Ziggy Stardust Mafia

[nutella]

linki: it's not a bullshit read. your slot's interaction with DS is hot garbage and you know this. if you were reviewing that slot from a neutral position you would have it as orange, I am certain. sure there's nothing really conclusive, but to me it fits the exact mold of a teammate pairing, partially because of the lack of material.

I probably put a slot with a bunch of nothing in the POE pool, yes. Again, this is not what you did. You went straight to hot garbage, and at my first incredulous reply you took it to 11 and said I "claimed mafia". That's not "going hard". That's bullshitting.

your read on me is the fake one. You know that I only go hard on you like this as town. In FTL I kept you comfortably in my pocket. You 100% know that I don't treat you like this as scum. You're full of shit.

No two games are the same. I had nowhere to go but to trust you in FTL, where literally my entire faction went to sleep for the whole game. You were the only other person doing anything, and credit to you for taking proper advantage of that environment. This environment is not the same, and the dynamic changes accordingly. You're a quality player with a diverse skillset that does not limit you to treating me in identical ways in every game, particularly when they are consecutive. So that is not going to cut it.

Besides, you are the one who broadened the POE pool too much. You concluded your interactive exercise with a 50/50 split, which is not your typical pattern. You are leaving your options open. I have exactly three suspects.

Damn I so wish I could vote for you. But I think Jiwon is pretty likely your partner here so it's ok.

Why is Tony town?

No comment on my strongest point against you I see.

I know when you're struggling to emulate your town behavior. You think you can hide in your analysis but I can tell you are nudging results in the direction you want and you are fabricating the strength of your reasoning for suspecting me. You're pushing to see how far this can go and I see right through it. Sure I'm tunneling and confbiasing and all that, whatever. You've gone past the point where I could reconsider you and instead you doubled down on your bullshit on me which in turn confirmed that I am correct about you.


Tony did some vague hinting that I didn't necessarily follow but knowing him I find that more likely a good sign than not. He's certainly my least clear non-suspect and would be my first fallback if my suspect pool fails.

[MacDougall]

ftr this is all reached in hindsight after DS. flipped. and then i notice how he ignored all her posts directed to him. isn't that odd too? she quoted him maybe 4 times (3 times about the angleshoot and once about discrediting his epi read) and not once did he directly respond to her, she who was a solid town read for him. he didn't seem to ignore TSP, Epi, or me or anyone who placed him unfavorably in their rainbows or voted for him (jaggedjack and mac respectively). it doesn't fit my mold of DS. to ignore criticism which made me wonder if he's ignoring nutella cos he literally didn't care or feel threatened by her.

I can understand your perspective in a roundabout way in that I think what you describe applies to Mac in parallel. He paid more attention to Mac than to nutella, but he did nothing with it and stuffed him awkwardly into the POE pile next to leetic and Epignosis -- two players for whom he could more easily justify that placement given his posts. I got the impression that DS cared about Mac's existence but not Mac's posts.

Because I had an rvs vote on him all day that was tilting him.

[MacDougall]

Jiwon is confused or something. I don't know why he's voting for me. We are on way lovers. If I die he dies but if he dies I don't die. We had btsc til today and now we're locked out of it and he's decided to vote me.

I am VT but I have a psuedo clear on someone because someone sent me a random rolecop and the role seems super likely to be a town one.

I don't want to out them though.

[MacDougall]

Fmpov Jay is obvious mafia tho. Just ignore all his bs today. Jack was my top scum and now suddenly he's off the poll and Dunya dies. Don't even need to humour it for a second.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

dunya is the reason I'm off the poll. I was notified I'd been buffed which is precisely what her role does.

Both of my top suspects have tried to play that against me now. Even if I cannot receive votes, I can be discredited.

I feel very comfortable with the state of this game. nutella and Mac could just be the team.

[MacDougall]

Ok lynch me then. Jiwon will die. Hopefully he was mafia. He was pretty towny in the btsc we had though.

[Duskfall]

dunya is the reason I'm off the poll. I was notified I'd been buffed which is precisely what her role does.

Both of my top suspects have tried to play that against me now. Even if I cannot receive votes, I can be discredited.

I feel very comfortable with the state of this game. nutella and Mac could just be the team.

I was hoping you would say this actually is considered it already

It also makes it a lot more likely Ds was notified about being a lover

[Duskfall]

Ok lynch me then. Jiwon will die. Hopefully he was mafia. He was pretty towny in the btsc we had though.

Mac and jiwon in a 2 for 1 is really nice since they are both in Poe imo

[Epignosis]

I am unhappy about dunya's departure.

I will be with you all after Brown Family Karaoke Friday.

