The Syndicate

TheFloyd73 wrote: MP's ranked Zebra the lowest out of anyone. This was day two.

sig wrote:

MacDougall wrote:So lylo huh. This is pretty fucked hahaha.

No he said we weren't at lylo, that means we have another phase before that. I need to think some things over I really thought 3J was mafia.

Epignosis wrote:

Diiny wrote:

Epignosis wrote:I have 50% shot at being right at this point. No one will lynch Floyd. So motel room it is.

I've thought Floyd was bad for a while, I could vote him. He's a better choice than motel.

Why is he a better choice than motel room?

TheFloyd73 wrote:

sig wrote:

TheFloyd73 wrote:

Diiny wrote: Floyd, say something game relevant please

Because this is surely game relevant.

Diiny wrote:If a tree wins a poll in the forest but nobody is around to hear it, does it get lynched?

Dinny

I don’t understand this post at all. Youranswer to Dinny asking you to make a game post is to give a sarcastic answer and vote for him?

You're kidding, right? I gave a more detailed reason to vote for Diiny than some players (both in this game and in other games).

For example:

a2thezebra wrote:

Diiny wrote:If a tree wins a poll in the forest but nobody is around to hear it, does it get lynched?

I don't know, Diiny.

I'm not pinging Zebra as scum, but I clarifying that voting in this way is alright with some players, but not me apparently.

Diiny wrote:

TheFloyd73 wrote:Diiny

This man has voted for me three times. Once for alleged hypocrisy. Once for a self preservation vote despite me explaining to him why townies self preserve. And here again. Who knows why?

Floyd, why don't you explain your votes? Why do you have so little content on anyone else? Why are you so reluctant to play mafia? Don't give me anything about you being bad at mafia, because you're not incapable of explaining yourself. I'd be willing to believe you were a struggling townie if I saw any real struggle or drive from you to grapple with the game.

Why doesn't everyone explain their votes? When did I ever vote for you as self preservation? I've voted for you again because it's simple, you're scum.

I'm not reluctant to play Mafia, have I not explained this before?

What is that meant to mean?

Isn't it funny that Diiny has voted for the three civilians that have been lynched?

MacDougall wrote:

Epignosis wrote:I have 50% shot at being right at this point. No one will lynch Floyd. So motel room it is.

If we're wrong we can just blame him.

Epignosis wrote:I have 50% shot at being right at this point. No one will lynch Floyd. So motel room it is.

a2thezebra wrote:I was aware that you've had a town read of me more or less the entire game. So by saying that I might be surprised that you are town-reading me is to imply that I was only suspicious of you because you were suspicious of me or some BS along those lines.

It's also trying to push the idea that my read of you is irrational by making our back-and-forth out to be more petty (on my side exclusively) than it actually is.

You continue to pretend that there is no logical reason to be suspicious of you and that anyone who is suspicious of you is just looking for reasons to be. If you were civilian you would at least acknowledge to some extent that you are being scum-read by more than one person maybe, like, for a reason or something, and act accordingly by defending yourself and proving each of us wrong by putting in a genuine scum-hunting effort. That is simply not what you are doing.

a2thezebra wrote:

Diiny wrote:

a2thezebra wrote:What do you think it means?

Buddying is when you attempt to build a rapport with a person or be friendly so that people (often that person) don't see you as a threat and are less likely to lynch you. Scum do it to town for reasons JJJ mentioned.

I have you, on balance, as a town read albiet one with stuff I'm not happy with and won't just let fly as I've said before. Our argument is probably as vocal as the three way between Mac, Epi and Jay. Does having you as a town read strike you as buddying? What do you think buddying is, because clearly it's not what I think buddying is.

Have you run out of shit to throw at me or something?

It astonishes me that think JJJ is the more obvious baddie with posts like this. I can accept that you're trying to push the idea that an unnecessary footnote with your town read of me wasn't buddying, but to push the idea that I'm accusing of buddying just for having me as a town read in itself, when you clearly know that is not the case? I'm frankly amazed you're getting away with it merely to the extent that the lynch is even tied.

motel room wrote:

Diiny wrote:

motel room wrote:

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:

DrWilgy wrote:

Diiny wrote:lmao is it confirmed that wilgy's bullshitting now? talking about a thought process that mechanically couldn't have happened?

No fuckin shit.

So, concession?

Coy.

Also I'm gonna come right the fuck out and say I'm not sure what jay's post or motel's post mean here. Someone explain. Was concession supposed to read confession?

I'll use this as a jumping off point. Here's what I don't like about the JJJ vibe im seeing this game.

