The Syndicate

This falcon flashwagon is extremely anti-town.

dyachei wrote: ↑Sat Jul 16, 2022 6:17 pm i dont want to vote seanzie, dunya, alison, SS or NAA today. who does that leave?

HK and Sabi

Shending_Help wrote: ↑Sat Jul 16, 2022 6:08 pm Wanna add tension? I'm down to start a cfd, I got 3 lvls of spicyness for you:

Spice lv 0: falcon

Spice lv 1: Jack

Spice lv 2: Alison

... Thoughts?

What are your cases on these three?

Eh, still want to do it. [VOTE: unvote] aubergine

Ugh, I was gonna unvote Sabi to tie it and add tension to the thread, but then Sabi claimed, and now if I unvote, it will look like it is in reaction to the claim, whereas the claim makes me feel very little right now, so that puts me in a weird spot because I kinda still want to unvote.

dyachei wrote: ↑Sat Jul 16, 2022 2:18 pm

Seanzie wrote: ↑Sat Jul 16, 2022 2:15 pm I skimmed a few D1s from Sabiplz, and am okay staying on them. I'm not going to promise I read the games super close, but nothing about her town v scum made me think she is town now, and a few things made me think she could be wolf (she felt a lot more comfortable in her first MU game than she does here, and as town she seems to do more reads and less casing, whereas here and in at least one of her mafia games, she did what felt more like casing on D1 rather than reads). I don't think these meta reads should hold too much weight, but the fact that they point negatively makes me okay staying where I'm at.

I think they prefer they/them to she.

I will say I always wolf read sabi early and it's hard for me to get a handle on them. They are usually easier to read as the game goes on, at least in turbos

Thanks for the correction, and sorry @Sabiplz for the misgender. I will try hard to use your preferred pronouns from here on out.

I skimmed a few D1s from Sabiplz, and am okay staying on them. I'm not going to promise I read the games super close, but nothing about her town v scum made me think she is town now, and a few things made me think she could be wolf (she felt a lot more comfortable in her first MU game than she does here, and as town she seems to do more reads and less casing, whereas here and in at least one of her mafia games, she did what felt more like casing on D1 rather than reads). I don't think these meta reads should hold too much weight, but the fact that they point negatively makes me okay staying where I'm at.

[VOTE: sabiplz] aubergine

Kinda like both wagons tbh.

Sabiplz wrote: ↑Sat Jul 16, 2022 1:38 pm

Seanzie wrote: ↑Sat Jul 16, 2022 1:34 pm

Sabiplz wrote: ↑Sat Jul 16, 2022 12:35 pm

Marmot wrote: ↑Sat Jul 16, 2022 12:26 pm

Sabiplz wrote: ↑Sat Jul 16, 2022 12:19 pm

Marmot wrote: ↑Sat Jul 16, 2022 12:17 pm

Shending_Help wrote: ↑Sat Jul 16, 2022 12:09 pm LOL

For like 5 seconds I thought Marmot was having the exact same problems with my response to the wisdom post as sabi had earlier, but thank the lord it was just a misquoted sabi post

For a second, I was concerned now that the content of sabi's post that I responded to weren't actually things that she said lol.

But I'm pretty certain they were based on the content.

What did you not like about my content. Be honest with me.

I explained it in P#207 (if you scroll past the final failed quote tag). I don't like that you're discrediting everyone's attempts to read LC's draft process.

For naa:

2) Lime Coke thinks I'm bad at mafia
3) Lime Coke thinks I'm bad at town

I hate the self meta. Hasn't included any proof of these sentiments and last I checked Brad only dislikes a handful of players and his name has never came up when he discusses that.

For wisdom:

I quite literally explained Alison. Since the cats V dogs game is over can quote something Brad said in dvc about Alison as mafia if that's allowed? Please lmk

For sean:

Idk if Brad would. Do. That strategy. That's all.

I agree with NAA's read. If NAA was chosen, it was specifically a wifom choice.

Who in this game has Brad talked about disliking?

What. strategy. is. that?

No one mentioned on the playerlist that's why I don't get the whole Brad hates me hence why I'm not mafia. There's two players I know Brad wouldn't include as mafia for how polarizing they are as mafia and can easily sr for it. One of those people in more confident on not being it (Alison) then the other (wisdom).

Sorry I'm phone posting.