[Long Con]

Jiwon is confused or something. I don't know why he's voting for me. We are on way lovers. If I die he dies but if he dies I don't die. We had btsc til today and now we're locked out of it and he's decided to vote me.

I am VT but I have a psuedo clear on someone because someone sent me a random rolecop and the role seems super likely to be a town one.

I don't want to out them though.

If he was in BTSC with you and decided to vote for you immediately after, that doesn't looks so great on you.

Did the 'love' end when the BTSC ended?

[Long Con]

linki: it's not a bullshit read. your slot's interaction with DS is hot garbage and you know this. if you were reviewing that slot from a neutral position you would have it as orange, I am certain. sure there's nothing really conclusive, but to me it fits the exact mold of a teammate pairing, partially because of the lack of material.

I probably put a slot with a bunch of nothing in the POE pool, yes. Again, this is not what you did. You went straight to hot garbage, and at my first incredulous reply you took it to 11 and said I "claimed mafia". That's not "going hard". That's bullshitting.

your read on me is the fake one. You know that I only go hard on you like this as town. In FTL I kept you comfortably in my pocket. You 100% know that I don't treat you like this as scum. You're full of shit.

No two games are the same. I had nowhere to go but to trust you in FTL, where literally my entire faction went to sleep for the whole game. You were the only other person doing anything, and credit to you for taking proper advantage of that environment. This environment is not the same, and the dynamic changes accordingly. You're a quality player with a diverse skillset that does not limit you to treating me in identical ways in every game, particularly when they are consecutive. So that is not going to cut it.

Besides, you are the one who broadened the POE pool too much. You concluded your interactive exercise with a 50/50 split, which is not your typical pattern. You are leaving your options open. I have exactly three suspects.

Damn I so wish I could vote for you. But I think Jiwon is pretty likely your partner here so it's ok.

Why is Tony town?

No comment on my strongest point against you I see.

I know when you're struggling to emulate your town behavior. You think you can hide in your analysis but I can tell you are nudging results in the direction you want and you are fabricating the strength of your reasoning for suspecting me. You're pushing to see how far this can go and I see right through it. Sure I'm tunneling and confbiasing and all that, whatever. You've gone past the point where I could reconsider you and instead you doubled down on your bullshit on me which in turn confirmed that I am correct about you.

When I read over your posts, it looks more like you are the one fabricating your reasons for suspecting Jay. I'm just not convinced by arguments like "I know" and "I can tell" and "I see right through it". If this were a no infodumping game, then I would be all over supporting you, but I'm not getting the meat of your accusation here.

[nutella]

I have no info to dump. I just view this as Jay's scum game, plain and simple. If you don't agree with me, fine. Lynch me if you must but promise he'll be next when you see me flip town. My record for reading Jay is spotless.

I reiterate that this is the strongest reason to suspect Jay, in combination with Jack's grossly DS-compatible history:

Besides, you are the one who broadened the POE pool too much. You concluded your interactive exercise with a 50/50 split, which is not your typical pattern. You are leaving your options open.

I find it hard to put into words beyond that but I simply have a feeling in my gut that Jay is feigning his suspicions and the way he has doubled down on me solidifies that read.



In other news, Mac's info is good to know I guess but does not preclude him or Jiwon from being scum; the uneven aspect of it seems like another balance thing and I feel like it points toward one of them being more likely scum than the other but I'll have to think about it more.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Apparently your suspects are the same as my own nutella, with yourself replaced with me. You refer to Tony as a sort of “alternate” for the POE pool, which doesn’t strike me as a significant departure from my own pool. What does this say to you?

[mention]MacDougall[/mention], did Jiwon give any indication of suspicion of you in your BTSC?

[JaggedJimmyJay]

My record for reading Jay is spotless.

