The Syndicate

I can't infodrop though. So sorry.

But I have made cases, and defaulting to rereading players instead. You're just gonna have to take what you can get.

Thanks. This is actually helping me out too. I just have to be careful, because thanks to hanging out with llama, I know some things the rest of you don't. :P

General role presumptions

Old Rogues

Captain Cold - Roxy (strong implications based on circumstance)
Heat Wave - ??? (presumed dead)
Mirror Master - ??? (presumed dead)
Weather Wizard - FZ. (strong implications and no opposition)
The Trickster - SVS (confirmed by lynch)
Golden Glider - blindfaeth (confirmed by lynch)

Independent Rogues

Captain Boomerang - ??? (presumed dead)
Abra Kadabra - Soneji (confirmed by lynch)
Doctor Alchemy - Bass_the_Clever (strong implications by behavior, and no opposition)
Magenta - ??? (presumed dead)
The Folded Man - ???
Rainbow Raider - MovingPictures07 (confirmed by lynch)

New Rogues

The Top - Turnip Head (confirmed by lynch)
Blacksmith - ???
Murmer - ???
Girdir - ???
Tar Pit - ???
Plunder - ??? (presumed dead)
Double-Down - Bass_the_Clever 1.0 (confirmed by lynch)

Arch-Villains

Professor Zoom - AceofSpaces (confirmed by lynch)
Zoom - ??? (presumed dead)
Gorilla Grodd - DREAM (confirmed by lynch)

The Detectives

Wally West - Sophie (strong implications, thanks to llama's resurrection and general statements and no opposition)
Pied Piper - Metalmarsh89 (strong implications, survived at least one lynch, and no opposition)
Barry Allen - thellama73 (confirmed by lynch)

DFARADAY

Okay, here is a very brief Day-by-day description of the events that have happened this game DF. I have left out a lot of details, so feel free to ask if you need more.




DAY 1 - Epignosis asks for a sidekick, llama pretended he didn't know who the Flash was, and craziness ensued. thellama73 is (barely) lynched, and he was Barry Allen

NIGHT 1 - You are imprisoned by Wally West. fingersplints is nightkilled by Gorilla Grodd.

DAY 2 - Bass comes in with a strange curse, and looks a bit sketchy with it. The lynch charge is led, and Bass is lynched, flipping as Double-Down.

NIGHT 2 - Epignosis is nightkilled by Captain Cold.

DAY 3.1 - Crazy. First we tried to lynch one of two players (AceofSpaces and Spacedaisy). Not only was neither lynched, but the day was restarted. The poll was never copied, so we don't even know who would have won the Day 3.1 lynch, and who may have survived. Not only this, but thellama73, was ressurected and returned to us, a confirmed Detective (Barry Allen).

DAY 3.2 - blindfaeth is lynched after a lot of heat thrown around between Roxy, timmer, Aces and Bullzeye. blindfaeth was Golden Glider.

NIGHT 3 - Dharmahelper was nightkilled by Captain Cold. Roxy was imprisoned by Wally West.

DAY 4 - AceofSpaces is finally lynched. He was Professor Zoom.

NIGHT 4 - Bullzeye is nightkilled by possibly two different parties, though neither one was revealed. It is possible that Plunder and Grodd were the kills, but the more current revelations seem to dispel these possibilities. More on that later.

DAY 5 - MovingPictures07 just replaced in, and goes nuts in the thread, making over 100 posts in the single day phase, mainly advocating for the Indy Rogues. He is subsequently lynched, but it was the result of a 7-7 tie with timmer. MovingPictures07 was Rainbow Raider.

NIGHT 5 - Night 5 was ended early by the Weather Wizard, so nobody died.

DAY 6 - There is little interest in lynching timmer after the MP lynch, so DREAM is pretty unanimously lynched. DREAM was Gorilla Grodd. DREAM's kill is revealed to be inherited by a mysterious party.

