The Syndicate

Akemi Homura

Ricochet wrote:
ika wrote:
Ricochet wrote:
Finally, I have a question: why was your impression, after Night 3 kill, that scum is not paying attention? Gleam actually killed one of the two cop-confirmed players. What should have he done instead?
Well, i felt like knowing who the cop was that scums werent paying full attention, i would of killed someone more vocal in the game. expicaly when that case was built

FMPOV knowing mingus was town confirmed i would of gone for tht
Mingus wasn't town confirmed, Voopy only got Vince as his D0 peek (I randomized among vanilla civs), then checked Coltrane and Holiday (who concomittantly died). It was fun to watch how everyone took from his posts whatever he thought was legit. Vompatti is such a chaos maker.

Haha I knew it! Great game everyone.

Akemi Homura

I literally just did. You are unfathomable.

Akemi Homura

Chris Potter wrote:
Charles Mingus wrote:
Chris Potter wrote:There must be a very good reason why Vompatti placed a vote on you, Mingus. He chose not to lynch anyone on day 1. Did he check you? That's what I ask myself. Perhaps you're the baddie after all.

Ornette Coleman wrote:Mingus is a confirmed civ.
Shit, I didn't pay attention. Sorry for that. Still weird that he put a vote on you, though, but hey it's Vompatti...

That "hey it's Vompatti" comment sure clashes with your previous "There must be a very good reason" comment.

Akemi Homura

I don't oppose a Dixon lynch but Potter is actually looking worse to me right now, and since his lynch seems more likely than Fleck's then I'm moving to Potter.

Akemi Homura

We've clogged up enough of the thread with this garbage, I don't see any progress being made here.

Akemi Homura

Bela Fleck wrote:
Charles Mingus wrote:
Bela Fleck wrote: the orignal convo was about the sockguess vs sock assume you changed it entirely, if they ar enot the same plz tell me.
They're not the same. That's what I did tell you. How the hell did I change the subject lmao?
you never explaiend how thye were diffrent, you jsut said "no not same"

I didn't know I actually needed to explain to you how guessing and assuming are not the same thing, holy shit. A guess is not set in stone, other options can be considered. An assumption on the other hand does not consider other options. A guess would be "You might be Epi but I don't have any proof" while an assumption is "You're Epi but I don't have any proof".

Akemi Homura

Bela Fleck wrote:
Charles Mingus wrote: And do you realize that your being consciously aware of what your town meta is means that you can emulate it when you're not town, and that no one in their right mind is going to take your word for it when you use meta defenses as the only reason why you've been consistently scummy throughout the game?
And you would realzie that silver knows me better then anyone and if i was scum she would of died n1?

do you realize that not everyon can jsut go "ok change meta" like you say?

do you relaize i will use meta defense all the time? and that fi you scum read me for it you can never accurately read me?

You can't prove that you would always kill Silver on Night 1 every single game you play with her, you can't even prove that to yourself. That's not something that one can "realize" because it's subject to change.

You don't even need to go "ok change meta" to consciously emulate your town play. Literally every scum player with more than a couple of games worth of experience does that without even thinking or going out of their way to attempt to do so. Meta defenses mean nothing.

I don't scum read you for having meta defenses by themselves, I'm scum reading you because you've been consistently disingenuous, opportunistic, and manipulative throughout the game. The meta defenses just don't help change my mind is all.

Akemi Homura

Bela Fleck wrote: the orignal convo was about the sockguess vs sock assume you changed it entirely, if they ar enot the same plz tell me.

They're not the same. That's what I did tell you. How the hell did I change the subject lmao?

Akemi Homura

Bela Fleck wrote:
Charles Mingus wrote:
Thats not the point at all and your missing my poitn entirely, it doest matter if you follow it or not, its a matter of whats laid out.
Either I don't understand or you're avoiding a legitimate response. Either way, please elaborate.

my point is this: he is cop with the supposive clears he had, even if you dont take it as godspell, you have at least considered it. even your psoting now shows you ahev at least had a thoguht of it.

