The Syndicate

I think I'm gonna take a break.

I'll be back reading the thread in like 12-14 hours and then be posting again or whatever soon after.

Seanzie wrote: ↑Fri Jul 14, 2023 1:43 amIf I am thinking of the same thing you are, Falcon and I had a similar start-of-game experience with not knowing the game was going on and having a hard time catching up, and he townread me for it. Personally I think it NAI, but meh.

I don't hold my belief over it anymore since my conversation with Falcon, but I thought you may have seen it suspicious for that discrepancy and that he seemed to explain that discrepancy away by mentioning his own alignment.

Seanzie wrote: ↑Fri Jul 14, 2023 1:43 ambefore that

935
937

Although the timing (6 minutes) was perhaps too close for you to have taken it into consideration, now that I looked at the timestamps too. Just because you read them before with that doesn't mean you haven't taken anything new into consideration as well. This was what I was referring to when I said "after that".

Seanzie wrote: ↑Fri Jul 14, 2023 1:23 am I went to go vote Martin, but they aren't in the poll. I then realized I didn't vote Rico in the poll, so I am now voting Rico in the poll.

How in the world did I drop so far (link)?

I swear it seems like people are voting (or trying to vote) me for any reason. At first it was vivax and someone I've not played with before. Next its a bunch of people who think, under the circumstances, I'm the best wagon. Then comes in Creature who I've played somewhat a long while back and get told that I'm not being obvious enough and underwhelming. Now its Seanzie who semi-strongly read me back on day 1 but then suddenly sparta kicks me further down the list than he has for Rico.

The only real highlight in that department is the someone had seemingly the impressive foresight of this happening and removed me from the poll for (I presume) a time.

I'm getting a bit frazzled at this game tbh. Not like actually upset at the game but if a few of these people suspecting me are town then that's kinda frustrating in a negative-WIM way. The lows and simplicity of the suspicions also just make it difficult to discern which one are the wolves because I find them all equally baseless.

Ricochet wrote: ↑Fri Jul 14, 2023 12:43 am

MartinGG99 wrote: ↑Fri Jul 14, 2023 12:26 am
[VOTE: Deerclops] aubergine

Firstly, the vote you quote is one for the spec/dead/host to vote to see the poll's voters.

After EoD1, I felt it may be more likely that I am pushed rather than night-killed. I was originally planning to get food, in anticipation of further pressure, but then SVS and Vivax (two ppl who voted me in the past) died which made me reconsider what I was going to get. I looked at the list of stuff, and figured I could get the shovel for SVS's gold.

I can in fact use the gold for something like the Pick, which will get me another flint in the long run.

While I do fairly positively read Tutuu, it did bother me earlier that after the mildest contention over one of their SRs they just gave me an IDK. On my right hand, the one I solve with more, I really don't see a wolf doing that. Like it takes guts to just wave your hands in the air with nothing when being engaged directly with evidence given. On my left hand, the one I use less to solve with, I didn't find it very pro-town answer and one that was given rather quickly.

Tutuu I don't believe is going to be in contention for who I put on my sights today. But I felt it worth noting in my ISO in severe case I have to re-evaluate a Tutuu in the future.

Would vote myself to show unvote as well but apparently that's impossible :wowee:

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Fri Jul 14, 2023 12:19 am You don't see how one town player had the near identical experience re: entering the game, lack of ping, finding out late your alignment in the same manner, etc, as another player...and thus giving a TR on said player...you find that suspect?

OK, I guess I can see some sus...but to what end? Like, am.I trying to pocket Sean? Is Sean someone with enough thread presence that it would be worth trying to pocket?

Given Sean & I's play history, and how he treats my slot I'm general, I can assure you it would be a useless gesture. You can ask him if you like.

I still don't see why that equates to you SR my slot, at least enough for a vote...have you even mentioned me prior to this recent interaction? (Which I engaged btw)

A vote isn't an immovable object, and I wanted to see how you would defend yourself. If I thought you to be very likely scum, I probably would be using more than just one reason.

I very much approve of the "what does that actually achieve" argument. Not that its my sole reason, but I used that style of reasoning before literally on day 1.

I also may have not really considered any dynamics between you and Sean as players.

[VOTE: Deerclops] aubergine

To unvote for now while I figure what else I could do at this moment.

I guess its more that, I have a terrible habit of "if I mention A, I have to mention XYZ too!!!" also.

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Fri Jul 14, 2023 12:02 am Whoa whoa whoa...we're unpacking a bunch of stuff that, while you might feel, is not at all what I intended.