You only know like half the playerlist here. I don't know in what capacity you know Brad, but I would be surprised if he routinely talked bad to you about people he doesn't expect you to know (like NAA or other people here on a site you don't normally play on). Did this factor into you "people's takes on Brad are bad" take?

I don't really get your Brad/Alison take. She is one of the best wolves on this site, and I feel like Brad is cognizant of this.

Why are you sorry about phone posting?

Sabiplz wrote: ↑Sat Jul 16, 2022 1:21 pm

Shending_Help wrote: ↑Sat Jul 16, 2022 6:09 am

Sabiplz wrote: ↑Sat Jul 16, 2022 1:16 am
Shending_help:

I really like their tone in this opening posts. Feels very nature and genuine.

Shending_Help wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 2:52 pm Yeah i mean, vibing is what we need rn to get things rolling, hard to go tryhard mode with 50 posts in the thread

And to your response... *fair enough*

I have play a bunch of turbo games with Swede here. When they are wolf they have difficulties articulating reads and feel very stiff and safe. When town they are very brazen and loud with their reads. What I mean is they don't mind dropping controversial takes when town. This post below is very much in their town meta range:

Shending_Help wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 3:09 pm My spiciest read is that Sean might be TWTBAW

literally just posting "first" and nothing else, and then later popping in with "yeah i can get behind this *votes HK*"

It's far from a solid read, but i kinda believe he'd post *something* else in either of his pop-ins if woofing

Anyway I like this post, very much shows Swede being comfortable, showing progression in their thoughts.

Shending_Help wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 3:36 pm I don't have any hard input on what exact players Limecoke/Brad would pick as mafia or not.

But i do have thoughts.

To balance a game like this the PRs / Mechanics that Lime has available to him must be EXTREMELY strong/interesting. Otherwise there would be no point in picking them over actual extra players in the mafia team. Therefore I strongly believe Limecoke couldn't resist picking at least 2+ of those PR / mechanics that he found the most alure towards, to see how they played out while he's speccing the game.

If he was gonna play too? Then i could see him just picking the max amount of players if he thought that was +EV, but as a spec? It sounds much more interesting to see if the OP mechanics you picked could work out towards a win than if a huge scumteam could pull it through.

TL;DR: i don't think there's 5-6 maf. Think there might even be 2 if i had to bet tbh

The last bit about about guessing how many mafia there is feels like a town slip. Yes I think all town slips are fake but this kinda feels real.

All the praise about Swede kinda gone with this post. I feel like as soon as she faced someone familar push back on them their tone got way more stiff. I dunno feels very uncomfortable to me.

Shending_Help wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 6:36 pm

Wisdom wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 6:24 pm

Shending_Help wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 6:06 pm Think wisdoms read on HK is villagery. Both the part about HKs treatment of Axe and the analysis of what t!HK would've done

You are also a wolf and this is a pocket attempt!!!

With all the hype (!!!) I can't decipher if you're joking or not, but maybe thats by design

But...

No I swear I'm not!!!

Hmm.

I havent actually played a normal non-turbo game with Sabi before so, I'd like some input from others on this progression on me.

1) sabi: "shending's opening rly towny/natural"
2) sabi: “shending is very stiff and safe as a wolf, which is unlike here *shows example*" "he's comfortable, showing progression"
3) sabi: "I don't generally believe in townslips but this seems like a townslip."
4) lastly she takes away all earlier positive thoughts from a single jokey response to a post from Wisdom that she didn't even agree with (that I still read as more of a joke than anything else).

And it's all done in a single catch-up post as well. I always feel iffy when people post a long progression of "oh I'm changing my mind here look at this" in a post that can be edited before posting. Like I understand that townies do it sometimes too, but I think it's rand W tbh. Especially when in this case I don't really believe Sabi would completely drop me down to Full Null (or even more?) from 1 bad small joke post when she was earlier talking so confidently about me having done like 3-4 things she found very towny. Meta stuff as well as non-meta stuff.

My reaction is to just snap kill this, but I need input from other ppl here

I can link my games that's aren't turbos.

I like to show my progression in thoughts in posts. Every day one, except one where I was town pr, I have struggled in.

I also did that post at like midnight after being awake since 6 am and on two cold meds so I apologize for how bad it is.

