The Syndicate

Long Con wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 9:51 pm

Manny wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 3:56 pm

Manny wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 3:52 pm I wonder what are the odds i get wagoned at eod considering i prolly wont be up for it.

Hardclaim Town Enclave Remnants [aka Town PR].

Im prolly consensus scumread enough that makes forcing wolves to self-resolve my ass at night worth it + i think its somewhat likely i might actually die today without claiming cuz Mac is still stuck on me!wolf apparently

I think it's very likely that this is the fakeclaim given to Caesar's Legion.

I was thinking something similar.

I'm walking to a friend's right now, so while I'm planning on keeping an eye on EoD, I likely won't be posting. Big brother is watching, though.

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 8:21 pm I didn't notice but I'm a big fan

Yeah, I'm pretty cool. Does that mean you're pocketed?

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 7:55 pm

LanMisa wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 7:49 pm Regardless, we really need to get more out of Epi and TSP or else we are going to lose this. We can't play a game with two unreadable low-posters and expect to win here (unless both are wolves/malign 3Ps but I'm skeptic that we got that lucky).

I'm very readable and don't mess with epi

What do you think of me soft-shielding you?

Lime Coke wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 7:41 pm Seanzie would you be against killing Mac? Dude is doing nothing but going after my townreads and I and if I'm right on who I'm shielding then he's just wolfsiding.

I got very strong town vibes from Mac earlier, and the things I've seen people point out about him as reasons to scumread him I think are NAI at worst for him. So yes, I would be against killing Mac.

My reads are also pretty opposed to yours I think, so him voting some of your townreads isn't a convincing argument to me. If you think something he did earlier was scummy, I'll hear you out, but as of right now, I don't see much of an issue with his votes.

Lime Coke wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 7:30 pm

LanMisa wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 7:25 pm My head feels like a vacuum and I'd really love to hear a voice, any voice, to get me back to sanity.

Right now I feel like no matter what I do it's going to be the wrong decision and it feels very paralyzing...

The issue is that I don't know where else I'd want to go and the other options in terms of who are wagons aren't as appealing to me since most of them are townreads.

Like only one I'd switch to is Epi or LC again since I don't townread either but you do with one and the other is just posting signs and if that's wrong then we make 0 progress with this game.

What do you think of Manny?

LanMisa wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 7:18 pm

Seanzie wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 7:06 pm Fine with Nanook wagon. Could possibly join on Manny to make things spicy, but also feeling good with my vote where it is.

Do you think that it matters that the NANOOK wagon barely moved/changed over several hours? I'm wary of this being Sig all over again.

I think that's a reasonable fear, but perhaps not one I would be willing to change my strategy for.

I think 1.) There's a chance that Nook is House, and 2.) If Nook did replace a wolf slot and knew he wasn't going to do a lot, he'd definitely just tell his teammates to let him die if it comes to it, and possibly bus for cred.

TSP and Epi do deserve more attention, but unfortunately we only get one elim per day. I know this isn't like a good read, but I still kinda feel like TSP is probably the most likely town out of the low-content folks. I think Epi is very very likely scum but... I'd be remiss if I didn't want to hear his next broadcast. He needs to die, but damn does he do a good job with that sort of stuff!

LanMisa wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 7:16 pm

Seanzie wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 7:11 pm The more I think about it, the more I wonder if we're in a Brad/Chelsea t/w world.

I think that regardless of Chelsea's alignment, yeeting Chelsea over/before Brad is going to create one very angry customer for us.

I also don't feel like going Chelsea today.

I fear that you are correct, but I don't necessarily think that should affect our decisions. I want everyone to have a good time, but part of that is on each of us to treat this like what it is - a game. I was getting quite irked by Chelsea earlier, and I took the onus to step away, because it is a game and not worth getting worked up about (even though part of the fun of it is that it is easy to get invested in the game). I hope everyone can do the same.

The second part, that's okay. I don't think they have a huge chance of going over here, but I do think they should be considered. Aside from my recent spat with them, I really didn't like how earlier they were like "Wolf!Mac wouldn't push me, they know they'd lose that thunderdome", then Mac pushed them, and so they seemed to decide that meant Mac was wolf. Their explanation that Mac has a good read on them isn't super convincing - even people with good reads sometimes make mistakes, and honestly if they actually thought it was this cut-and-dried, I'd expect Chelsea to be hard-pushing a Mac elim.

The more I think about it, the more I wonder if we're in a Brad/Chelsea t/w world.

Fine with Nanook wagon. Could possibly join on Manny to make things spicy, but also feeling good with my vote where it is.

Chelsea wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 6:32 pm

Seanzie wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 3:48 pm

Chelsea wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 3:39 pm

Lime Coke wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 3:38 pm

Chelsea wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 3:37 pm

LanMisa wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 3:36 pm

Chelsea wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 3:33 pm It's crazy how many times I need to reword my statement because Sean can just find a creative way of not answering me that makes me want to smash my face into a wall call it town and then never speak on it again.

But maybe I should just go take lunch first.

I see that the two of you have an argument here but I don't feel like my brain has enough power to process it for now. Too much text, too many names. I'll try to have a look into it tomorrow and get back to it on D3.

I do still feel like many of Sean's posts since D2 started have been very deep and towny though, so if that's the point of debate this is my stance on it.

No, I've also come away from the conversation that has me moving Sean up on my reads list but it feels like I have to pull out my teeth just to get an attempt at the answer I'm looking for.

That's normal.

Is it? Please tell me if I'm going crazy because these past few pages make me think I'm going crazy and maybe my statements are hard to read or I'm the problem but I don't feel like I am so please TELL ME IF I'M GOING CRAZY

No.

I asked you two specific questions. 1. WHICH POSTS, and 2. NAME A GAME. Question 1 considers 51 possible posts, so there are exactly 2^{51} possible answers to that question, and thus you can give a complete answer. 2. also has a finite number of possible answers (the number of games you and Brad played together). You haven't asnwered either of those. Those VERY SPECIFIC calls... which ALSO CAME FIRST.

And then you fault me for not answering the question "So if you're so well aware [objective towniness] exists what stops you from applying it to a wolf game?" (which I believe I did, but apparently not to your satisfaction). DO you understand the difference between the questions I'm asking (that you're avoiding) and the one you're asking? MINE AREN'T OPEN ENDED. THEY'RE SPECIFIC. If I did not write a long enough essay for your question, OH SORRY! You thought did not answer a MULTIPLE CHOICE question.

