The Syndicate

Now really, good night

I saw that, i even replied to it. But it was not the question i asked. i asked WHY. Not WHAT. WHY. I have seen nothing to make me think that, but if someone would show me why, I would be thrilled to listen and take it under advisement. But K4J just stopped posting, you are answering questions i am not asking, and TH just keeps saying, "I am not Dom, how do we know you came back a civ?"

I am not unreasonable, if someone can show me why i am wrong, i gracefully admit i was wrong. But i have to believe i am wrong to do that.

And i am typing too fast and typo-ing all over the place becasue I am taking this all too seriously.

xoxo love ya Epi

See though? This is why we have issues. you know what i meant. You chose to be pedantic. io know, you're a teacher I know, i can be pedantic too. But seriously, yo knew what i meant.

OMG.


I wanted to know why you thought another player WAS NOT BAD. Why is that such an outrageous request?

Not tell me everything i wanted to know? I wanted to know why you thought another player was a civ. Why is that such an outrageous request?

S~V~S wrote:

Epignosis wrote:

S~V~S wrote:No I will. But you have to listen to the questions being asked. you said stuff, but not the stuff i was asking.

In The Island, I asked you multiple times about DH, and you gave me nothing. You just said I was wrong.

i thought i was a bit clearer than that.

that game had stable roles that could be outed. I had direct, factual role based info that I was not allowed to out. that could not be the case in this game, it would have to be based on perception. Which is opinion, which can be shared.

Linki~ you are saying you did not answer me becasue i did not answer you in a different game, right? Otherwise why even bring that up? It was a very different set of mechanics than this.

You intentionally did not answer me becasue I did not answer you in another game?

Epignosis wrote:

S~V~S wrote:I think you are very astute and have an awesome gut, but you have to be willing to talk to people, not at them. I wanted to know "why", but you were answering the question YOU would ask, not the question i DID ask.

See above.

So...this was tit for tat?

Epignosis wrote:

S~V~S wrote:No I will. But you have to listen to the questions being asked. you said stuff, but not the stuff i was asking.

In The Island, I asked you multiple times about DH, and you gave me nothing. You just said I was wrong.

i thought i was a bit clearer than that.

I think you are very astute and have an awesome gut, but you have to be willing to talk to people, not at them. I wanted to know "why", but you were answering the question YOU would ask, not the question i DID ask.

No I will. But you have to listen to the questions being asked. you said stuff, but not the stuff i was asking.

Well there you go, Epi, you have another whole day to convince me to not vote for TH, and of the inherent evils of FH.

Looking forward to it.

kneel4justice wrote:

DharmaHelper wrote:Actually i just noticed Sorsha voted for me so :P

Right back at you Sorsha

You toooooooo shady!

And your opinion, I value it. Why did you pull out of this conversation?

Well, you sure acted like you killed me. You said all the things I would expect a killer to say with their main accuser out of the way.

Right now i am really, really confused and actually getting a headache. I asked repeatedly for answers and got the runaround (not from you, from Epi). Feeling stupid is very, very frustrating.

ALSO~ at that stage, I was less sure than i am now.

Linki~ and just something to chew on epi~ i said that before my rezz.

And since the confirmed civ is saying he does not see a way TH can be a civ, based on his roles,

I asked TH for his opinion, for an alternative, for SOMETHING, and he waffled at me. Does not make me feel better, tbh, and then he said trying to convince me was a waste of his time. All righty then. that convinced me even more that he was bad.

Linki~ and where did that get me? At this point, all i am asking is for an explanation. If you give me one, i will go with it. But you refuse to.

Sorry if i am gonna trust BWT and not you.

Voting for the person I believe most is bad.

And we know that how? And I only like to lynch them actively if i feel thy are dangerous. Some are, some are not (all have the potential). I personally think TH killed me, so forgive me for thinking he is dangerous.

I feel like the dentist here pulling teeth. I have to believe that BWT, who says why he thinks what he thinks, is right in this case.

