The Syndicate

Do you understand how that makes no sense? If she thinks he's a baddie, and he wants to stop playing, and he HAS to be a baddie for her case on me to be right... We should just learn keys' role, right?

She thinks Keys is WW and voted me yesterday because he knows I'm a railroad. Yet she's not voting for Keys, she's skipping straight to me without knowing if the first part of her theory is even true.

No MM. Splintsy's case on me is BASED on Keys flipping Water Works. He wants to quit. Why isn't she voting him FIRST? It would give her case some credibility if he flips WW and poke holes in her case if he's civ. either way it looks like he doesn't want to play anymore. Meanwhile I've been fighting for my life all damn game.

$75 +5 votes.

Keys wants to quit anyway. Let's lynch him and see if your theory is right splints. You're putting the cart before the horse if you vote me without knowing keys' role.

I don't have time to defend against another set of allegations (that have nothing to do with MY behavior and all to do with Keys, whose role we don't even know) this late in the day, I've spent all my time defending already. I'm voting for Keys, he wants to quit anyway. Frankly I hope he's NOT Ww because I can guarantee he didn't vote me due to me being a RR

Why do you think I'm a railroad splintsy? That's a new one...

Both I guess. But I wanted to know in general.

Where are YOU leaning now, splintsy?

I didn't win Electric Company.

Long Con wrote: He had a kill night 2, and chose to kill Black Rock 1.0... and when we looked back on all of BR's posts, the only thing that stood out was that she had spoken up against TH.

But do you remember who it was did that "looking back on BR's posts" thing after she died? It was... wait for it... the BIrdwithteeth himself. It looks like he specifically NKed BR to try and implicate me.

And I'll say this... when I'm bad, I don't kill my accusers. Call it WIFOM but it's just not my MO. I'm of the belief that doing so brings more attention than it alleviates. Especially since BR's suspicion of me wasn't even very strong.

Long Con wrote:He was around Night 4, and so he didn't likely MISS the kill. He may have chosen not to kill in order to implicate low posters, or the roleblock may have been used on him. Both do seem unlikely.

I did mention that the missing kill was probably linked to an inactive player, but I also specifically advocated against lynching any of those players. On the same day that I was a major lynch candidate, I said we shouldn't lynch a low poster. I'd like the conspiracy theorists to explain that wrinkle.

Long Con wrote:So there was not, like a super-huge number of opportunities to reveal Lorab as an RR.

Except there would have been a PERFECT opportunity for me to kill Lorab... on Night 4! Hedgeowl had JUST been lynched under the pretense that only baddies can survive NKs without purchasing protection powers. If I NKed Lorab N4 and she survived, I wouldn't even have to do anything else, that lynch train would have run all by itself.

bea wrote:hi domodom! what say you sir?

I'm late in the game so I'd like to hear what you think about everything outside of your normal lacky comments. fill a sista up please

I do believe Dom is modding. Hahaha.

I'm just pointing out the facts. It looks like Keys was not around for the missed kill, and returned just before last night's kill.

fingersplints wrote:However, I do agree with you that keys deserves reexamining. I stand by my "keys might be WW" idea. He has missed kills before when I have hosted him, and I think he voted with bwt. And again, there is no reason for him to have tried to outbid me on that rob. I think if he was a civvie he would have let me have it.

Keys didn't vote for BWT. He voted for LC about halfway through Day 3. Epi brought up his case on BWT a little while after that, but Keys did not post again during that lynch.

Then on Day 4, keys posted once ontopic to vote for Hedgeowl, and then rest of his posts that day were trying to outbid splints for the rob power, which he lost.

Night 4 was the night of the missing Water Works kill.

Keys did not post at all from Day 4 up until his one post yesterday (Day 6) where he voted for me.

On Night 6, Water Works killed again.

Well I can't defend against accusations of WIFOM. My actions do not make sense if I'm a baddie, and you're saying that's WHY they make sense as a baddie. I can't defend against that. Some people will suspect me no matter what I do.

Yeah, if I'm WW and missed that kill to set up low posters, but then I DEFENDED low posters from being lynched... what exactly was my endgame there?

You've got some neat ideas there LC, and I must say it's refreshing to see an actual case against me for once. I'm not Water Works though, and here's why.

Long Con wrote:I'll go with one of the smaller pieces of evidence first, that TH was actually actively campaigning to NOT kill Water Works, based on the fact that Water Works missed their kill on Night 4. He wanted to skip Water Works and go after LMS groups in order to leave the kill in the hands of an inactive player. He wanted us to accept the theory that we would be seeing Water Works miss more kills in the future, making it safer for everyone to leave Water Works alive.

