The Syndicate

My question is why Epi thought it was so important to point that out.

Good point.

Epignosis wrote:I'll post more tomorrow.

I don't understand why you gave everyone 8 minutes to object when you don't even plan to talk about everything right now, but okay.

I reached the same conclusions in about 10 seconds, lol. This is assuming the detectives have BTSC, which is still a big assumption at this stage IMO. It would make sense thematically that they have BTSC, but I don't see how it's supported by what we know of the roles.

Soneji wrote:

Turnip Head wrote:

S~V~S wrote:What about you?

With Soneji I didn't like that he voted for Llama without posting about his vote, even though he was here posting at the time.

I am rather unused to this whole voting via poll thing and didn't think much of voting for Llama without saying something in-thread about changing my vote as I had already explained my suspicion on him. It was between two wagons at that point and I had given my thoughts on both Epig and Llama.

Okay, so what are your thoughts for today?

Epignosis wrote:

Turnip Head wrote:Wait what

Are you objecting?

Turnip Head wrote:...Proceed...

...Proceed...

Wait what

Sorry LC, I forgot that not everyone watched the first four episodes of Season 5 as soon as they leaked

And you make an interesting point about Bass. I see what you're saying. Cast a wide net and let others reel it in.

blindfaeth wrote:Th, you seem to be a bundle full of non suspicions. I get that you say you suspect roxy, but she's silenced. And you're looking at ika and soneji, but they are lower posters and also new to our forum and unfamiliar with our customs. I have a hard time believing you can't come up with something more convincing. These three are an easy out for coming up with suspects on day 2.

Sorry if you feel like it's an easy out, and I'm sorry if you have a hard time believing I don't have better suspicions at this point, I understand my current suspicions suck but it's simply where I'm at right now and I'm not going to make up suspicions just to have them. It's why I'm trying to open up discussions and get others' input. I'm not out here trying to get the two newbies lynched, I'm letting them know that I'm concerned with their activity thus far. What I AM doing is trying to have conversations and discuss suspicions with others.

Long Con, in case you missed it:

Turnip Head wrote:Rabbit vs. LC feels like civ vs. civ to me. Where are you looking for this lynch, LC?

I didn't realize it was a serious question, but I suppose I should have.

My new BTSC with Epignosis is not going well at all because I don't have BTSC with Epignosis, nor have I at any point in the past. I don't suspect Epignosis of being bad, and so I realize everything I say about him is only going to fuel your suspicions of me. But you have the wrong idea, I just don't share your distrust of Epi

rabbit8 wrote:

Turnip Head wrote:Rabbit vs. LC feels like civ vs. civ to me. Where are you looking for this lynch, LC?

Maybe you should vote BF?

I feel pretty good about BF. What are you seeing?

Epignosis wrote:

Turnip Head wrote:

Epignosis wrote:All things being equal, I would vote timmer (or Eloh, as the poll shows) again. But it's Day 2. I have more to work with.

What are you working with Epi?

Nah. It would just distract people from talking about me.

Epignosis wrote:All things being equal, I would vote timmer (or Eloh, as the poll shows) again. But it's Day 2. I have more to work with.

What are you working with Epi?

Rabbit vs. LC feels like civ vs. civ to me. Where are you looking for this lynch, LC?

FZ, I would say that Timmer's playstyle has more in common with my own than that of many other players in the game. I think he's crafty both when he's a civvie and a baddie and that it can be difficult to accurately discern his intentions. I can also say that I felt way more comfortable reading Elo than I do reading Timmer

FZ. wrote:I know you do I'm just afraid that you'll disappear and then I won't get to enjoy your pearls of wisdom
Actually, Timmer really bothers me. Admittedly, there are 2 reasons for this:
1. I have a feeling Epig somehow found out Eloh is really bad, and maybe now is backing off because he feels bad for Timmer...but I could be wrong
2. Since he started playing, I feel like he's been saying all the "right" things. I can't really back it up with a case, but it's a feeling. Also, the fact that Eloh really did answer in a weird way when she was still playing, and I also feel like Timmer knows it and was trying to get himself out of it in a very smart way.

