The Syndicate

I have been bad with him, too, I know. But it is so much harder to think of him that way. It's his gift

Metalmarsh89 wrote:
S~V~S wrote:Congrats winners; I was so disjointed this game. My gut told me LC was bad, but my logic told me he couldn't be, so my cerebral cortex shut down. And LC/Sorsha bad again!?!?!
You forgot about meeeeee.

I did; mainly becasue no matter how capable of evil you can be, when I visualize your team and your chatroom, I visualize them concocting evil plots, and I visualize you doing acrobatics and magic tricks to amuse them, lol. Some people are easy to visualize as evil plotters (your teammates, me) and some are not. This is a good thing, not a bad one

Congrats winners; I was so disjointed this game. My gut told me LC was bad, but my logic told me he couldn't be, so my cerebral cortex shut down. And LC/Sorsha bad again!?!?!

Long Con wrote:
S~V~S wrote:Sorry formissing thevote guys, I got sucked into the never ending bbq w/beer.
That's ok, things went really well without you.

Who would you have voted for?

You lunched a civvie, you think that is really good?

I likely would have wanted to vote BWT, but probably would have voted Wilgy cause I did not think Faraday was bad

But really,I have no idea, I have been saying that for days.

Sorry formissing thevote guys, I got sucked into the never ending bbq w/beer.

Epignosis wrote:During Day 3, there was talk about who might miss a kill. For example:

Spoiler: show
Epignosis wrote:I am more inclined to vote for gleam than Scotty. Scotty does not strike me as one to miss a night kill, and from my reading, that's the only way there was no kill.

a2thezebra - Capatin Grogan - Lynched Day 2
agleaminranks - A potential miss
birdwithteeth11 - A potential miss
DFaraday - A potential miss
DrWilgy - I think a potential miss only if done purposefully with the intent to deceive
Long Con - Most likely would not miss a kill
Marmotpictures87- Killed his own teammate in Downton Abbey; a potential miss on purpose with the intent to deceive
Ricochet - Killed Night 1
Scotty - Most likely would not miss a kill
Serge - Was bad in Turf Wars with me, and was not terrible active; got replaced, but I do not recall missing a night action
Sig - Belle - Lynched Day 1
Sorsha - Was bad in Downton Abbey and not terribly active; a potential miss
S~V~S - Most likely would not miss a kill

Potzdorf is therefore someone who feared Ricochet enough to remove him first thing, but not so invested that he or she would submit a second kill. If the other two captains are active and anything like me, they would be frustrated with their lost opportunity.

My vote is likely to go to agleaminranks, birdwithteeth11, DFaraday, or Sorsha.
and

Spoiler: show
Long Con wrote:Gotta go to work, so I'm voting now.

Voting BWT11 because I think he's very likely to have missed the nightkill.
DrWilgy did not seem to have an issue with this sort of talk. In fact:

Spoiler: show
DrWilgy wrote:Hell, I think I'd be willing to vote Gleam for calling my claim baseless.

On terms of a more rational vote. I could see BWT being bad and not submitting a kill. Players that weren't posting though the night include Epi and BWT. Barry and Baddie?

If BWT is bad, I'm pretty sure LC is as well... Maybe that thought will amke me vote there.

LC do please answer my questions when you can.
But when I stop focusing on who might have missed the kill by accident and instead focus on who might have intentionally missed the kill, I am met with this reaction:

DrWilgy wrote:It's not a matter of opposite view points existing. It's a matter of "do I believe that opposite viewpoints can healthily survive in a mafia game" and the answer is no. There is a right and a wrong and disagreements need to be absolved by majority. When two even and opposite patterns stagnate there is a reason for that, and that reason is either 1) a player doesn't care enough about said pattern or 2) a player is lying.

A good example of this would be Zeebs and Sig. A opposite and even pattern arose when they both agreed on Gambler's Fallacy, but there was opposition through Zebra. Zebra ended up being caught a liar.

Tl;dr players that have opposite views don't just shake hands and walk away in this game.

In responce to you BWT... It's spooky that both you and Epi who I have in my mind as baddies are calling the NK a set up, and this is on the 3rd of that set Scotty who I also thought was bad.

Hmmm... Epi Sorsha and BWT analyzing the NK. That bothers me as well, NK is a tool for the baddies to use, any analysis of the sort would be WIFOM and only favor the baddies at this point in the game.
According to DrWilgy, we must believe the kill was missed accidentally, because thinking outside of that paradigm "only favors the baddies at this point in the game."

Nah.

This is a really good point. We just saw a game where the baddies kiiled one of their own to set up WIFOM, intentionally dropping a kill to set up the inactives one after the other like dominoes is a very plausible scenario.

DrWilgy wrote:Everyone should post their "Hey we should lynch these people in this order" list... on the off chance you die...