There is NO real answer to your question. It might as well be a discussion prompt. MY QUESTIONS have ONE answer (or if you are BSing, which I think you are, zero answers).

If this is genuinely how you think the conversation happened (it isn't) there's nothing to discuss anymore. Speak to me the next phase when you have a clear head.

Which posts of mine were bad?

Manny wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 4:01 pm

Seanzie wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 4:00 pm What'd you do last night?

Falcon visited you which is why i've been townreading him lol, dont see any point for wolves to act on u.

General fear seems like a pretty strong motivation.

Why choose to watch me?

Manny wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 3:56 pm

Manny wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 3:52 pm I wonder what are the odds i get wagoned at eod considering i prolly wont be up for it.

Hardclaim Town Enclave Remnants [aka Town PR].

Im prolly consensus scumread enough that makes forcing wolves to self-resolve my ass at night worth it + i think its somewhat likely i might actually die today without claiming cuz Mac is still stuck on me!wolf apparently

What'd you do last night?

Caesar's Legion (guaranteed to appear)

During each day phase (no later than one hour prior to the vote deadline), you may submit a list of all living players to the host. In the event of a tied vote, the player in the tie who is highest on your list will be eliminated.

Separately, twice during the game during any separate night phases, you may select a player. You will be told who that player visited if anyone.

Finally, twice during the game during any separate night phases, you may select a player. You will be told who visited that player if anyone. This ability will not successfully detect any fatal actions.

Chelsea wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 3:39 pm

Lime Coke wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 3:38 pm

Chelsea wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 3:37 pm

LanMisa wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 3:36 pm

Chelsea wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 3:33 pm It's crazy how many times I need to reword my statement because Sean can just find a creative way of not answering me that makes me want to smash my face into a wall call it town and then never speak on it again.

But maybe I should just go take lunch first.

I see that the two of you have an argument here but I don't feel like my brain has enough power to process it for now. Too much text, too many names. I'll try to have a look into it tomorrow and get back to it on D3.

I do still feel like many of Sean's posts since D2 started have been very deep and towny though, so if that's the point of debate this is my stance on it.

No, I've also come away from the conversation that has me moving Sean up on my reads list but it feels like I have to pull out my teeth just to get an attempt at the answer I'm looking for.

That's normal.

Is it? Please tell me if I'm going crazy because these past few pages make me think I'm going crazy and maybe my statements are hard to read or I'm the problem but I don't feel like I am so please TELL ME IF I'M GOING CRAZY

No.

I asked you two specific questions. 1. WHICH POSTS, and 2. NAME A GAME. Question 1 considers 51 possible posts, so there are exactly 2^{51} possible answers to that question, and thus you can give a complete answer. 2. also has a finite number of possible answers (the number of games you and Brad played together). You haven't asnwered either of those. Those VERY SPECIFIC calls... which ALSO CAME FIRST.

And then you fault me for not answering the question "So if you're so well aware [objective towniness] exists what stops you from applying it to a wolf game?" (which I believe I did, but apparently not to your satisfaction). DO you understand the difference between the questions I'm asking (that you're avoiding) and the one you're asking? MINE AREN'T OPEN ENDED. THEY'RE SPECIFIC. If I did not write a long enough essay for your question, OH SORRY! You thought did not answer a MULTIPLE CHOICE question.

There is NO real answer to your question. It might as well be a discussion prompt. MY QUESTIONS have ONE answer (or if you are BSing, which I think you are, zero answers).

Chelsea wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 3:33 pm It's crazy how many times I need to reword my statement because Sean can just find a creative way of not answering me that makes me want to smash my face into a wall call it town and then never speak on it again.

But maybe I should just go take lunch first.

What? In what world is that what is going on? I answered your question to the best of my damn abilities.

On the other hand, I've asked you VERY SPECIFIC questions 1. WHICH POSTS, and 2. GIVE A GAME and you don't respond. No. Just no. If you are town here, you are being deliberately obtuse, and it is making it impossible to even try to find common ground with you. Just no.

Chelsea wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 2:55 pm

Seanzie wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 2:39 pm

Chelsea wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 2:00 pm

Seanzie wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 1:21 pm

Chelsea wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 12:54 pm

Seanzie wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 11:46 am I've asked you numerous questions which I think are all fair and can create positive discussion between us. You haven't responded at all. I'm not sure why.

Can you please respond to my posts? All three of these have gone unanswered:

I believe I've answered the second question a bit ago, as for the other ones:

1) While Falcon and Tony at that point in time just felt like throwing darts and picking a read, I saw some conviction and sway in your posts, even if there wasn't a lot it was enough that I didn't like the direction you were going with it. You believe you're firmly in your town meta? Why are you so towny that the play you're displaying can't be from a wolf?

3) I see parts of Brad's wolf meta, but with the way Brad is playing if he's a wolf X is happening and quite frankly he's never won when X is happening so I'm perfectly fine to let that go through. I just think he's town though and going out in a blaze of glory. I understand why people would vote that for game sake but yeah.

1) Do you associate conviction with wolfing? What posts are these bad posts? I'd be happy to engage with you on it, but this doesn't give me enough to know what direction you're talking about or where to start.

I don't think it's even a meta thing, I believe I am starting to bleed objective towniness. The easiest way you're likely to see it is to engage with me (for example on exactly what you were seeing earlier) to see my purity of thought. If you'd like specifics though, I believe the nuance of thought I've given on topics, especially recently, but starting pretty much D2, is more-or-less exactly what you were saying about LanMisa, and I believe I am one of the people showing the most interest in pushing the game forward positively for pretty much this entire day phase.

3) What is "X" here? If you mean to say that wolf!Brad never wins, that isn't true. Have you ever seen notes of wolf!Brad in a town!Brad game? if so, can you provide some detail/evidence?

1) No, but conviction can be read and results can be drawn to it. If people made a read on Falcon and Tony previously regardless of what the result is I wouldn't have believed it was strong. You on the other hand I would've understood because there's more to it to discuss. I don't recall saying your posts are bad, so I cannot point you to what you're asking. You're wanting to know what I took issue with so I would be fine voting you, right?

The posts aren't "bad" there's a flow and a direction to them that I simply did not like. You know, when you look at something and ask what's weird and you just go based on the sense. I am curious though you think 'objective towniness' exists, does that mean 'objective wolfiness' exists? Even if I push aside my own opinion that those terms don't exist, you've basically given a checklist on what you expect a villager to do.

So why can't those methods apply to yourself? Are you trying to tell me your wolfgame is so bad that you just can't play like the way you have?

