The Syndicate

Metalmarsh89 wrote:
Sorsha wrote:
Metalmarsh89 wrote:
Sorsha wrote:I'll most likely be voting for jjj also today. I'd hate to see a no lynch but I'm going to hope that he's lying about either his prize or what happens.

If Wilgy is the second most vote recipient that would be good I think. Hopefully if jay does have immunity it'll just go to the next highest and I've got no reason to believe Wilgy is civ.
Why don't you just vote Wilgy today and Jay tomorrow then? Why risk an actual no lynch happening?
Ok.
I don't mean to tell you what to do. I just think that mislynches are generally more useful than no lynches.

Me too. I'd have preferred a llama or Boomslang wagon. But I don't suspect Wilgy, so a no lynch it is.

I just tied it up.

Made wrote:
Quin wrote: The point is that if you read Eloh's post and my pushing it as a role claim, it'd be hard for you to not connect the dots and come to the conclusion that she role blocked me on a night where nobody died. It's not the kind of thing you forget or don't see the significance of.
No, I follow that, It just doesn't read as a role claim, especially in a game where role claim are allowed. It felt like a tinfoil.

Well, she didn't really role claim. I kind of did that for her. That was my mistake. Although on that front, I'm not gonna make a fuss about Eloh being the role blocker and then kill her if I'm bad. Ah, delicious WIFOM.

Made wrote:
JaggedJimmyJay wrote:Let's talk about Made:

Made wrote:Unless someone can explain any further significance of this argument and LC's response, the interaction feels more like a doubt than an accusation, and that make this argument feel more like one of semantics rather than one of alignment. I'm not really seeing what JJJ's seeing.

Made wrote:I kinda read the original post as tinfoily myself, mostly because Eloh's post didn't seem like a role claim to me.

And having read 16 pages in one sitting, the theory against Quin is kinda lost on me. Is it because of his tinfoil theory??
He made one substantive post, which I've snipped to these pieces. His contribution has been to discount the suspicions presented by other people (my suspicion of Long Con and Elohcin's suspicion of Quin). He was vaguely critical of me here (asserting I was concerned with semantics and not alignment) which lends some support to his eventual decision to vote for me. It's a bit convenient though that his only meaningful post provided him with the rationale necessary to participate in a two-way lynch dynamic between Quin and I.

The highlighted question is a little ick at face value. In his first sentence about Quin, he acknowledged Elohcin's post, and though he didn't think she was roleclaiming this at least evidences that he was aware of that point's existence. So that should tell him that "the case against Quin" consisted of more than just the tinfoil theory.

Also, two question marks. Yikes.
I read Eloh 1.0's post, but I missed eloh's suspicion on quin. Also wasn't Quin was the one pushing it as a role claim. But I can't find the post where this all happened.

The point is that if you read Eloh's post and my pushing it as a role claim, it'd be hard for you to not connect the dots and come to the conclusion that she role blocked me on a night where nobody died. It's not the kind of thing you forget or don't see the significance of.

I think his belief that the suspicion on me is based on my tinfoil theory is a pretty big contradiction.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:
Quin wrote:None. I wouldn't know he was playing if he wasn't on the tally.
You see that little chat Marmot and I had?

Link?

None. I wouldn't know he was playing if he wasn't on the tally.

Boomslang wrote:
DrWilgy wrote:Ok, here's an issue.

"I wanna lynch Wilgy because he's not very vocal"
"I wanna lynch Wilgy because he's now vocal"

Eloh, Boomslang and Scotty can I please have context as to how I'm forcing posts or suspicion unrelated to my post count?
My suspicion of you has nothing to do with your level of posts—I tend to be a quite player too. I also don't think you're forcing posts or suspicion. I do think you're casting a really wide net in an effort to look like you're contributing. As has already been pointed out about the below:

DrWilgy wrote: My top 3 suspects are Llama, JJJ and idk. (content cut)
INH, LC and Quin can I have you 3 let me know full reads on the other 2 in this group?
Niju, Marmot, and Epi can I have you 3 let me know full reads on the other 2 in this group?
That's mentioning at least eight separate players in a single post, with relatively little rationale about why. It's player salad, trying to very quickly establish a record with everyone so we feel you've had something to say on them.

