Avatar The Last Airbender Mafia postgame

[chardonnay]

I'm leaning toward cayvie as the chop right now. I don't like how her change of opinion on DDL went, and her ISO largely reads to me like pocketing attempts of DDL and Alison. [VOTE: cayvie] aubergine

Its pretty on the nose for Cayvie to pocket a player in such a manner.

Whats your read on Carotte?

[Alison]

I'm pretty happy giving PSI a day 1 pass since everyone who's played with them is saying in no uncertain terms that they're well within their town meta. The end of day 1 is approaching in 9 hours, and I'd like the wagons to be between Jiwon and Cassowary. If you're not one one of those two people, or don't want to be, talk to me about your concerns.

Re: the cayvie case, I'm not sold on it. It's a constructed narrative. Like yes, if you walk in and try to make up a story about why cayvie is scum and why her actions fit some scum agenda, you can say the glasses read was an attempt to pocket DDL, she was trying to pocket, yadda yadda.

But take a step back and look at the balance of probabilities, and ask yourself if there's anything that makes that interpretation more likely or convincing than any other. I don't think it is. There's a lot about cayvie's behavior that doesn't make sense if that theory is true. For instance, LC, you tell me you think cayvie is trying to pocket me and DDL. Does wolf cayvie trying to pocket Alison accuse her of being condescending and strongly disagree with her posts about mafia theory? Does wolf cayvie trying to pocket DDL really come up with "your joke about glasses had town energy" as the most likely thing to say to make DDL townread her?

linki:

Im not sure what to make of you lamp shading your own actions so quickly UG haha. You seem pretty ill at ease rn.

This is leaning me towards a Cassowary exe over a Jiwon one. This is the kind of post mafia makes to shade a townie. It's an indirect way of attacking them ("you seem pretty ill at ease") that is difficult to defend yourself against or pick apart (because the snap response is, "hey, that's just how I felt"), but is also couched in a hedgy way ("I'm not sure what to make of you...") that removes accountability for the read if UG flips town.

This is a post that wants us to narrow our eyes at UG, but without making us think "Cassowary wants us to vote UG". That's scummy.

[nutella]

eod is in 21 hours I believe.

[nutella]

This is leaning me towards a Cassowary exe over a Jiwon one. This is the kind of post mafia makes to shade a townie. It's an indirect way of attacking them ("you seem pretty ill at ease") that is difficult to defend yourself against or pick apart (because the snap response is, "hey, that's just how I felt"), but is also couched in a hedgy way ("I'm not sure what to make of you...") that removes accountability for the read if UG flips town.

This is a post that wants us to narrow our eyes at UG, but without making us think "Cassowary wants us to vote UG". That's scummy.

hmm this is a solid take. on snap intuition I find cass townier and UG less so, but I could see it the other way

[Carotenoid]

[VOTE: cassowary] aubergine

[Alison]

eod is in 21 hours I believe.

Oh, you might be right, I miscounted the hours. I like to start consolidating early with this little activity to force people to take stances early instead of being able to claim they weren't around at EOD though.

[chardonnay]

Okay maybe Long Con is town

fwiw I liked U-G's interventions so far.


dov - Fatmo - JiwonMeganPark - KitsuShel are complete ?? and I feel it's kinda holding me from moving forward. (bIG PicTurE reAdS) There's probably like... 1-2 scum in that?

What stands out about Long con as town from that interaction?

What have you liked about UG's posts so far?

(Gosh I wish there were muti-scum in that lurker pool! I'd feel less crazy for wanting to have so many early town reads)

-/-/-/-/-
Pre-edit

You quote'd me Alison :/

I made that remark about UG seeming "ill at ease" as a friendly jab b/c UG is normally a very confidant player.

[Carotenoid]

Okay maybe Long Con is town

fwiw I liked U-G's interventions so far.


dov - Fatmo - JiwonMeganPark - KitsuShel are complete ?? and I feel it's kinda holding me from moving forward. (bIG PicTurE reAdS) There's probably like... 1-2 scum in that?

What stands out about Long con as town from that interaction?[...]

I think it was a townie wtf because scum would have been more likely to feel "caught" and try to defend/explain it

[cassowary]

Im not sure what to make of you lamp shading your own actions so quickly UG haha. You seem pretty ill at ease rn.

