The Syndicate

Unless we want a re-run of GoC

[VOTE: Alison] aubergine

We can kill Chop Chop tomorrow.

Alison likely has a night-vig. So does Frank Horrigan, potentially. Which means they can do up to 3 kills tonight, and we can save one by deleting them.

Fairly sure I spent like most of D1-D3 thinking where I could get allies for my alignment.

Like you have to consider alliances in this game, if you don't then you might be scum lol.

Urist wrote: ↑Tue Mar 16, 2021 3:02 pm
Marmot wrote: ↑Tue Mar 16, 2021 2:59 pm Guys, Urist is caught in a lie right now, or am I crazy?
you're reading way too much into the fact that i'm voting for alison. yeeting her today actually is the optimal play but i don't think anyone is listening or cares anyway.

^

Yall are reading into it too much imo. Even more so, Alison recently admitted that she's reliant on the Enclave to not get killed as her enemies are likely confirmed town.

Long Con wrote: ↑Tue Mar 16, 2021 2:44 pm What are the chances that chop chop and Tony are just engaged in massive distancing all game? Chop's single-minded insistence on Tony's death approach the level of comical unbelievability.

I've strongly town-read Tony independently of that. I don't think the distancing and bussing theory is true.

Besides, if both of them were wolves and this got resolved on like, D3, its possible the other would get quite town-read and then possibly shot by Vault City or something.

Long Con wrote: ↑Tue Mar 16, 2021 2:42 pm Hey so can I count on the thread generally to kill Hubologists? I think I need them all dead to win?

You need all but one dead.

AFAIK, or at least in the worlds and theories I have built, there has been little evidence to suggest any non-wastelander faction has had 3 players in it, only two at most.

If it was possible to have 3 players for a faction I feel that it would have become apparent sooner.

You guys could do that*

Well, actually guys could do that.

I don't particularly mind as a New Reno member unless it helps Enclave which Alison may have to.

Someone should put a vote on Alison.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Fri Feb 26, 2021 12:28 am You are an intimidator. For every three consecutive day phases in which you do not receive a vote in the final poll tally, you will begin the following phase with one vote automatically removed from you in the elimination poll. These do not stack.

ChopChop wrote: ↑Tue Mar 16, 2021 9:29 am I’m practically caught wolf anyway because I made the wrong choice, nothing I can do.

IIRC I think I was going to scum-read you more for simply choosing Epignosis anyways, plus with the protective claim even if you said Alison was a slaver I would still have doubts in my mind about you.

Oh and I forgot to include Dom in the dead towns list. Woops.

Yeah I'm fairly sure everyone in my town-read pile is town.

Only doubt I can imagine is if Poison / Syn / Seanzie happens to be an enclave vigilante, but given they're the only Redding that I know of, I'm not really looking to evaluate them in-depth. At a glance though nothing really pinged me from that slot on a serious level.

The dead towns
BoKnows - Wastelander
c4e5g3d5 - Wastelander
DrWilgy - Wastelander
falcon45ca - Jagged Jimmy J
Rej - New Reno
staypositivefriend - Hubologist
Sloonei - Wastelander
KZA - NCR
NANOOK - NCR

The town-read; some aren't 100% cleared but for my theory purposes they are.
Epignosis - Chosen One / Arroyo
reywaS / Kylemii - Matt / BoS
MartinGG99 - Louis / New Reno
TonyStarkPrime - IDK what exactly he is but I think he's lock-town or a wolf I would lose to
Urist - Some sort of protective; May be one of our only protectives.
Poison / Syn / Seanzie - Likely Sheriff Marion / Only Redding?

The likely or possible towns
Grogu - Hubologist
Long Con - Wastelander

To Be Determined
Jackofhearts2005 - Unkown
Marmot - Unkown
Spacedaisy / sprityo - Unkown; should be re-evaluated in light of Wolf chop chop.

Slaver
Alison - Slaver

Vault City (Dead)
MacDougall - Vault City
Esooa - Vault City

Enclave
ChopChop - Enclave
Daughter of Omega - Enclave

So my current **working theory** of the game clears Epi + Urist + Me + TSP + Kylemii + Seanzie

Alison 100% as slaver

And if there's any towns left its probably Grogu and LC.

Everyone else should probably be re-evaluated imo. Possibly including Space Daisy / Sprityo.

Oh and btw I thought about Urist possibly being a fake protective and the scum doing something dumb such as shooting Alison since slaver has a vest but I think that would've changed ChopChop's "result" and visit earlier.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Fri Feb 26, 2021 1:07 am 5. All voting will be decided by plurality at the day phase deadlines. There is no majority or hammer vote.

@'ing the host about it probably isn't going to rush things.

Grogu wrote: ↑Tue Mar 16, 2021 3:51 am
MartinGG99 wrote: ↑Tue Mar 16, 2021 1:34 am
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Tue Mar 16, 2021 1:33 am chop being a wolf makes five more likely because of the day 3 vote count: wolves just couldn't get traction elsewhere
I'm not sure. 5 Enclave wolves with 2 Vault City seems preety strong in an environment where towns are meant to rip each other apart a bit.
Was there only 2 vaults? Why the hell would the other scum team have more than double?

