The Syndicate

Ricochet wrote:

Quin wrote:
Night 1 was without a night kill and tonight had 2. I'd imagine that there are criteria that have to be met before the Yellow Turbans can make a kill (just like in Psych). As for the Nanman, maybe they went after Dong Zhuo night 1. I highly doubt five (well, four) mafia members were all inactive.

Host design says that both mafia teams kill every Night (plus, I remember the Host alluding prior to the start of the game that it will run far smoother and quicker, because of the double nightkills). What makes you think there are limiters, after all?

Since Wilgy and MM were Nanman, I think the odds that Nanmans derped on sending the kill Night 1 are close to 0%. I even recall (though not sure if I remember this correctly) MM suggesting at least one night kill failed - which now reads as what probably that team experienced.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote:This game is probably reaching a record for number of players I'm afraid of reading as civ in the same game.

My only read game-based paranoia is the recruiter, tbh. Any given Day, it's likely for one civ read to turn into a indy and coast away with the cred.

The only thing I really think is that there's no way an entire baddie team missed the kill. I've never seen it happen and I have no reason to believe it happened this time, especially because there's some clear alternatives. Some of which is, as I said, they have a criteria, or else that they targeted a night-kill proof player.

As for your earlier post, I feel the same as Luffy - MP was thorough in his argument and at the time nutella did appeal to me as a valid lynch. I don't feel better nor worse about him from what I read in his defence, though. 'At least he's honest' is literally all I thought when he mentioned he was just going off other peoples suspicions.

She for me, Q.

Dom, do you suspect anyone besides DF at the moment?
Also, anything specifically lead you to trust SVS? She never participated at all.

nutella wrote:She for me, Q.

Dom, do you suspect anyone besides DF at the moment?
Also, anything specifically lead you to trust SVS? She never participated at all.

SVS is tired and not that in the mood for PLAYING mafia, I think. She would have been more energized if she had a team with her !

I gave a list just the other day of who I suspect. Dfaraday topped the list. You were a distant second, with scotty and 3j rounding up the bottom. Sig is somewhere in there.

nutella wrote:She for me, Q.

Dom, do you suspect anyone besides DF at the moment?
Also, anything specifically lead you to trust SVS? She never participated at all.

Apologies.

Dom wrote:SVS is tired and not that in the mood for PLAYING mafia, I think. She would have been more energized if she had a team with her !

I think this read on SVS is both accurate and genuine.

I'm really feeling good about Dom this game.

Dom wrote:

nutella wrote:She for me, Q.

Dom, do you suspect anyone besides DF at the moment?
Also, anything specifically lead you to trust SVS? She never participated at all.

SVS is tired and not that in the mood for PLAYING mafia, I think. She would have been more energized if she had a team with her !

I gave a list just the other day of who I suspect. Dfaraday topped the list. You were a distant second, with scotty and 3j rounding up the bottom. Sig is somewhere in there.

I wasn't on that list. Why? I thought I'd have been on there considering I was supposedly pushing 'nothing' against you.

I wonder if the scums are aware there is a game going on at all?

And mess at me actually being right with a guess for once. I finally had some time to involve myself further in this game as, just as I admitted, I had played really vaguely because, frankly I'm not used to such huge games and didn't have time too. It was late July when Sig recruited me for this and I expected the game to start earlier than it actually did.

A big post is coming up from me. Get ready for your weaves to be snatched.

Yay! I caught up!!!!! And now, random thoughts from throughout my catch up:

The great thing about reading posts when you know the outcome of lynches is that you can read things with fresh eyes, knowing a piece of information not known when originally posted. In that vein, I am quite suspish of TH.

This post:

Turnip Head wrote:It's pretty suspicious that I am the marmot's only neutral read. I wonder if I am his teammate.

I don't mind that Jan hasn't found the content to be relevant so far. I would feel pretty detached if this was my first game with 30+ other players and nothing of consequence had happened yet.

looks like a silly, in your face, tempting face push by a mafia TH. A teammate would never do that...looks to be distancing but isn't....etc....

Coupled with this:

Turnip Head wrote:

Quin wrote:

Turnip Head wrote:It's pretty suspicious that I am the marmot's only neutral read. I wonder if I am his teammate.

I don't mind that Jan hasn't found the content to be relevant so far. I would feel pretty detached if this was my first game with 30+ other players and nothing of consequence had happened yet.

What do you mean? Marmot's reading you as civ, unless he does his rainbow lists differently or something. Why do you think it's suspicious? He's only listed three people.

Because it's Day 1, and Marsh is always bad on Day 1.

Pointing out that he's MM's only neutral read, reads to be pointing out the teammate non-committal comment, in order to hide in plain sight.

Also:

Turnip Head wrote:THE ANCIENT RITUAL OF CHALLENGE DUEL HAS BEEN INVOKED. RUSSTIFINKO NOW HAS 24 HOURS TO ACCEPT OR WE WILL RAID HIS ANCESTRAL VILLAGE.

What ancestral village is that? The one you're in with MM?

Basically: I suspect that TH is a teammate of MM.

In other news....

DrWilgy wrote:

nutella wrote:Oh I also want to hear more from Wilgy. I feel like he's usually a lot more active than this, but I keep forgetting he's even in this game and I don't think that's a good sign. Likewise with sig, to a slightly lesser extent.

How could you forget about me LoRab? I was at work and had dnd night, but never left...

While I recognize that LA is totally awesome, she and I are NOT the same person.

Glorfindel wrote:

Quin wrote:

Glorfindel wrote:What the HELL happened to Night 0?