SO no matter what ange you take at this, its hipoctical of you to yell at us abotu this stuff when you are guilty of doing it yourself[/quote]
If this is your point then I wasn't missing it at all to begin with. I've already explained why it's not hypocritical of me to "yell" at Coltrane and Potter and if you're going to pretend that explanation doesn't exist then be my guest. I've repeated myself enough with you already.

Akemi Homura

Bela Fleck wrote:
Charles Mingus wrote:
Bela Fleck wrote:
Charles Mingus wrote:
Bela Fleck wrote:
Charles Mingus wrote:You know what's funny?

What's funny is that you claim to have thought that Coleman was the cop before the flip, partly because he said at one point that I was confirmed civ, yet at the time he said that, you were still advocating that I was a baddie.
i know i was, i did it intetionaly, like i said, POE wins out every time
What does either lying about reading me as bad or lying about thinking Coleman was the cop have to do with process of elimination?
i already explined the cop scnario thing, the lyign is wifom galore
And you do realize that, especially in this case, that WIFOM is working against a civ read of you and not in favor of it, right?
And do you realize, especially in my case, i dont give a damn whats works for and aganist me? do you realzie that eveythign you are askign em is town me?

And do you realize that your being consciously aware of what your town meta is means that you can emulate it when you're not town, and that no one in their right mind is going to take your word for it when you use meta defenses as the only reason why you've been consistently scummy throughout the game?

Akemi Homura

Bela Fleck wrote:
Charles Mingus wrote:
Bela Fleck wrote:
Charles Mingus wrote:
Bela Fleck wrote:
Ricochet wrote:Sockguessing is up to you, if you think it serves the game.[/u][/b]
You're not sockguessing, you're sockassuming.
same thing overall
Right like how "confirmed civ" is the same thing overall as "Bela Fleck thinks they are civ". Is Newspeak your native language?
im sorry are apples now oranges?

you gonna adress the orional point or not? way to change subjects

What original point? How did I change subjects? What was the original subject and which subject did I change it to? Why is your tongue brown?

Akemi Homura

Bela Fleck wrote:
Charles Mingus wrote: You wonder why I haven't been responding to you that much and this is why. Yet again,, even after I've outright stated it, you miss my point completely. My point against Coltrane (as well as Potter) is that they wanted to take Coleman's words as gospel while both simultaneously suspecting me. Since I, unlike them, refuse to take Coleman's words as gospel, then it's not hypocritical for me to still suspect Coltrane. Another thing that helps my argument for not taking Coleman's words as gospel is because Potter was using Coleman's temporary vote for me to justify a suspicion, while conveniently ignoring when he said that I was confirmed civ. Since he's not wrong about the temporary vote and not wrong to wonder why that temporary vote was cast, it calls Coleman's actions into question.
Thats not the point at all and your missing my poitn entirely, it doest matter if you follow it or not, its a matter of whats laid out.

Either I don't understand or you're avoiding a legitimate response. Either way, please elaborate.

Akemi Homura

Bela Fleck wrote:
Charles Mingus wrote:
Bela Fleck wrote:
Charles Mingus wrote:You know what's funny?

What's funny is that you claim to have thought that Coleman was the cop before the flip, partly because he said at one point that I was confirmed civ, yet at the time he said that, you were still advocating that I was a baddie.
i know i was, i did it intetionaly, like i said, POE wins out every time
What does either lying about reading me as bad or lying about thinking Coleman was the cop have to do with process of elimination?
i already explined the cop scnario thing, the lyign is wifom galore

And you do realize that, especially in this case, that WIFOM is working against a civ read of you and not in favor of it, right?

Akemi Homura

Bela Fleck wrote:
Charles Mingus wrote:
Bela Fleck wrote:
Ricochet wrote:Sockguessing is up to you, if you think it serves the game.[/u][/b]
You're not sockguessing, you're sockassuming.
same thing overall

Right like how "confirmed civ" is the same thing overall as "Bela Fleck thinks they are civ". Is Newspeak your native language?

Akemi Homura

Bela Fleck wrote:
Charles Mingus wrote:
Bela Fleck wrote:
Charles Mingus wrote:I will oppose any lynch that isn't Coltrane, Dixon, or Fleck.
Hye look mingus did the same thing!

isnt it funny how the pot and kettle ar eblack
What do you mean the same thing? Elaborate.

