Girl Genius (END)

[Dyslexicon]

The Creature and Sabie wagons being so similar is odd. Both contain Jack, Diz, Timmer, Juliets. We added LC to lynch Sabie and subtracted Michelle, who voted Timmer instead, under the guise of independent thought after I pushed her for her bad Creature vote.

I think that’s a bad look for Michelle and a good look for Timmer.

Let’s see what Michelle actually said about Creature, Sabie and Timmer.

I noticed that as well. I wasn't really against a Sabie lynch on D4 either, but I preferred Creature over her. I remember Juliets jumping back and forth between Creature and Sabie. I don't think scum would do that if teamed with Sabie. I expect scum to either have bussed or just went for Creature. Still suspicious of Michelle who also voted off Sabie both times. Could also see Timmer being teamed with Sabie and wagons last day being scum/scum.

[Epignosis]

If you think I called for sabie's head and then tried to save my unreplaceable teammate who isn't here, then

Here's the thing, Epi.

The more I play mafia, the more I think about wolf strategy in terms of numbers and endgame.

Scum needs X mislynches. Scum needs Y players to survive until endgame.

Sabie wasn't surviving til endgame. If you're scum, I don't think you blast her and then try to save her. I think you blast her but not hard enough to stop Creature from getting lynched and then you say Timmer's scum with her and try to mislynch Timmer before and after Sabie swings.

The goal isn't to save Sabie and get her to endgame or even to use her power one more time. It's to get a mislynch while the mislynching is good.

That's not unreasonable.

Here's the thing, Jack.

sabie doesn't get lynched unless I say, "I want to lynch sabie." She was on nobody's radar. I was receptive to lynching Creature too. If I'm sabie's teammate, I can easily facilitate the Creature lynch and string up a different civilian next.

Your accusation against me, that I mastermindedly made sure Creature got lynched first, is silly. The poll was tied. Had sabie gotten the rope first, this conversation would be very different.

[Dyslexicon]

I think Timmer is town on his own merits. Now @Timmer don’t let me down.

If Timmer is bad, shooting LC and leaving Epi alive is dumb. LC townread Timmer. Epi is going to push there today.

There's only been one kill the last two nights and we still have both Mafia and SK in the game. So either kills are being blocked or perhaps SK is inactive (which would likely make it Sprit or Drag)

[Dyslexicon]

people who are sus af:

juliets
jack
timmer
dyslexicon

Why?

[Dyslexicon]

Put this another way: an efficient usage of the scum powerset is to block two people each night. That can narrow down the list pretty quickly. For the last two nights there have only been one kill. Blocks? Maybe. Doctors? Maybe. Same targets? Maybe. Immunities? Maybe but then there'd be some other clear information available. In any case I'd assume scum has some solid distinction of what people are and what people might be more dangerous to them.

Oh. This might be why there is only one kill then.

[Dyslexicon]

those four are either timmer
or
voted for creature over sabie and then suddenly found sabie suspicious

I didn't suddenly find Sabie suspicious though. Actually I ended up leaving my vote on Sabie mostly because if she was indeed scum it would be annoying to lose to scum who's lurking rather than people actually playing. Maybe a blah reason to vote, but that was mostly it. It's like you're saying that the people you listed suddenly flipped their read on Sabie, but that's not true for me, and Juliets almost voted Sabie D4 as well. Jack I don't really remember their stance on Sabie D4, but I'm pretty sure they didn't town read Sabie since she was mostly just not here.

[Dyslexicon]

Sure. Potential.
Why am I defending someone I haven't voted for instead of you defending your vote for her... ?
That seems ass-backwards.

No. If you think someone is town you say why. Have you played with Michelle before?

[Dyslexicon]

@Dyslexicon has the most posts in the thread. I don't know what any of them are anymore.
That's a problem.

If only there was a way to figure it out

[Dyslexicon]

11 players +Quin
3 scum, 1 sk, 7 townies.

Townies are Jack, very likely Tony, very likely Dom.

4 more townies. Gth Juliets and Dizzy are town too.

2 townies in Epi, Michelle, Sprityo, Timmer, Owner, Drago.

Epi and Michelle both antialigned with Timmer, particularly Epi.

I want some gth reads on the ugly pack. Who are the two townies there?

I still read Owner as town, but waiting for the say she fools me tbh. No idea on the others. Why is Tony town to you? Also can you walk me through the anti-alignments?

[Jackofhearts2005]

11 players +Quin
3 scum, 1 sk, 7 townies.

Townies are Jack, very likely Tony, very likely Dom.