I'm just trying to understand your thought process more, and this has helped me get an idea of what you meant.

I appreciate the concern but we're not really unpacking anything except, like, a biography I guess :P

I've been a bit vocal about it since a few months ago, beginning in a place called Deck Mafia and also in Champs as well.

Trust me, I got no bad feelings or whatever. Game has been really enjoyable, and I have no negative feelings towards anyone rn. Myself included.

Ricochet wrote: ↑Fri Jul 14, 2023 12:04 am

Epignosis wrote: ↑Thu Jul 13, 2023 9:14 pm

It is now Day 2. You have until 8pm ET to lynch someone and pick things off the ground or wherever.

[VOTE: Clam Chowder] aubergine

I never knew you could combine image and URL links with the BBcode. That's cool. Although I don't know how I would ever use it.

this was my vote post

MartinGG99 wrote: ↑Thu Jul 13, 2023 9:24 pm [VOTE: Falcon] aubergine

Interesting vote by Seanzie and I'd like to discuss that and his view of Falcon. I'm not quite sure what I want to discuss specifically though regarding Rico outside of stereotypical "why", I'll need to re-check my knowledge of Rico for like the 3rd time.

One of Falcon's responses towards seanzie was TRing him because Falcon was town...which is among the very few reasonings he has stated. Later he mentions being let to slank longer and it reads to me as having difficulty getting into the game but not wanting to admit it. At the very least I am hopeful to see more from them today.

this was my vote post

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Thu Jul 13, 2023 11:50 pm Wait, I've been ghost voted?

By fuckin Martin & tutuu?

@MartinGG99 @tutuu

What's up?

IDK tutuu's specific reasons but I thought you were having trouble getting into the game while not wanting to say it

Your reason for TRing Seanzie in particular kinda felt LAMIST ("look at me I am so town") because a major part of that is contingent on the belief that you, yourself, is town. Post link here. I can understand a low-level or throw-away read, as is generally given by some towns on d1 or when they're slanking, but I generally don't see it in a form where its connected to one's own alignment.

Seanzie after that read you positively though, which is interesting. I'm currently waiting on others to join the thread and see what they say, and whether the weigh in on you. Among other things.

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Thu Jul 13, 2023 11:42 pm

MartinGG99 wrote: ↑Thu Jul 13, 2023 10:54 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Thu Jul 13, 2023 10:47 pm

MartinGG99 wrote: ↑Thu Jul 13, 2023 10:38 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Thu Jul 13, 2023 10:35 pm

MartinGG99 wrote: ↑Thu Jul 13, 2023 10:20 pm I almost hate that I like your response.

I don't need to TR you more I need to advance my reads goshdarnit xD

Why do you need tutuu to advance your reads?

Hearing other people's perspectives is useful. Especially if I've missed something.

Completely separate sidenote, why do people keep presuming that when I do something I need to do it? Like seriously, I could be doing something just because its one of the ways it can be done smh.

I have no idea where I got that idea from

not the same as "I need tutuu to help me otherwise I can't advance my reads"

and if that were true my demeanor toward them would be applying more social pressure to get something out of it

its true though I need to advance my reads, make them better and ect, and I thought asking Tutuu would be a good step towards that.

Well, I'm sure you can see why I said what I said re: needing tutuu to advance your read...you seem a touch defensive about it, may I ask why?




Have you been accused lately of needing when you were just...I dunno, wanting?

Yeah, I understand, but I'm a bit assertive about it because I have to for my own sake.

The short of it is that I have cognitive behaviors which can be preety self-critical. If what I've done didn't achieve much + its perceived as like the only or among the very few things I was capable of then that leads to a not very good evaluation of myself as a player (or, taken more severely, as a person).

I think only 1-2 people have said something like that before, and I was able to brush it off, but since it happened again I wanted to be a bit more clear about it. Its not really a you issue, your issue, or anyone else's issue. It's just my issue and I had to point it out in the form of mild frustration before my personal issues become a thing. You can see I also try to play it off as semi-funny or whatever in my post after pointing it out.

I've always had this sort of problem though, and the fact that I'm being more vocal about it (instead of almost never mentioning it like in the past) is actually a good thing. It means I'm acknowledging the potential BS that I give myself can be, well, BS and doesn't deserve any consideration. It's healthier, I think.

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Thu Jul 13, 2023 10:47 pm

MartinGG99 wrote: ↑Thu Jul 13, 2023 10:38 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Thu Jul 13, 2023 10:35 pm

MartinGG99 wrote: ↑Thu Jul 13, 2023 10:20 pm I almost hate that I like your response.

