new nijuukyugou ISO, this time with tunnel vision turned on.
As I've mentioned in pretty much every post I've made since last night, my new concern is that Ninja's interactions with both
G-man and
sig (both dead Lloyd Webber team members) do not paint her in a very favorable light. This is a stark contrast to my original read of her, where was an overwhelming town read. I'm discarding my previous read entirely and starting anew. This theory is still in its early stages and I'm not entirely convinced of it myself, but it's something that absolutely warrants a closer look.
nijuukyugou wrote:Oh good god, four pages on Day 0. Already gonna be a lot more talky than in Bible Mafia, I see. And the threat of more technicolor lists. Super :P
Comments on what's been commented on:
Voting newbie players on Day 1? I don't think I have much of an opinion on it. I don't actively avoid it, but I also don't actively go after new people in particular, as I do want them to stay. Hello, new people!
I'd like to see where these buddy-buddy so-called "truces" will end up (or is it just one "truce" between MP and his buddy?), but I personally think it's nothing right now.
That's all I can think of to say at the moment. No strong opinions on anyone just yet.
Gets he feet wet by commenting on a couple of issues in the game, but does not offer any particular reads on anyone, other than to say the "truce" thing between MP and Devin was "nothing", which amounts to, well, nothing.
nijuukyugou wrote:Mmmmk somewhat caught up. I'd say remind me not to leave the thread for too long so I don't have 4 pages to read, but I'll inevitably do it again.
nutella wrote:I don't get the Hedgeowl suspicion at all. She posted while catching up and gave her input on a couple main discussions. None of her posts look particularly bad to me, just kind of average minimal-but-sufficient participation. I guess I understood LC's point (though it was regarding SVS) about commenting on issues rather than players, but Hedgie gave her views on LC/Epi/SVS so that doesn't really apply. I don't know, she could be hiding behind that type of participation (I haven't played many games with her but isn't it kind of her norm?) but I just don't really see the reasons for suspecting her, they seem contrived.
I could see SVS as bad. I mean, SVS is always bad
Agreed (at least the part about Hedgeowl suspicion). I think it was good of TH to search her like he did, but I disagree that it's baddie behavior from her. I don't think his suspicion was contrived.
Epignosis wrote:Sloonei wrote:
what are you so scared of, little puppy?
You didn't witness the maelstrom of deceit that was Canucklehead in Roger Rabbit.
They still whisper about it in Toontown.
(Just kidding, Canuck - I was actually very excited to see your name!)
MovingPictures07 wrote: Consequently, my mafia game, which is often defined by a high volume of posts, will be affected this game. I will be much more likely to pop in less frequently, which will increase my already notoriously long posts probably much more so, and make my style seem more like a cross of Blooper-esque, Epi-esque, and MP-esque, rather than straight-up MP-esque combination of frequency and volume.
I'm an -esque!! I'm so touched
MovingPictures07 wrote:Blooper, you note in this post multiple "truces", but ask the question whether there is just one thereafter. Devin and I never agreed to a truce. Just wanted to clear that up.
You specifically note you have "no strong opinions". If that is the case, do you have weak opinions? If so, what are they?
Fair enough. I just saw a lot of (mostly jokingly it seems) buddy-buddy Day 0 stuff, so I figured I'd comment on it. I'm notoriously bad at getting lost in the first several days of larger games because of the sheer volume of people, so I'm trying a new thing called "comment about SOMETHING, whatever it is" to at least keep a placeholder. So far, not doing so hot. But hey, here I am!
As for my opinions (and the actual contributory points of this post), I have a few opinions. I never trust Epi, but damn I do love actually playing a game with him, and whatever my vibes are right now, I'm feeling all right about him today. This means that I think he's genuinely baddie hunting, and I think both of his suspicions of LC and SVS are fairly sound (I almost said
interesting but I know better than to use that now :P). I think LC's response to Epi's going after him looks too defensive to me. I think my general view of SVS is that she gets defensive regardless of alignment, which makes her hard to read, but I agree with others (can't remember exactly who) that suddenly defending the whole "interesting" argument in the manner she did was suspicious. So, there's that.