Also, Cats vs. Dogs is at least one gigantic ugly-ass spot.

~~~

I will likely be hampered in my ability to remain active during this day phase. I have an extremely busy weekend ahead with work, a podcast, and my father’s 60th. Use me up now folks.

One thing I haven’t done is read the thread in full sequence. Down with ketchup. It’s short enough to bother, so I’ll see how that impacts my view of things.

[Epignosis]

Brown Family Karaoke is over. I sang "Rocketman" by Elton John and "Stellar" by Incubus, completing my outer space theme.

I am here now after an additional four minutes.

[Epignosis]

YETL

What the fuck is it?

[Epignosis]

DS. has 2 posts that name nutella, his first was questioning my reads list on why nutella is so low and saying he'd swap nutella into my green list instead of jaggedjack. he has not once engaged with her itt. what earns nutella a shining green spot in his list of townies?

also worth noting he had no suspicion at that point against him? he was walking around thinking he's all but "town confirmed" himself and picking fights about really inane things.

Dropping where I am at before I run out posts
Town
Dusk
Dunya
Jiwon
Nutella

Null to scum
Tony
Jack
LC

Poe:
Leetic
Mac
Epi

there is no thought process on how he reached a town read on nutella. the same argument can be made for jiwon existing in his town pile. what jiwon has going for her that nutella doesn't however is: 1. she hammered DS (which is not a lot) but 2. a public scolding of DS.'s "bad humor" towards leetic, and DS's "have you even read the thread" post to Jiwon. i know that sort of stuff can be easily staged, but it felt authentic at the time and i don't feel like discrediting it atm.

now nutella's handling of DS was interesting. she took a stance on Jack. she never engaged us in leetic after the initial day 1 of day 1 when i did my case on leetic for being wolf.

DS, this is either severe angleshooting and you know it, or you’re faking. I’m choosing the more charitable option. I’ll call it NAI cause I’m nice. Let’s get on with the game.

It's minor angleshooting at best (It's definitely not YETL), and I am fine with that.

lmao i'm actually a big fan of the yetl thing and don't really find it angleshooty necessarily, while this is for sure

doesn't seem like town nutella is pissed that someone is angleshooting tbh. feels more like scum nutella knowing what's going on.

the jack stuff is interesting however,

[VOTE: jack] aubergine


this is wolf regardless of leetic's alignment

this feels like whether leetic flips town or not, she has jack to go after once that's done. jack was right in pointing out...what does this even mean.

[VOTE: jack] aubergine


this is wolf regardless of leetic's alignment

I don't believe you believe that.

I especially don't believe you believe Leetic and I are wolves together.

she didn't say you and leetic are wolves together.

She said I was a wolf even if Leetic is a wolf.

I don't believe Nutella believes that's true.

Linki: Because I was watching Hunter x Hunter. Greed Island arc. It's not as good as the Phantom Troupe arc but it's still really good.

hmm upon more thought i don't think i do, but my point was really that i suspected you more than leetic by that point -- given dunya's meta point and some of leetic's responses i reconsidered him but suspected you regardless. and now yeah i think you are wolf and leetic isn't but i am still reading the actual content you have now produced so it's not a lock read

do you think jack is town like i do and pls tell me why on earth i'm not tunneling jack like i should?

could jack and leetic be it.

Well I'm currently voting for Jack but that's from before most of his posts and I'm honestly not really sure how to feel about him. I think he's *probably* not w/w with leetic??

she even admits that the vote against jaggedjack was before most of his posts, but stays on jack regardless till eod. why didn't nutella update her read after she "read jack's actual content". when was she going to take a firm stance on jack? after leetic flips town?

why are leetic and jack *probably* not w/w?

if she was set on lynching jack and believed jack and leetic were not w/w, why didn't she push for jack?

feels like too many loose ends with nutella. her reactions to leetic's Lover claim were also more reserved and calculated than say...LC's were, but i can say she was following the flow of the thread. no one showed any resistance towards the leetic lynch: i don't believe DS's partner was going to draw attention to themselves that late in the day with like 20-30mins to go before end of day towards saving DS out of the blue when the thread environment was basically not having any of it. it would have been too risky and too obvious.

she is in my bad pile.

[VOTE: nutella] aubergine

dunya is dead and you are alive. Talk about this if you haven't already.

[nutella]

Easy, she was everyone's top townread. Seems like an obvious kill choice in any world. And potentially a frame job on me. Also she was misreading Jay as town, so. Wifom and all that.


I explained the yetl thing earlier btw if you would care to read my posts. While you're at it, check out my sweet case on Jay.

[Epignosis]

[Mostly-OT] Btw the "yetl" thing is a reference to an incident from a previous season of champs (that I didn't witness firsthand but have heard tell of), I believe the season that DS claims to have been "robbed" of winning lol. Basically he was in F3 with locked-in votes, there was a player named Yeti, and DS baited out the wolf by deliberately voting for a misspelling of Yeti's name so it wouldn't actually go through, and when the other player jumped on it DS caught them as a wolf and voted them instead, and I believe it is the reason that MU added the "invalid vote" warning. It's controversial but I think it was hilarious and clever tbh, I can see why it could be considered dirty play and why they changed the vote label to dissuade it, but I don't know if I'd call it "angleshooting" per se. [/Mostly-OT]

