The Syndicate

Yeah, I think it worked out that if we had lynched me and night killed some Civ, it would have been the same as nightkilling me and then lynching that sieve

Good times, it was definitely the right move, went down in Mafia history.

And yeah, I've been singing the same tune for 2 years, sure, it's because the false rumors of my awesome skills still love to creep around, and its really annoying.

Why do I keep thinking :lol: will get me that?

Metalmarsh89 wrote:
Long Con wrote:Oh yeah! And I wanted to congratulate sig for calling me out on that COMPLETE BADDIE SLIP when I said Spacedaisy wasn't an info role.

And shame on you Civvies who felt that it was not a baddie slip. You guys were so wrong, and you owe him respect now.
Golden did the same thing in Gentlemen's Guide. How do you guys slip like that?

Contrary to popular belief, I'm the worst at Mafia. :lol:

Oh yeah! And I wanted to congratulate sig for calling me out on that COMPLETE BADDIE SLIP when I said Spacedaisy wasn't an info role.

And shame on you Civvies who felt that it was not a baddie slip. You guys were so wrong, and you owe him respect now.

Polo wrote:
Long Con wrote: And Metalmarsh didn't quite tell our Night 2 plan right, we withheld the kill in order to try and fool Mary Crawley, the roleblocker, into thinking she had successfully blocked a kill. Polo, did that work on you at all? We killed Polo the next night, so he had only Day 3 to possibly react, unfortunately. Polo voted Lorab that day, was she his Night 2 blocking target?
No, I chose Spacedaisy on Night 2

So.. no inkling that maybe you saved someone's life on Night 2 with a lucky roleblock? Did you suspect Daisy for it?

Scotty wrote:
Long Con wrote:
Metalmarsh89 wrote:
Scotty wrote:
Wow, that is surprising. I thought you could only block night powers. Little did I know.
Is this the norm? I've never heard of a a lynch survival being able to be blocked.
It's definitely not the norm around here. This is the first game I've seen it.
I love it. I would make the role need to send a PM at night, stating that they'd like to have the power to switch/stop a lynch on the following Day. Nightly power to affect the next lynch, fully blockable/stealable.

Dom wrote:
ika wrote:So for anyone wondering why I never posted I don't do cypher posting
The reason why I hoped you did is because I had the key to translate it. I responded to what people posted so they'd trust me.

That's why Illy did that 180 on me. Though, I suppose I might have told my role to LC.... played me like a fiddle.
I can't believe we blackmailed you to vote for me on the same night that my traitorous wife decided to come after me in her Edith post. On the same night that YOU insanified ME! Perfect storm really. That night decided the game for the Civvies.

And Lorab, good instincts, I was pleased that no one listened to you.
You blackmailed someone else to make a case for your own teammates? Lol how many people did you do that to?

You blackmailed me to make a case for MM and so I was immediately duped into thinking MM was good, but the more I thought about it, the more I realized Mafia would know I'm easily fooled by info and would do what I can with whatever info I have. Not a bad play, though I saw through it in the end.

Those were the only two. We were the most gleefully self-destructive baddies ever, I think. If BR hadn't come after me the Day she did (and had I not been insanified), we were going to nightkill me anyway, after I gave a final "infodrop-seeming" rainbow list. Like Spacedaisy did, actually - I was so upset that she upstaged me by basically doing the same thing first, except, you know, hers was honest. I had been dropping supersubtle hints about being an info role, and I was going to slam it home before my big death scene.

And yeah, we did it to get cred, and we were thrilled when it worked on you at first (yes we saw your post of trust in MM and loved it!). We wanted to keep you around because you could have been MM's saving grace, PLUS we knew we couldn't lynch you. Dom, did the blackmail give you any indication at all that I was Civ to you? Just wondering how some of our plans turned out, it got soured by Edith's message against me. It worked a little on Scotty, what were your thoughts on me at the time?

And Metalmarsh didn't quite tell our Night 2 plan right, we withheld the kill in order to try and fool Mary Crawley, the roleblocker, into thinking she had successfully blocked a kill. Polo, did that work on you at all? We killed Polo the next night, so he had only Day 3 to possibly react, unfortunately. Polo voted Lorab that day, was she his Night 2 blocking target?

Metalmarsh89 wrote:
Scotty wrote:
Wow, that is surprising. I thought you could only block night powers. Little did I know.
Is this the norm? I've never heard of a a lynch survival being able to be blocked.
It's definitely not the norm around here. This is the first game I've seen it.

I love it. I would make the role need to send a PM at night, stating that they'd like to have the power to switch/stop a lynch on the following Day. Nightly power to affect the next lynch, fully blockable/stealable.

Dom wrote:
ika wrote:So for anyone wondering why I never posted I don't do cypher posting
The reason why I hoped you did is because I had the key to translate it. I responded to what people posted so they'd trust me.

That's why Illy did that 180 on me. Though, I suppose I might have told my role to LC.... played me like a fiddle.

I can't believe we blackmailed you to vote for me on the same night that my traitorous wife decided to come after me in her Edith post. On the same night that YOU insanified ME! Perfect storm really. That night decided the game for the Civvies.

And Lorab, good instincts, I was pleased that no one listened to you.

Epignosis wrote:From LOST AGAIN

Scotty wrote:
Matt wrote:Any ideas on night one yet?

I'm not even sure who all is playing lol
I think LC is pretty dangerous and good at reading people.

Clapping Epi on the back with an axe would not be a bad idea. He's pretty much playing up Sawyer as much as possible and can be a pain in our neck down the road.

Hey, cool Scotty! Thanks for that vote of confidence, I'd say I AM dangerous, but absolutely crappy at reading people.

Scotty wrote:
Long Con wrote:Hey guys, that was a harrowing lynch, I'm glad we finally got one in Sorsha. Oh yeah, also how's about you don't lynch me because I'm not a freakin' baddie?!

I don't know what inspired people to hop on the classic old "LC is a baddie" train, but I assure you that you don't want to lynch me. I don't really know what else to say, is there a case against me, or did someone just point their finger and everyone ran where they were pointing?
Eyyyyyy lmao your wife thinks you're bad.
Case and point.

Well, I've been lynched for much less, but that doesn't change the fact that she's wrong... or the fact that there's no real case for me to even rebut.

Hey guys, that was a harrowing lynch, I'm glad we finally got one in Sorsha. Oh yeah, also how's about you don't lynch me because I'm not a freakin' baddie?!

I don't know what inspired people to hop on the classic old "LC is a baddie" train, but I assure you that you don't want to lynch me. I don't really know what else to say, is there a case against me, or did someone just point their finger and everyone ran where they were pointing?

Matt wrote:You should do me a solid and trust me for once, Epi. Even if I'm wrong on the why, I'm like an idiot savant with stumbling onto bad peeps for the wrong reasons.

Long Con, get in here and vote Illy dude!

JWP

Scotty wrote:
Black Rock wrote:
Epignosis wrote:Well, as it stands, either Long Con or Sorsha can place their vote onto me for survival. I'm none too pleased about that.
That's pretty crappy. I'm pretty sure civvies, at least some, have voted for you and they need to change it now.