Suggesting a concession\confession is never going to result in anything except a safe place for a scum to put a vote in my experience. I've never seen anyone just shrug and give up, so this looks like a subtle explanation for where his vote ends up. Doesn't seem like a usual JJJ response.


i think there's a post somewhere also where he says why his pressure and vote on Epi was the tougher thing to do and should be viewed as town that didn't turn me on but I can't find it right now and need to jump on a conference call at work but looks like I'll be around for EOD today.

motel room wrote:

Diiny wrote:

motel room wrote:there's a lot of little separate shit going on that I want to get my head around but I'm somewhere like this right now:

MacDougall
MovingPictures07
Epignosis
sig
a2thezebra
TheFloyd73
JaggedJimmyJay
Diiny

Wait since when am I your scummiest and why? Last you said about me as far as I can tell from ctrl f is saying you didn't think I was scum. What the fuque.

You have 2 posts about J as far as I can tell and said you didn't particularly want to lynch floyd.

There's so little in your ph. Why are your baddies bad.

I think i said I wasn't as certain you were scum when Wilgy was saying you were def scum and Enrique was saying you were def scum. But you have this throwing everything on the wall and seeing what sticks feel to your posts when I read them, especially in your argument with zebra this was you


Floyd has done nothing but silently vote you since the vibe on him seems to have shifted to town-friendly.

sig wrote:

Diiny wrote:Sig, why is JJJ scum outside of potential connections? Why am I scum outside of potential connections? Connections are useful as fuck in catching scum, and the spew review played a big part in last game's proceedings, but the connective element there was only useful because we'd already caught scum. Your scum read of certain players must be pretty strong to start making other people scummy by connection, and you've said next to nothing outside of connections. Why are your scum reads scummy in the first place?

linki: ugh, only if you reply to my reply to you first

I do have a strong scum read on him right know. I find the fact that you were able to survive two days of potentially being lynched to be suspicious, and JJJ post. Know what JJJ says about his meta might be true, but I don't know if it is. I recall JJJ being much different in TH mafia when I accused him.
I also believe he purposely set up a Enrique lynch. He mentioned Enrique a few times, but not to often then suddenly voted for him starting a counterwagon on you.

So yes a good part of my suspicion of him is based around his defense of you as well as his voting. It isn't a very strong case true, but I'm confident in my read of JJJ.

a2thezebra wrote:What do you think it means?

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:Oh fine.

Diiny wrote:

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: I'm going to make a friendly suggestion, sig. You can ignore it if you please. If you're town, I think you're too absorbed with people defending each other. Almost everything you have to say in this big post is in some way associated with that concept, and at least in every case involving my name, you're wrong. I think you'd be wrong most of the time with this mindset. Mafia-aligned players are going to dupe you frequently if you don't adjust. If I'm wrong about your mindset or you think I'm just wrong in general, very well.

What you say about Sig is true. He's looking entirely for connections and hasn't actually said why you were scummy. He's given one reason as far as I can see: that your reaction post was scummy. I did the research and found out you do this when you mislynch as town, but whatever. I have an issue with this, but I also have an issue with your reaction. I'm undecided on you, Jay, and whilst on the most part I'm seeing the JJJ that's only gotten himself lynched as town a couple of times with your most recent bout of posting, this seems like you're trying to emulate polite JJJ too much instead of being the aforementioned not-lynched-as town J. This man has constructed a case against you that doesn't actually accuse you of scummy behaviour, only connections that are based on you being scum. And instead of blowing it out of the water you politely suggest he think about the case in a different way if he wants to.

I don't think you're judging his case fairly. I even said "I don't fault you for thinking this." to at least one of his points. He's wrong, and I think his approach is a bad one, but that doesn't mean he has ulterior motives. I actually appreciate the enthusiasm he showed by jumping into this thread with a bone to pick, even if it's misguided. I get the impression he was spectating a bit before joining (he can refute that if necessary) and thought I was mafia as a neutral observer. I bet a solid few of those in spectator heaven think I'm mafia, it'd be understandable.

I even said earlier that I feel similar to how I felt in the Champs Finale, when I was mafia. This effort from me has not been to my standard and I would expect people to suspect me. I'm not quite the sleepless robot that many think I am, but based on the body of work people have observed before this game -- I understand.

I am suspicious of sig only in that he is the progeny of FZ.

motel room wrote:

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:

DrWilgy wrote:

Diiny wrote:lmao is it confirmed that wilgy's bullshitting now? talking about a thought process that mechanically couldn't have happened?

No fuckin shit.

So, concession?