That's shit play and unsportsmanlike.

[Epignosis]

Easy, she was everyone's top townread. Seems like an obvious kill choice in any world. And potentially a frame job on me. Also she was misreading Jay as town, so. Wifom and all that.


I explained the yetl thing earlier btw if you would care to read my posts. While you're at it, check out my sweet case on Jay.

She wasn't mine.

[Long Con]

She was mine.

[Epignosis]

nuetlla, if you are a civilian, I'll consider your stuff on Jay (Jack). None of that makes any sense to me. MacDougall looks bad, sure, but that also looks like a red herring that can be handled.

[Epignosis]

re: LC: i said:

i guess if i had to make a pool of 3 suspects instead of 4, i would go with nutella, mac and jiwon.

so no, he's not a suspect. i think the good outweigh the bad in his iso thanks to the end of day stuff and DS. actually flipping bad. and nutella, mac and jiwon look way worse.

in order:
my town pile:
dusk
epi
TSP
jaggedjack
LC

scum pile:
mac
jiwon
nutella

I've one question stemming from your nutella review -- what about nutella's handling of the angleshoot crap is suggestive to you that she knew what's going on and/or what about it does not resemble a town nutella that is pissed?

for starters, she didn't outright tell him to stop in the same way TSP did she's done that before in mountains mafia iirc. she doesn't like breaking games. the "..................... what" post felt like someone drawing more attention to the "town-firm" tbh. i'm not saying she encouraged the angleshooting, not at all. i know how above that nutella is. and to be fair, DS. was lying about being vanilla townie, so morally, was it even angleshooting? some will argue nah. he wanted to plant that thought in our heads as much as we wanted to keep it NAI and move on from the subject, so i personally think it wasn't fair play in either alignment, but that's a whole other argument for another day. i just felt the way she discredited it was kinder and more teammate-esque than town-nutella telling DS. to drop it.

ftr this is all reached in hindsight after DS. flipped. and then i notice how he ignored all her posts directed to him. isn't that odd too? she quoted him maybe 4 times (3 times about the angleshoot and once about discrediting his epi read) and not once did he directly respond to her, she who was a solid town read for him. he didn't seem to ignore TSP, Epi, or me or anyone who placed him unfavorably in their rainbows or voted for him (jaggedjack and mac respectively). it doesn't fit my mold of DS. to ignore criticism which made me wonder if he's ignoring nutella cos he literally didn't care or feel threatened by her.

Hmm.

[Epignosis]

FINE I'LL DO IT MYSELF

Interactions of Jackofjay2005 and DS

Jack's posts:

Spoiler: show

Let's try for a quick clear.

, sorry. Flavor!

You need an avatar.

Here you go.

Honestly I could see this as a w/w thing lmao. There is evidence that backs up the "no avatar = default suspect" concern, and Jack could be legitimately distressed that his teammate doesn't have one.

You're saying that you can eliminate some as partners, okay maybe, but there's no way (in my opinion) that those reads could really be solid, but hey, I don't have meta so maybe you are seeing things that I'm not, who knows, I still think it's unlikely

But let's say you're right and we can eliminate some players from being your partner

That doesn't make it so that we KNOW who your partner is. You see what I'm saying? There's not enough information

This is exactly my feelings on Leetic's appeals to "If I'm a wolf, who are my partners then, huh?"

Like I've said that as a townie....on day 4 after getting in fights with literally the entire playerlist. On D1, it doesn't mean much.

While I'm using a post, here's about where I'm at

Dunya (light green starts here)
Jiwon
Dusk
DS (yellow starts here)
LC
Mac
Nutella (orange starts here)
Leetic <- but Leetic is not scum with Epi or Nutella probly
Epi

Puts DS at top of yellow tier. Zzzzzzz

i can still see leetic and nutella w/w if i want to look hard enough. nutella's prod to leetic and their prod back to her could have been a bit weak sauce distancing. and nutella is no stranger to bussing.

i could definitely see leetic and epi still w/w. i feel like epi's reaction to leetic, that started off as a joke about bowie's package, escalating to something exaggerated quite quickly after my back and forth with leetic and could be intention distancing in case leetic does take the d1 town-kill.

my town is dusk and ds followed by jiwon and i feel good about jack which probably means he's bad because i always scumread him when we're both town.

Don't even try to read me. Save yourself the headache.

If one of Epi and Nutella is teamed with Leetic, it's Nutella by a mile. If.

You have DS alot higher than me. Why is he high? Like he's fun and loose but I haven't seen him do anything to make me think he's town beyond a single mindmeld.

Justification of DS read. "Fun and loose" but not deserving of a townread. Meh.

The avatars I tried were too big I guess and I didn't care enough to resize

How did you know I am the yung gambit hoe tho?

Cause Gambit’s the best. Also he’s holding a Jack of Hearts.