3) I am saying if Brad is a wolf, he's making a play. A play I've seen him do before and haven't won with such a play. Basically he's dying for his teammates to benefit the most off of. Do I think that's what's happening? No, I think he's just town. Of course I've seen hints of his wolf game in his town game. If you cannot see vice versa in either game then by example you're saying a player is so blatantly wolfy and or towny that they're to be cleared.

1) You were talking about ME having conviction, not people having conviction about me. You specifically said:

Spoiler: show

Chelsea wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 10:57 am [stuff deleted by Seanzie to shorten post]

I think Sean and Scotty have had bad posts in general. Does that explain it?

. Not really what I was asking, but sure, explaining this would be a good start. You did say my posts were bad, now you're saying my posts aren't bad, but you don't like the flow. In any of the cases, you still haven't really said which posts. I need you to meet me halfway if we want to have a productive discussion.

I don't think us engaging on mafia philosophy is at all helpful in either of us reading the other. I believe how I've been playing recently is very townie. You can tinfoil it, or say that it is possible I could still be a wolf, but that is not productive. If you disagree, we can talk about it (that IS productive), but a question like this does not do anything for the game.

3) Can you provide some evidence of a game where you played against town!Brad and saw some of wolf!Brad in his play? Perhaps a link to a game, and a sentence or two about what he was doing in that game that you thought was wolf!Brad?

-------------------------
You're bringing up good philosophical points, but it is making so that your answers often avoid talking about this game. I'd like to understand things like WHAT YOUR READ ON ME IS BASED ON, and things like YOURS AND BRADS HISTORY, to understand the current game and I am asking pointed questions to get to the bottom of these things. I feel like I am just repeating the previous questions because they were not answered, and instead I got back a bunch of generic "does objective towniness exist?" and "Doesn't everyone always show notes of towniness and scumminess?"

Let me get this out of the way: Any question I ask is because it helps me with my read on a player. When I sit down and try to post seriously I tend to try and avoid asking questions I consider pointless. So while you might not see the value in it. I see it for myself. Help me so I can help you in return.


1) You barely had any posts at the time before you started to become active. Apparently I did use the word bad, flow is a better word that isn't generalized. I think an even better way to put it was looking at Tony/you/Falcon side by side I didn't see why people would wolfread them, but I did see it when I looked at your iso.(Sidenote isoing on this site is such a pain in the ass)

I don't think my question to you was philosophy. The fact is that you believe objective towniness exists. So if you're so well aware of it exists what stops you from applying it to a wolf game. You show me these actions you've taken that are so objectively towny but you're missing the important part on why.

Could is never as important as Why when it comes to mafia.

3) I can throw a mash game or two and show that Brad does wolfy stuff as town (and you could also look yourself) can I ask what you're wanting to get out of this though because I think we can skip the middle man.

You said my posts were bad in #1216. By my count I had 52 posts before that. Granted, you were replying to #1176, so perhaps you had only read to there when you replied, but that only decreases my post count to 49. I'll ask you again (for the third time), WHICH POSTS were you referring to? All 49 of them? What "flow"? Who was I talking about in this flow? It feels like you can't name a single specific thing you based your initial read on me. If I had few posts, it should be that much easier to be specific about which ones, and what exactly you found objectionable.

To try to answer your questions (even though I do think they are philosophical, and honestly I am starting to think you're hiding behind that): When I said "objectively", I meant "without needing to reference meta". I think this question is (someone paradoxically) both too obvious to answer, and too complex to answer. Wolves have TMI, they have a different wincon, they cannot truly hold suspicions, or paranoia. I can know that a good actor should be able to cry on demand, but that doesn't mean I can cry on demand. I can know that a townie should be able to show a nuance, purity of thought, the right amount of paranoia, a combination of maliable and unmovable thoughts and progressions, etc, that doesn't mean I (or anyone) can perfectly fake these things. If you didn't believe the same thing, I'd guess you would have stopped playing mafia long ago (or maybe you're just really into playing a game where it is all just blind guessing)

3) THEN PLEASE DO! PLEASE DO THROW A MASH GAME OR TWO OUT THERE. Why are you wasting posts? Just do it. I've asked so many times. Why are you wasting my posts? Why are you wasting my time?

What I WANT is to understand your read of Brad, your progression on them, your thoughts on them. I personally think he very rarely shows strong wolf notes as town, and is often obv!town. I'd like to know your meta on Brad (what do YOU think wolf!Brad looks like, and what do YOU think town!Brad looks like?), and then I'd like to see if we can come to a common mind about Brad (one way or the other). I do not feel like you have any interest in coming to a common mind though.

Manny wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 2:43 pm Lan > Creature > Jack > Mac > Falcon > Brad > Seanzie > Scotty > Chels > Dunnstral > Long Con > Epi > TSP > Nanook

i kinda hate the order of the last 5 but idk how to switch it around.
[also i may or may not switch this heavily in the next couple hours depending on my mood]

Tell me about Creature's position, and my position.

Do you still think me/Brad is a difference check?

Chelsea wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 2:00 pm

Seanzie wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 1:21 pm

Chelsea wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 12:54 pm

Seanzie wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 11:46 am I've asked you numerous questions which I think are all fair and can create positive discussion between us. You haven't responded at all. I'm not sure why.

Can you please respond to my posts? All three of these have gone unanswered:

I believe I've answered the second question a bit ago, as for the other ones:

1) While Falcon and Tony at that point in time just felt like throwing darts and picking a read, I saw some conviction and sway in your posts, even if there wasn't a lot it was enough that I didn't like the direction you were going with it. You believe you're firmly in your town meta? Why are you so towny that the play you're displaying can't be from a wolf?

3) I see parts of Brad's wolf meta, but with the way Brad is playing if he's a wolf X is happening and quite frankly he's never won when X is happening so I'm perfectly fine to let that go through. I just think he's town though and going out in a blaze of glory. I understand why people would vote that for game sake but yeah.

1) Do you associate conviction with wolfing? What posts are these bad posts? I'd be happy to engage with you on it, but this doesn't give me enough to know what direction you're talking about or where to start.

I don't think it's even a meta thing, I believe I am starting to bleed objective towniness. The easiest way you're likely to see it is to engage with me (for example on exactly what you were seeing earlier) to see my purity of thought. If you'd like specifics though, I believe the nuance of thought I've given on topics, especially recently, but starting pretty much D2, is more-or-less exactly what you were saying about LanMisa, and I believe I am one of the people showing the most interest in pushing the game forward positively for pretty much this entire day phase.