I don't recall ever having a Night 0. Doesn't it always just go from Day 0 to Day 1?

The Story of Creation
1 In the beginning, when God created the universe, 2 the earth was formless and desolate. The raging ocean that covered everything was engulfed in total darkness, and the Spirit of God was moving over the water. 3 Then God commanded, “Let there be light”—and light appeared. 4 God was pleased with what he saw. Then he separated the light from the darkness, 5 and he named the light “Day” and the darkness “Night.” Evening passed and morning came—that was the first day.

So interesting to read a translation of this text that isn't directly from the Hebrew. The subtle differences are fascinating. I've read Christian tranalstions before, but I don't come across them often, and especially from an extremely familiar text. Seriously--fascinating.

Jan wrote:Why wasn't anyone killed?

And not me choosing Wilgy for prefect and he turned out to be scum. I'm rather trustful of Scotty now. This has way too few votes to be a scumplay. And the reason why I missed the deadline was because there were so few votes, which got me confused.

And I preferred to stick around to those I know. I've played with Sig, DrWilgy and Glorfindel, whom I found out he's Matty only recently. I know Nerolunar as well, however never played with him.

Why wasn't anyone killed? For any number of reasons that kills often fail, I'd guess. Protections, blocks, etc.

Glorfindel wrote:Given there was no NK, may we assume that Zhang Jiao is one of the non participating players in this game so far? Someone who perhaps didn't post from the latter part of Day 1 onwards perhaps?

I don't think that we can assume that, at all. The roles state that teams can send PM's, and the chances of an entire team being MIA is seriously small--nor do I think that Epi would allow for the existence of a team that would be likely to have that happen. Also, why do you only name one of the killers, and not that of both teams?

And, yeah, I'm sure someone will point out that I was MIA early in the game and am defending, but whatever. I'm not bad, so I don't really care if you make that non-connection.

And you seem to be harping on this idea:

Glorfindel wrote:

Glorfindel wrote:Given there was no NK, may we assume that Zhang Jiao is one of the non participating players in this game so far? Someone who perhaps didn't post from the latter part of Day 1 onwards perhaps?

I'm not usually a proponent of lynching low posters but in a circumstance where we have TWO teams with NK ability (one of which has BTSC and still can't get their shit together) and there is no NK, I think I'll be looking at the low/non posters a lot more seriously this game

And why are you assuming the kill was not sent in (which is a seriously rare occurrance...I can maybe think of maybe 2 times in my mafia history that I've seen that happen...maybe less than that) and not the much more common explanation that the kill attempts failed.

Glorfindel wrote:

Dom wrote:

Glorfindel wrote:Given there was no NK, may we assume that Zhang Jiao is one of the non participating players in this game so far? Someone who perhaps didn't post from the latter part of Day 1 onwards perhaps?

This seems presuming !

What secrets do you know ? Or what do you want all of us-- the regular people-- to think?

This is not a matter of knowing any secrets, my friend - it's simple logic. If you can come up with another plausible explanation for the lack of ANY NK well, I'm listening...

Protections and blocks.

Turnip Head wrote:Bubbles and MM's votes smell the fishiest to me. I want to go back and investigate those.

Scotty my man, I'm sorry I ever doubted you. You are the hero we need. Please be my sensei.

Nod to smelling fishy throwback phrase. That said, this post does not ring true to me. See above.

Turnip Head wrote:Or I could always vote myself so that I can duel the marmot and bring honor to my home.

Because either way, you protect that house?

sig wrote:Okay I'm voting Dom for reasons previously stated and lorab since she has posted yet hasn't caught up or in fact posted again since she made her first one that is odd. I'm unsure of MM but wouldn't mind seeing him duel. I don't recall the case on Russ at all so I won't vote there.

Linki I think it makes Mac look slightly more pingy yes. I'd like to see what he says though.
I'd rather not duel hin today and leave him alive for another phase since I think it is to weak to lynch on

sig wrote:Okay I'm voting Dom for reasons previously stated and lorab since she has posted yet hasn't caught up or in fact posted again since she made her first one that is odd. I'm unsure of MM but wouldn't mind seeing him duel. I don't recall the case on Russ at all so I won't vote there.

Linki I think it makes Mac look slightly more pingy yes. I'd like to see what he says though.
I'd rather not duel hin today and leave him alive for another phase since I think it is to weak to lynch on

Sorry...it took me more than 24 hours to catch up. How is that pingy? Not sure how quickly you read, and I am a pretty fast reader, or how much free time you had, but it took me more than that to get through the game to this point.

Jan wrote:I wonder if the scums are aware there is a game going on at all?

And mess at me actually being right with a guess for once. I finally had some time to involve myself further in this game as, just as I admitted, I had played really vaguely because, frankly I'm not used to such huge games and didn't have time too. It was late July when Sig recruited me for this and I expected the game to start earlier than it actually did.

A big post is coming up from me. Get ready for your weaves to be snatched.

Why do you think the baddies aren't aware of a game?

Also, I didn't have one quote to grab, but I'm unsure about Dom. For a while I thought he was cursed/thread punished....but the timing didn't match up for that to make sense. And so I'm flumoxxed. Really not sure what to make of his posts or, therefore, of him.

And I think I had something else to say, but I can no longer remember. And this post is probably long enough, lol.

So I'm not just not going to try to catch up but rather start fresh from here. I'm sorry if my spontaneous vote strategy confused or offended some people, it made sense to Mr at the time. I figured, many of the people holding back votes will be plotters on bad teams, if one of their own is up for lynch. So since I had no idea about anything, I pushed the #2 and #3 guys up to ry to force baddie to get agitated and sloppy. It made sense at the time

I will observe the day's events and vote with my gut when the time for it comes.