NIGHT 6 - Spacedaisy is nightkilled. The general belief of the events that occured is that the Top (the secret role) obtained Gorilla Grodd's nightkill, and attempted to use it. However, the Trickster set a trap on the Top's target, reversing the nightkill. However, one of the Top's abilities redirects nightkills, so Spacedaisy was unfortunately randomly targeted, and nightkilled.

DAY 7 - timmer and Metalmarsh89 tie for the lynch today, though Bass gained a few votes early on. Nobody is lynched, and we move on to Night.

NIGHT 7 - thellama73 is finally killed again. He was killed by a drone from Professor Zoom, but it is unclear if the drone was controlled by the dead Professor Zoom himself, or another party who may have picked an item up. - Also on this night, Wally West's kill appears to fail and possibly even backfire. Also, the Top's kill appeared to fail, as he appeared to attempt to nightkill the unnightkillable Girdir.

DAY 8 - Turnip Head is lynched today, and he was the Top.

NIGHT 8 - Nobody was killed this night, though it is unknown if the Top's kill was inherited or not. However, some craziness happened, and somebody turned off the lights, affecting the next day's lynch.

DAY 9 - Everyone is listed as a number (which they were not allowed to reveal), so after a few discussions of strategic approaches, the somewhat random #3 was chosen for the lynch. Luckily, we lynched the inactive Soneji. Unfortunately, he was Abra Kadabra.

NIGHT 9 - rabbit8 was imprisoned by Wally West. No other kill happened this night.

DAY 10 - There is more discussion to lynch timmer today, and a TON of role-hinting and discussion of these ideas going on. In the end, it was determined that one of timmer, SVS, or FZ was lying, and SVS was ultimately lynched because some decided she was the lier, possibly due to a night action error, though it is unclear. But SVS was The Trickster.

NIGHT 10 - Nobody is nightkilled, but 2 players are removed from the poll for the next day: Black Rock and timmer.

DAY 11 - There is more discussion of roles. timmer was the decided lynch choice, but he was not on the poll, so Metalmarsh89 was lynched instead, mainly because it was assumed he is unlynchable. Everyone guessed correctly, and nobody was lynched.

NIGHT 11 - timmer is imprisoned by Wally West, and DFaraday is released from jail (10 nights after he was impounded).

FZ. wrote:

Metalmarsh89 wrote:I placeheld on Long Con as a response.

Do you still think he's bad? If not, who is?

We'll see, I'm still trying to figure it out.

If not DFaraday, that it must be one of (or both) BR and Long Con. Devin is an outside possibility.



This is what I'm working with right now.

LINKI: I'm doing a summary for him now.

I placeheld on Long Con as a response.

I've got some questions that could use answering though. I guess I'll wait to hear from MR, and DF. Hopefully he comes in to chat earlier rather than later.

Long Con wrote:I think he'll probably go with the flow more. He's probably a New Rogue though, that's what my gut says.

I don't know. I felt pretty strongly that he was the Mirror Master. His rezz seems a bit out of place though.

Was it because he had been jailed for so long? Did the Prison Ward really run out of room?

Long Con wrote:

Metalmarsh89 wrote:It's Day 12 son. Things are getting late.

That's right, dad. Time for the old folks to get to bed.

Actually, you're probably older than me.

What do you think about DF being rezzed? The guy was NK'd on Night 1. Do you think he has a chance to catch up on over 3,000 posts and participate in the next 24 hours?

It's Day 12 son. Things are getting late.

And remember everyone. 24 hour day phase.

Black Rock wrote:Holy crap what a night. How the hell did DF get out?

You sound upset about DF getting out.

I am not. Hi.

I just bookmarked that smiley.

It's so quiet in here and 3 players missed the vote. :O

Mr. MR, does this poll have any influence on the game?

Linki: Oh hi.

Valtari!

Long Con wrote:

Metalmarsh89 wrote:Meh, I think Captain Boomerang is dead anyway.