I don't need to TR you more I need to advance my reads goshdarnit xD

Why do you need tutuu to advance your reads?

Hearing other people's perspectives is useful. Especially if I've missed something.

Completely separate sidenote, why do people keep presuming that when I do something I need to do it? Like seriously, I could be doing something just because its one of the ways it can be done smh.

I have no idea where I got that idea from

not the same as "I need tutuu to help me otherwise I can't advance my reads"

and if that were true my demeanor toward them would be applying more social pressure to get something out of it

its true though I need to advance my reads, make them better and ect, and I thought asking Tutuu would be a good step towards that.

like guys I'm not that incapable and limited lol

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Thu Jul 13, 2023 10:35 pm

MartinGG99 wrote: ↑Thu Jul 13, 2023 10:20 pm I almost hate that I like your response.

I don't need to TR you more I need to advance my reads goshdarnit xD

Why do you need tutuu to advance your reads?

Hearing other people's perspectives is useful. Especially if I've missed something.

Completely separate sidenote, why do people keep presuming that when I do something I need to do it? Like seriously, I could be doing something just because its one of the ways it can be done smh.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Jul 13, 2023 10:08 pm I don't have much time right now to dig in, but I do have some baseline philosophy of the game that I think is pertinent:

Day 1 was characterized by some frustrating trends. The game seemed to be weirdly factionalized (not in the usual way) between "reads camps", such that any one person's town reads suspected each other in various different iterations (especially my town reads), and there wasn't much cohesion or purpose to what was happening. That's going to need to change for this game to get onto the right track, and there is still plenty of time to see that it does. This doesn't mean anyone needs to change their reads necessarily, but it does demand an open ear and willingness to hear each other out.

I have a few methods in mind to sort things more thoroughly, and I will in due time.

Sounds good to me, and I look forward to it. Truth be told I haven't fully wrapped my head around the camps thing, and I think part of that is that maybe the two camps are organized differently. Like the 1st camp is largely organized by a commonality of town reads, and the 2nd camp is organized by a commonality of either susses or "I would be ok throwing this out". From the limited time I was at EoD, it seemed like there were only two groups of voters and they usually followed each-other. Sometimes that was because of me, sometimes it wasn't.

I'm unsure how productive looking into this could be though. It was day 1 after all, and I doubt its something the mafia were simply masterfully manipulating to their advantage while simultaneously being aware of it. Day 1 had plenty of posts and not everyone was able to keep up all the time. If there is some core issue with our collective solving however I'm all for detecting it and setting things clear.

I almost hate that I like your response.

I don't need to TR you more I need to advance my reads goshdarnit xD

tutuu wrote: ↑Thu Jul 13, 2023 9:58 pm

MartinGG99 wrote: ↑Thu Jul 13, 2023 9:56 pm

tutuu wrote: ↑Thu Jul 13, 2023 9:24 pm rico - imo towny via tone, towny attempt at solving despite him mowing down my towncore

tell me about the tone if you can describe it

tutuu wrote: ↑Thu Jul 13, 2023 9:24 pm lime coke - i dont see why he's town

expand on this if you can as well

fmpov lime coke has been preety decent if not lean town

rico - he seems confident that he knows what he's doing

lime coke - i can't. i dont see anything. thats why i dont see him being town

Reason why I asked is that, if I recall from memory correctly, Rico doesn't have much in the tone department but his progression and case on Scotty is decent enough that I can see it from a town perspective even if I have problems with it (biggest problem in particular was how he seemed to have issue with Scotty had "flat" pushes but IMO its typical of some towns to push more than a few buttons on d1 to get the game and solving going, and I don't see Rico giving that benefit of doubt that I would).

As for Lime, I think his tone has been fairly good at times. I think this post (link) is among the better examples. The fact that you say Rico has good tone while Lime (through omission you communicate that) doesn't have that is kinda the opposite of where I am on those two slots. Is there some other reason holding you back on Lime Coke?

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Jul 13, 2023 10:04 pm I thought day started later. I've been getting my time zones screwed up

It, in fact, was supposed to start like 2 hours ago. But delays happen, and I don't care to speculate over that. Could've been sudden IRL things for all I know.

tutuu wrote: ↑Thu Jul 13, 2023 9:54 pm maybe rondo took himself and martin out of the poll. seeing how a lot of roles are deisnged to be in pairs (mine, svs, perhaps rondno). seems like a towny role to me from a host perspective

I've come to conclusion that pondering about the poll disappearances isn't really going to advance any certain-enough conclusion, and so not really worth discussing.