LoRab wrote:

Jan wrote:I wonder if the scums are aware there is a game going on at all?

And mess at me actually being right with a guess for once. I finally had some time to involve myself further in this game as, just as I admitted, I had played really vaguely because, frankly I'm not used to such huge games and didn't have time too. It was late July when Sig recruited me for this and I expected the game to start earlier than it actually did.

A big post is coming up from me. Get ready for your weaves to be snatched.

Why do you think the baddies aren't aware of a game?

I've never played a game where the scum team(s?) haven't managed to dispose of at least one townie by Day 3 with a Night Kill. I don't know what exactly is going on in there, but frankly it would be against the balance of the game for the scums not being technically able to submit kills so either someone has a super secret ability that effectively stops scums or someone on their part fucked up.

....Did you miss the part where two people were night killed?

nutella wrote:....Did you miss the part where two people were night killed?

Oh wait. RIP.

I guess I'm still not the most useless person in this game.

Dare I say Jan scumslipped?

MacDougall wrote:Dare I say Jan scumslipped?

How so?

Dragon D. Luffy wrote:SK is serial killer. The fact it needs to fulfill requirements to start killing doesn't change what the role is.

Causality doesn't work that way, but ok, I have a better understanding of why you openly treated the role as SK, I suppose.

Dom wrote:Finnicky Rico-- now that you've started playing, why don't you make a real opinion and not just jump on the hater wagon ?? Sad !

I don't deserve the benefit of teh doubt. I deserve a real argument to be made against me, and none has been made. I am the best there ever was and Dfaraday is the worst . okay, folks? The way he jumped on me here-- hey, maybe I was looking for it, I don't know??

It is inaccurate to say I simply jumped on any wagon. I do have a real, monitor read on you. I think you developed your persona and posting style roughly when the contests and bids for prefect started happening, which was fine: you got inspired by in-game interactions, got creative and developed a "gimmick" a-la-G-Man (though I'm not sure why you didn't save this one for a more appropriately themed game ).

The problem with how this posting style, at least in my perception, gels with your actual activity has to do with some of the following:

1. It murks the lines between being confrontational with your sussers simply because it's in your persona's bloodstream and actually disapproving or deflecting suspicions in a valid way. This is a entirely hollow banter reaction to JJJ finding your suss on Bass to be weak. This is just one example of how blurry the line between 'spittin' Domald' and NO U'ing can get - and frankly, I tend to label NO U'ing Dom as bad Dom. I basically don't spot any player to have suspected you that didn't get this treatment: JJJ and DFaraday most of all, to a lesser extent nutella, Quin, Scotty.

2. Your ratio between full banter posts and meaningful ideas/messages behind the façade has improved over the course of the game, quite in sync with the wave of mixed or negative reactions you received. I'm inclined to read this as trying to patch things up. "Fine tuning! Bad!" I mean, your very last post is completely devoid of gimmicks. Look how serious you've gotten all of a sudden, when having to vouch for civreading a fallen player (SVS) or being asked repeatedly to state your suspicions.

3. It's not about deserving BTOD or not, it's about getting it. I think it's safe to say you survived having to duel on Day 2 because of a new wave of players reading kindly into your performance, particularly your antics: "he wouldn't do that if he'd have a team agenda", with opinions as strong as the hunt on you being called BS. On my side, I believe you could very well be experimenting with a new playing angle, after a series of games in which you were either bad all the time or in which you weren't, but wasn't exactly trusted given your baddie legacy and usual style (*raises hand*). This "experimentation" could be happening to simply refresh your style a bit, regardless of alignment, but points 1) and 2) still make me lean on spotting baddie traits from you. Plus, if you're bad, you've obviously done a good enough job to create some "oh, he wouldn't do this if bad" impressions.

I have no way to explain this properly in English, but there's a wretched garbage musical genre in our country called "manele / mynele" in which 70% of the lyrics are "death to my haters and enemies", and, to simply paraphrase, I think a lot of your posts are just that, either in a total bantz way, either with rebuttal intent that comes off, however, as NO U'y or evasive.

Golden wrote:I think this read on SVS is both accurate and genuine.

I'm really feeling good about Dom this game.

I don't have any issue with considering SVS a civ victim (the most remote tinfoil would be that the Turbans thought she could be a dormant baddie opponent), but what part of Dom stating obvious, accurate things about SVS is an alignment indicator?

I could add, in fact, a detail that Dom omitted, which is that SVS is probably still in no-internet limbo. Would this earn me any points? Does it need to?

timmer wrote:So I'm not just not going to try to catch up but rather start fresh from here. I'm sorry if my spontaneous vote strategy confused or offended some people, it made sense to Mr at the time. I figured, many of the people holding back votes will be plotters on bad teams, if one of their own is up for lynch. So since I had no idea about anything, I pushed the #2 and #3 guys up to ry to force baddie to get agitated and sloppy. It made sense at the time

I will observe the day's events and vote with my gut when the time for it comes.

Please try to clarify why you thought making uninformed, yet relevant (shaping up the dynamic of the main wagons) nominations was the best move, as opposed to other tendencies exhibited by other players, who were just as out of the loop as you, such as: self-voting, sideline voting, voting because the initials match, etc. I'm also open to the concept of teammates holding back, but I'd also like to get a sense of why your move, in contrast, would simply be a civilian faux-pas, rather than a hidden save move, at a reasonable time for results to change.