I don't have a good read of the new people in here, but I'm glad to see some fresh meat (at least to the Syndicate). It certainly makes for some...
fascinating gameplay.
Her response to MP here reads a little bit like backtracking/covering her tracks. She admits to misrepresenting (whether intentionally or not) the truth in regards to her earlier post about the truce discussion and also provides an excuse for herself to get off to a slow start. However, she then starts to provide a few reads. However however, as has been noted a bunch of times throughout this game, with two scum teams, the baddies should be doing about as much scum hunting as the townies in this game, so her observations that Epi 1.0 seemed to be "genuinely baddie hunting" and that "LC's response looks too defensive" could just as likely have been made by a baddie, presumably a non-Wildhorn one. The three names she mentions here (Epi, SVS, Long Con) were the three that everyone had an opinion of on Day 1, so it would have been nice to see Ninja dig a little deeper for reads here. Not feeling as good about this post as I was before, but that's gonna be a common theme right now. The next read she offers is on Cobalt, the other player everyone had an opinion of Day 1:
nijuukyugou wrote:Sloonei wrote:nijuukyugou wrote:@Bass I was also a little weirded out by Cobalt implying that because he was super-civ important player in a previous game, then he is totally civ this game, but I forgot to mention it (I knew there was SOMETHING about SOME new person to me that I had seen). But for now I'd just like to keep my eye on him.
Do you believe he was trying to convince he was a civilian, or do you believe what he said about just wanting to let everyone know he's not a new player?
My vibe is that I think he's playing the civ card hard. A little too hard.
nijuukyugou wrote:The bad news is, I've been without internet access since last night due to traveling, power outages, and, y'know, socially interacting with people that I've traveled to see in real life (might need to get my priorities in order). This means I haven't had much of a chance to read through the thread as much as I'd like before the poll ends (I am still socializing after all :P ) or go back and look at something like I promised someone (I can't even remember who I promised this to. Long day).
The good news is, for the first time in my mafia-playing career, I have decent suspicion from what I have been able to gather of all three of the top vote-getters in this thread, and I'm okay with voting any of them, which is...a miracle. The question is, who do I want to pick?
I have been able to read a bit. Cobalt's made me itchy, and I read over the last page and the opportunistic vote switch. I'd still like to analyze him more closely if I get the chance. SVS has been highly, HIGHLY defensive and has weirdly voted for herself, which is something I'm not used to (the self-voting, not the defensiveness), so slightly mixed feelings but very much leaning bad. But tonight, I think I want to make things...interesting. I also like Epi's case and interaction with LC - like it in the way that I think it points to LC as a baddie. Epi's a manipulative bastard, but he's a manipulative bastard giving me good vibes, and I wanna see what happens when I press the big red button that no one should press (and by that I mean make the votes closer right now).
So I'm gonna vote LC.
Linki - Silence broken!
I can't help but now read this post as her leaving the door open on all three lynch possibilities, creating the freedom for herself to vote any one of the three lynch candidates from that day. The bigger middle paragraph where she runs through her reasoning about all three feels a bit contrived and doesn't seem to fit as well with her previous statement that she's excited to have "decent suspicion" of all three and is "okay with voting any of them". Immediately after saying this, she expresses that she's not actually okay with voting Cobalt, waffles a bit on SVS, and ultimately settles on Long Con because she "likes Epi's case". I feel like a town Ninja would not have been so quick to make a decision here, even with changeable votes. Her later comments about doing it for the "interesting reactions" also now comes back to me as not particularly fitting with the tone of this post, as it is suggested here that she at least feigned careful reasoning before voting, and was not just doing it to provoke others. Here it is:
nijuukyugou wrote:sig wrote:@ Sloonei I've played with someone who would always vote for themselves after to many people became suspicious I don't think it is a good mafia method but one person has in the past fooled me bydoing that and I've seen two others do the same, it is a mindgame which always makes me think they are mafia trying to make themselves seem like civilians.
