Coffia (Coffee Mafia) [END]

[TonyStarkPrime]

I'm not sure if town/wolfs are just setting up LC as the designated NK so TSP can throw in F3 again but i'm for it

[TonyStarkPrime]

alexa are you a wolf caveat I haven't read any of the game

[Gira]

alexa are you a wolf caveat I haven't read any of the game

i respect the flex if you're mafia

[Gira]

brad you gonna say anything

ftr if you see this later i was asking because you always show up as online so i was figuring you were lurking while i was yelling at spf which i guess is incorrect. nothing more than that

[Lime Coke]

brad you gonna say anything

ftr if you see this later i was asking because you always show up as online so i was figuring you were lurking while i was yelling at spf which i guess is incorrect. nothing more than that

If I'm at home then I typically have the game open on a tab on my laptop and I'm doing other things, specifically if the game is inactive.

But at that moment I was just observing the argument, wasn't really going to interject because that felt like something you two could resolve on your own regarding the content of the argument. I had half a thought to post "Is this wolf theater? " but I wasn't going to make the situation worse.

Then my friends on a discord server invited me to play Jackbox and I joined in.

Otherwise I was just rattling my brain in terms of who it could be and if it makes sense.

[Gira]

k

[Gira]

so let me reframe my thinking

i am not considering tsp as mafia. some of the stuff he's said sets off alarm bells and him not reading the game is irritating, but whatever. i had the previous players as town and i am not going to reconsider. i am fine losing to that slot if it is mafia.

that makes 2/3 of the clique mafia, which mostly explains why the nightkills have played out the way they have. at a minimum, one of you threw wilgy under the bus day 1 because he's a weaker scum player and coasted off the momentum from that vote. this has resulted in a decidedly mediocre series of eliminations on people for posting too little rather than actually being scummy. (dolby basically quit on the game which is a really cruddy thing to do, but whatever)

it is basically impossible for me to hide my irritation at this situation, which is assuredly not the best form, because i need to actually convince whoever in the clique is town that i am town. and generally people are reactive and me being irritable and cranky isn't going to win me any fans. and of course at this moment the scum in the clique want to provoke me to keep that going.

it puts me at a bit of a loss, frankly, because that requires 1. identifying the town in the clique and 2. appealing to them, and frankly i'm not a good enough player to do either of those. i'm just writing this out in the hope it makes sense to someone i guess

[Gira]

@Lime Coke

can you explain to me why you actually voted wilgy on day 1?

[Gira]

Alright well thrilling EOD, but I'm fine with Wilgy going over because I think this can actually help me solve certain players in regards to how his flips.

Townreads:
Alexa
Dizzy
SPF
Illario
Alison
Nanook
Esooa

My main thought is that if Wilgy flips town then Esooa goes higher on the list, if he's mafia she's kind of stuck on that bottom spot and leaning back.

Top 4 is my most confident townreads.

[alexa]

TSP/SPF now W/W, LC not wolf, Gira wolf

please try to explain why i make 2 straight kills on people townreading me as scum because that's straight -EV

that's.. a good point

the best logic i can think is killing people who are getting generally cleared, but you may go for LC in that case

hm

[alexa]

based on interactions today + throughout

SPF/Gira not W/W
SPF/LC not W/W

I think SPF only works with TSP

[alexa]

i mean if youre a wolf, then fypov, your only pushes are lime coke/alexa/TSP. all of those names are very difficult to push and all of them have been towny at various parts of the game, so if you are a wolf then i would expect you to be pushing me just like youre pushing me right now

granted, that doesn't MAKE you a wolf, but it does mean that your approach today is aligning specifically with how you would likely be playing this situation as a wolf

why do you think you're easier to push then TSP?

a part of me feels like w!Gira doesn't pick v!TSP to clear of all people

[alexa]

and now i'm getting some LC paranoia which i hate

@Lime Coke why would you kill me n1/n2 when i'm a top person townreading you? what if your partner didn't want to? like, the longest i've lived in games have been when you were mafia

[alexa]

i mean at this point all i need to do is lock 2 people as town for a solve and the fact that recent posts have me thinking "gira" as most comfortable lock is a bit concerning

idk, i may vote SPF because i feel like i have the least reasons overall to townread her slot and she's most capable of actively snowing me as wolf

[TonyStarkPrime]

incredibly concerned that Alexa just mirrored my thought process (replacing tsp with alexa where applicable)

[TonyStarkPrime]

i almost woke up this morning and thought "yeah I'm probably just voting SPF at the end of this"

[Lime Coke]

and now i'm getting some LC paranoia which i hate

@Lime Coke why would you kill me n1/n2 when i'm a top person townreading you? what if your partner didn't want to? like, the longest i've lived in games have been when you were mafia

Like I said both games I told my teammates I wanted you dead N1 because you can read me the best and you're never going to be a viable ML, but I'm told no because you townread me in those games.
But, again like I said earlier, your townread always wavers on me when I'm mafia and you end up killing me later in the game.
If I actually want to win, you don't stay alive.