You're saying that you can eliminate some as partners, okay maybe, but there's no way (in my opinion) that those reads could really be solid, but hey, I don't have meta so maybe you are seeing things that I'm not, who knows, I still think it's unlikely

But let's say you're right and we can eliminate some players from being your partner

That doesn't make it so that we KNOW who your partner is. You see what I'm saying? There's not enough information

This is exactly my feelings on Leetic's appeals to "If I'm a wolf, who are my partners then, huh?"

Like I've said that as a townie....on day 4 after getting in fights with literally the entire playerlist. On D1, it doesn't mean much.

While I'm using a post, here's about where I'm at

Dunya (light green starts here)
Jiwon
Dusk
DS (yellow starts here)
LC
Mac
Nutella (orange starts here)
Leetic <- but Leetic is not scum with Epi or Nutella probly
Epi

I should be dark green btw, again, I've already lock cleared myself so it's strange to me no one has picked up on it yet

Lol my bad.

Response to the "lock clear" thing uninspiring

@DS.

Who is scum? Pretend I don’t care about your role pm or fucking aliens or anything else you’ve talk about lately.

Generic prod

skipping a quote here where he answers a site-mechanical question

Lol bank shot.

I think we should be lynching off wagon for the next few days no need to tinfoil that scum were hard pushing their partners lover

Would wolves have known DS was loverized tho? If he claimed it before the hammer it was right before it.

Reaction to the flip. I don't see any evidence that Jack noticed leetic's claim in real time, and this has potential to be a DS-teammate reaction imo.

DS's posts:

Spoiler: show

- response to the avatar thing, already quoted above

whys tony town dunya?

I was more at why is Nutella so low?

Swap Jack and Nutella and I am okay with it

this is a yikes from me dawg. there's essentially no prior direct mention of jack from ds and now he wants to place him low in a rainbow with no explanation (in tandem with pocketing me)

Dropping where I am at before I run out posts
Town
Dusk
Dunya
Jiwon
Nutella

Null to scum
Tony
Jack
LC

Poe:
Leetic
Mac
Epi

DS - Not lynching today (I don't lynch new people Day 1)

And yet you're on me day 1

in the null-to-scum pile, again with no elaboration. Faaaaaart


and that's..... it.

conclusion: yeah these are teammates

"yeah these are teammates" needs evidence. I'm willing to hear it.

[Epignosis]

I get two more posts!

You sir however are in the worse position in my reckoning as per my previous post.

I have nothing to say about Jack's posts. I will snort though that you're suggesting any instance of Jack shoving one of his fecking gifs in someone's face is cause for suspicion. You fakennnn

LMAO thanks for the scumclaim, makes my job easier.

This is confirmed mafia yall.

[VOTE: jaggedjimmyjay] aubergine


.....i wrote this before the night post and im pissed i cant vote him. likely mafia ability tho so we'll get him eventually

Can you talk about the large stuff more?

[MacDougall]

Jiwon is confused or something. I don't know why he's voting for me. We are on way lovers. If I die he dies but if he dies I don't die. We had btsc til today and now we're locked out of it and he's decided to vote me.

I am VT but I have a psuedo clear on someone because someone sent me a random rolecop and the role seems super likely to be a town one.

I don't want to out them though.

If he was in BTSC with you and decided to vote for you immediately after, that doesn't looks so great on you.

Did the 'love' end when the BTSC ended?

I haven't been notified as such. I wasn't very active in it. I am vanilla town outside of the random things that have happened to me. I am also Ziggy Stardust. I don't know if that means anything at all here.

[MacDougall]

Apparently your suspects are the same as my own nutella, with yourself replaced with me. You refer to Tony as a sort of “alternate” for the POE pool, which doesn’t strike me as a significant departure from my own pool. What does this say to you?

@MacDougall, did Jiwon give any indication of suspicion of you in your BTSC?

Yes he did.

[nutella]

Epi I'll just wait until you've read all of my posts because I think your questions have mostly already been answered and I'm tired of repeating myself and I'm running out of posts. I only have 10 after this I believe. You should keep track of yours as well. In case you didn't notice, the cap is much lower today. Good luck.

[Epignosis]

Btw just gonna say now with people speculating over 451 standards, I think if a 9-2 game was ever posted on 451 host would get flamed for it being way way way too townsided. Some of you have played there, I know at least jjj and Nutella and it's possible Nanook rebalanced but 9-2 on 451 is definitely an unfair game, 8-3 feels about even.

8v3 is not even at all.

Yes I'm burning a post to say this.

Sorry nutella if that concerns you.

[Epignosis]

I get two more posts!

You sir however are in the worse position in my reckoning as per my previous post.

I have nothing to say about Jack's posts. I will snort though that you're suggesting any instance of Jack shoving one of his fecking gifs in someone's face is cause for suspicion. You fakennnn

LMAO thanks for the scumclaim, makes my job easier.

This is confirmed mafia yall.

[VOTE: jaggedjimmyjay] aubergine


.....i wrote this before the night post and im pissed i cant vote him. likely mafia ability tho so we'll get him eventually

I don't see the scumclaim, tell me your angle!