Look guys, i obviously am missing something. But if no one tells me what it is,

I am trying to find out why no one thinks TH is bad anymore. The baddies could do that every other day. Why such a concern today?

What the hell does that have to do with TH?

I have read the bad roles, and do not see how reading them again will tell me TH is not one of them if i have no idea what i am looking for.

And even if i thought TH was not bad, I am not sure i think FH IS. Before I died everyone agreed with me, now no one does, I can't for the life of me see why, and no one will tell me, or even give me a hint

All the while I was dead, he sounded incredibly bad, and since I have come back all he has done is make veiled insinuations that I am came back bad.

If someone cannot tell me WHY I am wrong, that so many other people seem to know, then I am gonna trust my own gut & BWTs beliefs which seem based on actual info that he has.

Right. So not sure what i am missing. He said he does not think, based on what the host said about powers, that TH can be telling the truth.

I feel very right now.

Linki @ Epi~ SO TELL ME HOW THE *&* I AM WRONG/he is wrong instead of just making these vague remarks. I trust BWT, why do you expect me to trust you when you say "He's wrong". You need to at least point me in the right direction.

I got the impression from BWT that he thought that *whatever* mysterious thing TH was alluding to was not possible? Do you suspect BWT?

Why would you think that,? I never said that. While I was dead he sounded very, very bad to me. What obvious thing did I miss?

You will not say why you think this? And I ask direct questions most games.

Link I, I am sticking with it because I suspected Dom. I am exactly the same alignment.

I asked, TH. Why not take it at face value?

Guess you did not go to work.

Linki at Epi, and I am not. Can you tell me why or just make proclamations?

Turnip Head wrote:

S~V~S wrote:

kneel4justice wrote:

S~V~S wrote:Linki @ TH~ Well, it is obvious i planned to vote for you, right? So I was hoping you would try to talk me out of it by giving me a viable alternative, I was hoping to see a bit of civ fire from you.

I feel I've given plenty of fire, SVS. I have not stopped giving my suspicions since I started in this game, even though everyone's had it out from me since I subbed in. FH, on the other hand, stormed off when it got to be too much. I have stuck with it, I've tried to defend myself, and I've been giving my own thoughts and suspicions the entire time.

Don't mistake my lack of certainty with a lack of civ fire.

And yes, it is obvious that you will vote for me. Maybe that's why I'm not putting too much effort into trying to dissuade you You have had a one-track mind with me (and Dom I guess) this entire game. I was really hoping you and I would be at an understanding by this point, but like I said I wasn't able to prove myself to you the way that I wanted to, so I'm at a loss on what to do about it now. And I can't even be certain you came back civ, anyway.

You can't be certain anyone would have come back civ, TH. the fact that you keep saying this when the rezz conditions are known does not make me feel better.

You should have tried, i asked you a sincere question, and you gave me "meh". There is more than one baddie, and had you given me a really viable alternative, i could have gotten behind it. Because i have been where you are, and it is not a fun place. I am not loving monomania.

kneel4justice wrote:

S~V~S wrote:This is rather vague, TH. I want to know who you think i should vote for if not you. This is very iffy, like you don't want to commit.

I actually liked his post. I'm thinking the points that are brought up against FH are better this day than today. And why if you are a baddie try to relynch FH when it clearly did not work well last time. What do you think about DH?

And FH, what do you think about DH?

And i honestly didn't like it, lol. And I think that no lynch situations can only last so long. I still think Dom was bad in my heart of hearts, i guess. I did not like the way TH talked when I was dead, I felt like he figured it would be easier to talk his way out of me dying than talk me out of my opinion. I think you should vote for the person YOU feel is bad, i am voting for TH again.

And it is my experience with DH that he tends to get a bit more over the top when he is bad than when he is good~ he can't help but twirl his mustachios a bit, if you get my meaning. I have not seen any over the top this game at all, though. So that would make me less likely to suspect him.

Linki @ TH~ Well, it is obvious i planned to vote for you, right? So I was hoping you would try to talk me out of it by giving me a viable alternative, I was hoping to see a bit of civ fire from you.