3) What is "X" here? If you mean to say that wolf!Brad never wins, that isn't true. Have you ever seen notes of wolf!Brad in a town!Brad game? if so, can you provide some detail/evidence?

1) No, but conviction can be read and results can be drawn to it. If people made a read on Falcon and Tony previously regardless of what the result is I wouldn't have believed it was strong. You on the other hand I would've understood because there's more to it to discuss. I don't recall saying your posts are bad, so I cannot point you to what you're asking. You're wanting to know what I took issue with so I would be fine voting you, right?

The posts aren't "bad" there's a flow and a direction to them that I simply did not like. You know, when you look at something and ask what's weird and you just go based on the sense. I am curious though you think 'objective towniness' exists, does that mean 'objective wolfiness' exists? Even if I push aside my own opinion that those terms don't exist, you've basically given a checklist on what you expect a villager to do.

So why can't those methods apply to yourself? Are you trying to tell me your wolfgame is so bad that you just can't play like the way you have?

3) I am saying if Brad is a wolf, he's making a play. A play I've seen him do before and haven't won with such a play. Basically he's dying for his teammates to benefit the most off of. Do I think that's what's happening? No, I think he's just town. Of course I've seen hints of his wolf game in his town game. If you cannot see vice versa in either game then by example you're saying a player is so blatantly wolfy and or towny that they're to be cleared.

1) You were talking about ME having conviction, not people having conviction about me. You specifically said: . Not really what I was asking, but sure, explaining this would be a good start. You did say my posts were bad, now you're saying my posts aren't bad, but you don't like the flow. In any of the cases, you still haven't really said which posts. I need you to meet me halfway if we want to have a productive discussion.

I don't think us engaging on mafia philosophy is at all helpful in either of us reading the other. I believe how I've been playing recently is very townie. You can tinfoil it, or say that it is possible I could still be a wolf, but that is not productive. If you disagree, we can talk about it (that IS productive), but a question like this does not do anything for the game.

3) Can you provide some evidence of a game where you played against town!Brad and saw some of wolf!Brad in his play? Perhaps a link to a game, and a sentence or two about what he was doing in that game that you thought was wolf!Brad?

-------------------------
You're bringing up good philosophical points, but it is making so that your answers often avoid talking about this game. I'd like to understand things like WHAT YOUR READ ON ME IS BASED ON, and things like YOURS AND BRADS HISTORY, to understand the current game and I am asking pointed questions to get to the bottom of these things. I feel like I am just repeating the previous questions because they were not answered, and instead I got back a bunch of generic "does objective towniness exist?" and "Doesn't everyone always show notes of towniness and scumminess?"

Chelsea wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 12:54 pm

Seanzie wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 11:46 am I've asked you numerous questions which I think are all fair and can create positive discussion between us. You haven't responded at all. I'm not sure why.

Can you please respond to my posts? All three of these have gone unanswered:

I believe I've answered the second question a bit ago, as for the other ones:

1) While Falcon and Tony at that point in time just felt like throwing darts and picking a read, I saw some conviction and sway in your posts, even if there wasn't a lot it was enough that I didn't like the direction you were going with it. You believe you're firmly in your town meta? Why are you so towny that the play you're displaying can't be from a wolf?

3) I see parts of Brad's wolf meta, but with the way Brad is playing if he's a wolf X is happening and quite frankly he's never won when X is happening so I'm perfectly fine to let that go through. I just think he's town though and going out in a blaze of glory. I understand why people would vote that for game sake but yeah.

1) Do you associate conviction with wolfing? What posts are these bad posts? I'd be happy to engage with you on it, but this doesn't give me enough to know what direction you're talking about or where to start.

I don't think it's even a meta thing, I believe I am starting to bleed objective towniness. The easiest way you're likely to see it is to engage with me (for example on exactly what you were seeing earlier) to see my purity of thought. If you'd like specifics though, I believe the nuance of thought I've given on topics, especially recently, but starting pretty much D2, is more-or-less exactly what you were saying about LanMisa, and I believe I am one of the people showing the most interest in pushing the game forward positively for pretty much this entire day phase.

3) What is "X" here? If you mean to say that wolf!Brad never wins, that isn't true. Have you ever seen notes of wolf!Brad in a town!Brad game? if so, can you provide some detail/evidence?

Dunnstral wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 12:51 pm

Seanzie wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 12:39 pm I'm very sorry, but I have a hard time looking at these posts and objectively saying that Manny is doing a good enough job wolfhunting to warrant an entire line in your summary of the thread. I'd love to hear from you why I'm wrong though.

I wrote down what was in my mind. Given that there were several points where it looked like Manny was doing this, it stuck out to me. I never said that they were compelling, that's putting words in my mouth.

Can you try to meet me halfway? I'm trying to engage with you on a topic you mentioned. I've given my interpretation, which I believe is in conflict with yours (perhaps I am wrong, but you saying Manny is making an effort makes me think that you believe this effort is 1. noteworthy enough to mention, and 2. genuine. If you did not mean this, then fine, but then could you say what you did mean?). I don't want to put words in your mouth, so could you please put words into your mouth? Perhaps a few specific questions would help:

What is your read on Manny?

Do you agree with Manny's PoE?

What wolves, if any do you feel closer to finding due to Manny's work?

Dunnstral wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 12:23 pm

Seanzie wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 12:07 pm

Dunnstral wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 12:00 pm

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 11:56 am

Dunnstral wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 11:53 am

Long Con wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 7:55 am Okay. So I went from "players I don't explicitly townread" list, to "everyone come on, vote Long Con!!" without a single reason why. It's like you just picked a name from your list and just *decided* to try and get a wagon started.

I think you're done here, other LC. [VOTE: Lime Coke] aubergine

Sure, but even if they did that I don't think that makes them mafia

Heya Dunn. Summarize the day for me. This is not me using you to ketchup. This is me not having a read on you and me wanting to get your pov on events so don’t like ignore me.

Macdougall looked good at the start of the day with long analysis posts, but as the day went on their posts veered more towards short antagonistic posts.
Lime Coke vs Seanzie seems to be motivated by a grudge.
Lanmisa made a lot of posts I considered insightful.
Manny has been making an effort to find mafia.
Chelsea is voting people just for pressure.
Creature popped in once and made a nothing post.
Nanook made several nothing posts.

There is no vs. here. I would agree that it feels to me like Lime has a grudge, but I do not. If you'd like to talk about Lime with me, I am open to that, but this is not a good summary of that specific subplot.

