Game of Champions 2020 [ENDGAME]

[Jackofhearts2005]

Not really a fan of this wagon formation. At least the Tony wagon looks real pure.

Wat.

The TSP wagon looks /fine/. That's it.

And like I don't know which wagon you're referring to.

But take a look at the HK wagon. Now THAT is pure.

I don’t care about that because I think HK is town and that’s part of why I don’t like the wagon formation.

[hollowkatt]

Ok, why though?
Like I'm thinking back to the spec chat game where I did some crafty setup for a future chop on town as wolf before I went over, townies bought it, and we went on to win the game. Hard defense of someone town as wolf is something that should be in every wolves repertoire, yeah? Especially because it leads into situations like this.
And, in my experience, when done correctly it's generally a wolf that brings it back up after a day or two so that they can look solving while susing town and not getting any heat back from it.

'I did this thing one time and therefore Radishes is mafia.'

Makes sense.

Wow, that's reductive and unhelpful! Good job

[Justplayingitcool]

Spoiler: show

Marmot ISO:

Spoiler: show

Hazelnuuuuuuuuut!!! who is on your team?

Not you apparently

ngl, I do miss this team

Made, LC, Hyena, and Marmot

If DrWilgy is mafia these are all town.

This isn't how DrWilgy works. If he's mafia here, than I'm mafia here.

This kind of looks egregious considering marmot made the same statement with cat, which I quoted earlier in the thread.

@MacDougall I vote group 1.

I do think tutuu's scum this game, so I don't want to give her immunity.

starts scumreading tutuu for some inexplicable reason. I looked back and the read seemed like a joke and there was no serious interactions between himself and tutuu, nor did marmot ever vote there.

Ask nutella. She's giving out snap reads like candy.

Last I saw Syn was wolf reading Nutella, so if she snaps at him it's not likely to be pretty.

So it sounds like we have a nututuu team. Noted.

Shades tutuu again, but yet still doesn't vote in tutuu's direction.

What are your reads? Do you think they're shit?

Alison, Michelle, MR = bad guys


No I don't, but then I remember that New! Coke was a thing, and those guys didn't think it sucked til the whole world told them, and now I wonder if I'm the new New! Coke

You lost me at "soda was a thing".

I agree on MR. The amount of on topic content I've seen from him is alarming.

Starts to shade Radishes

I think that Kyle is Mafia; the way he's constantly talking about having to catch up is a way I've seen Mafia do, can't really argument it; it's just how I've seen it; I think there are other people who groan at having to catch up but they aren't following it so faithfully / they meme from time to time / they still give reads from time to time.

I think the way Kyle is approaching this is wolfy and he's constantly reminding us that he's trying to read every post (which I believe him that he is) but that's busywork IMO and he's mafia.

You're right, I don't recall Kyle doing this. I think he tends to post off-topic rather than complaining about catching up.

I'mma look him up in other big games as a townie player.

marmot puts his hand in the honey jar, and starts throwing dirt in kyle's location.

I am so lost, can someone catch me up. Why are we voting 112 now?

THIS IS A FUCKING LOST WOLF SOFT OR MY NAME ISNT TUTUU

[VOTE: Made] aubergine

I SWEAR TO GOD THIS IS A LOST WOLF SOFT CLAIM

You know what

[VOTE: Made] aubergine

Marmot seemingly dropped his scum read on tutuu out of nowhere, and then joins tutuu on a Made wagon. I get the impression that marmot was trying to pocket tutuu

goldeneye was good for its time but has been surpassed in its genre ten times over.

Ok, this guy prolly still town. Only a towny could still be so wrong

im not sure why im not getting more townreads as #2 poster, i feel like i'm out of my scumrange but it's possible i'm not as obvious bc i'm distracted by work and stuff

This is so scummy, nutella might be town

Do you normally give TWTBW reads falcon. You gave two of them back-to-back here.

Begins to shade falcon

I think Thunal is the only town player in the game

Probably just TMI, and getting thunal/HK on side

Tutuu is actually le town.

Nope.

I don't see a solving mindset there.

Starts to scum read tutuu again and throws shade in that direction? even though Marmot agreed with two of tutuu's reads on both Made & kyle (quoted above). It feels like marmot was trying to pocket tutuu but was trying to ensure she remained firmly in the PoE.

@dyachei you said you want two votes and received Marmot's
If you need another one, i'll give you mine

i really want the top 2 wagons to be thunal and cat

I've explained thunal a lot and I think cat's a hit too (mostly based on mac's case)

i think that if both those wagons were to die today I'd be pretty happy

This post feels kinda manipulative. Why don't you want to entertain outside of these two?

That said, I agree that cat's posts are pretty scummy, but I disagree on Thunal.

I think this post shows potential in the theory that cat was ruthlessly bussed D1.

Another possibility of TMI on thunal to look good as she was starting to become a wagon at this point iiirc. Please correct me if I am wrong.

Um tutuu, are you dismissing me?

you asked me to not respond but i cant not respond, i dont understand why

dismissal is a negative word, i dont view me challenging your read as something thats negative

I disagree about word usage and expression, I think that is a great way to catch mafia. I mean, I'm not very good at catching mafia, but I've had more recent success in this way.

