
Yeah even if tony bought my crazy gambit, or figured I was Virtue or something, They would of let me lived and killed ketterman as a sort of power move to kill 2 virtue in one day/night cycle, before virtue would have a chance to react night 6.

Did you seriously just out Keterman and yourself as Virtue here?

Definitely sounds like it to me.

DharmaHelper wrote:

Dana wrote:

DharmaHelper wrote:

Dana wrote:Could it be possible that Tony voted cement and didn't kill on purpose to throw us off?

100% not possible

How come?

Too many assumptions associated with this theory. You assume A) Tony knew the poll would result in a block and B) That Tony was for some reason willing to forgo a kill during the end stages of the game.

Not possible.

Agreed.

It's times like this I wish I had a completely accurate spreadsheet for this game.

While I don't see the benefit typically in lying about something like that, it would be in DH's best interest if he were Tony to obviously keep himself off the Harbor list. I don't really think that's true, but I just find it odd that only leaves Bullz or Dana as possible Tony, assuming this theory about Harbor voters being blocked is correct.

It also doesn't seem that Blooper's vote was stated in the thread, so I'm not totally sure on that one either, although inclined to take DH's word for it.

Bullzeye wrote:

DharmaHelper wrote:

Bullzeye wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:Can someone confirm the Harbor voters? I know I was one but other than that I'm not sure. I can look it up later when I'm not multitasking though if no one else gets around to it.

DH voted Harbour. He initially voted something else but a glance through his post history shows he changed to harbour at the last minute.

I changed back.

Really? You never mentioned it so that's completely unverifiable unless someone has a screenshot of the results or something.

Can someone confirm the Harbor voters? I know I was one but other than that I'm not sure. I can look it up later when I'm not multitasking though if no one else gets around to it.

DharmaHelper wrote:The post is about how the attempt to throw the bodies in the harbor failed and how the cops came and detained people for that. Then MR says "some" people were blocked for being detained.

Not exactly a deductive leap.

Well, assuming this is a completely logical assumption to make (and I agree it is), and knowing I'm not Tony, that would leave... Bullz or Dana?

Weird.

That's why I was thinking Made to be Tony, but Bullz makes good points about him being Virtue.

Bullzeye wrote:It's mostly based on his reaction to my curse and the fact he's the only (non-forced) person who voted for me. I feel like Virtue had tried to set me up for a lynch with the Dana thing and it just didn't work out. So by that logic Made has to be Virtue. He also didn't originally vote for me because of any suspicion he held but then claimed I'd 'lessened' his suspicion. Which just doesn't make sense.

Oh, right. Nevermind, that makes more sense, he's more likely Virtue then. Here's hoping!

If Made does have teammates, I'd bet on him and Keterman being Virtue. I guess I could just see him being Tony too.

Bullzeye wrote:Really, MP? I'm practically convinced he's part of Virtue.

Really?

Well, that'd be more awesome, so I hope you're right.

I wouldn't be shocked at all if Made were Tony. In fact, it's probably the most likely role for him at this point. I guess we'll find out.

How is that suspicious? It's an honest assessment -- Keterman was the first person to vote for you.

I've since reconsidered and actually believe it more likely for Keterman to be bad... though I still would consider Blooper by process of elimination if it gets to that point. Blooper's flying under the radar playstyle struck me as more suspicious than Keterman, but it's obvious that Keterman's your teammate, so... :P

Words of a baddie, so I guess I don't care anyway, but still.

Woo, no death!

Voted Made.

No, we're waiting on MR to come back.

Bump

DharmaHelper wrote:

Made wrote:

DharmaHelper wrote:I'm gonna lose my shit if this post is at like 4am,

You seem uncharacteristically nervous.

If you're not nervous during a game of mafia, you're not playing right.

This.

thellama73 wrote:
I use that emoticon as a civvie in almost every single game. Maybe that's why I get lynched so much.

Lol, I'm guilty of that too.

Made wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:

DharmaHelper wrote:

Bullzeye wrote:I have reason to believe I've been NKed tonight, so hopefully the civs can pull through anyway. I'd really like to know after the game what it is I did to make the baddies treat me like such a big deal tbh. You guys should almost definitely lynch Made tomorrow, I don't see any way he can possibly be a civ after everything that has happened so far. After that I don't know. There probably aren't more than two or three civs left so it might not even matter.

