The Syndicate

Golden wrote:
Dragon D. Luffy wrote:
Golden wrote:Seriously, I'm not criticising or discrediting silverwolf in any way.

If silverwolf believes she made the case and SVS followed it, she is welcome to give that take.

I think silverwolf had a suspicion, and SVS then went and ISO'd Fuzz and made a case.

This is no more discrediting silverwolf as it is anyone else who is not named SVS for not being the one who made the case.
SIlverwolf pointed out Fuzz's suspicious post. You put him in the list of possible CFD lynches. SVS elaborated on the suspicion and explained the case. You posted again to say you were fine with lynching him. Sloonei started the wagon. You followed it.

That's what happened. It's a little more complicated than the version you're telling.
Btw DDL, I didn't specifically address this post from earlier although SVS response was entirely on point. But just saying it now to say it is another thing that to me doesn't make me feel good about you.

What is the end goal of this post? Do you actually disagree with any of the points I was making with the simplified version? Things like this make me think you are more interested in creating a perception of me that is negative, rather than evaluating the content and point of what I was saying.

A lot of what you have done this game has felt to me like you are trying to create perceptions, subtly changing the focus and angle of what is going on, and I don't like that.

To end a discussion that can be explained by looking at facts.

I wasn't trying to portray you as bad in that post. I apologize if it looked like that.

Soneji, who else do you think is bad besides Draconus? Based only on what you've read?

Somehow I managed to skip a large post by Soneji.

He makes a good point on Mongoose, though in the last quote, I have to say the fact she is asking about how mafia is played here is because she is back after a long hiatus, during which a lot of people from different communities came here and change the usual playstyle.

Turnip Head wrote:This shit is bananas.

B-A-N-A-N-A-S

Well I guess Scotty proved my point wrong.

Can we make a compromise then?

LYNCH GLEAM. NOT SIG. PLEASE DO NOT TIE THE VOTES AT THE LAST MINUTE

Turnip Head wrote:I don't like that Gleamsicle hasn't responded to any of the recent pressure on him. He was around when he started to get indiglo's attention (and mine), but then he disappeared, and I don't know what to make of that. But I wish we had some sort of response from him.

He called me a hack, assuming that counts.

Golden wrote:I was counting you too, DDL, since you had indicated that you were happy to.

I am, but I'm afraid we might not get enough gleam lynchers to pull it off.

You're not stubborn about votes, you are stubborn about winning arguments with me.

But let's not start that shitstorm again, please. Focus on the problem at hand. Who else is going to change?

I've looked at the last page and didn't find any outside the 5 who have already voted for gleam.

linki: sig already got on. Indiglo said she's lynch him next day, so I'm not sure of that. I didn't see TH.

But okay let's do this then.

gleam

You better be right about those changes, or I'm switching back to Sig depending on the poll.

Okay who else said it?

Golden wrote:What happened to you being annoyed with my black and white reads, DDL?

Two opposing behaviors can still be equally malicious.

But either way, I'm not accusing you yet. I'm working with the idea that you might just be stubborn as fuck.

Golden wrote:But at one and a half hours out from the lynch, you have no idea how close things will be, but you are scaring people into the idea that it will be close a long way out. How about you wait until much closer to deadline to bemoan its closeness?

So half the players are afk and there's no time left to prevent the disaster?

I don't like the sound of that.

I will scare people out of doing stupid shit if I feel like. I think I said that back in day 1.

Also I'm puzzled how the guy who literally said he'd eat a camel if Sig was bad wants to back down from his lynch now.

Put your vote where your mouth is, Golden.

Golden wrote:
Dragon D. Luffy wrote:2 vote difference. Chances of cops buying a vote and using it to off a civ are increasing as we speak.
I don't like this post at all. The second time you have posted an oppositional post in the face of a changing vote towards end of day. If Gleam ends up lynched and comes back bad, expect my eyes tomorrow.

Bring it on.

We just had a civ lynch because of the loan shark mechanic. Are we seriously giving that a chance to happen again?

I'm okay with lynching gleam. What I'm not okay is having a tie between gleam and sig where the chance of at least one being a civ is fairly high so the cops can just manipulate it.

Either we lynch gleam by a large margin, or I'll oppose it.

2 vote difference. Chances of cops buying a vote and using it to off a civ are increasing as we speak.

There is a post from Sig I quoted early where he mentions Serge that gave me an impression of soft distancing. You guys might want to look at it (I'm on phone so I won't quote again).

Sloonei wrote:I've been going back and for that on DDL but I'm currently thinking he's town. A lot of the things that people keep throwing suspicion at him for seem too scattered and tentative. I always come out feeling like I understand why a townie would be playing the way he is, and I feel good about him.