To be fair, I wanted to skip lynching an inactive Water Works for now and go after railroads and LMS groups, not just LMS groups as you state here. They are all threats, but I figure that an inactive player who is solely in charge of an NK is the least threatening of those. In addition, I didn't want to randomly go after a nonparticipant hoping they were Water Works, again because it's like looking for a needle in a haystack AND the kill would transfer to another group anyways. It seemed safest to leave it in WW's hands if WW wasn't playing. It also seemed safe to wait one more day to see if the trend continued. Sadly it did not.

Long Con wrote:Upon reflection, that's a fool's dream. I don't think it's a remotely plausible thing to believe. But Turnip Head was pretty insistent on it, even going so far as to accuse people who wanted to kill Water Works of anti-Civvie behaviour.

Thank you Captain Hindsight, a fool's dream indeed. But I ask you why it is uncivvie-like for me to want to save lives by leaving that NK in WW hands if WW wasn't using it? If WW had missed another kill last night, wouldn't we be better off leaving WW alone for as long as possible? Lynching an inactive WW would have moved the kill over to a more powerful team, which is all I wanted to avoid. I was trying to save civvie lives.

As for accusing people for wanting to kill WW... that was just BR. I've since written this off as a misunderstanding on her part. She didn't realize how the Beatdown power worked.

Long Con wrote:One of TH's main suspicions is Lorab. He is really pushing the idea that she's a Railroad. Lorab landed on Electric Company on Day 1. If TH is Water Works, then he's doing this because he knows that Lorab is a Railroad, and he's now moving to take her out. It makes sense to wait a while after learning her role so early, because she would be looking for a Utility coming after her after landing on it. And in the last lynch, TH vs Llama, you would think that Llama would be the first vote, since this was his case... but Lorab is actually the first vote.

In the 'Mexican Standoff' situation of a Uitility knowing a Railroad, and a Railroad knowing they know... the Railroad would probably act fast to eliminate the Utility once they know who it is.

If I KNEW Lorab was a railroad, if I've known since Day 1 as you claim, and IF I'm Water Works... I would have tried to NK Lorab and I would have done it immediately. She probably would have swiftly received the Hedgeowl treatment after surviving. I would NOT tip my hand of being the game's only rolechecker by accusing her straight up, I'm smart enough to know better than that.

Long Con wrote:Zeek, incidentally, also landed on Electric Company and had his role learned. Water Works killed zeek last night. If zeek was a red property, then that's why he was killed. Which means Water Works would have a Death Hotel in possession. If that's true, and we lynch Water Works, then that hotel will be up for grabs, and the reds obviously have enough money to outbid anyone to get their property back. Just stuff to think about.

This... has nothing at all to do with me so I guess I don't have to respond to it. Hopefully Zeek was a red or a member of another monopoly, but I don't know his role and I didn't kill him.

Rest in peace Zeekypoo. Hope your hiatus isn't a long one. Looks like the utilities are back to their old tricks.

Does Ninjablooper even realize she's playing this game? She signed up for Cars Mafia today. Meanwhile she hasn't posted in this game in ~3 weeks.

Metalmarsh89 wrote:

Long Con wrote:Bye Llama.

I got you once.

I'm reconsidering wanting you lyched Long Con. I don't think you're one of the reds, and they are more important to track down right now.

While I agree the reds are more dangerous, keep in mind that the baby blues have recently purchased more houses, and their hotels are significantly cheaper for them to buy than the reds' hotels. Once those hotels go up, that money is coming out of our pockets.

Rest in peace Llama

Looks like I've gotta vote llama. Hope you're bad buddy.

Read back through Boo's explanation of that again and then let me know if you still want to lynch an inactive Water Works.

If we lynch Water Works, the kill will pass to whoever bid the highest on Beatdown, assuming that player votes for Water Works. The railroads do not factor into this at all so you missed my point completely.

And now that I think about it, the fact that BR seems so gung ho on lynching an inactive Water Works today might be an indication that she is in the LMS group that won the Beatdown power. There's not much other incentive to go after an inactive Water Works. A civvie BR should be happy that the kill is not currently being used against us. Something to ponder.

SVS, I know you are just as worried as I am about where a baddie kill might end up once a team is eliminated. I'm not sure if you saw this, since you mentioned Boo's previous ambiguous answer re: the kill. This was a power that Boo put up for silent auction:

boo wrote:4) Beatdown: This power allows anyone with BTSC to take over the night kill of one of the mafia teams. In order to do so, all members of the mafia team must be dead (at least 1 of them must have been killed with help from a member doing the beatdown), and then the night kill can be claimed. Can be played prior to the requirements occurring, but will only go through once they are met. Bids for this power can be done privately. - Starts at $200

It's very likely that one of the two established LMS groups has obtained this power.

I'd rather leave the kill in the hands of an inactive player than to just hand it over to one of those guys.