An interesting perspective.

Sure.

This is the first time Boomerang has been mentioned at all. Either it is flavor for the lynch...

OR

A boomerang affected the vote. But again this is the first time the boomerang is even mentioned in the lynch. So I think Captain Boomerang is dead, and someone picked up an item.

timmer also said he came across Dharmahelper a while ago, and said he was an Indy Rogue.

And let's be honest, if there was no lynch shenanigans happening, timmer was the sure lynchee today. So he probably did find a boomerang, and used it last night without knowing he would not be on the poll today.



And actually, this makes me feel more solid about BR being an Indy Rogue.

Meh, I think Captain Boomerang is dead anyway.

I voted pitchfork, but there's really no such thing.

Long Con wrote:If we were all New Rogues... then this game would be over already, wouldn't it?

Well who's got the nightkill? :P

Well, what if you, BR, Devin, and timmer are all New Rogues? That's certainly a possibility too.

Linki: Just in case timmer, or anyone else, had some last minute shenanigans.

Or maybe I'm misunderstanding what you're saying?

Long Con wrote:Maybe someone we think is dead was the Mirror Master?

I thought the Pied Piper already confirmed that?

Such as what?

Well no, but I did direct these questions at you earlier when I thought you were online.

Metalmarsh89 wrote:

Long Con wrote:All I'm asking is that you give me a chance. If the game doesn't end when Timmer dies, then by all means, open up this discussion. Just don't kill me before letting me try to win with you guys.

So why don't we lynch Devin? Would that impact your own survival?

Metalmarsh89 wrote:FZ has just pointed out that one of you, BR, and Devin is not an Indy, which you have been suggesting lately. But that does not seem to be true at all.

So who do you think is lying? Actually, that's not the right question. They have not claimed to be Indy, as you have claimed for them. Which of Devin, or BR would you think is not an Indy, since you claim to be an Indy yourself.

I still would like an answer from you. Pretty please?

I don't want to be lynched anymore.

FZ. wrote:I think that the fact that TImmer didn't join us with the vote, proves we're right. If he really was an OR, he'd want to help us get rid of NR. So would he do if he wanted to look like and OR if LC wasn't valuable to him.

Devin, BR, and Bass. If you're around, please come and vote for LC before it's too late

And also, if he was a New Rogue, and LC wasn't, one would think he'd want LC dead.

Ah well, we'll just have same result we had intended to get earlier, so no harm done.

Indeed, especially since LC has not responded, nor has anyone else really chimed in at all.

I suppose everyone is just busy on a Monday night. Or I really hope so.

Oh hi FZ. You've awoken!

Where'd everybody go?

FZ. wrote:LC, I have 3 minutes for you to respond. If you're not here by then, my vote is going to you, sorry

Not a bad scenario. I'll move my vote away if I change my mind, and your vote won't mean anything.

Or at least until LC responds.

I feel more confident about my vote now.

Devin the Omniscient wrote:It's possible. How else do you explain both of them being off of the poll?

WIFOM!!!

Dunno. If you were a baddie and you could take two players off the poll, would you take you and your teammate off?

Devin the Omniscient wrote:

Metalmarsh89 wrote:If Devin is telling the truth, then that means he can be The Folded Man, Magenta, Girder, or Tar Pit. Now llama had Devin had BTSC, llama never went after Devin or suspected him, but it looks like he was nightkilled not long after this. So, based on my knowledge of The Folded Man's role, I will assume Devin is not he, which narrows things down to the other three.

Now if Devin is lying, he is surely not an Indy Rogue, because why lie about such things or even say it?

The way I read it, the Folded Man can choose to hide from or enter map btsc with another player upon entering the same square as him/her. I can go into more detail if you would like... Why would I want to hide from a known detective?

The way I read the role, he cannot gain BTSC. I guess I never considered he could choose to gain it if he wanted to.