MacDougall wrote:Dare I say Jan scumslipped?

Citation needed.

But speaking of Jan, his clumsy posts are starting to land on the thin line between "how derpy can you get" and "can this be a façade".

I'm multiquoting in the morning for over an hour instead of studying. Ah, this ol' mafia feeling...

On LoRab re: Turnip, I agree that his early posts would shape up the suspicion of being a third voice in our WIFOM choir, in light of Wilgy's and MM's flip, but I'd inquire what her interpretation of Turnip's voting intents and pattern, concerning MM, during Day 2.

No soup for you!

Ok, here's an independent read from me Rico. I think you are town. I'm cool with Mac too. I don't see the fuss about df. But all of that is still ill-informed, because as I said I have no intent of putting in effort for at least this phase, I need a brain break after champs.

But demanding baddie reads from me ain't going to work, I'll have some when I have some.

Its just easier to talk about roles by giving them labels imo. Epi likes to restrict his SKs by not giving them killsnfrom the start, but the classic role is basically the same.

Likewise, the recruiting guy is the cult leader, and Ibagree we should be paranoid about him.

Golden wrote:No soup for you!

Ok, here's an independent read from me Rico. I think you are town. I'm cool with Mac too. I don't see the fuss about df. But all of that is still ill-informed, because as I said I have no intent of putting in effort for at least this phase, I need a brain break after champs.

But demanding baddie reads from me ain't going to work, I'll have some when I have some.

I'd just like to see more than this pattern of disagreeing with others' suspicions, t'was my point.

Jan wrote:

MacDougall wrote:Dare I say Jan scumslipped?

How so?

I misread you.

I thought the fact Dom started dropping the gimmick was interesting too, but maybe he just got tired of it.

Quin wrote:

Dom wrote:

nutella wrote:She for me, Q.

Dom, do you suspect anyone besides DF at the moment?
Also, anything specifically lead you to trust SVS? She never participated at all.

SVS is tired and not that in the mood for PLAYING mafia, I think. She would have been more energized if she had a team with her !

I gave a list just the other day of who I suspect. Dfaraday topped the list. You were a distant second, with scotty and 3j rounding up the bottom. Sig is somewhere in there.

I wasn't on that list. Why? I thought I'd have been on there considering I was supposedly pushing 'nothing' against you.

You didn't jump on the bandwagon in the same way the other haters did.

Ricochet wrote: 1. It murks the lines between being confrontational with your sussers simply because it's in your persona's bloodstream and actually disapproving or deflecting suspicions in a valid way. This is a entirely hollow banter reaction to JJJ finding your suss on Bass to be weak. This is just one example of how blurry the line between 'spittin' Domald' and NO U'ing can get - and frankly, I tend to label NO U'ing Dom as bad Dom. I basically don't spot any player to have suspected you that didn't get this treatment: JJJ and DFaraday most of all, to a lesser extent nutella, Quin, Scotty.

Quantify your assertion that No-U Dom is bad Dom, please.

Look folks, I'm a busy, busy man. I set a trap for players to fall in wtih my very very good brain. I've got the best words and now I know what they're up to. I know more about the baddies than the HOST does! Okay, folks? Believe me, we're going to make teh syndicate safe again.

Ricochet wrote: 2. Your ratio between full banter posts and meaningful ideas/messages behind the façade has improved over the course of the game, quite in sync with the wave of mixed or negative reactions you received. I'm inclined to read this as trying to patch things up. "Fine tuning! Bad!" I mean, your very last post is completely devoid of gimmicks. Look how serious you've gotten all of a sudden, when having to vouch for civreading a fallen player (SVS) or being asked repeatedly to state your suspicions.

This is some tired, lazy crap. Someone oughta show this guy what a real point looks like.

Ricochet wrote: 3. It's not about deserving BTOD or not, it's about getting it. I think it's safe to say you survived having to duel on Day 2 because of a new wave of players reading kindly into your performance, particularly your antics: "he wouldn't do that if he'd have a team agenda", with opinions as strong as the hunt on you being called BS. On my side, I believe you could very well be experimenting with a new playing angle, after a series of games in which you were either bad all the time or in which you weren't, but wasn't exactly trusted given your baddie legacy and usual style (*raises hand*). This "experimentation" could be happening to simply refresh your style a bit, regardless of alignment, but points 1) and 2) still make me lean on spotting baddie traits from you. Plus, if you're bad, you've obviously done a good enough job to create some "oh, he wouldn't do this if bad" impressions.

Okay folks, let's break this down.
Let's present two options either I'm bad (ha!) or I'm civ. (waits for applause)


I don't think in a single game I played this year, I was civvie other than this one. I can't remember one. I mgiht have, but the vast, vast majority of games, I was bad. In fact, I faced some joke supsicion over this in my last few games, especially given my inspiring performance in each of those games-- either winning or coming close to winning each time. Now, it is true, I am the greatest mafia player of all time. Yes. Yes, folks, it's true. BUT in this game, I am a civilian. No matter what I did this game, this criticism would be here unless I played no differently than usual-- in which case, I'd get the "Dom is always bad" rap.

So, this is a lazy, low energy argument and I expect better out of you, Rico.

Ricochet wrote: I have no way to explain this properly in English, but there's a wretched garbage musical genre in our country called "manele / mynele" in which 70% of the lyrics are "death to my haters and enemies", and, to simply paraphrase, I think a lot of your posts are just that, either in a total bantz way, either with rebuttal intent that comes off, however, as NO U'y or evasive.