A Sorsha vote is a good bet. I will vote to save Epignosis. I'm confidant he is not bad.

If you are not confidant, like I am, about Sorsha then vote LC. I will switch my vote to him to save Epignosis.

Also Matt is a bad vote. So don't vote there. If he was bad he would have never tried to push suspicion on me.
Why are you so confident Epi is good?

I want to give LC the same grace that a bunch of you gave me when I was silent, and not vote him today.

JWP

Dom wrote:I voted LC.

JJ

Black Rock wrote:
Scotty wrote:
Black Rock wrote:
Long Con wrote:JJ
I understand, you're right. I might be taking advantage of you.

I'll vote Sorsha.
This is the cutest thing I've ever seen.
When people get married, do they adapt a unique language?
lol indeed they do.

JJ

JBIFAUHLZMWHDYDRWTT

Matt wrote:#Illyismafialetsgether

That gets more and more believable as time goes on. Maybe I'll ISO her after Dom, should be faster.

Epignosis wrote:Scotty's early posts are rife with hedging.
Spoiler: show
Scotty wrote:
Nerolunar wrote:
Scotty wrote:
Matt wrote:Checking in. Haven't read the thread yet, will try to get that done before work today.

Yay game!
Are you the Riddler?
Not this again

I'm feeling good about Silverwolf.
You know, I was just gonna say that of Silverwolf and ika, I find silver more suspicious. She seems more subdued thus far, where ika has already tried to work out the game (albeit in an exploitive manner).

That being said, they could both be civs and I'm probably voting a low poster day 1

Scotty wrote:
Metalmarsh89 wrote:
Scotty wrote:EBWOP: becauSe I find it strange you are attaching yourself to bwt while patently avoiding discussing Dom thus far, and to an extent even Dfaraday
Why is this strange?

You have not mentioned Dom or DFaraday at all this game before this post, but you suspect me for not doing so?

You're walking a dangerous road my friend.
Ah yes, but I votes for you on the reason that you haven't mentioned the trains and voted for someone for a thin reason that had a vote on him already.

I'm calling the kettle brown to an extent, because I think based on your actions I think that one of Dom or DFaraday is bad but I don't feel comfortable voting there yet in case I am wrong.

I feel better voting for you

Scotty wrote:I think that It is too early to tell for Dom and DFaraday. I lean scum on Dom, but having 4 people outright vote him is either a bullseye by town or a huge mistake.

im curious about bwt. My gut tells me he could be bad (yes I see that you are voting him) but I need a reminder: was he bad in "A World Reborn"? He was NK'd n1 I remember, and he is acting differently this game I feel.
In Turf Wars, I lied about making a spreadsheet to throw some last minute discord into the thread (I had no spreadsheet in Turf Wars). This was Scotty's reaction to my joke:

Scotty wrote:
Dom wrote:
Scotty wrote:
Epignosis wrote:
Long Con wrote:It can be upsetting to mess up a nice spreadsheet.
Fine.
Ah, I see you messed up your spreadsheet in a game in which you were bad and that aroused a lack of interest.

wait are you serious?
Maybe.

Scotty wrote:Not so much impressed with bwt's lack of defense on the matter. His D1 has been pretty unfulfilling thus far.

bwt
Scotty voted birdwithteeth for the above reason. The only mention of bwt was to ask about his alignment in a game he ended up getting confused over.

Scotty wrote:
Sorsha wrote:
Scotty wrote:I think that It is too early to tell for Dom and DFaraday. I lean scum on Dom, but having 4 people outright vote him is either a bullseye by town or a huge mistake.

im curious about bwt. My gut tells me he could be bad (yes I see that you are voting him) but I need a reminder: was he bad in "A World Reborn"? He was NK'd n1 I remember, and he is acting differently this game I feel.
bwt was bad in A World Reborn but he was not killed night one. Timmer was killed night one and then later replaced bwt
Ah, you know what? I meant Recruitment IV. I didn't even play World Reborn, I just got the two confused.
And before that, Scotty criticized (and voted for) MetalMarsh89 for this reason:

Scotty wrote:Hey Marmot: what do you think of the 3 current trains right now? How do you feel about those particular people being voted for?

Scotty wrote:EBWOP: becauSe I find it strange you are attaching yourself to bwt while patently avoiding discussing Dom thus far, and to an extent even Dfaraday

Scotty wrote:I guess what I'm tryin to say is: Metalmarsh

I could very well see a Dom or DFaraday/MM pairing. A teammate trying to save one of the big trains by attaching to another. A day 1 marmot lynch wouldn't be so bad, would it?

Scotty wrote:
Metalmarsh89 wrote:
Scotty wrote:EBWOP: becauSe I find it strange you are attaching yourself to bwt while patently avoiding discussing Dom thus far, and to an extent even Dfaraday
Why is this strange?

You have not mentioned Dom or DFaraday at all this game before this post, but you suspect me for not doing so?

You're walking a dangerous road my friend.
Ah yes, but I votes for you on the reason that you haven't mentioned the trains and voted for someone for a thin reason that had a vote on him already.

I'm calling the kettle brown to an extent, because I think based on your actions I think that one of Dom or DFaraday is bad but I don't feel comfortable voting there yet in case I am wrong.

I feel better voting for you
Scotty accuses MetalMarsh89 of trying to start a third bandwagon (on bwt). Scotty thinks one of Dom or DF is bad, but is unwilling to commit to either, to read between the two of them and come to a decision. Instead, he temporarily votes for MM, and then joins MM's lynch against bwt.

It's also worth nothing that MM and Scotty have voted together three out of five times, the last time for ika. Keep this in mind.

In conclusion, I think Scotty and MM are teammates, and this was warning early distance. Erm, Distance Early Warning. Erm. You get what I'm saying: Red Alert.

++++

After birdwithteeth died, Scotty pointed to me. His MM suspicion up and vanished. What was Scotty's criticism of me?

Scotty wrote:RIP bwt.

I think Epi is bad.

I think he is capitalizing on slight mistakes people are making that don't necessarily indict them. I think he's hiding behind his BR vote and throwing a banana into the ring instead of his own two feet. Epignosis is Donkey Kong.

Epignosis wrote:Sir David Withteeth gets taken out yet again because of go-along voters.
Epignosis wrote:
Black Rock wrote:I voted for epig because that was a weak ass vote that I think he's hoping to generate some speed. He knows he can out talk me. One of your teammates in trouble?

Linki: I don't think I've been that good at mafia recently.
Oh yes. I took my vote off Dom (who had three votes) and put it on you (who had none) to save a teammate.
This is what I'm talking about. If Epi were bad, he may be certain that his teammate is not getting the axe.
Never mind that multiple people stayed out of the Dom / DFaraday / bwt triumvirate- I don't think that's important.

What's important is that Black Rock accused me of trying to save a teammate (see what Scotty underlined), but his interpretation was that I "may be certain" (more hedging, by the way) that none of my teammates are in trouble.

That contradicts the idea that Scotty thought one of Dom or DFaraday could be bad. If he genuinely believed one of Dom or DFaraday could be bad, then why didn't I vote to save one of them, as Black Rock accused? Bear in mind that we know DFarday was good, and that my vote was on Dom for most of Day 1, and I switched to LC and then Black Rock near the end of the Day (as I recall).