4 more townies. Gth Juliets and Dizzy are town too.

2 townies in Epi, Michelle, Sprityo, Timmer, Owner, Drago.

Epi and Michelle both antialigned with Timmer, particularly Epi.

I want some gth reads on the ugly pack. Who are the two townies there?

GTH I would pick Epi and Owner as town.

I’m kinda thinking Epi and Timmer.

*ducks*

[Dyslexicon]

I’ll hesitantly trust better opinions on this one. Also can’t really imagine anyone who’d rather be Town than scum but I think I might be an odd one out on that.

This site has a scum bias tbh. On my homesite I think most players prefer town actually. It's much more fun to try to figure things out imo, I just find that challenge more interesting. When I'm scum I just end up feeling bad lol. Luckily I haven't randed scum in a very long time, and I'm probably going to suck hard when, or IF, it happens. =p

[Jackofhearts2005]

Dom, I’m saying a Timmer flip will effect my Michelle read.

That doesn’t mean I don’t have a Michelle read.

....right....

"I think Michelle is bad. But I'll know if she's bad if timmer isn't. Therefore, I should lynch Michelle first!"

What.

@juliets-- what do you think?

Sorry, I don't know either. My gut feel is she doesn't do it if Rainy is a teammate.

That is my gut feeling, but

Why are you saying I should adopt the strategy that would cause me to lynch a townie if my reads are correct?

We don’t have a bucket of extra mislynches.

[Jackofhearts2005]

Dom, I’m saying a Timmer flip will effect my Michelle read.

That doesn’t mean I don’t have a Michelle read.

....right....

"I think Michelle is bad. But I'll know if she's bad if timmer isn't. Therefore, I should lynch Michelle first!"

What.

This is correct reasoning if you don’t think Timmer is scum and you do think Michelle is scum. It’s obviously correct reasoning. It’s not particularly controversial.

Lol thanks.

[Dyslexicon]

you should all lynch epi actually

Maybe.

day 5 epi was literally just reaffirming every five minutes that he supports a sabie lynch with every post in between condemning it instead

gottem

I could see Timmer, Epi and Sabie all being teamed actually. Don't remember why exactly, but I got that feeling reading through. But I also think Michelle is likely to be teamed with Sabie, and Epi has consistently town read Michelle for reasons I don't really recall. Don't know if Epi does that if teamed with Michelle (?) Maybe.

[Jackofhearts2005]

If you think I called for sabie's head and then tried to save my unreplaceable teammate who isn't here, then

Here's the thing, Epi.

The more I play mafia, the more I think about wolf strategy in terms of numbers and endgame.

Scum needs X mislynches. Scum needs Y players to survive until endgame.

Sabie wasn't surviving til endgame. If you're scum, I don't think you blast her and then try to save her. I think you blast her but not hard enough to stop Creature from getting lynched and then you say Timmer's scum with her and try to mislynch Timmer before and after Sabie swings.

The goal isn't to save Sabie and get her to endgame or even to use her power one more time. It's to get a mislynch while the mislynching is good.

That's not unreasonable.

Here's the thing, Jack.

sabie doesn't get lynched unless I say, "I want to lynch sabie.". She was on nobody's radar. I was receptive to lynching Creature too. If I'm sabie's teammate, I can easily facilitate the Creature lynch and string up a different civilian next.

Your accusation against me, that I mastermindedly made sure Creature got lynched first, is silly. The poll was tied. Had sabie gotten the rope first, this conversation would be very different.

Fair enough.

[Jackofhearts2005]

I think Timmer is town on his own merits. Now @Timmer don’t let me down.

If Timmer is bad, shooting LC and leaving Epi alive is dumb. LC townread Timmer. Epi is going to push there today.

There's only been one kill the last two nights and we still have both Mafia and SK in the game. So either kills are being blocked or perhaps SK is inactive (which would likely make it Sprit or Drag)

Also a fair point.

[Dyslexicon]

I'm joining on Michelle. I think maybe scum team is largely inactive and I can see Michelle's voting as trying to carry numbers over for scum. Also just haven't recognized town in Michelle.

[VOTE: Michelle] aubergine

I'm more busy in general this week, but I'll probably be around tonight. FYI

[Jackofhearts2005]

11 players +Quin
3 scum, 1 sk, 7 townies.

Townies are Jack, very likely Tony, very likely Dom.

4 more townies. Gth Juliets and Dizzy are town too.

2 townies in Epi, Michelle, Sprityo, Timmer, Owner, Drago.

Epi and Michelle both antialigned with Timmer, particularly Epi.

