The Syndicate

That is what happened to me as well, FZ. But I have no knowledge of role changes personally. Just no more fun BTS partners </3

Long Con wrote:
Ricochet wrote:@LC: Because I don't understand what's on topic about it. TH is not even in this game.
Damn... picked a random player there. How chumpy of me.

I'm not irrelevant. Any conversation that's not about elephants is irrelephant. I'm playing on gut because it's the new cool. If we lynch S~V~S, we can get a baddie.

Nah.

Linki~ have roles changed? As far as I know mine has not. I did not get a PM from the host, in any case.

Yeah, really? Why am I sketchy?

No it isn't a responsibility, but being helpful to the civs IS a responsibility if you are one. Just saying.

And how is this implying anything about you?:

Since you ask about Elizabeths messages, while her old message had some truth in it re Epi, she did not have info, so I got the impression it was just a "let's start discussion" ploy by naming two of the most aggressive players out of the gate. I have no real opinion on Blooper but she tends to be a gray area for me in general. So far I am not alarmed by Zomba.

No mention of you, no snide remarks or implication about you. No *you* whatsoever.

I did not vote before, but I am going to do so now. The whole "not my responsibility" is possibly one of the least civvie like statements I have ever seen in a Mafia game.

Linki @Ricochet, then ignore that up there ^^

Linki@ Zomba~ any opinion on Ninjajujube?

Also, I want to ask, why is everyone suddenly posting links, not quotes? It is really hard to navigate the thread on phone with the links rather than quotes. If you want the post in context, adding the link is an awesome idea, but navigating links can be harder for some people. K, Thanks <3

The poll; why didn't you post the poll before. I posted right after you, I thought it would have been clear, sorry

. People have been talking about the confusion re the poll since day ended, and you had a screenshot, and did not post it?

And I though that your whole post felt bad, it felt like you knew why Epi survived, and you were trying too hard to explain it.

And yes, you asked for others opinions on the Gossip posts, and I gave mine. That's all. Why are you defensive about that?

Linki, yeah, on Day One when there had not been days of discussion, lol. I love changeable votes, as of now I am pretty sure and at this time I want to put my money where my mouth is. I can always realign my investments at a later time, though.

Why didn't you post that before?

I am going to vote for you at this time. I think Llama made some good points, and this post:

Ricochet wrote:It's true that we don't know what the Host would do in case of a tie, but it's still an option. As you've said, the easy interpretation is that Margret Reed was a LC voter and thus brought it back to a tie. The subtle interpretation is that Epignosis had a secret power preventing him altogether from being lynched. Due to the complementary nature of the Weather/Hunger forces, a guess would be something like "neither of them can be day lynched as long as the other is alive".

Another guess, but without fully knowing if this can actually be true from the rules, would be that their protections extend to or are in effect on the Day. So Hunger opted on N0 to protect Epignosis (since killing was not allowed) and the protection ran through Day 1. Thus, Epignosis nonchalantly didn't mind the lynch train he himself set and that is also what he meant by the "I can read" part: "You can decide whether to let someone starve to death on even nights or protect Weather." The starving part is basically a night kill, but the protection could in fact take place outside the Night phase.

...seriously pinged the living daylights out of me.

Since you ask about Elizabeths messages, while her old message had some truth in it re Epi, she did not have info, so

I got the impression it was just a "let's start discussion" ploy by naming two of the most aggressive players out of the gate. I have no real opinion on Blooper but she tends to be a gray area for me in general. So far I am not alarmed by Zomba.

Before I vote I want to reread MM to see why he was killed, perhaps that will give me some guidance that my instincts are correct. Then i likely will vote early myself. I disagree with you, Ricochet, about early voting. I think *bad* bandwagons tend to form late in the day when people come in wanting to vote, but not being really being caught up, and a last minute "catch" gets people into that pitchfork waving frenzy without giving the focus of the votes time to respond.

Zomberella12 wrote:
Ricochet wrote:By making a strong, credible case against someone you think is bad. Isn't that the essence of this game?
Right now, I have no information about anyone bad; only information about people who are good.

Implying you have info in and of itself is info of a sort. Ask the host for clarification, or you teammates since in this game we are lucky enough to have them

TBH, you should probably be asking the host or your BTS partners this, since you have them, re what is and is not acceptable.