Maybe I misunderstood your tone, but it didn't feel like a challenge. I thought you were saying "Yes Marmot, good try, but it's wrong, go try again". Were you implying something else?

I think these set of posts look good for tutuu.

tutuu sounds genuinely confused and these set of posts don't come across as fake.

[VOTE: Falcon45ca] aubergine
See you later, or after the game.

This took a lot of courage

[VOTE: VOTE CAT] aubergine


Guess how long it took me to go thru the ISO?

5 minutes between these posts (that's my answer falcon).

I guess this is a self-prez vote, but it's otherwise pretty bad.

[VOTE: falcon] aubergine

Awkward scumread and vote on falcon. I think marmot tried and failed to save Cat d1, despite previously calling them scum. GTH I don't think falcon/marmot/cat are partners.

Cat's ISO looks meh. Their earlier posts don't look great, particularly the one where Sloonei asked for their reads. Their response to the case from Mac (and others) looked better. But they didn't really leave much of a legacy aside from Sloonei grilling them for reads.

I'm also happy voting falcon.


I will not be voting for Thunal though. The overtly formal nature of their approach being a sign of scum is a read I disagree with.

He really didn't want cat to fall d1, and was trying to get people to move over to falcon and downplay the scumreads on cat.

Why do people want to bake Tutuu now that I'm actually townreading her??

Starts townreading tutuu now? I tried going through a reason for the change in read but I couldn't see why or when he changed the read. tutuu was starting to gain traction and I think there is a pattern between her and thunal/HK. Marmot was happy for those wagons to go-ahead, tried to take town cred if/when they flipped town but didn't really try to stop either of the wagon from progressing.

and look at the two mafia br0z on falcon loooool

This is the way

Marmot was on falcon at this point. I can't remember who the second person

I'm in the middle of ISO'ing Martin, and the most egregious thing I can see thus far are his heavy attempts to defend tutuu.

Continuing reading.

And now marmot shades Martin for hard defending tutuu. In hindsight, it really did feel like he was being a goldilocks

I read falcon's Day 2 and don't feel any better about it

There were 4 posts, but I won't tell you how long it took.

meh

[imagine big tutuu spinning anime girl gif and big flashy text with sparkles and stuff]

THE MAFIA ARE MARTIN MARMOT DYSLEXICON LONGCON AND TONYSTARKPRIME


[dab]

If Dizzy is scum, I'm just giving up now.

I also think I see what nutella's saying. Everyone feels townie rn.

Except Syn.

Syn is already part of the towncore and I think this adds a further reason to why I believe he is town.

[VOTE: Tim] aubergine

I hope marmot gets yeeted and he flips mafia and im next. I want out please

Are you not having fun? I want you to have fun.

I don't think marmot faked this meaning he seemed genuinely surprised by tutuu who was implying she wasn't having fun, which to me implies they are probably not wolves together. Marmot would know if tutuu was faking the not having fun post if they were wolves together due to being in scumchat, and I genuinely believe in the surprised tone from marmot, as well as believing tutuu when she stated she wasn't having fun.

In summary:

I think tutuu looks pretty good from reading marmot's iso. He keeps flip-flopping on the read whenever it suited him. He was scumreading tutuu, but then agreed on two of the votes/progressions she made on D1, and then randomly scumread again accusing her of not trying to solve the game? It felt like he was trying to pocket, but ensure she remained in the PoE whenever someone else would go and townread her. Marmot townread thunal/hk and tutuu when their wagons were beginning to gain traction, and yet did absolutely nothing to steer town away from either wagon, and I believe he was trying to go for the free towncred when they flipped. So I think this looks good for both HK and tutuu. Marmot and tutuu's interactions do not feel faked or wolf theatre.

Marmot's vote on falcon is awkward, and I think he was trying to get people to move off from cat and lynch falcon instead. I think this is important because marmot wasn't really trying to save either tutuu or thunal/hk as previously mentioned. This means this is a good look for falcon at the moment.

I think wilgy has partner potential, but I think it might be a dumb read as it's only based off the cat post I posted early and similarities it had with the wilgy post I quoted in the spoilers.

I disagree with your conclusions on tutuu being spewed town by marmot, but that's fine, i guess. I think there could still be partners there.

tutuu

6
26%

Voters: NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME, Long Con, Michelle, nutella, Timsup2nothin, hollowkatt

I think no matter tutuu's AI. this wagon contains a wolf.

I wish for an alignament cop to check Nanook, Tim or HK, in this order
Nutella is volume cleared and Mac flipping villager means he had a good read for her
Long Con is a soul town read, who thinks I am wrong should tell me why.

I agree with your order in regards to the alignment cop. Though tbh I think hk is spewed town from reading marmots iso

Do you mind elaborating on the town read with Long Con? Unless it's just a gut read.

The bold above indicates you also thought at one point I was spewed town by marmot, what changed and when/why?

i think it will be a night action

or eod but i think it allows or disallows a night action

Come vote me tutuu!!!!

but whyyyy u have the same alignment as i do

Unlikely to be wolf theatre

Here you say the above is unlikely to be w/w theater but then HERE you say opposite:

I'm a little unsettled that Dizzy isn't immediately townreading me like he usually does.