I doubt Epi would back off Timmer just because he feels bad :P

I don't know re: Timmer though. Elo was feeling very genuine to me towards the end, but a lot of that had to do with her asking to be lynched instead of Epi. She got replaced before that could ever actually happen though, so maybe I'm putting too much stock into her empty words.

My question is why would Timmer bring up the Elo thing if he's bad? He could just be trying to be slick, sure, but I feel like that's an unnecessary move to make this early, especially since it seemed like public opinion was on Elo's side before Timmer subbed in.

FZ. wrote:

Turnip Head wrote:FZ, I have said that at this point it's mainly Roxy, ika and Soneji looking fishy to me. I was briefly concerned with SVS keeping her vote on Epi all day yesterday and not voting for him yet today, but her response to this point was satisfactory to me.

I don't suspect BF, he seems normal. I think Bullz has said some some not-so-civvie-minded things but I don't think that makes him bad at the moment. I've seen him react similarly in other games where he's been a civvie, so I think that's just how he plays. I think the baddies are laying low and looking for ways to blend in.

Thanks :-) I remember you saying something about wanting to hear more from ika and Sonjei. So you think they are bad just because they're not posting more?
What about the ballsy people? Wouldn't you think they like your theory and are talking more to not seem blendy? You could actually be one of those. Though at this point, I haven't seen you put in as much as I expect from you. And assuming you're going to be gone in a bit (it hasn't started already, has it?), I would really love to hear more from you.

This is how much I often talk in the early goings of games FZ, I feel like I say this in every game we play lol, and it's because I don't feel strongly about anyone yet. I'm floundering today because Roxy was honestly my best guess for a baddie based on her Day 1 behavior and I'm not allowed to go after her today, and my other two suspects aren't talking. But I don't suspect Epi or Bullz and I'm a little tired of talking about both of them. Who else do you think I should take a look at?

FZ, I have said that at this point it's mainly Roxy, ika and Soneji looking fishy to me. I was briefly concerned with SVS keeping her vote on Epi all day yesterday and not voting for him yet today, but her response to this point was satisfactory to me.

I don't suspect BF, he seems normal. I think Bullz has said some some not-so-civvie-minded things but I don't think that makes him bad at the moment. I've seen him react similarly in other games where he's been a civvie, so I think that's just how he plays. I think the baddies are laying low and looking for ways to blend in.

S~V~S wrote:FZ, and that is also possible. I am just trying to wrap my head around the whole "Well, I decided to kill her regardless" aspect of this, and WHY he would do that rather than saying, "Hey Elo, I know you don't really want to play, why not let Timmer have your spot?". I guess I just don't understand it at all.

Because Epi also thinks that the mathematical probabilities point to Elo/Timmer being bad.

S~V~S wrote:What about you?

I was intending to look into Roxy more today, but I'm putting that on the backburner since she's silenced. The other two on my watch list were Ika and Soneji. I feel ika has gone out of his way to appear involved in the game without ever volunteering any of his player reads, which makes me suspicious. With Soneji I didn't like that he voted for Llama without posting about his vote, even though he was here posting at the time.

I was just curious why you hadn't voted Epi yet since you voted for him early on Day 1, citing the fact that votes are changeable.

Do you still think Epi is bad, SVS? Is anyone else jockeying for your vote right now?

Rest in peace splintsy and DF.

I agree with Pied Piper, I will be looking at Roxy today. I felt like she used a manufactured reason to vote for Epi yesterday, and her tone so far has had me concerned. I'd also like to hear more from ika and Soneji today.

I voted for thellama because I did not and still do not believe Epignosis is bad - despite his questionable methods - and I felt much less sure about Llama, and sometimes all the options on Day 1 suck.

Rest in peace Llama, sorry

I voted for Llama. I suspect him more than I suspect Epi. It feels like Llama is putting on a little bit of an act this game.

timmer wrote:Hey all I can't possibly catch up enough to vote before the pool closes. If there are punishments for missing votes i will random or something!

Elo told us to vote for you instead of Epi, so maybe just do that! Kidding, welcome to the game timmer! I'm sure the host would understand if you abstain from the vote or randomize if you prefer.