My order is: Scotty, BWT, EPI, SVS.

SVS and BWT'S position are variable depending on their contributions in the near future!

Making a few posts will change my position from least suspicious to most suspicious?

Have you abandoned the licking persona?

There are three left, so any given baddie has only 2 teammates left. MM seems to be assuming Wilgy is a Captain, so he could have only 2 teammates left. Unless I am misunderstanding something very basic, which is totally possible?

I also like BWTs explanations better than Gleams, tbh. I have to vote now since I am leaving work shortly, and may or may not be home by 5:20 and I don't want to miss.

*Voting Gleam*

birdwithteeth11 wrote:
DrWilgy wrote:Y'all seem to be ignoring the fact that I acknowledged Gleams existence, but ruled him out since he was here.

If you think I'm singling you out BWT you are correct. You were, by posting means, AFK. The only other was Epi. Based on how often you die day 1 with me, I have little to indicate how you would preform as a baddie. When you compare this to Epi (who I think I can read better based solely on game time together) you are the greater liability.

What do you think of these players BwT:
- Epi
- LC
- Scotty in the context of both "avoiding Zebra vs Wilgy" and the "guy who wants gleam murked"

I'll go over Gleam as soon as I'm out of my shower.
Epig: Neutral. Don't have a good enough feel on him yet. He seems much quieter than I would normally think he would be though.

LC: I thought the dragon thing earlier on was a bit odd. But after his explanation I feel much better about it. I'd lean civ.

Scotty: Leaning bad. I still think he could have been staying out of the thing between zebra and you because he wanted to be non-committal about it.

Also, I think a baddie not sending in a NK under any circumstances is one of the worst possible actions a baddie could take. To me, it's the baddie equivalent of what a lynch is for the civvies: the most powerful tool at one's disposal.

Do you recall ever personally missing a kill due to your active afk lifestyle, since you bring up your high level of responsibility as a baddie killer?

I am lost alone & clueless. I am not even a corporal, much less a captain

I have a slow PM at work today, I should have time to reread & get some more focus.

DrWilgy wrote:
agleaminranks wrote:Alright, I have no good excuse this time. I'm bogged down with finals and I just forgot the deadline was earlier than I thought it would be. Spectacular failure on my part. I will do my damndest to be a better player this upcoming day period.
This was posted at the start of night 2.

Gleam was here.

So what is your feel on BWT?

Good question. ''

I am still hoping BWT gives us the benefit of his insight, though.

agleaminranks wrote:Also, since I know I'm good, BWT is a captain too.

Ok that long post may have gotten you my vote.

Sig was Barrys Mom. Sig was screaming to NOT kill a specific person, who was NOT Wilgy. What makes you think he had BTSC with Wilgy?

I am hoping to hear what if anything BWT learned in his catchup, but it will be one of you for me.

Long Con wrote:
Metalmarsh89 wrote:
llamaman wrote:The second in my ambitious series of Kubrick themed mafias, based on my second favorite Kubrick film. This will be a straightforward game with no secrets and everything out in the open, only with an added Hierarchy mechanic. This being a story of people swept along by the whim of circumstance, the individual players are fairly limited in their night powers, but I do not think that will lessen the fun substantially.

Ah... ok then, and inactive failure? I see Scotty voted for gleam, is he the only inactive one?

Well, BWT for one.

birdwithteeth11 wrote:Sorry I've been gone. The last 2 days were crazy. Going to start catching up now.

Llama does not go in for that behind the scenes stuff, what you see is what you get.

So BWT who was gone for 2 days, did you learn anything in your catch up?

Yeah it does kinda look that way. Intentional or not? No kill with so many no/low shows could work.

DrWilgy wrote:
S~V~S wrote:Quick question, LC & Sorsha, can I get opinions on each other? Not becasue I specifically suspect either of you, but becasue of recent history, I think it would be valuable.
Hmm... What recent history is this SVS?

Also, LC and SVS, could you two comment on each other? I'm intrigued as to what you two think of each other.

Their recent history of being bad together, like in the game that just ended plus at least one of the recent smaller games, I don't recall which. They have seen each others recent baddie game, so their perspectives on each other would be valuable.

And no, not bad. Sorry, you be barking up the wrong tree. Not helpful, yes, bad, no.

And I always think LC is bad, and last time I was wrong. I used to read him fairly well, I think, but not so much anymore. I do not think he has BTSC with Serge, though. There is that

Serge wrote:
DrWilgy wrote:Hmm... I could also see a Serge vs Epi tomorrow.
What does this mean? Am I getting lynched? Why did I even follow your case then?

Yeah, I am rather confused as well. I am having a hard time following here, tbh. A lot of people have gone pretty quiet, and Wilgy totally confounds me.

I think Epi was sincere. I think if he was bad, he would have come up with a better theory.