He did rationalise it. It was a good explanation, too.

Then again, I'm not sure I believe in it. But it's not a tinfoil.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:
Quin wrote:
JaggedJimmyJay wrote:So far it's been nothing. Instead I have received a pile of votes, been told I am trying to control the thread, and left in a state of total confusion. I am literally begging everyone else to share their perspective on the matter.
This desperate tone meshes with that idea.
You are approaching Matt levels of tinfoil sir. Do whatever you think is best.

The desperation is a reflection of my extreme frustration that nobody was giving me decent feedback about my LC case despite my repeated requests.

You keep calling all my stuff tinfoil in this game. And especially in this case, that's definitely not true. It's a pretty cut and dry circumstance in this case.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:I told you exactly what my item is an how I used it. I am not Mr. Gambit. Believe me or don't, but lynching me today will prove to be a waste of everyone's time. I guess the one silver lining is that it'd force everyone to then consider the civilian explanation I have attached to my decision, because it was the dang truth.

Would you a consider a no lynch today a terrible thing?

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:So far it's been nothing. Instead I have received a pile of votes, been told I am trying to control the thread, and left in a state of total confusion. I am literally begging everyone else to share their perspective on the matter.

This desperate tone meshes with that idea.

Mongoose wrote:Mini-Event: Canine Carrier Express

If you would like a special ride on the Canine Carrier Express, send me a PM. Even-numbered requestors will receive an item. Is the item good or bad? Paws your game momentarily to reflect.

Thus, the 2nd, 4th, 6th, 8th, 10th and so on players to request an item will receive one.

There is no prohibition regarding sharing whether you received an item or not (and what it is) in the thread, but that might not be the best idea. You have until the end of Day 2 to request an item (if you want one). Items will be given by the end of Day 2. If you are an odd-number requestor, you will be told immediately.

This reads to me like items have the potential of being negative. It's possible that rather than lynch immunity, 3J has a vote penalty today.

Although on 3J's item, I guess it's possible that he really did get an item and he's just lying about what it was.

insertnamehere wrote:
Quin wrote:
insertnamehere wrote:
Quin wrote:
insertnamehere wrote:huh. well. looks like I need to re-assess some things and watch La Jetee on Flimstruck.

I'm not gonna lie, the result of this day left me breathless. Hopefully Llama forgives the contempt from earlier. Not sure what to think about the band of outsiders who voted alongside me for Llama. But still, it's my life to live, and my vote to give, so I'm still gonna defend the logic I used when I wrote a case against Llama. Anywho, I'll have more to say over the course of the week end.
The highlighted shows that after DDL's flip you had some sort of change of heart about llama. You did flip-flip. Almost everybody has been attesting to that. I wanted to know why you did. Is 'two baddies are unlikely to be on the main wagons D1' your final answer?
No.

I didn't.

Stop spreading the nonsense opinion that I did.

A: I was attempting to work in the phrases "Contempt" and "Band of Outsiders" into two sentences.
B: I felt like I was a little too hot on Llama. Hence the forgiving of contempt.
C: I was entertaining the notion that members of the D1 Llama wagon had impure intentions.
D: The sentence after those highlighted post says that I still think the logic against Llama is sound, which isn't something someone posts if they think a person is 100% civ.

Join us again next week for another episode of "Quin Tells INH What His Opinions Are!"
I do not know what Contempt and Band of Outsiders has to do with anything. Without that knowledge, you just came across as though you'd weaned off of your llama read.
They are both films by Jean-Luc Godard, who Mongoose referenced in her EOD post.

Well, you can keep your opinion on what I was thinking, and I'll just, you know, remember what I was thinking.

Are you willing to vote Llama or 3J today?

Hesitant to vote 3J, though a no lynch wouldn't be the worst thing in the world if he's being honest about his lynch immunity. I think he is, because Epi claimed an item as well and didn't seem off-put by 3J's claim.

I'm good to go with a llama vote.

I'll probably just drop my vote where the majority are.

insertnamehere wrote:
Quin wrote:
insertnamehere wrote:huh. well. looks like I need to re-assess some things and watch La Jetee on Flimstruck.