Could you point out where Manny is doing this? I think this is a place that you and I differ, and it would help me sort you (and Manny possibly) if we could find where that difference is.

viewtopic.php?p=1109816#p1109816
viewtopic.php?p=1109818#p1109818
viewtopic.php?p=1109824#p1109824
viewtopic.php?p=1109828#p1109828
viewtopic.php?p=1109860#p1109860
viewtopic.php?p=1109862#p1109862
viewtopic.php?p=1109869#p1109869

Those are all posts, and while I can see why they could be considered evidence for what you said, I find almost every post there shallow and lacking. I'd be remiss if I didn't say that I am worried about you finding this compelling, but perhaps there is some meta between you two? If not, do you have any insight into why you and I are seeing these posts differently?

Just considering these posts, I see that he seemed to be considering a w!Scotty world, but that didn't show up in his later PoE of [Nanook, TSP, Epi, LongCon]. That PoE is essentially those that aren't giving a lot of content, and while sure, these are all worrisome names, I don't think anyone should get town!points for pointing this out. That also covers two other posts you quote - pointing out that TSP and Epi don't have a lot of content isn't bad, but I don't think this is prime wolfhunting. The remaining two posts here are a Brad vs. Seanzie post, which doesn't really seek to solve between me and Brad (Manny seems to townread Brad and scumread me, but we're a diffcheck because "annoying"? Yeah, Brad calling me an idiot is annoying, that doesn't make this a difference check.) The final post is a wagon-analysis, not a bad thing to do, but aside from scotty ending up on bottom, there isn't any reasoning given for the list ordering, and this is essentially a formulaic thing.

I'm very sorry, but I have a hard time looking at these posts and objectively saying that Manny is doing a good enough job wolfhunting to warrant an entire line in your summary of the thread. I'd love to hear from you why I'm wrong though.

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 12:17 pm Out of date rainbow for Seanzie

TOWN
LC
Epi (not gonna explain this one til it matters for reasons)

TOWNISH
Seanzie
Lime
Mac

NO CLUE
Dunn
Tony
Manny
Nook
Falcon
Chelsea
Creature

SCUMISH
Scotty
LanMisa


Don’t take anything but the LC and Epi reads to the bank just yet.

Even if I don't take it to the bank, can you say something about Scotty and LanMisa? These are reads that are pretty far removed from what I'd consider the thread consensus (especially the LanMisa read).

Dunnstral wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 12:00 pm

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 11:56 am

Dunnstral wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 11:53 am

Long Con wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 7:55 am Okay. So I went from "players I don't explicitly townread" list, to "everyone come on, vote Long Con!!" without a single reason why. It's like you just picked a name from your list and just *decided* to try and get a wagon started.

I think you're done here, other LC. [VOTE: Lime Coke] aubergine

Sure, but even if they did that I don't think that makes them mafia

Heya Dunn. Summarize the day for me. This is not me using you to ketchup. This is me not having a read on you and me wanting to get your pov on events so don’t like ignore me.

Macdougall looked good at the start of the day with long analysis posts, but as the day went on their posts veered more towards short antagonistic posts.
Lime Coke vs Seanzie seems to be motivated by a grudge.
Lanmisa made a lot of posts I considered insightful.
Manny has been making an effort to find mafia.
Chelsea is voting people just for pressure.
Creature popped in once and made a nothing post.
Nanook made several nothing posts.

There is no vs. here. I would agree that it feels to me like Lime has a grudge, but I do not. If you'd like to talk about Lime with me, I am open to that, but this is not a good summary of that specific subplot.

Could you point out where Manny is doing this? I think this is a place that you and I differ, and it would help me sort you (and Manny possibly) if we could find where that difference is.

Manny wrote: ↑Sat Feb 17, 2024 11:00 am Interesting drop in my position but tbf i did kinda ignore ur question

Ignoring my question isn't great, but it is more a broad pattern - you're throwing out a few weak associative reads, and then doing a lot of things that look more like performance than solving (e.g. you looking for something from me and you having a townread on Falcon you won't say anything about - these things could LOOK like you're doing stuff behind the scenes, but I'm not seeing evidence of it, and I don't give points for behind the scenes work). You suggesting me vs brad as a diff check I also think was scummy. There isn't a me vs Brad. Brad isn't pushing me (he has me on his "I don't townread" list, but you can look at how he interacts with me and tell that he doesn't see scum!Seanzie, at least IMO, and Mac noticed this as well), and a reasonably large portion of the thread has Brad south-of-null. Thinking that there is still a Me vs Brad kind of suggests your worldview likely hasn't updated much since yesterday, which is not great.

If there is some reason I should have you higher, I am all ears. I'd be happy to hear from your side on these things, or just... some reads from you with reasoning (I prefer non-associative - I take almost no stock in associative reads until we see actual wolf flips) would help me figure out if you're where you belong or not.

Seanzie wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 10:05 am I'll put this on and see how it feels after wearing it for an afternoon.

LanMisa

Creature
MacDougall

Manny
TonyStarkPrime
Scotty

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME
falcon45ca
Long Con

Jackofhearts2005
Dunnstral

Epignosis
Chelsea
Lime Coke

LanMisa

Creature
MacDougall
falcon45ca

Scotty

Long Con
Jackofhearts2005
TonyStarkPrime

Dunnstral
Manny
Epignosis
Chelsea

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME
Lime Coke

@Long Con @Jackofhearts2005 @TonyStarkPrime could each of you summarize your current gameview? Something like a rainbow list, or top 3 town/mafia would suffice, but if you could include any reasons, that would also be good. I am having an extremely hard time finding much at all in your ISOs, and with as many scumreads as I have, that won't do.

@Manny I recommend you just tell me what you were looking for earlier. I'm having a hard time thinking that you'd miss my early D2 posts if you were interested in me for some reason.

Epignosis wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 1:45 pm

Seanzie wrote: ↑Wed Feb 14, 2024 2:35 pm While I am voting Mac, I really don't like how the wagons today have become me/Mac.

Very bad D1 wagons, lemme tell you.

Can we do Lime instead? I'd also consider Scotty, or maybe even Epi.

First off, today I learned that one of your posts has a link to a vocaroo. You made a second post with a picture of a radio, but that one does not have a link. Is it supposed to.