I want some gth reads on the ugly pack. Who are the two townies there?

I still read Owner as town, but waiting for the say she fools me tbh. No idea on the others. Why is Tony town to you? Also can you walk me through the anti-alignments?

This is the part of the game where I see town Tony. He’s not manipulating. He’s evaluating. His positions make sense, right or wrong. There’s no agenda. Wolf Tony’s biggest weakness is he can let agenda leak in.

To be clear, I don’t think Timmer and Epi/Michelle must be opposite alignments. I think they aren’t wolves together. Epi doesn’t try to kill Sabie and then when people want to do so, he switches to Timmer who is actually somewhat active. Subbing in and bussing 2 teammates this late in the game is awful wolf strategy imo. Michelle used real iffy reasoning to vote off the Sabie wagon twice. Once, it netted a mislynch in Creature. Once, it almost netted a Timmer lynch. If you’re wolf Michelle, why not bus Sabie. There’s an obvious block of Creature voters to blend in with. Timmer is more active than Sabie. If I’m Michelle and Timmer is scum, I’m voting Sabie every time.

So really at least one of Timmer and Epi and one of Timmer and Michelle should be town.

Do I think Epi and Michelle are both town? No. So I think Timmer is town.

[Dom]

you should all lynch epi actually

go on...

Dom, I’m saying a Timmer flip will effect my Michelle read.

That doesn’t mean I don’t have a Michelle read.

....right....

"I think Michelle is bad. But I'll know if she's bad if timmer isn't. Therefore, I should lynch Michelle first!"

What.

This is correct reasoning if you don’t think Timmer is scum and you do think Michelle is scum. It’s obviously correct reasoning. It’s not particularly controversial.

And the reasoning that timmer is civvie is.....

those four are either timmer
or
voted for creature over sabie and then suddenly found sabie suspicious

I didn't suddenly find Sabie suspicious though. Actually I ended up leaving my vote on Sabie mostly because if she was indeed scum it would be annoying to lose to scum who's lurking rather than people actually playing. Maybe a blah reason to vote, but that was mostly it. It's like you're saying that the people you listed suddenly flipped their read on Sabie, but that's not true for me, and Juliets almost voted Sabie D4 as well. Jack I don't really remember their stance on Sabie D4, but I'm pretty sure they didn't town read Sabie since she was mostly just not here.

"I had no reason to suddenly vote sabie so let me spew bullshit for several sentences"

Sure. Potential.
Why am I defending someone I haven't voted for instead of you defending your vote for her... ?
That seems ass-backwards.

No. If you think someone is town you say why. Have you played with Michelle before?

No I don't. I also didn't say she was civvie.
You're being manipulative. And you're not doing it well.

@Dyslexicon has the most posts in the thread. I don't know what any of them are anymore.
That's a problem.

If only there was a way to figure it out

I remember most other people's reads/opinions.
Why not yours?

Dom, I’m saying a Timmer flip will effect my Michelle read.

That doesn’t mean I don’t have a Michelle read.

....right....

"I think Michelle is bad. But I'll know if she's bad if timmer isn't. Therefore, I should lynch Michelle first!"

What.

@juliets-- what do you think?

Sorry, I don't know either. My gut feel is she doesn't do it if Rainy is a teammate.

That is my gut feeling, but

Why are you saying I should adopt the strategy that would cause me to lynch a townie if my reads are correct?

We don’t have a bucket of extra mislynches.

Dyslexicon-- why does Jack not owe an explanation for why he thinks timmer is civvie but I owe an explanation for my non-read on Michelle?

[Michelle]

Everyone who suspects me raise your hand lol.

I considered you villa few days in a row but I have a doubt rn. You started to shade me since y-day and today you only see me in the playerlist to solve the puzzle. This is agenda-y and your towniness is way lower now.

[VOTE: Michelle] aubergine

I hate her sheeping a townie she’s watched derp all over the place when it comes to reading a player she knows just as well as me which resulted in a mislynch on Creature instead of a scumlynch on Sabie.

I’m still waiting for her to do something.

That said, I wanna resolve Timmer vs Epi pretty badly. It’s easy to argue Timmerwas trying to save Sabie D4. It’s easy to argue the same of Epi D5. I doubt Epi decides to buss Timmer and Sabie at the same damn time after doing so well so imo a scum lynch on either player clears the other.

