Sorry this is wrongNANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2020 4:17 amDon’t think so tbh
Yes he probably is but not cause of anything he’s done, cause of drago
Moderator: Community Team
Sorry this is wrongNANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2020 4:17 amDon’t think so tbh
You understand me! <3
Look at the FTL game and you’ll see why I’m SRing him I thinkTonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2020 4:29 am I don't think drago was necessarily a wolf. drago is just drago
Nanook read - this is 50% tonal (good opener, engaged with people about mechanics in a way that felt open & honest, just generally putting themselves in the thread in a way that doesn't feel forced or agenda-pushy) and 50% content (engaged with multiple different people, strongly denied a derpclear). #82 was a post I liked. You don't often see scum telling other people to "project town" because they want other players to put in less effort and get read as a sketchball, not try hard, effortpost and look supertown.Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2020 3:29 amCan you talk about your Nanook read?
That's creative.
Also, I'm town, and you've played with me before. =)
Looks a lot like buddying when you consider what I've pointed out above, that the 7 green reads look super sketchy and like an attempt at currying favor with the town when under pressure from nutella's read list.Also Dunya is never wrong, and if she is it's her fault and not mine.
Oh u are maphier. Look at your maph.NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2020 3:39 am Do I have all townreads on me? What the actual fuck
@MacDougall come rectify this and OMGUS me please I need a sense of normality
Thank you bb I feel so much better nowMacDougall wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2020 4:36 amOh u are maphier. Look at your maph.NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2020 3:39 am Do I have all townreads on me? What the actual fuck
@MacDougall come rectify this and OMGUS me please I need a sense of normality
tl;drAlison wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2020 4:34 amNanook read - this is 50% tonal (good opener, engaged with people about mechanics in a way that felt open & honest, just generally putting themselves in the thread in a way that doesn't feel forced or agenda-pushy) and 50% content (engaged with multiple different people, strongly denied a derpclear). #82 was a post I liked. You don't often see scum telling other people to "project town" because they want other players to put in less effort and get read as a sketchball, not try hard, effortpost and look supertown.Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2020 3:29 amCan you talk about your Nanook read?
That's creative.
Also, I'm town, and you've played with me before. =)
Dyslexicon read - for context, it's page 5, you put down 7 relatively strong townreads and then 1 (tonally confident) scumread on Dragomir.
1) It's rare to have 7 townreads so early in the game. People's posts near the beginning of the game trend a lot more towards null stuff - "hi everyone"s, jokes and fluff, throwing around weak "maybe X is town/scum" based on meta or tone. Is it possible to look at 7 separate people and go "based on their early game posts, I think all of these people are likely to be town"? Yes, but it's pretty damn rare and smacks of buddying. The timing is also pretty sketchy because it came down right after the laser gun holder put you at their bottom of her list, giving you an incentive to try to earn some immediate towncred. You literally townread everyone who had more than like 0 or 1-2 posts, with the sole exception of...
2) Dragomir. Let's take a look at the four points of interaction you had with Dragomir before the readslist came out.
a) [in response to Dragomir's post #40] "scummy"
For context, post 40 was Dragomir's first post in the game, saying hello and that he'll be back in the morning. That isn't scum. It isn't town either. It's as close to null as I can imagine a post being. It doesn't even have much of a tone to read into. Why single that out for being scummy without any explanation?
b) [in response to Dragomir's post #78] "Why? I feel like wrapping my head around the strategy is what interests me the most right now, since there's several pretty simple ways to lose this game if we go about it the wrong way. Is it not interesting to you?"
#78 is a post that could actually be considered to be scummy, since Dragomir is intentionally refusing to try to engage with the setup meechanics and try to contribute to building a better protection scheme for town. I wouldn't read it as scummy personally since I know a few players who switch their brain off when detailed setup/mechanic discussion comes into play, but it's a plausible reason to try to read Dragomir as scummy. That's not what you do though. You respond with a probing question that's sort of neutral-ish. It's not particularly accusatory, it's not particularly supportive, it just wants to find out more about Dragomir's thoughts.
c) [in response to Dragomir's post #170] "Purple parts are scummy to me. It reads like you don't think the reasoning is valid like you're suspected for wrong reasons rather than the suspicion being wrong. Also, using Dunya's name just feels slimy. Like you're touching her shoulder and leaning forward but like in a scummy way. =p"
Of your three interactions with Dragomir, this is the one I find most genuine. It's a fair point, and it's believable that a towni would find this scummy and push Dragomir into the scumpool based off it.
d) [in response to dunya's post #162] "Also, I think if Drag is scum it's likelier that he TMIed Carrot as town when he challenged your scum read on her."