Even more unsettling is Scotty's criticism of me here is that I stayed out of the bwt / DFaraday (false) dilemma, implying some sort of civilian credit on his behalf that he, unlike me, jumped in "feet" first. Scotty's criticism of me was that I did not lynch a civilian.

However, fast forward to Night 5:

Scotty wrote: I can only start looking at the common denominator- something you so readily gave us:

Epignosis wrote:Lorab
8
Epignosis (4), Nerolunar (10), Matt (11), DFaraday (12), Metalmarsh89 (13), sig (14), Spacedaisy (15), Polo (19)
42%

DrWilgy
5
Epignosis (9), Nerolunar (11), sig (12), Metalmarsh89 (13), DrWilgy (16)
31%

Nerolunar
6
Epignosis (3), Illyria (5), Black Rock (7), Long Con (8), Scotty (10), Sorsha (12)
46%

So which is it? Am I bad for not lynching birdwithteeth11 Day 1, or am I bad for leading a lynch on DrWilgy and Nerolunar?

After telling Dom I was "flicking my poo finger" at people (whatever that means):

Scotty wrote:
Epignosis wrote:Well, I'm one of those rare sorts that actually listens to messengers who say something useful.

Edith didn't say anything about Long Con, however.
Wait so you're taking the advice of a party that knows nothing but gut read? Or are you implying that you think Black Rock is Edith?

Either way, that's a quick turn around for someone that has been clinging to petty votes thus far.

Epi

Scotty wrote:OKAY well I didn't check the poll before writing hat. Epi is off the poll today.

How convenient.

Scotty wrote:I hope Mrs. Hughes knows what she is doing. Because if so, that makes me feel better about Epi for the time being.
What this tells me right off the bat is that Scotty cannot be Mrs. Hughes.

Three minutes after this little revelation, Scotty does not pursue suspicion of Dom or DFaraday or MetalMarsh89, but rather opens a new can of worms: Matt:

Scotty wrote:
Matt wrote:Oh man, I'm gonna get shit for this, but I still haven't caught up. Randomed between Bwt, DF, and Dom, and got Bwt. Sorry, even if you are bad Bwt
I don't like how you are handling yourself this game. Hollow promises to catch up (x3), not catching up, and "random" voting between the 3 trains. This doesn't spell confidence, Matt.

Matt.

And then another can:

Scotty wrote:Ok. If Matt never comes back I'm keeping my vote on him.

If not, I'll humor the Nero vote.
This time, he would considered a Nerolunar vote, whom we just lynched. Again, do note that Scotty had his vote on Nerolunar all Day but switched to ika at the end.

I know that ika likes bussing his team and being bussed himself. If ika did kill Silverwolf, he would beg his team to lynch him (and here he is even voting for himself).

The upside here is that, if Scotty and ika are on a team together, Scotty can vote out ika and point the finger at me for thinking through whether or not ika killing Silverwolf Night 1 fits the evidence and concluding that it didn't. Indeed, that is Scotty's plan. It's posturing:

Scotty wrote:i still want to vote ika before you, especially since you think he is civ.
When I asked Scotty what he meant by this:

Scotty wrote:That bubbles replacement does seem...coincidentally timed with these votes rolling in for her. I must admit. But at least she's showin up. That's why I'm voting Matt.
He dodged the question.

My intention for asking him to talk more about this was his appraisal that Bubbles was "at least...showin[g] up." Yet Bubbles had three posts, and only one of them was content.

At the end of Day 2, Scotty makes a worthless poke at MM:

Scotty wrote:You know who hasn't been around on the later half of this day? MM.

Is he still set on Matt? did he cocoon himself away to evolve from marmot to man?
This is Scotty's list. ika is listed as good, but MM is listed as bad. Bear in mind that Silverwolf is long gone. Night killed. Scotty played Turf Wars in which ika was bad and wanted to be lynched and wanted to kill Silverwolf.

Scotty wrote:Hokay. I'm not gonna rainbow list, but I will list thoughts I have for every person. Nothing super long.

Black Rock: null read for me. Epi's back and forth with her regarding LC didn't ping me either way and for some reason, Lady Edith trusts her. Would like to hear more from Lady Edith in why we should leave BR alone

DFaraday: suspicious only because he garnered so many detractors but I think his detractors had the most hollow of points in suspecting him. I still don't see the arguments against him, and would like to believe that statistically he didn't roll 3 Mafia roles in a row.

Dom: is still a suspect to me. I don't know what constitutes "bad Dom" but I do remember him being slightly antagonistic when he was bad in Arkham. He's not quite to that level right now, but he has a pattern this game of asking people if they are bad, and not following up on it. Aka lots of stoking the fires but not putting any logs on.
His vote for Illy yesterday does nothing to sway my mind.

DrWilgy: I have good vibes from him, though it's very hard to read his diary entries or actions thus far as indicative of his alignment.

Epignosis: I have Epi as slightly civ right now, primarily because he was removed from the poll Day 2. This is a strong statement and I went into the day thinking he looked most fishy for his voting for an outlier day 1. But he has appeared to offer something of substance as a civ so far, so I'm doubling back on my original suspicion.

Illyria: it's a toss up. I see that most of her writing hasn't been brought with substance, but she could just need to get her bearings after being away for so long. Someone brought up that she had been asking questions in thread a bit too much. I don't know her playstyle, but on the surface she seems like she could be posing. I mean that not as Audrey Hepburn, but as Milli Vanilli. Ya dig?

Ika: ika Is acting different than his last game where he was bad. I think he is thinking along linear tracks that makes sense. No reason to suspect him right now.

Long Con: slight pings here and there, but nothing overwhelming. He suspects me for buddying him and for a few other things, which I guess makes sense. I agreed with his assumptions day 1, but day 2 he grew weary and has been a little slipperier.

LoRab: looks bad. I didn't remember anything she has said so I ISO'd her. Not a lot of anything there. Half her posts are just nostalgic posts of the past or asking questions. The other parts:
Day 1, she laments that she doesn't see the case on Dom or DFaraday because they're both playing typically. She votes BWT with the crowd because...he made an inconsistent point, and that was unlike him. Then, shying away from all the bandwagons 24 hours later, does a meaningless vote for Wilgy because he is posting in normal Albeit strange Wilgy manner- also demanding he post normally.
She has played with Wilgy before and knows he has some quirky posting style every game. For someone that doesn't suspect certain people for posting similar to their meta, this is a surprising vote.
Day 2, she misses the vote, and comes back recently saying she doesn't know how she would have voted. Offers the same excuse: "I need to reread" the case on DFaraday. She accepts Epi's suspicion for being quiet, and says that her game has been unusually quiet so far.
Her excuses make her seem worse for wear. Even admitting recently that her game has changed recently.
I think LoRab could very well be bad, and would like to follow this suspicion further.

Matt: I'm feeling better about Matt. I probably would have taken my vote off him towards the end since he actually started to catch up and post thoughts lol

MetalMarsh: ehhh this guy is my top 3 suspects. We have voted similarly but I think his votes are disengenuous. His comments seem....hmm, off? Somehow? Than normal bantery MM. Like he's trying to appear civ.