Also if it is a single power that can remove two people at once (instead of some combo of mechanical factors) that seems really strong and begging for an NK by the mafia, as later-game that could screw up plans. So I'd rather not speculate on whoever it is too, unless that power seems to do more than just that and/or something nefarious.

tutuu wrote: ↑Thu Jul 13, 2023 9:24 pm rico - imo towny via tone, towny attempt at solving despite him mowing down my towncore

tell me about the tone if you can describe it

tutuu wrote: ↑Thu Jul 13, 2023 9:24 pm lime coke - i dont see why he's town

expand on this if you can as well

fmpov lime coke has been preety decent if not lean town

Creature wrote: ↑Thu Jul 13, 2023 9:41 pm

tutuu wrote: ↑Thu Jul 13, 2023 9:38 pm oh i forgot martin also claimed @Creature. he has like 35 posts, not too hard to find in iso, in case u missed it. imo its towny

He needs to be more obvious

I'll try being more open with my thoughts if that's what you'd like to see. But truth be told if its something that's "obvious town" then its a good chance I don't know or realize anything about it. So I'm just going to mostly keep doing what I've been doing.

so...."underwhelming" and "not obvious town"

Former, maaaaybe. I don't think so but its possible that's from old data. My mindset towards mafia has changed a mild bit over the years, but I don't think its drastic enough to suggest that I haven't put a fair amount of effort into this game as to what's typical of me.

Latter, nope. AFAIK people have trouble getting a consistent read on me unless you're Alison. If anything, I suspect I am more defined by wolf tells than town tells as a player. Correct cases of me being wolf are generally on me being wolfy or doing something suspicious/odd instead of "not being towny enough" or something of the sort.

OMFG SELF META!!!!! I'm only talking about it because there's legitimately no way I can defend myself on those subjects without referring to it.

Creature wrote: ↑Thu Jul 13, 2023 9:30 pm Seanzie and Martin are both wolfy

You're draconian.

No offense.

I was considering selfishly going for some lasagna (also lasagna is very tasty) but since it so happens that both people who died are also who voted me at one point or another d1

I'm gonna take the [VOTE: Shovel] aubergine and see if I can make use of SVS's day 1 gold in the future.

[VOTE: Falcon] aubergine

Interesting vote by Seanzie and I'd like to discuss that and his view of Falcon. I'm not quite sure what I want to discuss specifically though regarding Rico outside of stereotypical "why", I'll need to re-check my knowledge of Rico for like the 3rd time.

One of Falcon's responses towards seanzie was TRing him because Falcon was town...which is among the very few reasonings he has stated. Later he mentions being let to slank longer and it reads to me as having difficulty getting into the game but not wanting to admit it. At the very least I am hopeful to see more from them today.

Honestly disappointed about the SVS kill

I was reading up and thinking they were townier and yet when I'm arriving at that conclusion mafia just NKs them (I presume Vivax is the werebeaver kill)

RondoDimBuckle wrote: ↑Wed Jul 12, 2023 7:54 pm

MartinGG99 wrote: ↑Wed Jul 12, 2023 7:53 pm If I flip after claiming I will laugh at anyone who has ever claimed that Tutuu claimed too early.

A im not voting for you

B its role madness so everyone has a role

A you're rondo

B you're rondo

get rekt

If I flip after claiming I will laugh at anyone who has ever claimed that Tutuu claimed too early.

I can switch to vivax. Though I feel like part of me would be doing that out of spite ever since he called me inauthetic and that, well, from the time I've been here it feels like I've been the only case he has ever really had.

My vote, of course, is going to be self-pres from now on.

I've take a short break from playing with my friend as it has come to my attention that I'm the top wagon for some reason.

Given that I do not have much time to spend here and make a case or push, I am forced to claim.

I'm a role that can completely wipe out any mechanically-added votes against a person. I'm not claiming character, and not specifying the flavor in which that takes place (or if there are any limits to what vote-manipulation I can deny), in case there's character anti-claim. Ideally with these limits I have not satisfied any anti-claim against me while satisfactorily describing my role.

If this gets me night-killed then its probably better that way than to be misyeeted over what seems to be largely shrug yeeting and/or unsubstantiated cases (from what I could limitedly read while playing with my friend).

OH and for clarity's sake by reconsidering I mean that positively. I have more things to ponder about when I return to consciousness.

Vivax wrote: ↑Wed Jul 12, 2023 5:52 am

MartinGG99 wrote: ↑Wed Jul 12, 2023 5:48 am

Vivax wrote: ↑Wed Jul 12, 2023 5:35 am [snip by martin]

I´d be interested into your reads on rico, scotty, JJJ. No explanation required.