Hang tough man we're not down for the count yet.

This.

I agree

If you want to seem like a civvie, that is the last emoticon you should use.

DharmaHelper wrote:

Bullzeye wrote:I have reason to believe I've been NKed tonight, so hopefully the civs can pull through anyway. I'd really like to know after the game what it is I did to make the baddies treat me like such a big deal tbh. You guys should almost definitely lynch Made tomorrow, I don't see any way he can possibly be a civ after everything that has happened so far. After that I don't know. There probably aren't more than two or three civs left so it might not even matter.

Hang tough man we're not down for the count yet.

This.

Also, Made, don't sweat it -- it's just a game, and I feel there haven't been any personal attacks this game, so not a worry from my end.

Agreed, one of the most crazy speed games (well, games in general even) I've played in a while!

DharmaHelper wrote:When is night over?

I hope soon, I'm so anxious!

Made wrote:Ight Tony, If you're out there. I'm gonna help you out. Kill me tonight, and you get a much needed advantage over Virtue.

Look at this point, I'm either dying tonight or tomorrow. If I die tonight, town kill Ketterman tomorrow and virtue kills a rando, then it's a 1 v 1 v 3ish scenerio.
not very favorable no?

The thing is if you decide to kill ketterman or even like dana (if you're really feeling silly), I die during the day, and everything I've said yesterday is validated. You won't last through the night.


Civs, don't screw this up. You're welcome.
Made

LOL, there is almost no way you are a civvie. Especially considering...

Made wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:Frankly, I just thought Blooper's vote (and timing) seemed more sketchy this past vote than Keterman's, so that's my logic on why I'm more apt to think Blooper is bad than Keterman.

Plus, Keterman has been making a genuine (or seemingly genuine) effort to scum hunt.

nijuukyugou wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:Vote already, Dana and Blooper, then MR can end the day early. :P

Fair enough. I vote Made.

lol this kid...also just noticed this...

MovingPictures07 wrote:Plus, Keterman has been making a genuine (or seemingly genuine) effort to scum hunt.

MovingPictures07 wrote: Good point bringing that up -- Keterman and Made definitely both tried to deflect attention onto S~V~S, and hard. I could see them being teammates.

for the record, his votes consist of no vote, no vote, SVS, SVS, SVS, Made.
one of those days he voted really damn early too...

That you said this. Trying to manipulate into making me seem bad, huh?

Keterman voted for you first; Blooper did last. My observation then that the timing of Blooper's vote seemed more sketchy is absolutely logical and had nothing to do with me prodding Blooper or Dana to vote.

And yeah, Keterman has been incredibly focused on S~V~S. I thought he was genuinely scum hunting.... and maybe he was, but he could be your teammate for sure.

DharmaHelper wrote:

Bullzeye wrote:

DharmaHelper wrote:To me, a team doesn't up and blow their load like that unless they're sure they have a win in sight. And the only way I can see Team Virtue picking Bullz to target and work so hard to lynch him would be if they thought Bullz was Tony, and killing him would give them control over who dies at night?

I dunno. Switching the lynch away from Made seems like it could be a baddie save.

But why would they think that and why wouldn't they just NK me?

I definitely think Made is bad. I see no other explanation. Notice he never answered me asking why he now claims to be suspicious of me despite initially saying he only voted me because you did.

Yeah thats where I get hung up. My other thought was, if we assume the opposite (they are on the ropes rather than in control) they might have used this big gambit of confusion to buy themselves some cover.

True, but here's the thing. I was expressing huge suspicions of Dana. If I were in their position, I would have seriously thought I could pull off that gambit.

Bullzeye wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:Okay, well, I look forward to reading what DH has to bring to the table as well, but I'm currently thinking

1. Made
2. Blooper
3. Keterman

I guess? For most likely baddies remaining. I just hope I'm not being hoodwinked here. And that list is subject to change. But I need to trust my brain and not my paranoia, and my brain says occam's razor comes into play for at least two of Bullz, DH, and Dana, if not all three. I suppose I just never expected two force roles.

Bullz, how strongly do you feel about your particular reason for DH's penciled in civ role? I just want to make sure this doesn't cloud judgment.