Tell me, what is suspicious about the way I'm playing. I'm askig this more out of curiosity.

agleaminranks wrote:Cuz I think it will hurt us good guys far more than you think.

Yes it will.

Death to all the cops.

agleaminranks wrote:Punk-ass. You've been tunneling me since the beginning. You want information? You wanna lynch me for the info regardless of my alignment, right?

Still waiting for you to show where I said this "regardless of alignment" stuff.

I sincerely hope those players who are doing nothing but using OMGUS arguments all game are bad. Or I'll have to change some of my concepts about mafia.

Cry me a river.

I'm okay with lynching Gleam instead of Sig, but I wish we would avoid splitting votes. Or scum might buy votes to help the one that is a cop, if the other one is not.

If a lot ot people move to gleam though, I will follow.

I was in both gleam wagons, fyi.

Don't remember who else. I guess SW, Ika, Golden and Scotty have been pushing him for a while too, iirc.

Silverwolf wrote:
thellama73 wrote:
Dragon D. Luffy wrote:
thellama73 wrote:Why aren't people voting Quin when he basically admitted to being bad?
Because people don't do that. Mafia 101.
Yeah they do. I've seen it.
I've seen it before where scum will admit it in the context of being sarcastic to try to get townread for it. I'm at the point where I feel there isn't much I can say scum would never do.

"Never" is a strong word, but most scum players won't intentionally admit they are scum. The tells are more subtle.

Of course llama's theory that people will unsconsciously joke about it falls in the "subtle" department, which I have no trouble believing in.

I agree Quin looks worse every time he posts an OMGUS response.

He's not in my list of priorities right now.

Like I said, a Sig bad lynch would be a game changer. He is currently dividing the player in a "pro-Sig" and an "anti-Sig" camps.

Golden wrote:Seriously, I'm not criticising or discrediting silverwolf in any way.

If silverwolf believes she made the case and SVS followed it, she is welcome to give that take.

I think silverwolf had a suspicion, and SVS then went and ISO'd Fuzz and made a case.

This is no more discrediting silverwolf as it is anyone else who is not named SVS for not being the one who made the case.

SIlverwolf pointed out Fuzz's suspicious post. You put him in the list of possible CFD lynches. SVS elaborated on the suspicion and explained the case. You posted again to say you were fine with lynching him. Sloonei started the wagon. You followed it.

That's what happened. It's a little more complicated than the version you're telling.

thellama73 wrote:In all seriousness, I see this all the time, and I regard it as a legitimate baddie catching technique. I ask someone if they are bad, and instead of saying "no" they make a joke out of it.

Why? I think there are still an awful lot of people who are subconsciously uncomfortable lying in the face of a very direct question, so they dodge instead. They don't mean to, but it is their instinct. I trust my methods, and it's why I'm voting Quin today.

Fair enough, didn't see that (still catching up).

I don't trust your methods though so I'm staying away.

thellama73 wrote:I'm starting to feel like I'm not being taken seriously.

Can't help it, I always imagine a guy with a fez and a curly mustache saying those things you say.

thellama73 wrote:Why aren't people voting Quin when he basically admitted to being bad?

Because people don't do that. Mafia 101.

Golden wrote:I don't really have a 'problem' with it either - but I'm damn well going to push you until I feel I've gotten to the bottom of it and whether or not it is genuine.

What do you think of a gleam vote? I think Fuzz voting ika might have been to save gleam.

After reading SW's latest post about Ika (I'm catching up right now), I'm starting to consider the save might have been for Ika.

Quin wrote:
Turnip Head wrote:
Quin wrote:
Nerolunar wrote:I believe we should lynch Sig.

Right now lynching Sig is almost the only thing we are talking about. Are we going to talk about him next cycle too? It feels like we are not getting anywhere, and I would much rather get the paranoia out of the way asap. I think we can have a more clear approach to things once we are not as occupied with lynching Sig.

Will keeping Sig alive solve any problems? In my opinion, no. Rather, if he flips bad we can probably clear Golden and that would be really beneficial.
Let's talk about this post.

To me, it screams 'Look, it doesn't matter if sig is civ or scum. We should just lynch him because then people will stop talking about whether he's civ or scum.'
Well I can't say I disagree with him. This is getting old and no one is changing their mind. Some people refuse to move on until this happens.
I think that is extremely dangerous territory. If/When sig is lynched I think it's pretty clear that I'll be next. There are arguments that I'm scum regardless of his alignment. Should we just lynch me tomorrow so people will stop talking about me?

Personally I'd go after gleam next.

Also Draconus just self-voted.

Thinking of voting wrong just to see what happens.

Also the answer is SW right? That's what everyone is voting.