This is leaning me towards a Cassowary exe over a Jiwon one. This is the kind of post mafia makes to shade a townie. It's an indirect way of attacking them ("you seem pretty ill at ease") that is difficult to defend yourself against or pick apart (because the snap response is, "hey, that's just how I felt"), but is also couched in a hedgy way ("I'm not sure what to make of you...") that removes accountability for the read if UG flips town.

This is a post that wants us to narrow our eyes at UG, but without making us think "Cassowary wants us to vote UG". That's scummy.

Chardonnay made this post, not me.

[nutella]

lol damn your names are too similar

[Alison]

Okay maybe Long Con is town

fwiw I liked U-G's interventions so far.


dov - Fatmo - JiwonMeganPark - KitsuShel are complete ?? and I feel it's kinda holding me from moving forward. (bIG PicTurE reAdS) There's probably like... 1-2 scum in that?

What stands out about Long con as town from that interaction?

What have you liked about UG's posts so far?

(Gosh I wish there were muti-scum in that lurker pool! I'd feel less crazy for wanting to have so many early town reads)

-/-/-/-/-
Pre-edit

You quote'd me Alison :/

I made that remark about UG seeming "ill at ease" as a friendly jab b/c UG is normally a very confidant player.

Oh okay you're out of my towncore then. Bad post. Townies take responsibility for their reads. In my defense chardonnay and cassowary look and sound alike.

[Long Con]

@cassowary
i'm also unsure why you qualified the Long Con vote as a wagon— nutella was explicit about her vote being a gut vote

meh, I guess I thought more people had voiced explicit suspicion on LC than I'm finding looking back

I stand by the vote though. Not a fan of LC's most recent post here either, even though I do appreciate a good gif.

Well, the gif was a totally appropriate response to a ridiculous assertion, so I don't know what to make of your lack of fandom. I take it you support the idea that me saying "as the chop" and not "as a wolf" is a negative indicator for my alignment?

I'm leaning toward cayvie as the chop right now. I don't like how her change of opinion on DDL went, and her ISO largely reads to me like pocketing attempts of DDL and Alison. [VOTE: cayvie] aubergine

Its pretty on the nose for Cayvie to pocket a player in such a manner.

Whats your read on Carotte?

I'll look into it.

I'm pretty happy giving PSI a day 1 pass since everyone who's played with them is saying in no uncertain terms that they're well within their town meta. The end of day 1 is approaching in 9 hours, and I'd like the wagons to be between Jiwon and Cassowary. If you're not one one of those two people, or don't want to be, talk to me about your concerns.

Re: the cayvie case, I'm not sold on it. It's a constructed narrative. Like yes, if you walk in and try to make up a story about why cayvie is scum and why her actions fit some scum agenda, you can say the glasses read was an attempt to pocket DDL, she was trying to pocket, yadda yadda.

But take a step back and look at the balance of probabilities, and ask yourself if there's anything that makes that interpretation more likely or convincing than any other. I don't think it is. There's a lot about cayvie's behavior that doesn't make sense if that theory is true. For instance, LC, you tell me you think cayvie is trying to pocket me and DDL. Does wolf cayvie trying to pocket Alison accuse her of being condescending and strongly disagree with her posts about mafia theory? Does wolf cayvie trying to pocket DDL really come up with "your joke about glasses had town energy" as the most likely thing to say to make DDL townread her?

Yes, why are you asking these questions which have obvious answers? It's what I said, ain't it?

You seem to be pushing the notion that a wolf starts the game with a set agenda and then carefully follows the original plan and always does things the best way. That's not the mafia that I have ever seen played. Scum react to the thread, and it's not always perfect in hindsight. You and DDL were big interactions for her, whether she intended it to be that way or not, and the way she dealt with it - especially DDL - looks like a wolf pocketing attempt to me. I guarantee I could take any assertion or accusation in this game and call it a "constructed narrative", so how's about we just use real terms that actually have meaning?

[cayvie]

I'm leaning toward cayvie as the chop right now. I don't like how her change of opinion on DDL went, and her ISO largely reads to me like pocketing attempts of DDL and Alison. [VOTE: cayvie] aubergine

rude >:|

what don't you like about my progression on DDL?