Linking a few games would be nice (preferably at least one town and one mafia)

hollowkatt wrote: ↑Sat Jul 16, 2022 12:44 pm

Seanzie wrote: ↑Sat Jul 16, 2022 12:38 am

hollowkatt wrote: ↑Sat Jul 16, 2022 12:21 am

Cape90 wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 8:27 pm

hollowkatt wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 6:50 pm

Wisdom wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 6:23 pm

hollowkatt wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 6:12 pm

why would town HK call you a wolf and go to bed? You are the same Wisdom that always makes a point to comment "you're reading me wrong again" when I wolf read you, right?

That never stopped you!!!^^

Because you typically make posts I want to wolf read!
Just so happens this time you didn't

Differences between the ways Wisdom is posting mow vs how they usually post?

Most often it's a weird early read that she has, or a push that she makes that I think is wrong/on obvs town, or she doesn't have a read I would expect her to have. I don't see that going on here so I'm offering up an early town read

Is Wisdom usually town or wolf when you wolfread her early for this sort of thing?

she's usually town and her pushes are usually town as well.

So you're townreading her for not doing things that she usually does as town? You're gonna have to unpack this one for me.

Sabiplz wrote: ↑Sat Jul 16, 2022 12:35 pm

Marmot wrote: ↑Sat Jul 16, 2022 12:26 pm

Sabiplz wrote: ↑Sat Jul 16, 2022 12:19 pm

Marmot wrote: ↑Sat Jul 16, 2022 12:17 pm

Shending_Help wrote: ↑Sat Jul 16, 2022 12:09 pm LOL

For like 5 seconds I thought Marmot was having the exact same problems with my response to the wisdom post as sabi had earlier, but thank the lord it was just a misquoted sabi post

For a second, I was concerned now that the content of sabi's post that I responded to weren't actually things that she said lol.

But I'm pretty certain they were based on the content.

What did you not like about my content. Be honest with me.

I explained it in P#207 (if you scroll past the final failed quote tag). I don't like that you're discrediting everyone's attempts to read LC's draft process.

For naa:

2) Lime Coke thinks I'm bad at mafia
3) Lime Coke thinks I'm bad at town

I hate the self meta. Hasn't included any proof of these sentiments and last I checked Brad only dislikes a handful of players and his name has never came up when he discusses that.

For wisdom:

I quite literally explained Alison. Since the cats V dogs game is over can quote something Brad said in dvc about Alison as mafia if that's allowed? Please lmk

For sean:

Idk if Brad would. Do. That strategy. That's all.

I agree with NAA's read. If NAA was chosen, it was specifically a wifom choice.

Who in this game has Brad talked about disliking?

What. strategy. is. that?

Shending_Help wrote: ↑Sat Jul 16, 2022 12:33 pm "which if LC drafted specifically players he liked, then sabi would definitely be one of them."

Regardless on whether sabi is actually W or not, I think this is a very towny thought to have from Marmot

How is this towny? I feel fine about Marmot, but looking at this point in isolation, it could easily be pure agenda.

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sat Jul 16, 2022 11:50 am Hey hey it’s Cape, Sabi and Wisdom. And Dunya, who I rarely get to play with any more.

Tbh, it’s my little sister’s birthday today so I’m not gonna be around a ton but I’ll at least look at all the posts voting for top/topish wagons and make an educated vote.

I say we wagon you.

I find it interesting that out of all my posts, you choose one which is me explaining two terms to someone who specifically asked about then... and then give a backhanded town read of it while accusing me of just using buzzwords. Also, by interesting, I really mean suspicious.

Alison wrote: ↑Sat Jul 16, 2022 2:38 am

Seanzie wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 4:57 pm I agree with this read and also believe it applies to me.

I wasn't aware that LC disliked you that strongly.

I'm not going to get into it for threadhealth reasons, but I stand by my initial claim.

Alison wrote: ↑Sat Jul 16, 2022 2:41 am

Seanzie wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 8:35 pm [VOTE: Alison] aubergine

serious vote.

Why?

Your initial vote on Cape and your follow up. You never explained why you were voting, and the "Why did you think emotes was the reason for the vote?" just really feels a lot more like a question for the sake of a question rather than you really digging at anything (can you give an example of an AI answer to that question?). Now, you've seemed to indirectly claim that this was just a vote to get the game going, which is fine in it's own right, but IME, people who do that are almost always strongly overstating a real (but weak) thought, rather than just making suspicion completely up, so a lack of explanation for the vote is concerning. Why did you vote Cape?

Wisdom wrote: ↑Sat Jul 16, 2022 4:40 am

dyachei wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 8:26 pm I almost forgot about this game

I think the only v read i have right now is NAA

Also good to play with you again SS!