Roxy wrote:If Epi had not pushed so hard to lynch Elo - a low/non poster and saying she did not wish to really play without first considering a replacement I would not be voting for him but he did so voting Epi

But does any of that make Epi bad? I'm not sure I like your reason here Roxy.

reywaS wrote:I've voted for DharmaHelper. It's a random placeholder at the moment. Maybe I can find a reason to vote someone else in the next 18 minutes.

This was a weird post from rey. It was made exactly 1 hour and 18 minutes before lynch deadline, so I think Rey was one hour off on when he thought it ended. But he didn't come back to change his vote or explain it in the next 18 minutes all the same

I've reread it a few times, and Epi's post about why he wants to lynch Elo seems really genuine to me, even if I don't agree with him about Elo at all. I hope LC is right and Magenta pardons this lynch to gain BTSC with the Detectives. I don't think Epi is bad.

I'm thinking about joining the llama voters, but I still have the morning to decide. I don't really suspect anyone else who has votes, and Llama's case on Bullzeye seems superficial, even by Day 1 standards. And I think thellama knows more about themonkey than he'd like us to think. I think he knows too much. But I'm gonna sleep on it.

Clearly Llama has spent time googling pictures of Grodd. His infatuation with the monkey is getting to be quite creepy...

Epignosis wrote:All of that could have been avoided if Russtifinko hadn't voted FZ. out of nowhere for no apparent reason.

Truth, I'll give you that at least

MovingPictures07 wrote:Turnip Head!!!!!

What are you doing still playing this game? Your Champions game starts soon.

:P

I'm giving this game everything I've got until the Champs game starts, at which point I inevitably won't have time for anything else :P

Epignosis wrote:Is my math wrong if I'm right about her not having BTSC?

Was the purpose of this revelation meant to preclude me from being any of the non-killing evil roles?

Your math could be right, sure... but at the end of the Day the math doesn't mean anything if she isn't bad. I watched you argue for days in Death Note mafia to lynch FZ, and your math overwhelmingly supported FZ being bad, and yet she wasn't. I guess I'm just more interested in reading Elo as a player rather than following any math probabilities that could point to her alignment. And her responses have made me feel much better about her today than I did yesterday.

I'm not sure what the purpose of your revelation was, but it let me know that your motivations for lynching Elo weren't pure within the context of the game. And I just wanted to point out that simply not having an NK at your disposal doesn't automatically make you an Old or Indy Rogue, that's all.

linki @ Llama: You WERE NK'ed in X-men, and then Elo (a civvie as well) rezzed you back into the game. That's how much we DIDN'T lynch you for wanting to be King of the Morlocks :P

I don't believe Llama actually got lynched for his behavior in X-men, though I think he said he did. Wasn't the case though. He was NKed by the baddies, not lynched. Not sure if he's playing that up on purpose or if it was an oversight. He's definitely been lynched in other games for similar behavior.

Okay, so, hmm. What did Elo's response do for you, Epi? She basically asked us to lynch her instead of you, which doesn't seem like a great baddie tactic. I assume you still think she's worth lynching since she doesn't have time for the game, but do you legitimately suspect her of being bad? I don't think I do after seeing her response.

On the other hand, even if you don't have the ability to NK your wife as planned, there's only two baddies who have the ability to kill, and they don't have BTSC with the other baddies. So... your newly revealed motivation for lynching Elo doesn't really preclude you from being those other baddie roles. So... I'm on the fence about you now.

S~V~S wrote:Turnip Head, I thought I asked this but it could be I forgot~ did you still want to be Epis sidekick?

Not really. The benefits package isn't as flashy as I expected it to be. I don't think Epi is bad at this time though. I don't think he'd be calling Elo out if he was, though I could be wrong.