Linki~ Rox may not have put Splints on the poll since she is a replacement. Sometimes hosts do that.

Zomba, I was not trying to discourage you. I was just saying that in general discussing who is what civvie role is not done. For the most part, yeah, the baddies can figure it out. But more than once when i was bad something someone said in thread got was a "Eureka" moment about who to NK.

It was advice, not a criticism

Zomberella12 wrote:
MovingPictures07 wrote:
Zomberella12 wrote:
MovingPictures07 wrote:RIP MM. BIH Epi.

So my Weather/Hunger lunch stop theory was right??? ..... Cool!
What was your weather/hunger lunch stop theory?
I think that weather killed tamsen and hunger tried to kill someone who cannot be NK'd instead of protecting weather. Also, Levina used one of her three kills to get Epig.
I thought Epi didn't care about getting lynched because Weather/Hunger had a secret (not stated) lunch stop. It appears that might have actually been true.
Or Jacob Donner did a lunch stop to protect Elizabeth Donner (who I think might be Llama).

Just an FYI, it is considered bad form to identify who you think to be a civvie role in the thread.

RIP Metalmarsh

And I guess Epi was a baddie

yeah, I love secret secrets, too. That way all the "Oh so & so must be role X becasue blah blah"

With Secret secrets that doesn't happen.

Roxy eats logic crumbs for breakfast. No logic crumbs for you.

i know k

Good to know.

For now. For tomorrow we may all change

Zomberella12 wrote:Okay - then here's what I THINK:

1) MP and Epi are not Donners.
2) Llama or SVS wrote the message from Mrs. Donner.
3) The lunch was stopped by a tie (can someone give me a tally of the ending votes?) or by Jacob Donner (I don't have a theory for why unless LC is Jacob Donner).
4) Epi somehow predicted that the lunch would be stopped (he is a Reed and they planned a tie vote? or is he a Donner?), either way, I don't think Epi is bad - for now
5) Maybe Epi guessed that SVS wrote the message from Mrs. Donner (or not) either way, SVS seemed to think that he did, so I don't think that SVS is bad either - for now.
6) If SVS wrote the message from Mrs. Donner then Llama might be bad. LC might also be bad, based on my initial gut reaction to his posts (non-info dumping related - based on his lack of analysis and "latching on" on).
7) I suspect that Snowman might be bad but SVS defended him so he might also be a Donner.

That is all.

Llama was taken off the poll. I believe that is a Donner only function. Interesting deductions; I don't agree with all of them, but I can totally see why you think what you think.

The problem here is that this is all likely to change tomorrow.

FZ. wrote:
Long Con wrote:
FZ. wrote:Had I just said that the probability of him being a baddie was higher for me because he wasn't a Donner, and then voted for him, would you not know he's not on my team?
But then there's also a possibility of you being a Donner as well. You gave out two juicy tidbits: you're not a Donner, and you're not on Epig's team.
That maybe true, but basically you're asking me not to voice any conclusions I have from the game. Didn't Elizabeth Donner info dump as well by letting everyone know Epi was not a Donner?

In a more typical game, that kind of statement would be a throwaway as there is no, or limited, civ BTS. But in this game, Rox has balanced all that civ BTS with the role change dynamic. So Elizabeth did expose Epi & MP iirc as "not Donners" but tomorrow one or both of them may well be Donners.

So

i am thinking of it more as a conversation starter than as "info dumping".

She kinda scares me a bit....

Yeah, there is a young man amongst us, not too young iirc, but we still want to avoid George Carlins 7 Words.

S~V~S wrote:

doh

Zomberella12 wrote:
S~V~S wrote:4 is a LOST number.
Changing to 4 b/c I want SVS to like me.

That's so sweet <3

4 is a LOST number.

Epignosis wrote:
S~V~S wrote:
Epignosis wrote:She danced around a vote for me.

She easily voted for you when she had elsewhere expressed a distaste for voting for new people (welcome by the way).

She criticized my methods but didn't vote for me.

All of this is antithetical to what I believe a good S~V~S would do.
Nah, I am good. And I think you know it. We can change votes here unlike in Film. But I totally dislike her analysis on Snowman, whom I believe to be good.