I find it pingy that I go though a great length to explain the logical process behind my Sig lynch and then people dismiss everything and just scream "he is lynching Sig just for information"!

agleaminranks wrote:Thanks for the reply Scotty. I still don't buy most of it, but you're true to your word.

That being said I still dislike how both Scotty and Zebra have been behaving at this point in the game. That last post of Zebra's was like the only serious analysis I'd seen her make in any recent memory. I'm aiming at one of them right now. I don't like DDL's aggression either, nor his philosophy on lynching for the purpose of information. Argh. I'm split. I was leaning more towards a civilian read on him but now it sounds like he's arguing for lynching people regardless of alignment again.

Truth be told I have no idea what to think of Golden or Sig. I didn't know what to think of Long Con either. I haven't examined enough of any of their posts. Maybe that's what today will be for.

When did I ever argue for lynching people regardless of alignment? That is just not something I do.

You are an asset to the cops regardless of my or your alignment, llama. They would be stupid to kill you as opposed to someone like Sloonei.

My remark was more on why you aren't in the lynch chopping block yet.

I am also very worried that Sig could be the undercover cop. It would explain his behavior perfectly and throw a wrench in town's progress.

Not that I want to call undercover cop immediately he flips civ, btw. But that possibility worries me.

I don't believe in lynching someone just for information, but that is a bonus that should be considered.

I am also getting the impression from Sig's posts and people's posts about Sig that there seems to be a schism among players. Some people support Sig and suspect the ones who suspect Sig, while some people are in the other "camp". While I'm paranoid about the idea of calling a whole scum team out of interactions, this "divide" seems to be a lot more apparent than in most games, so I think the potential for info out of this lynch is huge.

Also Sig is shady as fuck, so there's that too.

The one association to Golden I think it is possible to make in case of Sig lynch is that if he is bad, Golden is civ.

Anything else feels like tinfoiling to me.

That said, I don't believe in the idea that someone can't be that bad to fake the way Golden is playing. I am still paranoid about him.

Also @Sig, way to dismiss every other post I used to justify my suspicion of you.

Seems there will be people eating some weird meals depending on how this game goes.]

First a camel, now a hat.

Changing to Sig. I'm convinced to lynch him, and his flip will teach us more about other people's (including TH) alignments than otherwise.

@Sig

Could you explain the thought process behind the following sequence of posts?

sig wrote:I've got a good gut vibe of LC so far, Zebra seems really quite which is weird.

sig wrote:Quin (5), Nerolunar (6), agleaminranks (11), Soneji (12), Serge (14),RadicalFuzz (16), Enrique (23), Long Con (28), sig (29)

The most suspicious here is LC.

sig wrote:Zebra and LC are slight civ leans.

sig wrote:LC is mafia imo as is Golden.

sig wrote:I forgot about Serge, his vote does look bad in hindsight, however when he made it I didn't find it that odd. I'd be willing to vote for him tomorrow maybe.

If Sig flips bad we can add this to our collective scum lists.

I mean, not to dismiss your real life business, but that's some hardcore tunneling you're doing.

thellama73 wrote:Dragon D. Luffy

I promise I'll catch up and be a good little participant tomorrow, guys. Exhausting weekend.

How are you still alive?

I have to say, it's Soneji is probably not bullshitting when he says he is not caught up.

He's been had problems being active in games for a very long time. Specially in the Syndicate.

That sad, I suck at reading his alignment, so I'm not gonna say I don't suspect him either. But I really want to see him catching up so I feel bad about lynching him.

Golden wrote:I have been on Epi's baddie team. We kicked ass.

We did. Never had so fun being lynched.

(and guess who was bussing me)

(yes I made that pun)

Turnip Head wrote:
Dragon D. Luffy wrote:I don't like the idea of giving him more time either. Either we lynch him now, or we leave him alone. 4 days should be enough time for anyone to prove themselves.
What an unnecessary ultimatum. How have you proved yourself in 4 Days? Should we make a decision about you right now?

You should try to make a read on me, yes. Which you can also change later on.

What you should not do is refuse to lynch me even if you think I'm scummy just so I can prove myself later.

Turnip Head

Yeah it does feel good.

Brb reading the rest of Sig's posts.

I mean, we COULD also lynch someone before Sig if we find someone more suspicious, but leaving him alone just so he can prove himself seems counter-productive.

Turnip Head wrote:
Dragon D. Luffy wrote:@TH:

Arguably the only day we haven't given him free reign was Day 3. On Day 1/2 he was receiving no heat.
What's your point? You're basically making my point. Did you understand my point?

Your point is that if we leave Sig alone he might be able to play properly and prove himself.

My point is that he was left alone for 2 days and that didn't help his case at all.

I don't like the idea of giving him more time either. Either we lynch him now, or we leave him alone. 4 days should be enough time for anyone to prove themselves.

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