sig wrote:I was suspicious of Mac early in this phase and did think TH made some good points, however I also liked Mac responses and his posts in general. So I won't be voting for him.
I will look over TH's case on BR in a bit, I did have a minor ping of her early on, but can't recall what it was from.
I'm also still considering a Typh vote, but I don't think I will end the phase with that vote. Besides if he is Penguin and tries to blackmail Mac, he can always find a way to tell us tomorrow and we can lynch Typh then.
Enrique's switch from hunting Inmates to not hunting is funny, are you sure you aren't an inmate Enrique? :P
Golden's vote is a slight ping, but not really I'm still reading him as a civ.
@SVS did you answer my question? If not could you please do that.
@DFaraday What are your current thoughts?
sig posts like this more or less exemplify my problem with you. For the whole game, you've stuck to wishy-washy behavior like this. "Heh maybe I think this but I'm also not sure," and then, when you actually
do form a strong opinion, you end up going back on it almost immediately. With the major exception being, of course, your insistence that info had to be shared (yes I'm bringing this up because it's still relevant).
sig wrote:a2thezebra wrote:Enrique wrote:Zebra, your team in of Montreal got away with making up a role and getting Made lynched because nobody who was paying attention was left. Inactive players are a huuge disadvantage, and there's no guarantee they're not bad either.
I'm not saying this isn't the case, all I'm saying is that aiming for their lynch unless there's simply no other option is something I can't agree with and can't get behind it.
I haven't paid a lot of attention to sig but I don't like the way he talks about me vs Golden. Then again I feel this way about sig in almost every game... at the beginning he's sensible and I agree more with him than most, then we completely lose track of each other.
sig pinged me pretty hard very recently when he advocated encouraging map discussion from the civs, when the host himself has said that it is essentially discouraged for everyone in general.
The second and imo more important part is Zebra. She is one of the few people who visited a place on her own and is trying to shut down us discussing any messages we received. This is very pingy. The mafia will already be sharing any information they got and they would most likely have picked different locations. The fact she doesn't want to discus this at all is troublesome to me. The host did say it was discouraged true, but we are still allowed to do it.
I'd like some other opinions on this. Should we or should we not share information about map locations?
linki: It was one of the main reasons for your conflict with Golden, and I thought you where implying he had anti civ motives or not wanting to equally focus on the inmates. Since then I think you've clarified your stance on the inmates/mafia and I find it less pingy. However, yes that is how I perceived portions of your discussions.
It's nice that he starts out asking for opinions right? Well, this is what he hears.
a2thezebra wrote:I'm not trying to shut down discussions about the map and even if I was that shouldn't be pingy. It's pingy that you're encouraging discussion about it despite acknowledging that the host discourages that, not for the game's balance, but for those in particular who would be discussing it. It seems to me like you know how mafia could take advantage of the civs discussing where they've been so you want to see that happen to gather information.
Bullzeye wrote:sig wrote:a2thezebra wrote:Enrique wrote:Zebra, your team in of Montreal got away with making up a role and getting Made lynched because nobody who was paying attention was left. Inactive players are a huuge disadvantage, and there's no guarantee they're not bad either.
I'm not saying this isn't the case, all I'm saying is that aiming for their lynch unless there's simply no other option is something I can't agree with and can't get behind it.
I haven't paid a lot of attention to sig but I don't like the way he talks about me vs Golden. Then again I feel this way about sig in almost every game... at the beginning he's sensible and I agree more with him than most, then we completely lose track of each other.
sig pinged me pretty hard very recently when he advocated encouraging map discussion from the civs, when the host himself has said that it is essentially discouraged for everyone in general.
The second and imo more important part is Zebra. She is one of the few people who visited a place on her own and is trying to shut down us discussing any messages we received. This is very pingy. The mafia will already be sharing any information they got and they would most likely have picked different locations. The fact she doesn't want to discus this at all is troublesome to me. The host did say it was discouraged true, but we are still allowed to do it.
I'd like some other opinions on this. Should we or should we not share information about map locations?
According to the polls thread, Zebra isn't the only person who went to the docks. Typh did too. I agree with you that the mafia will be discussing the info anyway and think it's probably in the civ's interests to have some discussion but if the hosts are discouraging it then maybe the subject should be dropped or at least approached with care. Based on the 'info' I got, I don't know if it'll do us much good anyway at this stage of the game.
Enrique wrote:For what it's worth, I think discussion of the map is pointless and if the hosts discourage it then maybe we shouldn't do it.
You guys realize that the biggest (aka all) Mafia teams have two members, right? They know the results to two of the places as most. It's not like they have some sort of massive advantage over us, why are we contributing to what they know?
And he somehow concludes, without a warning, to post all of his information for the thread to see. This is after it's been pointed out how the thread discourages it, how it's feeding info to the mob not cancelling them out somehow.
sig wrote:Enrique wrote:okay sig that's not a good look. It's like you simultaneously borrowed from and completely ignored my last post.