Ornette Coleman wrote:John Coltrane is a confirmed civ.
your post used someon else who is cop cleared. so you bitching about us is hiporcitcal consideing you ddi the same, hence the prhase "pot meet kettle, both are black"

You wonder why I haven't been responding to you that much and this is why. Yet again,, even after I've outright stated it, you miss my point completely. My point against Coltrane (as well as Potter) is that they wanted to take Coleman's words as gospel while both simultaneously suspecting me. Since I, unlike them, refuse to take Coleman's words as gospel, then it's not hypocritical for me to still suspect Coltrane. Another thing that helps my argument for not taking Coleman's words as gospel is because Potter was using Coleman's temporary vote for me to justify a suspicion, while conveniently ignoring when he said that I was confirmed civ. Since he's not wrong about the temporary vote and not wrong to wonder why that temporary vote was cast, it calls Coleman's actions into question.

Akemi Homura

Bela Fleck wrote:
Ricochet wrote:Sockguessing is up to you, if you think it serves the game.[/u][/b]

You're not sockguessing, you're sockassuming.

Akemi Homura

Bela Fleck wrote:
Charles Mingus wrote:I will oppose any lynch that isn't Coltrane, Dixon, or Fleck.
Hye look mingus did the same thing!

isnt it funny how the pot and kettle ar eblack

What do you mean the same thing? Elaborate.

Akemi Homura

Bela Fleck wrote:Plus epi, you used a lot fo meta here for someone who says they dont use it

Please stop using non-sock account names to refer to players that aren't dead yet.

Akemi Homura

Bela Fleck wrote:
Charles Mingus wrote:You know what's funny?

What's funny is that you claim to have thought that Coleman was the cop before the flip, partly because he said at one point that I was confirmed civ, yet at the time he said that, you were still advocating that I was a baddie.
i know i was, i did it intetionaly, like i said, POE wins out every time

What does either lying about reading me as bad or lying about thinking Coleman was the cop have to do with process of elimination?

Akemi Homura

But of course I shouldn't single out Fleck for doing essentially the same thing Coltrane did more recently.

John Coltrane wrote:
Charles Mingus wrote:I will oppose any lynch that isn't Coltrane, Dixon, or Fleck.
Wow This makes me not want to lynch Dixon, are you mafia man? Since I'd expect town to be more observant and not say we should Lycnh two people who could be easily mislynches, espacilly since one is cop cleared. This is a sloppy bandwagon attempt.

John Coltrane wrote:If you look at the posts of our cop, then yeah you can puzzle out who might be a confirmed civ.

Akemi Homura

Haha oh look a silent vote for Dixon.

Akemi Homura

Ornette Coleman wrote:Mingus is a confirmed civ.

About two and a half hours later...

Bela Fleck wrote:So its between mingus/hiromi like silver said.

Akemi Homura

You know what's funny?

What's funny is that you claim to have thought that Coleman was the cop before the flip, partly because he said at one point that I was confirmed civ, yet at the time he said that, you were still advocating that I was a baddie.

Akemi Homura

Bela Fleck wrote:Or we can jsu accpt those are his to clears and move on like i knew after his flip

Sure, we could. But by accepting that we would also have to accept a lot of contradictory behavior in Coleman's ISO, which wouldn't be wise.

Akemi Homura

I think that's supported by his frequent unexplained vote changes, more than once voting for himself.

Akemi Homura

Hiromi Uehara wrote:
Charles Mingus wrote:Vompatti didn't clear me lol, just like he didn't clear Coltrane. Are we forgetting that our cop said this:

Ornette Coleman wrote:To be honest I would be voting for no lynch if I didn't have four votes on myself. Hiromi is a possible baddie, but not a confirmed one. I think it would be wise if we all thought this through and voted for no lynch. Remember, a mislynch is no less likely than the baddies accidentally killing one of their own during the night phase!
I think that just means he didn't feel comfortable with lynching me. I don't think this post has much to do with you or Coltrane.

My point is that nothing the "cop" said can be taken at face value. We shouldn't blindly accept any statement that Coleman made, because Coleman is Vompatti and his methods often have ulterior motives. I think the cop wanted us to question things, even himself.