Coy.

motel room wrote:there's a lot of little separate shit going on that I want to get my head around but I'm somewhere like this right now:

MacDougall
MovingPictures07
Epignosis
sig
a2thezebra
TheFloyd73
JaggedJimmyJay
Diiny

I wouldn't need to if you weren't trying to make my vote for him look like a flip when it wasn't. I wouldn't need to say I was never a fan of him if you weren't the one trying to make it look like I was. You don't think it looks objectively like you had a town read of the guy? Why does MP agree with me here? I'm sure others do. Bullshit. How? Again, it should be obvious. Telling someone who votes that they're making the game easier for scum is clearly indicative of your stance on the guy. I've been over this three times already. Wilgy's content at that point was nothing but WIFOM, and Wilgy himself agreed so don't try to deny it please. For me, WIFOM means just as likely bad as good. You've voiced your disagreement with that opinion, I'm aware. But you're acting as if my perception of how WIFOM should best be interpreted is the same as yours, that way my vote for Wilgy looks more like a flip than it actually is. Splitting this one into two because it's long. I'm not questioning your stance on wifom if that isn't clear. Maybe flip isn't the right word, if you're adamant that he was a neutral read. It was an unsubstantiated, unevidenced and unexplained by express posts or through anything in your post history vote jump to someone you were quite clearly defending. "THE NEXT DAY PHASE" Give me a break. You know I'm not what you're making me out to be, both in my opinions and with my actions. Therefore, you are not simply mistaken about my motivations. Therefore, you are being opportunistic. Therefore, you are scum. It's not me looking for things to disagree with you, it's you making arguments that you yourself don't believe. Fabricated. Disingenuous. Mafia. It's flat-out absurd that you haven't been lynched yet when this was apparent from the beginning of the game. Thanks for confirming that you didn't say anything before the next day phase. Don't deflect from that point by shouting that I'm scum over and over because that's not going to make it true. It's not a flip. Look at the post that Wilgy made that resulted in me voting for him. I even quoted it for you but you are deliberately ignoring it so your all-caps "nothing" makes more sense to anyone who isn't paying enough attention. THAT'S your evidence? You literally quoted it and typed ugh. No reasoning, no content, no explenation, nothing. It wasn't until the next day that you elaborated, you just swooped in and despite being questioned on it left it at that. Why? I also extrapolate from the questioning of your vote that I wasn't the only one with no idea what the hell was behind it at the time. That is because, again, as I have already friggin' said three times before this post, the post that sealed my vote was Wilgy's post right before it. There's no "progression" because Wilgy had given no reason for me to think he was good or bad before that post. It was the first post that struck out as neither genuine nor overtly WIFOM-y, so it was all the progression I needed. Hence. My. Vote. How is this not apparent when looking at my vote post in context itself? I don't believe for a second that you don't understand it.From yellow to tip top scum read because of one post literally discussing self preservation that both townies and scum do? No, I don't understand at all. I suspected Wilgy and that post didn't ping me. Bullshit [...] That was me accommodating those that skimmed through the context of my vote post to read your scummy misrepresentation of it.. I genuinely think I'm missing a post in your PH. You said 'ugh' in reply to a post and voted someone who was previously a 'yellow read'. Nothing since after the day phase. Are you genuinely telling me that this is what I'm looking for and that everyone who wondered what the fuck your vote was about should have looked at and realised everything? Because that's insane. Lots of people saw it and nobody understood what was going on. Yet again, it wasn't a flip. A flip would be if I town read him before and scum read him later. My vote was the first time I read him as anything other than neutral. And this was clear WHEN IT HAPPENED.why are you banging on about this point when 'yellow' (despite public defence) to red in one post that's unexplained despite requests is just as bad?My read of Wilgy was developed more organically than anyone else in this game, even if it was wrong.. It doesn't show. I'm 100% sure people will back me up on this.Bullshit.. There's isn't anything like that there. Scumhunting, real scumhunting that is, is genuine. If anyone is accused of being opportunistic the implication is that there is an ulterior motive behind insert suspicion here. Don't try to play semantics just because you have no real defense for your disingenuous behavior.. I'm not. I've seen scum caught by townies by being opportunistic. Thank you for explaining to yourself why my vote on Wilgy was justified.. I can't believe this is a post. You call me opportunistic, then I describe what a good opportunistic townie is you simeltaneously accuse me of being disingenuous AND attempt to agree with me by justifying your own behaviour with the same brand of townie strats you called scummy? Right because your back-and-forth with me here is totally taking into account everything else the thread as to offer. Oh and your Floyd suspicion as well. Totally not fabricated one bit.If you expected me to take 'ugh', literally three letters, as making your vote change acceptable you were wrong.