I´d ask about tutuu too (don´t spell it out loudly) but you think the claim made her town, while I keep in mind that fakeclaiming is possible. That´s what made me think you used an information angle where you knew she was town and threw the read out as a form of appeasement/earning townreads.

No explanation? I mean, that's kinda what my reads-list of sorts was a few hours ago. I grouped people from top to down. Higher up was more town and down lower was more suspect, though the biggest blob was my more-or-less null-equivalents.
spoiler space

Spoiler: show

MartinGG99 wrote: ↑Wed Jul 12, 2023 12:15 am tutuu

JaggedJimmyJay

Vivax
Lime Coke
Scotty
falcon45ca
Ricochet

RondoDimBuckle
Belzy
Creature
DrWilgy
Seanzie
Zenon
Porscha
motobot

S~V~S
die_meatbaby

Something like this? I would say? A lot of it feels like waiting for more to happen from certain people so I'm not sold on this arrangement. But it does bother me since my vote could go onto a person whom I could maybe solve later and I dislike being inefficient like that (unless I get lucky and its on a wolf). Better than letting Tutuu die though.

Looks like I'll have to see if I can be here tomorrow (IRL) more. No promises though since usually my Wednesday evenings are spent with a particular online friend unless they're too busy.

spoiler space
Anyone who is fake-claiming d1 is knowingly putting a huge risk of being caught in a lie for it. So I immediately disregarded any chance of it. Only time when I've actually seen that happen was when a town did it so they could suicide bomb another player on day 2 (they couldn't do it day 1).

Thanks. What do you think warrants voting DMB over SVS (which btw I forgot about, if you could explain to me what makes them mafia to you I might even agree with you on it)

Since I don‘t see them around much in general atp

The groupings aren't ordered within themselves. But re: DMB, I am reconsidering given their strong language in this game upon re-entrance. SVS I am hoping I will have a better idea of when they re-enter the thread, but if all else fails (in terms of what I'm hoping to develop from people) they among the people I'm most willing to vote for, off the top of my head. SVS reminded me (post link) a fair bit of a wolf teammate I recently had, or at least felt in similar style. It also feels like they've not really interacted much with or talked about, like, four people or something and for what they've done so far I hadn't really gauged anything positive. That was a big part of the reason I was hoping to see more of them before the day ends, although with how I'm avoiding sleep rn that may mean I'm cutting into my opportunity/time-constraints to look at that later.

I should probably go correct that and go to sleep now.

Vivax wrote: ↑Wed Jul 12, 2023 5:36 am I also don´t understand why you require a tutuu townread to form a read on Zenon

Most of Zenon's content had been on Tutuu, and that made it difficult to work with since part of it seemed from the whole fiasco earlier (like first half of d1) with heated emotions. I figured both mafia and town could probably be saying those things given the context. In my earlier mafia years if I got into a heated argument as wolf somethings I would lean into it more because I knew town me would say the same or similar things. Maybe I could've read for that, but I think any ability to catch that without knowing Zenon much before that is quite unlikely by anyone.

I did something more nuanced and drastic in the hopes it would help me solve them and not have them as null. Also, it wasn't specifically a requirement, for all I know if I had all the time and mafia wisdom in the world I would've had a better plan or something like that. This is what I thought of and its what I did.

Vivax wrote: ↑Wed Jul 12, 2023 5:35 am [snip by martin]

I´d be interested into your reads on rico, scotty, JJJ. No explanation required.

I´d ask about tutuu too (don´t spell it out loudly) but you think the claim made her town, while I keep in mind that fakeclaiming is possible. That´s what made me think you used an information angle where you knew she was town and threw the read out as a form of appeasement/earning townreads.

No explanation? I mean, that's kinda what my reads-list of sorts was a few hours ago. I grouped people from top to down. Higher up was more town and down lower was more suspect, though the biggest blob was my more-or-less null-equivalents.
spoiler space spoiler space
Anyone who is fake-claiming d1 is knowingly putting a huge risk of being caught in a lie for it. So I immediately disregarded any chance of it. Only time when I've actually seen that happen was when a town did it so they could suicide bomb another player on day 2 (they couldn't do it day 1).

Zenon wrote: ↑Wed Jul 12, 2023 5:32 am What is the point of pretending to TMI slip?