Dragomir's challenge of dunya's scum read is located in post #110. dunya voices suspicion of Carot for not gamesolving in her first post, and Dragomir says "Do you expect players to come right off the bat with game solving in their entry post?". This isn't TMI (although funnily enough, I'm going to argue that you and Dragomir are scum together because you TMI'd him). TMI is a type of scumslip whereby you have no reason to believe that someone is scum/town but somehow "know" that they're of that alignment, because you're scum and know everyone's alignments. That isn't what Dragomir is doing though. He's not arguing that Carot is one alignment or another - he's engaging with dunya's post and pointing out a flaw in the logic. Whether or not Carot is scum has no bearing on whether or not town players are expected to come out of the gate with game solving in their entry post. So this read doesn't make any sense to me.
My conclusion is that there's a suspicious gap in your attack on Dragomir. You take a null post and you leap straight to "this is scummy". You take an attack on dunya's logic and leap straight to "Dragomir has knowledge he shouldn't be having as a town member". What this sounds like to me is that you had a conclusion in mind - "I want to attack Dragomir" - and started combing through posts and making up reasons to scumread him rather than having those reads organically develop. That is scummy behavior, and points to either you trying really hard to get town!Dragomir mislynched or you trying to make up a reason to scumread scum!Dragomir early on so that you can point to it later as evidence that you suspected Dragomir all along to get towncred. I suspect it's the latter, because it's more natural for you to just wait for a townie to say something dumb (like I did) and then leap on them (which you did to me) rather than try to shoehorn some reasoning as to why a townie should die. The Dragomir slot going completely off the rails later on strengthens my scumread on them and in turn, my theory that you were bussing Dragomir.
Oh, and this part of the Dragomir scumread:Looks a lot like buddying when you consider what I've pointed out above, that the 7 green reads look super sketchy and like an attempt at currying favor with the town when under pressure from nutella's read list.Also Dunya is never wrong, and if she is it's her fault and not mine.
tl;dr: Your case against Dragomir was inconsistent, logically unsound and forced, like you were trying to force it to happen or make something up. The rest of your readslist smacks of trying to buddy up to other players.
"MacDougall's posting reeks of caught scum" =/= "I assume/know MacDougall is caught scum", in the same way that "X's posts are scummy" =/= "I assume/know X is scum". Do not misrepresent my posts.Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2020 4:15 amInterestingly, I think if Mac is scum, you're likely to be scum too. Both because you just assume Mac is caught, also because you made it a point to link me to Mac. This is unnecessary harsh towards Mac, which is more likely s/s interaction. Or else you're just kind of harsh, cause afaic, Mac is making content, whether or not you agree with it.