What progression. You suspected him, then he told an almost-joke, and then you were gushing with townpraise for him. It's fake, it's a pocketing attempt.

i mean i said i thought he was town? then i got asked several times to explain my read so i basically said the same thing over and over because it wasn't particularly deep. your face is a pocketing attempt :P

"gushing with townpraise" is bs

[Jackofhearts2005]

@chardonnay

Yeah, I “town hunt.”

Correctly identifying a townie means I can work with that player and look for wolves elsewhere.

[Alison]

I mean the way I used it has meaning. You're supposed to look at a sequence of events and try to figure out what's the most likely explanation for those events. You can point at anything I said about the game and I'll tell you why that explanation is the most likely one compared to alternative interpretations. The point I'm trying to make is that there are other, better explanations for cayvie's behavior and you appear to be tunneled on it.

[Jackofhearts2005]

Lol what does my post drooling mean??

Like you’re really hungry and ready to eat DDL up.

[Jackofhearts2005]

Let’s see what I missed

[Epignosis]

Good evening Airbenders.

I suppose that's a silly thing to say since there's only one of you given that up there it says "Last Airbender," but "Final Fantasy" is on its 211th title, so what do I know?

Anyway, I'm your (Last?) (Final?) (Penultimate? ) moderator on duty. If at any point you experience distress with other participants here, the host, the setup, or if your daily fantasy baseball team lost by one point (like mine did ), please PM your frustrations to me rather than letting them spill into the thread. I'm here to be the audience of your grievances and I will serve as an intermediary for any such conflict that shouldn't properly belong in a Mafia game.

Have fun...and uh...bend some air if you're the last one who can do that.

[PSINightmareEmpower]

@chardonnay
can i confirm why you're voting cassowary? you haven't said much immediately about them outside of 'something' feeling off and currently disagreeing with their PSINE read

forcing a read that they weren't really confidant in, (PSINightmare).

Oh shit I just did that huh

Yeah I didn't want my FIRST iso to be a null read so I kinda put a gun to my head and said "Nooter slightly scummy" even though it's closer to null.

Errr...what? This post wasn't even about you, why are you reacting to it?

[VOTE: Ultimate-Gamer] aubergine

To me this reads like U-G was already nervous about his Neutron read and had been thinking about it as he read the thread. His immediate reaction to the words "forcing a read that they weren't really confident in" was "oh shit I just did that" and immediately feels the need to defend himself. It's like he thought for sure someone was going to call him out on it so he felt the need to do it himself preemptively. I could also say that needing a not-nullread is scummy too, but I've that pressure too so I don't think that holds up.

I'm not super confident in this vote right now, but last time I read into a reaction as a scummy train of thought I was totally right (we would have chopped a wolf D1 if enough people had been on board, still salty about that) so I'm inclined to trust my gut here. Might change this later though.

linki:

Im not sure what to make of you lamp shading your own actions so quickly UG haha. You seem pretty ill at ease rn.

This is leaning me towards a Cassowary exe over a Jiwon one. This is the kind of post mafia makes to shade a townie. It's an indirect way of attacking them ("you seem pretty ill at ease") that is difficult to defend yourself against or pick apart (because the snap response is, "hey, that's just how I felt"), but is also couched in a hedgy way ("I'm not sure what to make of you...") that removes accountability for the read if UG flips town.

This is a post that wants us to narrow our eyes at UG, but without making us think "Cassowary wants us to vote UG". That's scummy.

While I somewhat agree with you here, I'm almost more inclined to read U-G/Chardonnay as w/w. It felt to me like Chard spotted the odd behavior of his scumbuddy and wanted to be the first to call attention to it in the thread for towncred or something, but didn't want to actually commit to bussing. There are two things wrong with this read though. 1. Chard likes to bus a lot, so him doing a half-hearted response to avoid bussing isn't as likely for him as it is for other people, and 2. They do know each other pretty well so I wouldn't be surprised if it was just a "my friend is acting kinda weird" reaction as either alignment.

Wow okay I'm pretty sure I just brought up all possible conclusions here and didn't learn anything from this thought process. Kinda pointless but those are my thoughts.