[alexa]

did i?

[alexa]

incredibly concerned that Alexa just mirrored my thought process (replacing tsp with alexa where applicable)

isn't that a good thing

[alexa]

actually TSP i'm having trouble following your recent posts so idrk what your thought process is
that SPF/LC and SPF/Gira don't work? Why does SPF/LC not work in your eyes if you didn't read day 1?

[alexa]

the best reason i have for TSP V is i don't think Crichards overreacts to that extreme as wolf, but idk if that's like, good logic at all and feels icky to clear the slot from that

Nook kill slightly concerning in regard to TSP alignment

[Lime Coke]

@Lime Coke

can you explain to me why you actually voted wilgy on day 1?

Didn't have reasons to townread him. His start of day sucked with him just sticking a vote on me saying I was "outed" and I should be killed immediately. The other wagon for a majority of the day was Alexa who I was townreading at the time and he was on the wagon.

During EOD the other wagons were Alexa, Nanook, you, and FingerSplints. I didn't want to vote out Nanook because he had a towny moment right before EOD with his kinda "fire" towards getting Wilgy wagoned. You were a possibility because you were kind of just there but your defense against Alison gave you some sort of edge over other options. FingerSplints was the only other "good" option because she wasn't too active and had a weird lazy solve that included Alexa who was top wagon and Illario. Alexa I was flat out strong townreading and never voting then.
But Wilgy just looked bad for most of the game. Plus he wasn't actually "self-pressing" onto FS so figured those 2 might've been partnered? So put the vote on him and hoped for the best.

[alexa]

ok i've went though LC's early ISO and i'm no longer worried about him

technically w!SPF would have a good reason to keep him alive anyway

[Lime Coke]

did i?

Last Will you literally came up with a perfect 3/3 solve during the night phase and wrote it as your will, and you kept questioning me, or at least your read on me, even if you were townreading me most of the game. This was my first mafia game though and I was still a noob so you had no idea how I'd play as mafia.

Buckets you had me as a townread Day 1 but you still had Illario over me majority of the time and you kept wavering on your read on me throughout the game.

Whenever I'm actually town you flat out end up with me as your top townread and you never change it. Like you flat out know how to read me better than anyone else.

[Lime Coke]

Also I'm still questioning my read on you but I looked at your iso as well and I'm just flip flopping at this rate.

[alexa]

did i?

Last Will you literally came up with a perfect 3/3 solve during the night phase and wrote it as your will, and you kept questioning me, or at least your read on me, even if you were townreading me most of the game. This was my first mafia game though and I was still a noob so you had no idea how I'd play as mafia.

Buckets you had me as a townread Day 1 but you still had Illario over me majority of the time and you kept wavering on your read on me throughout the game.

Whenever I'm actually town you flat out end up with me as your top townread and you never change it. Like you flat out know how to read me better than anyone else.

ok that's fine but i know you'd say the same thing about ender and you did trick him well last game which is part of my paranoia

[alexa]

Also I'm still questioning my read on you but I looked at your iso as well and I'm just flip flopping at this rate.

do you have any questions for me?

[alexa]

i don't even wolfread SPF that much when she's posting i just don't think this game makes a lot of sense with her as town

also i'm kind of over this game and ready for a re-do (though ik i can't blame myself for villagers doing fuck all) so tempted to just vote her but i will be good and wait

[Lime Coke]

Also I'm still questioning my read on you but I looked at your iso as well and I'm just flip flopping at this rate.

do you have any questions for me?

Not really? Most of the paranoia is just the fact that we're both still alive as I'm hard shielding you and it's LYLO with 3 other players I have reasons to townread both good and mostly bad.
I actually thought your defense last night was kind of tame for what I thought you would do if you were town. That was my main concern.