If I knew Sabie is scum I would be on his wagon yesterday and pick up the town points.
You hate me sheeping a town read I had? In a game with unknown players and in a moment when I didn't read all the thread should I rng my vote? just asking

Linking at a surface level 3 players like this is nagl because the starting point is biased

going to answer at the other posts too asap

[Michelle]

The Creature and Sabie wagons being so similar is odd. Both contain Jack, Diz, Timmer, Juliets. We added LC to lynch Sabie and subtracted Michelle, who voted Timmer instead, under the guise of independent thought after I pushed her for her bad Creature vote.

I think that’s a bad look for Michelle and a good look for Timmer.

Let’s see what Michelle actually said about Creature, Sabie and Timmer.

Instead someone else noticing this oddness, let Jack tell you this, he who had not a better behaviour. He scumread or not Creature but he voted him and after he is accusing me of bad sheeping. He is clean, of course.

Michelle consistently scumreads Timmer all game because Timmer pushed Rej and Michelle didn’t like that (will have to check if Michelle cared about the Rej push at the time or if it’s just vote justification after the fact.

Michelle says absolutely nothing about Sabie all game. That’s a very weird spot to be considering how big a suspect Sabie has been and that Michelle was on the counterwagon to Sabie twice.

I've played with Rej few games, he has an odd way of villaging but I wasn't present here all day to notice you will lynch him for real. My only sin was hard multitabling.

Can you better say about who other I didn't say absolutely notyhing all game? Around 80% of the playerlist I think

Michelle offers this lone post in defense of Rej D1. That’s it.

Spoiler: show

Spoiler: show

@Michelle tell us about yourself as a mafia player. Where do you come from, what’s your strategy? What are you looking for or looking at in this game right now? Does anyone or anything stand out?

I played one alias game with Michelle and I also believe she was in the Champs game with the representative from PerC, which I followed.

I would definitely recommend lynching Michelle at all costs.

ngl the "at all costs" is really ugly

i liked the post #470
http://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/viewto ... 10#p548810

Oh, and also didn't like Michelle's entry to the game that much.

again about me, sorry i didn't have time to make an entry to please you. That much doesn't mean at all yet you vote me after.

Yo, why you so set on lynching Michelle?

That first thing wasn't serious, if that wasn't obvious.

Also, hi Luna, hi! Nice to see you again. I'm totally town this time though. <3

For me was not obviously a not serious thing

posts 476 and 477 contains reads on many players, i like this.

http://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/viewto ... 16#p548816

Yo, why you so set on lynching Michelle?

Regarding this though =p

[VOTE: Michelle] aubergine

^

Spoiler: show

This was my first thought too; though I don’t think it’s accurate. My guess on generic = has similar reads to him.

I’ll answer one of the questions: rej flip is the obvious answer, but I think Drago or Epi is the more interesting bet.

Generic being same reads doesn't make sense to me.
But I do agree Drag probably would be the most exciting flip

noted this

[Timmer is scum]

Can someone tell me about Rej's meta? Cause this post is so weird.
Lots of people have expressed suspicion on Rej. Why would Timmer be the opportunistic one?

This is the second time when i like in a townish way your post because usually scum don't ask about meta to check a player. I've played around 3 games with Rej, 2 as town and 1 as scum. As scum he never defend himself like he did today here. I am not 100% sure but the suspicion on him came from miswording and he may be civ.

i don't feel to continue this, idk your meta but i am not scum reading now you because you made few villagery movements.

Yes I was low poster. this is my meta lately.

[Jackofhearts2005]

Okay great. Help me find a wolf if you ain’t one.

Who should we lynch?

[Jackofhearts2005]

It’s actually in our best interest to lynch the sker today but imo, we’re going to have to luck into that.

[TonyStarkPrime]

[mention]Dom[/mention]

Yeah it’d be nice if he explained that beyond the wagonomics. But to that extent his townread of Timmer is at least documented. If to him one of Timmer and Michelle is scum he’d vote for the one he thinks is scummy.

[TonyStarkPrime]

It’s actually in our best interest to lynch the sker today but imo, we’re going to have to luck into that.

(Hence the first line of questioning of the day)

[Jackofhearts2005]

It’s actually in our best interest to lynch the sker today but imo, we’re going to have to luck into that.

(Hence the first line of questioning of the day)

[mention]Dom[/mention]

Eh?

[TonyStarkPrime]

If scum knows who the SK is than we’re best off lynching scum because it’s such a high risk strategy to not block the SK — but if we lynch scum scum might determine that that risk is mitigated by their low numbers.

[Jackofhearts2005]

Never mind. I can make eyes at Dom all day but he’s never developing telepathy to tell me what I want to know.

[TonyStarkPrime]

Here's some actual mechanical analysis: someone give me odds that the mafia knows who the serial killer is.

