The Syndicate

If only you people had paid more attention to the Llama Gambit, Lizzy could have been decommissioned ages ago.

Good game, all!

Snow Dog actually is the authority on all things Llama.

Simon wrote:Oops I forgot a funny face.

Don't make fun of me.

A Person wrote: People seem to be against random voting, and Llama was acting quite strange, so I decided to try my luck and see what happened. In the end the exact thing I feared happened and he turned out to be innocent and just conducting a strange experiment.

Yeah, strange like a fox.

S~V~S wrote:Welcome to the Scrap Yard, Llama

Thank you. Good to be here. I am insanely proud of the Llama Gambit and hope that it lives on in many future games long after I'm gone.

What a world, what a world! Avenge me, friends!

Bullzeye wrote:
Snow Dog wrote:While Llama appears to be noble it is only a good strategy if you don't actually want to continue playing. So didn't you want to play anymore llama old buddy?
That's what I don't get about the whole thing. Either he wants out, knows he won't be lynched, is a civvie who made a mistake and is trying to cover it up as intentional, or he's a baddie trying to cause confusion. I'm not even sure which I think is most likely.

I do want to kep playing and I hope I am not lynched, but more than that, I want my team to win, so it is worth it to me.

I am an experimental player, and while it would have been easy to play slow and logically, carefully deflecting suspicion away from myself and seeking out baddies, I found trying a different approach more fun. My vote for DP was a blind. It might as well have been anyone. It was designed to look irrational for the purposes of my plan. Perhaps I did err in urging vote consolidation, but I did not anticipate so many people following my vote. I thought Nev was most likely to be lynched behind myself, honestly.

Now that all the votes have been cast, I can reveal the patented "Llama Gambit."

Knowing that most of the time baddies try to act helpful and logical to blend in with the civvies, I decided to act crazy and illogical. A baddie would have to be nuts to act the way I've been acting, and I was counting on the civs realizing that. Therefore, civs would be unlikely to vote for me, but baddies would see an opportunity. They could vote for a civ and when my affiliation is revealed excuse themselevs by saying "well, he was acting really crazy."

However, by revealing my strategy in the thread, one of two things will happen: Either I get lynched, in which case the civvies have good info on who the baddies are based on who voted for me, or I survive and still have good info based on the votes for me. Either way, my team is aided substantially towards victory.

This is the "Llama Gambit." I hope you are sa impressed with it as I was when I came up with it.

I have to run now, and I doubt I'll be back before the lynch so I want to leave a parting word in case I am not alive when I get back.

If I die today, know that I intentionally sacrificed myself in order to give the civvies the info they need to defeat the bad trains. Good luck to all of you!

I think the baddies are using my apparent irrationality to scapegoat me. If I am lynched, look at those who voted for me to be filled with evil.

Nevinera wrote:
Bullzeye wrote: You really think Llama has info? I think that if he did he's a good enough player to find real stuff to back his points up with rather than joking about the letters in someone's username making them bad. I'm considering a vote on Llama myself as I find the whole pig theory weird and didn't think it was actually a serious thing until he based a vote on it.
I found it really strange also, but he's just not the sort to vote randomly.

If the info said 'you cannot reveal that you have this info' or something..
I could maybe see him making up a wacky reason just so people would figure out the real one?

I have no info besides that which I have posted in the thread. I think the pig theory is sound. It could be a weird coincidence, but I am testing the waters to find out. If DP is lynched and flips civ, my theory will be disproven. If he flips baddie, I will have a clear path on how to continue.

If I am lynched today, I hope the survivors will heed my advice on this.

birdwithteeth11 wrote:How much vote manipulation do the baddies honestly have? I see they have one vote block, but that's about it. So unless someone can point it out to me, I don't see how the baddies have significant influence on this vote.

They can influence the result with their votes. If two or three people are tied with the most number of votes, all one baddie has to do is wait until late in the day and vote for whichever one is not on his team. Bing bang boom, another dead civ.

S~V~S wrote:Nice way to spread the vote even further~ the baddies can swoop in and lynch a civ with just one vote with such a spread, especially if the lurkers dont vote

Hedgeowl wrote: Noted that DH voted for Nev as well, but can't ask why.