Nero: null read. I go from civ to bad. It's not that he's pinging me, but that he's not saying anything that is making me feel he is civ.

Polo: he's a newb and I lean civ right now. Epi trusts him.

Sig: I like his posts and am reading him as civ. Which, as he has said, if he appears civ then he is probably bad. So...

Sorsha: she's taken a pretty aggressive stance this game. Not sure what that says about her alignment. Null read

Space daisy: don't have time to ISO her now, but I haven't really had a great read from her. I'm leeeeaaaaning bad but she has said some stuff (from tone) that reads civ.

Llama: I don't like llama coming out brazenly and latching onto a Nero lynch, not expanding on it, and then changing to Bubbles at the end. Could he really have something on Nero and want to stave it off until a time he can really peg him, and ultimately just jumped on a suspicion of someone else? Llama is a null leaaaaaaning civ read for me.
The most substantive thing said here was against Lorab. That's where he voted Day 3. Another can of worms without following through old suspicions.

Scotty wrote:For now, placing a vote on LoRab.

I'll be looking to her, MM, Dom and several others this phase.
Here is what Scotty had to say about ika Day 3:

Scotty wrote:
sig wrote:
sig wrote:I see three scenarios here.

1. Ika is mafia and killed Silver before she could get a strong read on him.
2. Someone killed Silver to frame Ika, this points to an experienced mafia member.
3. Silver mainly talked about DF, Epi, and LC around the time of her death and EOD. One of them is mafia and killed her.
I'm requoting this, the more I think about the more likely it is to be true, plus I think all three would think that Ika could be framed for Silver's death. I'll do the leg work for it over the phase, I'm just throwing out some thoughts right now.
Yes, I thought about this, and I'm actually surprised ika hasn't talked about this point more. If I recall, he and silver like to feast on NK analytics. Though some people, like (arbitrarily) baddie DFaraday has admitted to preferring to kill people that support him or aren't involved with him one way or another to throw people off the trail. This wouldn't seem like a baddie DFaraday move.
I could be behind LC though.

i wish not to believe that ika is bad because a) that would undermine the role that takes people off the poll and b) he is acting vastly different than his last baddie game. Too much WIFOM in the argument that he killed his wolf partner.
After tangling with Lorab a bit, Scotty decides to stick with his guns and-

Oh wait no.

Scotty wrote:
ika wrote:i feel liek thsi game is going nowhere and its jsut back and forth aboutt he same things....

lets lynch dasy!
Ok. Ill throw my stick in the fire.

Daisy.
Scotty votes with ika.

Keep this recent accusation in mind as you read this stuff. Let it be a refrain to this song of the damned.

Scotty wrote:i still want to vote ika before you, especially since you think he is civ.

Scotty wrote:Well I'm mad again. Way to go, household.

Also, hi.
Scotty is mad because he was silenced and couldn't vote Day 4. That means Scotty isn't Mrs. Patmore.

Scotty wrote:Thanks for not lynching me today while I was holed up in the basement. I will respond in the morning to what I'm sure are rivoting reasons why I was the lead lynch for a while.

Also brief thoughts off the top of my head:

Llama seems bad to me. Nero seems bad as well. I'd be down with a Nero lynch tomorrow.
I trust Epi right now.
I am willing to leave LoRab alone, as well as Daisy.
I trust ika.
MM is still a ??? to me.
Matt...is about as hopeless this game as Bernie is to win the nomination.
More tomorrow.

Scotty wrote:Dropping in to vote for Nero. Nothing he has said in defense of his leading 4 votes all day has made me think he is anything but bad.
No discussion between that and this:

Scotty wrote:Voted ika.

Sorry I've been gone most of the weekend. Busy stuff.

The results of the champs game came out and ika did in fact kill silver n1. This seems eerily similar.
Now we're here, with Scotty wanting to lynch ika and then me.

Scotty wrote:
Epignosis wrote:
Scotty wrote:
Epignosis wrote:
Scotty wrote:Starting to be more unsure about Epi. I thought at first he and Polo could have had BTSC but his cases have been...bad, to say the least.
Question:

What does Scotty thinking I had BTSC with Polo have to do with my cases being bad "to say the least?"
Answer:

They're independent thoughts.
Impossible. The conjunction betrays that notion. The two thoughts are grammatically linked. The second independent clause is the reasoning for doubting the first.
I think the Engish teacher in you is picking apart trivial details that don't matter but lovely weather we're having, ain't it?

More like: "I thought the English teacher in you was picking apart trivial details that don't matter but your hairline is receding, so..."

Your example dropped the past tense, which I think is an important distinction... and the weather part has nothing to do with Epi, whereas the original statement has both parts about Epi.

I have to agree with Epi's read - what it communicates is that you used to think Epi and Polo had BTSC, and his bad cases made you reconsider that notion.

17. Corrects Black Rock's "sneaky" analysis to "nuanced".

18. Brings up the dichotomy of Black Rock not suspecting him yet calling him "sneaky" Suspicion of Black Rock

19. Repeats the point from #18 in different words. Suspicion of Black Rock

20. After Epi brings up that BR wasn't talking about this game, Dom says he doesn't suspect her, but then reiterates that the word choice could be intentional to foster suspicion of him. Suspicion of Black Rock

21. Confronts sig for his true opinion of Dom's alignment. (I will not label this one as "Open question" because it's more direct than "Are you bad?" or "What do you think of XXX?") Denies Silverwolf's 'try-hard' analysis. Accepts that Black Rock wasn't trying to get Dom lynched ("I can buy that."). Upon reread... Dom had already said that he wasn't suspicious of BR. Why would he act like Epi convinced him, rather than respond with something like "Exactly, she was not suspecting me" kind of talk? "I can buy that." reads to me like "That works, let's drop it now".

22. Hard-claims town, and gives a

for ika presupposing Dom is bad due to their previous interactions.

23. Tells ika he has no read on Metalmarsh "because he's too wacky". Responds to Spacedaisy's detective work into the BR affair with a pretty legit answer.

That's where I'm calling it a night, peeps. Way too 4:45am-ish for me to go on. Right now, I have an elevated level of suspicion for Dom, but I did like his answer in post #23. I'll try to continue this tomorrow here and there.

Metalmarsh89 wrote:What sorcery is this llama? Every banner is broken except for yours!

Ain't my Photobucket.

sig wrote:If Ika has given up the will to play and just keeps self voting we should lynch him, he will in the end just aid the mafia by doing that.
I'm at a loss who to vote for, I think LC might be good.

I am good. Which is why you shouldn't vote for me.

How does it aid the Mafia?

Dom, A Retrospective - Part 1

1. Starts out with an OT-sandwich, hold the green. Between two throwaway comments to Illy, a small challenge to ika for not revealing all his reads. Suspicion of ika

2. OT and throwaway

3. Throwaway, and asks Polo if he's bad. Open question

4. Keeps some sideways pressure on ika, then tells of a read without revealing it (like he was pressuring ika for doing), answers Polo's counter-are-you-bad with a "no". Suspicion of ika

5. Asks Illy what she thinks of Polo's post. Open question

6. Declares he "noticed something" about Polo's post, but that he liked Polo's response. Suspicion of Polo Unsuspicion of Polo

7. Denies Polo any information about post #6.

8. Asks ika if Silverwolf is bad. Open question

9. Links ika to A World Reborn to see Macdougall's policy lynch in that game

10. Asks for more people to talk about his interaction with ika Open question

11.