Nijuuk if your wary of SVS why not vote for her? I'm not understanding your vote
Because I wanted to make it interesting. I'm wary of all three of the top candidates and am okay with any and all getting votes. (PS you can call me Nijuu or Blooper if you want)
I am no longer buying this excuse. When I asked her about it, she responded affirmatively:
nijuukyugou wrote:Sloonei wrote:Also would you say things have been made more interesting by your LC vote, Blooperstranger?
Oh, quite! It's garnered some good reactions.
But then it took her a few days to follow up on it, and when she did there wasn't really much evidence to back up the claim:
nijuukyugou wrote:In general, after my LC vote Day 1, people seemed to flip out and start changing votes, but that is often the norm here on TS with changeable votes. However, it was specific reactions that got my attention. First, it gave me (and others in their analyses) my first real ping of sig, who was the first to freak out and try to call me bad for mixing things up when I did. He freaked the FUCK OUT (and I laughed so, so hard). Honestly, it also made me look a bit in your direction since you freaked out about a possible tie, but that was a mafia cultural difference that you explained. nutella switched her vote soon after from SVS to Cobalt. Golden changed his vote a few times to break the tie. Hedgeowl and Gumshoe came in last minute and voted. Cobalt tried to say he would've switched yadda yadda yadda (I've already said this twice). Looking at this now several days later, it's not as much of a great analyzing point as I'd like it to be, and the "good reactions" I mentioned were rather more amusing than informative, but there's the raw data of what went down that day.
I'm still itchy about Cobalt, especially since his activity has died down considerably these past few days. His two posts for today were either nonsense about G-Man's supposed threat to being voted or about getting back into the game when his RL stuff dies down. The RL stuff might be true
and I hope it's not terrible! but his participation has been little more than "DIE LC" and getting angrily defensive when he has been here, so I'd like to see what he means by getting back in "full force." I am a bit wary of nutella based on behavior (I had mentioned she seemed more serious than what I'd experienced as her civ self in the past) and that vote switch from Day 1, but then I look at her vote record - she has voted for people on both mafia teams. However, for some reason I'd thought she'd voted earlier in the LC and sig lynches, which is what really held me back, but she seems to have voted when they were pretty much a done deal (aside from vote switching mechanics). So I guess what I'm saying is that I need to look back at her again and she could still be a baddie.
I know that's not what you guys are talking about currently in the thread at this hour, but I figured I'd get these thoughts out while they were in my head and to make myself tired enough to go to sleep (and because Guess Who might start tomorrow, which will likely alter my concentration and participation in this game). However, I will at least comment about vote analysis in finding baddies - it freaking works. It caught us BAD in Biblical, as Golden attests
so I'm glad to see it being used and discussed here
For the record, I'm still not tired. Maybe I'll try reading myself to sleep.
I especially disagree with her when she says sig's reaction to her vote gave many people their "first real ping" about him. I know I first became suspicious of sig because of the way he handled his own vote that day. I did not even become wary of his response to niju's vote until after he had been lynched and I looked back through his posts, and the only reason it stood out to me was because of how strange he was acting towards niju in particular. I think it's also worth noting that she makes
absolutely no mention of that sig ping in her big huge follow up post. She does spend a lot of time telling us why Cobalt is bad, though.
nijuukyugou wrote:Well, I am late for this party, but I am laughing profusely at the thread
I don't plan on changing my mind about what I believe to be Cobalt's alignment, but I suppose it would be prudent to look at...others. I will determine what others I want to focus on at a later time, as I simply want a placeholder/check-back-in post right now
and I'm exhausted from moving boxes up three flights of stairs in nearly 100 degree weather, but I digress. Back later to read back and post in more detail.
Linki - Ohhhh man gotta love the picture posts
Still no mention of sig...
nijuukyugou wrote:I gotta stop doing this to myself. But moving takes so. Much. Time. Here we go.
So I've tabbed quotes from people that I agree with and/or find interesting (I'll make it clear what I think about them as I go). Sometimes I'm sad I wasn't there in real time to respond, but thems the breaks. I'll also comment on general things that have been discussed.
timmer wrote:Dom wrote:
Coablt's discussion has been totally about role descriptions.... you can choose to believe or disbelieve him.
You obviously have the final say on this, Dom, so I'll move along. I'll just say that I don't like his play, and that if he is a civ, his actions have more likely hurt than helped the cause, imo.