Devin the Omnipotent wrote:

Metalmarsh89 wrote:

Devin the Omniscient wrote:Moving my vote to Timmer because I don't want MP to go out this way AGAIN.

Kind of strange thing to say for someone who hasn't played a game on this site since Fight Club Mafia.

I've played plenty of MP games and games with MP to know that this happens to him a lot. The game I had in mind when I said "AGAIN" was Homestar Runner mafia.

Well, it has actually happened in several games over the last couple months, so I guess it is not just a recent occurrence.

I'm switching my vote to Long Con for now.



You saying that BR and timmer are the last two or something?

FZ has just pointed out that one of you, BR, and Devin is not an Indy, which you have been suggesting lately. But that does not seem to be true at all.

So who do you think is lying? Actually, that's not the right question. They have not claimed to be Indy, as you have claimed for them. Which of Devin, or BR would you think is not an Indy, since you claim to be an Indy yourself.

Long Con wrote:All I'm asking is that you give me a chance. If the game doesn't end when Timmer dies, then by all means, open up this discussion. Just don't kill me before letting me try to win with you guys.

So why don't we lynch Devin? Would that impact your own survival?

EBWOP: LC looking like and Indy Rogue, not a New Rogue.

LC has done a really good job of looking like a New Rogue all game. But since you mention that, I have no idea.

If there are only two Indy Rogues left alive (apart from Bass that is), then what are the odds that LC is one of them and knows that BR is the other one? I mean being Captain Boomerang, Magenta, and the Folded Man have no way of knowing outside of general thread interactions (or map BTSC).

FZ. wrote:

Long Con wrote:The places I would have looked have diminished. I think rabbit was bad, I don't think you are (although ending the day early with MM's blessing would be a nice confirmation), I certainly don't suspect MM any more, Sophie's cool, BR I am sure is Indy, and Devin reads very Indy as well. I really think that the game will end with Timmer's death.

My Problem is, that I think at least 3 indies are dead. Rainbow and Abra are dead, and I'm assuming Magneta is also dead, because I can't imagine her not stopping a lynch and us knowing there's another okay person. Then, there's Bass who we all assume is indie too. That leaves only 2 indies. This means there's no way BR, you and Devin could all be indies. Someone is lying

Exactly, and two of those players are up for a lynch.

Let's not forget that timmer said that DH was also an Indy Rogue, and that is actually something I would agree with him on, which will narrow down the Indy Rogues even further.

So since timmer and BR are off the table, I think we should strongly consider either Long Con or Devin for lynching today.

Let's see what I can come up with after a reread of Devin.

Devin the Omniscient wrote:By Aces!

I'm glad I'm not the only one who thinks the line between civvies and baddies in this game is rather blurred. I initially thought that the Arch-Villains were the most obvious baddies. I still think they are, but I just realized that we don't actually know what their win condition is.

On second thought, after rereading win conditions, the New Rogues are the most obvious baddie team. Lol.

Here's an early comment from Devin about the New Rogues and Arch-Villains. His first assumption were that the Arch-Villains were the baddies, but realizes that they are not THE baddies. I don't know what perspective this post would come from. Certainly not an Old Rogue or a Detective. Possibly an Indy Rogue or a New Rogue. Also possibly an Arch-Villain. But for the sake of this reading and the public interest, I will assume that all of the Arch-Villains are dead.

Devin the Omniscient wrote:FZ, I totally agree that it seems strange that the kills started back up (if I read your post correctly) or are coming more frequently after all of these replacements came into the game. Now being a replacement myself, let me go ahead and say that I do not have a night action. Period. I don't think I can say anymore without incurring MR's wrath.

If Devin is telling the truth, then that means he can be The Folded Man, Magenta, Girder, or Tar Pit. Now llama had Devin had BTSC, llama never went after Devin or suspected him, but it looks like he was nightkilled not long after this. So, based on my knowledge of The Folded Man's role, I will assume Devin is not he, which narrows things down to the other three.