Zenon wrote: ↑Wed Jul 12, 2023 5:33 am Also I don't believe in slips in either direction tbh tbh

Well, if you had believed slips existed then I could've analyzed your knee-jerk reaction to it and see how far you took it or not, as me having TMI on Tutuu would imply you being very wrong on Tutuu while simultaneously pointing me out as wolf to you

Basically baiting/reaction testing, although I didn't have a specific idea of what is clearly bad or good. I was planning to review it all after waking up later but instead I've kinda skipped sleep for like 2 hours now.

Vivax wrote: ↑Wed Jul 12, 2023 5:20 am

MartinGG99 wrote: ↑Wed Jul 12, 2023 5:17 am

Vivax wrote: ↑Wed Jul 12, 2023 5:04 am

Vivax wrote: ↑Wed Jul 12, 2023 4:17 am

MartinGG99 wrote: ↑Wed Jul 12, 2023 2:14 am

Zenon wrote: ↑Wed Jul 12, 2023 2:09 am

MartinGG99 wrote: ↑Wed Jul 12, 2023 2:04 am

fwiw Tutuu mentioned most wagons are decided by a few votes (think they said 4) on TS

regardless of the truth of it, the perception there implies it would be a really simple decision for a !wolf Tutuu and their teammates to say they'll pile votes on someone and (probably) get away with it till late game

no claim necessary unless things are going down-hill

Okay why can't you claim later in the day the numbers are still the same. First wagons rarely go over in mafia games

because if the held perception (that most wagons pass with like 4 or 5 votes) is indeed true, then I don't see why not claim at that point in time

doing it later (like 12 hours before EoD instead of 24) increasingly risks it not having enough effect to cause a decisive shift away from them

there isn't a !town tutuu world where they don't believe in the claim they made, so the reason why they're town necessarily involves it -- especially when if they were wolf it would call for a different action instead of claiming which potentially boxes you in

This post is also worded from a perspective where he assumes all the information he gets is perfect.

If I had to call Martin mafia it´s because he builds his posts from a different vantage point. This one feels like it as well.

[VOTE: MartinGG99] aubergine

Either way, if he´s scum his pelt is mine even if I get mischopped.

To expand on this post and cause I like to quote myself in general, talking to myself leads to astounding results occasionally, his entire rationale I bolded in martin´s post reeks heavily informed and I would place the purpose of the post at "appearing right while sacrificing information others don´t have".

Which is something some mafia like to do to appear useful in my experience.

He aims at giving flawless reasoning to keep the heat off but that´s less townie than he thinks it is.

Vivax, why is it that the only thing you truly talk about me that isn't vague

is the preety obvious pretend-TMI slip I set up to see if Zenon would identify it or not

like seriously am I so vaguely inauthentic (your words btw) that the only real distinct evidence you have to support that is me interacting with zenon in a single post?

on the one hand I think there's a decent chance based on your prior reasons that you just don't vibe with me (which can happen between towns) but on the other hand this just rings opportunistic whereas prior you couldn't find solid ground to justify your stance against me

It´s less of a vibing issue than you looking to me like you´re fake contributing with your justification for tutuu´s alignment read revolving around her claim. Opportunism would require me to find townies to attach to and pocket and then imitate their reasoning to vote a popular wagon.

But as it looks like I claim hipster rights to the scumread on you instead of that.

I have yet to get a vibe where you dig into something that makes you think a player is mafia and then pursue that at least for a while, but it looks to me like you´re the imitator. No offense.

My justification (specifically the reasoning regarding the claim) was only provided when I decided to defend Tutuu, and only did so in the interest of potentially solving Zenon (and maybe others who interacted with the TMI assumption). Multiple people have implied or directly said before-then that Tutuu was not going to be the chop for the day, so there was no real towncred in defending Tutuu or re-affirming a consistent read I've had since early into the game. Maybe I would've looked smart, but that intelligence would've held very little impact in people's eyes. It wouldn't have changed the game at all really.

Not everyone figures mafia day 1. Unless you're Macdougall, in which case at some point in the day everyone has been figured as mafia at one point or another.

The only credit I am giving to you about your suspicions of me is that its semi-accurate, in that is generally one of my go-to's as mafia. Most notably whenever I decide to white-knight someone. But Tutuu did not need white-knighting and I wasn't going to gain anything from it. I only engaged in something looking of the sort when Zenon persisted in their suspicion of Tutuu.

Vivax wrote: ↑Wed Jul 12, 2023 5:04 am

Vivax wrote: ↑Wed Jul 12, 2023 4:17 am

MartinGG99 wrote: ↑Wed Jul 12, 2023 2:14 am

Zenon wrote: ↑Wed Jul 12, 2023 2:09 am

MartinGG99 wrote: ↑Wed Jul 12, 2023 2:04 am

Zenon wrote: ↑Wed Jul 12, 2023 1:54 am You aren't conformable you are using it on someone in the PoE who could just be your scum bud. Your role is categorically not confirmable to the majority of the player base.