[Long Con]

I mean the way I used it has meaning. You're supposed to look at a sequence of events and try to figure out what's the most likely explanation for those events. You can point at anything I said about the game and I'll tell you why that explanation is the most likely one compared to alternative interpretations. The point I'm trying to make is that there are other, better explanations for cayvie's behavior and you appear to be tunneled on it.

A matter of perspective? I would not say that I'm tunneled on anything, but maybe we have vastly different definitions of what tunneling is, I don't know. From my perspective, I looked at cayvie's ISO, and got the feeling that she wasn't on the level, and tried to ascertain why I felt that way. Those behaviours are what I believe made me feel that way.

If you have the awesome ability to look at any sequence of events and figure out the every possible explanation for them, AND which one is the right explanation, then please, don't let me stand in your way. I'm not convinced that your perspective is that broad just because you say it is.

[chardonnay]

Okay maybe Long Con is town

fwiw I liked U-G's interventions so far.


dov - Fatmo - JiwonMeganPark - KitsuShel are complete ?? and I feel it's kinda holding me from moving forward. (bIG PicTurE reAdS) There's probably like... 1-2 scum in that?

What stands out about Long con as town from that interaction?[...]

I think it was a townie wtf because scum would have been more likely to feel "caught" and try to defend/explain it

I think I understand what you mean, but Long Con gives me the impression that he moves v confidently as a player regardless alignment.

Are you going to get back to me about UG?

-/-/-/-/--

I made that remark about UG seeming "ill at ease" as a friendly jab b/c UG is normally a very confidant player.

Oh okay you're out of my towncore then. Bad post. Townies take responsibility for their reads. In my defense chardonnay and cassowary look and sound alike.

Are you saying that you TR UG?

-/--/-/-

@chardonnay

Yeah, I “town hunt.”

Correctly identifying a townie means I can work with that player and look for wolves elsewhere.

THanks, its not as big a point of interest to me now as it was when i asked it. At the time how you TR'd Allison pinged me. Page 1 town is more likely to be wary of other town, meanwhile mafia would see it as clearly town motivates behind actions.

Can you talk me though your DDLxCavie read again. I don't think I quite understood it?

[DrWilgy]

Feeling better about LC now.

Just a note as we are looking at tied votes between 4 people.

Often I think a gamestate like this is indicative of being on the right path and that wolves have attempted to open counter wagons.

There must most definitely be a wolf amongst Cayvie, Cass, Ji or LC.

6

[Fatmo]

Hey guys! My first game here, and first time seeing most of you.

Like I said in the signups thread, I was never going to be able to be too active this game, especially early on. I'll try to be around a bit more later. I've read some random parts of this game (mostly from the first page) but not the whole thing. When I'm able to be around, I'm thinking it might be better for me to just talk with whoever is around rather than going back and doing a bunch of ISO type stuff. Especially early.

I'm still trying to change my playing style to something where I don't feel as compelled to spend as much time or drive myself cray-cray over these games. Lol it's hard sometimes and I'll feel guilty about not being around as much to post, so then I end up going too far the other way and just not doing much at all. This is my first forum game in about two months or so.

Early impressions basically from the first page are that Alison, Cayvie, and Carotenoid are first gut townleans. Maybe Nutella too.

Alison for her opening and just the townie energy that seems to be coming out of her.

Cayvie for the way she brought up mechanics early, but more for the reaction she had when Alison and maybe some others jumped on her for it. It reminds me a lot of how I open games sometimes. I consider myself a very weak mechanical player, and will often bring up mechanics questions to start the game just to see what people have to say about it. Sometimes you get some really readable moments when people inevitably start discussing/arguing about if even bringing up mechanics talk is good or not. The way Cayvie defended herself and kind of dug in about it being a good idea to speculate about mechanics strikes me as a townie reaction (It's how I've reacted in the past as town, which gets me into trouble more often than not, when it would have probably been easier to just back off from the pressure), as does Alison's initial jumping on it, and then coming to the conclusion that Cayvie is more likely town for her reaction to it. That just seemed to be a very genuine exchange from both ends.