There was a second part of my case regarding why Dyslexicon's case against Dragomir feels forced and inconsistent. Even if you don't agree with the first bit, what about the second?NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2020 4:39 am Idk Alison I semi-regularly try to have 5+ townreads within 24ish hours when I’m trying to play a certain way, so
Some people are just comfortable flinging reads around and seeing what sticks, that’s fine
I put a tl;dr at the end specifically for people who don't have time or inclination to read wallstutuu wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2020 4:42 am ok so the dumb townread on alison is that she goes from
No read on nanook -> "tutuu idk why r u townreading nanook for that" -> "i, alison townread nanook" with no explanation
So in my mind if she was scum she would be more cosncious of how she comes off itt and would not make such inconsistnecies
So i thimk shes town cuz she didnt keep up us up to date cuz if shes town she was like doing her thing u know
also im not reading that wall sry alison life is too short
I don’t think it’s meaningful but I also didn’t see the need to say that. Sorry.Alison wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2020 4:48 amThere was a second part of my case regarding why Dyslexicon's case against Dragomir feels forced and inconsistent. Even if you don't agree with the first bit, what about the second?NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2020 4:39 am Idk Alison I semi-regularly try to have 5+ townreads within 24ish hours when I’m trying to play a certain way, so
Some people are just comfortable flinging reads around and seeing what sticks, that’s fine
Why don't you think it's meaningful?NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2020 4:56 amI don’t think it’s meaningful but I also didn’t see the need to say that. Sorry.Alison wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2020 4:48 amThere was a second part of my case regarding why Dyslexicon's case against Dragomir feels forced and inconsistent. Even if you don't agree with the first bit, what about the second?NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2020 4:39 am Idk Alison I semi-regularly try to have 5+ townreads within 24ish hours when I’m trying to play a certain way, so
Some people are just comfortable flinging reads around and seeing what sticks, that’s fine
If I wanted to do a point by point breakdown I would’ve lolAlison wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2020 4:56 amWhy don't you think it's meaningful?NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2020 4:56 amI don’t think it’s meaningful but I also didn’t see the need to say that. Sorry.Alison wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2020 4:48 amThere was a second part of my case regarding why Dyslexicon's case against Dragomir feels forced and inconsistent. Even if you don't agree with the first bit, what about the second?NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2020 4:39 am Idk Alison I semi-regularly try to have 5+ townreads within 24ish hours when I’m trying to play a certain way, so
Some people are just comfortable flinging reads around and seeing what sticks, that’s fine
Actually, mebbe.tutuu wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2020 4:42 am ok so the dumb townread on alison is that she goes from
No read on nanook -> "tutuu idk why r u townreading nanook for that" -> "i, alison townread nanook" with no explanation
So in my mind if she was scum she would be more cosncious of how she comes off itt and would not make such inconsistnecies
So i thimk shes town cuz she didnt keep up us up to date cuz if shes town she was like doing her thing u know
also im not reading that wall sry alison life is too short
Don't tell me to not misrepresent you if you're going to spend walls doing that to me thank you very much. Also, misrepresenting is one of my least favorite word in mafia. I'm telling you my perspective on things. It looked to me that it's possible that you're trying to link me and Mac because you know Mac is scum. And I've seen scum be more harsh towards each other compared to other interactions in games.
I had a bad feeling of Drag D0 turning into an assumption that we are both scum makes no sense what so ever to me. But you know what, I'm not you. So question is, does it makes sense that YOU would think that. I don't know, maybe. I don't know you that well. Mac is clearly not lolcatting. Throwing out ideas is like 90 % of my play, get into it. Mafia isn't a game of logic, primarily, fite me. Maybe people just play differently that you do. You do you, but let others do them. And lol about the Nut bit, what are you trying to accomplish.I'm harsh towards Mac because I had that huge ass post earlier about how you made it seem like you two were wolves together, and then Mac responds by shitting up the thread with a flurry of nonsensical, vague, unexplained, gish-gallopy posts that seem designed to make the thread as unreadable as humanly possible. The posts don't make sense, which is why I said they're lolcatting. Accusing people at random of being scum, mindmelding with people who have the exact opposite of the reads he has, tossing out random ideas backed by 0 logic is behavior that should rightfully be treated harshly. nutella was pretty harsh towards Mac too iirc - do you think she's scum too?
There's a reason I didn't engage much with the latest post. Either the meta read turns up clean, in which case I was wrong, or the meta read turns up dirty, in which case I'll have irrefutable evidence that Dyslexicon is scum. I don't think it's productive to get drawn into an argument about misrepresentation or whatever.NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2020 5:11 am This interaction seems like it’s quickly deteriorating past the point of usefulness tbh
Well, we literally just played a game together on MU (well, it's still ongoing). I've played mostly games on Personality Cafe. I don't have many recent games on MU, and I also don't know anyone when I play there mostly. I've played some games here which you can probably check out if you really want to. I don't care about your read on me. I've said my piece. I don't know why you just jump to the conclusion that, yes I must be scum and with Drag specifically, instead of the very obvious and real conclusion that I'm just town with a read lol.Alison wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2020 4:58 am for the record I really hate the little "this is a town tell for me" "I would never bus d0" stuff because it feels manipulative and I know a lot of people won't bother doing the work of checking up on your meta background to see if it's true. I'm going to actually do the work and check up on your meta and see if those claims are legitimate. Do you have any games you want to show me, or do you just want to direct me to your MafiaUniverse profile and let me read all your games there?