I'm not sure about Llama. I think his case on me is silly (obviously), and his jokey posts about partners remind me of when he did the same thing in the Harry Potter game when we were baddies together. But that's all I've got on him. He plays with bravado whether civvie or baddie.

I think an inactive player is Water Works and want to see what happens with the kill tonight.

Lorab is my main suspicion for a railroad but I don't see that gaining any traction. Her vote for me came off as extremely defensive, like she was just happy to have a reason to vote for me and scuttle back out of the thread. Her "I'm not a baddie" song and dance means absolutely nothing any more, she does that twirl every game.

Bea has been even quieter than usual and I feel she might be trying to intentionally slip under the radar. I don't remember any of her contributions to the game and that concerns me.

I'm 100% convinced LC is in an LMS group and will need to be lynched eventually. I'd rather lynch a straight up baddie than go for an LMS, but to be honest the LMS's are just as much of a threat to the civvies.

In the end I'll be voting for whoever has the most votes to help ensure I don't get lynched. But I'd rather try to go for one of the above players because I'm just not feeling sure about Llama. I think he's just blinded by his suspicion of me.

LoRab wrote:Especially since you accuse me of specifically being railroad--and not WW. Is that because you are WW and therefore know I'm not? But still want to make the accusation to get attention off yourself?

I accuse you of being a railroad and not WW for two reasons, Lorab.

1) If you are lying about not winning the bid for Electric Company, and you were Water Works, I don't think you would put EC up for auction (as was the case). You would want to hold onto that card.
2) Epi was killed by a railroad, and you're on my short list of people who may have killed him because of your tete a tete with him earlier in the game.

Llama, LC said "good", not "bad", tehehe. I think he may have been talking to everyone EXCEPT you.

LC, I've refuted the case against me several times. Since the same old case is popping up again, I'll indulge you guys one more time.

thellama73 wrote:

Long Con wrote:An argument toward why TH could be good would be fine to hear. Or a reiteration if it already got put forth.

I've put it forth multiple times, but I'm game to go again. It's mostly an accumulation of circumstantial evidence that I think points to him being the other utility.

1. TH was among the last voters for BWT, a utility. I think it is reasonable to assume that BWT's BTSC partner would vote for him late in order to gain civ cred. I do not think he would vote for his partner early (too dangerous), or vote for someone else (too obvious a save attempt).

As I've said before, I've been a late voter in all 5 lynches. It has nothing to do with my role and everything to do with wanting the $200 bonus.

But just because I voted late for BWT doesn't mean I was not involved in the discussion about him. As I've said before, I was THE FIRST PERSON to agree with Epi's case on BWT and I never let my foot off the gas pedal there. I thought it was a good case and continued to push it to the forefront of discussion. You keep missing this fact.

thellama73 wrote:2. He was eager to bid on BWT's utility. I can't see a good reason for a civ to do that (even though we know Boogs did bid for it, and he was civ.)

Yeah, Boogs bid on it and was civ. I bid on it and was civ. YOU bid on a baddie property Llama. You did. You WON it. Does that make you a baddie?
I have tried to win baddie properties to make sure they stay out of the hands of the baddies. Why did YOU bid on the railroad?

thellama73 wrote:3. He seemed, to me, overly eager to jump on other people's cases as soon as I brought his name up, which spells guilty to me.

I did not jump on anyone's cases after you brought my name up. I continued to discuss my own suspects, because I'm trying to find baddies. The fact that you suspect me doesn't get in the way of my OWN baddie hunting. I'm not going to stop doing my civvie duty of trying to find baddies just because you think I'm bad.

thellama73 wrote:4. He and Boogs had a fight over who actually won the utility in the bidding war, each denying that it was them. Boogs flipped civ, so it's unlikely he was lying, which makes TH more likely to have lied.

Again, I'm not lying about this, and if I WAS bad, there would be NO REASON for me to lie. I've been upfront about everything that I've done. I have won other auctions including baddie properties. I did not win Electric Company. I stated as much in the thread so that we as a group could try to determine who DID win it and why. LC showed that I COULDN'T have won it because I didn't increase the bid enough. Again, if I was a baddie and won that auction, I would have said NOTHING, because there was no benefit to getting caught up in this mystery. I don't think people are looking at this situation from that angle. My actions in this matter literally don't make any goddamn sense if I'm a baddie.

I've been a major player in the lynching of all three baddies. I didn't bring up the original cases but I pushed them all along. Black Rock was the first to point out that Made's partner comment on Day 1 was weird, I was the first person to call it an actual slip. Epi was the person who brought up the case on BWT, but I was right there after him to try and keep that case buoyant while other players were discussing separate cases and were ignoring Epi's. LC was the first to point out that Hedgeowl's survival was suspicious, I was the next person to come in and condemn her. I've helped take out three baddies and I've tried to defend people I believe to be civ. If taking out baddies and defending civvies makes me bad, I don't know what to say.