[Lime Coke]

did i?

Last Will you literally came up with a perfect 3/3 solve during the night phase and wrote it as your will, and you kept questioning me, or at least your read on me, even if you were townreading me most of the game. This was my first mafia game though and I was still a noob so you had no idea how I'd play as mafia.

Buckets you had me as a townread Day 1 but you still had Illario over me majority of the time and you kept wavering on your read on me throughout the game.

Whenever I'm actually town you flat out end up with me as your top townread and you never change it. Like you flat out know how to read me better than anyone else.

ok that's fine but i know you'd say the same thing about ender and you did trick him well last game which is part of my paranoia

Yes but his is more meta based and you hard re-evaluate every day phase and your reads 180 like crazy so I can't actually plan a day phase or a line of ML around you.

I'm re-figuring out why I hate wolfing against you.

[alexa]

Also I'm still questioning my read on you but I looked at your iso as well and I'm just flip flopping at this rate.

do you have any questions for me?

Not really? Most of the paranoia is just the fact that we're both still alive as I'm hard shielding you and it's LYLO with 3 other players I have reasons to townread both good and mostly bad.
I actually thought your defense last night was kind of tame for what I thought you would do if you were town. That was my main concern.

my defense is game dependent. like, if people are trying to push on me and i feel i should be blatantly obvious town and had buried wolves etcetc then i get angry. this game has been kind of a lot of coasting due to multitabling/people not doing anything/holidays/emotional reasons so the best i can really say is look at my ISO because you know how to read me too imo

[alexa]

what are the best reasons you have for TSP town besides uh.. Crich getting emotional?

[Lime Coke]

what are the best reasons you have for TSP town besides uh.. Crich getting emotional?

That's literally my only reasoning being Esooa and CRichard "raging" out of the game.

[alexa]

what are the best reasons you have for TSP town besides uh.. Crich getting emotional?

That's literally my only reasoning being Esooa and CRichard "raging" out of the game.

for Esooa i think that's NAI as she's left all her games

for Crich.. yeah. like, i definitely put stake into that earlier, but with it being LYLO i would feel a lot better with something solid and reassuring because i mean at least for me that stuff is mood/mental health-based not alignment-based and i wouldn't be surprised if it was the same.. and also Nook was one of the people not clearing that slot for it

[Lime Coke]

Also I'm still questioning my read on you but I looked at your iso as well and I'm just flip flopping at this rate.

do you have any questions for me?

Not really? Most of the paranoia is just the fact that we're both still alive as I'm hard shielding you and it's LYLO with 3 other players I have reasons to townread both good and mostly bad.
I actually thought your defense last night was kind of tame for what I thought you would do if you were town. That was my main concern.

my defense is game dependent. like, if people are trying to push on me and i feel i should be blatantly obvious town and had buried wolves etcetc then i get angry. this game has been kind of a lot of coasting due to multitabling/people not doing anything/holidays/emotional reasons so the best i can really say is look at my ISO because you know how to read me too imo

Like I get that, and I get it if it was say Dizzy or someone that doesn't talk to you that often. I just figured because it was me, the person who is going to get meme'd on the hardest if I end up incredibly wrong in townreading you but would be annoyed at myself for misvoting you in LYLO at the same time, questioning you that I'd get something a bit more beyond "look at my iso."

[Lime Coke]

Honestly it could be TSP.

[alexa]

Also I'm still questioning my read on you but I looked at your iso as well and I'm just flip flopping at this rate.

do you have any questions for me?

Not really? Most of the paranoia is just the fact that we're both still alive as I'm hard shielding you and it's LYLO with 3 other players I have reasons to townread both good and mostly bad.
I actually thought your defense last night was kind of tame for what I thought you would do if you were town. That was my main concern.

my defense is game dependent. like, if people are trying to push on me and i feel i should be blatantly obvious town and had buried wolves etcetc then i get angry. this game has been kind of a lot of coasting due to multitabling/people not doing anything/holidays/emotional reasons so the best i can really say is look at my ISO because you know how to read me too imo

Like I get that, and I get it if it was say Dizzy or someone that doesn't talk to you that often. I just figured because it was me, the person who is going to get meme'd on the hardest if I end up incredibly wrong in townreading you but would be annoyed at myself for misvoting you in LYLO at the same time, questioning you that I'd get something a bit more beyond "look at my iso."