I marked this as town? because I find forgetting games town indicative but of course that's fakeable so it's more like a temporary read.

I am of the opposite opinion. While I agree it is towny to actually forget about the game, I think it is probably very slightly >rand!wolf to TALK about forgetting about the game (I know I've definitely claimed I "forgot" about a game as scum, when in reality I am actually just overly-concious of the fact that I didn't post early in the game, whereas if I was town and late, I'd just dive in without feeling like my absence needed to be excused [unless the absence was remarkably long, but that is not the case here])

Alison wrote: ↑Sat Jul 16, 2022 5:56 am If I was the town drafter, I'd just focus on drafting good solvers that can clear themselves easily. dunia, dyachei, Seanzie.

If I was the mafia drafter, I'd flip a coin. If it lands on heads I just make a list of who I think is best at wolfing in this game in order, and then draft down the list. If it lands on tails I'd draft one strong player (probably dunia, or dyachei if dunia is taken) and then fill the rest with players that either tend to be quieter presences (Wilgy, Spacedaisy) or players that most people wouldn't expect me to draft either because I haven't gotten along with them in the past or because I don't know them (Axe, Cape, Shending).

I kind of hope the town drafter did not choose people. IME hand-picked scum teams are easier to catch than randomized ones, and the town drafter picking townies gets in the way of this. Unfortunately, I do not really understand Rondo very well, so I don't know what to expect from them. LC though I kind of think he'd use a straightforward with the possibility of one or maybe two wildcards, but I don't think I'd try to guess who the wildcards are, as that seems like a dubious exercise (I am offhandedly accusing you of having an agenda in this post btw).

Wisdom wrote: ↑Sat Jul 16, 2022 6:03 am Adding SS to town pile.

Am I correct in assuming SS is Shending?

hollowkatt wrote: ↑Sat Jul 16, 2022 12:21 am

Cape90 wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 8:27 pm

hollowkatt wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 6:50 pm

Wisdom wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 6:23 pm

hollowkatt wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 6:12 pm

Wisdom wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 6:00 pm From a non Wolf Captain PoV I still think Alison is wolfing. Probably HK as well. And NAX is likely town.

I think Alison's reads is forced and being reads for the sake of having reads.

HK saying NAX is a bit sus also feels like being edgy for the sake of being edgy. Town!HK would probably just call me a wolf and go to bed.

And I trust NAX to be town for the time being. Not locked, but for now.

why would town HK call you a wolf and go to bed? You are the same Wisdom that always makes a point to comment "you're reading me wrong again" when I wolf read you, right?

That never stopped you!!!^^

Because you typically make posts I want to wolf read!
Just so happens this time you didn't

Differences between the ways Wisdom is posting mow vs how they usually post?

Most often it's a weird early read that she has, or a push that she makes that I think is wrong/on obvs town, or she doesn't have a read I would expect her to have. I don't see that going on here so I'm offering up an early town read

Is Wisdom usually town or wolf when you wolfread her early for this sort of thing?

Marmot wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 10:56 pm Townreads thus far

NAA
Cape
Shendog
Wisdom

Null

Everyone else

No, put me here too.

Tell me about Wisdom.

Cape90 wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 9:28 pm

Seanzie wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 8:40 pm Aside from Alison posting her rolecard in the thread

nice sass

Thanks, this new pair of jeans I got does wonders for my sass.

Wisdom wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 6:24 pm

Shending_Help wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 6:06 pm Think wisdoms read on HK is villagery. Both the part about HKs treatment of Axe and the analysis of what t!HK would've done

You are also a wolf and this is a pocket attempt!!!

I had this same thought, Shending's numerous townreads for weak reasons feels pockety. I'm not sure if this read on Shending is actually good, but I'mma give Wisdom a few points for the mindmeld.

Aside from Alison posting her rolecard in the thread, not much has happened, and that should change.

Someone do something that actually makes me feel things before I jokingly give a post-game cred list of four names, which actually ends up perfectly spot on, and everyone congratulates me for bagging the scum team on post 105, and then I don't ever admit it was just a joke list, and for the rest of my days I feel like a phony because my "best" town victory is actually just a sham, all because this current thread is slow.

So uhh... yeah. Somebody do a backflip or TMI someone else or something.

[VOTE: Alison] aubergine

serious vote.