You have used zero compelling arguments to try to pull my vote off you. Your claim was way to early. It feels like a LAMIST attempt to pull votes off yourself with a role claim that isn't heavily town sided.

If your unwilling to use the doc on someone that is not PoEd and heavily town read than your not willing to work with town than you are not confirmable. Not to me.

fwiw Tutuu mentioned most wagons are decided by a few votes (think they said 4) on TS

regardless of the truth of it, the perception there implies it would be a really simple decision for a !wolf Tutuu and their teammates to say they'll pile votes on someone and (probably) get away with it till late game

no claim necessary unless things are going down-hill

Okay why can't you claim later in the day the numbers are still the same. First wagons rarely go over in mafia games

because if the held perception (that most wagons pass with like 4 or 5 votes) is indeed true, then I don't see why not claim at that point in time

doing it later (like 12 hours before EoD instead of 24) increasingly risks it not having enough effect to cause a decisive shift away from them

there isn't a !town tutuu world where they don't believe in the claim they made, so the reason why they're town necessarily involves it -- especially when if they were wolf it would call for a different action instead of claiming which potentially boxes you in

This post is also worded from a perspective where he assumes all the information he gets is perfect.

If I had to call Martin mafia it´s because he builds his posts from a different vantage point. This one feels like it as well.

[VOTE: MartinGG99] aubergine

Either way, if he´s scum his pelt is mine even if I get mischopped.

To expand on this post and cause I like to quote myself in general, talking to myself leads to astounding results occasionally, his entire rationale I bolded in martin´s post reeks heavily informed and I would place the purpose of the post at "appearing right while sacrificing information others don´t have".

Which is something some mafia like to do to appear useful in my experience.

He aims at giving flawless reasoning to keep the heat off but that´s less townie than he thinks it is.

Vivax, why is it that the only thing you truly talk about me that isn't vague

is the preety obvious pretend-TMI slip I set up to see if Zenon would identify it or not

like seriously am I so vaguely inauthentic (your words btw) that the only real distinct evidence you have to support that is me interacting with zenon in a single post?

on the one hand I think there's a decent chance based on your prior reasons that you just don't vibe with me (which can happen between towns) but on the other hand this just rings opportunistic whereas prior you couldn't find solid ground to justify your stance against me

Zenon wrote: ↑Wed Jul 12, 2023 2:09 am

MartinGG99 wrote: ↑Wed Jul 12, 2023 2:04 am

Zenon wrote: ↑Wed Jul 12, 2023 1:54 am You aren't conformable you are using it on someone in the PoE who could just be your scum bud. Your role is categorically not confirmable to the majority of the player base.

You have used zero compelling arguments to try to pull my vote off you. Your claim was way to early. It feels like a LAMIST attempt to pull votes off yourself with a role claim that isn't heavily town sided.

If your unwilling to use the doc on someone that is not PoEd and heavily town read than your not willing to work with town than you are not confirmable. Not to me.

fwiw Tutuu mentioned most wagons are decided by a few votes (think they said 4) on TS

regardless of the truth of it, the perception there implies it would be a really simple decision for a !wolf Tutuu and their teammates to say they'll pile votes on someone and (probably) get away with it till late game

no claim necessary unless things are going down-hill

Okay why can't you claim later in the day the numbers are still the same. First wagons rarely go over in mafia games

because if the held perception (that most wagons pass with like 4 or 5 votes) is indeed true, then I don't see why not claim at that point in time

doing it later (like 12 hours before EoD instead of 24) increasingly risks it not having enough effect to cause a decisive shift away from them

there isn't a !town tutuu world where they don't believe in the claim they made, so the reason why they're town necessarily involves it -- especially when if they were wolf it would call for a different action instead of claiming which potentially boxes you in

tutuu wrote: ↑Wed Jul 12, 2023 2:01 am

Ricochet wrote: ↑Wed Jul 12, 2023 2:00 am Now that it comes up, why JJJ, tutuu?

Youre gonna love it Rico

Ready?

Okay, brace yourself...