I don't like how it was announced that there were suspicions, but not what they were. Waiting to announce a suspicion is one thing. Announcing a suspicion, but holding it to yourself is weird to me.

But this is kind of what Dom did in # 6 & 7? Suspicion of ika

12. Says ika is mischaracterizing Dom's point. I don't see that perspective. Suspicion of ika

13. Tells Illy his play hasn't changed significantly.

14. OT

15. Accuses ika of a No U because ika red-graded him. Suspicion of ika Briefly delves into dissecting Silverwolf's suspicion of him.

16.

It was intentional that I withheld the suspicion I had of the person who was withholding suspicions. Your second point isn't a suspicion. I said something about the post caught my eye and I liked his response, so

Dom says he withheld his suspicion of ika intentionally... but my analysis to this point contains several posts where suspicion of ika seems pretty clear.

------------------

I know I'm not too far in here, but I'll post this starter analysis. Probably better to have it in a few separate posts anyway.

Epignosis wrote:
Scotty wrote:
Epignosis wrote:
Scotty wrote:Dammit. Sorry Nero. I came to my senses too late.

I think ika should be next to go. And I think at least a couple of those on the Nero train should be heavily looked at over the next few cycles.
Starting to be more unsure about Epi. I thought at first he and Polo could have had BTSC but his cases have been...bad, to say the least.
If my cases have been so bad, then why have I led three lynches in a row? Why did you have your vote on Nerolunar until the eleventh hour?

If my cases are bad, the time to say so is during the Day phase when I'm making them, not after you've seen the lynch result.
I was busy, negative nancy. I wasn't the ones making the cases.
The point you were making in the town showing up to make their own cases is true, however you saying so doesn't make me feel better about you, but worse. It's like scolding a child for getting into the pantry to steal the peanut butter and while the child is in time out, you spoon out 10 tablespoons for yourself to pin on the child later
Nope. I feel like I'm one of the only ones doing any legwork and a large number of people are coming in just to drop a vote and fuck off somewhere.

I don't say things to make Scotty feel good, especially when there's an even stronger possibility that naughty Scotty is killing people.

And I don't like peanut butter, so there.

Me neither. Gross stuff.

RIP Nero, I can't believe you could have saved yourself. But that Game of Thrones was pretty awesome, right?

Oh yeah, and "in the midst" of ISOing Dom means in and out while cleaning the house and stuff. It's not completely imminent.

Dom wrote:
Epignosis wrote:
thellama73 wrote:
Epignosis wrote:There's just such little participation here, it's difficult to work out anybody's opinions. I vote and make a case and people follow that.

THIS is why civilians lose. It isn't because of mechanics (most of the time) and it isn't because of balance (most of the time).

It's because civilians don't try.

Try goddamnit.
You're so bad.
why
I will admit that this is the most un-Epi post that I've seen all game.

No it's not. This is definitely not the first time I've seen Epi express these exact sentiments. Unless you mean the "why" post, then I dunno.

I agree with some more looking at and discussing, so I'm in the midst of ISOing Dom a bit. Looking at his votes, they're

. First vote to put BWT ahead of DF on Day 1, both Civs. Day 2, voted Illy and (Civ) Wilgy also voted her. Bubbles/bea was Civ-lynched. Day 3 votes for (nightkilled, likely Civ/Doctor) Spacedaisy while Lorab gets the most votes and DF is surprise lynched. Day 4 he votes Daisy over sig before the Wilgy train even got started.

Linki: Quite the ika story there, Epi. So, just to be clear, you believe that Silver reading ika as Civ makes ika a likely Civ?

Linki 2: MM

Epignosis
1
Epignosis (1)
100%

Epignosis wrote:
Long Con wrote:
Epignosis wrote:
ika wrote:
Epignosis wrote:
Matt wrote:So today should be easy peasy.

After reading through Wilgy's ISO...

sig

RIP Daisy
Easy, huh? What makes it easy?

Spacedaisy wrote:Now, of those who are in my top green, I'm most confident about Epi and Sig being civ.

your point?
My point is there's no way in hell I'm lynching sig, and the people pushing it now have my eye.
But Spacedaisy wasn't an info role, why would you put more stock in her opinion than Wilgy's (info-fuelled) statements?
Why would spacedaisy have to be an info role?

Because otherwise her trusting sig is just an opinion. Although now that you mention it, I can think of one other way that Spacedaisy could know sig is Civ, but I just don't think that is the case. Spacedaisy believed sig is a Civ, but that doesn't carry much weight for me because she could be right and she could be wrong. She's probably been wrong a number of times in this game, I don't see what makes you so sure that she's right about sig. Is it because she is right about you, and that makes you trust her opinion more?

sig wrote:
Long Con wrote:
Epignosis wrote:
ika wrote:
Epignosis wrote:
Matt wrote:So today should be easy peasy.

After reading through Wilgy's ISO...

sig

RIP Daisy
Easy, huh? What makes it easy?

Spacedaisy wrote:Now, of those who are in my top green, I'm most confident about Epi and Sig being civ.

your point?
My point is there's no way in hell I'm lynching sig, and the people pushing it now have my eye.
But Spacedaisy wasn't an info role, why would you put more stock in her opinion than Wilgy's (info-fuelled) statements?
You didn't say a known info role you said an info role, as in period. I'll also note lady Edith didn't say anything last night and Daisy died. I think you or a teammate role checked dasiy, and you made a TMI slip.

I know what you think, you're just wrong. It was in comparison to Wilgy's known info role, if you read it in context. Wilgy is, as I said, an info-fuelled source of information, and Daisy's opinions are not as reliable because she could be any role... yet Epi is clearly putting a lot more stock in Daisy's opinion.

sig wrote:
Long Con wrote:
sig wrote:Wait how do you know she wasn't an info role?
I meant a *known* info role, like Wilgy. I doubt she was Sarah O'Brien.
No but you might be which is how you know she wasn't an info role.
It seens like a scum slip to me.

No I am not, and no it was not.

sig wrote:Wait how do you know she wasn't an info role?

I meant a *known* info role, like Wilgy. I doubt she was Sarah O'Brien.

Epignosis wrote:
ika wrote:
Epignosis wrote:
Matt wrote:So today should be easy peasy.

After reading through Wilgy's ISO...

sig

RIP Daisy
Easy, huh? What makes it easy?

Spacedaisy wrote:Now, of those who are in my top green, I'm most confident about Epi and Sig being civ.

your point?
My point is there's no way in hell I'm lynching sig, and the people pushing it now have my eye.

But Spacedaisy wasn't an info role, why would you put more stock in her opinion than Wilgy's (info-fuelled) statements?

thellama73 wrote:I'm going with Scotty again. A bit puzzled as to why the people who agreed with me yesterday have been shifting away from him.