[VOTE: Thunal] aubergine

I wonder why.

Why are people voting Thunal, I was obviously joking

could this be w/w?

I think it could be

What gives, and what is the difference for you?
Kinda reads like you can't make up your mind if I'm spewed town or if I'm hard partnered, but either way the inconsistency with how you're treating my slot vs how you're treating tutuu is weird and I'm not sure what to make of it.

Context matters.

When tutuu/Marmot were saying there thing it was right at the end of the phase, and marmot was about to die.

Marmot and thunal on the other, it was the middle of day 1, and when I quizzed marmot on why he kept your vote on there, his response was: "These things happen".

I did think you were spewed by marmot, but then I read sloonei's case and I started having doubts on my conclusion, and plus I disagreed with several of your reads, in regards to tutuu and marmot.

gotcha, thanks. I'll go read the sloonei case then.
Last question for now: does disagreement automatically indicate wolf to you then? Because that's what your last comment sounds like.

Depends on if their reasons are strong enough. Apart from nutella and Syn, Radishes and tutuu are two of my top towns, so it legit concerns me when I somebody wanting to chop two of my top townies for meh reasons.

[hollowkatt]

ok to shoot:
112 (if not chop), drwilgy, dyslexicon, falcon, jack, marmot, nanook, tsp

@ towncore feel free to remove names, i'd maybe remove dizzy and falcon atp

tim, shoot in these. don't be a neg util hero shooter. thanks

I'd be fine with a shot in that pool

There are some pretty heavy hitters (ie, people who claim to be reading and ISOing who post quotes and stuff) pushing back on the Tutuu and Falcon wagons...but nothing else seems to gain any traction at all. Is it just me, or does that feel like wolves have settled on a strat of holding TvT wagons in place?

Do you think there's a wolf being voted for then currently?
Looks like wagons are:
112
Wiggly
falcon
LC
Sloonei
HK
TSP
tutuu

Of those I like LC for town, TSP seems ok, haven't gotten anything on sloonei or wiggly, would sheep the 112 arguments, and really still want to brutally day murder tutuu
Falcon wagon comp: I like nutella there, and kinda Radish, and kinda tedxtr

Huh, townreads TSP but is also ok with shooting TSP

yeah why not?
I can understand why a chunk of people I think are town think TSP could be a good shot. Just b/c I town lean there doesn't make me right and them wrong, and if they're picking up on things I'm not seeing good on them.

I dunno, I just find it at odds with town reading players and being cool with them getting killed as well

checks vote count, moves on

[Jackofhearts2005]

tutuu is just like "you have to assume roles on the syndicate are as maximally bizarre as possible"

i promise u epi is not quite that insane

[Timsup2nothin]

So I'm gonna be out for a chunk of time this time, and I leave you with this:

We got a couple of wolves, which is great. They were both pretty wide consensus agreement slaughters, which is really great and made the game feel easy.

The game is not actually easy. There is very likely not going to be a high posting active player who just revealed heavy wolfiness that we can all (or mostly all) agree on. This is shaping up to be one of those days where we make a decisive and divisive chop. We may be right or we may be wrong, and being on the right or wrong side of history is going to have lasting consequences.

I think TSP has a fair chance of being a hit, and i also acknowledge it as a cowardly way out. Low content poster who actively says he isn't gonna contribute a lot to solving the game kind of invites that. I can't make a "TSP is a wolf" case, but no one can make a case that TSP is town so a chop there is sort of a delaying action. I am taking it because i think there has been a pretty strong "no that's not a wolf" case made against every significant wagon so far.

Game is hard. Good luck.

[hollowkatt]

Spoiler: show

Marmot ISO:

Spoiler: show

Not you apparently

ngl, I do miss this team

If DrWilgy is mafia these are all town.

This isn't how DrWilgy works. If he's mafia here, than I'm mafia here.

This kind of looks egregious considering marmot made the same statement with cat, which I quoted earlier in the thread.

@MacDougall I vote group 1.

I do think tutuu's scum this game, so I don't want to give her immunity.

starts scumreading tutuu for some inexplicable reason. I looked back and the read seemed like a joke and there was no serious interactions between himself and tutuu, nor did marmot ever vote there.

Last I saw Syn was wolf reading Nutella, so if she snaps at him it's not likely to be pretty.

So it sounds like we have a nututuu team. Noted.

Shades tutuu again, but yet still doesn't vote in tutuu's direction.

Alison, Michelle, MR = bad guys


No I don't, but then I remember that New! Coke was a thing, and those guys didn't think it sucked til the whole world told them, and now I wonder if I'm the new New! Coke

You lost me at "soda was a thing".

I agree on MR. The amount of on topic content I've seen from him is alarming.

Starts to shade Radishes

I think that Kyle is Mafia; the way he's constantly talking about having to catch up is a way I've seen Mafia do, can't really argument it; it's just how I've seen it; I think there are other people who groan at having to catch up but they aren't following it so faithfully / they meme from time to time / they still give reads from time to time.