DharmaHelper wrote: Zhu Zhu Ama sound is the name of the game.

That's why! Isn't it obvious?

Lizzy wrote:
thellama73 wrote:
Lizzy wrote:I'll go with my gut feeling, since this is how it's done. Normally I would have chosen DH for rushing to vote 'goats' and because the baddies apparently can target one of their own. However, because DH has been absolutely hilarious today and cannot defend him/herself, I'm going with Llama, because the two of them seem to be on the same team. See the goats. I'm still keeping an eye on DH.
Why do you think DH and I are o the same team? He is funny, and the target of a baddie, so I hope he is on my team, but I don't know. If you know, I would appreciate you telling me.
With baddies being able to target one of their own in order to draw people's attention away from that player, assuming DH is in that situation, and you are on his team, that would make you a baddie. But these are just assumptions. I just found it odd the other day when you two rushed to vote for goats. I may be mistaken, of course. Plus your choice of avi, while I absolutely love it, makes you seem evil as well. :P

So you're assuming I'm bad because DH is on my team, and you're assuming DH is on my team because he was targeted and you're assuming he was targeted because he was bad and you're assuming he is bad because he's on my team and you are assuming he's on my team because I'm bad? Is that right?

A Person wrote:I still have no leads and don't think the poll results have any useable information. Maybe I random again.

I don't see why people are giving me a hard time for my (flawless) reasoning about voting for DP, but this is allowed to go on.

Lizzy wrote:I'll go with my gut feeling, since this is how it's done. Normally I would have chosen DH for rushing to vote 'goats' and because the baddies apparently can target one of their own. However, because DH has been absolutely hilarious today and cannot defend him/herself, I'm going with Llama, because the two of them seem to be on the same team. See the goats. I'm still keeping an eye on DH.

Why do you think DH and I are o the same team? He is funny, and the target of a baddie, so I hope he is on my team, but I don't know. If you know, I would appreciate you telling me.

I'm voting for Disgruntled Porcupine because out of the people who voted for Pigs, his name contains the most letters of the word "Pigs" and because pigs grunt.

DisgruntledPorcupine = Pig splice turned round

What more proof do you need?

Bullzeye wrote:
thellama73 wrote:
Snow Dog wrote:What's this about the pig voters?
All four votes for Pigs came from people who missed the previous lynch vote. I have a crazy conspiracy theory that these people had some info on the poll, and I think that indicates baddieness.
Let me get this straight. Your theory is that all the baddies missed a lynch vote, and to reward them for this Epi gave them info on the best poll option for them to choose? That does sound crazy.

Yeah, crazy like a fox!

Nevinera wrote:
thellama73 wrote: All four votes for Pigs came from people who missed the previous lynch vote. I have a crazy conspiracy theory that these people had some info on the poll, and I think that indicates baddieness.
I didn't get anything from that poll, if it helps. Not even bacon, and I feel a bit cheated.
Would it have killed you to pm me some bacon, Epi?

Snow Dog wrote:What's this about the pig voters?

All four votes for Pigs came from people who missed the previous lynch vote. I have a crazy conspiracy theory that these people had some info on the poll, and I think that indicates baddieness.

What are people's thoughts on the lynch today? I will going with a Pig voter, but haven't decided which one yet. Probably either Nev or DP. I think Hedgeowl may have been on to something with him.

Snow Dog wrote:
thellama73 wrote:
S~V~S wrote:Nice way to spread the vote even further~ the baddies can swoop in and lynch a civ with just one vote with such a spread, especially if the lurkers dont vote
I suspect this very good advice is likely the reason for her sudden departure. We would do well to heed it in the future.
I don't understand. She was Nked, not lynched. Or do you mean she was killed for giving good advice?

Bullz was asking what would make the baddies single her out for an NK. I was suggesting the good advice she was giving might be the reason.

S~V~S wrote:Nice way to spread the vote even further~ the baddies can swoop in and lynch a civ with just one vote with such a spread, especially if the lurkers dont vote

I suspect this very good advice is likely the reason for her sudden departure. We would do well to heed it in the future.