Nope the first line of questioning was about Drago on review. Whatever line of questioning this was

[Jackofhearts2005]

Lol what if Timmer is the sker?

Suspicious players hate him!

[TonyStarkPrime]

Lol what if Timmer is the sker?

Suspicious players hate him!

(An implication)

[Jackofhearts2005]

Lol what if Timmer is the sker?

Suspicious players hate him!

(An implication)

I know. Just trust your heart and stuff.

[Dom]

@Dom

Yeah it’d be nice if he explained that beyond the wagonomics. But to that extent his townread of Timmer is at least documented. If to him one of Timmer and Michelle is scum he’d vote for the one he thinks is scummy.

And I'm supposed to just read his mind on all of this?

It’s actually in our best interest to lynch the sker today but imo, we’re going to have to luck into that.

(Hence the first line of questioning of the day)

[mention]Dom[/mention]

What?

Never mind. I can make eyes at Dom all day but he’s never developing telepathy to tell me what I want to know.

The fuck?

[Jackofhearts2005]

Yes. Please read my mind.

[Dom]

wtf

[Jackofhearts2005]

wtf

Forget it.

Just help me find scumbos.

[Dom]

That is... precisely what i'm doing....

[Dom]

If you are interested in playing this game and not spewing nonsense about how i'm supposed to read your mind-- then generate some discussion.

[Jackofhearts2005]

If you are interested in playing this game and not spewing nonsense about how i'm supposed to read your mind-- then generate some discussion.

Do you think Timmer could be the sker? And if so, what does that mean for Epi and Michelle?

[sprityo]

@sprityo

Were you gonna post something or just checking to make sure nobody is voting for you or what?

Something

[Epignosis]

I want to thank Quin for being the hero we needed, although sadly not the hero we deserve.

Also, Poseidon really has it out for my nutsack today.

[Jackofhearts2005]

Sprityo obviously a hidden jester role.

Mafia is easy.

[TonyStarkPrime]

@sprityo

Were you gonna post something or just checking to make sure nobody is voting for you or what?

Something

pls SK kill this man

[Jackofhearts2005]

@sprityo

Were you gonna post something or just checking to make sure nobody is voting for you or what?

Something

pls SK kill this man

Tony, gimmie a rainbow.

[TonyStarkPrime]

Let’s talk about the usage from Jack and others of sker.

sker would imply that just sk would be serial kill.

There is no such thing as a serial kill it is almost oxymoronic. Therefore it is a bad abbreviation and we should cut off the last two letters and leave it at SK.

Thank y’all for coming to my ted talk.

[TonyStarkPrime]

@sprityo

Were you gonna post something or just checking to make sure nobody is voting for you or what?

Something

pls SK kill this man

Tony, gimmie a rainbow.

Welp I’m nothing if not performative.

Grey: Quin

Light green:
Jack
Epi

Yellow / current townie tinfoils:
Dys
Juliets

Light Orange:
Dom
Owner

Orange:
Timmer
Michelle

Purple:
Sprityo
Drago


Just a coincidence that it’s two to a tier. Arranged top to bottom on willingness to lynch except purple cause what the heck do you do with them

[Jackofhearts2005]

Let’s talk about the usage from Jack and others of sker.

sker would imply that just sk would be serial kill.

There is no such thing as a serial kill it is almost oxymoronic. Therefore it is a bad abbreviation and we should cut off the last two letters and leave it at SK.

Thank y’all for coming to my ted talk.

Remember that one time Grinner was a Cereal Killer but it was me all along?

[TonyStarkPrime]

Let’s talk about the usage from Jack and others of sker.

sker would imply that just sk would be serial kill.

There is no such thing as a serial kill it is almost oxymoronic. Therefore it is a bad abbreviation and we should cut off the last two letters and leave it at SK.

Thank y’all for coming to my ted talk.

Remember that one time Grinner was a Cereal Killer but it was me all along?

If you ever hand me a rock again I am going to not keep it.

[TonyStarkPrime]

Also my deep rooted assumption is that Jack never reminds me of the time he tricked me as SK if he is the SK.

[Jackofhearts2005]

Let’s talk about the usage from Jack and others of sker.

sker would imply that just sk would be serial kill.

There is no such thing as a serial kill it is almost oxymoronic. Therefore it is a bad abbreviation and we should cut off the last two letters and leave it at SK.

Thank y’all for coming to my ted talk.

Remember that one time Grinner was a Cereal Killer but it was me all along?

If you ever hand me a rock again I am going to not keep it.

I named every rock and they all were good pets.