I think the way Kyle is approaching this is wolfy and he's constantly reminding us that he's trying to read every post (which I believe him that he is) but that's busywork IMO and he's mafia.

You're right, I don't recall Kyle doing this. I think he tends to post off-topic rather than complaining about catching up.

I'mma look him up in other big games as a townie player.

marmot puts his hand in the honey jar, and starts throwing dirt in kyle's location.

THIS IS A FUCKING LOST WOLF SOFT OR MY NAME ISNT TUTUU

[VOTE: Made] aubergine

I SWEAR TO GOD THIS IS A LOST WOLF SOFT CLAIM

You know what

[VOTE: Made] aubergine

Marmot seemingly dropped his scum read on tutuu out of nowhere, and then joins tutuu on a Made wagon. I get the impression that marmot was trying to pocket tutuu

Ok, this guy prolly still town. Only a towny could still be so wrong

This is so scummy, nutella might be town

Do you normally give TWTBW reads falcon. You gave two of them back-to-back here.

Begins to shade falcon

I think Thunal is the only town player in the game

Probably just TMI, and getting thunal/HK on side

Tutuu is actually le town.

Nope.

I don't see a solving mindset there.

Starts to scum read tutuu again and throws shade in that direction? even though Marmot agreed with two of tutuu's reads on both Made & kyle (quoted above). It feels like marmot was trying to pocket tutuu but was trying to ensure she remained firmly in the PoE.

i really want the top 2 wagons to be thunal and cat

I've explained thunal a lot and I think cat's a hit too (mostly based on mac's case)

i think that if both those wagons were to die today I'd be pretty happy

This post feels kinda manipulative. Why don't you want to entertain outside of these two?

That said, I agree that cat's posts are pretty scummy, but I disagree on Thunal.

I think this post shows potential in the theory that cat was ruthlessly bussed D1.

Another possibility of TMI on thunal to look good as she was starting to become a wagon at this point iiirc. Please correct me if I am wrong.

you asked me to not respond but i cant not respond, i dont understand why

dismissal is a negative word, i dont view me challenging your read as something thats negative

I disagree about word usage and expression, I think that is a great way to catch mafia. I mean, I'm not very good at catching mafia, but I've had more recent success in this way.

Maybe I misunderstood your tone, but it didn't feel like a challenge. I thought you were saying "Yes Marmot, good try, but it's wrong, go try again". Were you implying something else?

I think these set of posts look good for tutuu.

tutuu sounds genuinely confused and these set of posts don't come across as fake.

This took a lot of courage

[VOTE: VOTE CAT] aubergine


Guess how long it took me to go thru the ISO?

5 minutes between these posts (that's my answer falcon).

I guess this is a self-prez vote, but it's otherwise pretty bad.

[VOTE: falcon] aubergine

Awkward scumread and vote on falcon. I think marmot tried and failed to save Cat d1, despite previously calling them scum. GTH I don't think falcon/marmot/cat are partners.

Cat's ISO looks meh. Their earlier posts don't look great, particularly the one where Sloonei asked for their reads. Their response to the case from Mac (and others) looked better. But they didn't really leave much of a legacy aside from Sloonei grilling them for reads.

I'm also happy voting falcon.


I will not be voting for Thunal though. The overtly formal nature of their approach being a sign of scum is a read I disagree with.

He really didn't want cat to fall d1, and was trying to get people to move over to falcon and downplay the scumreads on cat.

Why do people want to bake Tutuu now that I'm actually townreading her??

Starts townreading tutuu now? I tried going through a reason for the change in read but I couldn't see why or when he changed the read. tutuu was starting to gain traction and I think there is a pattern between her and thunal/HK. Marmot was happy for those wagons to go-ahead, tried to take town cred if/when they flipped town but didn't really try to stop either of the wagon from progressing.

This is the way

Marmot was on falcon at this point. I can't remember who the second person

I'm in the middle of ISO'ing Martin, and the most egregious thing I can see thus far are his heavy attempts to defend tutuu.

Continuing reading.

And now marmot shades Martin for hard defending tutuu. In hindsight, it really did feel like he was being a goldilocks

I read falcon's Day 2 and don't feel any better about it

There were 4 posts, but I won't tell you how long it took.

meh

[imagine big tutuu spinning anime girl gif and big flashy text with sparkles and stuff]

THE MAFIA ARE MARTIN MARMOT DYSLEXICON LONGCON AND TONYSTARKPRIME


[dab]

If Dizzy is scum, I'm just giving up now.

I also think I see what nutella's saying. Everyone feels townie rn.

Except Syn.

Syn is already part of the towncore and I think this adds a further reason to why I believe he is town.

[VOTE: Tim] aubergine

I hope marmot gets yeeted and he flips mafia and im next. I want out please

Are you not having fun? I want you to have fun.

I don't think marmot faked this meaning he seemed genuinely surprised by tutuu who was implying she wasn't having fun, which to me implies they are probably not wolves together. Marmot would know if tutuu was faking the not having fun post if they were wolves together due to being in scumchat, and I genuinely believe in the surprised tone from marmot, as well as believing tutuu when she stated she wasn't having fun.