And I've actually played a good game with Carotenoid, and observed another. She just seems to have a very similar tone. The way she pressures people and the kind of phrasing she uses. I feel like she has a distinctive way of pressuring people, and I'm not sure how easy she could replicate that as scum. My thinking is that it would be hard. I'm also putting stock into how strongly Alison is townreading her.

However, apparently she was scum in some recent game here and fooled a bunch of people. I think it was Nutella who was expressing some paranoia there.

Who else here was in that game with Carotenoid who has played with or observed her in other games? Or I guess who has seen her as both town and scum? I've only seen town. But again, this looks like what I've seen.

In general, I'm a bit slower to come to stronger reads than most people seem to be, especially scumreads, which will get me scumread sometimes. As town, I'll often be scumread for seeming "wishy-washy" or equivocating, especially early. I'm basically used to never being in the widely accepted towncore until maybe D3 or 4 lol.

So usually, my early days voting tends to be more of a thing where I'm voting someone I see the fewest reasons to townread rather than hard scumreading or anything like that. Or to save someone I feel is a decent townread. If I have a decent scumread on someone who's a wagon early, I consider that a pleasant bonus. But I do decently well coming to opinions more slowly, whereas I really hate the way I play when I start tunneling or going too crazy over the game.

So, especially the four people I've mentioned as townreads, who should I be voting for and why? I'm not necessarily going to sheep you, but I'll certainly take your opinions into account, because you all have obviously been more active and have had more time to think about stuff.

I'll try to be around a bit more later tonight. If not, I will do what I can to try to be around for EOD at least. This is my first game here, but I assume we can expect some kind of EOD insanity? Is that usually a thing here? Where I'm from, EOD is almost always just crazy, especially in early days, and it's something you want to be around for if you can.

I gotta go back to RL for a bit now, but already feel better now that I've at least gotten something into the thread lol. See you all later.

[Long Con]

There must most definitely be a wolf amongst Cayvie, Cass, Ji or LC.

Why do you make me waste a post asking why you think that, man? How can you say something like that and not know you are expected to explain why?

[nutella]

I agree with what PSI said about UG. Still iffy on LC but I'm never quite sure how to read him so he could probably be in both ranges rn. Moving to [VOTE: Ultimate Gamer] aubergine for now, let's see how he plays with a bit of pressure

[nutella]

And I've actually played a good game with Carotenoid, and observed another. She just seems to have a very similar tone. The way she pressures people and the kind of phrasing she uses. I feel like she has a distinctive way of pressuring people, and I'm not sure how easy she could replicate that as scum. My thinking is that it would be hard. I'm also putting stock into how strongly Alison is townreading her.

However, apparently she was scum in some recent game here and fooled a bunch of people. I think it was Nutella who was expressing some paranoia there.

Who else here was in that game with Carotenoid who has played with or observed her in other games? Or I guess who has seen her as both town and scum? I've only seen town. But again, this looks like what I've seen.

In general, I'm a bit slower to come to stronger reads than most people seem to be, especially scumreads, which will get me scumread sometimes. As town, I'll often be scumread for seeming "wishy-washy" or equivocating, especially early. I'm basically used to never being in the widely accepted towncore until maybe D3 or 4 lol.

welcome to the towncore lol


jk but nah i tr this post


also - me, alison, wilgy, and lc were all town in the recent carotte scumgame (amdibals at the zoo), and I believe we've all been in games where she was town as well (pyre and space invaders)

[Long Con]

To be fair, though, you guys lynched me baselessly as soon as I subbed in, so I don't feel like I got a good dose of her scumgame there.

[chardonnay]

While I somewhat agree with you here, I'm almost more inclined to read U-G/Chardonnay as w/w. It felt to me like Chard spotted the odd behavior of his scumbuddy and wanted to be the first to call attention to it in the thread for towncred or something, but didn't want to actually commit to bussing. There are two things wrong with this read though. 1. Chard likes to bus a lot, so him doing a half-hearted response to avoid bussing isn't as likely for him as it is for other people, and 2. They do know each other pretty well so I wouldn't be surprised if it was just a "my friend is acting kinda weird" reaction as either alignment.

I don't really love bussing tho? I'd say less then 50% of my scum games feature me bussing.