Although I am pretty clueless. I feel like I am suspecting the people I normally suspect, and that's stupid. I did not particularly distrust Zebra more than anyone else, I mainly voted for her becasue I had to leave, and it sounded like I could have taken votes, so it was a self protection thing.

I just feel like everyone in here is bad, lol, and that can't be true, so I am not sure how valuable my opinion is.

Quick question, LC & Sorsha, can I get opinions on each other? Not becasue I specifically suspect either of you, but becasue of recent history, I think it would be valuable.

Metalmarsh89 wrote:
Spoiler: show
S~V~S wrote:Becasue the main reason he had any suspicion at all was becasue of the "dragon" crosspost with Serge thing.

What I find suspect is people not seeing the worlds most obvious thing. I always miss role related stuff, and I caught this ASAP.

And back to this:

Scotty wrote:Sorry I've been absent a while. Getting back on track.

I want to stay away from the Wilgy/zebra lick-a-thon for now. Im not seeing baddies out of either of them and instead of possibly getting two mislynchesmislynches, I'll stick to more glaring developments.

I think Epi is right RE: SVS. Why make a comment chiding others for not voting if you havent even voted yourself? Then she leaves! it's absolute fluff to let everyone know she's still here and can make mistakes like the rest of the working class, and I don't buy it. I think Epi may be on to something.
Did you read my original posts?

Only 30 seconds apart! I came in and thought the poll was almost over. Surprised at only 2 votes. Posted,looked at the poll again, felt stupid, reposted. I had nothing to add since all the discussion had been Wilgy (whose game I have no clue bout, with this licking business) and Zeeb, whose points I either don;t understand or disagree with. SO I LEFT.

Thepost before mine was at 3:57, and the next post wasn't until 8:01, so noone seemed to care about showing themselves to still be here.

I was glad not ot have to vote since I was totally clueless, lol

linki, OK bai, postinganyhow
Ah, so this is how you can see player posts in seconds!

Go into the UCP, xhoose "Custom" as your date format, and put this into the syntax window: D M d, Y g:i:s a

Typhoony showed me that at RM.

And yay for not dying and yay that a baddie died

I dunno,vmaybe I think all of the reasons being put forth for suspecting me are silly because I know my role, distinctly possible. I have no clue about Wilgy, I am totally bewilgered by him. Zeebs has votes already, and a few people have mentioned me, so I am gonna go with Zeebs. The dead horse she is beating plus the "save myself" thing since I am on my way out and won't be back until after the day is over.

Votes a2thezebra

No, I was surprised that he had not already overthought it; it was something he should have caught. It was the mega super obvious point about sigs flip.

Becasue the main reason he had any suspicion at all was becasue of the "dragon" crosspost with Serge thing.

What I find suspect is people not seeing the worlds most obvious thing. I always miss role related stuff, and I caught this ASAP.

And back to this:

Scotty wrote:Sorry I've been absent a while. Getting back on track.

I want to stay away from the Wilgy/zebra lick-a-thon for now. Im not seeing baddies out of either of them and instead of possibly getting two mislynchesmislynches, I'll stick to more glaring developments.

I think Epi is right RE: SVS. Why make a comment chiding others for not voting if you havent even voted yourself? Then she leaves! it's absolute fluff to let everyone know she's still here and can make mistakes like the rest of the working class, and I don't buy it. I think Epi may be on to something.

Did you read my original posts?

Only 30 seconds apart! I came in and thought the poll was almost over. Surprised at only 2 votes. Posted,looked at the poll again, felt stupid, reposted. I had nothing to add since all the discussion had been Wilgy (whose game I have no clue bout, with this licking business) and Zeeb, whose points I either don;t understand or disagree with. SO I LEFT.

Thepost before mine was at 3:57, and the next post wasn't until 8:01, so noone seemed to care about showing themselves to still be here.

I was glad not ot have to vote since I was totally clueless, lol

linki, OK bai, postinganyhow

Becasue if Serge had BTSC with sig, he did not have it with LC.

Why has this been so hard for people to figure out?

Note that I stopped suspecting LC when sig flipped.

Becasue I thought the poll was ending in 20 minutes.

Linki, Sigs role had civvie BTSC. Sig was saying not to lynch serge.

And I have no idea who I suspect.

To be blunt since I kinda of lost interest a bit after trying to force people to see a point without being too obvious, looking at sigs last posts, and then at how sig flipped, I had a role in mind for Serge, and it was not a Captain. So not a fan of Serge suspicion.

And I don;t think affiliation matters much in a tie in such a small game. I mean, in turf wars we had two baddies tied, which was amazing, I have seen multiple variations.

I have to vote by about 1o'clock becasue I have the cemetary, Mothers Day & a movie with my Dad.

Anyone who actually votes for me based on this should be ashamed.

Epignosis wrote:S~V~S is my vote right now, were it cast.