The very obvious discrediting of my read? Simply claiming that I'm faking, laughing in my face rather than acknowledging that my view of his slot is valid? That is not how town Jay reacts to my tunneling of him. He knows that I'm town and that I'm right and he's just trying to paint me as a scapegoat.

I am platonic lovers with mac, DKDK'ing Mac will solve all of our problems~
Vote: Macdougall

hmmmmmmmmmmmmm


I can't figure this one out

I'm reading this as "I'm partners with DS and I can't stand it. Please help."

[Epignosis]

@MacDougall are you the letter U? Because I love U~

Well this looks like a lover claim huh.



Would nanook really put two of these in a game of this size seeing as they could potentially take down two mafia members? That really seems unlikely to me... unless this one is different from how leetic's choice worked and can only be two townies? I'd honestly be surprised if both Jiwon and Mac are town here though, but if we're assuming a 3 person team, that's Jay + one other, and I suppose someone else could be fooling me.


I don't know. I'm eager to see what Mac says about....anything at all really.

Yes, Nanook would. Move on.

[MacDougall]

I am rather confused by something.

I've received a message that seems to be a role that's a rolecop that doesn't get their own info but has to send it to other people.

The role that I received was definitely not the person who sent it. The role I received seems very likely to be a town role. The mafia sending a town, another town's role seems weird. It wasn't sent by Dunya either.

The thing that confuses me the most is that everyone who it could be has suggested I am in the POE/suspect. So someone has sent it to me regardless of me being a suspect to them, or it was actually sent by mafia?

[Long Con]

I am rather confused by something.

I've received a message that seems to be a role that's a rolecop that doesn't get their own info but has to send it to other people.

The role that I received was definitely not the person who sent it. The role I received seems very likely to be a town role. The mafia sending a town, another town's role seems weird. It wasn't sent by Dunya either.

The thing that confuses me the most is that everyone who it could be has suggested I am in the POE/suspect. So someone has sent it to me regardless of me being a suspect to them, or it was actually sent by mafia?

I am not involved in that strange situation. You got a role, right... not a player? As in, you can't clear anyone off this, but merely have the knowledge that there is a rolecop?

[Long Con]

I get two more posts!

You sir however are in the worse position in my reckoning as per my previous post.

I have nothing to say about Jack's posts. I will snort though that you're suggesting any instance of Jack shoving one of his fecking gifs in someone's face is cause for suspicion. You fakennnn

LMAO thanks for the scumclaim, makes my job easier.

This is confirmed mafia yall.

[VOTE: jaggedjimmyjay] aubergine


.....i wrote this before the night post and im pissed i cant vote him. likely mafia ability tho so we'll get him eventually

I don't see the scumclaim, tell me your angle!

The very obvious discrediting of my read? Simply claiming that I'm faking, laughing in my face rather than acknowledging that my view of his slot is valid? That is not how town Jay reacts to my tunneling of him. He knows that I'm town and that I'm right and he's just trying to paint me as a scapegoat.

I am platonic lovers with mac, DKDK'ing Mac will solve all of our problems~
Vote: Macdougall

hmmmmmmmmmmmmm


I can't figure this one out

I'm reading this as "I'm partners with DS and I can't stand it. Please help."

Is that nutella making that interpreted statement?

[Epignosis]

Also if Jiwon knew she was lovers with Mac on D1 why did she seem pretty eager to eliminate him at one point (and obviously again today but that can be more excused by her awareness that many of us would like to resolve her slot) ....maybe she just figured that leetic was going to be it at that point anyway. Idk. This is weird.

Her reaction to the lover stuff is pretty interesting on a second look. She says it would be a good deal if DS is scum and then goes ahead and hammers. Is that a bus with the tradeoff of taking down a townie too? I personally think it's pretty easy to read that way. Especially since nobody really suspected DS at the time.


After the flip she says "I created the most suspicion against DS" which......isn't really true at all lol. She was more like "what the hell might as well hammer in case DS is scum" without really suspecting him much beforehand (she had like one post with some minor pressure on him tbf). I think she knew exactly what she was doing.

[VOTE: jiwon] aubergine


linki: it's not a bullshit read. your slot's interaction with DS is hot garbage and you know this. if you were reviewing that slot from a neutral position you would have it as orange, I am certain. sure there's nothing really conclusive, but to me it fits the exact mold of a teammate pairing, partially because of the lack of material.

your read on me is the fake one. You know that I only go hard on you like this as town. In FTL I kept you comfortably in my pocket. You 100% know that I don't treat you like this as scum. You're full of shit.

Besides, you are the one who broadened the POE pool too much. You concluded your interactive exercise with a 50/50 split, which is not your typical pattern. You are leaving your options open. I have exactly three suspects.

Damn I so wish I could vote for you. But I think Jiwon is pretty likely your partner here so it's ok.

Three teammates? Wild.

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