I'm not gonna lie, the result of this day left me breathless. Hopefully Llama forgives the contempt from earlier. Not sure what to think about the band of outsiders who voted alongside me for Llama. But still, it's my life to live, and my vote to give, so I'm still gonna defend the logic I used when I wrote a case against Llama. Anywho, I'll have more to say over the course of the week end.
The highlighted shows that after DDL's flip you had some sort of change of heart about llama. You did flip-flip. Almost everybody has been attesting to that. I wanted to know why you did. Is 'two baddies are unlikely to be on the main wagons D1' your final answer?
No.

I didn't.

Stop spreading the nonsense opinion that I did.

A: I was attempting to work in the phrases "Contempt" and "Band of Outsiders" into two sentences.
B: I felt like I was a little too hot on Llama. Hence the forgiving of contempt.
C: I was entertaining the notion that members of the D1 Llama wagon had impure intentions.
D: The sentence after those highlighted post says that I still think the logic against Llama is sound, which isn't something someone posts if they think a person is 100% civ.

Join us again next week for another episode of "Quin Tells INH What His Opinions Are!"

I do not know what Contempt and Band of Outsiders has to do with anything. Without that knowledge, you just came across as though you'd weaned off of your llama read.

Elohcin wrote:
JaggedJimmyJay wrote:
Elohcin wrote:I think that y'all need to give me at least day to prove myself, I would hope.
I don't necessarily oppose that notion, but if you were to receive that kind of "extension" it'd be vital that you use it to your fullest advantage. The only read of yours that I have an idea of is Quin; it'd be good to know how you feel about everyone else.
No pressure, right?

Well, after reading through the thread today, I have two suspicions.
#1 is Wilgy. Quiet...quiet...quiet....And then he is here with fire. Makes me wonder if he is bad, was laying low, and then suddenly felt the need to come in and defend himself because his teammates said so.
#2 is Epi. I know I kind of said this, but I replaced in and he was on me before I could post. Really? I understand there is a possibility that someone comes back bad, but don't you think you ought to give them a chance to at least speak first? If he is civ, I would think he would want to at least hear from me. If he is bad, jumping on me before I can even say anything is an amazing opportunity for him because he KNOWS I am no good at defending myself even if I am civ.

I would be willing to vote either Epi, Wilgy, or Quin today.

One of those is not a valid option.

insertnamehere wrote:
Quin wrote:
insertnamehere wrote:
insertnamehere wrote:
Quin wrote:
insertnamehere wrote:huh. well. looks like I need to re-assess some things and watch La Jetee on Flimstruck.

I'm not gonna lie, the result of this day left me breathless. Hopefully Llama forgives the contempt from earlier. Not sure what to think about the band of outsiders who voted alongside me for Llama. But still, it's my life to live, and my vote to give, so I'm still gonna defend the logic I used when I wrote a case against Llama. Anywho, I'll have more to say over the course of the week end.
Why does a baddie DDL flip clear llama? I don't see the posts in either guys ISO's that would point to that.
I don't think Llama is cleared by any means, but I'm not quite as hot on him as I was before DDL's flip-eroo.
This what I posted after the D1 EOD.

I personally don't see this a turnaround, and I dislike that people have miscatergorized it as such. I didn't mean that I thought Llama was civilian, simply that I had to re-assess my reads.

In fact, Llama is nowhere near off my radar and is currently my number two suspect, after Mista J.
Okay, but why have you singled out llama and inferred that your read has changed at all based on DDL's flip?
What do you mean "why have I singled out Llama?" I still suspect him for the reasons I suspected him on D1 for.

I just think, more often than not, two baddies aren't the two leading co-wagons on any D1. It was the first real point in Llama's favor.

Frankly, your insistence that it means nothing, and your pushing the "INH did a flip-flop on Llama" narrative makes me raise an eyebrow in your direction as well.

Part of the reason why I'm willing to lynch Llama is that I feel his alignment would directly affect my read on a few others in this game. I put you into that category.

The highlighted shows that after DDL's flip you had some sort of change of heart about llama. You did flip-flip. Almost everybody has been attesting to that. I wanted to know why you did. Is 'two baddies are unlikely to be on the main wagons D1' your final answer?

insertnamehere wrote:
insertnamehere wrote:
Quin wrote:
insertnamehere wrote:huh. well. looks like I need to re-assess some things and watch La Jetee on Flimstruck.