My brand is synonymous with success, okay? Ask anyone-- anyone will tell you. There's no manele needed here. I, simply put, am the best.

I have launched an attack on DFaraday and Nutella. I have defended others, or expressed disinterest in their votes. I don't know what you want from me. You seem (like nutella) more annoyed with how I am playing than having any actual points that make me bad because of how I am playing. This makes me think nutella is bad for a multitude of reasons-- one of which is that, she, ya know, tends to be bad, in my experience, when she calls me annoying. Rather than quantify her suspicion against me, she labels it as "annoying" and looks to get me out. It's rather easy and no one really pays attention to it ! Surprises me, folks.

DFaraday has repeatedly lied about what I have said. He has totally changed the narrative about my words on Bass. Civ DFaraday wouldn't do that. Bad DFaraday looking to place a vote on an easy target absolutely would.

I have explained these suspicions ad naseaum. For any of you to try and imply that my personality is keeping me from expressing valid suspicions is just... it's not just not right. Believe me, civvies love me more than anyone else, and if you're trying to just undermine that because you are jealous or maybe-- i don't know-- maybe you have got something else going on-- i don't know-- plenty of people have written that, maybe. I don't know.

I am civillian and the lazy, tired, low energy, and bad bad arguments have got to stop against me. This is sad.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote:I thought the fact Dom started dropping the gimmick was interesting too, but maybe he just got tired of it.

Dom never gets tired. He is so strong.

If Dom is Mafia he has me fooled.

OK I'm finally back. Sorry for not being around. Two mafia in the first two lynches, how about that. Way to go. It sucks JJJ and S~V~S got killed. Anyway what's new?

MP I'm glad you decided to stick it out.

I would like to apologise to everyone here. I started work this morning at 8:00 am and have been engaged in training sessions and meetings solid until now. It is nearly 10:00 pm as I write this and I need sleep. I will be back in the morning after some sleep. I'm sorry.

When I look over the player list I forget some people are playing because they aren't saying anything that sticks out to me , or not posting at all. I'm probably going to look into some of those people when I get off work and can use a laptop.

I will be checking in and out all day at work so if anyone wants an option on anything just ask.

Dom wrote:

Ricochet wrote: 1. It murks the lines between being confrontational with your sussers simply because it's in your persona's bloodstream and actually disapproving or deflecting suspicions in a valid way. This is a entirely hollow banter reaction to JJJ finding your suss on Bass to be weak. This is just one example of how blurry the line between 'spittin' Domald' and NO U'ing can get - and frankly, I tend to label NO U'ing Dom as bad Dom. I basically don't spot any player to have suspected you that didn't get this treatment: JJJ and DFaraday most of all, to a lesser extent nutella, Quin, Scotty.

Quantify your assertion that No-U Dom is bad Dom, please.

Look folks, I'm a busy, busy man. I set a trap for players to fall in wtih my very very good brain. I've got the best words and now I know what they're up to. I know more about the baddies than the HOST does! Okay, folks? Believe me, we're going to make teh syndicate safe again.

First of all, are you say there is NO U, in the form of simply sussing back others who suss you, is a civvie trait? Explain.
Variation b) to this: are you saying NO U'ing is part of your civvie traits? Elaborate.

Anyway, if it's meta you want, I'm not going to go search for it at this stage. I think I backed up above with examples how your reactions to suspicions on you look like. While NO U, in some degree, might be a part of your game pedigree even when you are playing a civ game, I'm talking about serious strong tone here. You bark and lash back more at players you're in an opposing relation with, that's my take on it. The only other element I remember as baddie Dom, but not quite seeing it in the game so far, is you picking on / questioning players, from small details and pings to sharp inquiries, on your own volition. Instead, most of your game so far is made up of reactions.

Plus, there's a difference between "I disagree with your suspicions because a, b, c and I think you're bad by doing this" and "I disagree with your suspicions because [void] and I think you're bad by doing this" and I'm seeing the latter.

Dom wrote:

Ricochet wrote: 2. Your ratio between full banter posts and meaningful ideas/messages behind the façade has improved over the course of the game, quite in sync with the wave of mixed or negative reactions you received. I'm inclined to read this as trying to patch things up. "Fine tuning! Bad!" I mean, your very last post is completely devoid of gimmicks. Look how serious you've gotten all of a sudden, when having to vouch for civreading a fallen player (SVS) or being asked repeatedly to state your suspicions.

This is some tired, lazy crap. Someone oughta show this guy what a real point looks like.

Tired implies overuse of this accusation, and yet it's the first time I brought it up.

Dom wrote:

Ricochet wrote: 3. It's not about deserving BTOD or not, it's about getting it. I think it's safe to say you survived having to duel on Day 2 because of a new wave of players reading kindly into your performance, particularly your antics: "he wouldn't do that if he'd have a team agenda", with opinions as strong as the hunt on you being called BS. On my side, I believe you could very well be experimenting with a new playing angle, after a series of games in which you were either bad all the time or in which you weren't, but wasn't exactly trusted given your baddie legacy and usual style (*raises hand*). This "experimentation" could be happening to simply refresh your style a bit, regardless of alignment, but points 1) and 2) still make me lean on spotting baddie traits from you. Plus, if you're bad, you've obviously done a good enough job to create some "oh, he wouldn't do this if bad" impressions.