Second off, after listening to your vocaroo, you are townreading Lime, but I didn't really get any reason why from your broadcast. You're also apparently scumreading me, but again aside from pointing to this post (call it a salad if you want, suggesting that that makes me wolfy is pretty damn meh, especially considering everything else going on), I don't know why. You didn't say anything about this post, just pointed at it (and you're not happy I'm scumreading lime, but what do you think of my reasons to? What do you think of how differently I am treating Lime in this game vs. Don't Starve?)

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 1:22 pm Idk what wolfy in a townie way means.

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 1:51 pm

Seanzie wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 12:02 am

MacDougall wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 12:00 am

Seanzie wrote: ↑Thu Feb 15, 2024 11:58 pm

MacDougall wrote: ↑Thu Feb 15, 2024 11:14 pm @Scotty give me your top 3 town please.

@Seanzie yours too please.

Jack
Dunnstral
LanMisa

I guess LanMisa is something of a threadspewed townie. I have my doubts on the other two. Can you outline your reasoning?

I don't remember why on Dun, but Jack said something wolfy in a way that I think might actually be townie about us sleepwalking into a Sig elim.

Here’s that description again.

The second post is the first time it was mentioned (by me). It was actually about TSP though, not you (mah bad).

Some things are level 0 wolfy in a way that wolves actually very rarely if ever do them. A good example would be from the very first game I ever played on this site, where D1 I hard-defended wolf!Made who was going down, and did a lot to try to push the wagon away. Made still flipped, and a level 0 assessment might say that my behavior looks pretty wolfy given Made's flip, but honestly wolves very rarely act that way, so it was actually very townie.

TSP made a comment about walking face first into a Sig elim, which post-flip almost looks like TSP is telegraphing an eventual town!Sig flip, which is level 0 wolfy, but I don't think wolf!TSP does that, there is no reason to, and TSP isn't exactly a slouch of a wolf. Perhaps he made a little mistake this time (happens to all of us), but looking back at it, I kinda thought it was actually more likely to come from town than scum. Not gonna pretend like this is the worlds strongest read, but for someone who doesn't really town hunt, meh... it something.

Scotty wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 1:24 pm

LanMisa wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 9:24 am

Scotty wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 12:10 am

MacDougall wrote: ↑Thu Feb 15, 2024 11:14 pm @Scotty give me your top 3 town please.

@Seanzie yours too please.

I should mention because I was thinking of Seanzie- he would’ve been a GREAT vig target.

If we had a vig, I would have assumed they would’ve shot yesterday. I do not think we have a vig (this is all based on how I would play of course)

Anyway, 3 town? Hmmmmm

So I did some thinking in the night and Dunnstral should be town, but I’m actually thinking they could be exactly a deepwolf in the making. The way they were pocketing me was very smooth and I chalked it up to me just being town as shit yesterday (I know, I know, only a few groupies agreed) but I think I might be getting it all wrong. Might be. Too scared to vote there tho.

That didn’t answer your question.

LanMila had some good back and forth. Not tooo blendy, and not scared to make reads.
Ironically, I think you came out of yesterday being pretty towny. I’ve flip flopped on you in my head and will probably do so as the day goes on, but for now you’re town to me.

I was coming around on Creature. He has emerged in the back half of the day as someone I wouldn’t mind borrowing my sugar

Hi, Scotty, I think I asked you yesterday already but I'd like your help in building a stance on Dunnstral who flies a bit under my personal radar. I see that you read him off of personal interactions, which is something I tend to do as well, but do you have experience with Dunn? Like, you are afraid of a potential deep wolf but have you seen Dunn take such strategies before or is that a general "I don't want to be snowed" stance?

Like, I get the aspect of questioning everything but being too paranoid can destroy town cohesiveness.

Yeah, I getcha.

I’ve never played with Dunn (or you for that matter) so personal feeling is all I’ve got.

Dunnstral is hitting all the right notes. Isn’t afraid to ask pointed questions. In some ways, has been parroting my thought process in their own way. All of that rings town to me.
On the other hand, because I don’t know them as a player I’m putting up a shield because of how smooth they are. I’m putting up this tinfoil now because I think if they’re town, and we start producing I’ll feel better. But if they’re still alive after a couple phases, it might be time to reassess

My perception of Dunnstral changed actually because of something you just said ... kind of "Isn't afraid to ask pointed questions"... I felt like they did ask a lot of questions, but many of them seemed like softballs , and I didn't really see what they did with them. Did they synthesize the answers into anything, or are they just asking questions to look engaged? I had a hard time saying they did the first thing, and I looked at ONE of their quoted town games, and at least early game, they didn't look anything like this.

Chelsea wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 11:24 am I just want people to play the game I was forced to sign up for.

I've asked you numerous questions which I think are all fair and can create positive discussion between us. You haven't responded at all. I'm not sure why.

Can you please respond to my posts? All three of these have gone unanswered:

Manny wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 11:19 am i wonder if i can call brad/seanzie a diffcheck
cuz it'd be pretty annoying if thats v/v

I wouldn't call it a diffcheck.

It is possible I'm wrong on Brad, but I think my reasons are solid. Brad I think actually likely knows I'm town (either via TMI or by just reading), but I think cares more about punishing me as a person than playing to possibly admit it. Chelsea disagrees with my Lime read, but she also has thus far not responded to me asking her to engage me on it, so it is hard for me to take much stock in her thoughts.

I think honestly based on how I've played with Lime, it should be more likely from an outsiders perspective that Lime and I are w/w rather than v/w. Wolf!Seanzie just doesn't play against town!Lime this way, it makes no sense. I know this is self-meta, but it is true, and I think one could be convinced that it is true.

LanMisa wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 11:16 am

Chelsea wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 11:07 am

LanMisa wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 11:00 am

Chelsea wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 10:57 am

LanMisa wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 10:28 am

Chelsea wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 4:51 am Falcon I just want to play more, it's the slot you probably want to vig shoot over exeing because there's just nothing in it. The can't make lylo player until they post well. . .any opinion. (Curious as I wasn't expecting Lime and Dunnstral to also be on here. Did Dunn's LHF clause only count for D1?)

I have Longcon as a villager because they're not wolf with Mac or Scotty and if both those slots are a villager with how high volume of their. . .confidence we're in trouble. (I think Scotty's wolf equality is pretty high though) Independent of that the convo with Lanmisa felt pretty good so yeah.

While I do feel okay with your catchup that I saw so far I don't see a Scotty wolf world here and I think that basing a read off of pre-flip associations is iffy.

I agree with Long Con's approach to me being towny though.

Also, the post after you went "TSP or Falcon, then Scotty or Sean" and I cannot follow that kind of logic. Would you do that regardless of who dies D2 and regardless of their alignment or...?