Spoiler: show

he picked non-food

tutuu wrote: ↑Wed Jul 12, 2023 2:02 am

MartinGG99 wrote: ↑Wed Jul 12, 2023 2:01 am

Ricochet wrote: ↑Wed Jul 12, 2023 1:39 am So, what did I miss?

don't really know what you've missed since I'm not you and cannot telepathically access your memories. I know you've left at a certain point but I cannot magically infer exactly what happened after that and what didn't happen after that in my memories

I love martingg99

I thought the spoiler was a signature and so I misread this as an accidental combo of (mis)posts saying that the reason JJJ is the target is because they love me lol

Zenon wrote: ↑Wed Jul 12, 2023 1:54 am You aren't conformable you are using it on someone in the PoE who could just be your scum bud. Your role is categorically not confirmable to the majority of the player base.

You have used zero compelling arguments to try to pull my vote off you. Your claim was way to early. It feels like a LAMIST attempt to pull votes off yourself with a role claim that isn't heavily town sided.

If your unwilling to use the doc on someone that is not PoEd and heavily town read than your not willing to work with town than you are not confirmable. Not to me.

fwiw Tutuu mentioned most wagons are decided by a few votes (think they said 4) on TS

regardless of the truth of it, the perception there implies it would be a really simple decision for a !wolf Tutuu and their teammates to say they'll pile votes on someone and (probably) get away with it till late game

no claim necessary unless things are going down-hill

Ricochet wrote: ↑Wed Jul 12, 2023 1:39 am So, what did I miss?

don't really know what you've missed since I'm not you and cannot telepathically access your memories. I know you've left at a certain point but I cannot magically infer exactly what happened after that and what didn't happen after that in my memories

Zenon wrote: ↑Wed Jul 12, 2023 1:54 am

MartinGG99 wrote: ↑Wed Jul 12, 2023 1:54 am

Zenon wrote: ↑Wed Jul 12, 2023 1:46 am

MartinGG99 wrote: ↑Wed Jul 12, 2023 1:25 am It was only a matter of time before other people figured out they could post in #Landing-Pad as well. Sigh.

I hope this game does not devolve into using that instead of the forum, and I would like to ask others not to use it as well even if discord permissions still allow them to do so at a later point in time.

For the record, Belzy sent a waving sticker thingy to Dyslexicon. Rondo soon followed up by waving everyone in the same manner in said channel.

But like why does this matter why is it game relevant? Why is waving in a discord bad?

Its not. But It would be quite troublesome if we had to ISO stuff on this site and then have to cross-reference that with searches in discord, plus potential hosting issues with that given the host appears new to running a discord hub.

Once a message is placed there it is either irrevocably there or the host decides to wipe out stuff that actually happened from the game itself.

Either of which I don't really like, and hence why I got upset at so much as just waiving because all we'll need is another "in for a penny, in for a pound" argument and before you know it its a bunch people posting in there just because someone else did first. Something something snowball-esque/slippery slope effect.

I don't think anyone is going to play the game on discord though... like...????

/shrug

we got differences in opinion and how wise it is to leave a discord channel open to such possibilities, and personally I find my point proven the very moment we all got pinged on discord from it, but that's my opinion

Like even at the very moment I was writing my initial post about the issue, even Tutuu added in one wave lol.

Zenon wrote: ↑Wed Jul 12, 2023 1:46 am

MartinGG99 wrote: ↑Wed Jul 12, 2023 1:25 am It was only a matter of time before other people figured out they could post in #Landing-Pad as well. Sigh.

I hope this game does not devolve into using that instead of the forum, and I would like to ask others not to use it as well even if discord permissions still allow them to do so at a later point in time.

For the record, Belzy sent a waving sticker thingy to Dyslexicon. Rondo soon followed up by waving everyone in the same manner in said channel.

But like why does this matter why is it game relevant? Why is waving in a discord bad?

Its not. But It would be quite troublesome if we had to ISO stuff on this site and then have to cross-reference that with searches in discord, plus potential hosting issues with that given the host appears new to running a discord hub.

Once a message is placed there it is either irrevocably there or the host decides to wipe out stuff that actually happened from the game itself.

Either of which I don't really like, and hence why I got upset at so much as just waiving because all we'll need is another "in for a penny, in for a pound" argument and before you know it its a bunch people posting in there just because someone else did first. Something something snowball-esque/slippery slope effect.

It was only a matter of time before other people figured out they could post in #Landing-Pad as well. Sigh.

I hope this game does not devolve into using that instead of the forum, and I would like to ask others not to use it as well even if discord permissions still allow them to do so at a later point in time.

For the record, Belzy sent a waving sticker thingy to Dyslexicon. Rondo soon followed up by waving everyone in the same manner in said channel.

I'll ofc be here for a few more hours but I'll be doing other stuff. I just don't expect much activity around that time.