I'm not gonna lie, the result of this day left me breathless. Hopefully Llama forgives the contempt from earlier. Not sure what to think about the band of outsiders who voted alongside me for Llama. But still, it's my life to live, and my vote to give, so I'm still gonna defend the logic I used when I wrote a case against Llama. Anywho, I'll have more to say over the course of the week end.
Why does a baddie DDL flip clear llama? I don't see the posts in either guys ISO's that would point to that.
I don't think Llama is cleared by any means, but I'm not quite as hot on him as I was before DDL's flip-eroo.
This what I posted after the D1 EOD.

I personally don't see this a turnaround, and I dislike that people have miscatergorized it as such. I didn't mean that I thought Llama was civilian, simply that I had to re-assess my reads.

In fact, Llama is nowhere near off my radar and is currently my number two suspect, after Mista J.

Okay, but why have you singled out llama and inferred that your read has changed at all based on DDL's flip?

I intend to vote between llama and Boomslang. Keen to find out who stands where on that front, because it looks like there's gonna be a few wagons at this rate.

Wilgy, what's your GTH read on Boomslang?

DrWilgy wrote:
Metalmarsh89 wrote:
DrWilgy wrote:Hey, sorry I've been gone. Getting ready for the new semester (along with Wilgette's parents visiting) has made me busier than expected.

I'm going to skim rq and post thoughts.
Are they as adorable as she is?
Yes, but only half as tasty.

So I'm caught up and I see that several of you would like to cook me. Makes sense as all I've provided the last 2 days are excuses.

@Marmot my top 3 suspects are Llama, JJJ and idk.

I would've probably voted for JJJ yesterday had I been around, while mostly tonal, his stance on his suspects has been too rigid for what I expect of JJJ. I think a good comparison is his performance in Mad Max (civilian) where during my lynch he was jumping in and out of suspicion on multiple people. I'm not seeing anything comparable to Mad Max JJJ.

Nothing has improved my read on Llama, but his discussion with Quin yesterday has actually reinforced the negative tones I felt before. I suppose something that does make me doubt my original read on Llama slightly is the lack of INH. I don't know where his suspicion of Llama went even though it was similar to mine.

The part that throws me for a loop is that I feel no reason to remove the possibility that JJJ and Llama are teammates. A pattern of 2 high posters would normally cause me to assume that only 1 of them could be bad, but I do not feel that this time.

I'm finding it difficult to actually say that I have a 3rd suspect, but that could also be due to how pivotal this game has been. If I couldn't place a vote on Llama or JJJ, I may vote for INH or Epi.

INH, LC and Quin can I have you 3 let me know full reads on the other 2 in this group?

Niju, Marmot, and Epi can I have you 3 let me know full reads on the other 2 in this group?

I'm feeling okay about INH right now. I The only thing that's holding me back is his sudden change of opinion on llama after DDL's flip. That still remains unexplained. I would like it not to be.

I'm comfortable with LC. I think his heart is in the right place in this game, and other than our initial spat early on, I'm feeling some degree of sync between us in this game, which is nice.

Long Con's putting himself right out there by calling out 3J as a liar for suggesting he has lynch immunity today. I'd give that a thumbs up for attitude, although I'm not on board with the idea.

Sorsha wrote:But what if Eloh1.0 did block the doctor last night and thats why she ended up dying? Isn't it unfair to the doctor that the mafia team might have a clue as to who s/he is?

If she blocked the doctor, I don't see how that could provide any sort of clue at all. She wouldn't know that she was being protected, so she wouldn't have any sort of advantage if she subbed in as a baddie.

I stand by my thinking that Eloh 1.0 was a role blocker, and that her gripe against me is because of what she did with that role. Whatever she knows has been brought into the open by this point, so we're essentially on an even playing field, I think.

I'm number one.

I do not know why the doctor was not on Elohcin last night.

Scotty wrote:I see Quin is off the poll. Probably for the best.

Oh, cool.

Metalmarsh89 wrote:
Quin wrote:
Long Con wrote:
Scotty wrote:Silenced? No...as you said, he posted twice on day 2.
Day 2, going by the 24-hour lynch poll, ended at 8:47 EST. INH did not post until after the lynch poll ended, and I agree that he was likely silenced.