In summary:

I think tutuu looks pretty good from reading marmot's iso. He keeps flip-flopping on the read whenever it suited him. He was scumreading tutuu, but then agreed on two of the votes/progressions she made on D1, and then randomly scumread again accusing her of not trying to solve the game? It felt like he was trying to pocket, but ensure she remained in the PoE whenever someone else would go and townread her. Marmot townread thunal/hk and tutuu when their wagons were beginning to gain traction, and yet did absolutely nothing to steer town away from either wagon, and I believe he was trying to go for the free towncred when they flipped. So I think this looks good for both HK and tutuu. Marmot and tutuu's interactions do not feel faked or wolf theatre.

Marmot's vote on falcon is awkward, and I think he was trying to get people to move off from cat and lynch falcon instead. I think this is important because marmot wasn't really trying to save either tutuu or thunal/hk as previously mentioned. This means this is a good look for falcon at the moment.

I think wilgy has partner potential, but I think it might be a dumb read as it's only based off the cat post I posted early and similarities it had with the wilgy post I quoted in the spoilers.

I disagree with your conclusions on tutuu being spewed town by marmot, but that's fine, i guess. I think there could still be partners there.

tutuu

6
26%

Voters: NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME, Long Con, Michelle, nutella, Timsup2nothin, hollowkatt

I think no matter tutuu's AI. this wagon contains a wolf.

I wish for an alignament cop to check Nanook, Tim or HK, in this order
Nutella is volume cleared and Mac flipping villager means he had a good read for her
Long Con is a soul town read, who thinks I am wrong should tell me why.

I agree with your order in regards to the alignment cop. Though tbh I think hk is spewed town from reading marmots iso

Do you mind elaborating on the town read with Long Con? Unless it's just a gut read.

The bold above indicates you also thought at one point I was spewed town by marmot, what changed and when/why?

Come vote me tutuu!!!!

but whyyyy u have the same alignment as i do

Unlikely to be wolf theatre

Here you say the above is unlikely to be w/w theater but then HERE you say opposite:

[VOTE: Thunal] aubergine

I wonder why.

Why are people voting Thunal, I was obviously joking

could this be w/w?

I think it could be

What gives, and what is the difference for you?
Kinda reads like you can't make up your mind if I'm spewed town or if I'm hard partnered, but either way the inconsistency with how you're treating my slot vs how you're treating tutuu is weird and I'm not sure what to make of it.

Context matters.

When tutuu/Marmot were saying there thing it was right at the end of the phase, and marmot was about to die.

Marmot and thunal on the other, it was the middle of day 1, and when I quizzed marmot on why he kept your vote on there, his response was: "These things happen".

I did think you were spewed by marmot, but then I read sloonei's case and I started having doubts on my conclusion, and plus I disagreed with several of your reads, in regards to tutuu and marmot.

gotcha, thanks. I'll go read the sloonei case then.
Last question for now: does disagreement automatically indicate wolf to you then? Because that's what your last comment sounds like.

Depends on if their reasons are strong enough. Apart from nutella and Syn, Radishes and tutuu are two of my top towns, so it legit concerns me when I somebody wanting to chop two of my top townies for meh reasons.

I'll be the first to admit my tutuu read is mostly built on their obstinence, continual insistence they're town, and overall lack of anything constructive I've seen thus far this game. To me that's prime wolf land. You just derp around, make random posts, land on the right wagons at the right time, etc.
I also strongly dislike their continual chipping in of "hk is obvs wolf lol" without actually doing anything about it. It's poisoning the well to me

[Jackofhearts2005]

Okay so this reaction from TSP, Tutuu and Sloonei to my Thunal case. Is precisely why Made is outed mafia for his reaction to my pushing Cat. @nutella

there's a frickin cat in this game?

why are we chopping cat

@dyachei you said you want two votes and received Marmot's
If you need another one, i'll give you mine

i really want the top 2 wagons to be thunal and cat

I've explained thunal a lot and I think cat's a hit too (mostly based on mac's case)

i think that if both those wagons were to die today I'd be pretty happy

bad vibes

[VOTE: cat] aubergine

smh

This progression sucks. Possible wolf.

1) Derp clear me cause I didn’t know cat was in the game.
2) Interested in the Cat case
3) Shades a townie saying they suspect Cat
4) Votes Cat after having said absolutely nothing about Cat. TMI.

Tbf on point 4, I didn’t check if Tony like hated the cw or something.

hm u actually rite tho

I was subtle about this earlier but it bears noting: tbf on point 4, I /voted for Cat on day 2 after he flipped wolf/. so yes, I did have tmi. he had flipped wolf.

Lmao

[Justplayingitcool]

It might be a dumb read, but I honestly think TSP is town for not submitting his ability.

[TonyStarkPrime]

HK wanting to chop two of my top towns is a huge red flag for me

Why? Are your townreads supported by actual facts that you have laid out in front of HK?

I want to shoot Made. Nutella is mad at me because she TRs Made. I tell her to prove her case, and she points out that I town read her as if that means I have to just assume she's right. That's kinda what you are doing here. Just because you town read them doesn't make them lock towns above suspicion for other people.

That said.