So this reaction makes me feel OK about switching my vote to you. Thanks for giving me a clear reaction so quickly
Ah. Again with what I know.

So something you posted weeks ago in another game before this game began was something you were cognizant of when you voted for Zomberella in order to gauge my reaction?

Talk about skillful planning.

Also i have no clue what you are talking about here, lambikins.

Yeah, Epi, you did for a little while. I hope someone caught that poll, i just came in here to do it, and it was gone.

But it seems quite a few people know he isn't on their team as well as not being a Donner. So

nijuukyugou wrote:
Metalmarsh89 wrote:Can we not lynch Epi? I wanted to play mafia with him.
Agreed. I thought I'd see some insight reading through the thread why he and LC are the top candidates. It seems Epi's being voted for being Epi. Let the man play, for God's sake! :P LC seems to be voted because of (possibly fake?) infodumping, even though others have seemingly done the same, and given this as a reason to vote Epi (the whole "it's probability" thing). And now LC's voted himself. So many self votes and switches. Is there something I'm missing? There's definitely some weirdness going on here. Weird game. So let's make it interesting.

Let's make it a tie and see what happens.

I thought people were voting for Epi becasue of FZ's theory about probability. I voted for him because of how he reacted to my vote for Zomba. I think he knows I am not bad, and he voted for me anyhow.

In any case all the self voting, yikes.

It might work in his favor if he unvotes himself

Metalmarsh89 wrote:
S~V~S wrote:It was a changeable vote and I changed it after it got some reaction. I thought it was a baddie thing to say, though.
I was lynched when I did a similar thing on Day 1.

And you were a civvie

This just proves my point that this is a civvies thing to do. We were just not aware of it when you did it

Like I said, I am sure Epi has figured out I am not bad at this time, and he voted for me anyhow.

It was a changeable vote and I changed it after it got some reaction. I thought it was a baddie thing to say, though.

Epignosis wrote:She danced around a vote for me.

She easily voted for you when she had elsewhere expressed a distaste for voting for new people (welcome by the way).

She criticized my methods but didn't vote for me.

All of this is antithetical to what I believe a good S~V~S would do.

Nah, I am good. And I think you know it. We can change votes here unlike in Film. But I totally dislike her analysis on Snowman, whom I believe to be good.

So this reaction makes me feel OK about switching my vote to you. Thanks for giving me a clear reaction so quickly

I am going to vote now since we can change. Voting for Zomberella; I was not a fan of her assessment of Snowmans. I know she knows him irl, but i thought she was putting the most sinister twist possible on his thoughts.

Semantics. You know what i meant. People who try to feel superior through word quibbles are not scary, IMO. You used to scare me, but i found a new POV.

Flase. You talk about how scary you are all the time.

edit by way of post

S~V~S wrote:
Zomberella12 wrote:
Zomberella12 wrote:
MovingPictures07 wrote:Zomb, I have the following questions for you:

- How do you feel about Snowman this game? Any read on him yet (more likely civ or bad) or not sure?
- Same question regarding Epi
- Same question regarding trice (I had a good laugh when you called him PornStar)
- Regarding your point about Russ and FZ., could they not have baddie BTSC with the same argument? I'm not saying I suspect or don't suspect either of them, but I'm merely playing devil's advocate with your argument.
- Snowman's behavior is typical. He likes to do psychoanalysis and then sit back and watch the fight. I cannot read him. Ever. I know that if he is a baddie, we are all probably dead.
Rethinking Snowman - Why would he vote for Epig? Only reason - He feels Epig is a threat - i.e., Snowman is a baddie and is afraid of Epig figuring him out - or Snowman is a civie and is trying to divert attention away from himself toward an easy target (in reference to the message from Mrs. Donner) and doesn't care if the target is a baddie or a civie. Either way, Snowman is dangerous.
Or he agrees with FZ' interpretation. Epi always feels that he is a threat, you seem to as well. What leads you to this conclusion?

ebwop~ have you been sitting in a chatroom with Epi listening to him talk about how awesome and scary he is? Ask him to tell you about WWE, lulz galore