Lol, you are really too much xD You'll never have irrefutable evidence that I'm scum cause I'm fucking town lol. We are clearly very different is my conclusion from this.Alison wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2020 5:13 amThere's a reason I didn't engage much with the latest post. Either the meta read turns up clean, in which case I was wrong, or the meta read turns up dirty, in which case I'll have irrefutable evidence that Dyslexicon is scum. I don't think it's productive to get drawn into an argument about misrepresentation or whatever.NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2020 5:11 am This interaction seems like it’s quickly deteriorating past the point of usefulness tbh
Hold meNANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2020 5:11 am This interaction seems like it’s quickly deteriorating past the point of usefulness tbh
I do it pretty regularly tbh, as both alignmentsDyslexicon wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2020 5:13 amWell, we literally just played a game together on MU (well, it's still ongoing). I've played mostly games on Personality Cafe. I don't have many recent games on MU, and I also don't know anyone when I play there mostly. I've played some games here which you can probably check out if you really want to. I don't care about your read on me. I've said my piece. I don't know why you just jump to the conclusion that, yes I must be scum and with Drag specifically, instead of the very obvious and real conclusion that I'm just town with a read lol.Alison wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2020 4:58 am for the record I really hate the little "this is a town tell for me" "I would never bus d0" stuff because it feels manipulative and I know a lot of people won't bother doing the work of checking up on your meta background to see if it's true. I'm going to actually do the work and check up on your meta and see if those claims are legitimate. Do you have any games you want to show me, or do you just want to direct me to your MafiaUniverse profile and let me read all your games there?
People don't just lie about their meta. Like, I haven't ever seen it happen. Believe me or not, but having several town reads and leans early is something that just happens to me, especially if I know people. Several people have been towny to me. Sue me.
I got you bbDyslexicon wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2020 5:15 amHold meNANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2020 5:11 am This interaction seems like it’s quickly deteriorating past the point of usefulness tbh
From a meme about the different types of mafia players.Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2020 5:15 amLol, you are really too much xD You'll never have irrefutable evidence that I'm scum cause I'm fucking town lol. We are clearly very different is my conclusion from this.Alison wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2020 5:13 amThere's a reason I didn't engage much with the latest post. Either the meta read turns up clean, in which case I was wrong, or the meta read turns up dirty, in which case I'll have irrefutable evidence that Dyslexicon is scum. I don't think it's productive to get drawn into an argument about misrepresentation or whatever.NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2020 5:11 am This interaction seems like it’s quickly deteriorating past the point of usefulness tbh
I'll get some links from here because I'm nice. But I really don't have the time fml
Lol. =p
There is much to look forward to.
Because voting for him serves no purpose whatsoever?Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2020 5:32 amThere is much to look forward to.
Mac, why don't you vote Rej with me? I have irrefutable evidence that he is scum.
Jesus christ who are you lolAlison wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2020 5:33 am Meta trawl, most recent to least recent. I'm not counting the game we played together, because that one hasn't ended yet so it would be illegal to talk about it.
S7 G5 - May 2020 (Town)
Girl Genius - July 2019 (Town, then Mafia)
ITA Death Mash - July 2019 (Town)
Anonymous Petrology - July 2019 (Mafia)
Mafia Universe Anniversary 2019 - June 2019 (Mafia)
Fruits and Vegetables - June 2017 (Town)
S3 G2 - May 2016 (Town)
The Disney Game - August 2015 (Town)
Needless to say, it would be impractical at best to read through all of these games, so I'm just going to ISO Dyslexicon with an eye on two things: 1) do they have a tendency to throw around a lot of townreads very early on in the game as town like they claim they do and 2) do they have a tendency to avoid bussing D1/D2 as scum like they claim they do.
I bet I'm scum if I'm not doing the exact same thing on MU 5 years ago as I'm doing this game. DDL probably just gave me the wrong role.
Shhhhhh we’re not talking about thatTonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2020 5:43 am I had jules dead on a "cares too much about meta" read recently but she was town so that went poorly
Don’t you hate it when the host gives you a town role but you know in your heart you’re supposed to be mafia that gameDyslexicon wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2020 5:45 amI bet I'm scum if I'm not doing the exact same thing on MU 5 years ago as I'm doing this game. DDL probably just gave me the wrong role.