@hollowkatt

The Marmot flip revealed that he had this weird Tetris based power. The Sloonei silencing shows that the wolves do have some way to use the powers of their dead. Radish claims to have been Tetris challenged. This I think is clearing, at least for now, so chop an onion or something instead of the Radish.

If you're a wolf and Radish is town you don't say this. you let me stay there b/c it looks meh and gets me negative attention from other townies making me a viable push later.
If you're a wolf and Radish is also a wolf you also don't say this, you let me vanity wagon b/c I don't have the thread presence and force of will to get people to follow me.

Therefore, you are not a wolf.

Well that was easy, Tim isn't a wolf guys, solved that for you.

If you're town and you think Radish is a wolf you also don't say that (which you did, because you don't)

You also don't say that if either 112 or TSP is a wolf with you because I've already indicated I think you're town and I think nutella is town, and those two players are the two people you two are voting for, so adding to those wagons instead of guiding me towards a mischop would be your goal here. So again, you're not a wolf with either of those two should they flip.

Finally, I like the TSP wagon composition more than the 112
[VOTE: TSP] aubergine

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/ ... nknown.png

[Jackofhearts2005]

What's going on with Dr Wilgy?

Yeah, why shouldn't why yeet Wilgy? Also, why shouldn't we yeet Jack?

Cause I’m pretty funny and also town.

[Master Radishes]

HK wanting to chop two of my top towns is a huge red flag for me

I assume radish and tutuu? Nobody has been able to explain to me why/how tutuu has to be town here, all I'm getting is "that's just tutuu" which is probably fine for the people who are vv familiar with them. For people who aren't (read me) that's not enough. Basically you're saying "HK, accept on faith that tutuu is town" and I'm saying "no"

Tutuu is town.

*Marmot's iso spews her likely clear. The way he interacts with her sounds like he's talking to someone not his teammate. The way he handles her slot is one where he's friendly and chatty but also quietly keeping her in the PoE. He talks with her a lot on D1, in fact, whereas he largely ignores Cat, his only other confirmed teammate.

*Tutuu's handling of Marmot at EoD2 could be WIFOMy scummate, but also is just probably town. Like she made clear she felt Marmot was town but didn't try to save him exactly. She voted him, then recanted, but never tried to gain cred nor fight back. She let it happen, whilst calmly stating she didn't agree.

*Cat's iso doesn't implicate tutuu either. I don't remember why I think that, though.

*Tutuu's emotional journey this game is traceable and feels genuine. She started off super pumped. Then when she started getting suspicion she felt was unwarranted she became frustated. She didn't stop trying to engage with people about their concerns, but was visibly annoyed that she was being scumread despite all her hard work on D1. And in fact when I backed off she kept trying to draw me back in to address what she perceived to be terribad reasons from me. She then kept playing but stopped trying so hard. Since the townread players have started to also townread her again, she's warming up again. This just all feels really organic and genuine.


Each thing mentioned is circumstantial. But that's a lot of circumstantial reasons to think someone is 'probably just town'.

[Jackofhearts2005]

What's going on with Dr Wilgy?

Yeah, why shouldn't why yeet Wilgy? Also, why shouldn't we yeet Jack?

What's your case against Jack?

I don't have one, I just don't have a reason to find him town so I was wondering if others have reasons. If Jack is bad, how do we find him?

*gets out a pen and paper*

[TonyStarkPrime]

So I'm gonna be out for a chunk of time this time, and I leave you with this:

We got a couple of wolves, which is great. They were both pretty wide consensus agreement slaughters, which is really great and made the game feel easy.

The game is not actually easy. There is very likely not going to be a high posting active player who just revealed heavy wolfiness that we can all (or mostly all) agree on. This is shaping up to be one of those days where we make a decisive and divisive chop. We may be right or we may be wrong, and being on the right or wrong side of history is going to have lasting consequences.

I think TSP has a fair chance of being a hit, and i also acknowledge it as a cowardly way out. Low content poster who actively says he isn't gonna contribute a lot to solving the game kind of invites that. I can't make a "TSP is a wolf" case, but no one can make a case that TSP is town so a chop there is sort of a delaying action. I am taking it because i think there has been a pretty strong "no that's not a wolf" case made against every significant wagon so far.

Game is hard. Good luck.

f this tim is a wolf

[Jackofhearts2005]

Promises made promises broken.

[VOTE: 112] aubergine

[TonyStarkPrime]

And frankly I think I've done a fair amount of game related work and I've never said otherwise

[TonyStarkPrime]

HK is town via spew from both ISOs so the purity of his wagon feels like a moot point

[nutella]

It might be a dumb read, but I honestly think TSP is town for not submitting his ability.

also i just reread the quotes in the jack post after realizing the vote was a d2 joke and... honestly the progression seems more like town without tmi who just didnt see it, i think wolves more likely to bus there

[Master Radishes]

So I'm gonna be out for a chunk of time this time, and I leave you with this:

We got a couple of wolves, which is great. They were both pretty wide consensus agreement slaughters, which is really great and made the game feel easy.