Now if Devin is lying, he is surely not an Indy Rogue, because why lie about such things or even say it?

Devin the Omniscient wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:I am just becoming increasingly convinced that people at The Syndicate don't truly understand how neutral independents work. I saw it in full form in Death Note and I'm seeing it again here.

Unfortunately, I was unable to participate in Death Note which makes me sad because it's by far my favorite anime series.
But rest assured, MP, you're not alone in this thinking. When I first joined up in this game, I too mentioned how blurred the lines between "civ" and "baddie" seemed. With the obvious exception being New Rogues who want everyone dead except for Indy Rogues. The rest of the win conditions are more pin-pointed to one+ factions.
So that being said, I will not be voting for you as I don't think you're bad, yet. I just think you are very misunderstood, and I'm tempted to look at those being really hard on you for this... LC and MM

Devin kinda shifts his perspective about the different factions, and this seems like it is coming from an Indy Rogue's perspective. Of course, the discussion about these things was already happening, so Devin may have just adopted the idea.

Devin the Omniscient wrote:

MovingPictures07 wrote:I need to obviously go away. Sorry for spewing everywhere.

Thanks for the support, Devin, but it's clear that no one shares my viewpoint regarding this game being unconventional. I knew it was a gamble. I should have just stayed not giving a shit, it would have ensured my survival better.

Anyway, I'm pretty mixed on whether I get lynched at this point, I honestly just want to be put out of my misery, but I really wanted to play this game.

Don't say no one. Because I totally do. As I've stated before the only conventional team is the obviously bad New Rogues. But that's about where that convention ends.
I'm sorry I wasn't able to speak up sooner. Super busy day here at work.

Another post from an Indy Rogue mindset, and linked with the previous post.

Devin the Omniscient wrote:Moving my vote to Timmer because I don't want MP to go out this way AGAIN.

Kind of strange thing to say for someone who hasn't played a game on this site since Fight Club Mafia.

Devin the Omniscient wrote:

Sophie wrote:Mp was all over the place. At some point he was almost like confessing baddie status. I dont know why he would act like that as an independent, still dont know.
The other suspect was timmer, who i ve been reading abd thinkin about...like i said before, im reading him as civvie, but it wouldnt been the first time he fooled me, so i kept my eye on him anyway, and actually brs theory that he was mind controlling people made me think about voting for him, until....some people started "vouching" for him, wich made his claim that he is a civvie a bit more likely. It seems he has btsc with a couple of people (via map) and somehow is making peeps like th thinks he is legit. That gave me pause on timmer again. Until mp did all his act and took over the thread with thaf overwhelmingly suspiciod beahviour i still dont get.

So im still open about timmer. And i reafirm my suspicion on rabbit (i ve saying it since day 1), and would have voted him if he had 1 vote and mp didnt do what he did. I also need to rethink something about bass, based on thing i know and some of his posts.... bbl with more thoughts

I still don't care for your reasons for voting MP. But I'm leaning more towards a couple of others for the next day.
I can, at least agree with you on the Timmer and Rabbit fronts. I would be comfortable with another Timmer vote. My warm and fuzzy feelings here are very fuzzy, indeed. He's been giving off strong "civ"/Old Rogue feels and I can't help but fear they may be manufactured.
And Rabbit is certainly an odd ball.

Lots of linki.

This isn't the first time he called timmer warm and fuzzy. Dunno how he really feels.

Devin the Omniscient wrote:I sincerely hope that your family's lucky streak doesn't continue down this path, SVS. Sorry to hear about everything going on, but glad to hear that he is okay!
Wow. 2 self votes already. What kind of baddie team strategy is this?
But seriously, Before everything exploded around MP the previous day, I had intended to keep my vote on a DREAMY non-talkative player. So I'll place my vote there for now and create yet another 3-way tie. I could make a habit out of this

There was the lynch of DREAM as well, in which Devin was the second voter on. Devin never mentioned any suspicion of DREAM before, but I will talk more about this.