Confused? Maybe...I don't know what "confused" means in this context. 2 off-topic posts doesn't a confused player make. I don't buy that shit.
I saw no indication that anyone was posting in a confused manner. Perhaps the confusion isn't a posting restriction.

Scotty wrote:What secret inhibits your own posting?
I don't have the sense that Quin's posting has been inhibited in any way - can you explain what you mean by this?
Maybe he misinterpreted what I was saying there. I was saying that INH's lack of presence today could be due to him being affected by a secret role.
Why don't you ask inh?

I think he'll get the memo when he reads the thread.

Elohcin wrote:Fair enough. I can see one of the first two before the third. I just don't see mafia blocking themselves right after losing a guy in Day 1 lynch. But I understand your points. Just keep an open mind that my theory could also be true. I think it's weird that after no one was lynched everyone just backed off of him completely.

Don't worry, so do I.

Long Con wrote:
Scotty wrote:Silenced? No...as you said, he posted twice on day 2.
Day 2, going by the 24-hour lynch poll, ended at 8:47 EST. INH did not post until after the lynch poll ended, and I agree that he was likely silenced.

Confused? Maybe...I don't know what "confused" means in this context. 2 off-topic posts doesn't a confused player make. I don't buy that shit.
I saw no indication that anyone was posting in a confused manner. Perhaps the confusion isn't a posting restriction.

Scotty wrote:What secret inhibits your own posting?
I don't have the sense that Quin's posting has been inhibited in any way - can you explain what you mean by this?

Maybe he misinterpreted what I was saying there. I was saying that INH's lack of presence today could be due to him being affected by a secret role.

Elohcin wrote:
Quin wrote:Boomslang was singled out as being the survivor of the night kill, and both Jay and I were singled out in the lynch post. I think there was a tie. How are ties determined, Mongoose?
then he backpeddals and says this? What's up Quin?

huh

Scotty wrote:
Quin wrote:
Scotty wrote:Remember INH? Remember why we thought he was good? I don't.

insertnamehere wrote:huh. well. looks like I need to re-assess some things and watch La Jetee on Flimstruck.

I'm not gonna lie, the result of this day left me breathless. Hopefully Llama forgives the contempt from earlier. Not sure what to think about the band of outsiders who voted alongside me for Llama. But still, it's my life to live, and my vote to give, so I'm still gonna defend the logic I used when I wrote a case against Llama. Anywho, I'll have more to say over the course of the week end.
Didn't realize more to say over the course of the weekend was what should have been green OT text about his food preferences.

His llama vote looked shady and he's done absolutely no hunting or contributing since day 1.

So...

For those of you that have gleaned civ vibes from him: why?
INH hasn't posted on topic once today and his vote was just *there* all of a sudden. I'd say he's likely silenced or confused. Or secreted.
Silenced? No...as you said, he posted twice on day 2. Confused? Maybe...I don't know what "confused" means in this context. 2 off-topic posts doesn't a confused player make. I don't buy that shit.

What secret inhibits your own posting?

Either way I'll want to hear more from him tomorrow and see whether it was a fluke or he's just coasting on propane

I don't know what the limitations of being silenced entail. Both his posts were off-topic, and after the lynch poll closed, so I think it's worth considering. He did vote, and I'm not sure whether hosts let silenced players do that. I wouldn't say it's confused either. I think I'd expect INH to have to post to a sort of restriction, rather than not at all. Secrets are secrets; they're worth mentioning.

Scotty wrote:Remember INH? Remember why we thought he was good? I don't.

insertnamehere wrote:huh. well. looks like I need to re-assess some things and watch La Jetee on Flimstruck.

I'm not gonna lie, the result of this day left me breathless. Hopefully Llama forgives the contempt from earlier. Not sure what to think about the band of outsiders who voted alongside me for Llama. But still, it's my life to live, and my vote to give, so I'm still gonna defend the logic I used when I wrote a case against Llama. Anywho, I'll have more to say over the course of the week end.
Didn't realize more to say over the course of the weekend was what should have been green OT text about his food preferences.

His llama vote looked shady and he's done absolutely no hunting or contributing since day 1.

So...

For those of you that have gleaned civ vibes from him: why?