I already said we should share some information about our locations, so of course I'd share the information I had, if I didn't it would have looked even worse no?
Then why ask for opinions in the first place?
sig wrote:It isn't a persistent push to discuss maps I've brought it up and am trying to create discussions around it, but I'm not hounding anyone to talk about it. Putting persistent in front of push is an attempt to make it seem like I'm being stubborn and anti-town, stop using evil adverbs on me :P .
Remember this post. "I'm not hounding anyone to talk about it."
sig wrote:a2thezebra wrote:sig wrote:Glorfindel wrote:I voted City Hall for a couple of reasons. Firstly, I've no idea at all what the hell I'm doing in this game and being the 'outsider' I always seem to be, it seems appropriate for me to select such a location. At 13 pages, this game has gotten so far away from me now... I just can't...
Again Glorfidnel was I believe the only person to go to City Hall
yet he doesn't want to share what he found out. This seems scummy to me and I know other people disagree however, my opinion on that won't change. Nothing much else here, I think him using the term outsider is strange, though I'm assuming he means from a lore point of view.
Please explain why that is scummy to you. Especially since you're so dead-set on it being scummy that you outright state that your opinion won't change.
linki @ sig - Absolutely. I'll take them over french fries any day.
I just find it to be scummy/Inmatish to hide information especially if it might help us to catch people.
DharmaHelper wrote:Enrique brought up a good point. The mafia right now are two groups of two, so like, does anyone think they'd have the balls to actively participate in early talks? I don't. This bodes well for the current crop of dicussions, and reinforces my thought that nothing suspicious has really happened yet.
I didn't think of this, which actually sounds like a good thought, then again if a high poster gets mafia would they change their play style that much and be able to remain unnoticed?
"I just find it to be scummy."
sig wrote:"not in your best interest" Whose interest though? It isn't in all players best interest but I'd think it could be in the civs/pro civ independents best interest. This doesn't seem to be the general conscience of other players though.
This interpretation still makes
no sense. He has backed down from everything else at this point, but never this. He even has to make excuses for it. "It could be in the civs' best interests." Really?? That's what you get from rule #14??
sig wrote:Okay after thinking about it more I guess not discussing locations isn't necessarily suspicious mafia behavior. Having said this I don't like that Zebra is saying me discussing locations is anti-town I think she is saying this for nefarious purposes.
"Not scummy anymore."
However, he
insists that Zebra is being disingenuous by calling him out on this.
sig wrote:This is the post I'm talking about.
DharmaHelper wrote:Enrique brought up a good point. The mafia right now are two groups of two, so like, does anyone think they'd have the balls to actively participate in early talks? I don't. This bodes well for the current crop of dicussions, and reinforces my thought that nothing suspicious has really happened yet.
Now, I think this is interesting. He asks for opinions on a post where DH is saying "Mafia's hiding, nothing suspicious has happened." Then his very next post...
sig wrote:So enrique do you think Matt is mafia?
I also find it curious your voting for me, even though besides my idea of exchanging info you have nothing!? I'd further point out it makes no sense if I'm bad or even an Inmate for me to take a stance that is unpopular and gives me negative attention. I could have never mentioned it or even sided with literally every other player but I didn't. I also dislike how you brushed off my question and know your answer to it is "well it doesn't matter and I can't see inside her head" the whole point of mafia is to try and figure people out yet you refuse to do so re zebra. It is obvious she was trying to set me up and you are refusing to even consider she could be doing this as a baddie/inmate?
Borrowing directly from it. "Why wouldn't I be hiding instead?"
sig wrote:Enrique wrote:sig I think it makes sense for the Mafia to convince the town to go with what benefits them. That alone is more than I have on like, everyone else, but while Golden could argue and make me think he was being genuine, a lot of your responses just came off worse than anything you'd said before. You kept pushing for a stance and didn't pull the best arguments when challenged. I haven't voted for you yet but I don't see who else I'd vote for at this point.
I brushed the Zebra thing aside because I think it's silly. I don't know if she did it as a civvie, I don't know if she did it as a baddie. I don't care. Frankly I'm not sure anyone got any valuable info, and at least I personally have no reason to get stuck on that.
What makes you ask that about Matt?
sig thats a spin but also im in class brb
You think Matt/Zerba could get lynched am I correct in saying you think Zebra is a civ? IF you feel the same about Matt why vote for me know/soon? Why not hold your vote to save a strong civ voice? I disagree, I don't think the mafia would be as active and try to discuses sharing information so much. If anything the mafia would be against it, they'd go with the herd and not want to spread information so they don't look suspicious or better yet not even mention it at all. I see no reason for why if I was mafia I'd draw attention to myself about sharing information especially when it became clear it was an unpopular opinion.
WIFOM, but most importantly a strong-willingness that you don't see him show on any other topic. In this post he also makes up that I've claimed to read Matt and Zebra as civs and uses it to paint me in a bad light.