No, your narrative does not hold water. Cat was a consensus agreement, but Marmot was not. With less than an hour to go before EoD (iirc) the wagons were 7/7 Tim/Martin and Marmot had 0 votes. The only reason Marmot got chopped is because (a) Syn/me/Nutella all clearly harboured suspicions and so started up a last minute wagon, and (b) nutella badgered a few extra people to vote for him.

I'm ignoring the rest of this post of yours because there's so much I find ick about it but I've come to learn that's not a tell for you.

[TonyStarkPrime]

Pretty sure Wilgy is legitimately volume cleared

[nutella]

4-4-4-4 again aaa

[nutella]

Pretty sure Wilgy is legitimately volume cleared

not a thing, hes been active as wolf before

[nutella]

and he...has not been active this phase at all so uh

[Master Radishes]

Ok, why though?
Like I'm thinking back to the spec chat game where I did some crafty setup for a future chop on town as wolf before I went over, townies bought it, and we went on to win the game. Hard defense of someone town as wolf is something that should be in every wolves repertoire, yeah? Especially because it leads into situations like this.
And, in my experience, when done correctly it's generally a wolf that brings it back up after a day or two so that they can look solving while susing town and not getting any heat back from it.

'I did this thing one time and therefore Radishes is mafia.'

Makes sense.

Wow, that's reductive and unhelpful! Good job

Your original attempt to explain why I might be a wolf was reductive and unhelpful. I responded in kind.

If you're town and you want to avoid getting mischopped, you need to do more, because you're deep in the PoE.

[Jackofhearts2005]

For the record, the reason I’m not voting Tony despite somewhat casing him and calling his wagon pure is that reading his interactive with wolves, they were mixed like 60 bad 40 good but I’ve literally misunderstood the situation twice so I figure it’s more like 60 good 40 bad in reality.

Like I’d vote Tony over HK or Wilgy but I’m not that interested in yeeting him, which is why I’m on 112, who I haven’t fulfilled my promise to read yet.

[nutella]

[VOTE: 112] aubergine

yolo

[Master Radishes]

4-4-4-4 again aaa

I was gonna vote HK but now I can't.

[Master Radishes]

Oh you ruined it.

[Justplayingitcool]

Not against a Tim counterwagon tbh

[Jackofhearts2005]

Pretty sure Wilgy is legitimately volume cleared

not a thing, hes been active as wolf before

Exceptions that prove the rule rollsafe.jpg

[Master Radishes]

So I'm gonna be out for a chunk of time this time, and I leave you with this:

We got a couple of wolves, which is great. They were both pretty wide consensus agreement slaughters, which is really great and made the game feel easy.

No, your narrative does not hold water. Cat was a consensus agreement, but Marmot was not. With less than an hour to go before EoD (iirc) the wagons were 7/7 Tim/Martin and Marmot had 0 votes. The only reason Marmot got chopped is because (a) Syn/me/Nutella all clearly harboured suspicions and so started up a last minute wagon, and (b) nutella badgered a few extra people to vote for him.

I'm ignoring the rest of this post of yours because there's so much I find ick about it but I've come to learn that's not a tell for you.

I'm still thinking about this.

I didn't at all feel like this game was 'easy' at any point. I struggled all of D2 to figure out a wolf because I never really liked any of the main wagon options that sprung up and gained traction, and kept trying to find someone lurking at the edges of the PoE that was not getting talked about. Even at the end I felt that Marmot was not anything close to guaranteed.

Your reading of the game is nothing like mine, Tim.

[Jackofhearts2005]

So I'm gonna be out for a chunk of time this time, and I leave you with this:

We got a couple of wolves, which is great. They were both pretty wide consensus agreement slaughters, which is really great and made the game feel easy.

No, your narrative does not hold water. Cat was a consensus agreement, but Marmot was not. With less than an hour to go before EoD (iirc) the wagons were 7/7 Tim/Martin and Marmot had 0 votes. The only reason Marmot got chopped is because (a) Syn/me/Nutella all clearly harboured suspicions and so started up a last minute wagon, and (b) nutella badgered a few extra people to vote for him.

I'm ignoring the rest of this post of yours because there's so much I find ick about it but I've come to learn that's not a tell for you.

Important context!

[Master Radishes]

Not against a Tim counterwagon tbh

I'm not going to argue against it like I did previously, but I do have to say that Tim is easy to misread. He often says things that sound scummy on the surface, or explores a weird and unlikely theory, or builds narratives that don't exist, etc - as town. If anything I think he's likely more reasonable as a wolf, albeit still manipulative rather than passive.

I dunno. I wouldn't stop a Tim wagon now, but I think there are better options.

[Jackofhearts2005]

Eh Radishes, why is JPIC town?

[Michelle]

Spoiler: show

Who should get off the phone?
Please note that if you vote, your vote will be visible.