Akemi Homura

Vompatti didn't clear me lol, just like he didn't clear Coltrane. Are we forgetting that our cop said this:

Ornette Coleman wrote:To be honest I would be voting for no lynch if I didn't have four votes on myself. Hiromi is a possible baddie, but not a confirmed one. I think it would be wise if we all thought this through and voted for no lynch. Remember, a mislynch is no less likely than the baddies accidentally killing one of their own during the night phase!

Akemi Homura

Hiromi Uehara wrote:Mingus, I'll ask again now that we know who the cop is. Why are you still convinced I am a civilian?

We knew who the cop was the first time you asked.

And I already gave you my answer here:

Charles Mingus wrote:It's what you haven't done, and that is to ping me. The fact that you haven't said or done anything that I find suspicious combined with the baffling amount of heat you've been getting that has all been based on little to no legitimate reasoning makes me think that the last baddie is trying to get you mislynched.

Akemi Homura

Chris Potter wrote:There must be a very good reason why Vompatti placed a vote on you, Mingus. He chose not to lynch anyone on day 1. Did he check you? That's what I ask myself. Perhaps you're the baddie after all.

Ornette Coleman wrote:Mingus is a confirmed civ.

Akemi Homura

Bela Fleck wrote:
Ricochet wrote: Ornette Coleman - [ Posts ] - LYNCHED Day 3: 'Jazz', Civilian cop
Hey mingus, whos not paying attention now

(the point)

(your head)

Akemi Homura

Chris Potter wrote:Mingus, Coleman was the cop.

No, Vompatti was the cop.

Akemi Homura

John Coltrane wrote:If you look at the posts of our cop, then yeah you can puzzle out who might be a confirmed civ.

We don't know who the cop is, and like I said, everyone has been throwing around the term "confirmed civ" like the word "confirmed" means "in my personal opinion" to them. And no, I don't think you're the cop.

Akemi Homura

It's what you haven't done, and that is to ping me. The fact that you haven't said or done anything that I find suspicious combined with the baffling amount of heat you've been getting that has all been based on little to no legitimate reasoning makes me think that the last baddie is trying to get you mislynched.

Akemi Homura

Akemi Homura

John Coltrane wrote:Also how is Hirome confirmed civ? I don't recall the cop saying that?

Charles Mingus wrote:
Bela Fleck wrote:
Why? shes confirmed civ.

how about we push you? how come you were so adiment to save tito?
Why push me? I'm confirmed civ. Is this a running joke that I'm not in on or is everyone in this game really deluding themselves to think that their strongest town reads are more than reads and that in fact that they know...for a fact, that the people they think are town are actually the people that they know are town, and that everyone else knows this as well, or at least they should. What am I missing? Because every time since the start of the game someone has referred to someone else as a "confirmed civ" I've failed to see the basis for such a bold claim or if it's just humorous then I'm missing the humor.

Billie Holiday is not a confirmed civ. There are no confirmed civs. Get over it.

Get it? It's a joke. Because there are no confirmed civs.

Hiromi Uehara wrote:Mingus, why the sudden faith in my civvieness?

Wow Hiromi, just wow. If you were paying any attention at all you would know that it's not exactly sudden.

Charles Mingus wrote:So Coltrane is voting for Hiromi because he doesn't believe in WIFOM, Coleman is voting for Hiromi to save his ass, and Fleck is voting for Hiromi because he wouldn't dare vote for the same player I'm voting for. What a sorry excuse for a counterwagon.

Charles Mingus wrote:
Bela Fleck wrote:
Charles Mingus wrote:So Coltrane is voting for Hiromi because he doesn't believe in WIFOM, Coleman is voting for Hiromi to save his ass, and Fleck is voting for Hiromi because he wouldn't dare vote for the same player I'm voting for. What a sorry excuse for a counterwagon.
Or maybe cus of POE that has been stated, and you complain abotu misrepresenttion
Wrong again, you don't even suspect Hiromi. If you did then you would've given a reason why you do by now.

Charles Mingus wrote:This is one instance where knowing the player behind the sock would have changed my mind completely, quite a shame. I still don't see any actual reasons for suspecting Hiromi yet and I will fight a lynch against her tomorrow.