Probably has a lot to do with Wilgy's Civ-read of him.

thellama73 wrote:
Matt wrote:
thellama73 wrote:I'm going with Scotty again. A bit puzzled as to why the people who agreed with me yesterday have been shifting away from him.
I think it was Day 2 when Wilgy pretty much cleared Scotty, and in later posts down the line, you can see Wilgy continue to say things like "Don't lynch Scotty!"

Derp
Oh right. I'm voting for Epignosis then. I think he's playing a masterful game and playing us all for fools.

What makes you think that?

Epignosis wrote:
sig wrote:Why do I have two votes already.
Relax pal. One of the people voting you is bad, and the other isn't paying attention and could be bad too.

Right now only Matt is voting for sig. Is he the bad one, or the non-attention-paying one?

Also, who was the other one, ika?

Never mind, I see it was ika, just got back to your argument with him. Now ika is voting Nero, what changed your mind, ika?

ika wrote:you literally jsut arbitrarily defined how my town play.

What does your scum play look like again?

ika wrote:
Dom wrote:I just added something relevant. I didn't discredit you. I simply informed you that you were wrong.

You, however, are doing quite the job of an attempted discrediting of me, though.
i was directing it at the post you made, had nothign to do with your overal play, nice misrepresentation

and no im not wrong, if epi belives im scum he should be voting me instead. if not i call bullshit

I don't read it as Dom misrepresenting you. I think Dom's coloured analysis of your post was quite apt.

Dom wrote:
ika wrote:
Dom wrote:
ika wrote:
Dom wrote:I just added something relevant. I didn't discredit you. I simply informed you that you were wrong.

You, however, are doing quite the job of an attempted discrediting of me, though.
i was directing it at the post you made, had nothign to do with your overal play, nice misrepresentation

and no im not wrong, if epi belives im scum he should be voting me instead. if not i call bullshit
did you know you can think more than one person is bad at the same time?
did you know thats not the point?
what exactly is, then?

You didn't answer this yet.

ika wrote:
Long Con wrote:
Nerolunar wrote:Tbh I find it weird that Wilgy listed me. I don´t have BTSC with anyone of any alignment. I think it was more of a scum read from him, and not an indicator of how his role worked out.
It took you a long time to say that. Is that because you didn't want the Lie Detector to check it last night?

Of Wilgy's bad list, you are the one I trust the least, so Nerolunar.

I was catching up on my phone last night, and the stuff between ika and Epi and Dom had me shaking my head and furrowing my brow. I'll reread on the computer, and see what I think.
does your conclusion come with a scum read on me and voting me?

If I do, it will be a fun surprise.

Nerolunar wrote:Tbh I find it weird that Wilgy listed me. I don´t have BTSC with anyone of any alignment. I think it was more of a scum read from him, and not an indicator of how his role worked out.

It took you a long time to say that. Is that because you didn't want the Lie Detector to check it last night?

Of Wilgy's bad list, you are the one I trust the least, so Nerolunar.

I was catching up on my phone last night, and the stuff between ika and Epi and Dom had me shaking my head and furrowing my brow. I'll reread on the computer, and see what I think.

Wasn't around for the Wilgy train, as usual I was working Friday evening. Crappy result, I can understand why it went down. I'm still not totally sure he wasn't faking the insanity though, seems likely that Silverwolf was the insanity maker... and didn't use her power the night she died? I dunno. I don't think it matters much anymore.

So Wilgy was the BTSC-checker, and left us three BTSC reads and two clean reads. Epi, sig, Nero as BTSC-havers, and Lorab and Scotty as non-BTSC. (I don't see the point of avoiding mentioning it at this point, night or day the baddies already have this info) It looks as though none of the three of them have Civvie BTSC with each other -- if anyone reads their interactions this game differently, let me know and I'm all ears, but I feel like they've been more likely to lynch each other than defend each other. I think the most likely scenario is one is Civ BTSC and two are bad BTSC?

Maybe. All three are definitely on the radar come tomorrow though.

I was rereading what I've read in bits and pieces on my phone since last night, and knowing the Wilgy flip, this Nero post stood out:

Nerolunar wrote:
sig wrote:
Nerolunar wrote:Wilgy gunning out reads the moment he comes under suspicion.
Yes agreed one of which is me, who is an easy person to say is mafia and not big deal when I flip civ. Wanna vote for me with him?
I suspect you, but I suspect him even more. Fine with me. This Lorab vote aint going anywhere.

DrWilgy

He votes for Wilgy after Wilgy has identified Epi, sig, and Nero as his perceived baddie team lineup:

DrWilgy wrote:ACTUALLY!! this is it:

Epi, Sig, Nero!

Boom-bassa-boom!

DrWilgy wrote:...

My confirmations have been confirmed! Epi, Sig and Nero in that yorder!

You might say he was trying to get rid of Wilgy when he realized Wilgy had some sort of info role, and that was my thought for a second or two. Then I thought "would the baddies really jump to lynch Wilgy, identifying him as an info role? Wouldn't they prefer to kill him anonymously that night?"

I just thought it looked like a *reaction* to Wilgy's bad-list when Nero voted him. Of course, his question about Civ BTSC is incriminating in a way that dwarfs what I'm talking about anyway, so as Joey says, it'a a moo point.

Wish we still had DFaraday around.

Wilgy, why were you posting in random capital letters before?

Do you see any similarities between your gameplay and Matt's?

Epignosis wrote:
Long Con wrote:
Epignosis wrote:I just asked the host something else.

Kills can be blocked but not redirected. Therefore, what Lorab suggested about Silverwolf isn't possible. Silverwolf is 100% civilian.
I would have never thought to ask that one. I think it was always best to consider Silver a Civ, rather than an extremely unfortunate baddie.
I've been rather aapjistic lately.

BR will love that one.

Epignosis wrote:I just asked the host something else.

Kills can be blocked but not redirected. Therefore, what Lorab suggested about Silverwolf isn't possible. Silverwolf is 100% civilian.

I would have never thought to ask that one. I think it was always best to consider Silver a Civ, rather than an extremely unfortunate baddie.

Spacedaisy wrote:That said, I disagree with the following statement. I'm not convinced the doctor is faking. We didn't see anyone insanified Day 1, it could easily be faked if they felt the insanifier was dead. Have we seen anyone insanified today? I haven't yet read back over Wilgy yet, but my gut is still unsettled about his "insanified" posts.

Metalmarsh89 wrote:I don't think the doctor's faking. No one else has been cursed.

Is it just me, or did you mean to say the opposite of this statement? Maybe "I'm not convinced the doctor isn't faking"?

Spacedaisy wrote:
Matt wrote:
thellama73 wrote:
Spacedaisy wrote:I'm at work so let me keep my explanation quick. Matt is low engagement right now, but he has not been replaced. I think a person who believes they might not have time is more likely to hang in there longer if they are a civ, because they don't have teammates they know they are letting down. Civs don't know who their teammates are so they are less likely to feel the pressure of helping their team. That was a very fast replacement and she didn't say anything about getting a replacement in her post that I recall. Most civs announce they are going to ask for one.
I agree with this. I think hosts are more likely to replace baddies whose team needs them than a lone civ. Many hosts have disagreed with me on this, but I've seen it happen, man.
Avert your eyes, Scotty...