You may select 1 option


112
5
17%
Voters: Made, Kylemii, Jackofhearts2005, nutella, NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME
Alison
0
No votes
Voters: None
DrWilgy
4
14%
Voters: Michelle, tedxtr, Syn, Dyslexicon
Dyslexicon
0
No votes
Voters: None
falcon45ca
2
7%
Voters: MartinGG99, 112
Hyena
0
No votes
Voters: None
JackofHearts2005
1
3%
Voters: Master Radishes
JustPlayingitcool
0
No votes
Voters: None
Kylemii
0
No votes
Voters: None
Long Con
1
3%
Voters: TonyStarkPrime
Made
0
No votes
Voters: None
MartinGG99
0
No votes
Voters: None
Master Radishes
0
No votes
Voters: None
Michelle
0
No votes
Voters: None
NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME
0
No votes
Voters: None
nutella
0
No votes
Voters: None
Sloonei
1
3%
Voters: DrWilgy
Syn
0
No votes
Voters: None
hollowkatt
3
10%
Voters: Sloonei, tutuu, Justplayingitcool
Timsup2nothin
0
No votes
Voters: None
TonyStarkPrime
4
14%
Voters: hollowkatt, Hyena, Long Con, Timsup2nothin
tedxtr
0
No votes
Voters: None
tutuu
1
3%
Voters: falcon45ca
No vote
0
No votes
Voters: None
No elimination
0
No votes
Voters: None
Mac's Mom (The Host, the Non, the Dead)
7
24%
Voters: Marmot, MacDougall, c4e5g3d5, JaggedJimmyJay, Epignosis, dunya, juliets
Total votes: 29

VC

[Master Radishes]

I just don't like the TSP or Wilgy wagons purely on principle. Those are wagons supported by people who don't know where else to reasonably push, either lost townies or nervous wolves hoping for their first mischop.

Like maybe one is scum - there's no strong reason to really think either is town - but I just don't like going there when we have so many people left in the game who are not cleared town.

[Jackofhearts2005]

Does Nanook typically vote with no explanation?

Yes

Who are you sheeping?

Nutes

Why nutella? Do you often sheep her, are you 2 home slices, or is it specific to this game?

Mac’s dead

Womp womp womp

[TonyStarkPrime]

this is dumb

Give me 2-3 other names that should get votes instead of you. Falcon can be one of them.

nanook, hollowkatt, dizzy i guess

hk is the biggest bone but honestly this is so town

[tutuu]

[VOTE: jack] aubergine

sheeping radish

[Jackofhearts2005]

I just don't like the TSP or Wilgy wagons purely on principle. Those are wagons supported by people who don't know where else to reasonably push, either lost townies or nervous wolves hoping for their first mischop.

Like maybe one is scum - there's no strong reason to really think either is town - but I just don't like going there when we have so many people left in the game who are not cleared town.

I feel like this post unnecessarily shades lost townies.

[Jackofhearts2005]

[VOTE: jack] aubergine

sheeping radish

Wat? Was your case “Jack is too logical to be a townie” not good enough?

You know Radishes is coming off a t/t game where he suspected me the whole time, right?

[Master Radishes]

Eh Radishes, why is JPIC town?

Because he is. Everything he does bleeds green. He's active, focused, having fun, solving on his own, following others when he likes their ideas, mostly serious and focused but with moments of levity when it strikes his fancy, not afraid to respond to anything from anyone that catches his attention, etc etc etc.

He is my myc from SF2 or Dizzy from finale or KZA from Spiderverse - I vibe with him so hard my teeth shake. He's never flipping scum and if he did I'd never trust again.

[TonyStarkPrime]

the 112 iso feels very pure to me to be honest

[Jackofhearts2005]

this is dumb

Give me 2-3 other names that should get votes instead of you. Falcon can be one of them.

nanook, hollowkatt, dizzy i guess

hk is the biggest bone but honestly this is so town

I don’t get it.

[Michelle]

[VOTE: Tim] aubergine

[Jackofhearts2005]

Eh Radishes, why is JPIC town?

Because he is. Everything he does bleeds green. He's active, focused, having fun, solving on his own, following others when he likes their ideas, mostly serious and focused but with moments of levity when it strikes his fancy, not afraid to respond to anything from anyone that catches his attention, etc etc etc.

He is my myc from SF2 or Dizzy from finale or KZA from Spiderverse - I vibe with him so hard my teeth shake. He's never flipping scum and if he did I'd never trust again.

K thx

[TonyStarkPrime]

112 didn't take the bait sloonei offered up.

[Master Radishes]

[VOTE: jack] aubergine

sheeping radish

Wat? Was your case “Jack is too logical to be a townie” not good enough?

You know Radishes is coming off a t/t game where he suspected me the whole time, right?

I read you wrong where you subbed in, weren't very active for awhile, and so never cleared yourself? Yeah. I also never pushed particularly hard to chop you in the end.

[nutella]

Eh Radishes, why is JPIC town?

Because he is. Everything he does bleeds green. He's active, focused, having fun, solving on his own, following others when he likes their ideas, mostly serious and focused but with moments of levity when it strikes his fancy, not afraid to respond to anything from anyone that catches his attention, etc etc etc.

He is my myc from SF2 or Dizzy from finale or KZA from Spiderverse - I vibe with him so hard my teeth shake. He's never flipping scum and if he did I'd never trust again.

myc was still a wolf modbot lied

[Jackofhearts2005]

112 didn't take the bait sloonei offered up.

Was this before or after Falcon started gathering defenders?