This is rather vague, TH. I want to know who you think i should vote for if not you. This is very iffy, like you don't want to commit.

I dunno, not sure i am seeing bad FH. She gets a bit snarkier when shes a cornered baddie, she just sounds annoyed and upset to me, not angry. There's a difference, and i am not sure I am seeing the anger here.

TH, who would you have me vote for if not you?

There really is no way to know, without knowing who sent in votes, and deciding if they were civs.

boo wrote:

You are also ressing a player today.

How it works:
Every player gets to PM me the names of three players they want ressed. The deadie who gets picked the most is ressed.

However, they will not be ressed in their previous role. If the first vote for the player ressed comes from an indie, the player will be ressed as an indie. If the player ressed gets the most votes from a civ, they are a civ. If the player ressed gets the most votes from baddies, they will come back as a solo baddie (can win with any baddie, but doesn’t have BTSC). Awesome points may be used as votes (but this will use them entirely. They will not be available as lynch votes, and civvies cannot use them to lock into a role if they use them as a vote).

You may discuss it in thread, but you do not have to be honest about which names you submit (or consider). These votes cannot be changed, and you need to send in all three names at the same time.

Well, I really did want to vote for you. And all you really have been saying, is, "Judge me for me, not Dom". But you AREN'T just you, you are Dom too. You have mainly been trying to distance from Dom, but you ARE him. And I was pretty sure Dom was as bad as they come. If he is, you are too. You are in a sucky situation, I have replaced in for people under suspicion and it is not easy, and I am sorry for giving you grief. But I know Doms game, and I don't think i saw his civvie game.

Like i said, i have to reread after dinner. If anything came up that makes me feel differently, I will let you know.

This, however, did not help:

And I am glad you are back. But I wish we could be more sure of your allegiance at this point.

If feels like a bit of a deflection, eh?

I came back a civ. I got the impression from boos post that not many people sent in votes, but the ones that did must have been civs

Turnip Head wrote:Welcome back SVS! Feel any different?

Surviving the lynch was a byproduct of how I've used my role. Just because you don't see it on the front page doesn't mean it doesn't exist. There are a lot of mechanics at work in this game, some of them are harder to spot than others.

Not sure, tbh. I have not totally caught up to where i was when i died. I quit reading the thread when, after i died, it was looking like you were blowing off all of my points as insignificant. I actually felt, for the first time in my mafia career, that I had been "gotten rid of", lol. But perhaps there have been new revelations? I have to catch up, which I hope to do later tonight.

Didn't he win a contest?

Yay me

S~V~S wrote:boo

Wow what a statement; ambiguity even in death. I meant it as in "boo", the remark you make when something happens that you don't like. it could also be interpreted as *boo*, what dead ghosty people say, OR as an appeal to the host. So don't interpret it those wrong ways, living people

I had no idea where to look, tbh. I wanted to lynch Turnip Dom, and still do, tbh. I should have copped out like I initially said i would and voted for someone I think is being blendy, but I was having some issues reconciling your behavior in this game with your behavior as a baddie, and like Sorsha said, it seemed to me that the votes for you felt like a baddie pile up. Still not sure there. Also I don't know that i think Aces would do that if he expected INH to flip civ.

So yeah, I want to hear what he says, and i also want to know what DH thinks of Aces doing this. I have seen him be wrong about Aces, but i still think his opinion has value re his brother.

Sorsha wrote:I voted INH also. I can understand that all of FH's case might not be correct but I really doubt she is bad and turning the lynch on her just because her whole case doesn't line up 100% just stinks to me.

This tbh. More than anything I wanted to lynch Turnip Dom today but no such luck. I think Sorsha makes sense, and I thought FH felt sincere before.

All that everyone is saying makes a lot of sense, but i don't see FH pushing a theory so feverishly if she is bad, either,tbh. She is a lot blendier when she is bad, IMO.