An addition/clarification to the rules: if everyone is out of posts before the end of day, the day will end early with the execution being whomever is leading in the poll at the time I close the thread.

[Epignosis]

linki: it's not a bullshit read. your slot's interaction with DS is hot garbage and you know this. if you were reviewing that slot from a neutral position you would have it as orange, I am certain. sure there's nothing really conclusive, but to me it fits the exact mold of a teammate pairing, partially because of the lack of material.

I probably put a slot with a bunch of nothing in the POE pool, yes. Again, this is not what you did. You went straight to hot garbage, and at my first incredulous reply you took it to 11 and said I "claimed mafia". That's not "going hard". That's bullshitting.

your read on me is the fake one. You know that I only go hard on you like this as town. In FTL I kept you comfortably in my pocket. You 100% know that I don't treat you like this as scum. You're full of shit.

No two games are the same. I had nowhere to go but to trust you in FTL, where literally my entire faction went to sleep for the whole game. You were the only other person doing anything, and credit to you for taking proper advantage of that environment. This environment is not the same, and the dynamic changes accordingly. You're a quality player with a diverse skillset that does not limit you to treating me in identical ways in every game, particularly when they are consecutive. So that is not going to cut it.

Besides, you are the one who broadened the POE pool too much. You concluded your interactive exercise with a 50/50 split, which is not your typical pattern. You are leaving your options open. I have exactly three suspects.

Damn I so wish I could vote for you. But I think Jiwon is pretty likely your partner here so it's ok.

Why is Tony town?

No comment on my strongest point against you I see.

I know when you're struggling to emulate your town behavior. You think you can hide in your analysis but I can tell you are nudging results in the direction you want and you are fabricating the strength of your reasoning for suspecting me. You're pushing to see how far this can go and I see right through it. Sure I'm tunneling and confbiasing and all that, whatever. You've gone past the point where I could reconsider you and instead you doubled down on your bullshit on me which in turn confirmed that I am correct about you.


Tony did some vague hinting that I didn't necessarily follow but knowing him I find that more likely a good sign than not. He's certainly my least clear non-suspect and would be my first fallback if my suspect pool fails.

My shit with you nutella right now is that you had no problem with Jack. Jack leaves and Jay comes in. All of a sudden you take a shit on Jay.

If I look through your interactions with Jack, what will I see?

[TonyStarkPrime]

Jiwon is confused or something. I don't know why he's voting for me. We are on way lovers. If I die he dies but if he dies I don't die. We had btsc til today and now we're locked out of it and he's decided to vote me.

I am VT but I have a psuedo clear on someone because someone sent me a random rolecop and the role seems super likely to be a town one.

I don't want to out them though.

If he was in BTSC with you and decided to vote for you immediately after, that doesn't looks so great on you.

Did the 'love' end when the BTSC ended?

I haven't been notified as such. I wasn't very active in it. I am vanilla town outside of the random things that have happened to me. I am also Ziggy Stardust. I don't know if that means anything at all here.

ZIGGAYYYYY
I think it means not much. You should at least be able to out the player you know as town, though, no? Unless it's like Epi in which case whatever. At the current rate people are going to be out of posts by breakfast time, leaving ample time for me to come in and figure everything out.

[MacDougall]

I am rather confused by something.

I've received a message that seems to be a role that's a rolecop that doesn't get their own info but has to send it to other people.

The role that I received was definitely not the person who sent it. The role I received seems very likely to be a town role. The mafia sending a town, another town's role seems weird. It wasn't sent by Dunya either.

The thing that confuses me the most is that everyone who it could be has suggested I am in the POE/suspect. So someone has sent it to me regardless of me being a suspect to them, or it was actually sent by mafia?

I am not involved in that strange situation. You got a role, right... not a player? As in, you can't clear anyone off this, but merely have the knowledge that there is a rolecop?

I got a player's entire role delivered to me. This player is not a rolecop. A rolecop sent it to me. A rolecop that sends other people's roles to people. The player whose role I have received appears to be town. Their role does not seem to be a scum role.

[MacDougall]

How bout this. I'll just post this person's role, and you can all discuss what alignment you think this person is?

"Rock n Roll Suicide

When you die (by any means), you can choose to enter a neighborhood with a player of your choice rather than go to dead chat."

Seems town right?

[Epignosis]

dunya is the reason I'm off the poll. I was notified I'd been buffed which is precisely what her role does.

Both of my top suspects have tried to play that against me now. Even if I cannot receive votes, I can be discredited.

I feel very comfortable with the state of this game. nutella and Mac could just be the team.