Charles Mingus wrote:I think it's more likely that whoever killed Vince was doing so in an attempt to make Hiromi an easy mislynch for today. I'm putting my money on John Coltrane being the last baddie since I don't think the development of his opinions over the course of the game feels natural, both the ones I agree and disagree with. But it could also be Fleck still.

Charles Mingus wrote:
Bela Fleck wrote:
Charles Mingus wrote:I think it's more likely that whoever killed Vince was doing so in an attempt to make Hiromi an easy mislynch for today. I'm putting my money on John Coltrane being the last baddie since I don't think the development of his opinions over the course of the game feels natural, both the ones I agree and disagree with. But it could also be Fleck still.
Or himori is just scum removing suspects? I mean occam razor is simpler to use
RIght, because HIromi being scum is the option with the fewest assumptions.

Akemi Homura

Although I'm still inclined to lean towards the last baddie being you Mr. Fleck. I don't think that much misrepresentation and disingenuous behavior could be accidental. Either you're doing it deliberately to manipulate the direction the game is going or you're doing it deliberately to frustrate people and demand attention. I hope it's the former.

Akemi Homura

Bela Fleck wrote:
Charles Mingus wrote:I will oppose any lynch that isn't Coltrane, Dixon, or Fleck.
Coltain is cop cleared.

Its himori or Dixon

Then it's Dixon. Hiromi is confirmed civ.

Akemi Homura

I will oppose any lynch that isn't Coltrane, Dixon, or Fleck.

Akemi Homura

I forgot all about Dixon, I could get behind him being lynched as well.

Akemi Homura

This is long overdue.

Akemi Homura

Mr. Fleck

Akemi Homura

Bela Fleck wrote:
Charles Mingus wrote:I think it's more likely that whoever killed Vince was doing so in an attempt to make Hiromi an easy mislynch for today. I'm putting my money on John Coltrane being the last baddie since I don't think the development of his opinions over the course of the game feels natural, both the ones I agree and disagree with. But it could also be Fleck still.
Or himori is just scum removing suspects? I mean occam razor is simpler to use

RIght, because HIromi being scum is the option with the fewest assumptions.

Akemi Homura

I think it's more likely that whoever killed Vince was doing so in an attempt to make Hiromi an easy mislynch for today. I'm putting my money on John Coltrane being the last baddie since I don't think the development of his opinions over the course of the game feels natural, both the ones I agree and disagree with. But it could also be Fleck still.

Akemi Homura

Here's some smooth jazz for those of us disappointed that Mr. Kenny G isn't present.

Akemi Homura

John Coltrane wrote:Dixon is most likely mafia. He was the other counterwagon day 1 yet neither tito nor bubles voted for or pushed his wagon. Dixon also didn't vote for Buble's AND he didn't vote for tito. TWO times he didn't vote for mafia, and for day 2 actively tried to get Fleck lynched over tito.

I could get behind a Dixon lynch tomorrow but I'd prefer to ISO everyone first before I vote. I won't publicize whatever I might find, however.

Akemi Homura

This is one instance where knowing the player behind the sock would have changed my mind completely, quite a shame. I still don't see any actual reasons for suspecting Hiromi yet and I will fight a lynch against her tomorrow.

Akemi Homura

Bela Fleck wrote:
Charles Mingus wrote:So Coltrane is voting for Hiromi because he doesn't believe in WIFOM, Coleman is voting for Hiromi to save his ass, and Fleck is voting for Hiromi because he wouldn't dare vote for the same player I'm voting for. What a sorry excuse for a counterwagon.
Or maybe cus of POE that has been stated, and you complain abotu misrepresenttion

Wrong again, you don't even suspect Hiromi. If you did then you would've given a reason why you do by now.

Akemi Homura

At this point, a Coleman lynch is a no-brainer.

Akemi Homura

Vince and HIromi haven't voted yet, even though they were both here recently and may still be here now.

Akemi Homura

So Coltrane is voting for Hiromi because he doesn't believe in WIFOM, Coleman is voting for Hiromi to save his ass, and Fleck is voting for Hiromi because he wouldn't dare vote for the same player I'm voting for. What a sorry excuse for a counterwagon.

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