Okay folks, let's break this down.
Let's present two options either I'm bad (ha!) or I'm civ. (waits for applause)

I don't think in a single game I played this year, I was civvie other than this one. I can't remember one. I mgiht have, but the vast, vast majority of games, I was bad. In fact, I faced some joke supsicion over this in my last few games, especially given my inspiring performance in each of those games-- either winning or coming close to winning each time. Now, it is true, I am the greatest mafia player of all time. Yes. Yes, folks, it's true. BUT in this game, I am a civilian. No matter what I did this game, this criticism would be here unless I played no differently than usual-- in which case, I'd get the "Dom is always bad" rap.

You were civ in the Championships, which I referenced by "raises hand". I gave you the "Dom is always bad" rap in there and you were more solid in pointing out how the points I've made don't stand up to your actual performance. I'm seeing less of that here.

Dom wrote: So, this is a lazy, low energy argument and I expect better out of you, Rico.

Number 3 wasn't an argument, as much as an interpretation/assumption concerning your adopted playing style.
Anyway, what is the better me or the better you'd expect from me? Could you quantify your expectations?

Dom wrote:I have launched an attack on DFaraday and Nutella. I have defended others, or expressed disinterest in their votes. I don't know what you want from me.

Less of (see points 1 and 2), for starters.

Dom wrote: You seem (like nutella) more annoyed with how I am playing than having any actual points that make me bad because of how I am playing. This makes me think nutella is bad for a multitude of reasons-- one of which is that, she, ya know, tends to be bad, in my experience, when she calls me annoying. Rather than quantify her suspicion against me, she labels it as "annoying" and looks to get me out. It's rather easy and no one really pays attention to it ! Surprises me, folks.

DFaraday has repeatedly lied about what I have said. He has totally changed the narrative about my words on Bass. Civ DFaraday wouldn't do that. Bad DFaraday looking to place a vote on an easy target absolutely would.

I have explained these suspicions ad naseaum. For any of you to try and imply that my personality is keeping me from expressing valid suspicions is just... it's not just not right. Believe me, civvies love me more than anyone else, and if you're trying to just undermine that because you are jealous or maybe-- i don't know-- maybe you have got something else going on-- i don't know-- plenty of people have written that, maybe. I don't know.

I'll revisit your exchanges with DFaraday.
I can accept your theory on nutella punching a ticket by picking on your gaming, when bad, but would inquire if it's that frequent or consistent of her to do so. Besides, she being bad for unsubstantiated / moody criticism of your game and you find her bad because she tends to pick on you when so are argument I'd rank about at the same level of weaksaucery, in principle.

MacDougall wrote:If Dom is Mafia he has me fooled.

I'm sure Epignosis is laughing at how much of a dumbass I am, if that's true.

I'd inquire people's vibes on Russ post-lynch, purely on the feeling that he's been less talked as the Duel 2 victor compared to how the Duel 1 victor was (Scotty). FWIW, while MM has been vocal about wanting to do the dance of swords with Russ and two fifths of the Nanmans have been revealed so far to be WIFOM burger chefs, I don't get the sense of him and Russ being teammates. MM even voted to push Russ into clear 2nd spot, which would be pretty defeatist.

Bass_the_Clever wrote:I will be checking in and out all day at work so if anyone wants an option on anything just ask.

Dom.

A better grasp on your voting tactic from the previous Day, given that you've went for top wagon (MM) and zero wagon (yourself).

Some thoughts on who to consider for nomination toDay, based on the vote evolution (see my chart on previous page, if it helps) or any other criteria you might consider.

How's Roxy doing?

Ricochet wrote:I'd inquire people's vibes on Russ post-lynch, purely on the feeling that he's been less talked as the Duel 2 victor compared to how the Duel 1 victor was (Scotty). FWIW, while MM has been vocal about wanting to do the dance of swords with Russ and two fifths of the Nanmans have been revealed so far to be WIFOM burger chefs, I don't get the sense of him and Russ being teammates. MM even voted to push Russ into clear 2nd spot, which would be pretty defeatist.

Bass_the_Clever wrote:I will be checking in and out all day at work so if anyone wants an option on anything just ask.

Dom.

A better grasp on your voting tactic from the previous Day, given that you've went for top wagon (MM) and zero wagon (yourself).

Some thoughts on who to consider for nomination toDay, based on the vote evolution (see my chart on previous page, if it helps) or any other criteria you might consider.

How's Roxy doing?

Roxy is doing better!
OK so I voted MM day one because I felt like he was just joking around the whole phase, and I've seen mafia hide behind that in games before and felt like it was a good place to start . When day two rolled around JJJ made a solid case which help confirm my suspicions of him . If I was able to vote early that day, I would have been among the first players to vote MM.
As for my self vote vote I didn't have time to catch up all the way because the site was acting funny and I didn't have any idea where I wanted to put my second vote so I voted myself.

Boomslang wrote:

Nerolunar wrote:I'm voting birdwithteeth and timmer. Random votes are just a no-no, despite how dificult this game is/seems to be.

Um... you didn't actually mention either of them in previous posts? I agree random votes are a no-no, but you just seemed to make two.

Rather, they were impulse votes. "Random" to me means choosing blindly from the player list and going with that, or simply feeling indifferent about the voted players. I voted as I did based on my reaction to Timmer and BWT, who seemed careless and uninterested. I believe there is a difference.

I would be comfortable being voted for.

I think Rico's finding on TH's WIFOM PB&J in the MM/Wilgy link is AOK. I could vote TH today.

We have SO many no-shows this game. I could also vote for INH for disappearing into the darkness.

Or Mac. He wasn't really on my radar until Mm flipped (and actually I think he looked rather civ) and now his soft defending looks bad to me.

Linki @Caps: O rly? Where for art thou getting comfortable?