Give me evidence that "buff" indicates what her role does. I.e, that you are off the poll.

[Long Con]

How bout this. I'll just post this person's role, and you can all discuss what alignment you think this person is?

"Rock n Roll Suicide

When you die (by any means), you can choose to enter a neighborhood with a player of your choice rather than go to dead chat."

Seems town right?

Cool... and now you and the sender both know. The sender is likely town, and they should be able to nicely spread the towncore if they can keep it up.

[Long Con]

dunya is the reason I'm off the poll. I was notified I'd been buffed which is precisely what her role does.

Both of my top suspects have tried to play that against me now. Even if I cannot receive votes, I can be discredited.

I feel very comfortable with the state of this game. nutella and Mac could just be the team.

Give me evidence that "buff" indicates what her role does. I.e, that you are off the poll.

I would imagine that a buff is a bonus on their inherent power. I don't associate "buff" with being off the poll. Maybe that's a buff for someone who has no abilities.

[TonyStarkPrime]

at this point whoever has that role can claim it at any time and can be functionally cleared.
Unless someone else is going to claim a buff then the only way JJJ is lying is if he's scum, they rb/killed Dunya, and someone else on the team got him off the poll. Seems unlikely. Buff is the simplest explanation. I agree with LC's notion that that points slightly to Jay being vanilla, but only slightly.

[TonyStarkPrime]

I kinda want to try to solve this game mechanically, not gonna lie

[TonyStarkPrime]

I am rather confused by something.

I've received a message that seems to be a role that's a rolecop that doesn't get their own info but has to send it to other people.

The role that I received was definitely not the person who sent it. The role I received seems very likely to be a town role. The mafia sending a town, another town's role seems weird. It wasn't sent by Dunya either.

The thing that confuses me the most is that everyone who it could be has suggested I am in the POE/suspect. So someone has sent it to me regardless of me being a suspect to them, or it was actually sent by mafia?

let's imagine you're scum and you get this role, what are you gonna do?

[MacDougall]

I am rather confused by something.

I've received a message that seems to be a role that's a rolecop that doesn't get their own info but has to send it to other people.

The role that I received was definitely not the person who sent it. The role I received seems very likely to be a town role. The mafia sending a town, another town's role seems weird. It wasn't sent by Dunya either.

The thing that confuses me the most is that everyone who it could be has suggested I am in the POE/suspect. So someone has sent it to me regardless of me being a suspect to them, or it was actually sent by mafia?

let's imagine you're scum and you get this role, what are you gonna do?

Send the towniest sounding scum role to a trusted member of the towncore probably.

[Long Con]

at this point whoever has that role can claim it at any time and can be functionally cleared.
Unless someone else is going to claim a buff then the only way JJJ is lying is if he's scum, they rb/killed Dunya, and someone else on the team got him off the poll. Seems unlikely. Buff is the simplest explanation. I agree with LC's notion that that points slightly to Jay being vanilla, but only slightly.

[TonyStarkPrime]

I am rather confused by something.

I've received a message that seems to be a role that's a rolecop that doesn't get their own info but has to send it to other people.

The role that I received was definitely not the person who sent it. The role I received seems very likely to be a town role. The mafia sending a town, another town's role seems weird. It wasn't sent by Dunya either.

The thing that confuses me the most is that everyone who it could be has suggested I am in the POE/suspect. So someone has sent it to me regardless of me being a suspect to them, or it was actually sent by mafia?

let's imagine you're scum and you get this role, what are you gonna do?

Send the towniest sounding scum role to a trusted member of the towncore probably.

Which would be your own. No, let's imaging that YOU are scum and have been sent a townie role by some arbitrary outside presence. What do you do?

[MacDougall]

I am rather confused by something.

I've received a message that seems to be a role that's a rolecop that doesn't get their own info but has to send it to other people.

The role that I received was definitely not the person who sent it. The role I received seems very likely to be a town role. The mafia sending a town, another town's role seems weird. It wasn't sent by Dunya either.

The thing that confuses me the most is that everyone who it could be has suggested I am in the POE/suspect. So someone has sent it to me regardless of me being a suspect to them, or it was actually sent by mafia?

let's imagine you're scum and you get this role, what are you gonna do?

Send the towniest sounding scum role to a trusted member of the towncore probably.

Which would be your own. No, let's imaging that YOU are scum and have been sent a townie role by some arbitrary outside presence. What do you do?

What's the point of this exercise exactly? To waste posts?

I would probably just hard defend the person and straight out them in the thread as that role and then kill them the next night or something. I dunno I'd have a lot to think about and don't really see the value in this exercise.