Because the other team has a whole lot more enemies than Vault City does.

And yes, there was only 2 vault city players. When Mac was deleted on D4, the host said Vault City was destroyed, because that's related to scenarios where the game ends.

Grogu wrote: ↑Tue Mar 16, 2021 3:28 am
MartinGG99 wrote: ↑Mon Mar 15, 2021 11:59 pm
Grogu wrote: ↑Mon Mar 15, 2021 11:53 pm If there’s like 2 more chop can safely die
When has there been a case where someone can safely die in this game other than D3???? lol

And you protected DOOM on that day despite the mech info against them.
That is incorrect. I never protected anyone this game

Grogu wrote: ↑Sat Mar 06, 2021 10:01 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Sat Mar 06, 2021 9:52 pm
Grogu wrote: ↑Sat Mar 06, 2021 9:51 pm
DaughterOfOmega wrote: ↑Sat Mar 06, 2021 9:29 pm Kill me if you want, though I'd advise you spend time on trying to find mafia since way more greens have died, though I don't feel liek trying so if killing me is what you come to lose, it gets me out of feeling obligated to show up
This is always town. Last night it was clear we had scum between chop and rej. We made the wromg choice and should kill chop today. Why is no one voting them?
What makes this always town? I have experienced wolves post similar things.
I feel her pain in the posts, she never claimed Nanook role. She softed things and that’s towny. She had no pressure and is towny on tone. She seems really annoyed of being misread. We played together almost every game, super easy read.

I have no clue. I looked through the user control panel thing but can't see an option for it. If you go to Overview -> Front Page of the control panel you might see it. Or at least I can for myself.

I just realized TSP has spent more than 10% of his total posts since 2017 in this game.

MartinGG99 wrote: ↑Tue Mar 16, 2021 1:34 am
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Tue Mar 16, 2021 1:33 am chop being a wolf makes five more likely because of the day 3 vote count: wolves just couldn't get traction elsewhere
I'm not sure. 6 total Enclave wolves with 2 Vault City seems preety strong in an environment where towns are meant to rip each other apart a bit.

I meant 6 not 5.

If we were to believe that the contingency is only meant for like when Enclave gets steamrolled.

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Tue Mar 16, 2021 1:33 am chop being a wolf makes five more likely because of the day 3 vote count: wolves just couldn't get traction elsewhere

I'm not sure. 5 Enclave wolves with 2 Vault City seems preety strong in an environment where towns are meant to rip each other apart a bit.

Including Chop Chop in that count btw.

I suspect only 3 or 4 more Enclave. Considering 3 "scum" have already died and we've already confirmed who the Slaver is.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Fri Feb 26, 2021 12:28 am Contingency win condition: If the Enclave is eliminated by the end of Night 5, all of the above factions win the game. This supersedes individual faction win conditions.

Urist wrote: ↑Tue Mar 16, 2021 1:21 am well chopchop is talking about lylo tomorrow so i guess there are 5 enclave alive rn

I don't think so. That would make for 6 enclave? We would basically have to night-kill one and consistently yeet them to meet the contingency win-con that we recently passed.

Well, we still don't know if Epi was attacked but I don't see any other claims about the attack.

Yet he still visited Epignosis. Coincidentally when Epi was attacked.

I specifically mentioned how I only targeted two people, and only one of them was Alison. Thus we could dodge any false positives on Alison if Epi already targeted more than just Alison (which he likely has as the Chosen One).

I still doubt IMO.

Chop Chop could have spied on me but didn't even when I've @ him about it on D5.

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Tue Mar 16, 2021 1:23 am chop is hypothesizing that epi was RBed (which doesn't track with marmot's confirmation)

Oh. I see.

ChopChop wrote: ↑Tue Mar 16, 2021 1:06 am I mean I suppose this is also probable.

You self-admitted to getting negative feedback instead of no feedback. If you had gotten no-feedback, you would've been firstly concerned about a role-block. After all, you've been tunneling on Alison for many day phases and if there was even the slightest chance of your result being false you would've said it before I made my case on you.

Role-blocks prevent feedback on the abilities that they block, in the vast majority of games that I have seen.

So you would've gotten 0 feedback if you had been role-blocked.

ChopChop wrote: ↑Tue Mar 16, 2021 12:57 am 2)How would my action not have gotten any feedback when I target the night after EPig targeted Alison not the same.

It specifically says you would get negative feedback.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Fri Feb 26, 2021 12:28 am Separately, you are a 1-shot faction spy. You keep a close eye on the NCR Rangers and their conflict with the Slavers to aid in your own mission. Once during the game during any night phase, you may select a player. You will be told whether or not that player has ever targeted the Slaver during any previous night phase.

Not "if that player has targeted/visited that slaver, you will learn of it" or something like that.