INH hasn't posted on topic once today and his vote was just *there* all of a sudden. I'd say he's likely silenced or confused. Or secreted.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:
Metalmarsh89 wrote:
JaggedJimmyJay wrote:
Metalmarsh89 wrote:If Quin was a particular civilian that can't be lynched, why would he maintain that the lynch was a tie and not just shrug his shoulders?
Some people don't like to be viewed as "cleared" for fear of a night kill.
Some people like to lynch people who aren't cleared because goodness knows we don't know what else to do with them.
That's a bizarre mindset. I don't feel that way.

The results for Quin here aren't totally conclusive but I'd call them a net positive.

I'd call them nothing. There was a tie which Mongoose didn't break. You can't deduce anything from any of that.

Epignosis wrote:
Quin wrote:
Epignosis wrote:There is no role to save mafia from a lynch. That clears Quin, I should think. You have to make some assumptions to consider otherwise.
No it doesn't.
Fine. I suspect you again.

And all is good in the world.

Either way, I think that means the lynch ended in a tie.

Epignosis wrote:There is no role to save mafia from a lynch. That clears Quin, I should think. You have to make some assumptions to consider otherwise.

No it doesn't.

Long Con wrote:
Quin wrote:
thellama73 wrote:Very interesting. Could it be thta Quin is the unlynchable role? He seemed very unconcerned in the run up to the lynch.

No. I'd just gotten all my legacy reads out of the way and had nothing else to talk about.
Getting back right into it - why didn't you consider the possibility of Jay being the unlynchable role? A very strong point was made that there was vote manipulation going on.
I would like to note that my point was not "very strong" in the sense that I was implying that my own vote was anything but a single, regular one. I believe Quin is the Denim Shirt, not JJJ.

Boomslang was singled out as being the survivor of the night kill, and both Jay and I were singled out in the lynch post. I think there was a tie. How are ties determined, Mongoose?

thellama73 wrote:Very interesting. Could it be thta Quin is the unlynchable role? He seemed very unconcerned in the run up to the lynch.

No. I'd just gotten all my legacy reads out of the way and had nothing else to talk about.

Getting back right into it - why didn't you consider the possibility of Jay being the unlynchable role? A very strong point was made that there was vote manipulation going on.

I've discovered a new love for old SNES games. I'm playing Lufia right now.

linki: Mafia and driving? Abhorrent.

Might make cheese toast. What's in store for everyone else's day?

twiddles thumbs

I hope I've got the vote manipulators on my side

Will A Person throw a wrench into the poll? Find out next time.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:I get mislynched so rarely. Oddly therapeutic if it happens. Like a much needed vacation. Good luck civs, I'm still rooting for you.

You're not even dead yet

Could go either way. I'm enjoying the suspense.

Metalmarsh89 wrote:
thellama73 wrote:Sorsha already voted.
Oh man, pressure's on.

I'll likely vote Quin. I think he's more likely to be mafia than Jay.

I think you should reconsider.

Friendly reminder not to trust Boomslang simply because he was the target of the night kill.

Epignosis wrote:
Quin wrote:
Metalmarsh89 wrote:
Quin wrote:
Metalmarsh89 wrote:
JaggedJimmyJay wrote:
thellama73 wrote:I'm increasingly willing to believe that 3J has been playing a super-helpful, positive baddie game. Not sold on it, but increasingly willing to believe it.
What does this say to you about Quin, who hates my guts?
He didn't suspect you until after the theory of a roleblock came out and that he was the killer. That sort of timing doesn't benefit my read of you.
This is wrong. I started to suspect him after he posted his initial feel-good/bad reads on Day 0.
No, you chatted with him on Day 0, questioned him on Day 1, projected your feelings on him, agree with him about llama, bantered with him, didn't include him in your reads when asked, and finally asked if he was llama's teammate on Day 2.

Sorry, but I don't buy it. You didn't "suspect" Jay until it was an extension of a suspicion of llama.

Would you believe me if I told you I was hiding my explicit read on him until I had something more substantial to work with?
I don't see why you would do that. Put a knife to his throat and make him talk if you think he's bad. Don't wait for something substantial. Make something substantial. Instead you used your time and energy having at it with llama.

Well llama's bad too, so it wasn't a waste of my time and energy.

I put my thoughts into the thread. It's not hard to infer a read from it.

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