CWAC - Contribute without actually contributing. Anything that has the "feeling" of moving the game forward without really having an impact. Often comes in the form of questions that don't go anywhere. Wolves and town both do it, but wolves will sometimes do only CWAC and IIoA (information instead of analysis) in hopes that townies don't spot that they really aren't positively impacting the gamestate.

Yes, multitask, that was a typo. TS is not MS, so this is not gospel here, but: https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Multitasking. From what I can tell of what Nook wrote, I think it is clear that mafia members could be assigned multiple roles, but they'd only be able to use one role per night (they can use their role and carry the NK on the same night though), so LC is unlikely to take more roles than mafia members (aside from a few edge cases where maybe they took a role useless for scum in order to keep it from town).

Shending_Help wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 2:55 pm

► Show Spoiler

Cape90 wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 2:52 pm

Shending_Help wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 2:24 pm

Cape90 wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 2:01 pm

Shending_Help wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 12:53 pm

Shending_Help wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 12:51 pm I can get behind the early good vibes on Mr. Marmot

It's mainly the "tbh lol" following his Cape vote. It's clearly referencing some thought-process of his that he's hasn't put in the thread yet (which is Rand V in my head)

Again, this hardly makes sense to me. How does saying "tbh lol" signify some kind of thought process that Marmot has?

One doesn't say "tbh lol" without it being referring to something specific (at least i can't see myself doing that). And he hasn't said anything specific regarding you in the thread

It's just kinda randomly thrown out there. It doesn't fit if you're just looking at what's in the thread, so i assume it's referring to something in his own head

I know it's not a super standard read of mine, but it's a thing

I see, upon looking back, I can see how my early game words were kind of scummy like where

Cape90 wrote: ↑Thu Jul 14, 2022 10:49 pm Whenever the mafia is ready to awaken and play the game, that would be a good time to play fr

this, even though something I didn't take seriously can be taken as... I think maybe like TMI if I really stretch

or maybe it's how I addressed HK

Cape90 wrote: ↑Thu Jul 14, 2022 10:49 pm Well, unless you yourself are just mafia

idk just felt like saying something like that since I didn't find their opener particularly said anything

this is a weird post

idk if scummy though

Try

Shending_Help wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 3:09 pm My spiciest read is that Sean might be TWTBAW

literally just posting "first" and nothing else, and then later popping in with "yeah i can get behind this *votes HK*"

It's far from a solid read, but i kinda believe he'd post *something* else in either of his pop-ins if woofing

Was my post where I asked for new-to-TS people's experience level not CWAC? I don't believe you really have this read on me.

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 3:29 pm This is a draft game? Lime Coke drafted mafia team...

Well, I'm confirmed town.

1) Lime Coke hates me and would never subject himself to being in a chat with me
2) Lime Coke thinks I'm bad at mafia
3) Lime Coke thinks I'm bad at town

Gym class is easy. I won't post again today, but I'll vote someone later. If I ever die during the day this game, I take no responsibility for it because you should all know better, and those who don't should inform themselves. It's not just like "Lime Coke slightly dislikes this guy"... It's bad.

I agree with this read and also believe it applies to me.

Shending_Help wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 3:36 pm I don't have any hard input on what exact players Limecoke/Brad would pick as mafia or not.

But i do have thoughts.

To balance a game like this the PRs / Mechanics that Lime has available to him must be EXTREMELY strong/interesting. Otherwise there would be no point in picking them over actual extra players in the mafia team. Therefore I strongly believe Limecoke couldn't resist picking at least 2+ of those PR / mechanics that he found the most alure towards, to see how they played out while he's speccing the game.

If he was gonna play too? Then i could see him just picking the max amount of players if he thought that was +EV, but as a spec? It sounds much more interesting to see if the OP mechanics you picked could work out towards a win than if a huge scumteam could pull it through.

TL;DR: i don't think there's 5-6 maf. Think there might even be 2 if i had to bet tbh

I severely doubt there are 2 mafia when roles don't multisask.

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 11:25 am [VOTE: HK] aubergine is a wolf this game and is to be yeeted at last light.

This is an imperial decree and shall not be revoked.

Yeah, I can get behind this. [VOTE: HallowKatt] aubergine

@Cape90 @Sabiplz since you both are new here, can you let me know your mafia experience (approx number of games/years played), where you're from, and who you know on this playerlist?

I've been playing a little over two years, probably played 50+ games in that time, I'm from MafC but mostly play her on TS, and I know everyone on the playerslist (including the two coaches) except you two and Shending_Help.

first!