-/-/-/-/--/-

[mention]Long Con[/mention]

If the Cayvie wagon doesn't pan out who would you switch to?

[Dragon D. Luffy]

Good evening Airbenders.

I suppose that's a silly thing to say since there's only one of you given that up there it says "Last Airbender," but "Final Fantasy" is on its 211th title, so what do I know?

Anyway, I'm your (Last?) (Final?) (Penultimate? ) moderator on duty. If at any point you experience distress with other participants here, the host, the setup, or if your daily fantasy baseball team lost by one point (like mine did ), please PM your frustrations to me rather than letting them spill into the thread. I'm here to be the audience of your grievances and I will serve as an intermediary for any such conflict that shouldn't properly belong in a Mafia game.

Have fun...and uh...bend some air if you're the last one who can do that.

Interestingly enough, there are two airbenders in the role list, but one of them is a character who died 100 years before the cartoon started and only appears in flashbacks, so the host is kind of cheating here.

[Carotenoid]

[mention]chardonnay[/mention] woops sorry I missed your UG question!

I liked his Neutron ISO post. I vibed with his PSINE assessment (kinda forced but not scummy) and agree with his read of DJ overall. The post about "woops i did that too" does feel super self-conscious, but that's not necessarily a scummy trait. I don't think w!UG sees you scumread cassowary and then go haha *lol i did the same thing wOoPS*. Like, I agree there's a sort of ~stressed energy but I feel it's not afraid of getting caught stress, it's more trying to do useful contributions stress.

[Ultimate-Gamer]

@chardonnay
can i confirm why you're voting cassowary? you haven't said much immediately about them outside of 'something' feeling off and currently disagreeing with their PSINE read

forcing a read that they weren't really confidant in, (PSINightmare).

Oh shit I just did that huh

Yeah I didn't want my FIRST iso to be a null read so I kinda put a gun to my head and said "Nooter slightly scummy" even though it's closer to null.

I mean... there's nothing inhertly wrong with forcing a read for the sake of content generation. Its more when its done for the sake of not standing out.

Im not sure what to make of you lamp shading your own actions so quickly UG haha. You seem pretty ill at ease rn.

Oh yeah I'm absolutely ill at ease. This is a new game on an unfamiliar site, with new people I've never played. I am anxious as FUCK rn even outside of game stuff.

So I'm kinda, just talking. I'm just gonna kinda say whatever comes to me and then judge people based on how they react to that.

That's worked for me before so even if I can't fall back on familiar metas, there's always That.

And sorry if people were trying to address me before this, I'm still at work, I'll try to find time later.

[Ultimate-Gamer]

Speaking of speaking my mind and familiar metas... I REALLY feel like Grendel would know that? Like, how anxious I am in new situations and stuff... It feels REALLY weird that he'd throw that kind of shade and then keep on about it. Like, REALLY weird... This actually legit feels like a scummy Grendel play...

[nutella]

sorry, grendel = chardonnay?

[nutella]

Speaking of speaking my mind and familiar metas... I REALLY feel like Grendel would know that? Like, how anxious I am in new situations and stuff... It feels REALLY weird that he'd throw that kind of shade and then keep on about it. Like, REALLY weird... This actually legit feels like a scummy Grendel play...

idk this post feels weird like... overhyping/exaggerating the scumminess of the callout in a way that i feel scum would do to justify a fake scumread of a townie

[nutella]

like the three all caps "really"s plus "actually legit feels" like. why do you have to specify that it "actually legit feels scummy" unless you know they're not scum and are taking advantage of them doing something that "actually legit feels scummy"

[Long Con]

While I somewhat agree with you here, I'm almost more inclined to read U-G/Chardonnay as w/w. It felt to me like Chard spotted the odd behavior of his scumbuddy and wanted to be the first to call attention to it in the thread for towncred or something, but didn't want to actually commit to bussing. There are two things wrong with this read though. 1. Chard likes to bus a lot, so him doing a half-hearted response to avoid bussing isn't as likely for him as it is for other people, and 2. They do know each other pretty well so I wouldn't be surprised if it was just a "my friend is acting kinda weird" reaction as either alignment.

I don't really love bussing tho? I'd say less then 50% of my scum games feature me bussing.