Still *catching up* (on page 10), but I don't think Bubbles being replaced has anything to do with her/bea's alignment. I was very nearly replaced just the other day, but I convinced our gracious hostess that I would play more and I'm civ soooo...

Also, Lol @ Epi. Yeah dude, I realized the irony after I posted it

Anyway, Illy is still my top suspect. Lots and lots of questions about multi-quoting, how to post in off topic, etc, it really feels like she's pushing the "I'm not on a team, see, look at all my questions about stuff" agenda.

I like reading about dying Wilgy and his diary pages. Good stuff.

Looks like Daisy is the first to vote for bwt (?) when Dom and DF were getting heat the other day. Hrm.

Anyway, I'll be back in a bit.
I've been doing some ISOing and this popped out to me. I never once meant to imply that Bubbles would be replaced without her consent that quickly, especially directly after her posting/voting. I don't know any host who would do that. I always believed that Bubbles had asked for a replacement but not told us in thread and that she did it in a hurry for some reason. I was wrong about her alignment clearly. But this statement by Matt went right by me. He had been posting and voting, why would he have to convince Elo to let him continue to play? That seems out of character for any host.

Epi, you know your wife better than I do, does this seem to fit something she would do as a host?

Better yet, Hostess: Would a player who was actively posting and voting be replaced without first asking for a replacement?

Off to continue my ISOs...

That certainly pops out. I don't know what to think about that, forcible replacements are pretty rare.

Epignosis wrote:Additionally, can you show me where I suspected Scotty previously?

Actually, no I can't. I think I mixed Llama's suspicion up with yours, sorry.

Epignosis wrote:
Long Con wrote:
Epignosis wrote:
Long Con wrote:
Epignosis wrote:I voted silenced Scotty. I gather he is silenced because only he and Illyria have not posted, but he has votes but has said nothing.
No moral qualms for voting a silenced guy? I hadn't realized he was silenced.
I never have moral qualms about that (well, mostly never). When the silencing is coming from a civilian, then I take a silencing to mean, "Shoosh, villain!"
A Civ might also silence one who is merely at their throat too much as well... but you already suspected Scotty, so I can understand why you'd lean that way.
Why did you vote spacedaisy but refrain from a second bout like you did with DFaraday?

I voted Spacedaisy because I got back to vote very late in the lynch, when it was something like 8-6, Lorab over Daisy, and I suspect Daisy more than Lorab. However, my suspicion of Daisy had already fallen quite a bit even by that time, and I'd put her in a neutral yellowish area of a current rainbow list. Also, I don't necessarily vote in twos as a rule.

Epignosis wrote:
Long Con wrote:
Epignosis wrote:I voted silenced Scotty. I gather he is silenced because only he and Illyria have not posted, but he has votes but has said nothing.
No moral qualms for voting a silenced guy? I hadn't realized he was silenced.
I never have moral qualms about that (well, mostly never). When the silencing is coming from a civilian, then I take a silencing to mean, "Shoosh, villain!"

A Civ might also silence one who is merely at their throat too much as well... but you already suspected Scotty, so I can understand why you'd lean that way.

sig wrote:@LC the fact it was a fly by vote right after you voted was the issue, not the fact he voted for me. However, I was only a major suspect after I suspected him.

A fly-by vote without a post is not how I like to see a vote cast, I agree with you there.

Epignosis wrote:I voted silenced Scotty. I gather he is silenced because only he and Illyria have not posted, but he has votes but has said nothing.

No moral qualms for voting a silenced guy? I hadn't realized he was silenced.

I don't have a problem with ika's vote for you - he said you were one of his top suspicions already. I was surprised that his vote was still on Llama and not on you at the time I voted, actually.

sig wrote:
DrWilgy wrote:
sig wrote:
DrWilgy wrote:Im getting baddie vibrations from Sig.

I'll vote there.
Day 4 and only vibrations? Not a very good reason to vote.
Seems like a good reason to me. Sig why is the reason behind your vote more concerning than the fact that it happened?
I don't understand your question?

linki: aww that isn't very nice. Good news though? Llama bussing me on weak reasons probably means he is mafia.

It wasn't a slip or anything close, Epi didn't answer my meta question yet went out of his way to say so. Then I asked in a different way and he still didn't answer.

But Llama is voting for Scotty.

And I think your question was manipulative.

Linki: I discussed Illy when I posted, and I don't think there's much there to suspect. You think she was manipulative when scolding Dom?

I'm placing my vote on sig right now. His "need a loaded question" thing with Epi looks like a borderline slip, and has given me my biggest ping.

Dom, I see you haven't voted yet? Where would you place your vote if you were to vote now?

thellama73 wrote:
DrWilgy wrote:I want reason for your Rab suspicion 1st if you can daisy.
Yes, I concur with this.

Scotty is one I could easily see being bad. He's kept kind of a low profile this game.

Llama and Wilgy.. are they defending Lorab? Llama seems to believe Lorab is the lynch switcher, contrary to Epi's theory. Llama is interested in a Scotty suspicion. So is Nerolunar. So is Dom. Dom and Nero also suspect Lorab, just slightly less.

Wilgy gets badder vibes from sig, and votes him. Then:

Matt wrote:Yeah sig is totes bad so I'll join him and vote ika.

Derp.

Matt is sort of a wild card in this game, is he more zany than substance? I feel like he's had some suspicion, but he's hard to keep a hold of. After Metalmarsh votes for him, he counter-votes Metalmarsh.

Llama votes Scotty, Nero follows suit, then Metalmarsh becomes more interested in a sig lynch.

Nero says no, Scotty looks badder. ika and Wilgy both prefer sig, but ika's vote is on Llama.

Currently, things are pretty spread out:

Dom
0
No votes
DrWilgy
0
No votes
Epignosis
0
No votes
Ika
1
sig (5) 9%
Illyria
0
No votes
Long Con
0
No votes
Lorab
0
No votes
Matt
1
Metalmarsh89 (8) 9%
Metalmarsh89
1
Matt (9) 9%
Nerolunar
0
No votes
Scotty
2
thellama73 (10), Nerolunar (11) 18%
sig
1
DrWilgy (7) 9%
Sorsha
0
No votes
Spacedaisy
0
No votes
thellama73
1
ika (4) 9%

Ok, I have read here and there on my phone, but I'm going back to read through stuff since my last post yesterday.

Epignosis wrote:
Polo wrote:Oh, the anxiety
Damn, man.

Seriously. Great timing on that one Polo, and RIP.

sig wrote:Can someone weight in on Sorsha's scum meta? I recall her being less active as mafia in EST and another game I played with her I think? However, I can't remember how active she usually is.

Sorsha was scum when I was hosting A World Reborn, and although she made it one lynch shy of the end of the game, she was not in the top ten posters. We need some comparison to games when she's Civ to be able to get much information from it without analyzing the content/style of her posts. Maybe I'll search something like that up when I'm done this catchup post. Future edit: I see that she poked her head in to say the other game is taking up most of her Mafia time right now, which is believable.

sig wrote:
Polo wrote:
sig wrote:
sig wrote:I see three scenarios here.