Jan wrote:

LoRab wrote:

Jan wrote:I wonder if the scums are aware there is a game going on at all?

And mess at me actually being right with a guess for once. I finally had some time to involve myself further in this game as, just as I admitted, I had played really vaguely because, frankly I'm not used to such huge games and didn't have time too. It was late July when Sig recruited me for this and I expected the game to start earlier than it actually did.

A big post is coming up from me. Get ready for your weaves to be snatched.

Why do you think the baddies aren't aware of a game?

I've never played a game where the scum team(s?) haven't managed to dispose of at least one townie by Day 3 with a Night Kill. I don't know what exactly is going on in there, but frankly it would be against the balance of the game for the scums not being technically able to submit kills so either someone has a super secret ability that effectively stops scums or someone on their part fucked up.

It seems from your post after this that you missed the fact that there were 2 kills last night. But if you know that it's day (which you do, because we're posting), I have to assume you read the night post.

Ricochet wrote:On LoRab re: Turnip, I agree that his early posts would shape up the suspicion of being a third voice in our WIFOM choir, in light of Wilgy's and MM's flip, but I'd inquire what her interpretation of Turnip's voting intents and pattern, concerning MM, during Day 2.

Having read the whole lynch knowing the ending, it was pretty clear from the outset that MM was going down. So, I'd guess bussing a teammate/distancing. It's what I would have done, tbh.

TheCapsFan wrote:I would be comfortable being voted for.

Are you bad?

TheCapsFan wrote:I would be comfortable being voted for.

Is that all you have to say?


Dom, I pick on you for being annoying anytime I find you annoying, regardless of my alignment. Also, I said that once this game and I have otherwise given actual reasons for suspecting you/your behavior in this game. I have specifically mentioned your voting behavior, the confusing exchange about Bass, and most of all your houndish no-u-ing of DF.

Dom wrote: You didn't jump on the bandwagon in the same way the other haters did.

Bandwagon? I'm pretty sure I was the first person to voice suspicion of you.

DFaraday has repeatedly lied about what I have said. He has totally changed the narrative about my words on Bass. Civ DFaraday wouldn't do that. Bad DFaraday looking to place a vote on an easy target absolutely would.

Show me how I've lied. I said that you didn't adequately explain your read on Bass or why his post count was indicative of baddieness, which is true (though MP since came in and elaborated on it). If you can show what I said that is a misconstruement of your words, I'll happily retract that statement, as I did when I caught my misread of your post earlier.

Anyway, Timmer has really caught my attention since the lynch. His vote not only makes no sense, it also raises alarms that he "Voted for people with votes" but not MM. I don't buy that trying to get a close race would help the civ cause, and looking over his posts, he really hasn't contributed anything useful. Timmer is likely getting one of my votes.

@Rico, I can't help you decide whether my move was a civilian faux -pas or not (I don't really consider it a faux pass anyway). That's for you to mull over, buddy! I explained it as I could

MacDougall wrote:If Dom is Mafia he has me fooled.

If I were bad, this would be a stellar accomplishment folks. One I am worthy of, but just-- sadly--am not eligible for.

Scotty wrote:I think Rico's finding on TH's WIFOM PB&J in the MM/Wilgy link is AOK. I could vote TH today.

We have SO many no-shows this game. I could also vote for INH for disappearing into the darkness.

Or Mac. He wasn't really on my radar until Mm flipped (and actually I think he looked rather civ) and now his soft defending looks bad to me.

Linki @Caps: O rly? Where for art thou getting comfortable?

WEren't you pretty dead set against lynch INH or discussing lynchign INH because he's a prefect or am I remembering that incorrectly?

nutella wrote:

TheCapsFan wrote:I would be comfortable being voted for.

Is that all you have to say?


Dom, I pick on you for being annoying anytime I find you annoying, regardless of my alignment. Also, I said that once this game and I have otherwise given actual reasons for suspecting you/your behavior in this game. I have specifically mentioned your voting behavior, the confusing exchange about Bass, and most of all your houndish no-u-ing of DF.

Is the exchange about Bass still confusing? It shouldn't be. Why is that suspicious?

No-U's are when you suspect someone purely for suspecting you. I suspect DFaraday because he clearly didn't read the thread very closely, saw an easy vote, and made it. That's just as strong of an argument as that is being made against me, if not better. Especially since the bst mafia player in the world is making it.

Rico, I can see your point of view, marginally. It's just wrong.

TheCapsFan wrote:I would be comfortable being voted for.

Hello, Caps. I get it if it's stressful to keep up and figure how things work, but I'd argue that, generally (and not counting Scotty ), we like the idea of finding baddies and lynching them, rather than doing clean-up lynches of inactives / low posters of any kinds, if that's what you're suggesting.

Unless you happen to be waving the white flag. Are you?

Scotty wrote:I think Rico's finding on TH's WIFOM PB&J in the MM/Wilgy link is AOK. I could vote TH today.

We have SO many no-shows this game. I could also vote for INH for disappearing into the darkness.

Or Mac. He wasn't really on my radar until Mm flipped (and actually I think he looked rather civ) and now his soft defending looks bad to me.

Linki @Caps: O rly? Where for art thou getting comfortable?

Do you mean my small bit of looking into TH's connections with MM or did you confuse me with LoRab's more elaborate quotes? Just asking to make sure.

What do you think about my idea that INH is among the most significant candidates (if not the one) to have been incapacitated (silenced + stripped of voting) on Day 2?

LoRab wrote:
It seems from your post after this that you missed the fact that there were 2 kills last night. But if you know that it's day (which you do, because we're posting), I have to assume you read the night post.