I think TSP and Falcon need to post more to get any sort of read on them (although others think they've posted enough take it as you will)

I think Sean and Scotty have had bad posts in general. Does that explain it?

Which posts from Scotty are bad? I see nothing but forward-thinking and solving posts from Scotty and I disagree hard with that stance.

I agree with Sean (talked about that yesterday enough) but got a more neutral feeling at the end of yesterday.

What makes TSP/Falcon different from Sean (not Scotty) with regards how you want to tackle them phase-wise?

I don't think solving posts in and of themselves are towny, and they certainly aren't where I play from. I've seen this statement tossed out by more than just you but unless a player is extremely polarized the amount of solving posts they make has nothing when actions and results also need to be taken account for. Let us just assume for example I am getting snowed by wolf!Lime (and that's giving a lot of BTOD) I think a lot of Scotty's posting has been very wolf-agenda coded. Esp early posting.

i find it hard to find the stances they've taken this game believable considering the 2 main wagons yall ended up on and then now are deciding "ah yes we must simply follow the same outlook." There's almost no sense of what feels to me genuine reflection or town trying to figure out the game. If you have really good reasons to TR them I'd like to hear it.


You can have low posts and still be wolfy and while I feel TSP/Falcon had next to 0 AI posts Sean's posting clearly had some attempts to them. I need more from TSP/Falcon to general to get a read on them, I don't with Sean.

My brain is unable to process the bolded part of your statement. Like, I literally do not understand what the sentence is supposed to say.

Scotty has shown several instances of both making and adjusting reads in a very natural and believable way, especially on D1. Since I haven't been in the game with him as much in D2 (or at all, I believe?) D2 has left less of an expression on me but I remember liking his entrance. It felt natural, like he was trying to both factor in the night actions and flips in a believable way. And I didn't get the impression of any of that being a wolf agenda - what exactly gave you that feeling?

But yeah, I do think that TSP needs to show us more and Falcon already has a pressure wagon, from what I can see, and is actively posting.

[VOTE: TonyStarkPrime] aubergine

Please come join us, we'd like to hear your input!

I think TSP should come and join, but honestly out of the people who IMO are not giving enough content, they're actually on the low-end of worry. This is mostly meta, but this TSP doesn't give me the same notes as the wolf!TSP that will pretend like they don't care about a game. This TSP I think is actually just not engaged.

Out of the people who I would really like to see more of, from most concerning to least concerning I think is:
Nanook
Jack
Falcon
TSP

Creature could possibly go on this list as well, but their ISO did have some spots that looked very town!Creature-y (even though I have definitely seen him do some solving as wolf!Creature), and Falcon I just haven't actually attempted to read, so meh, his place on this list might be more due to me than him. Nanook IMO stands above the rest since some things he has done is IMO strongly associated with how Nanook sometimes wolfs.

Chelsea wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 10:57 am

LanMisa wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 10:28 am

Chelsea wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 4:51 am Falcon I just want to play more, it's the slot you probably want to vig shoot over exeing because there's just nothing in it. The can't make lylo player until they post well. . .any opinion. (Curious as I wasn't expecting Lime and Dunnstral to also be on here. Did Dunn's LHF clause only count for D1?)

I have Longcon as a villager because they're not wolf with Mac or Scotty and if both those slots are a villager with how high volume of their. . .confidence we're in trouble. (I think Scotty's wolf equality is pretty high though) Independent of that the convo with Lanmisa felt pretty good so yeah.

While I do feel okay with your catchup that I saw so far I don't see a Scotty wolf world here and I think that basing a read off of pre-flip associations is iffy.

I agree with Long Con's approach to me being towny though.

Also, the post after you went "TSP or Falcon, then Scotty or Sean" and I cannot follow that kind of logic. Would you do that regardless of who dies D2 and regardless of their alignment or...?

I think TSP and Falcon need to post more to get any sort of read on them (although others think they've posted enough take it as you will)

I think Sean and Scotty have had bad posts in general. Does that explain it?

Can you explain your read on me? I'm fairly certain that my towniness is shining through if you look for it closely enough. You're welcome to disagree, but if you do, let's talk about why.

Chelsea wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 10:51 am Yeah that's all I needed to see

[VOTE: Mac] aubergine

Didn't you say earlier that scum!Mac wouldn't push you? Can you explain what "that" is above, and why it is all you needed to see?

Low-key worried that Mac is deliberately playing into my suspicions (at least partly), but meh... that's a D3 problem if I've ever seen one.

Manny wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 6:23 am wait did seanzie post alr and i misssed it brb

Did you do anything with this? Also, what exactly were you waiting for?

I love hearing about me.

I thought about it more, and Nook should be south of null. His Lime vote is sus regardless of lime's alimement.

I'll put this on and see how it feels after wearing it for an afternoon.

LanMisa

Creature
MacDougall

Manny
TonyStarkPrime
Scotty

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME
falcon45ca
Long Con

Jackofhearts2005
Dunnstral

Epignosis
Chelsea
Lime Coke

Upon reconsideration, I do not believe Dunnstral deserves a spot quite so up the list as I said before.

LanMisa wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 9:40 am Also yeah, I will not read any of the Lime/Sean posts since I do not condone that kind of behaviour, period. I don't know what happened prior, I don't WANT to know either, but either stay civil or don't enter spots simultaneously where you end up headbutting.

I'd like it noted that one of us has been civil.

Lime Coke wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 9:05 am

Seanzie wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 9:01 am

Lime Coke wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 8:55 am

Seanzie wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 8:37 am

Lime Coke wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 6:17 am

Manny wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 6:14 am

Lime Coke wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 6:13 am Fam I'd be trying way harder if Chelsea was my partner.

I mean this doesnt really help me cuz if u are a wolf i think u are alr trying way harder than im used to lmfao.
Im leaning more "not wolf" than "wolf" rn but thats mostly cuz i can maybe see a world of w!Seanzie

I mean you can look at Taffy's Birthday Game that was my try hard moments.

But yeah I'd do significantly more than just showing up at SOD and EOD.

^This^

It has felt like some people have been mostly reading Brad on outdated meta. While I'm not going to suggest he can wolf on par with the likes of Dizzy (who can?), he also isn't completely polarized, and can hit some of his town notes while wolfing.

Your meta on me has never been correct. Ever.

I literally scoped you and Nook as wolves one game because you were faking agression and he was trying to hide it by telling you to calm down. I've identified you correctly as town through a relatively short process in almost every game we've been t/t in.