1. Ika is mafia and killed Silver before she could get a strong read on him.
2. Someone killed Silver to frame Ika, this points to an experienced mafia member.
3. Silver mainly talked about DF, Epi, and LC around the time of her death and EOD. One of them is mafia and killed her.
I'm requoting this, the more I think about the more likely it is to be true, plus I think all three would think that Ika could be framed for Silver's death. I'll do the leg work for it over the phase, I'm just throwing out some thoughts right now.
Are you and ika both mafia?

I'm not sure if Silverwolf's suspicions really were spot-on before the first nightkill; I believe she did not have enough time to gather much information and the mafia might have killed her just because they know how good she can be at reading people as the game progresses.

But it's still a possibility that one of those is mafia. For reasons I've already stated, I believe Epignosis is civ, but I'm not sure about DFaraday and Long Con.

One thing to consider: maybe the mafia did not vote for BWT because no mafia was among the lynch candidates on D1 and they abstained from jumping on bandwagontarget11 because they wouldn't raise suspicion on themselves.

Out of the people Silverwolf was talking about, Long Con did not vote for BWT; he voted DFaraday on D1 and on D2, when there was a tie between Bubbles/Bea and DFaraday.

Just thinking out loud here.
So he was wrong about DF, that leaves LC and Ika.

Just want to stop you right there. He was wrong about DF, so that leaves LC, ika, and sig. As in: "Are you and ika both mafia?

" Putting yourself in the Polo-analysis doesn't incriminate you, but leaving yourself out is not cool, sig.

sig wrote:
Polo wrote:
ika wrote:read the end of your post i quoted, you said "IF I FLIP CIV"

You know ika, your attitude in this game is very different from EST mafia. You've been much more aggressive. What happened?

Day 3 he was killed that night, I don't think it is a coincidence he suspected Ika and was then killed. I'm starting to believe more and more that Ika is mafia, potentially with Llama as a teammate. I'd like to lynch Ika today.

VOTE IKA

I'll ISO him soon.

besides that not much from Polo some early suss on Dom, but he later reads him as civ. As well as daisy and a slight civ read on Ika and maybe on Epi. This actually adds more weight to my Ika theory. Kill the player who suspected then changed his stance on you. It gets rid of an issue and isn't as likely to lead back to the killer.

That does read well from a solve-Polo's-death perspective, but would ika kill Silverwolf on night 1? I've been giving him the 'prob-Civ' benefit of the doubt for that, despite his grossly suspicious playstyle. :lol: I do not agree with Llama being linked up as ika's teammate, but that's neither here nor there at this time.

sig wrote:@Everyone can you clue me in on Illyria's meta? Is she usually so jokey about serious stuff like lynch votes on her? I've seen a few things one in particular which I'll link and I'm unsure if she is being playful or manipulative. (Not in a bad way, but in like a you might be mafia and I wanna kill you way :P)

Illyria wrote:
Dom wrote:I'm putting a vote on Illy right now. I didn't love her responses to being suspected and I'm going to be out for the rest of teh day.
That hurts young man.

She seems like regular Illy to me, and I missed her very much. It's been too long for me to give Civ/baddie meta reads on her... I have enough trouble remembering the usual Civ/baddie meta for anyone, really, most people seem the same to me in either alignment.

Neutral read on her right now, and I'm probably biased at the moment, not going after her much because I don't want her dead. As for Illy's description of herself being bad as a baddie... that probably has historical truth, nothing I personally remember, other than the hosting thing at which she is good.

Epignosis wrote:
sig wrote:
Epignosis wrote:"Meta" is foolishness.
I disagree. Though if you won't talk meta what do you think of her slightly manipulative posts and comments about how fast and crazy the game is.
What do you think of loaded questions?

sig wrote:I think I wouldn't need to have asked a loaded question if someone had given me a meta read/insight instead of saying meta was foolish.

The idea that you "needed to ask a loaded question" in order to get the response you wanted is the thing that strikes me as "slightly manipulative" in this situation.

ika wrote:
sig wrote:I'm starting to believe more and more that Ika is mafia, potentially with Llama as a teammate. I'd like to lynch Ika today.

VOTE IKA
if you think im scum with llama why do you vote me instead?

ika wrote:so sig/llama are sucm and daisy porb third

So you think sig is scum because he suspects you, and you think Llama is scum because sig said his name?

Anyways, I'm up to Daisy's rainbow list, and I have to go outside and do stuff. So here I post!

Scotty wrote:
LoRab wrote:
Epignosis wrote:Lorab, stop defending yourself. If you are good, then who is bad? Go.
If people stop making cases about me, I'll stop defending. In the meantime, I would like to preserve my life.

Who is bad? As I said, I still have an eye on Wilgy. Not a huge suspicion, but he's on the list of people I'm carefully watching.

I eyeballed that one post of Ika's, but I don't really suspect him overall. That one post made my eyebrow twitch.

As I said, I'm now thinking about the folks who bandwagoned me. I realize that no one else knows that I'm civ, but I know that I am, so I'm thinking of it that way. I can't help but think that Daisy was being saved with votes for me--look at the order of votes in the lynch poll--I start getting votes outside of Epi's after Daisy has several votes on her.

In all, of those who voted me, I don't actually supect you, Epi, even though you were an early and vocal voice against me. I think your suspicion of me, while misguided, is your honest opinion.

Nero's vote was suspicious--he didn't really mention me before that, and didn't really say much when he voted, just that he was convinced. Seems like a baddie vote adding votes on to the chosen target and to save a teammate. Matt, I have no idea. DF we know was civ. MM has been reading civ to me, but I'm not so good at reading MM. Sig is a question mark. Polo I am starting to suspect because he's been playing the newbie card a bit, and because from the vote order, it looks like he was jumping onto my lynch because then he could hide.

Of those that didn't vote for me, I suspect Scotty a bit. I feel like he was twisting things and presenting facts in a skewed way in order to make me look bad. He also, by not voting for me, could be setting up for later in the game so that a glance at votes won't show that he was a prime player in the lynch train against me. In my experience, it is baddies who plant the seeds for a bandwagon, and they then let the civies do the bulk of the dirty work. In this case, I think that Scotty planted the seeds...but i also think that there are those that voted for me for nefarious reasons.

So, I'm mostly looking at Daisy and Scotty, and to a lesser extent Polo. Wilgy is a tier down from that. The others I mention here (or whom I'm not thinking of at the moment) are all in various places of no idea to I think they're civ.
If Daisy were being saved as you hypothesize, how would that look in relation to me? Am I jumping on a bus opportunity early?
I want to say i don't suspect you any more, but the truth is I found myself taking more of a break from you and following a leap of faith against Spacedaisy, who, btw, appears to me more and more of a baddie attempting to claw and scrape her way out of the toaster.

You call me setting up seeds, I call letting my seeds sit on the sill unplanted because I'm uncertain if they will grow into an illegal marijuana plant or a sensible Rhubarb bush.

You should totally plant those muthas!

I won't be around much for the night. When does it end? I'll be back here this evening EST.

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