ChopChop wrote: ↑Tue Mar 16, 2021 12:22 am After my flip if Town still doesn’t realize it’s Tony, I’m gonna lose my mind!

Him ending it off with that, this feels notably different from LC's reaction to me on D5.

ChopChop goes all mechanical without emphasizing on how he has been acting is a !town him. Generally speaking a town, when alleged as scum, may angrily or assertively point out their own behavior as towny because *they know* they are town.

Whereas LC seemed to genuinely believe him putting a deciding vote on Mac on D4 was town, indicative of him, and asserted that repeatedly.

First of all, TSP potentially could have not predicted who I was, much less that him releasing on that night, if he was curling, would lead to you being mech-confirmed very likely scum.

Secondly, I don't know what "failure" means but I imagine its effectively a role-block. Your action wouldn't have gotten any feedback. Yet you said Alison wasn't slaver, as if you got negative feedback.

Thirdly, Marmot has pointed out that you could have motive for not confirming her as slaver.

Fourthly, we don't have any proof that you even tried to make a 2nd message. Only that you visited them by your own admission.

Other than this case, of course.

Grogu wrote: ↑Mon Mar 15, 2021 11:53 pm If there’s like 2 more chop can safely die

When has there been a case where someone can safely die in this game other than D3???? lol

And you protected DOOM on that day despite the mech info against them.

I sincerely thought he was that stupid to get stuck on TSP and Alison,

but maybe I'm just the mostly stupid one. But hey, I'll improve in the future. Hopefully.

Not that we discussed this game anywhere, but I had other recent ongoing games in the past with him.

Sigh. I sincerely thought the guy was going to be a very hard read in the future if he's scum this game.

I just didn't want him to be scum. But he is and apparently I shouldn't underestimate that guy.

He just did some things not here that felt like it was genuine to me with his motivation of a new playstyle in this game and I just got fooled by it.

Rip Tony's gonna be unhappy.

Kylemii wrote: ↑Mon Mar 15, 2021 11:11 pm why does chop do any of that stuff if he's mafia though

why does he get mech information against him such as this if he's BoS though

And urist at start of today's day phase said he saved Epignosis.

ChopChop wrote: ↑Mon Mar 15, 2021 9:38 pm
MartinGG99 wrote: ↑Mon Mar 15, 2021 9:00 pm
ChopChop wrote: ↑Mon Mar 15, 2021 8:49 pm OMFG!
How TF is Alison not Slaver!
Who did you target @ChopChop
EPiggy

here he just admitted visit Epignosis

ChopChop wrote: ↑Tue Mar 09, 2021 8:44 pm TF Scum, I just wasted my last message on Sloon.
Why would you kill someone like Sloon?
Honestly, this game is stupid.

ChopChop wrote: ↑Wed Mar 10, 2021 12:54 am
Urist wrote: ↑Wed Mar 10, 2021 12:52 am chopchop tell us the truth
did you kill slooneitunes
No I was gonna message them this:
/Message Sloon

Congratulations!
You have won a Free Day Vig.
But ONLY and ONLY if you state all you have targeted during the nights in the public chat during today in this day phase.
IF and only IF you have target Alison you will receive an additional Day Vig.
BUT and only BUT if you vote Alison today, you will receive a Universal Janitor to go with it.

On D4 he admits to messaging Sloonei.

Kylemii wrote: ↑Mon Mar 15, 2021 11:03 pm
MartinGG99 wrote: ↑Mon Mar 15, 2021 10:50 pm You forgot to include the aspect that Chop Chop admitting to visiting a dead player and a player that was probably attacked.

Then that is all correct.
this new part confuses me

It's not really new.

Chop Chop admitted to messaging Sloonei the night Sloon died, and he recently admitted to faction-spying Epignosis.

Urist earlier said he saved Epignosis from last night's attack. Add two and two together, and its likely Chop Chop has been carrying the Enclave kills as of late.

Seanzie wrote: ↑Mon Mar 15, 2021 11:01 pm Sorry, I am missing part of the story. Has Chop Chop claimed something? And if so, what have they claimed their role has done thus far?

They claimed Luke of the Brotherhood of Steel since D2. They sent a message to Space Daisy on n1 as I said in my summary to you earlier.

We held off on him for the most part because he was the only known BoS, and there's garunteed 1 player of each faction.

However, Kyle appears to be Matt of the BoS. That, and the fact that Chop Chop just lied about his faction spy attempt makes him quite likely to be the Enclave messenger role. Unless Epignosis lied about targeting alison.

Chop Chop also used his 2nd message on Sloonei the night he died, and faction-spied Epignosis the night Epignosis probably was attacked.

This isn't something that I planned recently like scum might've

this is my fucking life story right here

I also said this on D2.

MartinGG99 wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 5:03 pm Epignosis has to be Enclave if he's a deep wolf. Otherwise only way he's scum is if there's an individual town sub-faction wincon against him.

I won't be immediately explaining how I got that mech info.

I was 100% confident in this information with exception to any mechanical interference such as a n1 role-block.

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