I agree so, so much with this and with your longer post from before. I still think Cobalt is baddie bad bad, but in the offchance in my mind that he is civ, he is NOT playing a very civ-friendly game. His insanified posts are rather amusing, though.
I enjoyed the G-Man pictures (might be because I saw a few of them in Economics but wasn't actually in the game). In fact, I seem to enjoy reading G-Man's posts regardless, especially knowing his identity as Balaam (he humored my request for more ass jokes
). I hope you keep some of your pictures! But speaking of G-Man (or another of his former alter-ego players),
Golden wrote:So I went back to look at timing.
Epi dies. Epi replaces in. Epi has (I think) only two posts - one where he says 'I know who killed me' and one where he says 'my suspicions haven't changed'. Then TGG asks to be subbed out.
I honestly think it's very consistent with someone who was part of a team that killed epi, that they killed them for cause, and was upset when he was able to sub back in and express the particular sentiments that he did. I think G-Man and LC are a team. I feel less sure that bubbles is, but she definitely could be.
Does it suck that someone subbing out on a matter of principle could sink a team? Yes. But this is why you should always keep your cool in mafia. I guarantee you, when people complain about things being unfair in this game, it's almost always mafia. Because they perceive it has harmed their chances. I don't think Epi's views necessarily held great weight, and I think the reaction to him subbing back in provides a whole lot more information about how important they believed killing epi to be.
This is a fascinating analysis and, since Epi seems to be silenced and absent, dare I say
interesting thought process. I like the ideas posed here (about TGG perhaps getting frustrated and mafia getting frustrated in general). It's a bit of a stretch but entirely possible. However, I'd like to give G-Man the BOTD for today at least since he's a totally different player than TGG. We'll see how it goes.
Scotty wrote:I REALLY want to hear more from row 3. So...calling MM, sig, njuu, nutella, and Turnip! Anything to report??
Roger that. I read and re-read your post about the messages, but my eyesight tends to start going double the more tired I get and, therefore, I get lost in longer analysis posts (this might be why I enjoy the G-Man pics - easier to read!). What information/analysis are you requesting, exactly? I'm happy to help where I can.
As for suspicions beyond Cobalt, I'm still game for LC (it's been a while and I got super distracted by Cobalt, but I liked and agreed with Epi's suspicion and analysis Day 1). TB (I don't really like calling her that, because it looks like tuberculosis
so let's go with TBubbles instead) is an enigma but I'm getting some weird vibes. I keep flip-flopping on how I feel about her, TBH. One moment I was just about to post how I felt she was weird for voting LC instead of Cobalt because she thought the "bandwagon was scummy," and then I re-read that and think, "Oh wait, that's actually logical." So maybe it's just a vibe thing (I'm using that word a lot this game, I notice), although my gut is usually pretty good in mafia. I suppose I should say I have mixed feelings about ol' TBubbles - I feel bad if she's civ and she's feeling so frustrated with this game that she's self-voted, but on the other hand she's been saying "I'm civ! I'm civ!" the entire game without giving us any other reason to believe it beyond that. Plus I don't care for self-votes.
But TBubbles, I hope you're not too frustrated, and I'm sorry you're not having much fun - I hope you stay and know that suspicion is nothing personal! Also, nutella seems a lot more serious and a little more biting in this game than I remember, and I'm pretty sure she's been civ in the other games I've played. So there's that. I'll probably give her another good look. Hope you had fun with Blooper stream-of-consciousness hour (and by that I mean I apologize for any discomfort it may have caused). Any questions before we move on?
Metalmarsh89 wrote:Effective immediately, Metalmarsh89 has replaced Metalmarsh89. As a result, Metalmarsh89 cannot be lynched today.
I laughed out loud at this for real
Golden wrote:I don't recognise myself with that avatar. Where is my golden one!
You and me both, buddy. I keep looking for Blooper to see my last post on a page and it's confusing as fuck.