-/-/-/-/--/-

@Long Con

If the Cayvie wagon doesn't pan out who would you switch to?

I see some UG talk, but I haven't looked at their posts yet...at this point I might sheep someone or hook up with a leading wagon that I felt strongest about. Maybe Wilgy, he's irked me a bit.

Linki: although that stuff nutella just said about UG is right up my alley.

[Carotenoid]

Fatmo's wallpost feels warm and fuzzy for some reason. I think it is a townie post!
--
Lol yeah Grendel = chardonnay!
--
In my experience town UG does have this kind of tone fairly often, I don't think it's scum indicative for him. I wouldn't want a UG vote today tbh

[cayvie]

Let’s see what I missed

what did you miss?

[DrWilgy]

There must most definitely be a wolf amongst Cayvie, Cass, Ji or LC.

Why do you make me waste a post asking why you think that, man? How can you say something like that and not know you are expected to explain why?

But I explained in the same post:
"Often I think a gamestate like this is indicative of being on the right path and that wolves have attempted to open counter wagons."

It's a gamestate type thing. I doubt we get to a tie like this without scum having a hand in it.

[Carotenoid]

oh I realized EoD is at 3 EDT, I might not be able to be around

I still don't feel very good about DDL's posting, would definitely vote here if it picked up. I'm also interested in the reasons some people are townreading him (?)

I don't think UG is a good vote today because their tone is well within town range and he's going to be much more readable soon I think.

Between cassowary and Jiwon I think I'd prefer a Jiwon flip but *eh*

[Alison]

I made that remark about UG seeming "ill at ease" as a friendly jab b/c UG is normally a very confidant player.

Oh okay you're out of my towncore then. Bad post. Townies take responsibility for their reads. In my defense chardonnay and cassowary look and sound alike.

Are you saying that you TR UG?

No.

-

Wilgy is town, not sure about LC. I have a bad track record of mis-exeing LC when he is town. Maybe his playstyle just reads scummy to me. I'm more inclined to trust my strong townreads to sort him because of that. Fatmo's opening post is super town.

Also I think UG is just town and is telling the truth about this being the way wolf chardonnay attacks people. nutella, I know what you mean about over-exaggerating the read, but this feels more like an "I'm anxious and I'm trying to make sure I get my point across read" rather than the scummy "constructed to cast shade/seem town" read.

[Carotenoid]

D1 - ~~16 hours 40 minutes before EoD votecount

Spoiler: show

Cassowary (2): Carotenoid, chardonnay
Cayvie (2): Long Con, DrWilgy
JiwonMeganPark (2): Alison, cayvie
Long Con (1): cassowary
Ultimate-Gamer (2): PSINightmareEmpower, nutella
Not voting (8): DJ Neutron Star, dov, Dragon D. Luffy, Fatmo, Jackofhearts2005, JiwonMeganPark, KituShel, Ultimate-Gamer

[cayvie]

There must most definitely be a wolf amongst Cayvie, Cass, Ji or LC.

Why do you make me waste a post asking why you think that, man? How can you say something like that and not know you are expected to explain why?

But I explained in the same post:
"Often I think a gamestate like this is indicative of being on the right path and that wolves have attempted to open counter wagons."

It's a gamestate type thing. I doubt we get to a tie like this without scum having a hand in it.

bluntly, i haven't seen any wagons all game--afair there's never been more than 2 votes on anyone--so i'm dubious of any wagonomics claims. join me on jiwon? do you have an opinion there?

[Long Con]

There must most definitely be a wolf amongst Cayvie, Cass, Ji or LC.

Why do you make me waste a post asking why you think that, man? How can you say something like that and not know you are expected to explain why?

But I explained in the same post:
"Often I think a gamestate like this is indicative of being on the right path and that wolves have attempted to open counter wagons."

It's a gamestate type thing. I doubt we get to a tie like this without scum having a hand in it.

So by "must most definitely", you really mean "this could be right sometimes".

Why would you pollute the thread with this needless false confidence?

[Alison]

Non-voteres put your vote down now. 2/3rds of the day is over and you haven't been voting all day. I can and will forcibly murder every single person in the not voting section if you do not take a stance in a timely fashion. Vanity wagons count as not voting unless you have a really good reason why you're correct to make that vote. Do not let the mafia hide their true intentions until it is convenient for them. Make them make difficult decisions early.