To Glorfindel around this time:
I'll also point out you're saying I'm not playing as Town Sig, which isn't always a good playstyle so why shouldn't I be trying to improve it? I repeatedly get lynched and suspected early as town (like right know) so shouldn't I try to stop this from happening? However, this is like the ultimate WIFOM self drag argument and I believe your insincere in pushing it. Or perhaps your being paranoid since I've in the past fooled you as mafia. Which I'm not doing Matty since I'm not mafia this game.
You're right, I'm not playing as Town Sig, but when you say it it's insincere!
sig wrote:Enrique wrote:Would anyone be willing to follow Matt's formula here? Three players per location to keep the others in check? I spoke against it before but the numbers actually kinda work out.
Still catching up, but are you serious like seriously? You voted for me, BECAUSE I wanted to share info and know you are advocating for not only sharing info but coordinating every player to go to certain locations? like seriously?
Not what I was doing.
sig wrote:Enrique wrote:Except I'm not advocating for info sharing? Hold your horses, all this does is make sure nobody pulls any info out of their ass.
Even if info isn't given this will help the mafia hide among voters and gather more intel with no explanation, and either way info sharing or no, this is still a complete 180 from your previous view?
How would that plan have helped mafia hide among voters?? They were gonna vote one way or another already! My previous view was "no info sharing," my view at the time of this post was "no info sharing."
sig wrote:I just don't see how it is bad to suggest sharing info? I can see your argument that it is a bad idea, but saying I'm scum for saying it doesn't make much sense to me.
Also welcome sabie.
It's
days later and he's still trying to contradict the hosts.
On Glorfindel:
Note I'm not saying you aren't paying attention, I'm saying your mafia/Inmate trying to set up my lynch.
I'd be up for a Glorfindel lynch today. I will ISO him tomorrow, but my gut is telling me he isn't pro civ at all.
linki: @Scotty Yes as I said earlier Glorf is always nice and carefully words things etc. However, as mafia he tries to act the same way and usually his posts just come out as slightly off. He is unable to keep up the nice Glorfindel act without well sounding off. I've had gut pings of him all of day 1 and I'm convinced he isn't pro civ. I will say this I'm usually 100% right on Glorfindel if he is a civ you can tell, however I've got the same vibe as I did in Star Wars some of his posts seemed like his usually self others seemed like he was trying to be his regular self, I was right in Star Wars, but never pushed him to hard mainly since I was trying to turn to the Dark Side and thought he might be a future teammate. :P
You don't seem as genuine in your niceness this game. Also using your niceness meta as an excuse for being town is untrue. If they read over your baddie game here (star wars) they will see you where nice there to.
I'm not sure about TH first he tried to get me lynched and that didn't pan out, so he switched to Scotty on flimsy reasons. I'd need to think about him more, but right know I still think Glorfindel is bad.
Sounds intense, right? Then it's just nahhh nvm.
Oh I also read over Glorfindel's Star Wars and Pikimon game, he defiantly isn't playing the same as in Pikimon, but not as obviously strange as in Star Wars. You claimed you weren't mafia okay maybe that is true. So tell me which Inmate are you Glorfidnel?
I also still think Glorfindel sounds slightly weird, but as off right know I don't think he is mafia so I won't be pursuing that for the time.
Much later on, when I think Matt is Batman but I don't want to give it away.
Okay good. I saw something but I'm not going to tell anyone CUZ REASONS!
Lets all play like this since ya know it is dangerous to talk in the thread, in fact lets all not talk for the rest of the game about anything game related cuz that's dangerous. just lynch who I tell you to.
He refuses to say just believe him cuz reasons it would be dangerous to say like super dangerous. So just trust him and Not lynch Matt since it would be bad like super bad. just let the mafia kill him tonight.
sig wrote:Enrique wrote:sig you're literally asking me to out a civvie how am i the scummy one
As long as there's ambiguity I doubt he'll be nightkilled.
I'm asking you to give real reasoning, you suddenly switch your views, tell everyone they are scummy if they have or then do vote for Enrique then paint a big KILLL MATT in the thread. How is that not scummy? Plus he still thinks your a baddie.
Also if Zebra agrees with me that means I'm onto something.
I was going to vote for Matt, but I really see no point and am curious as to how Nero will flip so I'll go with him.
I'm pretty sure
not lynching a civvie is a good thing, but oh well. You can call it "target painting" but what do you think will happen if I out him? At that point he was just begging me out someone I had reasons to believe was good, because if I didn't
that was the baddie move.
I admit, this is a lot weaker than I expected on paper. But dammit I don't trust him. You know how Golden called him forgetful earlier? That's what I get from him. He doesn't take positions, and when he does he just immediately abandons them, with one exception. He's probably called me both civ and mafia the most times in this whole game, sometimes 40 minutes apart. He was dead sold that Glorfindel was bad, but then he read another game and that was enough to forget about him forever. Maybe I'm tunnelling or whatever, but I can't shake it. I can't see this dude as anything but bad and I will be voting for him. He is my number one suspect, after all.