I should state that some of my evidence on which color groups LC is NOT is circumstantial and assumptive, but nonetheless compelling.

Did some quick research...

Looking at specific comments LC has made, plus his bidding patterns, and my own nightly searches, I can systematically eliminate LC from being a member of every color group except light blue or red. But to do so I would have to out my own color alignment, which is against the rules.

If I'm lynched, I'll lay out that evidence in my final moments of life. But I think we need to lynch LC today.

Again, the evidence against me is that I defended a civvie on Day 1 and voted for a baddie on Day 3. Lol.

Long Con wrote:Your TH thing, worth looking at. It would not faze me if he were a baddie, in part due to the theory that I put forth about him on Day One.

Oh right. Your theory that I posted this on Day 1:

Turnip Head wrote:I really don't think Epi is bad. I also don't think he'd be so ostentatious with someone else's money. He looks like he's working on his own to me. Don't understand the votes for him but I guess on Day 1 you gotta go with something.

because I'm a baddie trying to gain civ cred by defending Epi's Day 1 actions.

Llama, LC doesn't care who gets lynched as long as it's not him or his partner(s). You can tell because he didn't even answer your question, just nudged your own suspicion of me along as "worth looking at." Speaking of, has anyone actually done that? Has anyone looked at Llama's case on me or my subsequent rebuttal of it? Go ahead and look folks, it's based on me suspecting and voting for a baddie.

If we're talking railroad suspects, Lorab is on my short list of players who might have NKed Epi last night. The only thing I remember from Lorab is her prolonged spat with Epi at the beginning of the game. I think he was an odd choice for NK directly after he led the charge against Boogs and the fact that he didn't have much cash and hadn't won any properties or powers.

I just want you to put your money where your mouth is. You've claimed more than once in past games that you don't know how to read me at all. Yet this game you've been calling for my lynch and regurgitating your Night 3 case against me (which I've refuted time and time again and yet you refuse to engage in an actual debate over the merits of that case). What will you do when you're wrong about me?

You ARE wrong, Llama. Your stubbornness is astounding.

If I'm lynched today and flip civ, will you agree to be lynched next? Go down with the ship so to speak.

thellama73 wrote:He's being annoying and I suspect he has impure motives due his dogged pursuit of a plainly false theory.

...

Funny, this is how I'm starting to feel about you :P

I don't see a case on MP yet, just bold accusations with nothing to back them up. He could be a red or a light blue but I have no reason to think that he is. He seems genuine and I don't get the feeling he's hiding anything. I should say I'm historically bad at reading him, but his play doesn't remind me of his baddie game at all.

Ninjablooper is online and hasn't posted in two weeks. I wonder if she'll grace us with her presence.

Lorab must have won the original bidding for Electric Company. It's odd, then, that she didn't step in and say something when Boogs and I were calling each other liars over this matter... I'm worried she's a railroad who was relishing the mayhem.

What does everyone think of Keys? MP and Zeek are getting flak for being quieter than usual... Keys barely even seems like he's here. I can't remember the last time he posted, nor can I remember any of his contributions beyond the union idea he had on Day 1.

If the reds lost one of their monopoly members to an NK, would the remaining two be forced to sell their houses?

On another note, we really need to start ferreting out the LMS groups, especially the reds. I wouldn't be surprised if they won the bid for the Beatdown power, which would let them take over Water Works' kill if WW is eliminated. Might be better to leave that NK in the hands of a comatose player...

Rest in peace Epi Sorry to see you go.

I agree LC, I think an inactive player is in charge of the utilities' kill now that BWT is gone. But how are we going to question the inactives? How are we going to get a feel for them individually? There's like 4 different players who haven't posted in 2 weeks.

Damn. Sorry Boogs.

I believe the bidding is over Boogs

HannaK wrote:I know I am sort of voting against my own self interest here but I honestly believe Boogs responses have been genuine and I rather vote for someone who I am almost certain is in a LMS group rather than someone who I only slightly believe might be bad (plus I don't like how people bandwagon onto someone for the 200 dollar bonus after just a few votes are in)
so I am gonna vote for Long Con. It won't make much difference but hey a man's gotta have a code (or something along those lines anyway)

Why do you say this vote is against your self interests?

It's gonna be Boogs.

That is certainly a weird thing for Boogs to say.. But as you point out, he didn't persue it further.

boo wrote:

LoRab wrote:Is it possible that after Hedge, Boo decided to not include target names on failed kills? In order to even things up a bit? I suppose I could just ask that question...

@Boo: Do the targets of failed kill attempts always appear in posts?

At the moment, I'm more swayed by the case on Boogs than I am by the case on TH. But I'll reread a bit and think more closely before votiing.

Yes.

I think this means that Water Works is an inactive player who didn't send in a kill.