Maybe he just noticed that the thread is open again and he can post.

On a more serious note, Caps and Jan are pretty much the only players I recall exhibiting issues in perceiving either our gameplay methods, the game's design or events throughout the course of the game. I noted a slightly positive, can't-act-this-clueless-if-he'd-have-BTSC-support (unless pretending very convincingly), from Caps in my spectating. Jan's derps should normally fall in the same spot, but I'm less sure, given how recurrent his tripping over the cord is. Could be nothing, could be feigning cluelessness. His vote wording is more problematic, anyway (voting players to 'see them gone', 'see how they flip').

Dom, ok well it's not only that but also, and I mentioned this a little in my response to MP, the way you've been focusing on DF/pushing against anyone who suspects you and meanwhile staying out of a lot of the main discussions. Since the beginning of the game you've been sort of saying your own thing on the sidelines, prioritizing your persona over getting involved in the thread and as I said earlier your posts thus had less content than I would have liked. Less so today, but for the first couple days it felt like you were playing from inside your own bubble, and I prefer to see more interaction with major topics of conversation.

Welcome back, Ricochet - it's good to have the opportunity to play with you again

It appears the thread has slowed to a crawl since 3J's demise - I wonder if that might (at least partly) be the result of a repeat of the issues a lot of s experienced at the end of the last Day phase? I can't speak for anyone else but I'm finding the time it takes to load (when it doesn't time out altogether) very frustrating...

TheCapsFan wrote:I would be comfortable being voted for.

Catching up a little. I don't like this.

Ricochet wrote:

TheCapsFan wrote:I would be comfortable being voted for.

Hello, Caps. I get it if it's stressful to keep up and figure how things work, but I'd argue that, generally (and not counting Scotty ), we like the idea of finding baddies and lynching them, rather than doing clean-up lynches of inactives / low posters of any kinds, if that's what you're suggesting.

Unless you happen to be waving the white flag. Are you?

Scotty wrote:I think Rico's finding on TH's WIFOM PB&J in the MM/Wilgy link is AOK. I could vote TH today.

We have SO many no-shows this game. I could also vote for INH for disappearing into the darkness.

Or Mac. He wasn't really on my radar until Mm flipped (and actually I think he looked rather civ) and now his soft defending looks bad to me.

Linki @Caps: O rly? Where for art thou getting comfortable?

Do you mean my small bit of looking into TH's connections with MM or did you confuse me with LoRab's more elaborate quotes? Just asking to make sure.

What do you think about my idea that INH is among the most significant candidates (if not the one) to have been incapacitated (silenced + stripped of voting) on Day 2?

Yeah I'm pretty sure you said it first, LoRab may have developed it.

RE: INH being incapacitated Day 2? Maybe. What doesn't help this theory is that he still hasn't posted on Day 3, so I feel as though he's just plain not here. I wonder if putting vote pressure on our other prefect could wake him up (wake him up inside, wake him up inside, save hiiiim)

Dom wrote:

MacDougall wrote:If Dom is Mafia he has me fooled.

If I were bad, this would be a stellar accomplishment folks. One I am worthy of, but just-- sadly--am not eligible for.

Scotty wrote:I think Rico's finding on TH's WIFOM PB&J in the MM/Wilgy link is AOK. I could vote TH today.

We have SO many no-shows this game. I could also vote for INH for disappearing into the darkness.

Or Mac. He wasn't really on my radar until Mm flipped (and actually I think he looked rather civ) and now his soft defending looks bad to me.

Linki @Caps: O rly? Where for art thou getting comfortable?

WEren't you pretty dead set against lynch INH or discussing lynchign INH because he's a prefect or am I remembering that incorrectly?.

No, you must be confusing me with someone else. To an extent, I think it is suspicious for someone to campaign to have a responsibility to the people and not show up. It's like he hopped on the one-way bus in San Francisco and now he's in Thailand without a phone. How did he get there? Any word would help.

I find the following exchange mildly concerning...

Golden wrote:

Dom wrote:SVS is tired and not that in the mood for PLAYING mafia, I think. She would have been more energized if she had a team with her !

I think this read on SVS is both accurate and genuine.

I'm really feeling good about Dom this game.

As Ricochet has already pointed out, S-V-S herself stated in the first of her only two posts this game:

S~V~S wrote:Hi all, I just found out this started. I will do my best to get caught up on phone (no wofi for another week or so, and post as much as is feasible on phone.

Given that, your comment Dom, seems to lack logic. If she doesn't have access, whether she was a part of a Mafia team or not would have been irrelevant to the degree of energy that she had exhibited in this game.

As for you Golden, my friend, I trust your second statement isn't predicated on the first? Assuming that to be the case, can you shed any light on the reasons for your views on Dom?

Glorfindel wrote:Welcome back, Ricochet - it's good to have the opportunity to play with you again

It appears the thread has slowed to a crawl since 3J's demise - I wonder if that might (at least partly) be the result of a repeat of the issues a lot of s experienced at the end of the last Day phase? I can't speak for anyone else but I'm finding the time it takes to load (when it doesn't time out altogether) very frustrating...

Hi.

There are issues, no doubt, but I'm personally not demotivate from trying to post whenever I have something to say. Can't really comment on the effect on this phase being thinner in content.

You voted Dom yesterDay, any update on those feeling towards him? Anything you can extract out of the lynch progression, what MM's remaining teammates might have done? Interested in your thoughts whenever you have some, have the time or the bandwidth allows it.

linki @ Glorfindel: nvmd, it seems you're ready to look into things