DON'T ANSWER THAT, it was a rhetorical question

Zomberella12 wrote:
Zomberella12 wrote:
MovingPictures07 wrote:Zomb, I have the following questions for you:

- How do you feel about Snowman this game? Any read on him yet (more likely civ or bad) or not sure?
- Same question regarding Epi
- Same question regarding trice (I had a good laugh when you called him PornStar)
- Regarding your point about Russ and FZ., could they not have baddie BTSC with the same argument? I'm not saying I suspect or don't suspect either of them, but I'm merely playing devil's advocate with your argument.
- Snowman's behavior is typical. He likes to do psychoanalysis and then sit back and watch the fight. I cannot read him. Ever. I know that if he is a baddie, we are all probably dead.
Rethinking Snowman - Why would he vote for Epig? Only reason - He feels Epig is a threat - i.e., Snowman is a baddie and is afraid of Epig figuring him out - or Snowman is a civie and is trying to divert attention away from himself toward an easy target (in reference to the message from Mrs. Donner) and doesn't care if the target is a baddie or a civie. Either way, Snowman is dangerous.

Or he agrees with FZ' interpretation. Epi always feels that he is a threat, you seem to as well. What leads you to this conclusion?

Why is everyone voting already? Why did Epi self vote?

I have to catch up to the film thread, but will bbl to read back.

Snowman wrote:I'm new to this, but I'm not new to social deduction games, so I'm trying to wrap my mind around how this version works. I see four possible perspectives:

1) I don't know what team I may be on during the final round, so the best strategy would be to eliminate the most potent competitors, regardless of what team they may currently be on,

2) I will role play my current affiliation, and behave in a manner that is completely loyal until I'm told that loyalty has changed,

3) we've been told that affiliation/powers may not change every night, so I should remain loyal to my current group because there is a chance that they will remain my group the following day,

4) the pre-determined alternation of groups can't be predicted or planned for, so there is no reason not to simply fire blindly into the crowd, because as long as you remain alive personally, you have no influence over who will be on your team the following day.

Personally, I'm leaning toward strategy #3...or am I?

I like this. I like it ALOT. I have to digest it a bit, and think about what it means to me.

Um interesting, Epig reacts to what looks like a joke to me with standard Bravado~ "I am awesome and everyone is afraid of me" which makes me smirk a bit, but not have any desire to vote for him. And MP overreacts with fairly typical "How dare you, I am tired of being incorrectly maligned" etc etc type post. Fairly stereotypical for both of them.

I am glad Rox went with 48 hour days, with 3 games and the unusual mechanics, I will need the extra time to wrap my head around the mechanics.

And @MP, yes, I misunderstood you. And realized it when i did more than skim through your post. That is why I said what i said.

If a marmot nibbles on my toes, I consider it a sign that it's time to get a tetanus shot. Maybe rabies, too.

And Thanks, yeah that makes sense, although I am not 100% sure I agree with it. I plan on basing my behavior on the present, and not worry too much about *if*

That may change, but for not it works for me. I am paranoid enough.

The roles say the Donners take someone off the poll. I doubt they would take off someone who was not one of them.

Also, MP, I guess I AM confused. I thought you agreed on what Russ said. Now that i am rereading it not on phone, I see that you do not. I was not trying to put llama in a spot. I just wanted it explained like I was in grade school, and I thought he would be better at that than you would.

Ricochet wrote:Since D0/N0 polls were changeable (actually, I don't know if N0 was), I assumed there would not be a strict rule of stating a clear vote, once - especially since it's all verbal, the development of the debate might often cause people to make statements about what they intend to vote, but not mean it to be final.

I am of the opinion that you should always clearly state a lynch vote, final or not. It looks sneaky voting without stating it.

I am hoping Llama will explain it. He is a bit more direct, he will give me the brass tacks version. It did make sense, but I want the sound bite version.

thellama73 wrote:
Russtifinko wrote: However, MP raises probably the best point for lynching your teammates. If you have a chance to switch and your teammates have figured out a way to catch you in a lie once you do, they're the people you need dead most in the game. So he's actually supporting my argument even though he says he's against it.
Oh snap, Russ is right.

I don't totally get it; can you explain it like I am in kindergarten? (I am asking you to be condescending to me; make the most of it

)

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