I've explained to you multiple times how I approach you when I am town. You don't ever seem to consider that though, and assume that me expressing suspicion on you on the first page is me locking in a read, and you never check on how I re-evaluate you through time (or if you do, you disregard it when you say things like the above), instead of a mechanism to help me get an actual read on you later on.

Yes it's easy to call out the 1 out of 20 other times you've scumread me.

But legit fucking why do it?

You know we have issues in games.

I do the due diligence of leaving you alone because that causes issues in the thread when we interact.

It's you going to me every single time.

"we" don't have issues. From my point-of-view, you have an issue with me, but it is not reciprocated (other than the fact that I don't appreciate your comments about me as a person). I have no ill-will towards you. I get that being suspected can be stressful, but this is a children's game being played on 20-year-old forum technology by a bunch of adults. Expressing suspicion is part of the game, and I try my best to keep it in game. The only issue I have with you is that you routinely take it out of a game, start insulting ME rather than talking about my slot.

Lime Coke wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 9:02 am Literally every fucking game it's you tunneling me regardless of what I do.

Every fucking game.

Like at that point there's something legitimately wrong there.

Uh huh... I just went 3/3 in past games where we were t/t:

https://www.mafiacafe.net/forum/standar ... #post50943

viewtopic.php?p=1072884#p1072884

viewtopic.php?p=1068709#p1068709

I'm sure I've been wrong on you before, and I'm sure I'll be wrong on you again, but "every fucking game" is not reality.

I think maybe you just don't get me (probably not solo on you, I'm pretty... uhh... opaque in how I play). If you're on the upper-side of my reads, I usually don't comment on it. If you're on the lower side, I do. I usually push you early on because you're an easy read to get early - when you're town you have no fear, when you're wolf, I sense fear. After that, if I don't keep following up, it's likely because I townread you. I don't really blame you for not realizing that when I'm not singing "Brad is town!" from the rafters in those games, but I've explained this to you before, so at some point the onus is on you to try to find common ground with me.

Lime Coke wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 8:55 am

Seanzie wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 8:37 am

Lime Coke wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 6:17 am

Manny wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 6:14 am

Lime Coke wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 6:13 am Fam I'd be trying way harder if Chelsea was my partner.

I mean this doesnt really help me cuz if u are a wolf i think u are alr trying way harder than im used to lmfao.
Im leaning more "not wolf" than "wolf" rn but thats mostly cuz i can maybe see a world of w!Seanzie

I mean you can look at Taffy's Birthday Game that was my try hard moments.

But yeah I'd do significantly more than just showing up at SOD and EOD.

^This^

It has felt like some people have been mostly reading Brad on outdated meta. While I'm not going to suggest he can wolf on par with the likes of Dizzy (who can?), he also isn't completely polarized, and can hit some of his town notes while wolfing.

Your meta on me has never been correct. Ever.

I literally scoped you and Nook as wolves one game because you were faking agression and he was trying to hide it by telling you to calm down. I've identified you correctly as town through a relatively short process in almost every game we've been t/t in.

I've explained to you multiple times how I approach you when I am town. You don't ever seem to consider that though, and assume that me expressing suspicion on you on the first page is me locking in a read, and you never check on how I re-evaluate you through time (or if you do, you disregard it when you say things like the above), instead of a mechanism to help me get an actual read on you later on.

Lime Coke wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 6:17 am

Manny wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 6:14 am

Lime Coke wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 6:13 am Fam I'd be trying way harder if Chelsea was my partner.

I mean this doesnt really help me cuz if u are a wolf i think u are alr trying way harder than im used to lmfao.
Im leaning more "not wolf" than "wolf" rn but thats mostly cuz i can maybe see a world of w!Seanzie

I mean you can look at Taffy's Birthday Game that was my try hard moments.

But yeah I'd do significantly more than just showing up at SOD and EOD.

^This^

It has felt like some people have been mostly reading Brad on outdated meta. While I'm not going to suggest he can wolf on par with the likes of Dizzy (who can?), he also isn't completely polarized, and can hit some of his town notes while wolfing.

Chelsea wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 6:14 am

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 6:11 am

Chelsea wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 6:08 am

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 6:07 am

Chelsea wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 6:06 am

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 6:04 am

Chelsea wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 6:04 am NANOOK IS HERE?

MY GOAT.

HIIIIIII IT'S BEEN TOO LONG <3333

Ayyyyyy

Sup?? <3

Not much, finishing paperwork, eating a brownie.

Mafia sux go find them for me so I can sheep o7

Idk I'd have to read more than broseph and Brad going back and forth while Brad takes potshots at every other dude in the game and that seems like work smhsmh

Brad takes potshots at everyone that isn't a woman.

But good news me and him are both in our town meta come join the towncore baby with Lanmisa <3

Ehhhhh idk brad can be b****y as mafia sometimes too now tbh

Do you think Sean is town

I think there Iso is mid and idm if the slot goes over but if it's a villager we are voting in Mac/Scotty until 1 of them flips red.

I don't like your worldview. Not just about me, but about what happens after I go over. I think Mac is hitting strong town notes today, and scotty... meh... he could be worse.

Seems like a high-value chop lineup if Mac is town though.

Chelsea wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 6:08 am

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 6:07 am

Chelsea wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 6:06 am

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 6:04 am

Chelsea wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 6:04 am NANOOK IS HERE?

MY GOAT.

HIIIIIII IT'S BEEN TOO LONG <3333

Ayyyyyy

Sup?? <3

Not much, finishing paperwork, eating a brownie.

Mafia sux go find them for me so I can sheep o7

Idk I'd have to read more than broseph and Brad going back and forth while Brad takes potshots at every other dude in the game and that seems like work smhsmh

Brad takes potshots at everyone that isn't a woman.

But good news me and him are both in our town meta come join the towncore baby with Lanmisa <3

Some of Brad's post look like town!Brad, but much of his behavior is also in his wolf meta. Are you seeing both parts, or no?

I don't know your meta, so I'll have to read you by other means.

Manny wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 5:54 am I also kinda wanna see Seanzie post a bit for unrelated reasons

To bad...

wait... opps.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 12:14 am

Seanzie wrote: ↑Mon Feb 12, 2024 11:40 pm Something something, Brad, something.

Seanzie was this you disliking Brad's page 1? Cuz I'm in catch up and just got to this post and was pretty much about to highlight I think I'm looking at wolf Brad.

I think "dislike" is a bit strong. I don't remember what, but something made me suspicious and decided to explore.