I would say I'm about 80-85% convinced. Yesterday's shenanigans threw me a bit but I made a post last night about how I think it can be okay for their to be two forcing type roles. Virtue are all about forcing people to do things they don't want to do and controlling people's lives.

Duly noted, thanks.

I actually just started watching the show, but I've only watched the first four or so episodes so far, so show insight is helpful.

Dana wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:I do think Dana nearly always sounds sincere, especially after I question her; I just get really paranoid of newbies playing the "I don't know" or "this is too hard" (not saying that's what she said, but her thoughts were along those lines) acts because I've been blind sighted by them way too many times. What struck me as the most weird was her transition from that to exact percentages, but I suppose if I buy her explanation to that, then I could see a real scenario where she is a genuine lone civvie this game.

For real though this game is a lot harder than I had expected. I had thought "hey this will be a nice fun mafia game like party version but just longer" but no, this is pretty hard-core. It is very fun, though. Just a lot to think through and keep up with, which makes it difficult.

I agree with your points about Made and Keterman, they've been pretty close for a little while, like with the whole targeting SVS thing. I'm unsure about Blooper, she hasn't been posting too much recently, so I'll wait to make a stronger opinion. Hopefully the team is only left with two people, that would mean a lot of civs are still around. I also agree that Bullz and DH are probably good, they both seemed to have been acting out of character yesterday so I believe they're telling the truth about being forced.

Oh, yeah, it is definitely difficult, and there is definitely a huge learning curve. Took me a few games to even find my footing, I believe. It's definitely different from the party version, but more enjoyable in my opinion (I love the theoretically infinite customization and complexity of the game). Even now after playing four years, I still can often feel totally lost.

Good point bringing that up -- Keterman and Made definitely both tried to deflect attention onto S~V~S, and hard. I could see them being teammates.

And yes, I'm enjoying my last few days of freedom before classes start WAY too much, if anyone couldn't tell. :P

I'll be leaving and doing something else for a bit here to give time for other people to post!

Okay, well, I look forward to reading what DH has to bring to the table as well, but I'm currently thinking

1. Made
2. Blooper
3. Keterman

I guess? For most likely baddies remaining. I just hope I'm not being hoodwinked here. And that list is subject to change. But I need to trust my brain and not my paranoia, and my brain says occam's razor comes into play for at least two of Bullz, DH, and Dana, if not all three. I suppose I just never expected two force roles.

Bullz, how strongly do you feel about your particular reason for DH's penciled in civ role? I just want to make sure this doesn't cloud judgment.

I must admit, what went down yesterday, when I think about it at face value and if I believe you are civ, Bullz, makes it pretty unlikely for Dana to be bad -- unless she's the lone member of the one mafia team that does not force/manipulate.

Occam's razor and all of that.

Man, I'd love for a fourth civ to exist... it is possible, if the mafia killed off each other even at all.

Well, if you, DH, Dana, and I are all civ, that would only possibly leave Made, Blooper, and Keterman, right?

I didn't pick up any particular reason to believe DH might be a particular civ, but I'll take your input for what it's worth on that one. I also believe DH has been genuinely civ for most of the game, that's why his silent vote yesterday shocked the hell out of me.

I do think Dana nearly always sounds sincere, especially after I question her; I just get really paranoid of newbies playing the "I don't know" or "this is too hard" (not saying that's what she said, but her thoughts were along those lines) acts because I've been blind sighted by them way too many times. What struck me as the most weird was her transition from that to exact percentages, but I suppose if I buy her explanation to that, then I could see a real scenario where she is a genuine lone civvie this game.

I just get really paranoid when I'm a civvie, and especially when games get down to the wire like this. I just want to make sure I consider every scenario. Not doing so has burnt my ass enough in the past.

Which means Bullz could be lying, but my gut doesn't want to believe that's true, especially after how things went down yesterday. That's the least likely scenario IMO.

It also means you are likely to die tonight, Bullz, so that's why I'm trying to engage you in conversation specifically even more so than everyone else (that, and I "trust" you the most of anyone right now).

But if DH was Made's teammate, would he seriously play his cards like that?

Frankly, I just thought Blooper's vote (and timing) seemed more sketchy this past vote than Keterman's, so that's my logic on why I'm more apt to think Blooper is bad than Keterman.

Plus, Keterman has been making a genuine (or seemingly genuine) effort to scum hunt.