Because it's fake. You're misrepresenting your own perspective. Consistency has nothing to do with being genuine here.. You're shouting about me being disingenous a lot but you're not telling me why. You're not telling anyone why. You're just shouting. It's the same thing in all of his games. The best way to catch Floyd is to catch him scumslip. He did that in Talking Heads more than once, have you seen him do it here? I don't think so. I don't need to. He's piggybacking opinions, lurking, being reticent, timid, not making sense with his arguments and barely replying to numerous requests for him to talk. That's scummy. Meta or no meta. Again, have you seen him do it here? Nope.I've seen him flounder, which apparently he wouldn't do with BTSC (can't recall off the top of my head if you asserted this or someone else.) Tell me what he's shown you that makes him scum. No one's lynched just because they're not overtly town, players are lynched because they are outright scummy. Already said above. Nonsense [...] Then make a case for why is he bad. If it's based on him using the excuse that he's inexperienced with the game as an indicator that he's scum, then it's nothing. If anything that's an indication that he's town because he would not get away with posting the way he is (that particularly) with BTSC buddies to advise him to do otherwise. I've talked about why I think the guy's scum both before in my PH and now. You can profess to have a town read of him all you want, but you can't invalidate anyone else's reads.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: I'm going to make a friendly suggestion, sig. You can ignore it if you please. If you're town, I think you're too absorbed with people defending each other. Almost everything you have to say in this big post is in some way associated with that concept, and at least in every case involving my name, you're wrong. I think you'd be wrong most of the time with this mindset. Mafia-aligned players are going to dupe you frequently if you don't adjust. If I'm wrong about your mindset or you think I'm just wrong in general, very well.

motel room wrote:some things:

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:*prolonged fart noise*

Good night y'all.

^ this was the same response JJJ had in RYM #82 after working a bullshit case on me, we argued, then I flipped town. Lest we forget.

Mac's hunger feels genuine to me.

My back is killing me, i must have slept on it wrong.

a2thezebra wrote:The linkitis is in that last post I responded to is especially damning. You're trying to make it out like I'm certain that you are simply wrong as opposed to being certain that you're being deceitful. It makes you look better that way.

MacDougall wrote:If Jimmy flips scum I will be looking deeper into Diiny too. And Floyd's Diiny vote today looks like distancing to me. I still think it's possible that Epi and Jimmy were staging a shit fight but in the harsh light of day it's highly unlikely they were. And I am now capable of aligning all of epi's behavior to civ so he is looking better to me.

a2thezebra wrote:

Diiny wrote:Frequently used in place of the real arguments and evidence in their favour that scum often lack, or used as seen here to avoid accountability for stuff.

It's only alignment-indicative if the scum-motivated explanation is just as if not more likely than any other explanation. I don't think Wilgy is avoiding accountability either.

a2thezebra wrote:

Diiny wrote:

a2thezebra wrote:

Diiny wrote:And I have no idea why Zebra's treating it like it's no biggie.

I'm not, I just don't see how it's alignment-indicative.

You don't see how liberal use of wifom is alignment indicative?

Nope. Enlighten me.

a2thezebra wrote:

Diiny wrote:And I have no idea why Zebra's treating it like it's no biggie.

I'm not, I just don't see how it's alignment-indicative.

a2thezebra wrote:Hey Wilgy there's no better cure for hangovers than lynching a bad guy, and you're currently the cause of a tie preventing a lynch against that guy.

DrWilgy wrote:Diiny can you be any more disingenuous?

a2thezebra wrote:

Diiny wrote:Top. Quality. Wifom.

10/10 would call a taxi

a2thezebra wrote:Whaaaaaaaaaaat the fuck. Why are we digging our own grave here? If scum is going to win this game let's at least give them a damn challenge.

a2thezebra wrote:TheFloyd73
Epignosis
MovingPictures07
MacDougall
DrWilgy
DFaraday
motel room
JaggedJimmyJay
FZ.
Diiny

sig wrote:Care to talk floyd?

TheFloyd73 wrote:Diiny

a2thezebra wrote:This post, MP. WIFOM is a bridge, and when the WIFOM ends you're either on the side with town or the side against town. I saw this post and concluded that Wilgy was on the wrong side.

DrWilgy wrote:So I'm still out of town and don't have time to catch up before EOD. I have suspicions towards Diiny and FZ still. I don't feel comfortable with how close I am to being lynched, Diiny would you be willing to change off me to FZ? I will as well