[Long Con]

Non-voteres put your vote down now. 2/3rds of the day is over and you haven't been voting all day. I can and will forcibly murder every single person in the not voting section if you do not take a stance in a timely fashion. Vanity wagons count as not voting unless you have a really good reason why you're correct to make that vote. Do not let the mafia hide their true intentions until it is convenient for them. Make them make difficult decisions early.

You get to decide which "wagons" are vanity, I take it. Is my cayvie vote "vanity"?

[Alison]

Non-voteres put your vote down now. 2/3rds of the day is over and you haven't been voting all day. I can and will forcibly murder every single person in the not voting section if you do not take a stance in a timely fashion. Vanity wagons count as not voting unless you have a really good reason why you're correct to make that vote. Do not let the mafia hide their true intentions until it is convenient for them. Make them make difficult decisions early.

You get to decide which "wagons" are vanity, I take it. Is my cayvie vote "vanity"?

A wagon is vanity if it has no chance of actually resulting in an exe. It's subjective and nebulous what makes a wagon vanity, but I think cayvie has enough probability of getting killed (some people have expressed suspicion on cayvie) that I would not call your vote on cayvie vanity. If someone who's been slanking the whole game puts a random vote on nutella 3 hours before EOD, that's vanity unless they can explain it so well that I feel the town (which up til now has expressed virtually no suspicion of nutella) has an actual chance of being swayed into exeing her.

Ultimately I'm not going to be like a binary sorter that categorizes votes into vanity and non vanity. What I'm trying to say is that I want people to take stances on wagons. If you don't take a stance on a wagon and I see you do that, I will probably think it's really scummy, and then I'll push you the next day for that. If your stance is legit you should trust that I will recognize you aren't trying to hide your vote (I don't think you are, LC), and that you can defend yourself if I come after you for it.

[chardonnay]

Speaking of speaking my mind and familiar metas... I REALLY feel like Grendel would know that? Like, how anxious I am in new situations and stuff... It feels REALLY weird that he'd throw that kind of shade and then keep on about it. Like, REALLY weird... This actually legit feels like a scummy Grendel play...

I don't recall you being noticeably nervous in that offsite game we played together a long time ago, and generally your early game persona tends to wax confidence on HS. I know I read your camp game a few years ago (was it really that long ago?), and I honestly didn't recall you getting this nervous in the early game.

Im not sure where I "kept on about it" as I think the only other time before this I mentioned it was because Alison attributed it to Cassowary instead of me.

The remark was jab to see if I could elicit a response from you. It did. Im thinking its a town response. Im aware of your tendency to be wary of me means that as town you'd be prone to aggressing me here, meanwhile scum you would pull back in this situation.

[chardonnay]

I work 2nd shift EST time so Im going to be MIA during EoD -.-; Probably a lot of EoD's I'll not be around unless one happens to land on a Wednesday, or Sunday, Which are my days off.

I'll do as much as I can tonight to make up for it.

[chardonnay]

Town in no particular order
Allison
Psinightmare
UG
Cayvie
Wiggly
DDL

Null but not willing to vote
Nutella
Long Con
Carot

Null but willing to vote
Fatmo
Neutron Star
Kisu
Jiwon
Dov

Scum I guess lol
Cassowary
Jack o' hearts

-/-/-/-/-

I read Fatmo's wall post and I don't get the gut town vibes that Nutella, and Carot see there.

Long Con, and Nutella, both seem like challenging players to get a read off of, and idk what, (If anything), makes them tic.

Wiggly was tmk the only other player to feel like Carrot was getting too much town steam too quickly. Pushing PvP as "do you think there's scum between them, and why?" I actually think is an interesting angle that I don't... think mafia would do comfortably early into the game.

Kisu, Dov, are non-entities. Jiwon isn't much better.

Neutron seem p reserved this game. I don't really have any concrete thoughts there yet.

-/-/-/-

I think that's everybody I haven't really talked about in so far, or in a while. If whoever else is up could drop a binary reads list to compare and help with consolidation please do so!