S~V~S wrote:20 minutes left, and only 2votes?

S~V~S wrote:Oh doh, it ends tomorrow. Nevermind
This tells me two things: First, she has no urgency before, and second, has no urgency after.

She made this same mistake before, so how hard is it to look at the poll (and the time)? She has even said herself that hitting the "View Results" button is autopilot for her.

S~V~S is a Captain.

This is probably the silliest case I ever read. If you actually believe this, I am not sure what to say.

Epignosis is wrong.

Oh doh, it ends tomorrow. Nevermind

20 minutes left, and only 2votes?

Why do you think he is bad? I have problems getting past his increasingly zany game these days. I have problems seeing past it.

What am I missing?

Oh give your self credit, you are not as shallow as you imply

a2thezebra wrote:
S~V~S wrote:
a2thezebra wrote:But what motive do you have for asking someone that you feel is an over-thinker to analyze a certain area?
Becasue I am seeing something I thought was obvious? And usually I expect Rico (or you for that matter) to pay more attention to nuance than I?

What motive do you have for trying to turn this into something sinister?
That's what I'm trying to do, I'm trying to figure out what you're getting at (if anything, you could just be trying to look like you're contributing) and if what that is happens to be something sinister than I want to be aware of it. What makes you think I ever pay attention to nuance? I'm all about vibes.

I think there was something very very very very obvious going on when you read sigs posts and then look at his role. I was actually beginning to suspect Rico becasue he seemed to be missing it, when he is someone I would expect to catch nuances. Certainly much more so than I.

And you do pay attention to nuance, you take tiny little things and catch vibes off of them. That is what nuance is vis a vis mafia, imo. I think you pick up thoughts from very small things.

Rico, I am sad you died.

Ricochet wrote:
S~V~S wrote:I am asking him to read it and to think about it, lol.
You are either recommending me to read something, the way you would just hand me a volume of Byron's finest, or you are recommending me to look into something that you might have an idea what it should reveal, so which is it?

Why do you want this spelled out?

Read what sig said his last day. Read sigs lynch post. I am usually Ms Obtuse, and I think there is something to infer.

a2thezebra wrote:But what motive do you have for asking someone that you feel is an over-thinker to analyze a certain area?

Becasue I am seeing something I thought was obvious? And usually I expect Rico (or you for that matter) to pay more attention to nuance than I?

What motive do you have for trying to turn this into something sinister?

I am asking him to read it and to think about it, lol.

Ricochet wrote:
S~V~S wrote:Ricochet, I recommend that you reread sigs ISO, and think about what he said.

Linki~ you're a zebra, maybe>?
What should I focus on or try to extract from it?

Dude, you're usually the guy who reads too much into things, not me

Ricochet, I recommend that you reread sigs ISO, and think about what he said.

Linki~ you're a zebra, maybe>?

At the time, when we did not know sigs role, I still suspected Serge. I suspected Serge & sig equally. So I tied it. I can't say what LCs reasoning was, just that the reasons I had for suspecting him have been ameliorated. And I can't in good conscience suspect him for doing essentially the same thing as I did. I never feel comfortable trusting LC, he can be mega slippery and will do anything (legal) to get one up on his opponents. Anything. But other than normal paranoia, I feel better about him than I did yesterday.

What do you now think of Serge? Since the entire suspish of LC originally was based on his weird seeming interaction with Serge, you must have an opinion there? What about Wilgy and the Wilgy voters?

Well, he voted for the same person I did. So I guess he found him most likely to be bad of the people with votes. Two people voted after he did and quite a few missed, so it isn't like the 8th player to vote (all the NP's voted before him) would be all that influential. Since there has not been a night none of the vote manips was in play.

I lost my main reason for suspicion of Serge and, consequently, LC. I am OK with LCs explanation re dragons at this time.

Personally I feel I am OK with LCs explanation.

*Backs out of the thread*

Serge wrote:LC and I have no BTS. We posted within seconds of each other. I was actually surprised he also came up with the Game of Thrones reference.

Actually it was about a minute. But looking at them like this, you gotta say it was weird.

Well that is a horrible result. Sorry sig.

And yeah, time for some opinion revision.

birdwithteeth11 wrote:
S~V~S wrote:Why?
I'm assuming you're referring to me.

I don't agree with his thoughts on the gambler's fallacy thing for sure. But he made a response that made me feel like he was presuming to know how the mafia are thinking. And how a civ could presume to know that on Day 1 doesn't sit right with me. Especially when he hasn't answered my question to him about it.

I don't like it when anyone brings those jargon/philosophical/fallacy things into the game myself because those can also be used by civvies. Just becasue someone uses a logically fallacious argument does not mean they are wrong. But I have never thought someone was bad for bringing it up.

But the not answering you makes sense. I did not quite understand the suspish on Wilgy, so Thanks.

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