I think what bullz said is logical and correct. I find Nev's reaction to it a little odd.

reywaS wrote:
thellama73 wrote:I love a hairbrained theory, and I'm going to stick with this one as long as it is tenable. The pig voters must have had info on the poll, and that means they cannot be trusted!
what makes them especially untrustworthy? Even if they do have info, that doesn't mean they are bad necessarily. Civvies get info on polls sometimes.

They are untrustworthy because I don't trust them, and vice versa.

I love a hairbrained theory, and I'm going to stick with this one as long as it is tenable. The pig voters must have had info on the poll, and that means they cannot be trusted!

Snow Dog wrote:Nev worries me. First he says he has noticed some things about the setup he would like to share, but refrains out of fear apparently, of doing so. The lynch ends and what is this marvelous insight? Simply a few words of caution to narrow gauge trains about hinting too strongly. Then saying that he is not narrow don't NK him.

I have my eye on Nev.

Yes, I find this odd as well. I also find the pig votes all coming from non-lynchers odd. Those people definitely have my attention.

Has anyone else noticed that all the people who missed the lynch vote are going with Pigs today? Could this be a meaningful pattern?

Andrew wrote:Cows of course! We need to keep cows. Because they make BUTTER and milk.

Goats do those things too., and are less heavy.

Goats! Goats forever! How else will we rid ourselves of our tin can surplus and supply the nation with affordable cheese and milk?

Well that's depressing. I was really hopeful that we would get a baddie early on. RIP Boogs.

Lizzy wrote:Fine fine! Although, where I come from the benefit of the doubt is a ruling principle, I'll try to adapt to this unwritten constructivist Mafia approach. :P I still can't find a decent reason to vote for one person or another, though. Not on Day 1. ;__;

Your desire to be cautious is admirable, but we have to vote for someone and I have always maintained that it's better to vote with some reason than with no reason. I'm not sure what you are suggesting we do, since you complained both about finger pointing and about randomizing.

Also,

Boogs, I know you have had a tough beginning in many recent games and if you are lynched today, I am really sorry. I had to vote for someone though, and slip or no slip you gave me a better reason than anyone else.

DharmaHelper wrote:Voted Boogs because I think the post pointed out by SVS is suspect.

Yeah, I guess I'll vote for him too. He says he trusts me. That's not like Boogs. Why would he trust me unless he was on the bad team and KNEW I was civ? I also thought Nev's explanation sounded reasonable.

McViper wrote:Nev...Nev...never say "Never"

What made you vote for Bullzeye?

Bah, randomizing.

S~V~S wrote:Llama~ Lizzy & Mongoose have only posted once, too. Krissy has not posted at all.

In addition to these 5, there are 4 more that have only posted twice, meaning half the players have not said anything of substance.

What leads you to single out Nev & A Person?

Linki, yeah, I agree re Simon & Andrew.

I singled out nev because he is not a n00b and typically quite verbose, so his one post is out of character. It leads me to think he may have BTSC. I singled out A Person, not because he only made oe post, but because he only posted one word, which struck me as odd. I too am not eager to round up the n00bs and lynch them all before they have a chance to play. I am all for giving people a chance to settle in. I do think low posting among established players could be a sign that they are doing all their talking in BTSC, though.

Snow Dog wrote:Although Simon's and Andrew's early votes are worth discussion I feel. Newbie exuberance perhaps?

Given the youth of both these players, I think that is likely what it is. I think I voted relatively early in my first game just out of pure excitement.

Snow Dog wrote:I guess we should discuss some possibilities. How about McViper. I am not getting a totally good feeling reading his posts.

Could just be new-player weirdness or you could be onto something.

Here's what I have so far(which isn't much): The only things that stood out to me on a quick reread is that Nevinera has only posted once, and he is usually a very chatty player, so that is atypical. Also, A Person has only posted one word, "blue," which prevents us from getting any kind of read on him whatsoever. These are the two I've got my eye on right now, but as always on day one, it's very, very thin.

Bullzeye wrote:Good old day one. I'm gonna have a quick read through everything and see if something catches my eye. Has everyone checked in yet? I think so but I'm not completely sure...