ohhhhh, i get what you're saying. yeah like, jsyk i recently was misvoted by both anne and illario in a LYLO situation and anne was incredibly upset after but i told her that i wasn't bothered at all because i'm .. trying to get past that anger, so you don't have to feel bad in that case. and irt the first part, i think i'm just not exactly sure what you're looking for. admittedly i'm not in a lot of LYLO situations but i can really only list the ways i'm out of my wolfrange that you may see:

-treatment of Wilgy D1
-emotional stuff w/Gira
-emotional stuff w/SPF
-treatment of illario day 1/interactions with him
-just generally being comfortable throughout and accidentally running out of posts day 1 when as scum i have to force myself in order to get my PC up

[Lime Coke]

Alright that's fine.

Fuck it I'm just going to call you town.

[Lime Coke]

Could be TSP and SPF then?

[alexa]

Could be TSP and SPF then?

that is sort of where my head is at in the moment, yes

[alexa]

if i'm actually right on SPF then you're just never mafia and i can sheep your day 1 read on her in the future lmao

[Lime Coke]

Yeah if I was right I actually have 100% accuracy on her.

Something I thought I'd never say.

[alexa]

i think the strongest thing pointing to TSP/SPF working as potential W/W is Esooa's day 1 treatment of SPF. v!Esooa is usually very paranoid of SPF (especially day 1) but she was repping a pretty strong townread there and defending her a significant amount to Brad

[Lime Coke]

You are right I figured Esooa would have more to say about me scumcasing SPF. She was more deadpan than I expected.

Also the irony in her talking about people trying to scumhunt properly after doing that...

[alexa]

mm ok, my overall conclusion is that brad is Valid in saying that spf's play this game compares to her scumplay in 16/8er, there are a lot of glaring similarities, but i'm also not convinced that this is out of her townrange in the way she treats reads when she hasn't fully gotten into a game yet, like in deck mafia when i was tunneling her for what i think is something kinda similar... brad is just solid town for this whole thing, SPF probably null lean scum but not to the never rescind point

also yes brad, you were pushing her on D2 in venom. she had some mech stuff against her but i could still tell she was town

i genuinely think that it might be outing for you to be bolstering lime coke's meta case on me, because respectfully, the comparison between the 18/10er game and this game is absolutely terrible and there is no way that a reasonable person can look at my opening posts in that game vs this game and say there are "glaring similarities"

[VOTE: alexa] aubergine

I think SPF's omgus here was pretty towny. Emotions escalated how I'd expect and it developed into suspicion for reasons I can believe on a person I can believe she would think that about. Like she wasn't a wolf looking for outs but was mrr at people pushing her and at first when Alexa pushed her it was just also fighting back like with LC but after a post or two more goes "nah this is actually wolfy from Alexa because of these reasons" I dunno though this is lighter I suppose

like idk
based on what i know of Esooa+SPF dynamic, this is a weird thing for Esooa to townread SPF for

[alexa]

also part of what made me feel confident on falcon was TSP's read because he genuinely does have a great read on falcon, the only time he pushed falcon wrongly i was a wolf with him

TSP, what made you confident on falcon here?

[Gira]

based on interactions today + throughout

SPF/Gira not W/W
SPF/LC not W/W

I think SPF only works with TSP

i am once again confused why you think me raging at spf today is non-partnered when i haven't even voted her

it is technically correct but i don't think that kind of fight is impossible for us to fake at all

the process just feels questionable

[Lime Coke]

I don't think that's unreasonable to think? Like I said I was going to post it as a joke that you 2 were partnered but no way you have that last for nearly 2 weeks and have it more and more intense as the game goes on.

[alexa]

based on interactions today + throughout

SPF/Gira not W/W
SPF/LC not W/W

I think SPF only works with TSP

i am once again confused why you think me raging at spf today is non-partnered when i haven't even voted her

it is technically correct but i don't think that kind of fight is impossible for us to fake at all

the process just feels questionable

eh i don't really care as much about your interactions today as they could easily be theater w/out anything else but you had something w/her the day that i was getting tilted that seemed genuinely upset by how she was treating her read on you that felt very not-W/W to me

cool, then vote me

nah im not voting this early in the day

WHAT ARE YOU SCARED OF IF YOU'RE SO SURE I'M SCUM

like idk this just felt really real to me and hard on the unaligned scale

[alexa]

some people can theater like that but i'm also gauging how i perceive gira as a player in that