Lots of suspects, but still none named sig. She does offer support of Golden's G-man/Gamerguy theory, but she also remarks that it's "a bit of a stretch" and that she wants to give G-man a pass for a day. Perhaps setting herself up to begin bussing a teammate later on, but not right away. Because we can lynch Cobalt first (I'm aware I've just done a 180 from my previous stance on her "give G-man BOTD" remark).
nijuukyugou wrote:Sloonei wrote:I don't expect anyone to read all of my big casing posts, but I would really appreciate if people could take a look at those last two (sig and gamer/g-man) and share their thoughts as well. They're the two players who I'm most seriously considering for a lynch, and I obviously think they're very good suspects right now. If other people feel the same way, that'd be great.
any other thoughts about any of my reads are also welcome, of course
I like your sig case. I tend to get lost in large games with so many people to keep track of, especially near the beginning, and I'd forgotten about him. He's been weirding me out with the wishy-washy votes and posts, too.
Long Con wrote:
Canucklehead wrote:Golden wrote:Canucklehead wrote:Can I ask ourHOST why G-Man is able to be voted for? I was off limits for the day I subbed in....
I think it's because you subbed in during the day, and G-Man subbed in at the start of the day, but I'm just guessing.
Thanks, Host! :P
WHO'S G-Man's teammate?
Here she finally mentions sig, after Scotty and I had both posted our cases against him and I specifically asked for people to respond to it a couple of times. As I noted in my previous post about sig/Ninja interactions, I find it a bit inconsistent that she claims to have both "forgotten about" sig and been "weirded out" by him. I now find it even more inconsistent, considering her later post about "getting her first ping" on sig after his reaction to her Day 1 vote.
nijuukyugou wrote:So...as with others, I'm confused at what happened to Sloonei. It didn't mention death, but he also seemed to exit pretty...not dead?
There are so many long posts that I am loving here. I apparently suck at using the spoiler tag, so I'm going to do what I hate and include the link to the posts until I figure out the spoilers, since they're so, so long:
Sloonei's first post analyzing connections to sig:
http://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/viewto ... 69#p154469
I like most of this analysis, mainly for the commentary for LC being bad in connection to LC.
The other one also caught my attention for analyzing sig's so-called reads on people:
http://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/viewto ... 89#p154489
I must comment on the last part for reasons. One is this, because it's driving me absolutely nuts:
sig wrote:0-10 10 highest 1 lowest
, nijuukyugou 5 she was less scum before her switching andthen saying she would just run and lynch
What in the name of god's green earth is this? I have done no vote switching this entire game. You see what happens to liars? :P I do like that sig tries to throw shade at me, calling me suspicious, then "hard civ" when he's on the way down, then wishy-washy'ing his way back to "suspicious." I see what you did there...well, kinda. Nice try.
I also like Epi's Cobalt/LC analysis:
http://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/viewto ... 93#p154493
It's just beautiful. I don't even know how to put in my own words how much I agree with it. But I guess I just did.
The inconsistency continues. If she was suspicious of sig for his Day 1 behavior, why is she not noticing/commenting on it until after he's been lynched? (I also said this in my other post, but it's worth restating)
nijuukyugou wrote:Woo hoo! Two for two!
I'm going Les Mis. It has less votes, and while I really like the storyline of Les Mis, Russell Crowe's horrid singing in its most recent adaptation cannot be forgotten. Also, I've never seen Miss Saigon, so I have no opinion of it, but since both musicals are apparently sung-through, it would probably annoy me, too :P
I like the theory that one or both of the scum teams would have tried to cover all their bases on the Les Mis/Saigon poll, and only myself, FZ, Scotty, and niju voted Les Mis that night. This also makes me scratch my chin at Scotty, but he's one of the people who's been bringing this theory about, and I'm not terribly suspicious of him otherwise at this moment (Would still really like to hear other opinions on him, btw).
nijuukyugou is no longer a town read. I'd like to hear her response to this, as well as any reads she has about current suspects.
Sloonei wrote:Hey all! It's great to be back! I've followed along pretty keenly since being killed and my opinion on ninja has not changed. She's getting my vote unless someone can convince me I've been wrong this whole time. I do not think I have been. I saw Golden hint a few times at her being some specific role, but I do not know what that is all about.