I am waffled on both sides of this issue. So I doubt i will vote for either INH or FH. i might vote for Epi or DH for playing such atypical games. I know you are both busy elsewhere gamewise, but I expect a bit more naked aggression from both of you, and so far I am disappoint. Whatever vote i make it will be late enough that no one can accuse me of trying to save anyone else

My point was WHY BWT? With that combo of powers, they could have lynched just about anyone, every single one of those roles has a manipulation. BWT was a good choice because they could pin the lynch on someone else. Like, let's say you are a civ, TH. This would be the perfect opportunity for them to get rid of BOTH of us (if PB was still alive). Were you lynchable they could have made everyone vote for YOU, then they would all turn on ME when you turned up civ (if you were one, which I sadly doubt). This would be a smart way to use their powers, turning very little suspicion on themselves. That whole disingenuous "Now who was it that first brought up the case on BWT??" remark, well, lets just say i could visualize Dom putting his finger on his chin, rolling his eyes up and batting his eyelashes when i read it, lol. dom knew, he just did not want to be the one to say it. The perfect plot

I have 2 games~ if it is still in signups when time opens up, I will try again It was eye opening, lol but knowing what to expect, i may handle it better this time.

Doh, I looked back to see who you replaced, and it was Dom,

So i won't be voting for you. But i really, really want to.

If you think it snowballed out of something tiny, then you read his posts, not mine. My suspicion has nothing to do with his opinion of me. I have thread based reasons for believeing what i believe. If you go back & reread my posts, you will see what i am saying.

Someone said something that led me to believe they were targeted by this guy to vote for BWT:

4. Gloryholes: Each night, you may pick a player, and force them to vote for a player of your choice in the following lynch. They may not make it obvious that the vote was forced (ever). If they succeed, you’ll return the favour, making their vote worth 2 the lynch after that. If they fail, any vote they take from that point on will be worth 3. If they succeed the initial forced vote and voted without making it obvious, but then later make it obvious they were forced, you may PM the host with the infraction, and the player will be killed if the host agrees with you.

I do NOT want to keep pointing this out for obvious reasons, but people keep apparently not reading what I have posted before. In any case, i came across this person while i was rereading the BWT lynch, and thought, "Why would someone want to lyncBWT so bad that they would force a vote on him?"

The lynch on BWT was mainly spearheaded by K4J, who also suspected Dom, very much. I quoted all the relevant post more than once yesterday.

I reread K4J yesterday, since i had time to do so, and tbh, he is coming across as very civvie to me. While I as trying to figure this out, I see a post by Dom. He says I seem insincere (I wasn't) and he also says:

Dom wrote:Sorry I've been so absent lately. I've been really busy at school and had some internet troubles today. I hate snow.

TBH, I don't really know where to start. I do think SVS's reaction to BWT seemed very insincere, IMO. But that's nothing much. :/ If anyone can remember who started the discussion on BWT, that might be helpful!

Hmmm. The very same person who has been hounding Dom started it, K4J

You would think he would know that, if someone is hounding me for days, i would make it my business to know what they are thinking.

I think Doms team (cause I think he has one) forced someone to vote for BWT, specifically to get rid of K4J, since based on his gameplay so far, i can't imagine why anyone would feel an urgent need to get rid of him otherwise. And K4J did not seem suspicious at all and would be rather hard to lead a lynch on, and of course, and NK would point right to...Dom.

This is rather convoluted, but tbh, this is EXACTLY the kind of thing I do when bad ALL THE TIME. Framing people is one of my fave tactics. And Doms bad game is very similar to mine in many ways, when we are teammates, we are always on the same page.

Voting Dom again, and plan on pushing it harder today.

I think the circumstantial evidence points to this being the case.

thanks for reading

insertnamehere wrote:I'm definitely looking at SVS and Epig right now. The way they instantly jumped onto FH's suspicion of me seems to me like they were trying a last ditch effort to save Rey.

No he wasn't save able, evrn if that were my motivation. When I saw no one else was going to follow me on Dom, I was willing to be flexible and follow FH. I really would prefer a Dom lynch tomorrow, but FHs analysis was sound.