Everyone has checked in, but Krissy is the only one note to post in the thread, although she voted for he color.

Hedgeowl wrote:Hmm, well what about color voting strategy? I am curious about the later voters, why they might vote the popular vs. unpopular colors. For example, Mongoose, what made you choose green as the 7th person vs any other color? Maybe some viewed aligning with black and brown as baddie colors and wanted to blend into the group? Makes Lizzy and Russtifinko stand out, but then someone has to be the first and you don't know if anyone will join. Could also be a good move to pick the smaller group. Thoughts?

@Simon - This is how I feel too

I think it's really hard to deduce anything from the color choices. You could argue thta a baddie wouldn't want to stand out and so would be unlikely to be a sole voter of a color, but I think if the baddies are any good they would just vote their favorite color and not think about blending or not blending. I'll be looking at thread evidence rather than color choice to make my decision, personally. Simon is acting very bizarrely, but I've never played with him before so maybe he is always like this.

Russtifinko wrote:Thanks for the poll results, llama! If it's not too much trouble I think I'll be needing those for all the polls during the game, since they end after my bedtime.

Happy to be of service, Russ! Let's hope cooler heads than that of our young friend Andrew prevail for both our sakes.

Although I could be more helful if the text editor and the text display used the same font so I could get the spacing right.

Boogs wrote: I want to not think you're bad in this game also, but the dastardly photo always makes me think you're watching me when I see it in posts lol. Are you a good llama this time?

Don't judge a book by its avatar. I am a good llama his time, yes.

Boogs wrote:Andrew he like to make fun, he's a tricky moustcache man. I am unsure who to vote for. I missed taking a photo of the poll so I can't remember who chose what colors. Anyone have it?

Player-------------------------Day 0
Andrew-----------------------Blue(2)
A Person----------------------Blue(23)
BWT---------------------------Green(20)
Boogs-------------------------Blue(14)
Bullzeye----------------------Blue(18)
DharmaHelper---------------Green(4)
DisgruntledPorcupine-------Red(21)
Hedgeowl---------------------Red(8)
Krissy--------------------------Green(19)
Lizzy---------------------------Black(16)
McViper-----------------------Green(12)
Mongoose---------------------Green(22)
Nevinera----------------------Red(13)
reywaS
Russtifinko--------------------Brown(15)
Simon--------------------------Blue(10)
Snow Dog----------------------Red(17)
SVS-----------------------------Green(11)
thellama73--------------------Green(7)

There, see how helpful I am?

Andrew wrote:
thellama73 wrote:
Andrew wrote:I'm voting for llama because made fun of me. Just letting you know I'm not going to be around tomorrow.
Jeez, we have some jumpy people in here today. It's only been day one for a little over an hour and already two votes in.

If everyone I make fun of is going to vote for me, I won't be around very long.
Then you better stop making fun of people.

Andrew wrote:I'm voting for llama because made fun of me. Just letting you know I'm not going to be around tomorrow.

Jeez, we have some jumpy people in here today. It's only been day one for a little over an hour and already two votes in.

If everyone I make fun of is going to vote for me, I won't be around very long.

Ugh. Day Ones are the worst. And it doesn't help that there are so many new players who I have never played with before. This is going to be a very difficult vote.

Epignosis wrote:It appears we just need reywaS and A Person to vote. If anyone can get them to come in and vote, we can continue on down the track. We would like to kick the poll end time back so it doesn't coincide with bed times and such.

Do it anyway. No sympathy for A Person and reywaS!

MovingPictures07 wrote: This post is thoroughly approved by Mr. Sock.

You know, on the topic of colors, one thing I always thought was weird with this album is the disconnect between the name and the album cover. Oddly, Discipline's cover to follow this features dominant red, yet this one is black. You would think this album would be the one to have the predominantly red color, but no.

Still, one of the best albums ever, so whatever.

And the cover of Larks' Tongues in Aspic contains neither larks' tongues, nor aspic. And Starless and Bible Black is pretty much the opposite of black. Those crazy, crimson fools!

Dutch is indeed a bottomless reservoir of funny-sounding words.

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