Epi, has anything other than Elo caught your eye so far?

ika wrote:

Turnip Head wrote:

ika wrote:Im not goign to read anything and act like i know what im doing here for day 1

however if someone wants to talk im game

Hey ika. Does anybody stand out to you as not trying to stand out?

im gonna bold the relevant stuff and then randomly chosse R~V~S cus thats the name that i saw when reading the votes

Interesting. I have no further questions at this time.

ika wrote:Im not goign to read anything and act like i know what im doing here for day 1

however if someone wants to talk im game

Hey ika. Does anybody stand out to you as not trying to stand out?

thellama73 wrote:

Bullzeye wrote: Did you see the part in btsc where I said I always play my baddie game because it's the only game I know? Did you see the part in this game where I've been helpful and nice and given everyone the benefit of the doubt? All I've said this entire game amounts to "sometimes a joke is just a joke". What do you mean looking for people who know they are bad? Everyone knows their role. Everyone knows if they're good or bad as far as I can tell.

If he always plays his baddie game, that means he is playing it now. Why would anyone admit to playing their baddie game? Keeping my psychologist hat on for a moment, I think Bullz is being betrayed by his subconscious. Maybe even, on some deep level, he wants to get caught.

He could just be speaking candidly. I know a few other players like to say that they "always play their baddie game". I've seen Epi say that, MP too. It usually doesn't do them any favors when they say it, either :P

Spacedaisy wrote:Epi and Elo. I am not inclined to vote either today, at least at the moment. I like to vote for Elo because I find her suspect, not simply based on Epi's declaration.

I don't know that I make much of Epi's abrupt conclusion either Daisy, but I still find myself puzzling over Elo's words here. She says she's confused because the roles don't make the win conditions clear, but that's only true for the Arch-villains and the Detectives, though the New Rogues are also ambiguously worded as well since it doesn't say which opposing factions they need dead. But the Old Rogue and Independent win conditions are stated quite clearly. And then right after that she misspeaks by implying that being an Old Rogue was a bad thing, but then maybe that's just how she read Epi's post about her. So idk what I think exactly, I feel pretty strangely about it and want to hear more from her

From the revealed secret letters it looks like there might be some BTSC among a few of the independents (Magenta, Rainbow Reader), along with the New Rogue's Blacksmith which we already knew about. The "s" alone is not much help in decoding the New Rogue or Arch-villain secrets so far, but one more good letter and we should be able to crack a good chunk of em.

Sophie wrote:

Turnip Head wrote:Lol! I kept reading Sophie's post expecting to get to the part where she talks about the game, but it just kept on being about how drunk she was Glad you're having fun Sophie When you're inevitably hungover in the morning just drink some orange juice and share your thoughts so far with us.

what time is it in that part of the world?
isnt weird im writing from an obsucre (?) unknown country in the southern hemisphere, who knows what time is it iright there in the US, right? or oeurope? how many people voting form all over the world despite diferences of time cultures etc, how valuabe if that? for realz


as far as my last page read what i think is lc questions are interesting. i wanna talk about the map. i dont really get it. should we share it. hwat happens if we are in the same squares. that semmed interesting thoughts. i was wanderings the same

I'm in California so it's only 9:15pm here It is pretty cool how we're all able to connect with each other from such disparate locations. It's crazy to think about!

The host answered some of LC's questions. We can't talk about where we are on the map, or use landmarks to give clues to our location. When two people end up on the same square they gain BTSC while they're together.

Lol! I kept reading Sophie's post expecting to get to the part where she talks about the game, but it just kept on being about how drunk she was Glad you're having fun Sophie When you're inevitably hungover in the morning just drink some orange juice and share your thoughts so far with us.

DFaraday wrote:I know votes are changeable, but it still doesn't sit right with me how many people have already voted. I also don't think Epi has done anything suspicious, although I don't agree with him that Elo is suspicious (she sounds perfectly normal to me).

Were there specific votes that don't sit well with you, or just the general idea of people voting early? I must say that changeable votes can be a useful advantage. Allows you to apply a bit of pressure and see how people react.

FWIW I did think Elo's response to Epi was worded oddly.

Elohcin wrote:You think I must be an old rogue - Mirror Master, Weather Wizard, or The Trickster. I understand why you don't think I have BTSC, but why do you think I am an old rogue specifically? And even if you were right, why do you want to lynch those roles? Just curious.

I think Epi was specifically saying he DOESNT think you're an Old Rogue Elo. What do you mean by the "Even if you are right" line? Sounds like you're leaving the door open for you not being an Old Rogue. Which... might be a problem if you aren't.