+++++++++++

A couple other things I want to mention. Timmer has voted for Devin twice now, both on Day 8 and today. I don't buy the sincerity there.I'm already certain timmer is a New Rogue. Would he toss votes on a teammate like that?

Lately, the discussion has been dominated by myself, LC, FZ, and timmer. Devin has posted a lot too, but he's done a lot of "parroting" as he has even acknowledged.



Then we get the lynching of DREAM. On Day 5, the day MP was lynched, Devin voted for DREAM so that he could help save MP, the final vote tally doesn't reflect it, but we can see the point where Devin voted for DREAM. Now the post doesn't indicate where Devin voted, but can see here that his vote was indeed on DREAM. Devin had never mentioned a suspicion of DREAM.

So MovingPictures07 gets lynched, but right before he does, I mention that I no longer trust Turnip Head, and Devin acknowledges that he doesn't trust TH either. But that 'distrust' was pretty short-lived, as Devin agreed with TH here, and even followed Turnip Head's vote on DREAM the following day.

I think the lynch of DREAM was a distraction from lynching timmer. I think the lynch of Turnip Head was the same thing. Now I know that we lynched serial killers both times, but Gorilla Grodd doesn't appear to be an ally of the New Rogues, and since the Top attempted to nightkill Girder, it seems to me that TH never had BTSC with his baddie buddies, or at least not official BTSC.

And timmer will survive yet another day.



Thoughts?

Don't end the day early please. I'd rather be lynched than have you use it.

I am rereading Devin, and think he might be a worthy lynch target.

Long Con wrote:I think the Attack Drone was clearly piloted by a baddie, because it took out the Confirmedest Civ, Llama. I think it's likely that it was an Item... as in the killing Item has already been used, and we haven't seen it again. Actually, reading the post again, it self-destructed after killing Llama. Probably a one-use Item, if that's what it was.

You know what, that is a very good point.

Aces had BTSC with Roxy, so their dead bodies must have been near each other. timmer also had BTSC with Roxy, so he probably was nearby. Is that too farfetched an presumption?

Linki: lol, not sure what you're looking for.

FZ. wrote:MM, can I ask you something? If you could have any power you desired right now (game related), what would it be?

Me? Any role power? I think I'd go for a ressurection. Having Roxy back would be ever so nice.

Long Con wrote:

Metalmarsh89 wrote:Anyone who thinks that timmer is Zoom, and not a New Rogue should come in and make a case for another player being a New Rogue. There is a minimum of one New Rogue left, and probably at least one more after that. If it isn't timmer, then who is it?

I still think we should No-Lynch and let Wally imprison Timmer tonight, and if he survives (as Girder, which I believe he is) then we lynch him tomorrow. If the game ends, we party. If not, then we lynch someone else. Wally seems to be the only one left with a kill. I don't really see the downside to that plan. You may not really care if we kill off some Indys on the way to the end, but brother - I care deeply about that subject.

Everyone who is left in the game at this point has played a good game - they are participators, they are invested, and they have put a lot of time and effort into this. No one deserves to die just because we can't hit Timmer today.

That is the key word in this whole statement. Turnip Head's kill should have passed on to someone, and I fear that the new killer is waiting until the right moment to make his move. This move would also deceive everyone else into thinking there are even fewer New Rogues than there are. Call me paranoid, but this is what I'm thinking right now.

And now that SVS (The Trickster) is gone, the options for nightkills goes up.

Anyone who thinks that timmer is Zoom, and not a New Rogue should come in and make a case for another player being a New Rogue. There is a minimum of one New Rogue left, and probably at least one more after that. If it isn't timmer, then who is it?

Devin the Omniscient wrote:

Sophie wrote:

Devin the Omniscient wrote:That leaves only one possibility.

Zoom?

Does that mean we lynch you today?